Messages

lily
So apparently you Have had OBEs yet are still trying to get outside of your room (?)
Remember that intention and focus are Key to getting somewhere/Doing something/meeting Someone while out of body.
I recommend setting the intention on getting outside your house/apartment and flying. That is one of the greatest thrills that I have experienced.


Grey   

lily moonsong
It is almost certainly true that the soul does need energy to sustain itself. Many paranormal investigators have found that discarnates=ghosts use energy in order to make sounds and communicate with ghost hunters. For instance many ghost hunters find that their flashlights and camera batteries go mysteriously dead right before a ghostly encounter. Later on many times those 'dead' batteries will mysteriously work again by themselves.
So quartz crystals, plants and fragrant Incense should be ample sources of energy from which to draw from while out of body.

Grey 


jub jub
It is interesting that what works for one person can hardly ever work for another. This is the case with me. It is Very rare for me to have an OBE while feeling the effects of alcohol. It has happened mayby one other time, at most. Maybe my astral/ethereal consciousness became disgusted with my physical intoxication and decided to 'go out' for a short time??  Who knows. lol
Anyways, just as a 'ballpark estimate' how many OBEs have you had as a result of a large consumption of alcohol??

Grey

[Much]

lily moonsong
All your ideas are appreciated. The idea of opening a window is a very good suggestion. Unfortunately it is still too cold here in Pennsylvania to remove the glass window and replace it with a screen. However, I have always found it Much easier to go outside through a screen than a glass window. So maybe in a month or so that will be possible.
btw (If you have had OBEs) have you found it relatively easy to go through a glass window? It has always been hit or miss with me, sometimes I can and other times I cannot. So any ideas or suggestions for going through glass windows could be quite helpful.

evan5
I generally agree with your comments. This highlights the importance of staying lucid and focused during an OBE. Because I began to lose focus I then temporarily 'forget' that I should have been able to breathe underwater during an OBE. This resulted in the projection ending within a minute or so. I should note that in general I try to avoid such stressful situations while out of body. When they do happen I usually react pretty well but not this time.

jub jub
Do you live near an ocean or a large lake?
I do occasionally fly over an ocean but it is usually in a dream.

Thanx
Grey

This took place only 2 days ago, early Saturday morning. This is the second OBE for me in a week and the third in less than a month. (Previous it had been nearly 4 months since the last OBE.)


Out of Body Experience # 77
"Brave New World?"
Saturday, March 15, 2008

   Very strong vibrations began directly from dreamless sleep. As I became hypnagogic the vibrations continued and lasted for several minutes, oscillating in intensity. At some point the vibrations nearly doubled in strength. Shortly after that I tried and suceeded in separating into a full, deliberate OBE.
   I rose directly up out of my physical body. I looked around yet could hardly recognize my bedroom. Though my eyesight was decent the room appeared strangely elongated. It was also very dim (this is how it should have been). I saw my physical body lying asleep yet mistook myself for someone else. I also mistook Allyssa for a young girl or a small women. (Allyssa is a friendly elemental who sometimes appears to me in OBEs and dreams.) So it appeared that 2 unfamiliar people were asleep in bed.
   The Iron Maiden song "Brave New World" was playing loud and clear. While floating up near the ceiling I was soaking up excessive amounts of energy and feeling quite good. I floated about for a few minutes before trying to go through a window. I got only halfway through the window then the OBE ended.
   Notes. Time was between 3:00 and 3:10 AM. I lay on my left side. Duration was about 6 to 8 minutes. I had consumed a large amount of alcohol (64 ounces of beer) at night. In fact I felt bad physically and this OBE actually came as a surprise.
OBE # 77   Locale I.    A familiar Location (my bedroom)      A familiar Person(s)/Being(s) (Allyssa, an elemental)   No unfamiliar Person(s) or Being(s)      Deliberate  Confused  Emotional  Energy (including pranayama)  Drugs/alcohol Flight  Floated Meditation  Music SawOwnPhysicalBody  Vibrations
   Addendum ---  I nearly tried experimenting with DXM (robotussin) earlier that day. I only decided Not to use DXM when in  a drug store about to buy a bottle of generic tussin. I decided against it because the experience was getting old and stale. Also there had been no new insights from the DXM experience in a long time. So instead I bought 3 cans of beer (64 oz total). Nomally I do not drink beer. Once again beer had the normal effects on my body - indigestion, headache and general malaise. This kept me awake for a good part of the night. Right after I fell asleep the OBE occured. It was a welcome surprise.

Thanx for readings. Comments are welcome.
Grey

jub jub
Thanx for your response, its always appreciated.

SnakeDoctor
No bruises. This was an OBE, not a case of sleepwalking. I can explain much of the confusion due to the physical setup of the room. The bed is jammed between 2 walls with a closed window on a third side. So when I go out of body I have only one way to go to avoid going into something.
On other OBEs, when I was more alert and focused, I could navigate the tight space better. This time I kept going straight into things. To my mind that explains why this OBE was so confusing. (And btw it is SO important to have a predetermined intention before going out of body.)

Grey

SnakeDoctor

An add on from the my previous post. Yes it did feel hard to breath. It could be that something else was happening with me, either physically or emotionally. In other words it might be that being underwater during an OBE did Not cause the problem. Rather maybe I had a physical breathing problem (I consumed alcohol the night before). Or maybe it was an emotional state that caused the problem. Strange thing is that I had never been underwater during an OBE before (and am Very rarely in water or am underwater during a dream.)

Grey

SnakeDoctor
Instead of "Die" the term became temporarily "unconscious" would seem to be correct. In fact the effect of being underwater while being out of body had the effect of quickly ending the OBE. The feeling of being underwater was very discomforting. It soon became a Major distraction and it may have caused my astral/ethereal body to become Unconscious and that would have been what ended the projection.

Grey

Here is my latest OBE, which took place only 3 days ago. It was confusing and somewhat short. Yet It was interesting (to me at least.)

Out of Body Experience # 76
"Up Against A Wall"
Monday, March 10, 2008

   Mild vibrations began while in the hypnagogic state. Separation was deliberate yet difficult. I was under 2 blankets which were an obstacle to projecting. Once out of body my astral/ethereal body felt very heavy and sluggish. Also I could not see for the first 3 or 4 minutes. After that time I was only able to see very close up (see objects that were only a few feet away).
   For several minutes I just leaned against a wall. It was difficult to move and I did not know what to do. Then I tried to go through the wall. This was also quite hard and it took 3 or 4 tries to push through. This seemed to take a very long time. On 1 or 2 occasions I nearly got stuck inside the wall. Finally I did go through the wall and floated outside. Eye sight was still very poor. Nor could I feel the 20 to 25 degrees fahrenheit cold temperate. Within a minute or two I was back inside the bedroom.
   I floated through the bedroom then headed for a small third floor window yet kept bumping into many pieces of furniture about the room. These objects felt much like real, solid physical objects and I could not pass through them. It was so distracting that I lost focus and the OBE abruptly ended.
   Notes  Time was between 10:00 and 10:30 AM ( I had the day off from work). I lay on my left side. Duration of the OBE was 6 to 10 minutes.
OBE # 76 Locale I and a familiar location. No (familiar or unfamiliar) person(s) and being(s). Deliberate, Confused, Flight, Floated and Vibrations.



Thanx for reading. Responses are welcome
Grey 

No doubt that there are subtle and invisible energies that cannot be seen by the physical eyes. The big questions are whether (some) of those energies are intelligent discarnates. Personally I believe that they are and that sometimes they are seen (usually as ghosts).

Grey

This is my most recent OBE. It happened just over a month ago. So far this is the only OBE that I have had this year.

Out of Body Experience # 75 a and b
"Over And Under The Ocean"
Tuesday, February 5, 2008

   This OBE was preceeded by a dream when I might have been out of body but only in dream consciousness.
   I awoke in (another) dream and immediately realized that I was out of body. The separation must have taken place either before or during the dream. I was flying over a vast grey ocean.  Having just flown out over the shoreline I was headed straight out to sea. It is uncertain where this unfamiliar place was.There were no people, buildings or vehicles to be seen. After only 2 or 3 minutes of flight I was pulled back and reentered my physical body. 
   It seemed very possible to have another OBE so I tried to separate (my astral/ethereal body from the physical body) again. It was difficult as there were noise distractions and some problems staying focused. Yet I overcame these distractions and managed a short full projection. Once again I travelled (teleported) back to the ocean yet found myself completely submerged. It was confusing because I was at least 10 feet underwater and found it hard to breath (?!) It took a determined effort to struggle up to the surface. This second OBE lasted only about a minute. During this time I had dual consciousness and was only vaguely aware of being in the bedroom while being OOB.
   The effort to stay afloat sapped my strength and was a complete distraction to remaining out of body. Suddenly the OBE ended as I was again reintegrated with my physical body.
   Notes. The time was 10:50 AM. Duration for OBE 75a was less than 5 minutes, for 75b was about 60 to 90 seconds. I lay on my left side.
OBE # 75 a.  Locale I, No Familiar Location(s), or Familiar or Unfamiliar Person(s)/Being(s). Dream>>(into)>> OBE, Flight, Travel-teleport
OBE # 75 b.  Locale I, Familar Location but No Familiar or Unfamiliar Person(s)/Being(s). Deliberate (separation), Confused, Dual Consciousness, Emotional, Flight, Short, Travel-teleport.




Thanx for reading. Responses are welcome.

Grey   

Finally I am Nearly up to date with these postings. This was the last OBE I had in 2007. It happened in late October.

Out Of Body Experience # 74
"Lake Flight Revisited"
Thursday, October 31, 2007

   This was an experience that I had at least once many years ago as a child or teenager. It began when already separated out of body flying outside my bedroom.
   I flew over the local Highland Park area. Suddenly I was in a completely different place. It was an area of many lakes and ponds separated by pleasant woodlands. It appeared southern, almost tropical, like a Florida or southern California resort.
   There were people about. They did not appear to be doing anything special. I did land from time to time yet did not talk to anyone.  Mostly I flew over the area in a large clockwise circle that covered between 2 and 3 miles. It was fun and the area was vaguely familiar.
   At one point I flew over a young woman. She apparently wanted to go with me. Yet, for some reason, I could not land and so had to continue without her.
   After 20 to 30 minutes I flew up a steep wooded hill. Here I was back in Highland Park. Skillful flying got me close to a building (known as the 'farmhouse' near the ballfield). At first I thought about going inside that building and then decided to go around it. A minute or two later the OBE aprubtly concluded.
   Immediately after the OBE I remembered the lake area from vaguely remembered projections decades ago (30 to 40 years). Is this a RTZ-physical location or an alternate universe? Or was this somewhere on a higher dimensional-astral plane? (a belief system territory??) I do not know. Next time there I should try to get information from a local person.
   Notes. Not sure what side I lay on (probably the right?). Duration was about 25 to 30 minutes. Time was roughly between 2:00 and 4:00 AM. It was a chilly night 'here' yet was a warm sunny day 'there'. This was not a deliberate OBE and consciousness (and intent) were weak.
Locale I (and very possibly another (Non I) Locale (perhaps an alternate universe/timeline or a BST).
A Familiar Location and Other (unfamiliar) Persons who were People (Incarnate or Discarnate?)
Emotional, Energy (pranayama), Flight, Meditation, Travel-teleportation.



Thanx for reading

Grey

[If]

Selski
There is no way that I can credit another person with having an out of body experience if that person is not fully aware of having the experience. Even If the person DID have an OBE but was only aware of the OBE as being a dream then the best that I can do is state that the person May have had an OBE. If a person is unsure of this then I too cannot be certain either.
So I see no point in stating that a lucid dream or a normal, non-lucid dream is an OBE when the person who has the dream or LD cannot be sure themselves.
To me debating the issue is purely academic and a waste of time.

Consider all the MANY posts on this website (and other websites) where the poster asks "Was this an OBE or a Dream?" Those posts almost always include a description of the experience followed at the end by the question asking "So what do you think? Was this an OBE or was it a dream?"
My point here, of course, is that if the person who had the expereince is unsure then there is NO WAY that another person can be absolutely sure either.
I pointedly disagree that all non-lucid dreams are OBEs. I have yet to hear a good reasoning to believe that. Some dreams may be OBEs. Yet how can anyone tell?

You ask

What is the difference between projecting to an alternate universe and a higher dimension/plane?  What is the difference between an astral projection and a projection to a parallel universe?  When you have an experience, what do you deem it to be...and more importantly what tell-tale signs of the experience led you to that label?

Okay, trying hard Not to be dogmatic here I will firmly claim that the out of body state is when a person's consciousness leaves their physical body. Sometimes their consciousness remains at the location where their physical body rests. On other occasions the discarnate consciousness leaves the location where the body rests and travels elsewhere. One way to label an OBE is by the location traveled to and visited by the discarnate consciousness. So there Is a meaningful difference between an OBE where the person remained in his/her bedroom and an OBE where the person travelled to another physical location on Earth (example Paris) and an OBE where a person travelled to an alternate/parallel universe and an OBE where a person travelled to another non-physical location like a Belief Sysytem Territory or Shamballah. In each of the different OBEs the person went to a different location so each 'label' has a significant meaning.

Your question

How do you know that astral projection generally isn't self-created?  As in parallel universes, higher planes etc.?

We can discuss and debate what is real, or what is reality, or what is objective and what is subjective. The long and short of that debate centers on how each individual views the world, what is real and what is objective. Suffice it to say that I view each individual as having an objective existence. After that I leave it up to each individual to decide for themselves what is real and what is objective. So I see no point in trying to answer your question. I am not dodging or evading the question, I do not see that the question can be answered in any meaningful way.

As regards phasing I have no personal experience with it and am undecided if it is a form of OBE, clairvoyance or remote viewing.

Regards
Grey

[So]

jub jub
Your resonse to the post is appreciated. Thanx.


Kraven
Your quote

It's always nice to recognize the moment when you realize an OBE is happening.

That is quite right. In fact those first few moments upon becoming aware of being in an OBE are usually intensely exciting for me. It can be So exciting that I often need to deliberately calm down or else will lose the OBE.

Grey

interception

your quote

So in very simple terms, one answer would be: if these labelled experiences overlap so much as they seem to be doing, and you often cannot tell them apart, then there's no real solid difference between them. Now is there? 

It is all just human labels and degrees of experience.

I would agree with you somewhat. The term "degrees of experience" is very appropriate. Two other  terms that could also apply are 'degrees of consciousness' and 'degrees of perception'. You are right in stating that many of the differences in such experiences are only labels that we conveniently use in the language of waking life .

Grey

[MAY]

An out of body experience is when a person is fully aware of their consciousness being separate and apart from their physical body. Of course there are different types of OBEs. There are ethereal/etheric/RTZ projections. There are astral projections. There are projections to alternate/parallel universes. There are projections to higher dimensions and/or higher planes. All of the above are OBEs yet IMO all involve a clear conscious separation of the astral/ethereal body-consciousness from the physical body.

Lucid dreams are experiences where the dreamer MAY be out of body yet is still only aware of the dreamscape. Of course this leaves open the possibility that much of the dreamscape in a lucid dream is Not created by the dreamer and therefore does have an outside objective existence. Whether or nor this is the case in a lucid dream the dreamer has not quite made the (quantum?) jump up in consciousness and therefore is not fully aware of it- meaning that the dreamer still perceives the experience as occuring in only a dreamscape.

And yes there is a HUGE area of overlap and it can all get quite confusing.

This happens to me ALL the time and at times nobody is more confused by the overlapping Grey area of consciousness than I.

Somewhat confused 

Or maybe not

Grey

Passages from the Bible aside, why would only a few people see the "silver cord" when out of body when most people do not see it? As I stated before there is apparently No connection of seeing the cord with a person's religious beliefs. So I find it extremely odd that a very few people see the "silver cord" during most of their OBEs, that a few people see the cord only once or twice and that most people do not see the cord at all.

Confused 
Grey

[OBE #73.]

Finally getting more up to date with my postings. This OBE is only about 3 or 4 months old, from October last year.

Out Of Body Experience # 73
"Night Flight Over Highway"
Saturday, October 6, 2007

   This OBE began as a dream titled "Prelude to an OBE - Country Trip" -
In this dream I am going in a car with some friends to a place out in the country that is part amusement park and part meeting place. Eventually I get out of the car and walk several miles and arrive at that place a few hours later. I am somewhat disappointed that the place is now much more commercial and charges an entry fee. A short time later I leave and start home on foot. Soon I begin to fly along a busy country highway. After flying 5 to 10 miles I am near a midsize town. As I got to within a mile of this town I flew up several hundred feet into the air to try to locate a major highway.
   
OBE #73. "Night Flight Over Highway"
Very suddenly day turned into night. This was the end of the transitional consciousness state and the start of the OBE proper. Consciousness was not lucid nor was I focused and it took me several minutes to realize that I was out of body.
   I flew above a road into the town at about 40 to 50 mph. I then turned and flew above a major street. Soon that street went down a very big hill towards the downtown area. My vision was poor. I had trouble reading the road signs as I flew past. It was very dark. I rose up again high into the sky to spot the vehicle lights on any nearby major highways.
   Eventually I did see vehicles and flew towards the highway, reaching it a few minutes later. I now had a sense of urgency as the pull of my physical body was calling me back. I flew above the highway trying to spot the Alleghany River (which would eventually lead me back to Pittsburgh). Five minutes later the OBE suddenly ended. I saw that the time was nearly 6:00 AM. I then scribbled down a few lines of notes and then got up and got ready for work.
   Notes. This OBE lasted 15 to 20 minutes. I lay on my left side. Projection/separation occured out of a dream and was not deliberate.
Locale I and Unfamiliar Persons who were (physical) People. Dream >>>(into) OBE, Travel-teleportation, Flight, Meditation, Energy (pranayama).


Though this OBE was not very dramatic I did at least have a sense of going somewhere and doing something.

Thanx for reading
Grey

What probably is confusing is that during the OBE there is an element of Dual Consciousness  -- that is partly being aware of physically in bed while also OOB. If the astral/ethereal body is too close to the physical body during the dual consciousness then there could be confusion about getting caught up in a blanket or sheets while actually out of body.

This, in fact, has happened to me during several partial OBEs and has prevented me from getting fully out of body.

Grey

Regarding the number of people who were out of body and saw their 'Silver Cord"--

Sightings of the "Silver Cord" were one of the Notes on OBE Phenomena that I included in the OBE Internet Survey that I did. (BTW that survey was posted in AstralPulse back about October or November of 2006. Here is the link
www.astralpulse.com/forums/welcome_to_obe_discussions/obe_survey_report_part_7_notes_psi_through_vibrations-t24957.0.html )
Only 71 of over 4,300 people who reported an OBE also reported seeing their "Silver Cord". That is only about 1.6%. That is quite a small percentage. However, the people who did report the 'Silver Cord' covered a broad gamut or range including sex, age and religious or spiritual beliefs. So I could find No preconceived notions of someone seeing a "Silver Cord" before they went out of body.

Grey

Another OBE that happened in the spring of last year --


Out Of Body Experience # 72
"Flight And Fight"
Wednesday, May 23, 2007

   During the early stages of what was already a full OBE there were 2 discarnates that were preventing me from getting outside a building. I was in a large office building (this might have been along the Parkway West between Greentree and the Pittsburgh International Airport.) Both discarnates were male. One was rather tall and the other was quite short.
   {Perhaps the office building was only a symbolic form representing my physical body and those 2 discarnates were preventing me from having a full OBE. This is unlikely yet possible.}
   The 2 discarnates followed me as I flew through various rooms and hallways. Everytime that I tried to go through a window and get outside they either distracted me or created an obstacle to prevent me from leaving. After nearly 10 minutes of going from room to room and floor to floor (and seeing well over a dozen office workers) I did go through a window and got outside. When outside I had to skillfully fly to maneuver under a large concrete structure, then flew over a busy highway near a large intersection. (Again I believe that this was the Parkway West between Greentree and the airport.)
   I flew above the highway at about 100 to 150 feet height. Many vehicles moved about below. Those 2 male spirit hinderers followed me. I used magick and attacked both, hitting each with offensive spells. I hit the larger discarnate once or twice with lightening. I visualized the spells first and then soon wounds began to appear on these beings. This did quite a bit of damage and, within a few minutes, both were unable to continue their pursuit.
   My flight lasted at least 10 minutes, maybe 20 minutes. At some point I flew past several multifloor office buildings in what looked to be an industrial park. A noise outside eventually ended the OBE and instantly brought me back to my physical body.
   Notes. I lay on my left side. Time was between 5:15 to 6:00 AM. It was daylight outside so the heavy vehicular trafic and office workers were quite plausible. Total duration was about 25 to 30 minutes.
Locale I in a Familiar Location and Other (unfamiliar) Persons/Beings who were (physical) People and the 2 Spirit Hinderers. Deliberate, Floated, Flight, Emotional, Magick, Barrier, Fight, Travel-teleportation, Meditation, Energy (pranayama).

Thanx for the link Dood. I will check it out.

Grey

Many theoretical physicists expouse the idea of alternate or parallel universes. The idea was first proposed by Hugh Everett in 1957. Everett was a quantum physicist trying to tackle (simplify) the vast complexities created by the dual wave-particle nature of sub-atomic particles, like photons. Everett thought that the inability of scientists to simultaneously measure photons and other quantum particles as both an energy wave AND a partivle of matter could be solved be having the subatomic particles co-exist in an alternate/parallel universe. Then it would be possible to measure both particle mass and wave energy at the same time.

However, Everett was far from a metaphysical thinker (he ended up working on nuclear weapons) and most of the theoretical work on parallel universes has been done by the scientists who followed him. The theoretical work that has been done is quite varied and complex. There is too much of it to try to summarize it in this post. However, Stephen Hawking was one of the first people to popularize the idea in his book, "A Brief History of Time". Other scientists like Kerr and Davis have expanded the idea and some have even diagrammed theoretical stargates (Kerr tunnels or Einstein-Rosen bridges) between this universe and parallel universes.

btw to my knowledge not All parallel universes Must have a copy of each of us in them. In fact it could be possible that many parallel universes do not even have an Earth. The varieties are nearly endless.

Personally I buy into the Parallel Universe theory, but only so far. Like all things based on physics (Newtonian or quantum) there are probably certain limitations that must be observed. Of course, at present, nobody knows what those limits are.

Grey
grey
GREY
grEY

Two options on what Monroe may have meant by that quote.

1) The knowledge and ability to leave the body via OBE allows a person to "leave behind" the old, outmoded physically based world view. That opens up possibly unlimited opportunites to expand the consciousness in a spiritual and/or metaphysical way.

2) OBEs allow an individual the option to literally take off and go whenever and wherever they want to go via Out of body travel. Of course the travel is not permanent, it is only temporary. Monroe journeyed to hundreds, if not thousands, of incredible locations. so when he wrote

You may pack up your experience and leave for whenever and for wherever you desire.

he was implying that the journeys were only temporary.
btw that is the way I interpret his quote.

Grey

For anyone interested in the possibility of communicating with deceased relatives (or friends) I recommend the website www.adcrf.org (Adcrf stands for After Death Communication Research Foundation). The site is run by Jeffrey and Jodi Long who also run the NDERF.org and OBERF.org sites. (Near Death Experience and Out of Body Experience Research Foundation). All of those sites have relevant information and hundreds of personal accounts.

Grey