Messages

Frank:  Yes, when I used the word 'they' I meant 'us'.  You would think that after 10 years of recieving red marks asking "they?" on my english reports that I would finally get it into my head to be more clear.   I guess I used the word 'they', because in so doing my ego hoped to not be associated with the group of people who are actively destroying the world.

And what I meant is pretty much what you figured out.  When we destroy what we have, it is in the process of creating it to better fit an image of what our ego-personalities think the world should be like.  To us (you and me and whoever else wants to think the following way) it may look like they are creating a pile of crap.  No arguments there.  (To me it is a pile of crap and I'll say right here and now that practically every critque on the world you have given had not escaped me.)   And if we ever hope to see things change to a way more fit to our liking, then we will be the ones destroying the way of things to create as we see fit.  Probably, their will be people that think that we are creating  a pile of crap.  Hopefully, we will be at a point where we can work collectively for the good of all and all will be excited to help co-create our existence in a harmonious and balanced way.

quote:You say that you can see the path humans have taken is not the best possible. Look, we're not talking about optimisation here; discussing how we can fine-tune the system and give it a little tweak to improve its efficiency a couple of percent.

[] That was not how I was intending for that line to be interpreted, but yes the interpretation fits.  I guess, I will have to say that it is due to my own personal style that has developed over the years.  It is very subtle and not many people would get it unless they had intimately known me for many years.  Understanding, mixed with dry fact, and a twist of sarcasim.  I believe quite certainly that this path is headed to ruin if our greatest fears are left drive it.  Fortunately, there are people like you and me and the others on this forum in this world.  So, I am not so pesimistic about the current state of things.  Not to say that you are being overly pesimistic.  I am pesimistic, but I've come to an understanding with myself that I will work with what I have and help in my own way and try not to be attached to the end results.  I gotta leave room for the optimisim otherwise I'm going to cop the jism  (hehe, inside joke)

I guess where I'm comming from is a strange place as I am still trying to incorporate some things.  A weak understanding of advaia vedanta, buddhism, new age, my own personal feelings, etc.    It's kind of difficult for me, right now, to be so certain about things, when I'm still digesting the idea that everything we experience is bound up with our senses and at the end of the day, the world we experience is not ultimately real.  

Dang nabbit, I have to get ready for work.  Well, I'll just have to end on that.

Hrm, so many delicious fruits to choose from... where to begin...

Oh this term 'natural' is an interesting one.  Why is the current state of affairs any less natural than the state of affairs that existed X amount of years ago?  Clearly, we are a product of nature and as such anything that we do or create is naturally an extension of that.  Whether it be for good or ill that is something yet to see, as I can only place the now in the context of my own current limited experience.  

And yes I can say the previous and still think that the path through the void that humans have currently taken does not seem to be the best possible.  It seems that if we do not try in our own ways to help spread what we know that it will be lost to the future and their way will become even more difficult.  I am so emotianlly attached to this.  But why are my ideals the way thigs should be?  Why is my instinct more natural than the instinct of another's to go out and get money and destroy the world?  At the same time they destroy they create, but not in the way I want.  Maybe it will end when they finally have it all and realize that they are still not satisfied.  May we not have to wait that long, may we be spared.  Oh this is silly, but I'll post it anyways.  

kenneth, am I doing something wrong?  I tried to undestand with my body, but as I tried to do that it felt like my mind was screaming in agony!  it felt so heavy like my body was being suffocated...  what's up?  how can I understand something without my mind?  when thinking stops, how am I suppossed to put any meaning into these bodily sensations?  and wait a minute, how am I even aware of these sensations?!  is my mind still secretly at work?  It's like I'm throwing a wrench into the machine and it want to break apart, but at the same time it feels like something is trying to hold it together.  weird

Nice post Kenneth.  Thanks for taking the time to write it.  I'm so tired right now, that I think I will need to read it again when I am more awake.

BlackTalon, I have no directions but we do have our inner guidance and the more I trust in it the smoother things get

It's cool to hear about the success with your experiment.  I think I should try it.

You know what's funny about my situation.  I smile at the customers and try and am friendly with them, but I'm working at a one hour photo place.  So, if I take a little too long with the customers, i got my coworkers down my back for taking too much time with the customers! lol   So even though I want to be me with the customers, I feel compelled to be a blank wall so that the customers will move on.  So many things to work on... heh  Man, it's hillarious.

Hrm, I used to think I was sick of being human.  But now I think I'm sick of being attached to the idea that I am seperate from other people and thus I need to protect my self from others that are only concerned about their selves.  

Human life can be fun and rewarding etc.  I want to be a spiritual being, but I can do that here on earth too.  Wherever you go the 'illusions' are going to be there.  But reconizing their impermanent nature we can have fun with them  dance with them  and go on our happy little ways.  

I guess I should add that I am vegan.  So, I don't eat any animal products (there are so many good reasons to not eat anything from animals.  Entire books have been written on the subject)  I did try a completely raw diet, for a time.  I felt so good and so light, but I found that I was a little low on energy and that i was spending 3x to 4x more on food.  I would love to do it if I could figure out how to solve those dilemmas.

I also mainly drink water and sometimes fruit juice.  On occasion I'll drink a soda (if the vending machine gives me dr. pepper when I ask for bottled water! heh)  and a little bit of tea.  But 90% of the time it is water water water.

I do not watch television, except for the occasional movie or if I happen to learn about a particularly good show, I will get the dvds or tapes and watch it.  

I also practice yoga and meditate pretty much every day.

All of this has deffinetely enhanced the quality of my being.  Life is smoother and I feel better and my mood is almost always positive.  However, I still have issues with being in public places and dealing with customers at work.  Taking these steps help, but they have yet to take me to where I want to be.

BlackTalon,  Well met, well met indeed!  You and I have chosen to walk similar roads.  I can not thank you enough for starting this thread.

I work in a one hour photo lab.  I have to deal with people all day long and it's my job to keep people happy no matter what they throw at me.  If someone's film is late or missing or not 100% to their satisfaction, I get to take the blunt end of their dissatisfaction whether or not I am in any way responsible.  So, needless to say, that I am flooded with negativity.  You must understand how seriously people take their pictures.  They think pictures are the most valuable things in the world as they capture moments that they want to keep forever.  Of course, I understand, but I come from an entirely different place in that I try not to value any one moment over any other moment.  Plus, if you really want to remember something, we have far better means to do so internally.  Although, that ability is being quickly widdled away, since we are transfering that skill to machines.  

So, basically, I also want to get rid of this attachment to the ego to suffering, etc.  And yes BlackTalon, although I also am not a Christian (been there and done that) I do find much value in the teachings of Jesus.  What I would like to embody is what my friends and I call "the Jesus love"  No matter what comes my way, I want to be able to remain composed and find love in all.  Even when someone is yelling at me because their photos are 3 seconds late and they are afraid they are lost forever or some other nonsense, I want to be able to see that these people are also here to develope spiritually and that they are learning their lessons but they have not learned the same lessons as I have and that I too maybe earlier in this life and in lifes past may also have reacted so dramatically over some piece of paper ... and that we all come from the same stuff we all are one and see that all there is is love for them.  But even if I do have this intellectual understanding, I still get stressed out and I still find myself reacting to these people and I just want to go home and not have to worry about photos anymore.  

I try to tell myself that if I could see clearly and not be attached to my ego that I could work this job and not feel it take any toll on me.  Rather, I could always act in a way that would help bing joy into people's lives.  I may not be able to sit and have a philosophical discussion with them and get them to see the emptiness of their attachment to tiny sheets of paper, but I may be able to serve them in such a way that would help calm their nerves and brighten their day instead of falling into anger over their photos.

So, yes, I see where you are BlackTalon and I know that feeling of being stabbed in the chest, etc.  I don't want to dread the moment a person walks up to the counter, because I'm reacting due to my thousands of bad experiences with previous customers.  Oh lord, I just want to run away and leave it all behind.  I'm tired, so tired of it.  I know if  wanted to I could live a life where I did not have to be in the world.  I might have to retreat to a ashram or monastary and I wouldn't get to do things exactly how I think I want to do them, but I wouldn't have to be pushed around by people who can't even see that they are pushing.  

I will follow kitamu's advice.  It is what I tell myself to do.

However, I don't want to have to flee from my brothers and sisters in order to find peace.  I want to find peace wherever I go.  I want to be able to flow with whatever comes my way.  But am I deluded to think that I can be happy in any circumstance?  

I know I could get a different job, but that doesn't seem to solve the problem.  It just seems like I am avoiding it.  Although, if I was at a less stressful job, I may find my life easier and that I am more happier and better able to work on myself and in doing so, I might get to the jesus love and find that I never have to worry about negative energy and being pulled around etc.

Thanks for allowing me to express myself.  whew.  Be well and lots of love.

Heh, QS, trying to get on as many lists as possible? lol

heh, that song is like perfect

interesting world

When i think of kamma and what it 'is' I am partial to the idea that kamma is just a statement of facts.  You are here because of what came before.  Just like Aileron said about the next step on the staircase, except for me the staircase is too solid of a thing to make an analogy to.  It's not like there is a set path.  You are completely free to walk where you will and if you do so with awareness then so much the better.  

Of course, I've read theories on karma and how it is stored and processed and yadda yadda.  Maybe it is good to know such things, but is knowing that going to help you with what is happening now?  If you can be cool no matter what comes your way, then what is the point in worrying about what is going to happen.  As they say, "Even this will change"

Funny, I was just thinking about web-bots not to long before I logged on today.  I read a brief article about them a couple days ago.  

Does anyone have a link to a good site with info on web-bots.  I'm interested in learning some more about them

I'm interested too.

People often have a hard time saying what they mean.  Obviously, there are many reasons for this.  Maybe a better sentence would be "Stop trying to control" and "understand that you are not this limiting ego personality, but rather something a whole lot... (well, any discription I can think of seems to be wrong in some way)  suffice to say you are not this limiting ego personality and some people would imply that you are some sort of "higher power" but I don't think I would describe it like that."

I mean you deffinetely don't want anyone else to control you and I think ultimately you find that all talk of higher powers is nonsensical.  Although, through a certain lense it appears to make sense, I think that with a clearer perception you will see how it is distorted.

*does a million backflips*  whee

The current structure of that sentence is making it difficult for me to put together its meaning.

wtg QS!  I'm not going to have any excuse to not try the process mself, once you're done.  How are you doing physically?  Are you able to go out at all or are you pretty much taking it as easy as possible?

pancakes and jam

The 'ol stonewall defense, eh?

I would say I have precog experiences all the time.  You know, like knowing someone is going to call today or I'm going to see a certain customer at work.  That, or I'll be thinking about something and for some reason someone will mention a similar topic very very soon afterwards.  The most recent event I had like this was:

I was just lying on the couch and just letting my thoughts drift when I recall an event from some years ago where a baseball player let go of his bat and it flew into the crowd and hit some kid.  Of course, I'm like why am I thinking about that.  Then maybe an hour later, I get a call from my friend that lives across country.  We're just chatting away and apparently he is watching television.  He starts telling me about what he just saw on tv and guess what?  He starts telling me about how he just saw a baseball player throw his bat into the crowd and hit a kid in the audience...  If you want to call that a coincedence (or however you spell it) then be my quest, but I don't put much stake into them.  As the days pass, it becomes more and more apparent how interconnected everything is and the amount of precog stuff that I notice increases.

because becasue because because; because of the wonderful things she does!

But isn't that a little condescending?  Change in what way?  So we are more like your ideal of what things are suppossed to be like?  Why is that the correct way?  What makes you so certain?  How can you prove it?

Why do we need to stomp on mole hills? and if we do stomp on them, isn't that going to upset the moles?

Why is your life and ideals more worth of defense than ours?  

actually it's more like I say "posts" and you say "pages"  [)] *rimshot*  lol

Veccolo, that fits with how I remember things also.  As i said, I am not a master of words and even if I were, I am unable to prevent people from deriving meaning from those words as they see fit.

Well, your comments may well be valid if directed at other people, but given that they were generated in a response to my post they just don't fit.  I have never asked for anyone to moderate anything and I am actually oppossed to it for the most part.  

Yes, I have no idea what the last page of posts said, so I can only go on what I have read.  I stated that so that when you responded to my post you would be able to keep your cool knowing that my response could only be made with a lack of knowledge of what had transpired.

I never said i had not read the last 10 pages.  *scratches head*  Make up things in order to respond to them...? hrm...  I guess I'll give you the benifit of the doubt since 'pages' is simillar to 'posts' in that they both start with the letter 'p' and have at least one 's'  and each contain a total of 5 letters

I have no hatred for the moderating and deffinately not for the person doing the moderating.  I understand it and thus my response is able to come from a different place entirely.  And if any hatred was generated towards me in thinking that I hate then I am sorry for I do not desire to generate hatred from others either, and since I am not yet a master of words, I for the most part try to keep quiet.  

My comment about one person asking for moderation is true.  Velccolo was the only person who asked for someone to come and moderate and lock the forum and right after he asked for this, Nay posted her warning, and then almost immediately after that (relative to length of time the thread had been alive) the thread was deleted.  Of course, since that would seem to be the order in which such an event would happen, that makes sense (I more talking to myself here than anything else)

Lame

So, at the request of one person, who after his request was then most interested in keeping the thread alive in order to prove himself and the need for a moderator to show herself that she indeed does have some power over people, we are deprived of the most interesting thread that I have come across in my days on the net.  

There were so many jewels in that thread and I'm not talking about the posts by oazaki only.  There was much to be learned for any person who ventured into that thread and spent some time reading it.  

Of course, I have no idea what was said in the last 10 posts or so, but still...  The internet needs to be kept a place where we can all come together and say whatever it is we want to say and learn to be able to be at peace with what anyone else says.  I would think the people at the astral pulse would be a little more open given their knowledge of the nature of the universe.  All is sacred.  It is all the same stuff.  We can not seperate one from the other.  When we censor people we are censoring our selves.  Of course, saying that I should be at peace with the actions that were taken.  Oh what a world.  I guess I have reacted and lost my center and drifted from my understanding of the universe.  It is confusing (sp) only because I want things to be a certain way that seem better than the way things are and yet I'm struggling with the notion that ultimately it is all for naught.  I am that I am that I am  That Twam Asi    all of this is just my perception and it is not me it is not Real in an ultimate sense.   I want everyone to have the same understanding and then maybe we can be more tolerable and understanding, but then do I fall into the trap again?  

I'm walking down the street and I am happy and at peace and the world seems beautiful and I think that if I can hold that perception and not let it falter in any circumstance I can bring a bit of my world into everyone else's world.  

Well, if someone happens to have a copy of the last page of two of the 2004 thread, please send it my way.  Have a great day everyone.  Hopefully we will get an explanation and maybe the thread will be put back up.  Just remember that it is your ego that is keeping you from putting the thread back up.  That or the delete button really does what it says it does.

Edit:  Well, I see we did get an explanation.  I guess if there was anything close to resembling a black spot on the forums, it was that thread, but whithin it, it also contained some of the brightest posts.  

And I hope that you understand my comments about the moderator that took down the thread.  I just think that I see the truth of part of the matter, but maybe I don't.  I just call it as i see it.  Not trying to be mean or start an argument, but formalities are such a limiting thing.

Can you protect yourself from this?  If so, how?  Does it matter?  Are we suppossed to be able to flow with any emotions projected at us?  Is it really "our" energy or isn't it everyone's energy and this particular part of it I take it to be my own?  Then if that is the case and the answer to my first question is yes, then what right do I have to stop someone from playing with that energy?  or is that just swallowing your tail, because ultimately are there any "rights"?  [][?][?][?][?][?][]

Again and again I have read in yogic texts that there is a path to awakening that involves the use of substances and again and again it is strongly advised that such a path is only for the strong of heart and those that have a trusted master to guide them.  

I did fine with mj when I used it in moderation and balanced usage with lots of meditation.  The problems started when I took to passing the bong around several times a day and started ignoring sleep and stopped meditating all together.  It took every bit of my willpower to maintain even a whim of sanity and on occassion I just had to ride out the storm, so to speak.

I loved using it because one or two tokes of a joint (the key is to inhale nice and slow and let it sit in the lungs for a little bit)  opened up my entire energy body (or at least made me very aware of it)  When I was being smart about it, I could basically keep the high from a couple of tokes for days and days.

I'll say that anything mj can do, you can do yourself.  You can get the same high, a better high, become aware of your energy body just as well by meditating or focusing your will / intent on getting to that place.