Messages

Regarding proof about ETs.

I suspect that the proof of ETS is Exactly like Proof of OBEs. You must experience one for yourself. Then when you try to tell someone they think that you are crazy.

No, seriously, there Are many reported encounters of humans with ETs. The best known of these is Billy Meier. He has taken hundreds of photos and written thousands of pages of contact transcripts. Yet the average person on the street has probably never heard of him.

In fact it is quite difficult to talk about either OBEs or ETs Very convincingly. I find it Very hard to accurately describe my experiences. And I DO NOT try to convince anyone. It's a waste of time. The only true Proof is to experience an OBE yourself.
Same for ET contact. Of all the people that I have heard talk about alien contact only 2 or 3 seem credible. The short list is Bob Lazaar, Stanton Friedman and Whitley Strieber. That's all. Everyone else might be telling the truth. But the others lack that special quality to make the unbelievable sound believable.

Grey

About "Astral Police"

Over the last few years I have read at least three or four different accounts of some type of "astral Police" "enforcing" the RTZ ethereal dimension. That is in addition to Robert Monros's account in one of his books and Old Dood's friend.
So there may be something to it. However, all the accounts have been reported third person style. It seems more rumor and speculation that actual encounters while out of body.
One explanation could be that political VIPs like Pres. Bush really DO have spirit guardians or guardian angels looking out for them??
So might make sense if you believe that there Are a group of discarnates trying to influence world events. Unfortunately this leads to more questions then answers so I try not to think much about it.

Unsure
grey

CFTraveler
your quote

About the 'two separate sets of rules', do you mean the 'belief caused hell' versus the 'guilt caused hell'? I don't see them as separate, I see them as versions of the same thing.  You believe that the afterlife is like this, you create it until you don't need to anymore, you die feeling guilty about something you did, you experience it, and then create what you think you deserve for it.  How is this different?

If I understand correctly then I like your idea. The idea that each individual evolves to a higher level of knowledge and undersatnding. In so doing then the old, outmoded ideas and thoughts can be discarded because they are no longer needed. Eventually even the most deep seated feelings and biases may be discarded if experience and knowledge warrant it. That would be the basis for enlightenment.

Sincerely
Grey 

Gandalf
your quote

In my view, any resistance is due to your mind. Other than that, there are no barriers.

I basically agree. But it does bring up the question -- that if a more evolved mind/conscience wishes to erect barriers and keep us out of a place then those barriers (though not physical) are still very real indeed.
There are limits even in the astral and those limits are probably imposed/created by more powerful discarnates.

It would be nice if I'm wrong but suspect not.
Grey

Zorgblar

Good idea. I have thought of that myself on occasion. Problem is that you need to be skilled at projecting to a specific location. And because you have never been to Area 51 there is no personal link there that you can attune to.

As to dangers there --- that is anyone's guess.
I believe that any harm incurred by an astral traveller at Area 51 would only be temporary and short term (but have no way of knowing for sure).


If you get there let us know !

Grey

Parapsycho

You were probably reasonabley close to an OBE.
Next time try to focus more on the intention of going out of body. If possible don't let distractions like noise or music get in your way.

Good luck
grey

A couple of thoughts about parallel or alternate universes.

They are most commonly experienced by people who go out of their physical bodies during a Near Death Experience. Usually what happens is that some sort of spirit guide gives them an option of whether to return to their physical bodies (and live) or remain in the superphysical realm (and die). This choice will be accompanied by a vision of the person's funeral. This is the parallel/alternate universe where the person experiences what the effects of his/her death will have on their family and friends.
(btw Obviously the person chooses to return and live or otherwise the story would never be told.)

Also Whitley Streiber recently appeared on coast to coast radio with Art Bell and related a fascinating account of travelling to several parallel universes, all in one night. His story can be found on his website
www.unknowncountry.com    (Look for his diary link on the homepage.)

Grey

Hi Alchemist.

Regarding your phasing experience to API.

No I have never seen anything like that. It should be mentioned that I have not actually projected to API. However, I have done several guided visualization meditations sessions on API.

Also, apparently very few people (if anybody at all) are attempting to OBE to API anymore. I don't know why this is because I feel that there are still some very interesting things to be expereinced at API. I still try to go there from time to time but have not yet been successful. So I have no idea about the signifance of what you saw there.

Grey 

About mirrors.

I have read many OBE reports of people using mirrors as a portal to go 'somewhere' else. That 'somewhere' always varies. It could be another location somewhere on earth. It could be somewhere on an astral "plane". It is strange that the mirror portals seem to lead to different places for different people and some people don't go anywhere at all. Very mysterious.

Confused 
Grey 

Here is another OBE from this past spring. Actually it was several OBEs that happened one after another. I only recall three projections although as many as 7 or 8 occured that night.

Out Of Body Experience # 71 a, b and c
"Confusing Series of Separations"
Wednesday, April 25, 2007

   This was not just one but several OBEs taking place over the course of an hour. There were actually more than 3 separations-projections but I can only clearly recall 3 of these.
   Consciousness during these OBEs was both unique and somewhat surreal, even bizarre. I realized what was happening in that I was aware of the actual OBE state of consciousness. Yet sometimes it felt like overlapping into another state of consciousness. It even felt like being in a parallel or alternate world or universe.  It was a feeling of being out of place. It was unnecessarily surreal. This is difficult for me to understand and harder to describe in understandable language.
   OBE # 71 a. I was out of body in what now seems an unfamiliar room. During the OBE the place did seem vaguely familiar. (I cannot explain that.) I tried to materialize through what appeared to be a large window. As I got halfway through the glass pane the window suddenly appeared to be a solid white wall. This abruptly ended the projection.
   OBE # 71 b.  I projected into the same location as OBE # 71 a (above) and again attempted to go through a large window. This time I was successful. The time outside was short and only vaguely remembered. I do recall flying over a residential area but, strangely, am now not sure if it was the same neighborhood where I currently reside.
   OBE # 71 c. The shortest OBE of the night. There was difficulty during the deliberate separation. Consciousness 'undulated' back and forth between hypnagogia (Focus 10) to full lucidity (Focus 12 <> Focus 15) to near waking mentality. I could focus long enough to effect a clear conscious separation and then float about a room for only a minute or so. This was the last OBE (of about 5, 6 or 7 OBEs) of the night.
   Notes. Time was between 3:00 to 5:00 AM (best guess). I lay on my right side. Duration # 71a 5 to 10 minutes, #71b 10 - 15 minutes, #71c was only about 90 seconds. It is important to again note and to stress the unusual state of consciousness. At times it felt like being in another world.
OBE #71a Floated, Barrier, Sleep paralysis, Travel-teleportation, Meditation, Energy (pranayama).
OBE #71b Floated, Flight, Vibrations, Travel-teleportation, Meditation, Energy.
OBE #71c Familiar Location, Deliberate, Short, Floated, Sleep paralysis, Meditation, Energy.
All 3 OBEs were in Locale I (RTZ)


As always any comments are welcome
Grey 

Hi Matt

Kodemaster basically has it right. The most important elements in successful projection are intent and continued effort and practice.

Any "work" that you now do should eventually pay off.  Most people have an OBE within a few weeks of starting what I will call a 'training routine'. Also, many times OBEs occur days or weeks after a person ends or suspends a regular routine of OBE induction and/or meditation, meaning that an intention to go out of body is firmly set in the mind, even the subconscious. So stay at it and don't quit.

good luck
Grey

Try not to be too put off by what people have to say about OBEs.
Everyone has an opinion and this is the place for them to express it.

That being said, always let your own experiences guide you on such matters. No amount of reading, book learning or opinion can substitute for an actual OBE.

Interpretation and analyses of an OBE is just okay at best. As you know, nothing can replace actually experiencing an out of body travel. In the end only you can describe to us what your OBE was like and other peoples comment are just opinions, which is no substitute for the experience.

Sthomo

Good oberservation. Usually the inexperienced are much more likely to ask questions. You will notice also that the same questions tend to be asked again and again.

Like you I am somewhat disappointed that people to not post their OBE reports here on a more regular basis. Some people, like tvos, have their own websites. Other people apparently feel that an OBE is a very personal experience and does not need to be shared.

BTW, I have posted several of my OBEs for 2007 in the Welcome to Astral Experiences forum.
I should be posting more OBEs in a day ot two.

Sincerely
Grey

A few ideas come to mind.

1) it was on another planet.

2) it was a belief system territory - a place in the astral or ethereal created by non-humans or humans made to resemble a place where they had lived during their physical lives.

3) a meeting place where many different creatures meet after their physical deaths.

4) perhaps it was in an alternate (parallel) universe.

5) or it may have been one of the proverbial "lower levels".

Anyway the only way to know for sure would be to ask one of those creatues. If you ever go back there again. 

Grey

My OBEs have confirmed my belief in an existence after physical death.
I think you got it right in your quote --

I would think having an OBE would diminish the fear and make one enjoy this life even more

Yes , it does Diminish the fear. But, No, it does not completely erase the fear. That fear is there for a reason - that survival instinct keeps people from doing foolish and dangerous things. I respect that fear and I respect death.

Here is another of my most recent OBEs.
This one happened in the spring. At that time I was beginning to OBE on a somewhat regular basis. Unfortunately, since that time my OBEs have come only sporadically. (sigh). This OBE shows the importance of controlling ones emotional state. It also shows how an OBE can be limited at the outset by lack of intention and focus.

Out Of Body Experience # 70
"Crawling And Flying"
Sunday, March 25, 2007

   This began with very strong vibrations. These vibrations first oscillated in intensity and then grew stronger. I tried 2 or 3 times to affect a separation but could not do it. Then, on the third or fourth try, I managed to roll out/float up and did separate my astral/ethereal body from my physical body.
   Once out of body I had poor vision and realized that I needed to pull away from my physical body by crawling along the floor. So I crawled through the door out of my bedroom. Continuing on, I crawled down 2 flights of stairs to the first floor. There I saw my mother sitting at the dining room table doing paperwork. (The next day she said that she had fallen asleep on a couch in the adjacent living room. She woke up there just about the time that I was OOB. So perhaps I saw her in the astral form. She could have been having an unconscious projection while dreaming of doing the mundane paperwork.)
   In any event I tried to get outside yet this was difficult to do. I floated in the corner of the dining room for a few minutes before successfully materializing through a wall outside above the driveway. Once outside my eyesight immediately became much better.
   Having a desire to fly I flew up over the next door neighbor's yard and headed north over the street. After going 1 block and coming to the intersection (of Grafton St.) I flew between 2 houses. This was a Great flight. However, I did have to be mindful and cautious about flying near trees. There was also a need to control my emotional state and not become too excited.
   Then I was transported to an unfamiliar place and was flying over a large open area betwen apartment buildings. I was between 50 to 100 feet up. There were many small birds flying below. Soon the flight, and the OBE, aprubtly ended. The flight lasted about 10 minutes.
   Notes. Time was between 3:15 and 4:00 AM. I lay on my right side. Duration was 15 to 30 minutes.
Locale I and a Familiar Location. Familiar Person who was my mother (physical or discarnate?) Other Person(s)/Being(s) which were birds. Vibrations, Sleep paralysis, Deliberate-active, Emotional, Floated, Flight, Travel-teleportation, Meditation, Energy (pranayama).

tvos
10 minutes does count !
In my own experiences the time spent between the original intention of inducing an OBE and the actual separation (usually during sleep or just after sleep) causes a severe loss of focus on intention. That usually results in me just mucking about in or near my place of residence and getting little or nothing of importance done while OOB.
Believe me that there are many places that I wish to visit while OOB (eg Area 51, the Pyramids, API, etc) and many people whom I would like to meet (living and deceased, incarnate and discarnate). Yet it just does not happen. I suspect many people have the same problem- they forget their intentions while asleep and then do little during their OBE.
The less time between waking intention and OBE means that more of the waking intention will be retained during the OBE. Then a person could validate their OBEs more consistently, remember their OOB travels regularly and make contact with important (powerful) entities on a regular basis.

Grey

tvos -

IMHO the next giant leap in this field may well be from the person who can effect a full separation of their astral/ethereal body from their physical body from a waking state of consciousness.
Robert Monroe may have been able to do this - go OOBE with only a few minutes rest or relaxation.
Perhaps a few westerners May have this ability (Ingo Swann, Blue Harary). Eastern mystics (Swamis, yogis, etc) have also reportedly had this ability. So far nobody has proven this ability on a consistent level.

Grey

iNNERvOYAGER

Yes, I would include both the RTZ and Phasing as "sublevels" of the Out of Body state of consciousness.
"Sublevels" is not really a good description but I hope you get my idea here. An example would be the Hypnogogic state of consciousness where "sublevels" include meditation, trance, hypnosis and subliminal autosuggestion (amoung others).

Grey

I second Synergy's thoughts about jimson weed being very dangerous.
I actually had a personal experience where I drank a moderate amount of Angel trumpet tea (Brugmansia species of datura). I have no idea if the people and objects that I saw on that pyschedelic "trip' were physical, astral/ethereal or pure illusion/hallucination. In any event at no time during that experience was I in any condition/state of mind to deliberately induce and experience an astral/ethereal projection.
Regards
Grey

Thanx to everyone who has read and/or replied to my recent posts.
Here is another OBE which occured in the spring of this year.

Out Of Body Experience # 69
"Off Course City Flight"
Sunday, March 18, 2007

   This began as a dream. In the dream Dave S was a boarder in a house with a family. The family had decided to take in another boarder and that person was me. Several days later a teenage boy in the house was in a hurry to go somewhere. This had something to do with baseball. Instead I used this as an excuse to leave the house. After walking a block or two I cut through a backyard then began to float up and fly over a house. At this time I became lucid. Within moments I realized that this was an OBE and decided to continue in the out of body state.
   OBE #69 After struggling to fly about 2 blocks I came to a familiar intersection. It was North Highland Ave. and East Liberty Blvd. Peabody high school is on one side of this intersection and a Home Depot is on another side. Here I am quite confused as there was still the dream logic of going to a baseball stadium or field. Peabody high school has a baseball field yet for some reason I felt a need to go to Forbes Field which was torn down in 1970 ?! Apparently I mistook the dream logic in the recent dream for an intention to do something/find someone/go somewhere in the current OBE.
   In any event I gain some height and fly toward a bridge. I mistake this for the Bloomfield Bridge yet am nowhere near Bloomfield?! Upon realizing this mistake I veer off in another direction. I now erroneously believe to be flying southwest over East Liberty toward Shadyside. Instead I am heading SE towards Point Breeze. Both direction and intention are thoroughly muddled. Both more or less remain in that state for the duration of this OBE. I fly around over various city neighborhoods for at least 15 minutes, probably about half an hour. Many people and vehicles are moving about. It is early morning and is light outside - as it should be because time is between 6:00 and 7:15 AM.
   Eventually this OBE fades into a dream where I am in Peabody high school in a huge library. This library leads to various places such as a department store, a clothing store, a shoe store, etc. Both high school students and shoppers are walking about, including a few people who attended Peabody high school back in the mid 1970s. This dream is Not lucid.
   Notes. Lay on my right side. Time of projection about 6:00 - 7:15 AM. Duration was about 25 to 35 minutes, very likely a bit longer. This was probably my longest flight over a familiar area while OOB.
   Locale I and Familiar Locations. Other Person(s)/Being(s) who were People. LucidDream>>>>OBE>>>Dream, Deliberate (passive), Confused, Flight, Meditation, Energy (pranayama).

Kodemaster and tvos - thanx much for replying. It is good to communicate to both of you again.

tvos - by wide awake, are you refering to projecting directly from waking consciousness?
Or are you refering to projecting from the mind awake/body asleep state?
From what I have read projecting directly from waking consciousness is extremely rare and seems to occur mostly at random.
Grey.

I will post the experience in its entirety to Synergy's thread in the OBE discussions sticky.
Good idea iNNERvOYAGER.
Thanx
Grey

Hallo all 
The old saying of "Be careful what you wish for because you might just get it" comes immediately to mind when thinking about out of body time travel. During an OBE sometime in the late 1990s I had an opportunity to time travel yet deliberately chose not to do it! Here is what happened.

Most of the OBE was rather mundane. I just floated around inside my apartment with no real intent or focus. Then, about 10 to 15 minutes into the OBE, I saw a sort of portal or door appear in the window. In this portal I saw a dark misty landscape and then a French soldier appeared in view. He was dressed in the uniform of a World War One soldier. He stopped and began to look in at me. It was almost as if he expected me to come through the portal and enter his time period - sometime between 1914 and 1918 - World War I ! This incident was most unexpected and I was very much caught off guard. Now I have no doubt that I Could have gone through that (time) portal but I definately chose Not to do so. Whatever would have happened if I had done so would most probably have been very bad. So I passed on the chance to time travel and was happy that I did.

BTW I can post the OBE in full here if anybody is interested in reading it.
Thanx
Grey

If I may, I would like to briefly return to the ideas of
1) an unknown brown dwarf star somewhere in Our solar System, and
2) The Roswell 'aliens' actually being future humans coming back in time on Earth.

As to 1) Would not a brown dwarf star constantly emit copious amounts of radiation in all wavelengths? And would not that radiation have been monitored by someone on Earth long ago. Maybe my knowledge of brown dwarfs is faulty. I thought that a brown dwarf is many times more massive than Jupiter and generates its own UV, thermal and IR radiation. (??)

As to 2) The time traveller explanation seems unduly complex to me. I have a lot less trouble believing that an advanced civilization of ETs has found a way to go faster than light than to believe that Roswell was the result of a time travel experiment gone awry. Wormholes/stargates/energy portals could account for interstellar travel with relatively low energy needed. Yet time travel, according to scientists like Michio Kaku and others, requires nearly an infinite amount of energy to accomplish. IMHO I tend to favor the simpler explanations. The idea of Earth having been visited by ETs (or currently being visited by ETs) seems to be the simpler explanation.