Messages

Do animals have a spirit or a soul?
How the hell would I know?
I've griped and grumbled and griped again,
That lilies and birds, (seemingly Jesus's friends),
Supposedly neither worry nor fret o'er eating nor shelter,
While human beings do all that, helter-skelter!

Sure!  I exclaimed.  They have no brains!
Someone came  along and said egoic mind is insane.
I sighed, rolled eyes, and kept on reading,
And on endless parchments, kept on feeding.
They say "All's energy!"  They say "All's One!"
God sleeps in the minerals, awakens in plants,
God in animals moves, and in humans.......
Rants?  
[]    {exit, stage left...no, right!....up?...illusion of exiting?   [Ha-ha, I'm IN you forever, can't get rid of me]{oh, shoot, and you in me?  And your dogs and parrots, too? ...forever!??}]}...[fade-out melodically]}

--Paukki

P.S.  Pleased if you put down newspaper before leaving the puppy behind.

quote:It took me about 20 years of meditation to reach a decent state of non-thinking.

This might be tangent to the topic, but recently I've been exposed to the idea that one can reach a state wherein there is no inner dialogue even during non-meditative times, (i.e., all day).  Are you in, or close to that state?  I can only guess, but it would seem that any "inner dialogue" in such a state would be at one's beck and call.  The egoic mind is dissolved in "Being" and can be picked up and set back down as needed.  Man, now that's a way!

--Paukki

Long ago I read in a bible study handbook that 666 had been interpreted to mean "Lateinos", (might've mispelled that, sorry), or "Latin kingdom."  This was the conclusion by a student of a student of St. John.  Can't remember if Polycarp was the student, with Iraneus being John's student, or t'other way around.  [?]  

Years later whilst sitting in a guardshack with nothing better to do than to listen to the radio, I heard a professor who was touted as an expert on the Dead Sea scrolls.  This professor claimed that the Essenes, (the authors of the scrolls and Jesus's "training ground"), were virulently anti-Roman.  His theory was that the original movement that grew up around Jesus was probably the same way--but they weren't Zealots, (another anti-Roman sect within ancient Judea), in that the Essenes and the earliest Christians saw Rome doomed to be destroyed not by human hands, but God's.  The professor said that the book of Revelations is clearly in the style of the Essenes.  He also touted the theory  [?] that the virulently anti-Roman earliest Christianity was eventually "Hellenized", meaning:  Watered down into a much more peaceful movement that could more easily find acceptance within the Pax Romana of the times.  But that's another topic, right.

There was a time when I was intensely interested in eschatology/literal 2nd coming scenarios.  That interest has long since waned and has been superceded by being drawn to the concept of an evolutionary breakthrough to a higher consciousness, affecting all mankind and the planet and beyond. For the better. []  Try reading "The Isaiah Effect" by Greg Braden.  I enjoyed James Redfield's "The Celestine Prophecy" and "The 10th Insight", also, (although a brother of mine called those "fluff", but he also claimed that Dannion Brinkley, the famous NDE-er,  was "full of bovine excrement and self-serving homilies.") A lot of present day luminaries are talking about reaching a critical mass in terms of human consciousness.  An awakening.  But this is possibly rapture without the fireworks, and bible literalists just won't hear it.   []   I hope that we can make that quantum jump and GROW UP!  []

--Paukki

quote:I believe the hemisync tapes work because with the helichrysum oil as a marker I feel more energy after I do it and are more relaxed but thats all they do though relax you as if you did a good meditation.

So what is helichrysum oil?  And--congratulations!  []

--Paukki

Hi Maheenso,
Someone once said that truth is like this huge thing behind you, but "forget about the truth", (i.e., don't get fixated on trying to define something that is beyond rational definition, beyond what our minds can accomplish at the so called "normal", or "beta" level of our existence)-- what you've got to deal with is what is right in front of you.  Ever read Eckhart Tolle's "The Power of Now"?  If not, you might find it very helpful.  I stumbled upon something of the same concept, (of focusing on "the Now"), when I was in the Army in the mid 1970's, and I was in a blissful state for months.  If I had stuck with that concept and not allowed myself to internalize outter conflicts forming around me, I'm sure I wouldn't have ended up experiencing the hellish experience that I did.  

You've got yourself signed up for what?  2 years?  3 years?  More?  So what's right in front of you?  Boots need shining?  Friend wants to go out for a beer and a chat?  It might sound overly simplistic, but I believe that's what you need to get done.    

In bootcamp, I once stopped a nasty argument that clearly was going to lead to a racist brawl. I did this by uncharacteristcally going into a fairly long discussion that started with the Jews and ended with Martin Luther King, Jr.  Not long after that, our drill sargeant had us in formation and asked if any of us were "...religious?  Really religious?"  Because he could offer such a person the chance to get out right then and there, but after bootcamp, no way--you were committed!  That 24 year veteran of Korea and Vietnam said the Army was no place for "really religous" people.  And I had a strong feeling he was talking to me.  But if I hadn't been there, what would have happened with that potential brawl?  Is that a "karma" thing?  I'm not so sure about karma. I am sure that what needs to be done RIGHT NOW is usually fairly simple to figure out.  But as Tolle explains it, we get stuck in past and future, in "psychological time", and thus keep going 'round and 'round in unconscious patterns that will have us anywhere but in the NOW.

Jesus once said that the one who is faithful in a little thing will be faithful in much, will be set in charge of a lot more.  That's all you've got to do, right NOW.    Don't worry about tomorrow.  Tomorrow will take care of itself.  Get through today.  Sometimes in the military that becomes enough of a challenge, yes?  There is no point in tormenting yourself about the dualistic nature of hawk/dove, peace/war, army/pacifist.  Jesus saw great faith in a Roman legionaire, but I don't remember Jesus telling him to desert the army and run to Lapland.  If you tire of Jesus quotes, (as did a lot of people in my Army days, hehe!), here's as couple from "The Lazy Man's Guide to Enlightenment":  

1)  Go beyond reason to love:  it is safe.  It is the only safety.  
2)  When you learn to love hell, you will be in heaven.

Happy Nows!
--Paukki

From the movie, "Platoon":  "Somebody once wrote, 'Hell is the impossibility of reason.'"  Please don't think too much.  Please be young and alive!

quote:How long did it take for
 you?? I made it in in 2 months, having
 my first expereince about a month
 ago. It hasnt happened since,
 because I have not been working on it
 too much.

Started dabbling with the obe techniques in 2001, but didn't really get serious about it until the spring of 2002.  I had some partial exits that seemed to take me, stage by stage, through some fear zones--a childhood fear; sleep paralysis; astral monkeys pouring through our bedroom window.  In this first full exit, there wasn't any fear.  I'm cautious by nature, so it makes sense to me that it took a while.  It came when I wasn't expecting it, but imho it's probably like learning to type or to ride a bicycle--once you get the hang of it, it never leaves you.  You just "know".  Hope you have wonderful journeys and tell us some great adventures!

--Paukki

Just a few days ago I was talking to a friend of mine about an Israeli gal, here on this forum, (and very young as I recall), who had to wait a whopping two weeks to have her first obe.  A Canadian responded to her, reminding her of how she was ready to give up after only a week of getting nowhere, but through perseverence she waited TWICE AS LONG!!!! and got that first obe!  (If you're reading this, Israeli gal, I hope you are having continual success and don't find this offensive.) Well, I started trying for the first time in 2001, I think.  Let it slide for a while.  And then started more aggressively last spring.  Today I just posted my first obe in this forum.  I'm 49. And didn't RB write about how he had obe's as a child, and then his first one as an adult was much more difficult?  Frankly, I just don't know about this age thing, but it would seem to make sense that if we get stuck in ruts, and/or allow our lives to atrophy in ways, then it's just going to affect quality of life all across the board.  You don't have to be getting "old" to get stuck in a rut, either.  This morning I was told something interesting about "age", as follows:

******************************************
by the way the fact that we call age "old" programs our subconscious to get older and older. I am serious here!. In times of old and older languages they used to say "I am the son of 40, 50 years or whatever. No "old" there. And their live span often reached 100 and more (see Flavius about the Essenes).
******************************************

--Paukki

--Paukki

Paukki is not my real name.  My mother has often called me that and says it's "Finn-glish".  My real name is Rumpelstiltskin.[]
--Paukki

Hey Brian,
Here's a couple of links.  Hope they're what you had in mind.  I'm sure there are others here who could make it a longer list.
--Paukki


http://www.monroeinstitute.org/
http://www.neuroacoustic.com/main.htm

For those who cannot resist trying to inject nitro into their finely tuned machines, (speaking figuratively, there, of course), and for those who find it might not be going so well, I would like to write a few  quotes, (especially on love, which is what you'll be needing...perhaps even desparately),  from "The Lazy Man's Guide to Enlightenment.":
******************************
What am I doing on a level of consciousness where this is real?

No resistance.

Love it the way it is.

Love as much as you can from wherever you are.

Whether I feel it or not, I am one with all the love in the universe.

Go beyond reason to love:  it is safe.  It is the only safety.

Whatever you are doing, love yourself for doing it.

When you learn to love hell, you will be in heaven.
**************************************************************

Love, and good luck, (whoever you are),
--Paukki

quote:Kelly Howell (Brain Sync) has a binaural for sleeping. It uses delta wave frequencies, which are supposed to cause growth hormones to be secreted.

Hmmm....which brings to mind......doesn't the Monroe Institute have something for sleep?  I think I need to look again.   Not that we really need a sleep BOOST, though, but just want the option to put on something pleasant.  Btw.......growth hormones???!!!  (What grows?  Brain stuff?)

quote:Getting to sleep is never a challenge for me. The trick is to stay awake.

The trick for me is to find the middle ground.  If I just go to sleep to sleep, no problem usually.  But if I go to sleep with a mind to get body asleep and keep mind awake, what usually happens is that body gets uncomfortable after 45 minutes, give or take 10 or 15, and then half the time I can't get mind OR body to sleep for some time longer.     A few partial obe experiences have happened, almost always after falling asleep totally, and there have been dreams of having an obe.

--Paukki

Thank you, Alpha.  So...is the whales & dolphins cd a solid 45 minutes of whales & dolphins?  Do you fall asleep listening to it?
--Paukki

Nerezza.......thanks for the feedback!  http://www.astralpulse.com/forums/images/icon_Smile_big.gif" border=0>
--Paukki

Hello Heimdall,
Personally, I enjoyed all three of Robert Monroe's books, but I'm not a scientist, and if a science purist were looking for hard data, I'm not sure that would be the place to start.  I found all three of his books at Amazon.com, and of course there is also The Monroe Institute at http://www.monroeinstitute.org/

--Paukki

They say that the materialist school regards consciousness as an epiphenomenon of nature, or matter,
Whereas a relatively newer trend within science  sees consciousness as primary, or "first cause".
That the universe is more of a big thought than a big machine.
Religious people laugh and say they knew it all along.

Robert Bruce's book, AD, has been mentioned, but I'm surprised that no one has mentioned Robert Monroe.  (I could've missed it.  Maybe I slipped out of body during that message, haha.)    He did not consciously invite his original obe experiences, and he clearly had the motivation, the time, and the money to make certain that he wasn't simply going nuts.  He not only did that, he confirmed stuff that he experienced in the RTZ, or at least found enough proof to convince himself that something "real" was going on here.  Maybe one of you could elaborate on that a bit--I mean, would you say Monroe had a truly scientific approach?
--Paukki

As such discoveries progress, when do we start hearing people say things like, "I should've taken the red pill, instead."  (Or is it the blue pill?)  http://www.astralpulse.com/forums/images/icon_Smile_wink.gif" border=0>

--Neo....er, I mean, Paukki  http://www.astralpulse.com/forums/images/icon_Smile_big.gif" border=0>

Hi Person,
Thanks for the tips!  The problem is that I don't achieve lucidity.  During the day I might ask myself "What time is it?  Am I dreaming?" while looking at clocks and watches, but when the clocks and watches have shown up in dreams, thus far, I don't arise to the cue and say, "Hey!  I'm dreaming!"  This morning was another one.  I was in an old office building with clocks on walls and when leaving it I wanted the time, so I tugged at my shirt sleeve to see my watch.  The sleeve was tight and I got it back with difficulty, and then I sorta laughed at myself because I realized that there had been clocks in the building that I could have checked for the time.  But not once did I stop to ask, "Am I dreaming?"  or have any sense of being in a dream.  What does it take to realize its a dream?     (I've had lucid dreams very infrequently.  They seem like accidents, almost.)  

As for the "ladder" dreams, I only remember two of those, but both were within the last month or so.  I dream about work a lot near the end of my sleep.  I have no "corporate goals".  Just the opposite.  I am there to pay the bills and would like to leave eventually.  I have no passion, job-wise.  On the other hand, I am highly interested in obe, AP, realizing HS, etc.  Part of my daily practice in this regard is listening to tapes from "The Academy of Remote Viewing", (   http://www.mindsafari.com/    ), and I find mysel, f thinking right now about  the context of these "ladder" dreams, thinking of where some narration on one of the AoRV tapes emphasizes, "Let go, let go!"  Both dreams found me realizing all I had to do was to let go of the ladder.  (I was weak in both dreams.  I often wonder if I couldn't do better, with AoRV, if I didn't have the job to contend with.  It can wear you out.)  Too, the original motion in the dreams was upward, whereas the AoRV tapes take one to DEEPER levels, (i.e., from beta down to theta, or even delta), so by letting go of the ladders I actually ended up getting something of a taste, I like to think, of things to come.

--Paukki

When I was a kid being forced to go to Sunday school,  I implicitly understood "worship" to be a ritualized sort of public confession along the lines of "I am weak, but Thou art strong", and/or "I am sinner, but there is no sin in Thee, please have mercy and save us", etc.  It made me squeamish and uncomfortable, usually, because nothing was proven in my own mind--I wasn't even certain there was a God, much of the time--and you could see the rote behaviour of the adults and how there wasn't much passion at all in it. So...did they really believe in what they were saying?  Or were they just taking out an insurance policy because death is universal, and EVERYBODY knows that?!  By the end of the 1960s the young adults of the baby boom generation were beginning to lash out at this sort of thing, (passionless path-following, whether into church or into war),  all across the board--there was a parallel movement cropping up in Christendom, too, by the early 1970s, in which young adults were becoming passionate about the "personal relationship" (i.e., with God/Jesus) thing, and sometimes the "Jesus freak"  on the street corner handing out tracts asking if you had "a personal relationship with Jesus Christ"  didn't look any different than the hippie handing out tracts saying where to gather tonight to protest the Vietnam war.

By the time the 1970s were ending I was in a little "passionate" church that met weekly in a welding shop and I still remember the young preacher trying to get across this idea that true worship is not about rituals with songs and candles and such, but is about what your actions say about what you truly believe.  In that context, I wonder how many hippies and Jesus freaks ended up becoming much like the parents against whom they rebelled, turning in the beard, beads, and long hair for the yuppies' BMWs and white collar job.  So you guys are right...what is worship?  Swiss cheese, man.  I don't even know how to answer it without causing inner conflict, if not outter conflict.  Most of my actions go to work, to a job I'm really, really tired of, because I have a mortgage to pay off and good-paying jobs are hard to find.  So am I "worshipping" mammon, filthy lucre, materialism, or what?  Recently I read Paramahansa Yogananda's "Autobiography of a Yogi", and that's full of miracles and interesting stories about Indian holy men who can live naked in the Himilayas, (haven't they read natural law?!!),  and by my childhood implicit understanding, and my the understanding of the preacher in the welding shop, I can see how people in that culture worship not just God, but their gurus, (and, reading it, I felt that same squeamishness and whatnot that I felt as a kid in Sunday school.  Perhaps I am just a dyed-in-the-wool "secular" type of  westerner, doomed to die in front of a tv set after a last meal of a tv dinner.)

Well, I've got to go now.  The Academy of Remote Viewing finally sent me the last 5 tapes the Remote Influencing Thought and Reality through Time and Space course, and I'd like to spend an hour on tape 3b.  I spent an hour in the morning and an hour at night.  So is my "worship"......changing?      http://www.astralpulse.com/forums/images/icon_Smile_wink.gif" border=0>   Btw, I'm almost done reading Gary Zukav's "The Seat of the Soul", anybody read that?  There's a whole chapter on "reverence" in it.

--Paukki  

Correct me if I'm wrong, Mr. R-Mouse, but it sounds to me like you would like to reach a state of mind wherein there is neither pretense nor awkwardness, but a certain grace and clarity of mind and action.  I know I would like to reach that state; then, as you surely would agree, doing something like writing posts in this forum would be easier and more fun!    But on to EGO!  I have had many discussions with a brother of mine about this very thing, because it is a big part of his "A Course in Miracles" studies, which he's been into for 15 or more years, now.  These discussions led to my checking the dictionary definition of ego, and in mine it defined ego as one's conscious self.  I cannot imagine operating without a conscious self, (which I told my brother), so when he would go on about the ego, (usually in terms of the illusion of separation, as compared to our actual oneness, universally),  I would simply think of him as talking about egocentricity, (or selfishness).  So many debates, arguments, etc., begin with a word, or a lack of definition, or a confusion about definitions!  I don't think reducing the ego question down to one of  selfishness is enough, though, when it comes to holy men and their discourses about dissolving the ego in Christ-Buddha consciousness and such things.  Surely a pan-holistic approach to spirituality--within the bounds of the present discussion on ego--would have to include the notion of an EXPANSION, so that one CONSCIOUSLY find's his/her beta consciousness swallowed up in something infinitely larger.  (Everbody in this forum is working on this, yes, no?)   This would be a conscious experience that limited intellect would only later begin to try to explain.  EXPANSION is a lot more, I think, then just recognizing that, (for example), your silly egocentricity just cracked a joke at the expense of your wife's dignity.  Maybe dealing with egocentricity is elementary school stuff, whereas becoming a conscious microcosm of the macrocosm is very much more than that.
--Paukki

So are we saying here that it is possible to see stars in the waters of a marsh?  Or that in the babble of a shell-shocked veteran returning from a bombarded entrenchment, a sharp interrogator might be able to pick up a little bit of military intelligence?  I've a personal reason for being interested in this discussion, because I had two severe schizophrenic episodes, 16 months apart, while I was in the military.  Both times I felt as if I were starting to gain some valid spiritual insights or coming into a bit of psi ability, (albeit very limited), but I lacked, what?...discretion?  a certain required groundedness?....and I entered into these nightmarish episodes within which it became very difficult to keep my imagination from getting carried away withitself, (therefore, I would think things and talk as if they should be understood by people, when in fact people weren't understanding me very well, if at all).  Within the type of Christian religioisity that was very much a part of these difficulties, there existed much potential for inner conflict, as surely as there were those who pushed for spiritual empowerment, while others warned about the problems involved with the expansion of mind required to so enter more deeply in the "spiritual realm", or even "warfare".  Perhaps this kind of warning is not isolated to western religion, but is also found in the east?  Yet the mind, when it is desparate, seeks to fly even if it should still be sitting in a comfy nest, high in a tree somewhere, being fed worms by mom and dad.  So I remember, many, many earth-spins ago, how tragic were the stories of some of my fellow wardmates, such as the fellow who could see only evil everywhere in human existence, and he stepped naked out of his trailer and fell on his face onto the ground, hoping beyond hope to merely merge with mother earth and bask in her love and be away from his pain.  All he got out of it was a broken, bloody nose, and a raft of tears.  In my own struggles, like one of you wrote about, I had to get grounded, and when I started to come out of it, the first thing I noticed bringing me back to reality was the marvelous, smooth feel of a meeting room table.  Then I started to keep track of clocks and dates on newspapers.  Later on, I would tell myself, if feeling anxious in a supermarket, "Get back down to earth!"  And so it would be.  Hmm.  I'm dragging on more than I should.  But anyway, is everybody really ready to mount up as  with eagles wings?  And one other thing.  I have a friend in a mental health group who somewhat casually told his therapist he was hearing "voices" of a negative kind, but he was speaking metaphorically, (not having literal auditory hallucinations.)  This therapist was ready to jump on him with pills and caused the poor fellow no small bit of anxiety.  

--Paukki

  Disorder                               Rating                                                      
  Paranoid:                               Low                                                      
  Schizoid:                               Moderate                                                      
  Schizotypal:                          Low                                                      
  Antisocial:                             Low                                                      
  Borderline:                            Low                                                      
  Histrionic:                              Low                                                      
  Narcissistic:                            Low                                                      
  Avoidant:                              Moderate                                                      
  Dependent:                           Low                                                      
  Obsessive-Compulsive:          Low

Ahahahahaha!  In 1977 the military retired me permanently for a "stabalized schizophrenic reaction".  In 1984, the Dept. of Defense's security clearance investigators wouldn't give me even a "Secret" clearance, (though my fellow workers and friends were baffled and thought I was just fine),  and said I was "paranoid schizophrenic in remission".  Ahahahahaha!   (I should have never told that shrink I was stll "virgin"......I'm not any more, and look how much better  I am!)  Ahahahahaha!  Say, have any of you read my topic in the Psychic Self-Defense forum about "24 years of voices"?  Ahahahaha!   (Well, one thing that the voices have done is to turn the whole notion of other people talking about me into sort of a dead horse that they keep beating on, till boredom eternal.)      And summed up My Great Guides and Loopies doth say:  Don't give a excrement!  Move on!    
                                                      http://www.astralpulse.com/forums/images/icon_Smile_blush.gif" border=0>

---Paukki

Help me out, as I'm a bit confused.  I thought lucid dreams were dreams in which you had total self-control, both of the dream and of yourself in the dream.  Am I wrong?  Or are there different kinds of lucid dreams--like one kind where you are aware of your dreaming but can't control it, and another kind where you >can< control it?  I can't imagine being in control of a dream and then dreaming of giving birth to an endless stream of mangled beings, so it would appear you werent' in complete control, but just completely aware of what was going on, right?  If it had been a non-lucid dream I would have wondered if I were being told that my thinking was still entirely too much in the lower vibratory realms, or that it was not being properly developed, (or gestated), followed through and brought to healthy fruition.  But that would be for me, I don't know about for you.  Just hope you don't have to "learn" too much more!

--Paukki

On page 4 I brought this up under the title of "syncronous body jerks".  It seems highly plausible to me that one can have "shortie" dreams that have a motor action, (in terms of the human nervous and muscular systems), and this leads to the JOLT, because the medulla oblongata has flipped a switch that disallows totally connecting up these systems.  It prevents you from thrashing around in bed during your dreams.  My most interesting recent experience with this followed a day of using a very long air wand to jab and poke at a stuck mound of unmoving biomass.  After I got home and showered and wound down a bit, I had a meditation session wherein the "jolt" clearly hit my upper right shoulder in a way that was clearly synchronous with semi-consciously reliving the jabbing of the air mass.  There's definitely a hypnogogic aspect to these things.  The following is the page 4 topic:

http://www.astralpulse.com/forums/topic.asp?ARCHIVE=&TOPIC_ID=2360

--Paukki

Nuts.  I've experienced waking, or sleep paralysis off and on over decades, but it's few and far between and I think usually happens when I'm exhausted.  (Almost like not having the energy to wake up???)  Now that I'm ready and willing for this to happen in a way that might lead to AP, think it happens?  Naaaaaa!  (Maybe I should go out and exhaust myself!)  
--Paukki

Would you run 10 miles for an obe?

Hey jouni, you mean like you let go of a ladder and went WHAM!!! on the floor and looked up into the eyes of your boss?