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( or agree to such inane concepts as "we are the masters of the planet and by damn it's our divine right to kill and eat anything that moves"

Sorry, but I take exception to that.  Specifically, that you consider it inane.  The fact is nature has a food chain, and for better or for worse, Humans are pretty much at the top of it.  Eating animals is how 99% of us survive; indeed, without the requisite "spiritual knowledge," it cannot even be said that any of we omnivores is even doing anything "wrong."  So please, spare us your judgements in that respect - or need I remind you that your spiritually advanced immune system is, right now, killing millions of pathogenic bacteria, endowed - presumably from your point of view - with as much right to live as any of us?

Aros, thanks for relating your story for us.

I have a suggestion regarding contacting your sister.  Try and read some Bruce Moen; just his website should suffice.  He seems to be an expert in this field, and there's a story on his site which may help.  It is to do with using imagination to begin the conversation and then letting the "real" follow from there.

As for the "narrators" you guys are hearing, mightn't they be your higher selves, or parts of them?

Didn't Shpongle do a song about it, called Behind Closed Eyes or something?  Anyway, I don't think Learning to Fly is really about AP.  David Gilmour is very big on actual aviation, owning as he does a huge range of airplanes.

Paker, you're a sweet guy

And you guys keep on worshipping Guru Brucurama. Some people are wired like that i guess.  Remember, NEVER broaden your horizon !!

Oh well, that post of mine was wasted after all.  You're a troll.

Well, his techniques certainly work for me, matey.  Thanks to NEW I was able to cure myself of a nasty injury that conventional medicine couldn't.  And while I've never had a conscious projection, Robert Bruce's techniques have brought me MUCH closer to one than anybody else's.  I've also had the pleasure of communicating privately with him on a number of occasions and found him to be nothing less than polite and pleasant, not to mention extremely helpful.

You say that he doesn't even acknowledge compliments...have you seen the sheer volume that he receives?  If he said thanks for each one he would spend all day every day doing little else.

You may claim that you're simply trying to promote critical discussion, but in my opinion you could have gone about it in a much better way.  Don't be afraid to talk at length about alternatives; we're all pretty open-minded people or else we wouldn't be here in the first place.  But please stop being so provocative, it won't win you any friends or respect.

Personally, if I'd found alternatives to NEW which worked better, I would have started a thread about them and pointed out, in an objective fashion, why they work better and I would have asked others to give them a try and post some feedback.

Oh, one last thing - if Robert were trying to simply make some cash out of people, I don't think he'd have posted so much free information on his website.  Robert himself has said that his completely free treatise on OBE is all you really need to get out of body.

R.Monroe had an encounter with the Astral Police in one of his books- 'Far Journeys' I think it was and to mark him as an offender he was made to put his astral hands in some weird type of ink that didn't come off until the next time he projected.

The way I read it, it sounded more like something to do with tha astral plane he was on.  You know, the specific locale.

I can't imagine why we, in our original forms, would do anything to place limitations on the choices we make, especially moral choices.  Good or bad, experience is what is wanted.  The idea of "astral police" kind of defeats that aim, in my opinion.

No offence intended, but I think most people here are approaching the problem from the wrong end.

I think that lucid dreams are a product of the mind, whilst OBEs are not.  The fact that there are a lot of similarities is hardly surprising, given that both involve non-physical perception.

Which leaves us with the real question, how to tell the difference?  We all have our theories on that, I'm sure.  What I'm trying to say, ultimately, is that just because there are lots of similarities, doesn't mean they're the same thing.  Imagine two different towns that are reached by the same road, except at a point where the road eventually splits into two, both of which lead to the two towns.  The journey begun in the same way, but the destinations are different.  That's how I see the whole picture here.

Well, plugging the headphones in and switching off your speakers ought to do the trick.

Adrian

I just want to say thanks to you and all others involved in the move.  A fantastic and speedy job has been done, and I'm very grateful.  The best part?  It's now fully compatible with Firefox!  YES!  

Hi everyone

I'd like to describe an example of how NEW is helping me greatly with an injury.  First, I'd like to say that since starting to develop my energy body I haven't been ill once.  This has been going on for a year now.  I always used to catch a cold in the winter, at least once, but last winter I didn't get one at all.  I've also been skipped by a couple of colds my girlfriend had this year.

Anyway, now for my case of specific self-healing.  Two weeks ago I rolled out of bed but my leg hadn't woken up yet, so when I tried to walk I collapsed and hurt my foot quite badly.  I caught a nail on something and ripped it half off, and I bruised the rest of my foot.  The worst thing was the second toe (next to the big toe) - it was bruised very badly and was very swollen.  Walking was almost impossible, and has been for the past two weeks.

I applied all the usual treatments and most of my foot healed over time.  However, that second toe, the heavily bruised and very swollen one, just would not heal.  The swelling never went down, and the bruise remained.  Last night, I decided to apply NEW to see if I could get the bugger healed.

You know what?  It worked like a charm.  As I lay in bed last night, doing my usual energy work, I concentrated on the bad toe.  I drew more energy through that specific toe than I normally would - in fact, I never concentrate on single digits when I'm doing energy work any more.  This time I did though.  As well as raising energy through it, I applied the etheric wrap technique.  As I "wrapped" the toe, I visualised a lot of bright white healing energy sinking into it.  After a few minutes of this, I carried on with the rest of my normal energy work and fell asleep shortly after.

Now, remember that for two weeks the toe hadn't improved at all.  This morning, after doing that healing work on it, the swelling has decreased by at least 50%, in fact it's closer to 75%.  The bruising has been markedly reduced, and the toe hardly hurts at all now (unless I apply direct pressure to it).  I can now bend it, and walk on it without having to limp.

So you see, for those with any doubts, NEW really can help with injuries.  All it took for me was a few minutes of concentration and energy work before I fell asleep.  I hope this helps someone. []

I have what may or may not be a problem with NEW.

Being tremendously undisciplined, I only tend to do energy work before I go to sleep.  I have therefore not progressed beyond the feet and legs part of NEW.  That's fine...I realise I have to give myself a kick in the bum and start doing it during the day so that I have longer to do it.  But I digress.

My problem is that when I first began NEW I would always get incredible energy movement sensations in my feet and legs.  As Mr Bruce puts it in AD, I took to energy work like a duck to water.  The sensations included warmth and tingling, and usually what felt like a bubbling beneath my skin.

These sensations are now almost gone.  I still get the warmth, but that's about it, and it's less pronounced than it has been in the past.  Now, in AD Mr Bruce says that strong sensations are actually caused by poorly-formed pathways, so what I'm hoping is that the reason I don't feel much now is because - having done NEW on my feet and legs so often - my pathways are very well-formed.  Is this the case, or do I have a reason to start worrying?

Thanks in advance for any opinions. []

Whilst asleep a few nights ago, I believe I attended a "sleeper class" that Robert Monroe talked about.  I'd like to tell the story here.

Here's something important to bear in mind first, though: Despite being a pacifist, occasionally I'll find myself reading a book or playing a game about war or violence and can't help but be sucked into the military mindset for a while.  You know, thinking a certain powerful gun is "cool" or whatever.  I'm sure everyone knows what I mean.  So with that in mind, on with the story...

"In my dream I was a soldier in the British army and I was in a mission zone with one of my friends from the Motherland (I'll call him M). We had some downtime and were spending it with a very nice family. There were four beautiful daughters and we were (obviously) spending most of our time with them. Things were progressing rather nicely I thought. However, after a day or two we got the call - a mission was about to get underway and we were needed.

It seems that some kind of military force was threatening the area. Our mission was to hunt the force and eliminate them. M and I tooled up in preparation. Boy, did we tool up! We were carrying at least two large guns each. I had some kind of modern automatic rifle and a huge sniper rifle. I was also carrying god-knows-how-many grenades and various other things. Most of our equipment (including the gun not being wielded) was carried in bags.

As we set out on the hunt, we passed by the family we had been spending time with at a distance of about 50 yards. They were waving at us, and as I looked at the girls the dream stopped being exciting; the knowledge that if we failed our mission this family and everyone else in the area would certainly die kicked in like a boot to the head. The smile faded from my face very quickly and I immediately felt nauseous. Onward we marched.

We approached a very large house and met up with a few other soldiers who were on the mission with us. The officer in charge - a woman - started issuing orders to split up and search the building; this was where the enemy were thought to be hiding. We began the search. After several uneventful minutes of fruitless searching, the four or five of us met up in a kitchen at the rear of the house that had a door leading outside. Our officer - indeed, all of us - were frustrated with our failure to find the enemy. M and I moved outside to continue the hunt, and I have no idea where the others went.

I'll be honest here. Despite the consequences of failing the mission, I really didn't want to find anyone. I was scared. Close to terrified actually. The sniper rifle I was holding was pretty heavy, a lot heavier than I had expected it to be. Its terrific length made it very unwieldy, too. I was not looking forward to conflict, but I couldn't stop thinking about those lovely girls and the fact that they were depending on us for protection, so onward we went.

I can't remember much else, but one event will probably haunt me for quite some time. Cresting a small hill, M and I spotted another house about 100 yards away. There was a soldier standing on the path that ran by it. Amazingly, I managed to keep my muscles under control and took aim. I was embarrassed by how long it took me to get the gun into a firing position. The eyepiece of the rifle's scope had a pretty small diameter and it was difficult to look through it. Eventually I got it right - it must have only taken 5 seconds in all, but in a combat situation that just can't be good - and trained the crosshair on the soldier. I couldn't make out whether the soldier was friendly or hostile. M wasn't sure either, and while we were trying to figure it out the soldier turned toward us and spotted us. Just as I was deciding whether or not to pull the trigger, my dream ended.

It was harrowing. The lesson I learned is that there's nothing glamorous about war or combat whatsoever. And despite what I may think about the 'common squaddy', I now have a bit more respect for soldiers. Going into warzones must be absolutely petrifying and I'm glad I'll never have to do it. I'll remember this dream for a long time."

...so there you have it.  The reason I believe it was a sleeper class was that, if you were paying attention while reading my preamble, hehe, you'll see that I was clearly taught a valuable lesson.

Opinions will be gratefully received. []

Opinions required.  Does the energy body exist solely in the physical plane and is as yet undetected or unrecognised by science, or does it 'straddle' the physical and other planes?

Has anyone here bought any Hemi-Sync from European dealers?  I've been on http://www.hemi-sync-europe.com but there's no info about any of the British dealers other than contact info.  I'm not really sure whether to go for it, or just order directly from TMI and put up with the added wait of ordering from America.

Does anyone in the UK have any stories to tell?

What the hell does this mean?!

A few weeks ago (dunno why I haven't posted about this sooner) I was staying in a beautiful guesthouse in Bath, UK with my fiancee.  The first night of the visit, I dreamt that I projected.  All I remember is being outside my physical body in the bedroom, and then turning toward my physical body to look for the silver cord.  I did indeed see it, clearly, between my physical head to where my projectable double's head would be.  As soon as I witnessed that, I either sank back into dreamless sleep or awoke.

Now, considering we do indeed project while we sleep, what the hell does this mean?  Did I temporarily shift my awareness into my projectable double?  All theories welcome! [|)]

Any experienced projecters here who have read Robert Monroe's books?  He seemed (well, seems, heh) to be able to travel somewhere by stretching his astral body the whole way there, then letting it 'snap' into place at his destination.

I gather Monroe was/is somewhat unique, but has anybody been able to duplicate this kind of travel?  I'd find out myself, if only...*sigh*...I could project. [|)]

I haven't managed to project yet, although I have been incredibly close to it, so I thought I would share an experience with everyone so that people in the same boat as me hopefully won't feel so bad.  Projection takes an enormous amount of willpower, you're not going to get it straight away!

Extracted from my LiveJournal, then...

OK, so I tried last night. Dismal failure. The problem was that I was too tired. Never attempt to project when you're really tired!!! As I was meditating and trying to descend into a trance, I kept slipping in and out of consciousness. It was only happening for a fraction of a second each time, but believe me, that was quite enough. It ruined the whole thing, and I barely got any exit sensations at all, despite stimulating my chakras for quite some time. A sad experience.

This morning, however, was a completely different story - it's the closest I have come to projection so far!

I lay on my bed, physically tired but mentally not too bad. I first tried something I had never tried before, which was RB's 'tensing' method. It actually worked! It relaxed my physical body no end (ha, listen to me talking abstractedly about my physical body already - you haven't done it yet, Huw!).

Next, I began meditation, coupled with breath awareness. Achieving meditative states is one thing, achieving a trance state is quite another. I don't think I quite got there, although my body did start to feel heavy, but that doesn't matter because the ROPE technique isn't reliant on it anyway.

So, after a good 10 minutes or so of this, I started to open my chakras. I'm getting better at this. I'm better at stimulating my base and heart chakras (*sigh*) than anything else, but I think I have started doing some good work with my Third Eye this morning.

So, trance - check. Breath awareness - check. Chakras opened - check. Energy flowing through chakras - check. Nothing left now but to attempt to project!

I began the ROPE technique. This time I put heart, body and soul into it. The exit sensations started. My body started to vibrate quite strongly. I feel it most in my head and my legs. It's like having a fit, but it isn't scary. It makes me feel cold though.

OK, so I'm climbing, climbing. My head is banging the pillow behind me but I ignore it. I'm climbing, climbing. My heart seems to be pounding at 200 beats per second, but I know it's just my chakra and I ignore it. I climb and climb and climb and.....this is it! This time I could actually feel my astral body start to lift! I recalled something RM said about thinking how great it would be to float, and I immediately felt myself getting lighter! My vision started to change, it must have been the beginnings of astral sight! I climbed further and further, then disaster. As I was lifting out (and I'm positive I was), that damned fear of the unknown hit me. The very millisecond I started to get doubts I hastily locked them away, but even that one millisecond was too much. As soon as it had happened, everything changed and I knew that this time was not going to be the one.

I tried for a few seconds more, then gave up. I sank down into bed, a huge grin on my face, chuckling occassionally. See, although I had failed, that was closer than I have ever been before. As I drifted off to sleep I kept saying to myself "I can do it, I can do it."

Just that one last barrier. The fear of the unknown. I will defeat you!!!

Hi

This morning, before going to bed, I tried Robert Bruce's rope method for the first time, and I was astounded at how easy it was!  In fact, I got to the stage just prior to separation so quickly and easily that my nerves got the better of me, and just before the moment of separation I had to quit (with some effort, I might add).

There's something I would love to ask experienced projectors before I take it any further.  Now that I know almost for sure that I can do it, I'm suddenly nervous.  How disorientating is it?  Is it scary when you finally separate?  Is the actual separation process scary or uncomfortable at all?

I hate this.  I want nothing more than to project, but I'm scared that I'll panic.  How easy is it to remain close to the body and get back inside after a quick look around?  How easy is it to panic and get lost?  During my first projection I intend to just have a quick look around to make sure I've done it, then return to the physical straight away.  Can this be done if I'm nervous?

Thanks very much in advance.

I think this is the correct forum to ask my question in.  If not, I apologise.

I was lying in bed this morning, before sleep (I work nights), and I decided to meditate (if it's relevant, the purpose was to attempt AP).  As is usual, I slowed my heartbeat to about 60 bpm and was breathing approximately 3 or 4 times a minute.

What I noticed was that my breathing had become so slow that occasionally I seemed to forget to breathe at all.  Sometimes I just stopped, and it wasn't until the next breath was long 'overdue' (even by meditative standards) that it occurred to me to take my next breath.

The thing that puzzles me is that no matter how overdue my breaths seemed to get, I experienced absolutely no discomfort whatsoever.  Is this because I had slowed my metabolism so much?  Also, does anybody here think that this kind of exercise could be conducive to achieving AP?

In his book Journeys out of the Body, Robert Monroe apparently discovered that President Kennedy had some sort of psychic protector.  Monroe unwittingly projected to a place where he later found out the President was staying.  As he approached the location out of body, he was stopped by a figure who wielded a gun (or what Monroe perceived to be a gun), and was threatened.

Unsure as to his vulnerability at the time, Monroe beat a hasty retreat.

quote:Originally posted by Nagual

quote:In all fairness, your very first post in this thread, Nagual, before Mustang directed any comments at you, was basically "I'm just jumping into this thread to say I don't care."

How does that make me a Castaneda fan/follower/believer/worshiper...?

I said what I did because of your reply to Akensai's question.  He highlighted a part of one of your posts that said you don't care about the topic, and asked why you were here, then.  Your response to that was that you were defending yourself against Mustang's accusations - I was trying to point out that you had declared your apathy before any accusations had been made.  The point is valid.

Mustang, many thanks for the interesting read.  I'm going to have a look through those links as time becomes available.

Oh, and...

quote:Originally posted by Nagual

He implied I was a Castaneda fan/follower/believer/worshiper...  I just explained that he was making gratuitious affirmations.

In all fairness, your very first post in this thread, Nagual, before Mustang directed any comments at you, was basically "I'm just jumping into this thread to say I don't care."

Binaural beats were part of what empowered Robert Monroe originally.  I've used BWG successfully to calm myself, make myself more alert, and to treat headaches.  There's definitely something in it, then.

I've never been able to project using them though, nor would I want to rely on binaural beat technology anyway.  There are some who believe, however, that using the technology can train your brain, so if you were continually successful using binaural beats to project you will eventually find yourself being able to do it at will without the need for listening to anything.

I'm rather skeptical myself.  Although Monroe used them to "get out", he was a rather special case, as anyone who's read all three of his books will know.  If anyone can use them to achieve results, fair play to them.  I wouldn't put much faith in them though.

Thanks for the comments, guys.

NEW is indeed an amazing system and in many ways as important as OBEs themselves.  In fact, I made the decision to do things properly and fully develop my energy body before I seriously start trying to project again.

Incidentally, if you come across a page that isn't displayed properly in Firefox, you can just right-click and select "view in IE".  You may have to download a plugin for it first though, from the Firefox extensions page.

It's a pity IE has to be kept for some websites.  Firefox is an infinitely better browser.