Messages

[Originally posted by Jeff_Mash:]

quote:Originally posted by Jeff_Mash:
[
Yes, I would say that is true.  The more in control of your feelings, the more control you will have over your experience.  This includes both the induction of an OBE (since it takes a lot of discipline of your thoughts) as well as your OBE itself (which takes a lot of focus).

Isn't that interesting? The astral world is a world where all our wishes and desires can come true.  Interestingly, whenever we have strong emotions (and that is where desires and wishes belong) we loose control over it.

This would make the physical world a product of our own emotions.




"Minds are like parachutes. They only work when they are open."  -  unknown

"Real science can be far stranger than science fiction and much more satisfying."   - Stephen Hawking

[Originally posted by MadJack:]

quote:Originally posted by MadJack:
Has anyone tried this -

Recently I bought a Trifield Natural EM meter - completely useless really but interesting in that it reads very small changes in very faint magnetic/electrical/radio fields - you can breathe and produce a reading - it's that faint. It can also produce a tone with user defined 'squelch' level.

Possibly the reading are similar to dream states, so be sure that you get some information about that first. I doubt that it is possible to see the diffrence of AP and dream states without certain experience. IHMO



"Minds are like parachutes. They only work when they are open."  -  unknown

"Real science can be far stranger than science fiction and much more satisfying."   - Stephen Hawking

[Originally posted by Frank:]

quote:Originally posted by Frank:

After a while of trying I'd hear a voice telling me about things I wanted to hear: the moment I heard the voice I'd immediately think, "Hey I just made contact!" and instantly the connection was broken. The same would happen if I concentrated on the actual voice.

So can we say when there is a way to control our feelings we can easier have OBEs or easier do anything during the OBE?




***Minds are like parachutes. They only work when they are open.***

[Originally posted by alpha:]

quote:Originally posted by alpha:
This has got me curious.After reading about it in Monroes 2nd book.He writes about going to the future.Sounded to me like anything that was there was fair game.He mentions becoming a cloud.Some kind of panther,A leaf if I remember correctly.And a bird.

Well, that is not really taking over the body of an animal. http://www.astralpulse.com/forums/images/icon_Smile_wink.gif" border=0>

What would be more interesting is while being an animal, do you have the brains of an animal?

Have you ever seen "Altered States"? Do you remember William Hurt turning into an apeman?

                                                                                                                 











-------------------------------
"WAKE UP!WAKEUP!WAKE UP AND LOOK AROUND YOU!WERE LOST IN SPACE AND THE TIME IS OUR HOME"
-------------------------------

[/quote]
http://www.astralpulse.com/forums/images/icon_Smile_wink.gif" border=0>

***Minds are like parachutes. They only work when they are open.***

[Originally posted by Tom:]

quote:Originally posted by Tom:
Of course I wanted astral projection before I knew what it was or that it existed. My idea was to create a machine to separate my consciousness from my body and store it in a computer of some sort. Back then there weren't really computers the way computers are today. It was pain that drove me to think that way. I changed my mind. It is not a physical device but astral projection which is my goal. It is not pain driving me but the pursuit of pleasure. There is no gradual transition between avoiding pain and seeking pleasure. It is the act of will. It is a decision. Do it now if you know what is good for you and care for the good.

Do you remember the film "Tron". They dematerialized an Orange and it appeared then on the Computerscreen. The next was a Programmer who became a "Program" in the computer system. The idea of OBEs is old. I once read in a Nostradamus book that he used a kind of machine or method to see into the future. He in China for instance, many people know the Chinese word for "OBE". The idea of having an OBE is frequently used in films and novels. Even Chinese legends and fairy tales talk about OBEs.

quote:

As for the idea of an axis, it is not the way things work. Sure, all objects have their own axis which spin. That is unimportant. The universe is limitless so every point is the center of the universe. That includes me. I am the center of the universe and all the universe surrounds me. My selfish needs and wants are mine. Selfish? Sure. I am a self with needs and wants. People who do not attend to their needs and wants just make work for other people. People cannot abandon their own goals and purposes to other people to accomplish, because purpose cannot be given away.

Perfectly right! I was once told a story about a woman that gave her own eye to save her husband eye. The woman was marked for the rest of her life. Once beautiful and adorable she became ugly. Eventually her husband left her for another woman.

How can a person be loved if he does not love himself?

Chamos,. somehow I think your view is a little pessimistic. Of course, many of us are longing for something. Perhaps it is the truth we are after or it is the excitement. However, to say that we do not "belong" here cannot be true. Whatever we do we cannot leave this world, because it would still exist in our memories. The only way to do that is amnesia. And even then it cannot not cease to exist in our minds as it would stay subconsciously forever. Even an OBE is no way of escape. The physical world will always be part of us.

I know that kind of feeling. The feeling of not belonging to this world. I had it before. Maybe on bad days it might return, as it did before. But when I think about it I know it is a deception. The only reason you fell so is that the world of your imagination is much better and it makes no sense that the real world is not like that. I know step that is needed to make this a perfect world is not a big one, but it is one that everybody must do at the same time. Unfortunately, when we do the step, they do not do it. When they do it we are too angry with them because they did not do it last time.

Everything changes when you start to imagine the Universal Centre is you. You just have to dare it.




***Minds are like parachutes. They only work when they are open.***

[Originally posted by amcturbo:]

quote:Originally posted by amcturbo:

1) Muscle Relaxer drug (prescription Vicoten)
   - Relaxed my body A LOT (but not knocked out like some people)

Do you know other names of the drug? I mean except the trade name.
How was it applied? Oral? Intraveinous? Intramuscular?

quote:

2) Hypnosis
   - Listened to "Activating Inner Healer" hypno CD 3-4 times daily

Can you describe the CD? I mean how does it put you in hypnosis?

Have you ever tried hypnosis induced by a hypnotist? What is (if any) the difference to the CD?



***Minds are like parachutes. They only work when they are open.***

[Originally posted by Chamos:]

quote:Originally posted by Chamos:
Technically, density, if the worlds all spun on your own axsis then alot of things in life would be very different. You can perceive the worlds as spinning on your axsis but in reality they have their very own axsises, laws, rules, forms, shapes. Though in some ways, at least in some people's point of veiws, the worlds might spin on their axsis, though it would be highly selfish of them, because everyone in the worlds around you all accumulate to that particular world's axsis thus making it a completely original axsis all it's own.

Leslie-Ann Cho

On the first glance it might appear selfish but it is not. All "bad" and "selfish" behaviour ultimately results in hurting yourself (most would call that karma).

Look at a mentally disordered person! How do you know it is him who is mentally ill and not you? It is that everybody thinks this way, so you think it too. Still it could be you instead of him who is not right in the head.

There can be absolutely no proof that the world is just so how we think it is. So we can say that the world only exists in our heads.

What we think about the world changes rapidly. It did so the past 3000 years and it will likely go on like that. 500 years ago they would have called you a heretic for saying the Earth was moving round the Sun and not vice versa. This supports only everything exist only in our minds. We cannot have any significant evidence. We can never know the truth.

You cannot even prove that I do exist. Even if I were standing right before your eyes, you could not prove it. There would always be the possibility of an illusion or an phenomenon of other kind. It could also be a special kind of "tape" you were watching. A tape that has not 90 minutes capacity but 80-120 years. Try to prove that it is not so.

Thoughts like these do not make you selfish.


***Minds are like parachutes. They only work when they are open.***

[Originally posted by Chamos:]

quote:Originally posted by Chamos:

Never forget that the worlds around you spin on their own axsis, not yours.

Do they? Everything around you is perceived subjectively.  So we can say that the worlds spin around our very own axis. It is just that they spin not only around one axis and they spin on every axis in a different way.


***Minds are like parachutes. They only work when they are open.***

[Originally posted by Jeff_Mash:]

quote:Originally posted by Jeff_Mash:
I have never used any drugs (legal or illegal) to help aid in my OBE's.  I would hate to be on something and have it effect my experience.  Call me stubborn, but I guess I feel that if I can't do this on my own without outside chemical influences, then it just wouldn't be natural to do.

I would not call that stubborn. I personally think the only really useful "tools" listed in my post could be the isolation tank, pyramid (if they do work) and hypnosis. That is, however, my personal opinion based on general knowledge. A mexican indian would probably choose salvia from the list. I only try to understand why he would do so.

The key to this problem is that your answer as well as your thinking is that of a majority in this forum (at least i think that it is so). A minority of people who feel difficulties of even getting any kind of experience will give up even before someone could tell them a way how to do it.

I think that makes sense. You will not find anyone here who has tried it for a very long time without any kind of success. For this kind of person a "chemical" might be the right choice.

That is why I asked for Pentathol. It is an anaesthetic that was used by hypnotists when the subject could not be hypnotised in a normal way. OBEs are usually self-induced so we have to make the decision on our own. No doctor tells us what to do. No doctor tries to analyse why it does not work.

Imagine OBEs were natural things that happen in 95% of the population. Imagine OBEs were necessary for our mental health. How would a doctor treat a "patient" who had difficulties with obtaining an OBE.

I think if the choice goes to drugs the dosage is very important. It should be "just enough" to reach an OBE, not a killer dose that is aimed at reaching the nirvana in one leap. It should be administered irregularily. Today I try it with and tomorrow without to train the individual to reach the goal one day without help.

[Originally posted by Frank:]

quote:Originally posted by Frank:

Having repeated and controlled, conscious-exit experiences is something that only comes with a lot of practice (well, for most of us that is).

Well, I have no doubt that practice is one of the key elements in this game. Nevertheless, another is knowledge and a third is the right environment or setting. The more practice you have the less you depend on the right setting.

quote:

If you were not born with some natural ability, then it's going to take you quite a bit of mental effort. Please don't believe those advertisements that claim they can sell you some kind of short cut, or think there is some kind of drug that's going to get you there today. Nope, short-cuts only end up being long-cuts in this game.

I can assure you that I never believe advertisment of any kind. However, I think what you call a short-cut will one day exist (or be discovered) without ending up being a long-cut. It is just a matter of time. Actually short-cuts do already exist. It depends just on how you look at them.  Compared to a try-your-OBE-in-the-streets-of-New-York-on-a-busy-Monday-morning a try-your-OBE-at-home-at-night is certainly a short-cut. Sure, some "short-cuts" have proven to be a dead end, but others have not. It is just that we do not call them short-cuts anymore because we all know them.

Now, let us assume there is somebody out there who knows a "working" short-cut, but who is not aware of that. I believe that even you know some "minor" short-cuts which you think are so "unimportant" to be mentioned. Have you ever read Chuang Tze?

quote:

Therefore, the most beneficial way to proceed is to focus your mind fully on the task in hand; with the intent to succeed beyond doubt; and realise that initial fears are a normal part of the process that go away once you gain a fair degree of familiarity.

Well, sure but can you invoke an OBE by that in the same way every time? Could you do it say in the afternoon or any other "unusual" time?

Do not misunderstand my question. I know that this is necessary for most of us.

Have ever heard of Musashi? He was a samurai who was in his time invicable. Oddly enough, he did not know why. I am looking for those Musashis among us and I believe more or less are we all one.

Btw, a good idea to improve your way would be autohypnosis.

[Originally posted by ralphm:]

quote:Originally posted by ralphm:
If you use the search function of this site you could look them all up. I know there was a discussion of Salvia a while back, and other drugs were discussed also, with the concensus that they may work but you will not have as much control over your experience as you would if you induced it without drugs. I have heard of people having obe type experiences while in the great pyramid and at other sacred sites. I had a friend that had a obe from cranial sacral therapy, so a lot of body work/massage could do i ttoo.

Yes, I've seen it now. The discussed drugs were Salvia, ketamine and "lucid dragon" (which is 90% salvia). Unfortunately no one tried to analyse why it was different. also no one seemed to talk about "low dosages" that cannot induce anything without the efforts of the subject.

btw. what is a cranial sacral therapy?