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in your personal experience then...there were actual mystics/gurus involved in manipulating your mind/perspective and planting some kind of "attack" seed that ensued for 5 years? was it a cult or an individual, or just something you heard passed about? what was it that finally woke you up to this? and how drastically did things change afterward? when you became aware?

lots of questions
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i think that might be bcuz everyone is over for the grand opening of RB's new site.

i think i'm just beginning to understand how truly difficult this is for some people. it's become such a daily, automatic thing for me that it's hard to remember how i got here. the actual steps involved. like trying to understand someone behind the wheel of a car for the first time, when i've been driving everyday for the past twenty some-odd years. it really isn't anymore difficult than driving by the way. as frank suggested there is no secret, no special words to chant to get there. i think in a way for me (especially being very artistically passionate from birth)...it's very visual and there's a definite separation from this world...being able to let everything go. not like flipping a switch, but just a gentle release. a drawing back of sorts into your mind. not your brain, not behind your eyelids, etc.

those colors and strange little pictures that begin to form in the dark with your eyes closed. don't grab onto them. just relax your eyes and let them settle in. they will. and poof...you're there. of course it doesn't always have to poof. i also found in the beginning that it was much easier to accomplish AP with some light around me. either during the day or keeping a light on by the bed. not major wattage...just pleasant. in the beginning it was hard to project in the dark.

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yes. i wasn't implying that people shouldn't have fun. for some reason people always think i'm pushing to be serious, when in fact i'm leaning towards less serious. truth is a weird word for me actually, but i agree that everyone has a unique unified spirit that can't be denied. i think when one gets older they look back on a lot of the "fun" and see it as an escape ("oh if i hadn't wasted so much time on all the meaningless stuff) i think that's what i was getting at.
of course this can always be argued forever...so i don't push any particulars. still i have to consider the children in third world countries...how much fun are they having?!? i'm sure they involve themselves in a great number of things, some of which we could never imagine...yet i have to believe it's a different kind of fun from the privileged western or developed worlds. there are a lot of kids out there that are married with children, who have lost children to terrible diseases & hunger, who are working full-time and caring for their parents/grandparents, etc...all by the time that they're 18. i could continue to paint a very sad and extreme comparison here, but i don't feel it's necessary. there is a huge difference between appreciating what one has and living a joyous life...and being just plain ignorant, self-absorbed and living in a disposable world. that's harsh but it's also real.

in the begin we don't need to explore "higher truths". as infants we are complete...then something happens that changes all that...and the quest begins...and that's the part i'm trying to figure out. if all this seriousness is really necessary?!?

like the wall for instance is it necessary to figure out a way to climb over it? i sure know you don't have to climb back! as i've said so many times before all this started for me when i was really young. i didn't know what sleep paralysis was...i thought i was dying. same with obe's & ap...i didn't know it was some path to enlightenment. it didn't enter my mind that people would actually work to accomplish these things. they freaked me out big time, which is besides the point...but what makes it so hard for people to get to? the wall as i said is "implied"...it doesn't exist. just like there isn't any huge gap between canada and the united states. and it's becoming just as hard to move back and forth between borders as it is to move back and forth between realms...or so THEY would have us believe.

just rambling bcuz i'm bored (or truly avoiding having to work ). none of this is directed to anyone in particular.

by the way where is everyone?!? AD by chance
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to me the conditioned mind it more of a symptom, "under the influence" like with your drug & alcohol idea. take someone that has drank too much. they might slur their speech, stumble, become overly aggressive or affectionate, but all of these things are an "effect" or symptom from the altering substance "on the mind". possibly the "conditioning" is a magnification of the un or subconscious mind. like a drunk person will forget a large portion of functioning and work with just a few base modes. my suggestion is there might be some unseen alteration taking place that cancels out a large percentage of our functioning and magnifies or causes us to work with only a fraction of it...part of the programming being that we see it as the whole function. why fix it if it isn't broke?
we do only use what....10% of our brains?!? i don't know.
these are just ideas.

i'm not talking about the mind in total, bcuz i believe the entire thing to be much more powerful than any program..in the long run. something to do with divide and conquer i'd guess. ultimately i see it falling, but that's not going to make it any easier to come to grips with when the veil is lifted.

anyway...that's where i feel that attuning to the astral can be of benefit if it's not used as an escape or some intellectual crutch, which at the best of times is what most are doing. i have gone through that myself...A LOT.
i think a lot comes through in the astral to wake us up to what's really going on...and it's not what most people think or expect. with time it becomes easier to utilize for the reunification. there's a huge "implied" wall that is reinforced by a lot of people. this whole CROSSING OVER thing that makes it seem unattainable to a most or worse like a bunch of mumbo-jumbo mysticism that ultimately "won't get you anywhere". and should all be approached very scientifically. hogwash! never trust the truth where you have to prove yourself to another, follow someone else's rule, or pay a price for it.
there is no separation between the physical and the astral, or anything else for that matter...IMHO. and there are no special privileges for a select few.

i can't answer your other question about sleeping bcuz i haven't had the luxury of it in the past 30 years. i am just as conscious while asleep (if not more so) then i am when i'm awake. my body of course uses this time to rest and recharge, but my mind has no escape...except for the handful of things i still deny myself the truth of. i am not claiming to be fully awake.
i'm not sure we can be fully aware or awake yet. we can be more vigilant of what we aren't aware of, but i think that all of it happens on an unconscious level...thank god that a more complete sense of ourselves has got it going on. it is too easy to write a little post about drugs being bad or impairing projection, while sucking down a diet coke...and never see the relationship. never catch the irony of that lesson. it's all so (edit) subtle. yes be aware, but be aware that what you're surrounded by isn't necessarily the truth. even that book you're reading, even what i'm saying, even what you're thinking, etc.
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thank god that was the 60's though.

this keeps going back to the same question that everyone seems to be ignoring. i know everyone is very attached to their minds, and the idea that it is "their" own....somehow sacred and off-limits. although to me that idea is extremely immature. so...it seems to be very clear to most that drugs and alcohol are prime tools for ALTERING consciousness. my question is do you truly believe these are the only tools? how easily we all own what we are taught (with so little questioning) when a textbook teaches you about gravity...is that not altering you consciousness. when someone leans into your ear and whispers that the girl across the room is a grump...does that not alter your consciousness? watching television, listening to the people around you, picking up on other people's habits...all it is is conditioning and very much mind altering. that's what we can see, hear, touch, taste...that's the physical conditioning, and alcohol and drugs are nothing more than tools...no different from a telephone, tv set, or car. if people are refusing to see how the physical alters the mind, then i see where "attempting to understand how & what "unseen" forces are altering the mind"...is just too much for the average person to comprehend.  

again...how do we know that are minds are our own?

i know nothing about this "focus level" stuff, and i don't pretend that i want to.  i am curious though what the physical level is referred to? is it viewed as just a "given"? a time-out zone? it feels like the ideas here are either to utilize the astral as an "escape" from the physical or...to rework the physical "through" the astral. all in all it seems that the space we occupy physically is ignored for the most part...and where is the truth in that???

anyone interested in mind alteration might find this mans work interesting.
(for those looking for credentials & expertise...this guy's got it)
http://www.cassiopaea.org/cass/greenbaum.htm

would be very interested in what anyone "thinks" after reading this!
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have you ever considered the fact that he might be under attack/possession.
seems like a ridiculous excuse for just being lazy or down & out, but anything  out of the ordinary that might suggest this?

i have no idea what you should say to him. just handle it WELL. be noble even if you are ticked off.

and now begins the long, arduous battle of rejection. it's probably not the type of "popularity" a girl hopes for...but stand your ground. one thing that might be beneficial about these times is that they have stepped up their mission. they have a quota to fill. this might in fact cause them to move on in a sense. no time to waste on the stubborn! too many people to sway.
i'm here if things get rough & you need to talk. you can always PM if things get freaky!!!

respect
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wow. nice atmosphere. a bunch of self-righteous guys blocking the pass.
very interesting behavior from the spiritually evolved. deprivation in the female does lead to enlightenment...in men it leads to perversion, over grooming & beating chests (among other things).

Souljah, that puts things into perspective. You're not here to actually communicate anything. Rather selfish, don't you think?

Thank you, though, for warning me that your posts are intentionally meaningless. Now I don't have to waste my time reading them.

young telos: amazing you could take my comments about using this forum as nice, simple escape from my work, and turn it into something "wrong". (non-communicative/selfish/intentionally meaningless & a waste of your time)...have i put you off somehow? i could care less if you read my posts or not. 1) i don't think you are reading them 2) why do you think that would bother me?

as far as what "i'm doing here"...signed up after hearing robert speak on C2C. was interested in others experiences. i've been AP/OBEing/etc for over twenty years so that limits me to a VERY small group here (if i'm looking for more experience than i myself posses). i have more experiences in one day, than most people here have had in their entire lifetimes...still i don't go around bashing anyone for their lack of knowledge in these areas, or deciding who's right and wrong/who's worthy of exchange,etc. i feel i bring a well-seasoned & balanced POV on astral topics. (that was a statement, not a question).  

y'all don't ACTUALLY have to be missing your eyes to be blind.
in the land of the blind one-eye is KING. it sounded good the first time i heard it, but to back this kind of nonsense...it's lost something. typical.

so whatever gets everyone's blood pumping here. BRING IT ON. i am oh so well trained in dealing with thugs, although i have moved on from the basics of hand to hand combat/fighting fire with fire...whatever gets you guys off?!? this space ironically is very much astral and my experience has led to a function where letting it all flow is most efficient (for me). i am not going to attempt to block whatever is slung in my direction. not ignorant enough to let any of it get on me. sorry. if you're looking for a battle of wits you need to make more intelligent blows. simply attacking my character ain't gonna cut it.

you're move
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oh.......my...........god.
that's suppose to be funny right?!? must be late.

it's a  scientific fact (don't you just love it when people are factual?!?)
that (for example) blind people's remaining senses are ACTUALLY more refined and intensified/astute...sound/touch/taste/etc. when you limit one the others get stronger. like when you shut your mouth you get smarter. no...that was bad. sorry. really it was ONLY a BAD/SAD joke. might be true though...i'm not sure. seems like it would have to work the same way. scientifically speaking. i'll have to research that.

and i think it's a much better idea if your girlfriend blindfolds & gags you!!!
for experimental purposes of course.    
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that's why i'm a painter. i work with images day & night, but in between when i need a break i do stuff like this. i once saw an interview of this boy (maybe 16) that stopped talking for an entire year. he was (afterwards) possibly the most profound speaker i've ever heard. very inspiring. seems like it would be an excellent experiment...even if it were simply for a week. all the other ways there are to communicate. maybe until we stop talking so much, we won't ever get closer to things like telepathy? maybe if we blindfolded ourselves as well we'd progress even faster. that would be a good 'scientific' project....1 weekend blindfolded and speechless & post effects.

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and 100 karma points to knightlight for agreeing with me 100%
actually for just agreeing

what guy?

i'm not sure if you're talking about the website i posted, but...you don't know. we're living in the information age. you can't trust anything except what feels like the truth for you and you alone.

it was more of a joke bcuz i didn't have time to link it all up. there are some very interesting things on that site...if one cares to follow them.
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if you can afford the time sit down and write it out on paper. sometimes it's easier to get your point across when you're only working in one direction. no retaliation. though it also leaves lot of room for misinterpretation, although that seems to be happening anyway. so if i were you. i write. get it off your chest at least.

333
there are millions of people wasting their time by choice. you can't save them and you can't convince them that time is of the essence. you need to focus on yourself.

36...two times too old, but i have question if no one minds...would help me with some research i'm doing and would be EXTREMELY appreciated.

i'm assuming some of you are of the "harry potter" generation.
i know you are all alternative thinkers & highly imaginative/creative as well.
i'm curious...for a similar type book based in american culture what things could be included that would make it different from the H.P. series? things that are less fantasy like and more realistic...like AP & OBE's? (instead of flying brooms and magic wands?) just wondering if anyone had any strong feelings about what might have missing from the series...in your personal opinion.

i don't want to change the nature of this thread at all so PMing would be great ..............................whoever cares to reply
much respect to all you indigo & crystal creatures!

don't let us old folks mess with your minds!
333  

seems to be the theme for a lot of movies as well. being surrounded and out numbered by the un-dead, and then a lot of talk about "awakening" (spiritually). choice is up to individual of waking up or remaining "____" (what) un-awaken...un-dead...living ones life in limbo and not choosing a force?!? makes sense. the dreams and the movies are pushing a point. i know a few others that are having similar dreams. there is a great amount of pressure in the way of belief systems that the masses (of un-dead) try to impose, esp. on the awakened. an eating alive of sorts.
definitely overwhelming count if it was divided into teams, but there are many unseen forces on your side.  good time to experiment with the situation in the astral and see what works/what doesn't.

keep us posted
333

seems to be a lot of request lately for me to provide information to back up my posts. seeker of truth wants me to impress him with the cassiopaean information. another small group wants me to explain the conspiracy of mind control, and now a request for connections between lucifer/saturn and whether or not bush is a satanist. man...that's a lot of running around on my part...and for what?!? so people can continue to consider me some loony, extreme conspiracy theorist. actually that doesn't bother me, but...i do a ton of networking and research, and there's no way that i could bring it all together in a neat little package or a link. everyone will have to do their own googling if they want to spend the time. if not...then they really didn't care to know in the first place.
i don't mind sharing my personal experience in the astral, but when it comes to web info...y'all on yer own!

but here's a little something just for CaCoDeMoN to start with
http://www.theforbiddenknowledge.com/hardtruth/george_w_bush.htm

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Unlike most of the things you've said, this statement is worthy of consideration

that's funny...what causes you to believe that i want to appease the scientific minds here? i wasn't criticizing franks statement (you might have missed the part about me being in agreement)...i simply was interpreting it in another light (or is that not allowed?) frank can pride himself however he wants and/or you can "interpret" franks pride however you wish. i don't need to tell you that, but i will say that my points aren't about either of you (really).

You're also more likely to be of more help to the rest of us.

unfortunately (i guess) for the "rest of you" whoever that is...i don't make of habit of testable/falsifiable comments. as i said i don't buy into right in wrong, and i definitely don't support it being imposed as the more intelligent form of discussion.

i'm not here to argue my point of view. i'm sure not here to argue someone else's POV either.
and good luck with the numbers
333

my truth: there is no such thing as right or wrong.

thank god!

there is much more that can be read into everything, but that one sentence summed it up so neatly, so completely. i didn't want to explain it to the nth degree...i just wanted to wait and see if "anyone" out there had their spiritual blinders off. blessed be tombo (not for taking my side) for being able to see in many directions at once.

people say stuff like that all the time without thinking, but where i can overlook it in people that are beginning to understand this sense of "I"...i tend to be a little concerned when it's used by people that claim to have a  "better understanding" than most of what's taking place. then i look at the people that missed it and wonder what the dynamics are in that. the ones that immediately said it was "nothing", said it was good more and more people were waking up. that is however not what was said. and here's the twister that causes me think this way...because in fact I AGREE with frank.
(and why the sentence jumped out at me). more and more people are now actually experiencing the truth for THEMSELVES...bcuz i believe that a shift is taking place that can no longer be CONTROLLED...by the "beings" that have controlled our minds for so very long. we just might come to know free-will by this. we may finally begin to utilize our powers fully, and do the things we've only "dreamed" of up to this point. the powers that hang over this place manipulating our minds are not going to move off quietly and allow this to happen. that is not in their agenda, nor is compassion an aspect of their nature.

the shift can't stopped. they can't keep people from waking up. all they can do is corral us into pools of same (like attracts like). keep us blind to our individual powers and use that heard mentality they implanted in us to cling together for safety in numbers. understanding this involves knowing that one of us has enough power to take out a large portion of this mental-grid, but for those dependent on it...that natural power is in a sad state of entropy...and the artificial power too strong to pull away from. the secrets to unplugging have to come from within and when one is ready, when we ask...the path will show itself. to claim that "I" know the answer, and compassionately pass it on...for ME to "help" "enlighten" others , would be a function that comes from this place of artificial power. the act of sharing "this truth" which doesn't truly exist would be leading away from the independent power of the individual. etc.

i know most people don't want to hear this and the "reactions" will be the same as to my other posts, but i am not here to sway masses or direct the individual...i know we are all waking up. being born into a new consciousness (our own), and if one is capable of understanding their birth into this physical world...if one can see back to that first moment and sense how truly uncomfortable and painful that move is. the light, the pressure of this atmosphere, air tearing through the lungs for the first time. once you can sense that, then you begin to see that any birth/rebirth is the same. it is not meant to be pleasant and comfortable, or easy (this awakening)...which is a controversial topic in this forum. it is at last a real choice of free-will. at the same time there is another false-awakening that is an easier ride. a little package plan with some manifestation and psychic abilities thrown in for attraction. each of us will make a choice, and all i can suggest is that choice will be better made with the blinders off.

(long sigh)......go ahead. PLEASE. feel free to tear this apart and resist whatever you wish. flex that muscle and get it prepared.
333

you're honesty is very rare & noble. admitting that as you know is only half the battle, but i love you for being open-minded...wonderful show of strength & humility (although also a little arrogant)
we are all a bit twisted when it comes to these situations. and distance is good. not rushing one way or the other. a subtle move and then waiting to see what happens next before you move again. this chess strategy stuff that we are conditioned into is great in some areas, but sucks for relationships. always trying to be six moves ahead of the other. it is the function of enemies, not friends.
it will be difficult i know to break away, but a new quest has begun.

you have already looked at your behavior and admitted many difficult things,  the other difficult part is in accepting him as i said. whether you remain friends or not...it's important to put yourself in his shoes (another aspect of the quest)...when he is ready he will find his way. there is time. space may be what he needs to reflect on himself. it sounds like he is transferring his frustration with himself onto you. it seems like you are trying to refuse him this move, but as long as you're together a certain exchange is already established, and very hard to change w/out some distance. he might find someone else to transfer onto, or he might go through an even lower period while working some things out, but they are his lessons, and they're no easier or no more difficult than anyone else's. it's all relative. you might find yourself in a similar situation in the future. you can't say. how would you want someone to treat you at that point?
compassionately, respectfully, but not enabling you to miss your lessons.

it's all once big circle. follow it thoughtfully.
best of luck
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naahever mind already. really.

well no...you know (one more time) it's kind of like saying...

more and more the africans are NOW actually starting to educate themselves.
or
more and more the native americans are NOW actually demonstrating that they can support themselves
or
more and more women are NOW ACTUALLY experiencing real independence for themselves

or something like...
more and more the people @ AP are NOW actually starting to think for themselves.

if no one see where that's insulting i am truly disturbed as i said.
333

omg.

i don't know why i'm bothering with this, but...(one more time)
ahhh...this is so silly.

WHO was DOING the EXPERIENCING BEFORE???
before these "people" (whoever they are) began experiencing it for
THEMSELVES???

how complicated is that to comprehend?
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gag. why did you have to do that?

i have a ton of sexual experience (astrally speaking) and i kept going back to that thread, but i could never bring myself to post anything. thank god (i didn't did i?!?). i couldn't read that thread again if someone paid me.

wondering how the marriage is going though?!?
still wondering in my twisted little mind how i might reply to sir jack hoff, who keeps falling off his bed and such...in fits of orgasmic ecstasy. poor guy
333

where's frank already???

and NO...that's still the most disturbing.

ha. praying to lucifer. you & bush
maybe you should have said praying to saturn?!?

some of the most successful people on this earth pray to lucifer...whether you're in good company or not i can't say...but you're definitely not alone.
(and no...i'm not going to prove that)
333

surely you JEST