Messages

Ok, I finaly made it after all this hard work!!!! This morning I woke up at around 6 in the morning and read about projection for about half an hour then attempted to project. Everything went normaly, and I started to enter trance, focus on my third eye and all that. Everything was cool.
I was drifting into and out of conciousness. I remember this is extremely hazy and I have bad memory of it. It seemed as though at one point I lost consiousness and woke up in the astral. I didnt really know weather I was there or not, I wasnt quite sure. My brother was tlking to me, but everything he said was unclear. Yet I still could not figure out weather it was in the astral or not. I regained consiousness in sleep paralysis after these dream "episodes" took place, yet I did not remember them until after the initial expereince of projection which is odd. I will explain that part now. So, I am in sleep paralysis, and then notice that with my will I could start the projection sytoms(REM,vibrations) with ease. "Finaly", I thought!!! So I kept making them last longer every time as I got over the fear I felt with them. I cant beleive how intense they were!! Way more than anything I have ever expereinced. Then my astral vision started to kick in during one of these attempts, and I saw my feet in a horizontal postion shaking sort of. IT was terrifying, it felt like I was being possessed, I the thought occured to me for a second. I have no fear of this, but have read it is a natural fear that people have. This episode was really scary so I stopped it and saw my legs back down in the normal position. Then I started again, and they rose up again. Now, I though that my body would look different in the ethereal realm, but it didnt. I could even see the hairs on my legs, as they rose up horizontaly. With great effort, I continued the prosses and found myself out!!!!!!!!! During the transition stage I remembered what I had read, and that after all this crazy wierd sh*t happens, verything will be peicful, and the sensatinos will go away. Thats what happened. I was floating above my body. I am out, I thought!!!!!!!!!!!! Yay, what to do. Well aparantally I just went with the flow. I spun around and drifted out my window. I was facing the oposite direction that I was moving. I saw my room, and house get further away, and I stopped on the road by my house. WOW!! I was in the ethereal realm. There was no snow on the ground, it was areally nice day. AT that point I wanted to change my reality. With the thought of that, I started to sink towards the ground.

I closed my eyes, or whatever I did. I made everything dark, and I expereinced a reality shift, and entered the astral realm. I can tell I was there because things were changing during the time I was there. I was in suberbia somewhere. I remember standing in the road talking to someone, but I cant remeb=mber who or what I was talking to/about. Its the only part of the expereince that is unclear. Then I noticed a really atractive female go by. She had awhite shirt and jeans on, and was on roller blades. Im like "sweet, lets go have sex"!! So I followed her, and he went into a house. I entered and was looking for her. The house was strange and really small for some reason. It was decorated for christmas. I searched the house looking for her, and came to the bathroom. Someone was hiding behind the shower certain. Yay, its the hot chick!! I thought. We can have sex now, in the shower. I pulled back the certains, and to my utter disapointment, there was a little kid standing there. I was anoyyed!! Where did the hot woman go!! So I kicked him gently to show my anger!! Then I started talking with him. It was freaky at first, cuz he was wierd. I was a little frightened of him at first,but then I talked to him some more, and I was not as scared. I realized he was a part of myself, and we both agreed on that. I left, and then I found myself back in my body. I thought about the expereince with my eyes closed, and was extremely exited to have had my first expereince. Yay!!!!! I am so happy I finally made it out and about on the astral realm!!!!!!!!!!!!

I love Pink Floyd!!

    Very helpful and practical information!! And well written too. I have never heard it put in such a perspective. Its really helpful.

 Anyways your basically saying that attention needs to be mental right? when one is focused on relaxing the body it could hinder progress as well because your clearly focussing on it. I agree with what you say. There is a difference between seeing with the physical eyes and seeing with the minds eye or third eye. The body falls asleep naturally anyway so if one learns to focus internally it happens anyways. With all the perceptions. They will all become internal!!

  I seem to catch myself starring fixedly with my physical eyes waiting to see something. This strains them and they are not relaxed. Our vision is a link the this reality so its easy to not notice your eyes "looking" for something....anything.

   Once they are relaxed, then attention will focus on the minds eye perception. It seems to me that the feeling should be quite obvious. At least I perceive it quite well nowadays. Its almost like you feel your eyes turn off, and you gain a more "in depth" perception or percpective. A more imaginary state.

this might be helpful....If you try really hard to visualize something, and keep your eyes as relaxed as you can, you might induce the feeling. You wont expect to see anything physically because its not there. You will gain a fantasy sort of vision. This is just visualization and does not require you to "see" anything.  If your at this site you should know that anyways!! Keep checking for strain is really good advice I would say!! Remember what I mean by "vizualization". RB goes in depth on the subject in Astral Dynamics. If you cant get it I think its in the treatise. I would suggest also for anyone wnating to have an OBE that you read every single bit of info that you can muster. Buy every book on amazon.com. FLOOD YOUR MIND WITH IT!! If you really, want an OBE you will get one.  If you say you do but arent willing to put time and effort into it,it wont work.

  If you wake up in a vibration state your vision is already orientated to your minds perception so you should just go for it. At least with my expereince anyways.


 As Jeff was saying earlier, people can be hypnotized into detaching awarness from the physical body. You can teach yourself this like you would anything else. A sort of automatic mechanism. Many things can do this. Your subconcious mind has to be tought this. A lot of the techs that Robert Bruce comes out with can teach this to you. Its like when you fall you automatically sheild your face or other things that are very important to your servival. You dont even have to think and you do it. You can teach yourself anything like that. Its like if you play guitar a lot you dont have to think about the doing, just the notes that you want to play. Everything else is subconcious. Or when you talk it just flows from years of engrained training.
A lot of people use magick rituals and the like to accomplish this, or anything else for that matter that has to do with really putting an impact on the mind for good or bad. I am in no way suggesting this, just pointing it out.

   A matra is a good example of this. Or those tapes that are supposed to teach you stuff when your asleep. Practice all the time and think about it!!!  Thats my best advice.

   I seem to have somehow made myself into a weekly projector in the last couple months!! I cant yet do it at will, at the moment but I have learned to wake up in the state almost twice a week for the last month of so. Its great!!! I do not always have an adventure. A lot of the times I am just learning how to move and flying around aimlessly and not to mention uncontrolably!! Doing backflips and the like trying to gain some sort of control. As Robert Bruce would say " Blundering about like a drunk in zero gravity"!![][]

anyways I found the most helpful thing to acheive an OBE consistently is to think about it all the time. At least every ten minutes of everyday. I have found if I do this I dont need any techs or anything. I simply wake up in the state. Its almost as if you mind knows how to do it already and you have to confince the hell out of it that you want an OBE. Everything else is automatic. Your mind will find a way to give you results without you having to do anything someway or another. And if you think you dont have time to think about AP every ten minutes just think for ten minutes and I am sure you can squeeze some AP thoughts in with all that other useless crap going on!! Oh and a dream journal helps a lot.

Anyways thats my input I hope it helps someone to acheive an AP!! Good luck with everything. And dont give up and all that.


 

After reading your post again I understood what might be happening. You may be having some sort of ethereal sex. If you read roberts documentation on the subject you will find the similarity. It is contained within this site. He explains the sensatinos of it, and it sounds similar to what you are expereincing.

quote:Originally posted by druat

Hi,

This may sound wierd but I suppose this is the right place.
I never believed in this sort of thing till now.

I met a woman on a chat site about 2 weeks ago.
We moved to a private area and started getting very explicit.
After about a week I felt a warmth go through my body I feel she is sort of inside me. When I'm in bed at night my whole body spasm,surges with energy need I tell you the rest. I feel like I',m whole in love one spirit

This woman is a healer and studies Kabalah she seem a nice person and I like this experience but I feel out of control. I need to be in control becuase its affecting my work life. Its like a drug.

I'm sure we both using this sort of phsyic connection to experience this but I not sure if I was sort of invaded to begin with

I need to talk to someone about this as its difficult not to be able to say anything to people. They'll think i'm off my rocker

druat@hotmail dot com is my chat  

  Topic  

Interesting!! Have you spoken to her about it yet?? I am afraid I cant help you, its out of my feild. Sounds interesting though. Maybe you should just enjoy it. How often do you get spontanious orgasms. Enjoy it while you can!!

solution:
Wake up 6am.
Go on internet.
read about AP at msg board for half hour.
attempt Astral Projection once mind totally awake. Night time not good for projection. Morning time much better.Thag!!!!!!!!!!!

quote:Originally posted by kakkarot

shawn, do you excercise? excercising a good amount (not too much) each day can get rid of most physical problems.

over the last while i've really been letting myself get, shall we say, not fit;). and when i started pushing myself even just a little, i realized that my heart was very weak. after a few days of just pushing myself a slight bit harder than normal in everything i did, my heart toughened up to the point that i can really push myself and i have to worry more about collapsing from my muscles giving out rather than my heart.

also numerous studies have shown that having a healthy (ie through excercise) body will help deal with many issues that are normally thought to be psychological in nature (ie extreme manic depressive episodes). it's not a cure, but it's a starting point. a good one.

~kakkarot

You could not be more correct. Even just a little exercise a day will make a huge, noticable improvment on your body, both physically and spiritually. You will also be in a better state of mind. Even if you smoke, and think there is no way to feel more energized. If you hike all the time, and do lots of activity I bet your lungs and heart will be stronger than someone who does not do anything. Even if you smoke.

I bet its becuase we always talk about negative enities on this forrum. Haha, we are creating our own fears. If noone knew about the negative entities they probably would not attract them. Fear is what attracts them.

Haha, dont worry you didnt die.Lol. You lost awarness of your breathing thats all. It happens all the time.

Durring my expereince I also had a lot of control over myself. As greytraveller said, most people just float around in a drunken haze. I found getting around to be quite conveneint. At first I just flaoted, and let myself go with whatever was persuading me. I didnt have a desire to control, so I just went with the flow so to speak, enjoying myself. Then, when I shifted realities, I was walking normally as I would in the physical. I could even feel the ground, and I was running around with complete control. The though of flying didnt occur to me, there was too much going on at present. My mind was having a hard of enough time perceiving what I was expereincing. I was dumbfounded the whole time, and just wanderered around in bliss exploring anything. Everything was interesting. It was a new world!! hehe!!

Wow, thats amazing!! Wonderful, I am soooo happy for you!! Its quite amazing isnt it?? And the clarity of consciousness is so present, unlike a dream at all. Congrats, you finally made it!! How long did it take for you?? I made it in in 2 months, having my first expereince about a month ago. It hasnt happened since, because I have not been working on it too much. Right now I am working full time, and we are building our new house for our band. I get spontanious oportunities all the time, even when I dont practice. I always wake up unexpectedly in sleep paralysis, expereincing the projection symtoms such as hearing voices, vibrations, floating sensation. I get scared out of it tough because its a bit too sudden. I hear the more you project, the less intense the symtoms are. I wish you luck in the future. Good job!!

Thats how I first projected. Try waking up in the morning at 6, then read about AP on the net and get really into it. Drink a cup of coffee or tea to wake your mind. After about half on hour you should feel a little tired. Your body will feel heavy. Try projection then. I found you will wake up after about two hours of sleep. If it is done right, and you catch yourself and remind you that you want to project, then you will still be in sleep paralysis. The trick is to catch yourself early enough, before you move. It should be easy from there, aside from the fear.

[Originally posted by Robert Bruce:]

quote:Originally posted by Robert Bruce:
G'day Forum Folks!

Thank you for your concern.

No, I have not been abducted by ET's again:)

Those damned probes are a real pain in the butt. . . .

Forgive me, I have not been able to spend the time I would like to on the forums, simply through a lack of time.  I love interacting here, but needs must as the devil drives, or so they say.

Here's an update on my situation.....

I am knee deep in my new book, 'Mastering Astral Projection: a 90 day program', and working long hours to catch up, re I have fallen way behind schedule. This will be a 'great' book.  We have been offered a contract by Llewellyn Worldwide Publishing, but are still negotiating at the moment.

Kundalini Dynamics is on hold, re I do not have the facilities to continue my high level investigations into such things at the moment. Hopefully, things will improve in the near future. I simply cannot devote the necessary time to this project at the moment.

When I am writing, I get up at dawn and collapse sometime after midnight, when my eyes can no longer focus.  This book will be about the size of AD, probably A4 workbook size, so you might imagine the work that is going into it. This will come with a pc CD with some custom made Bwgen presets for use with the program.  (see www.bwgen.com) As you might know, I am a single father with school aged children, so my time is doubly stretched.

I still do a couple of hours email every morning, but over the past few months my inbox is approaching 600 again. I could really use a PA and secretary:)

I get onto the forums whenever I can.  But when I am writing I generally rely on people to point out posts that I need to attend to.  

We are also trying to discover funding, to get TBI off the ground (The Bruce Institute).  I have big plans, but it all comes down to discovering the $$$ to get things moving. We have some irons in the fire and, fingers crossed, this will start happening soon.

There is the possibility of some workshops coming up later this year. If
the deal comes off, it will be held at Hotel Costa Verde, in Costa Rica,
South America.

Check out  WWW.HOTELCOSTAVERDE.COM

Pretty cool place, aye....

I have no idea how much this workshop will cost to attend, as I've never done one before. I've never even attended one, but from the look of this resort I don't think it will be budget priced.  If it goes ahead, it will be a
learning experience for everyone, myself included.  But it sounds like fun and I could really use a holiday out of my office. If this works out, I plan to get some surfing and diving in too:)

Our lovely organizer, Maria, is not sure if she'll gather a group of authors and do a mixed workshop thingy, or if she'll do a solo one with myself.  We are thinking of starting up a main topic soon to generate some ideas and feedback to help with planning.

That's about all for now....


Take care, Robert.

WOOOOOW!! Looks like I might be taking a trip to Costa Rica!!  Those books look absolutely amazing!! Mastering AP.......wow.  I have not had the honour yet to read Astral Dynamics. I cant wait. Thanks for all the great work and inspiration!! Hopfully, someday I will be able to come to one of these seminars, but for now I think I can only dream. I had my first AP in 2 months thanks to all your work!! Treatise on Astral Projection is an amazing document, as all of your writings are. Try not to get attacked by a shark this time!!


I love Pink Floyd!!

[Originally posted by glenshadow:]

quote:Originally posted by glenshadow:
OK sorry about that post before. I appologize.  Now I experienced spasms last night twice just like you said Leviiathan.  Tell me what you make of this.  Here is what happened:
I have never projected before but I have been trying for about a month now. Last night as me and my girlfriend were falling asleep I felt a heavy feeling come over my body as I was focusing on my third eye and thinking of projecting.  Suddenly I felt myself VIOLENTLY shaking from side to side and up and down and I could see myself and my hands shaking. My heart was also racing exteremely fast. Suddenly I was standing out of bed in the living room and I walked through the verticle blinds and sliding glass door out onto the patio. I got so scared of the shaking that I screamed and I guess my screaming woke her because she woke me.  When I had asked her if I was shaking at all before she woke me she said no. She said all I did was scream.

During the time I was walking out to the patio the shaking had stopped but it all happened so fast that when I was screaming from the shaking it ended up happening when I was outside.  When I had woke I was sweating but my heart was beating nice and slow.  The same thing happened a second time about 5 mins after we tried to go to sleep again but this time I only made it as far as seeing the blankets on the bed in front of me before I yelled from the shaking.

What do you make of that?  Do you think it was a projection?

Yes!! Well done. You were expereinceing a projection!! That is exactly how my first one went. You can read it in the astral expereince forrum and it explains. I was attempting a projection, and when it kicked in the vibrations went crazy and I started shakinbg back and forth. At this time my astral eyes kicked in, and I saw my whole body shake and rise up. IT was terrifying!!  I new it was a projection though, and was able to be calm enough to go with it, although a few times I stopped it because I was too scared. It would just come back right away. After that everything was calm, not frightening and my adventure began.  The heart beat thing will go away, I used to get that too. Things get a little calmer with more practice. That damn seperation can be quite a startle to ones mind if one has not expereinced it before!!! What a damn trip that is!! Well done, I think you are well on your way to a conscious projection!!  I think the shaking is created by the mind. The shaking feels sooo real that the mind may create an acual vision of the shaking.


I love Pink Floyd!!

Have you conciderred that you might not even be moving in the physical?? Have you acually noticed it physically?? It might just be your astral body loosening.  Though I have expereinced twitching and spasms physically when on the edge of sleep.

    Sometimes I have noticed they are a result of the point where you just begin to slip into dreams. Your mind will start randomly thinking about situations. You dont see these, but you think so hard of them, somtimes they may result in your physical body acually reacting to these if it is not asleep enough yet. I am sure they are quite common, more so for people doing meditation, because they are going deep into there mind, and letting the subconscious show itself.  Basically what Zarklon said.

I love Pink Floyd!!

[Originally posted by --ViciouS--:]

quote:Originally posted by --ViciouS--:
Hey Glacius!  I already know about your experience, but im gonna post anyways.  

Maybe the kid just represents a certain part of your life, that you aren't to comfortable with, you did say you felt really weird about him.  Anyways, there's nothing wrong with sex. At. All.  Relax, if it wasn't for sex, none of us would be here.  Every living thing reproduces somehow.  *Shakes head* Repressed. http://www.astralpulse.com/forums/images/icon_Smile_wink.gif" border=0>
And if that chick was a real being, then you'd probably just know she was, and you wouldn't just 'try something'.  Or she'd at least let you know.
Just cause most religions teach that it's wrong doesn't mean sh*t.

Also, who exactly decides what is 'good' or 'bad', or moral or immoral, and who cares?  And no, I don't think that there are any 'laws' in the astral.    Who cares what society thinks anyway?

:::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::
Whatever happens...happens.

Haha, ya thats about how I feel. bonk it, I am just going to go with the flow and learn what I can. Screw morrels in the astral, I will learn them for myself.



I love Pink Floyd!!

[Originally posted by jilola:]

quote:Originally posted by jilola:
But I'm not cluttering. I just listed the things I've gone through to arrive where I am. They are just points of call along the way.
I don't have any technique because they are all essentially tricks to do what should just be let happen. The way I go about attempting to exit is more like zazen that it is anything else.
Just set the intent and get out of the way.

But this is not enough yet I've found. Something needs to be added or removed to make the exit reliable. I tihnk may it's just more practise to gain confidence and train the mind.

Thanks for you input, though. I apppreciate all comments and thoughts.

2cents & L&L
jouni

Yes, exactly. More practice. I have found that whenever I have seeked a goal, with anything I find myself cluttered with ways of reaching it. I must sort through all this info, and methods in order to simplify it to something that will work for me. In this case practice is the answer. To find the way that works. It seems you have made great progress, well done!! And intent is also important I found when I had not expereinced projection. The desire to do so. I suppose in is just as important now, as it was then. All I can say is try the 6 in the morning method. I had my second expereince this morning only two days after the first. Both times using this method. Like you said, setting the intent and going along. This is a great way of helping you to project, as it takes care of relazing the body, so you dont have to really think about it, if that is a difficulty, and also putts you in the right state of mind. You must be awake for half an hour, or until your conciousness feels totally clear. Your body should still be tires cuz you woke up so early, but your consciousness will wake up entirly.



I love Pink Floyd!!

[Originally posted by jilola:]

quote:Originally posted by jilola:
How long? I did a stint of OBE practise 10 years ago that ended with me being too impatient. This time, I began at the time I signed up for this forum, was it Mayish 2002?

Tech details?

Hmm at first I did the NEW for about 3 months until the sensations faded and I realized all I really had to do was a gentle sweep of awareness from feet to head to get a feeling like a pressure wave following the awareness. That's the extent of specific energy work.

Meditation is a bit more difficult to describe as I spend most of my non active time (ie. not specifically concentrating on anything else) in a light meditative state. I extended the state by practising what I'd label a void-mind, could be same as still mind, quiet, whatever.

What I get after a period varying between 15 minutes to me giving up http://www.astralpulse.com/forums/images/icon_Smile_wink.gif" border=0> is a sudden implosive sensation that leaves a lingering and slowly fading sharp prickly sensation. Something like when circulation gets cut to your legs but not quite so pronounced. The funny bit is that to reach this void mind, I don't actively try to stop thinking, rather I let go of thinking. very quickly my mind stills and there is no verbal thought, only fleeting memory-like sensations and thhe occasional visiontype image.

Also I've sought to locate what you guys keeep calling the 3D blackness as I figured this may be indicative of an impending state change. It now appear (3D) within 2 minnutes usually. Doesn't always stay for long, though.

As for exiting I've given up on many of the techniques described, they don't seem to work for me. But since they actually serve as points of focus an d I can concentrate, if anything, I've found that a gentle but insistent feeling of something akin to remembering vaguely of the goal to exit seems to be the way to go.

All this isn't really as exact and definitely not reliable at the moment but from the experiences I've posted before and some that have happened since I can only deduce that I'm on the right track.

Now that I have a feel for what the alleged http://www.astralpulse.com/forums/images/icon_Smile.gif" border=0> RTZ experience was like I can add that to the whole and posibly create better results.
I feel confident that a major hurdle is almost behind me. I'll be sure to post anything interesting.

OOps, that became a rant http://www.astralpulse.com/forums/images/icon_Smile_big.gif" border=0>

2cents & L&L
jouni

 
  I see your problem I think. You are making this wayyyyyy more complicated than it has to be. By cluttering your mind with all these different techs, you are just making you consiousness more active during projection attempts. I had this problem at first, and it was a hell of a thing to get over. Let it all go. The techs, all that you have learned. Open your mind. Let yourself be at total stillness. You must consentrate on not doing so. Clear your mind. Its hard!! You will finds that all these exersises and meditation and everything else on OOBE are meant for one thing. To quite the mind, and let the body go to sleep while you still are concious. You must be ale to move into non-verbal awareness, and you cant do this by thinking about techniuqes. You must get to the right point in projection before you can use these techs. You must stop everything until you have aquired the right state of mind, then the techs can be applied. This is just what I have learned, I have olny projected once so do not take my word for it 100% as I have next to no expereince. I can, however say that I did astral project within three months of starting out, so I must have done something right. I just dont know if I have the expereince to put it into words. This is that attempt. I hope it helped somehow!! If you need more acurate guidance feel free to PM me, I will do asm uch as I can to help. Just dont give up!!!



I love Pink Floyd!!

Haha, very observant of you!! As you can see, my thought proccesses are scattered, and uncomplete due to the fact I had just smoked a joint beforehand. And yes, serving others is probably the thing that I understand to be considered the best understanding of good I have. That is why I exist,  to help other people. Although, my desires are also an important part of me. If I had no desires, I would not have projected to the astral realm in the first place!! One of my desire is to be good to others. It makes me feel good, better about myself, and gives good karma. These are things I desire. To see others happy. Whatever you do, desire has a small part to play, even to the most holy, I beleive. It makes sense. Maybe when a higher level of existence is shown to me my opinion might change.

And lets forget I even said I kicked the child. It was more of a freindly kick that happened without me thinking about it. You have to be there to know. Here is what happened as exact detail as I can remember.

I open the shower certain.
"hey" I said!!   "Your just a little kid"!!

Little kid-"Yes I am"

"what happened to the beautiful girl"!!

"No response"

"Who are you"??

"I am someone that masturbates in the shower all day"!! (do not ask me why he said this)!!  

"But your only 5 years old"!!!!

"so"

At this, I became extremely fightened of the child. He was really wierd, and scared me alot with these wierd replies to my questions. One thing I learned from this is to get over my fear. I did that by resuming the conversation.

I noticed he had lost his left hand, and it was just a stub.

"how did you loose you left hand"??

"from masturbating to much"    

Then I noticed it was his left hand. At that, I spoke aloud

"hey, I am left handed too". Are you a part of me?? I asked. He nodded his head. I explained to him that he was a part of my sexual desires, in human form. I talked openly with him about this with great fear. This little kid was pretty damn wierd, it was firgtening to talk with him. I suppose the biggest lesson I learned was to face my fears. Maybe something was giving me a lesson?? That following my physical desires on the astral was wrong, and by seeking the woman, I was being wrong. She was flirty though!!! But she wasnt. I cant explain. Telepathy is the only thing I can come up with. Maybe it was a lesson to face my fears??


     I suppose it might be a while before I learn wether or not my actions were wrong. I bleleive I handled the situation quite well considering the circumstancing. These are that it is the first time I have ever floated out of my body and expereinced a different realm of existence, consiously. Not really your everyday activity, eh?? haha.  And the forest was directed to wisdom, to whomever wanted to read it. Just a good saying, thats all. And I supose the layout of your first post seemed sort of hatful, yet not in a sense. Just, I feel it was a nasty way of wording it, you know. Like a) do you kick little kids in real life? Now, thats not a very nice thing to say to someone, and for somwone who is astral projecting, it seemed out of place. No one that has ever been there would say that, because they realize how strange the whole thing is. Maybe I got the wrong impression, sorry. Regardless all my posting last night was basically for insight, to everyone about not being jugmental. All those metaphors and stuff can be simplified, I just like using them. And yes, being openminded does not let you know the difference between right and wrong, but the more you learn, the more factors are involved in interpreting right and wrong. One cannot learn without a degree of openess. The more we learn, the better understanding we have of right and wrong. We are choosing the hardest topic in the world to discuss!! Right and wrong. Things just keep popping into my mind before I can type them. Well, no matter lets just be, and try and be good!! Thats what its all about. Intention!!
     


I love Pink Floyd!!

You are blocked because you think you are blocked. It is the only thing holding you back. I dont really have the expereince to explain to someone who has not acheived prejection. I cant explain. I have had one, and it took three months of hard work and dedication to remove the blocks in my mind. Maybe someone who can explain better can help you. I think you just need more time to learn about the expereince. Dont read about it ans talk about it. Do it. All the time. Try it all the time. The more you try the more you learn.

I love Pink Floyd!!

Oh, and that forest saying is not directed at you. Its meant for explaining things to stupid, hatful people on the net in a clear and easy to understand matter. It had to be written with authority(just a joke) And I supose it had to stay in its original form.

I love Pink Floyd!!

You provide me with wondeful phylisophical insight!! From my understanding, according to what Robert Bruce says, there are different planes of reality. This is a mixture of different readings and understanding I have aquired in the last few months: There is a state in which one is pure, and to some, that may be reaching the 7th level of heaven, ones soul will become pure, and join the oneness of everything. "the consiousness"!! Or maybe you become pure at level 6, whatever. Maybe this is nervana, when there are no thoughts or desires?? Whatever this is, as a spiritual being, would not our sexual desires still be a part of us?? In essence, no matter how pure one attempts to make one pure, is it not our nature to still have sexual desires?? Depending on what you would believe to be pure, this can change dramatically acording to yourself. Our understanding of pure, may only be perceived by us through what we know, at that time to be pure. How, with our limited expereince, are we able to perceive this, when we do not know what it is?? With our level of understanding, comparred to what there is to know about reality, we cannot attempt to even understand it, unless we expereince it.* Back to the computer alalogy*

  So, we must now attempt to define pure..........??........... Do you know?? Is it total good?? What is total good?? Do we expereince the desire for sex as an evil thing??  Maybe our desire can be spritually explained, as us being pure. Now, me being the person I am desires a female companion. It is not a flesh desire for sex. Anyone that I, being the person I am that I would want to be with, may guide this desire. A joining of two souls, so to speak. Maybe sex, as we perceive it is the essence of us. We are here because of it. We are here because of the joining of two souls, physically anyways. MAybe this is not such a bad thing?? anyways, the whole thing relates to my other *metaphor alalogy thingy*, on a higher level of understanding. which is also one of the insights of the *mountain part of the wisdom*. MAybe by showing my view, and getting offended I contracticted the very faoundation apun which my understanding was based. Oh well, like the other part,* noone is perfect.*

The stars are refrences to the explaination.

   I have always imagined finding a spiritual being on a different plane that I want to connect with. One that is good. Kind of like a relationship in a different level of existence. Amazing!! Itwould be really neat, think about it. Do you acually think you can move to a different reality beyond the physical? if so, would you want a girlfreind from another plane?? It would be great!! Now, suppose astral projection is a mere travel into the human mind. Not quite that pathetic, but comparred to the other theory quite more understandable. Then it wouldnt make any sort of difference. The problem is, explaining the my girlfreind that I have an inter-dimmentional relationship. Hhaha.

Anyways, back to the fact. Always, constantly re-evaluate your understanding of good and evil, as you expereince through your eyes, keeping on open mind. Anyone with an open mind will know what is good. This is a very helpful tool for life in general, and is what I have learned thorugh my spiritual expereinces. It can change yourself for the better.

I love Pink Floyd!!

Oh hey, thanks for realizing your post may have offended. It did slightly. I hope I elaborated the situation in my reply. ANd no.....it was not a lucid dream trust me!! Wait till you project you will know exactly what I am talking about. You know the reference robert makes in the treatise on projection:"its like conparing a super computer to a childs calculator"?? While, thats about how far apart the two are. I expereince lucid dreams allllll the time, but this was not one of them. This was a fully consiouss projection!!!!! The signs are tell tail to say the least. Vibrating, REM, buzzing sound, astral vision, preasure in chakra areas, floating sentation, seeing my astral body acually float up, the clarity of conciousness, the absolute real surrounds. Not dream surrounding. They are just as real, if not more real that physical. You would simply not understand unless you expereince it. I recognized the ethereal realm. As there is always a point, during projection were one is temporarily in elreal form, wetaher recalled or not. Then wham, reality shift to alice and wonderland aka"astral realm". Things changing, taking into mind the sensitivity of astral matter to though(to quote Robert). Deffinatly AP!! Returning to the physical with a memory of the event more clear and real than any other memory. Now you see, that it was indeed projection.

I love Pink Floyd!!

Glad your happy I made it out after all my hard work!! I was not expecting the judgmental response you presented me with from such an open minded community. I have not had a response as negative as that my entire time on the internet exploring and discussing with other interested and wise people. Everyone I have encountered has given me the most freindly, and encouraging advise. Maybe I can explain to you who I am, and the morrels I have to show that I am not a negative person. That is the last impression I wanted to give on my first post at this wonderfully looking site.

And I dont kick little kids!!!!  I dont suppose I really know if she consented to me following her with the intent of sex. I did not seem to find her afterwards, so I did not have the oportunity to ask her. She seemed to want me to follow. She seemed playful towards me, urging to follow. She did not speak, just smiled. I guess I got the impression that she was interested from the body language. Its not quite clear. She entered the house, and the door was left wide open, as if expecting me. The house was empty, and so I entered. From there I met the child, which was a part of me, we both came to the conclusion of. Maybe what you were tought as morally wrong may be wrong, or not apply to these different demensions. Ofcoarse, in objective reality, or what you want to call as" the world we/you live in", denies the freedom of thought and expression the astral allows. Maybe you would understand if you travelled there?? Thoughs seem to have instant effect on yourself, and the world around you in the astral. In my situation, everything seemed so at home, yet not. Like in alice and wonderland. Ofcoarse I would have asked the being or person if they wanted to engage beforehand!!! I am not an astral rapist or whatever the heck you would call it!!!!!

  And when you project, you will know it. Its not a lucid dreaming at all.

  Acually following the woman seemed to lead me to an important lesson about myself. Remember, conciousness is always expanding, and we will never know the whole truth. Maybe astral projection is nothing more than concious transition into the dream state?? Than rules like that seem absolute folly. I would go about dictating to me about morrels unless your some sort of god. Everyone has a degree of imperfection, and morally, in the sense that you understand, I am extremely more than most on this plane we exist in.

  Regardless, I didnt hurt or disburb any entity, or harm anything in any manner so therfore my actions were not morally wrong. Maybe now, you will see reality from the top of the mountain, instead of stumbling around in a dark forest of false beleives and asumptions and learn to put the peices together from your own prospective, yet be at peice with existence,and be a part of the forest, loving and understanding the creatures in it without deciding what is evil, and forgiving ignorance?? Love is understanding of people who also love. One will never know until one understands.

I love Pink Floyd!!

Congrats!! Looks like you had an OOBE!! Well done. Keep practicing and you will have more of them. I had my first one yesterday morning, and WOW!!!!! I didnt feel any confusing things after the seperation proccess. Which was quite the episode I may add. Terifying to say the least. After I was out I had great control over my enviroment, to a certain extent. I was in the ethereal realm when I projected, but then traveled to the astral(or what I beleive to be the astral) and met some strange people, and found a sort of........ wonderland so to speak(yup, sounds like what I have read about the astral). I have only known about AP for a couple months, but I made it sooner than most people!! I am so exited. I am going to post my expereince so I hope everyone finds it interesting. Maybe you will learn something from it. Most people I talk to expereince darkness, and confusing surroundings once they project and nothing seems to work right. Although for me, I did not find this so. It was cristal clear. More real than real if that makes any sense. I am sooooo exited!! For all you people that havent made it out I can say that practice and hard work will give results. And dont get discouraged because you will do it sometime if you keep trying I promise!! After my experein

I love Pink Floyd!!

You awoke in a state know as sleep paralysis, when the mind becomes aware of objective reality before the body wakes up. This is a state that is very close to dreaming, and from this state it is quite easy to re enter the dream, create a new one or astral project/atempt OOBE.

 If you find yourself in this state when you wake up, try not to be alarmed, and dont move a muscle. From this state, awarness of the physical body is non-existant. You can enter a dream, astral project or just wake up. It is quite easy to fade back into a lucid dream from this state. Practice consentrating on part of your dream/astral body, like your hands to increase lucidity, or prevent returning to objective realtiy sooner than desired, if you find yourself in a lucid dream. If you stay calm during paralysis and maintain it, you can easily phase back into the dream world.

I love Pink Floyd!!