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Not quite what I mean, I by no means at all wish to stay on the ethric planes, I'm only wondering if you can stay with them in the astral and higher planes once you've both passed on from the physical.

Inkheart

It seems reasonable enough since (judging by countless NDE experiences) the fact that you spent your physical life with that person means you both, together, chose to participate in it in the first place. Therefore, you both have something in common that connects you in the astral.

Look up Theory of the Torsion Fields, very interesting stuff.

I am currently in the process of researching and understanding what I think is actually happening.
For instance, Thomas Campbell explained the following (Behold my unimaginable skills in MS Paint):


The green is our little system - the Universe, everything physical. The red is the paranormal, or nonphysical shell around it.
Yet, you can see the gray 'circles' are what Consciousness is and the other colorful 'circles' are other systems like ours (with all their differences of course) within consciousness. So, we are merely a drop in the sea, so to say.

Dr. Campbell he said that we eventually will always find ourselves in a dead end street following the principle that everything derives from something else.
I believe something has created Consciousness and all within it, but we cannot yet understand who or what that is since, I think, it has created Consciousness while being in an environment outside of consciousness itself and probably still is there. So we would have to go beyond the system of consciousness to see who's in charge of it and who's in charge of what is in charge of consciousness and so forth. Unless, it has accidentally or intentionally left clues within the system of consciousness that would identify it.

Thus, I think we are not exactly a farm since we would not be productive enough to contribute any power that would be significant to whatever created consciousness. More like an endless amusement park for us to participate in, while something is observing our behavior so as to create other similar amusement parks and establish statistics that would probably help its self development in the hierarchy of its own system, or whatnot..

It is interesting because I believe it has created consciousness in its own image or of an image of something in its system as it is the only source of knowledge it can extract ideas from. Much like how we created helicopters by looking at bugs
And perhaps it finds itself in its own prison cell of consciousness created by something else and so it goes. Someone once said that when you just think you found an answer it is just another illusion. It supports in a way the principle that something always has to derive from something else.
Well, in my opinion Dr. Campbell is right after all when it comes to consciousness, yet I still think he is considering consciousness to be all that is. And maybe it is, but not for me until proven how it came to be, which, I am afraid, will not happen anytime soon, if ever.

I realised, however, that you may be referring to something else. I think that we may indeed be illustrated as a farm for other beings in our conscious system to feed of. And these beings may be a farm for other beings to feed off of them.
We see this process in the animal kingdom, for example.. yet not a good one. I don't elaborate my point well in the post as a whole and I'm sorry, but I am in a hurry and I like taking my time to explain myself well since my condition prevents me from remembering terms and certain meanings of words and it usually takes time for me to dig into my notes and attach the points there to whatever point I am expressing here.

Edit: I recently noticed Mr. Campbell to actually mention something about this that goes into the 'we cannot and do not know' lines. I hope is turns out to be incorrect for the first former.
Best regards

Let's see what Franz Bardon has to say about this:

The mental and astral bodies are connected to the physical
body only by a very subtle elastic ribbing that shines like silver. If during the period in which the mental
and astral bodies are loosened from the physical matrix, the latter were touched by another person, no
matter whether skilled or unskilled in magic practice, the said ribbon, being extremely subtle, would
break in two at once. The connection between the physical body being thus interrupted, physical death
would be the consequence.

Additionally, it has not been documented to my knowledge that anyone has been pulled out of their physical body by another human being. There were however a few that say they have helped someone that has projected but is stuck.

[I think]

So your telling me if you had a device and all you had to do was push a button and you would be out of body, you wouldn't use it?

I think he is missing the point by endorsing an assumption that taking 'supplements' or, in your case, using devices is something not part of the journey; such a road does not exist. There is no action (as everything is action) that is not an inevitably pertaining part of the journey.
If it exists, here, now, it is a part of the journey. Ethics are holding you back on your journey of discovering new places along the way; yet they are a part of the whole and adhering them is tempting so as to satisfy the Ego's desires that are somewhat parallel to those upheld beliefs imposed on it by the others sharing its surroundings.
Ethics are, of course, required, since if the action of taking supplements we illustrate as running along the way, then ethics are merely a way to slow down and observe your surroundings and the land where you are; the newly found one.
But after a while you may have to run again, to discover new lands since the former ones no longer have the 'stuff' and have become the erstwhile.

You already are.

I can't wait for your update!
Thanks

[VERY]

Hi Cho, you wrote.

I must say that you are one lucky son of a gun. I have only read about bonafide amazonian shamanic ayahuasca ceremonies in books (Jim DeKorne's "Psychedelic Shamanism") and seen them on tv (A program about the Amazon on Discovery or History Chanel this past Sunday night). From what I understand about taking ayahuasca the set and setting are VERY important. The intention, the location, the other people in the ceremony and the master shaman all must be in harmony in order for the participants to get benevolent visions and an OBE.
So good luck with that.

Regards 
Grey

Hello, Greytraveler

This particular shaman I know of has given a friend of mine the ayahuasca before ( she is a missionary in Peru right now ). When she drank it, she had a very clear image of a snake resting upon her head, she began perceiving through the illusion of this frequency, into other dimensions, and still does. Some 30 minutes of puking was involved in the beginning so as to, as far as I understand, clean the body and soul. I don't think she has been ill ever since, including any negative emotions of loss and so forth, which is what I am most interested in - the healing.

I think the vines growing in the jungle there contain high amounts of DMT molecule. Yet, I realised it would be worse than suicide if I am to take the real shamanistic substance without any protection. In the long term, it might be like imposing life upon something that is suffering, in a way. And I can't think of anything worse than that.

It's a shame shamans are disappearing one by one. I think in Africa there are 2 or 3 left as well.

If the cord was severed, your physical body and brain would die but your astral body would remain in the astral. I don't think that sucks, I think it's pretty cool.  In my opinion though it's only the death of the body in the physical which causes the severing of the cord, not anything you can do in the astral.

This statement should only be treated as a theory, which it is. It is yet to be ascertained whether a person dies due to cord severance or something else. I do support this theory to some degree, but it is only a theory.
Astral experiences, in my opinion, may cause insanity or any condition pertaining to it. And it would usually be in result, based on my own experiences, due to the lack of understanding about the experience, where does it derive from and why it is as it is; in other words, ignorance.

What I try to emphasize on with the following quote is that plants are meant/willing to help humans alter their perspective and observe the observer. Thus, I believe, weed pertains to these plants and it is not taking a shortcut ( It is ignorant to assume you can achieve the absolute clarity on your own, as nothing works that way), but merely taking the right way, the only way. So long you do not fall into extremes, that is become addicted of observing the observer and restrain yourself from the experience you are meant to have on this, current vibrating frequency. To observe the observer is merely a way to avoid the extreme of being ignorant due to arrogance and assumptions.All you will find here regarding your question is various differing opinions, so whenever somebody says something, ask yourself: 'Why do they say that? Just because it is so for them?'
Nobody has died from weed to my knowledge, so it is up to you to try it yourself. Yet, I am not encouraging you to do it, just sharing my own opinion.
It is an interesting read, nevertheless. I encourage you to read it

A Shamanism Primer, from My Experience,
By Peter Gorman (cited at David Icke's Forums)

Link: http://www.davidicke.com/forum/showthread.php?t=9538&page=5

Hello

Interesting technique, the last one. I will try it soon, see what happens. I will post results for anyone interested.
Thanks

Yet, these people seem not to realise far more beautiful 'realities' are a part of their consciousness but it is the ignorance that holds their hand from adjusting the frequency of perceiving.

Apparently that would be the best thing to do the first couple of times.

Post by ladyjane from David Icke forums:

Hi everyone
I have drunk Ayahuasca 10 times under the guidance of two master shaman Ayahuascaros plus three apprentices in the Peruvian Amazon and am returning later this year for 5 more ceremonies.

I know Aya is available in the West but I would never take it without the guidance of a master shaman who can hold the space and ensure no dark entities enter one's auric field whilst in the mareacion (ayahusaca state).
Ayahuasca opens the crown chakra fully and in an unprotected environment very, very unpleasant beings can take advantage of that. This is not fluffy New Age BS but a very serious warning. Demonic possession is real and not fun.

Not only that, taking Ayahuasca is not a recreational activity like popping a few 'shrooms. It will send to into the depths of your own hell, screaming, shitting and puking, thinking you're dying in order to deal with whatever you have to deal with. It is strong medicine, NOT a recreational drug.

Ayahuasca is not like other psychedelics but will take you beyond a trip experience deep into other realities. If any of you have read Rick Strausman's book DMT The Spirit Molecule you will read the accounts of seasoned psychedelic users describing DMT as like nothing else they have taken. Ayahuasca differs in certain respects to pure intravenous DMT but parallels can be drawn. For example, one subject is quoted as saying "this is REAL, not just like doing LSD/mushrooms".

I would concur. Ayahuasca bears no resemblence to any psychedelic I had taken. Interestingly, the Amazonian shamans are offended if you call the sacred vine a 'drug' or 'psychedelic'. Ayahuasca is so much more than that and as such should be treated with the highest respect. The vine should be taken, I feel, only in a sacred and protected setting.

This is why I am a little alarmed with folks on this thread suggesting home consumption. Perosnally I would never, ever do this but if you must, do your homework and know what you're letting yourself in for first.

Why would you want to take short cuts?
Learn to do it yourself and you'll be much stronger for it in the end.

Hello

@ Xanth: I think you have missed my aim with this. Only when you try the shaman ayahuascha you will see what I mean. It's about healing, even though an inevitably pertaining aspect is the thrust to higher states of consciousness (remaining for the rest of your life after a couple of sips) that I assume you were referring to.

@Greytraveler: Thanks for the information. I figured it'd be best if I travel to Amazonia this summer and learn how to brew the herb myself. I know of a shaman there that a friend of mine is in close relations with, and he'd be glad to teach.

Yes, I think it is what part of the website says that it is contained in quite a lot of plants. But the question that bothers me is how to extract the DMT substance itself without the rest  of what the plant is made of.
I know dealers used to sell this drug before, usually to college students but I have not seen it recently. Also it has become illegal without any justification whatsoever.
I think the amazonian Ayahuasca, made by the shamans there, contains this substance and because of that it is so strong when it comes increasing the perception beyond the physical senses.

Has anyone ever tried DMT and, if so, does one know where to obtain some of this currently illegal drug in it's most natural mode, or if it even possible nowadays? Or if anyone has managed to frame it on their own in a way that it would provide satisfactory results
I noticed that it's less and less observable, especially around university campuses where it used to be seen a lot in former times.


Here is more information for those interested in this amazing substance:

Links removed

Astir, It is not my intention to offend you, but I must say you assume too much.
I am on a raw vegan diet for a while now (reversed my diabetes; my whole family tree is full of diabetics and it eventually tried to take a grasp on me) and, not only have I lost all my excessive over weight, but I am very productive now (rarely feel the need for sleep which provides me with the opportunity), very active, never sick, never ill. I do not try to change people with words, it is useless as I have seen, instead I change those around me by making them look at how I have changed and how I am changing in due course.  Eventually, they come up with their questions.
Do not believe me if you wish, it is alright as long as I have tried to help.
Cheers

Ever seen a chef with glasses?
You can do exercises for the eyes and, additionally, cutting onions to make your eyes produce tears is a native remedy my people use.

Seriously, lately I am feeling a blockage of some sort. I can't focus, nor can I expand my awareness like before. I have never had trouble with falling asleep accidentally while trying to 'project' but just recently it started happening. Anyone else?