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by "What should be next?" i meant what scene in tv show should be next this was relate to method ThaomasOfGrey mentioned.

It is fairly easy to fall into that borderline sleep state and lose awareness.

that explains why my head starts to lean then i immediately catch that im falling sleep

scenes I called minidreams

yea something was telling me that these are mini dreams

Thank you everyone for answers, really appreciate

Some times I find it very difficult to return to run down, almost like there is some kind of mental strain involved and you get exhausted from driving the scenario.

yea i know what you talking about i have same thing dont know what its is and why

A possible strategy to combat this is to use scenarios that are easily cemented in your mind so you always know what comes next. I don't know if this is an option for everyone but I have a good memory for TV shows that I like. Watching an episode in your mind seems to be a decent way to achieve a non physical focus. Anyone else have any experience with that kind of technique?

i tried that long time ago but i get caught into " what should be next " and i start to think to much, instead  i added my self into tv serial. i did that few min ago result was i held focus longer then usually but at the end scenario continue without me being conscious but i realize that when i brought my awareness back ( its like you woke up from unconscious dream and then u know that some stuff happened ) i had this twice in ~40 min. i dont know why i stop being conscious at the end.
Any idea ?

two weeks ago i came a cross Tom's videos and he basically confirmed what i was suspecting from quite some time (i needed out side confirmation) that you dont need work on chakras, you dont need vibrations, you dont need raise from body, you dont need sleep paralysis, you dont need specific amount of time to ap. Place, time, position it doesnt matter.
Everything is about what are my beliefs
This explains why Robert Bruce's 400$ program didnt work form me. I simply dont belief that i have to do all that chakras work or chanting for 24 hours ( which i did ) to proof my higher self that i really want ap ( like past 1,5 year of trying wasnt good enough proof ;p if we what to go this path ).
Unfortunately i started learning about ap from youtube videos and if you watch youtube 99% of ap videos contains all this old limiting beliefs 
So i stopped caring about vibrations, if my body is 100% relaxed. I sit in chair my head is not resting and i go much deeper than i ever been before. I didnt ap but i experience now many different levels of consciousness which i never experienced before, which is awesome.
I understand now why some people say that you dont go OUT of your body this is more inter exploration you go inwards and it actually feels for me like going more and more inside
Now i understand why Xanth said that you can ap standing on your head, i sat with cross legs on floor ( for test ) my back was straight  it wasnt comfortable i could feel my back but after some time i went deeper and deeper i wasnt aware of my back hurting any more when end and i brought back my awareness oh boy i could feel them ;p  Point is i can get to the same state on floor with my back hurting and when i sit in chair comfortably, Campbell can ap on one leg there is no reason why you couldnt ap upside down on your head. Position and physical relax is irrelevant

3 weeks ago i had ld i demanded full awareness now i immediately become much much MUCH more conscious so i knew what work i want to do i knew i need to be in my room ( doesnt matter why and what was my plan ) so i said i what to be in my room - nothing, i said when i turn around i will see my room - nothing, i found door i thought i will open doors and i will see my room - i opened doors nothing, i opened next doors and i see my body standing in front of me looking at me not moving, this scared sh* out of me it was ( then ) disgusting and creepy and i woke up.
After thinking about this amazing experience i realize ( i knew that before ) im not my body, im non physical, i dont need to be in my room its illusion anyway.

Over last 6 months im using phasing and noticing, watching hypnagogic imaginary 
Now knowing what i know i have questions.
Most of the time when you read about watching hypnagogic imaginary you see something like: watch shapes ,be passive ,then shapes become scenario and you being drawn into scenario. but why?
Tom Campbell said he is meditating then he is pure consciousness in black void and from that point he decide what he what to do healing remote viewing etc.
Why i have to be drown in to some random scene, i know now that this is illusion its pointless to appear on some random ship, its not pointless its unnecessary just like raising from body.
So perhaps this is another limiting belief because i expect something that will not appear just like vibrations
Now when i writing this its clear to me that people been drawn into scenarios because they identify themselves as body so they have to be somewhere, they cant be nowhere, just like raising from body if they expect to go out of the body they have to get out somehow or silver cord that "connect soul and body" 

I know that some people know what void im talking about 
how you recognize that you are in that void ? i assume that i never been in void so how do i know when im there
I understand that im asking about something that is hard to put into words  but if someone will take time and try i will really appreciate this

( im not making fun of or nagging people who beliefs that they need work with charkas etc if this work for you, perfect awesome )

-S

1. Sounds like you have some inflamation in your knees. Position some pillows so that your knees are slightly bent. Don't put the pillows too tight under your knees as it will restrict blood flow.
2. An hour is sufficient for one practice session. Do shorter sessions through the day. 
3.  Exercise regularly. Don't do the same type of exercise every day. If you walk vary the surface that you are walking on. For example hike one day on dirt, walk on the road or track the next day and ride a bike or swim  another day. I found exercising on an elipse in the gym to be very helpful for knee pain when it flairs up.
4. Don't sleep on your back. It locks out your knees. Keep them slightly bent while you sleep.
5. if you have a recliner do your projection/phasing practice in the recliner. It's best not to do this in your bed. It's a skill you are learning, not nap time. Train your body to relax into trance while your in that place. A designated place is best but your bed is probably the worst place to practice. You can project in any position, you do not have to be lying down. ...

I am still waiting to see Xanth project while he is standing on his head. He better hurry, doing stunts gets more difficult as you age 

nope its no it,
i dont sleep on back , i always bent knees when im on side, i practice  in bed , on floor and on chair, i can get to hypnagogic state quickly and it doesnt matter where im,
this pain occurs in joints and muscle
i never get this pain when i sleep only when i play with consciousness
again sometimes
I read somewhere that pain could be test like itching before sp but dont know if that true
(yes i know i dont need sp to obe)

Thank you for trying

Sometimes when i lying still in bed doesnt matter how, after 60-90 min my legs start hurt more and more and more until pain is so strong that i need get up because i cant focus any more and im fine pain disappears immediately. im perfectly healthy btw.
pain feels like crushing bones ( mostly knees ) it also happens sometimes when i wake up ( because i fell asleep during meditation attempting ap ) and i know that i want to ap so i dont move and pain occurs quickly.
again sometimes.
Any one know why this happens ? 

Have you ever just sat down on a beach at sunset and just "watched" the sun while it's setting?
You just sit there, watching... taking it all in... enjoying it... not thinking about anything... not judging the sunset...
You're just straight up enjoying the experience.  You're "seeing" it, but you're not "watching" it.  You're "taking it in", but not really "looking" at it.
It's a passive experience of "experiencing".

Does that make any sense? 

yea  i get this i think

Look behind them not at them. The second you try to recognise what they may be, your analyzing them. This part of your mind shouldn't be used at this time.

I like this very much very clear, except "Look behind them not at them"

In your case I would suggest to try interacting with the scene and the shapes. Stretch your astral arm and try to touch them. Try to change the shapes.

That was interesting i did that for the first time. I saw a shape and i imagine that i grab it with my hand and i immediately saw/ was watching my hand holding pole on some small boat and i was sailing in cave that was maybe 3 sec long experience so random, it wasnt color it was made of black&white/hypnagogic colors. later i was thinking maybe i was imagine this but there is no reason  for me to imagine boat or sailing in cave, very random thing

I really have to focus on not concentrating on the sounds or the imagery otherwise it's a fail.

You can and should definitely pay close attention to them... in fact, pay so much attention to them that you allow them to draw your awareness INTO them. 

The images you start to see should be noticed but mostly ignored.
You should still notice them and not pay any attention yet.

umm sure.

First thanks for answers and that you are trying to help me

lets clarify something from what i understand there are few steps
relax > lights/shapes > scenes/landscapes > merge with scene 
Im stuck with shapes when i notice them they disappear after sometime

The images you start to see should be noticed but mostly ignored.
You should still notice them and not pay any attention yet.

I dont understand what you saying. How can i see something and not watch it ?
And since i dont understand it im probably not doing it right so please explain it

I really have to focus on not concentrating on the sounds or the imagery otherwise it's a fail.

interesting i always focus and images disappears, i will learn not to concentrate.
How you not concentrate if thats all what you see ? When you notice how you un-notice ?

You shouldn't be thinking about anything really... just go with what's being shown to you.  Allow yourself to see it with no judgment.
If you begin to think about things, you'll begin to analyze what you see... that will bring your intellect into the equation and, for most people, will ruin the experience by shooting you out of it.

I read on other website and opinion are split some people say pay close attention to this shapes and that how you progress other say ignore them completely .
what i was doing always was when i saw something i start to pay attention and focus on this shapes really hard ( just like u try to see something very far or you trying to hear some quiet noise ) and they start to be more sharp i see clear borders between black and white but then they just stop and disappears
i used to but now i dont talk to myself while doing this

what are you thinking about when you watching hypnagogic imagery ?
i can easily go to that state when i start to see lights and shapes and sometimes i can "evolve" that to be able to see something that starts to looks like landscape but sometimes i start to see shapes / lights and they disappears.   now i did this soo many times but i have no clue what makes me to "evolve" that state and i have no idea why it stops instead of evolve
perhaps you have suggestion or you found some helpful trick
thanks
S

I'll take a stab at this though to be honest I'm not sure what your question is, the only one I could find is "does anyone have experience with this?", also Bruce Moen's online book store is down so I can't pick up a copy of the book and read it to see what exactly he is talking about (I mean who doesn't their ebooks on kindle in this day and age:).  However with playing around with this a little bit I believe the tightness in your chest is coming from your intent to not let your intent happen.  What I mean is you build up an intent to move your finger but you don't want at first to actually move your finger so you have to block this intent from actually happening.  I use to get this same sensation when attempting to do the Monroe log roll where you are trying to roll over with your 'energy body' but not your physical one.

I believe the tightness is actually do to a stabilizing slight isometric hold of your chest muscles. If you try to hold yourself perfectly still, as in no movement at all you get this same tightness in your chest and quads (at least I do).  I do not think this is what you want.  I would back off slightly so you hold the intent in your mind without developing this tightness, once the tightness shows up you are overdoing it, for lack of a better word.  I would stop and start the intent over until you can hold the intent without allowing it to physiologically express (In the form of chest tightness).  Then once you have this intent down this would be the state to try and use to move awareness away from your body.  Hopefully this helps a little.  Good luck with your practices.

EDIT:  isometric contraction or hold just means you allowing tension to build up.

Thanks for answer, yea this make sense
I was wondering about this chest thightnes and when i found someone alse with same experience i was really curious what it is and why it heppened and if this is the feeling moen was talking about.

Yea his store is closed but he doesnt have this book (the last one ) in ebook form anyway  ( i found this information somewhere on his website ) ...

Basically you use this method to lern how your inten feels like. When you bend your finger first you have intent to do it then impusle go from brain to musle and you bend finger, but this process is so fast that normally you dont notice this , acording to moen and moens students you can use that feeling of inten to project/phase .

Long time a go i wake up in the midle of the night and i said out loud" you know i dont give a f* i will go o sleep right now and i will have lucid dream i will remeber it perfectly" ( i was realy angry ) i fall a sleep and i had lucid dream that night , so i understend that intet is very powerfull. You cant fake it, you can say it but it doesnt mean that you truely mean it, and this method add that meaning to what you want, moen said that it can really boost your affirmation i can see other use of this intent boost like healing or manifesting thats why i was and still am suprise that there is so little info about this method

Few tips i found
Use non dominant hand ( use left hand if you normaly write with your right hand )
Some people bend finger some stop befor bending and then they bend
Feeling you looking for is impatience, "be ready to go" , waiting for something to happen

I will post more info here in future when i will be able to feel this feeling

~Stan

Did you also check the 2nd link I provided? I quickly found several responses to your topic on Bruce's site by doing a simple Google search.

i quoted from second link and there is no answer to my question otherwise i wouldnt ask here

Bruce Moen was briefly on the board here back in 2003 often responding to Frank's posts. You may find your answer in his five responses at AP.

http://www.astralpulse.com/forums/profiles/bruce_moen-u1154.html

Also, Bruce Moen has his own talk board (afterlife-knowledge.com). Here is a related response to your question on that forum.

http://afterlife-knowledge.com/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.cgi?action=print;num=1272573858

I have not read Bruce Moen yet myself and I am not familiar with his methods technically, but he is a very well respected leader in the OBE community and one of Robert Monroe's original travelers (e.g., I think he was a teenager at the time).

Good luck. 

i read his posts here and i quoted from second link and there is no answer to my question otherwise i wouldnt ask here

I was reading posts from 2003 on this forum and i found interesting exercise call Silly Little Finger Bending Exercise. I read in Bruce Moen's book  how to do it and what feeling to expect. I start to feel some physical feeling and i dont know if they are correct one because i never paid attention to how impatience or "be ready to go" ( as someone said here ) feels like. I found and other forum this :

"I've done this exercise a few times and the closest I've come to feeling intent is a tightness in my chest that gets released after I move the finger. Has anyone else experienced this?
I also feel a bit of a twitch in the back of my head "

And this is exactly what im feeling, tightness in chest and twitch in the back of my head
Im surprise that there is not much information about this exercise

So perhaps 12 years later there is some here who knows how it feels and where it feels

For those who dont know about this exercise,  here is quote from Ginny

Okay...here's the Intent post:

In using the TMI Gateway tapes over 13 years ago, if I had known then what I know now about the placing of intent, I never would have spent so many hours hanging out in that inner 3D blackness--while using a tape---waiting for something to happen. I would get to a focus level and then just wait for someone or something to happen, having no idea that all I had to do was mentally state my desire---where I wanted to go, what I wanted to do. Now I know that placing intent is a simple thing to do. Actually we do it constantly and really never give it much thought.
What Bruce calls, The Little Finger Exercise: this is where I am now going to FEEL that place within where we actually place the intent for anything. I use this everytime I want to place the intent to explore because it works. As I remain relaxed, knowing I'm going to move, say, my index finger in a few seconds, as I approach that moment of actually moving my finger I first just feel and become acquainted with that area within where we make things happen. Some people 'see' color or perhaps an image, some just feel that inner place. At Bruce's workshop I 'saw' a soft orange color (why I don't know)...but most importantly, I became acquainted with what that area of consciousness *felt like*. And when you're there, move your finger. And then do it again but instead of moving your finger, place your intent (desire) on where you want to go in the afterlife, who you want to meet, etc. I must say here that I don't feel I'm explaining this step well....but I hope you guys can get the drift. There are times in the afterlife when I just relax and send out a mental statement.....place my intent.

Have fun with this. It's only been around 10 days since we heard about this new travel method so I'm learning as I go...but as is true with everything in the afterlife, all of it is ours...available to all, at any time. And Adrian, Bruce has posted several messages at his conversation board regarding this, so you may want to pay a visit and read as I'm sure I've only given a rough idea here.

Much love...and I enjoy very much being a part of this forum. Thank you again.

Ginny

Okay after long research i found answer to my question Why i snap back
Snapping back is protective sense of awareness and its a good thing means you make progress

Q:
Okay i've started to notice a strange phenomenon during my practice sessions. Sometimes I feel like I might be about to phase, or obe, or I'm viewing hypnagogic imagery, and then I will "snap back". This snapping back is something like being in a daydream and then realizing where you are in real life. It's sort of a sudden change in your focus of awareness.

A:
Yes, that's what you should be experiencing. It's a distinct shift in your focus of awareness. And there is no mistaking it too. Like, you are not placed in a situation where you are left wondering did you make the shift or not.

The reason why you currently keep snapping-back, is due to your protective sense of awareness kicking in. It's not something you can consciously control as the protection aspect operates on a very base level. But it does stop happening the more you practice. As your protective sense of awareness gets used to the shift, it becomes a case of, yawn, here we go again.

here is link: http://www.astralpulse.com/forums/welcome_to_astral_consciousness/a_little_bit_to_the_right-t3975.0.html;msg119691#msg119691

Hi everyone
Few days ago i realize that, (in past) when i was charging my chakras ( base on what robert bruce talk ) i often start to have random movies/thoughts but without inner voice without talking to myself. I didnt know why i cant achieve that state when i try to project, later i realize that charging charkas was nothing more (in this case) than strong focus on deep breathing and visualization of energy. I did that few days ago (deep breading for about 40 min) and i start to visualize that im in my room ( i tried image this as much realistic i can so i brought back image of piano from memory ) i took a flashlight that is on my piano (which is true ) i turn on it and it became lightsaber from star wars ( and that part wasnt my i didnt think ohh and it will become lightsaber ) and i look at this lightsaber and i thought "umm what" and i snap back, im pretty sure that i project and i became conscious for a split of second
In past i have few experience with light, I was visualize that im walking on the street and at some point i randomly look at sun or car's headlight and they were oddly bight, blinding, realistic and i snap back in a second,
that why i choose to pickup flashlight.
*Any one know how to overcome this snapping back ?

I looked on forum but i didnt find answer

Thanks
Stan

Well, im no expert in the matter, but it seems to me, from the outlook of your images that you are remote viewing something.

Interesting that you mention remote viewing, about 10 months ago i had something like that i was siting in my room on chair and trying to project and after a while i realize that i can see my room very clearly i didnt saw that i have body i was more like consciousness moving through my room but i was simultaneously fully aware of my body and i could feel it, i did post here but no one answered what it is, later i find out that Robert Bruce call it Mind Split effect and other call it remote viewing

["seeing things" is very important, but the point of them isn't to just "see things".It's to use those things as your focus to remove yourself from THIS reality. So being able to HOLD an image, isn't really important.]

I really think I should not be on this forum as everyone phases or learns to phase.   

The reason im trying phase method is because over past 12 months i tried traditional method like rope etc waiting for vibrations and nothing was happening everyday i tried, so i switch to phasing
especially after reading what Xanth wrote about phasing and about his fast progress, also Robert Bruce switch to phasing method he said by himself that this method is faster

Here is what I said:
"seeing things" is very important, but the point of them isn't to just "see things".
It's to use those things as your focus to remove yourself from THIS reality.  So being able to HOLD an image, isn't really important.

I used wrong word i dont see i watch them so by watching im focusing on them therefore im removing myself from this really but

If you have one image which you're able to hold for an hour is no different from getting image after image after image.. as long as what you're seeing is taking your awareness away from THIS reality.
That's all that's important.

when shapes fade away they never come back ( and im not hooked up on specific shapes i know that they are changing all the time and it doesnt matter what they are how they look ) the point is that they dont come back. im predicting that the reason is that i focus on them so much and i bring myself back from trance even if i dont comment "for example: oo what is this"  but i could be wrong
-

Second thing
I cant figured out why sometimes i can see shapes/dots and sometime i see images like this:





i notice that i usually see them when i sat down relax and let my mind completely free (the monkey mind is free) i dont try control it and after some time i snap and focus on what i see and i see images like these but not always
1. i dont understand why i dont see them always after i snap
2. first of what make ( ok i make they but how ) them to appear

Third thing
I create this image based of what i saw its fairly accurate

this are shelves in shop/market 
you can see noise, its black&white and you cant see whole picture of shelves only circle, its look like you are watching through hole.
months ago when i tried to project i saw my ceiling through close eyes (normal color image just like real life ) and when i notice that i wasnt sure if i have open my eyes so i squeeze them (they were close) and i start to watch like through hole a big hole that slowly shrink a saw less and less of ceiling and more of black frame with small hole in the middle until it was completely black.

Im curious about that "hole" any one experienced something similar with hole ?

Hi
Thank you all of you for all your responses

Good luck, hope to read a succes post with this technique written by you soon!

Yes, for sure i will write post

I think most people are missing the point of the Noticing Exercise...

Well i miss the point i think, because i was notice bight dots or some shapes and if they desperate then i would stop take a break and come back hour later i thought that this work this way:
black > noise ( tv snow) > shapes,dots,lights > back&white image > color "HD" image > being "out" (in that image)
so if dots or shapes fade away i just stopped  and do all over

When you are starting to see things that is the time to get out of your body.   If you just lie there and do nothing the shapes will stop so the experience is likely to end.   

I thought that the point of phasing method is to do nothing until you phase out (beside noticing but i dont consider it as doing something), do you mean i shod do some exit technique ? like rope

Stan

Hi,
Im playing with phasing method and i feel that this method gave me the most "success" and information about me that any other method i tried in last 12 months
i can easily see something every time i do attempt which is awesome  im doing progress so yay

during noticing i start to see shapes and i watch them and watch and they slowly disappear i know about eye problem but i didnt notice that i change my focus, the shapes just fade
Any one know other reasons why shapes could stop ?

If this is the case, then don't be expecting the more traditional and physical feeling of separating and floating out of your body. With Phasing, at a certain point you will simply transition instantly into the scene.

Thank you very much EscapeVelocity that is a great information !

Hi everyone,
long time since i posted something ,
its 10th month when im trying AP,
month ago i started to think that im clearly doing something wrong and i decide to do things which i didnt believed that are required to AP ( clearing chakras, doing mantras for opening 3rd eye, now i started sun gazing and drink special vegetable-fruit juice [blehh] to clean pineal gland )

since i started clearing chakras and doing mantra especially after mantra i started to see easily random color light patterns when i have close eyes 
anyway since that time i started to experienced something that i dont know what it is and what to do with that

i relax, clear my thoughts and after ~20min i start to get this random "movies" of random things. During this movies im not aware of any thing i just see them in my mind its like imagination but more realish because you are not aware of anything until i "wake up" like a short vivid dreams ( these movies are short like few seconds and they are random )   sometime i gain awareness and start to see my hands but this is second and i wake up (also its rare) and after that im suck again in to this movies for few seconds and again and again. In this movies when i see source of light like a sun or car headlight or reflection of light on building this light is always very bight and im instantly wake up when i notice it

What are this flashes of movies ? is there any name for it
what can i do with them, is there any AP technique that use them to project ?

Thanks !
Stan

hi 
quickly what im doing and few questions

i sit in my chair and i start thinking about rubbish until i start see some random thoughts that are not "my" im half conscious then, i recognizes that state and i immediately focus my eyes and i see some random imagines in blackness like face or vines or spinning triangles

once i saw spinning triangles that start move closer and closer and when i look in the middle of them i start to see tunnel that look like this:

then i start laughing i almost fall from my chair i dont know why , yea i know passive observation

another day i saw vines that start move closer and closer

1. is these images must move ? and get bigger and bigger ? is that the rule ?
2. this tunnel is this my goal ? should all images transform in to this tunnel ? or tunnel is just another image and it shouldn't bother me that i dont see it any more 
3. what should i do next when i see these images ? 

Thanks
Stan

I used to use those but soon found out the earbuds really hurt my ears later on in the night if I slept sideways.  I'd recommend putting your device on volume without the buds! 

Do you had any success with this method  ?

Also, there are lots of Android apps that use the accelerometer to "tell" if you're in REM or not.  You can record audios of yourself saying "I'm dreaming" or whatever you choose.  I've used that a few times and had great success with it 

Do you remember name of your app ? 
why you do use it anymore ;p ?

yea, i had ld today but i have no idea if it was because of looped mp3
i waked up at 4am i was reading about sp and ld for 30 min after that i was inducing sp (i felt vibration but i was analyze them to much ) after that i turn on mp3 and did MILD until i fall asleep

-Stan