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I meant in today we know praying to gods has nothing to do with crops... but everything to do with weather.

I know the Mayan's worship had almost everything to do with crops. the fact they lived predominantly in rain forests and had a god called Chak... with a huge hooked nose I might add... tells us this.

They also used a 360 day annual cycle... and spent the other 5 days hiding in case the world ended. To them it was every year.

They also used a HELL of a lot of Cocaine. They loved that coca leaf. Maybe why they were so paranoid.

360 hmmm im goin to have to look that up again i thought is was just off by 4 hrs i know for fact that they had like  eh i cant think of the word right now but its a time in the calender where they kinda reset it or i mean get it back on track it was like every 50 or 100 years anyway about the cocaine lol they had to stay awake somehow at night 

but i can agree that back then all they had was this mystical understanding of how the world worked n it was actually pretty accurate for their assumptions enough to be able to survive, the mysticism behind it was just a way to be able to unite their people and keep them calm or hype them up or even divide them, whatever was needed at the time depending on different social climates,

i mean cmon u know nothing of astronomy ur just a farmer tending to his crops so he can trade in the city for things he needs to keep his family alive and probably hopefully he can get his kids to be educated somehow by one of the high preists (which was and stilll should be an honor) anyway then  one day a preist comes along or someone of upper authority and they tell you to sacrifice or to worship harder today orelse the sun will not recover and stay black,,, ha and a solar eclipse happens, id be shakin hard in my sandals eatin coca leaves prayin like a muslim and christian combined

gives me shivers,,,
..........................
thats something id expect north korea to do

anyone else have any more resources or suggestions on whats going to happen when the Moon gets further and further away.??
young soul here and i just found this out not so long ago, and it got me thinking of outcomes
http://www.ridgenet.net/~do_while/sage/v2i2f.htm
http://www.thenakedscientists.com/forum/index.php?topic=6217.0
http://starryskies.com/The_sky/events/lunar-2003/eclipse8.html
heres 3 that'll show up on a search engine the last one is just some nice statistics about her

Moon why are you so quiet, im surprised, this is the most serious issue on an astronomical level that the human race must deal with,
will our civilization evolve, or die off letting another species dominate
awsome to think about though 2000years ago the moon was so close must of looked beautiful,

hmm probably that can explain our strange weather changes and also the poles i don't think the moon is also orbiting in a fixed line as in in must be going up and down up and down or like in a car, the road is the orbit n earth but u steer back and forth on it to make curves
this will make noticeable effects on the oceans and maybe even the air

I think it rather depends on the line of thinking of the rest of the western world.

The Mayans WERE proficient at ASTROLOGY and observing the bright dots in the sky!!! They didn't know they were planets, stars and galaxies... they thought the sun was a god... not a ball of Helium and Hydrogen... When are people going to see the difference between religion and actual fact? They did not attribute the stars as billions of lightyears away... like we know they are now. They may have seen this interesting thing happen where some of the dots line up... or when their sun disappeared...  but we now know this means nothing about crops.. whether it's a good year for hunting or whether we need to sacrifice children and slaves to make a blood offering to our sun god.

everything u just said is correct except for the part about it didnt have anything to do with crops

first off its really getting irritating that people still believe the end of a calender is the end of the world, the calender is the tool they used for scheduling just how we use it still to this day, simple as that!,
time isnt linear and even the mayans new that but the calender had to be a fixed linear pattern in order to actually work, this is where we get the end to the calender, if you want it to sound like a profecy or "divine", how much can u even say about the mayan culture, here

at the end of our time the people of corn shall be recycled/destructed just like the people of wood, dirt and stone before them and the sun will make an even better civilization and that shall surpass the people made from corn and they shall be the man of light to START the new Time.

there thats what a mayan would tell u especially the high preists, something along those lines, its called hope, mesoamericans were very spiritual
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they used these mathematical tool and natural coincidences to be able to keep track of certain events like the HARVEST, and especially the TIME TO START PLANTING new crops, that right there was very crucial, their calender was so accurate is was only off by 4 hours, AMAZING!!

if the mayans were soo good at predicting the end of the world how come we didnt see the spanish coming haha

i dont think so what is it you would need a shaman for?? and depends what you mean by shaman?

[Obsidian]

hobbies ay, i love to mess with audio effects and synthesizers, i can sit in a room for hours just purely having fun with synthesizers, syncronizers, and effects,
i dont own any guns but i like to disassemble and reassemble them whenever i get the chance, and clean them over and over ha,
throwing knives!! now thats fun small knives, long knives, wide, skinny, spikes, discs, any projectile that can be thrown is awsome to practice with, ive practiced enough to be able to make a pen or sharp pencil be able to stick on a reasponable target,

MUSIC. all kinds of music, blues, jazz, reagea, rock n roll, opera, orchestral, band, modern mixes, pop, 50s,60s,70s 80s, 90s, ragtime, cumbia, mambo, salsa, ska, merengue, tango, mariachi, funk, disco, house, soul, R&B, hiphop, rapp, country, heavy metal, electro, dance, and so on
i like to collect different stones precious medals eh it makes me feel busy, Obsidian is my favorite, Gold and Silver as always, Diamonds lol. Amber, Jade, Turquois, Uranium lol  space rocks as in meteorites,

I love to cook i dont know if that counts as a hobby but cooking is an art form! i loive to expirement and try new things with my cooking im pretty diverse when it comes to cooking but  still make plenty mistakes since im so young and impatient ha like the common mistake where i make something so big and beautiful looking so appetizing to the eyes and yet when u bite in it has no flavor lol but im, getting better slowly but surely

[the quick explanation]

the quick explanation
Here's a quick list of the alternate memories people have:
- Nelson Mandela died in a prison-misunderstanding
- The guy at Tienanmen Square actually got run over by the tank (seen on video)-u really think china was going to release his death on video so soon?
- Jane Goodall was killed by a poacher in the 80's-miss info
- Mickey Rooney died, eulogy was given by other actors and everything-low informed
- The U.S. has 52 states (was taught in schools)-thank the skrools
- Billy Graham is dead-all of the above
- geology differences, such as China being above Russia, and New Zealand being northeast of Australia- most americans would say new zealand is next to russia  

immorality ay, not trying to sound pessimistic but silence is powerful and feels peaceful,
also when Ur awake silence is very loud i gotta get that checked by a doctor make sure its not tinnitus or somethin ha

we are just afraid of the manner in which we die, i dont want to get shot or etc.

the worst part is what can you say.
Its a happy sad irony.

BAM! on the money

yeah ive had those moments, they used to get me stuck, but honestly the best thing you can do is just hear and acknowledge, sympathy is too cheap at times,

i remember i was at a gas station buying some gas and there was an older man buying cigarettes he was drunk making small talk and little quick jokes at the register that ppl didnt really seem to care about, me being a talkative guy i would respond to his good humor, turns out we get a conversation going as we head outside and continue to do so, discussing how chicago would soon turn into a ghost town with all the regulation and such, then outta nowhere he told me that he just buried his 30 year old son that same day and actually thats where him and his wife were coming from. =/ i didnt know what to say and he states no sympathy plz, because in his eyes u could tell he didnt want to remember the sorrow just the reward of being able to know his son and to share theyre lives together =)

gold... which is the 'real' currency.

yes it is bedeekin yes it is, im just waiting for u to go on another rant lol atleast u give sources unlike most of us

hey well im not gonna lie thats not a bad thats a nice segway into a job ad, kinda got me fired up there

i think the world economy is different because the US is in Dept

Um im not sure bout u but isnt it kinda nice that we pass away?? 

supernova! 

honestly people are thinkin so in the box this is perfect for doin nice romance with your wife or man for that sort, take em out, do a gift, you wont ever be able to say hey i got u somethin for the end of the world lol
my girl doesnt believe in the whole thing, she knows in reality the end of the world could be tomorrow as in any day(which we both find to be even scarier) but all the hype still gets her restless and down with thoughts at times,
on the 22nd imma take her out and do the whole cheeseiness, least i could do, it'll be fun

my theory for that still stands, it was just UDM unidentified drunk man
large animals are living beings too, so that means they can get lost lol and wander off into the unfamiliar territories
Crowley? well not too much i can say there, my 2cents, this being was just another living form of hate, some ppl just never want to give up, consciousness must be weird at that state, mainly just override of angered passion and impulse

Death is merely another form of transformation, we die alot during ourlives, or atleast most people do

haha i new this story would of taken some kind of twisted turn after i had seen it announced on msn, honestly i feel pain for nasa their story will only be broadcasted to shift change
anyway shout outs to my fellow mesoamericans for New Calendar day, We have enough stone now

im not just trying to narrow it down to a specific entity coming from christian perspective (u dont even know if im christian or not), point is here and in china bad is bad and good is good , like i said if these feelings are merely chemical reactions then why is it these beings cant exist, in actual flesh and blood, majour ka's post is also nice because yes one's own mind is powerful enough to posses itself, its called a Lie, a majority of cases out there are just people so dellusional or extremely, well, in a bad state of mind that they become their own possesers

you throw the subject into an automatic conclusion of no, when everyday in life there are perfect exampls of real devils, real demons that need to be dealt with

you too have seen this everyday in the living world
some people are happy and grateful just because and others are angry and bitter, some dont care, and some care but aren't urged at all
others dont believe in such things and search everyday for proof to easy their thoughtful mind, and some believe but ignore it completely and forget about values and respect, morals, other don't and still deny
bible and qur'an stories, are nice stories but they talk about the same thing, if you've never encountered such thing then why cant another be living proof of its existence, some people go their whole lives never being in a conflict, and others just cant seem to get rid of it

its ironic but their is no religion at all they are just all fan clubs of the same force, different parties in a race for your vote!

[you have a choice whether or not you want to experience those descions or consequences, whether they be good or bad is another story]

Are you personifying crime and immoral deeds? Are you anthropomorphising bad decisions and actions?

o yes this is very thin ice, i know bedeekin where ur coming from on that response,
i'll admit at times i make the error of incarnating or yes personify certain words or phrases, i do so because almost everytime i explain myself i try to make it easy to understand that even a kidd can compute But! (I end up complicating it even more)

with the seven words of Greed, Vanity, Sloth, Jealousy, Lust, Envy, and Pride, we have concluded these forces exist
these are just forces of human nature that can have major and general influence over human behavior
i guess yeah i do like to give them a face or signature to be able to think about it more practically in the head, easier to remember, i mean what are they? this is the question of this topic what are demons? well even demons at one point were angels and yes i am going by traditonal christian catholic opinion, lucifer himself was among the highest his name meaning most beautiful/brightest light

has anyone here ever seen hellraiser?
yes i know this is just another horror flick with your average blood and gore, but regardless it states something interesting
to the best of my knowledge when the well hellraiser gang pops out the box, they introduce them selves to the person whom opened the box,
"some have called us demons, some have called us angels, we are beings of further consciousness and experience, we know great Pleasure and great Pain, lol come we have many sites to show you"

Also about the Devil,
a great story and image, is the Tarot Card of the 15 Major arcana, symbolizing the devil


the man and woman have been hooked to the chains of devil through their own demons of Greed, Vanity, Sloth, Jealousy, Lust, Envy, Pride
he sits their babysitting them, watching them, when ironically enough he has no real power over them
The chains themselves are weak enough to break and not only that the loop around their necks is big enough to slip right off
this card represents the true force itself of giving your own will away to an external force or being, anything you wanna name it, will, life, value, choice

its funny because there aren't actually beings like, jealousy, what is jealousy really?, ask me i'd say its a state of consciousness, something that is experienced,
bogusly enough that movie depicts these figures to be deadly and so does the rest of society, I say its just misunderstood
honestly its hard to understand thats why we have judges, and a whole justice system, (corrupt) anyway crime itself is just the proof that these souls exist.
you have a choice whether or not you want to experience those descions or consequences, whether they be good or bad is another story because we have problems actually defining good or badd, like i said we got a whole sytem for that but life is always news, and you have to use your own knowledge and logic to be able to find the greater good
It suits me personally easier to give these words, terms, some divine ID

honest opinion mental illness is truely tricky grounds when you literally have proof to show that your missing a part of your brain or, certain areas just arent doing their job or are doing something else, how does one experience this? Every feeling is a chemical reaction.. we know thiss for fact, so then could it be said that certain emotions, feelings like jealousy, lust, or greed are nothing but mere results of chemical reaction and if so doesnt that obviously state that there is some divine connection between those chemicals and that outcome? then wouldnt this be physical proof of evil?

[belittle]

I dare you to try to say I willed those marks on my skin. Did I burn my wounds too? Did Dan will away part of his ear? What was I afraid of during a regular, waking day that caused me to go temporarily blind and over 72 hours of amnesia? Did I, completely sober and awake at the time, simply dream this all up?

No, and that's why I believe that demons are real. That's why I've done my research, and that's why, quite frankly, it pisses me off the way you try to discredit what others believe and belittle them.

belittle? honestly whether or not ur account is true or false, the truth is if some thing can be so good then what is the lack of good?

"demons" is the term we will use for these beings for now. For Trea Vibration u nailed it!
everything or almost everything has a vibration frequency to specfiy its self, like an adress for a house
although since ive never seen a demon, i cant say its a vibration, but! Light is also how a signature can project itself,
bordmb's right on the fact that some beings have less light than others but its really rare IRONICALLY, bedeekin has a point u usually see the living trying to idolize or romanticize, and it usual always ends up in a bar bathroom with ur pants off down and blood on ur shirt in bum frunk scottland or waking up drunk next to a fat guy in a who gives a squirt mississippi

like i said i havent encountered one and why would i want to?
Demons HA what about Greed, Vanity, Sloth, Jealousy, Lust, Envy, Pride
now these beings these will mess with you
bordmb's tale is just another example of why we must breaks our barriers, his friend more than likely had a complex relationship with these entities leading him to Negative Times and Spaces, eventually through probability and mathematical law, wrong place wrong time =/

you had a choice whether or not to keep associating yourself to him as a friend and yes sometimes what a friend should do is keep close and at others he should separate to show a signature of righteousness, which then leaves his friend in a pending desicion, whether or not to change his negative input in order to project a positive output

that is what you get when you deal with demons, i bet there are cases where the victims have done nothing wrong their whole lives and end up having to engage with beings, it happens all the time even in real life its called Crime!
just today on the radio here locally they were talking to a man who just recovered from being stabbed in chest by another man, who just got done robbing and stabbing another man seconds before him,
average young fellow no more past 30 late 20s just workin at the bar in a nice hotel in downtown chicago right by the john hanncock building, heres a cry for help! stop that man!, all he was doing was his job assisting the customer, victim 1 was just having dinner by the way when he went to the bathroom and bow it a robbery,
the young fellow hears the shout and sees a man walking out the door suspicious figure going out the revolving door passing guests and kids, he goes out to get him into the crowded street and catching up another shout from behind the young man and then the suspect turns, and lunges towards him knocking him down,

Arrested 69 times, more than 3 felonies, and homeless age 56, =/ life
and thats not mentioning the pending trial goin here of the lady who murdered her baby and another child whom she was babysitting for someone else

yes, i believe people can plague theirselves with thoughts and mis conconseption to decieve themselves, call it schizophrenia, possesion, delusion, or any other mental disorder, it starts with a state of being Evil and then its the Devil himself
the true definition of devil is to give up your own will to another external force
your god given right to have a choice, at times it is ignorance other stubborness, it's in many forms,

When you see them u will know it just how u will know when you see your Father

arent you just technically re-wording it to Sell It better?

living right is correct.

there is a mono rule in living or at least human DNA to follow certain guidelines and principles, basically what bedeekin brought up
The GOLDEN Rule
really simple and ironically complex

as for the little ones i always think its best to associated different entities and morals with incarnated figures to put a suspense on the lesson thus causing an easy accessible reference point in a developing or child's mind, so that it is easier to remember at judgmental moments
(its just quicker)

i had a couple of friends over whom i really didnt know much of
i was unwise in doing so of my over trusting others
later on we get robbed
obviously u know who it was

this wasnt due to forces of good nor evil
it was because certain measures were not taken and things that could of prevented such actions were not done
thus letting the domino effect or chain of events occur and resulting in the final outcome

i think of Karma as a butterfly effect
but i also like to personify her
so that i can use her image and symbol as a moral teaching (lol especially for my lil nephew)
its amazing he thinks of karma in that way of if i do something bad then karma will come and make something bad happen to me
he gets terrified!! i got him thinking she is a Zombie
it was perfect to stop him when he started mis-behaving
but then one day -(!)- he gets sinical
what if i do something good then karma will do good things to me right?? hes ask, i respond "yeah sure sorta kinda why?"
he starts doing all these good little things for me like helpin me out, giving me rocks and leaves ha
so i had to explain this to him in the most simples terms, which is quite ironic because if u cant put this stuff in the most simplest format that a kid can understand it, then adults won't get it either (i know its hard to believe but...eh, human capacity) anyway

lil Oscar u dont have to keep doing all of that because its not really from the haert, see Karma is always working she doesnt stop matter of fact she has others who help her out, because they are always moving the wheels and setting up the next steps, when you do something bad or good it is put out there in the universe and someone notices it regardless it be Karma or your Dad, then because time doesnt stop things will start to change and the Karma you have inside yourself will determine if good or bad things happen to you, if you can use the situations that are given to you in the right way then you will have the best outcome period. She gives you what you Need not what you Want

[I think the media has a hell of a lot to answer for when it comes to modern human (Western) society. The mass of information on the internet is a blessing and a curse.]

I think the media has a hell of a lot to answer for when it comes to modern human (Western) society.
The mass of information on the internet is a blessing and a curse.

"A God of such advanced scientific, mathematic, and Artistically righteous capabilities would not have given me the Same highly advanced abilities to Waste and Ignore their Potential" - by someone i cant remember at the moment-

It is safe to say the day non-physics, meta physics, or any other synonym, is commonly accepted and understood throughout the world as a universal bond between living organisms then we sill start to have a deeper understanding of our distinctions between others who are or are not enlightened   literally

we will then be able to seperate those who are able to believe and co-operate in a Monolithic society that is unique in difference individually, from those who can only ignore the being of a Living Mass

There was a time when I was getting bored of reading the same newbie questions over and over, the same debates, the same opinions. And not just the AP, but the whole internet.

Im not so sure of my source on where i heard this from, it was probably from  a peice by socrates or the founding fathers of the U.S.
"We came here not to establish something new but to up-hold what has been true for all ages and eras,"

im pretty sure it is from a document surrounding something about the US consitution or a letter sent between those involved, anyway samething goes for what this topic has been touching up on

honestly every teacher throughout history has hit this milestone, and the only thing one can do is keep going, to keep up holding the basic principles that make one a true Teacher

Well its delightful to know that this topic has not only given us a spark of motivation but its good to acknowledge these errors that we all seem to exhibit from time time.
but honestly this teaching fatigue is something that can be applied to any teachings,
professors, teachers, doctors, they must all get tired from time to time having to explain and answer the same question over and over again, they realize what we have discussed over this topic, and that is to not make the lesson too complicated,
earlier someone mentioned how our would is fractal based and its true, its the only way to make something so Big be so Small, honestly its pretty Scary but it works!! 

samething goes for any teaching or lesson, each lesson, skill, ability, etc. has its own story its own "BOOK"
so when someone starts to ask about a specific technique, or situation, STOP TRYING TO READ THEM THE WHOLE BOOK, AND JUST TELL THEM WHERE TO FIND IT  , its saves alot of time

and again whether they decide to read the book or not is up to them, then their the ones responsible for their own learning