Messages

Jeff_Mash, right on!

Murt, I mean no offense to you, but I strongly object the idea of suggesting various rituals, even if they may work for you. Any sort of ritual is tightly bound to the corresponding Belief System, and enforcing your Belief System on others (even indirectly) undermines the Principle of Freedom of Choice. Let him decide for himself what he believes in, who he worships (if any), and how.

It also gives false impression that you would be left unprotected, unless you resort to some rituals that you don't even understand the meaning or purpose of.

But thats just me.

In addition, according to R. Bruce, during the NDE the actual etheric body separation occurs, whereas during projection into RTZ (OBE) or Astral, the etheric body stays in place and the projection is performed by the "projectable double" of corresponding type.

Its gets pretty complicated. You'll have to get the book if you need details.

Yafey's post made me suddenly remember an episode I've had a couple of years ago. I was walking somewhere in midtown Manhattan, got pretty tired and decided to rest on a bench for a couple of minutes. On the nearby bench next to me there was sitting an old jew in typical outfit (black raincoat, hat, beard, the whole package). He approached me and told me some of my personal info - my and my mother's name, where I was born, etc. It appeared to me that he was extracting / remembering / obtaining information on the fly, as opposed to knowing it beforehand - he kept closing eyes and looking upwards, as if he was trying to recall the info. I asked him how he knew all that, but he didn't answer. Instead, he said "I have a present for you". He opened a briefcase and pulled out a new unsharpened plain regular M2 pencil (which are usually sold in bulk packages). He gave it to me and went away. After analyzing pros and cons of the situation, I decided that the optimal course of action would be to dispose of the "present" just in case, so I threw it out in the nearest trash-can.

The morale of the story: what the hell was that? Did I do the right thing?

James S,

quote:I believe he is something good

I think it is too early to even try to make preliminary conclusions regarding whether he is good or bad. People here simply express concerns in case it is the latter.

I'm guessing here: these might be representatives of astral wildlife that happen to vibrate on low frequencies, partly in physical.

And, might I add, the site is uber-neat!

http://www.anywho.com/rl.html

To answer your yes/no questions - yes, yes, yes, and yes.

However, to answer your how-to questions, you'll need to read some books, namely,

R. Bruce:
-Astral Dynamics (the industry standard textbook on OBEs)
R. Monroe:
-Journeys out of the Body
-Far Journeys
-Ultimate Journey

Other titles you might be interested in are:
W. Buhlman
-Adventures Beyond the Body
R. Peterson
-Out of Body Experiences
http://www.robertpeterson.org/obebook.html


Regarding that woman - she definitely gets the first prize in "the most horribly useless way to waste an OBE" [][B)] It literally made me whimper.

As a rule of thumb, anything anybody can come up with has been probably beaten to death in at least 10 threads [][B)]

Recent topic pretaining to your experience:
http://www.astralpulse.com/forums/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=7744
Search for "paralysis", "paralyzed" to get other relevant topics.

"No worries, mate. Just go for it" (c) ~me

"tenex just knocked me out" - that is quite disturbing, considering that Tenex is a brand of Eley ammo.
http://www.nealjguns.com/ss_store/media/25109.jpg

[] Sorry for the OT.

SOB = System Of Belief.
What did you think it meant? [}:)]

This may be due to the fact that an ordinary Christian (or whatever), having 3rd-party induced spiritual experience immediately jumps to conclusions of what it was, which is likely to be heavily distorted by the SOB.

Tay appears to know the field pretty well, having numerous contacts with guides, aliens and whatnot, both in Physical, as well as Astral planes, so he should know what he's talking about, so the SOB distortion is presumably less in this case.

I still think, however, that THEY (Aliens & Co) are LIARS! _{(this statement is subject for review upon availability of verifiable information)}

Be careful with what you say - most people here would KILL for such vibes []

quote: Is this your opinion based on extended experiences?

That is my opinion based on the information I obtained from reading a number of books and articles by leading UFOlogists of various parts of the world that have spent their lifetimes analyzing the history of the phenomenon that goes way back, as well as thousands of witness accounts throughout the world.

Tay, your experience is not unique. It is a single datum among the sea of similar alien revelations. I do not doubt that your experience was as real as it gets. However, things are not always what they appear to be. In fact, most of the time they are not. The only way to figure it out is not to confine your judgements to your experiences only, but try to get outlook on the bigger picture.

I'm making my conclusions by judging the phenomenon "from the outside", by being familiar with a number of cases that I haven't been part of. You make your judgements "from the inside", based on first-hand experience, and If I were you I would have probably arrived to the same conclusions (or maybe not).

In fact, I haven't encountered anything paranormal in my life despite continuously seeking for it (thats why I'm into OBEs right now, and I'm making progress!). Perhaps I'm being intentionally avoided because they know they'd have hard time convincing me of what they'd try to make believe? []

Seeing is not believing; not at this level.

---
P.S. A do admit, however, that you have more grounds for making conclusions than me, since you know these things. And me - what the hell do I know?

[unpredictable]

<looks around/> Are you talking to me? Religious? ROTFL!!
Sorry to disappoint you, but I'm as unreligious as it gets - I'm a Christian's nightmare. Sorry to disappoint you again, but I'm not atheist/unbeleiver either. Truth is my religion.

quote:If evolution for humans took place and not God creating us, do you really think that it took 3 million year for humans just to evolve, but it took 168 million for the first mammal to appear on Earth, some part of that doesn't fit to me.

It takes 0 to 1000 for the function exp(1000*(x-1000)) to get from 0.0 to 1, but then you approach 1002, it jumps to 3.8*10^868. Is that surprising? Not really? Then why the case with evolution should be?

The notion that the human race may have been genetically engineered does have some ground, but the fact that such info is coming from this "reptilian" Lunchetta (or whatever her name was) only undermines this theory.

A "social studies student" coming from underground to reveal the great secrets, carefully hidden from the human eyes over the history of the humanity? Global catastrophe caused by "unpredictable fusion with hydrogen" due to detonation of a bomb during StarWars-style warfare among aliens? A functional race of beings living underground? Who colonized Venus??? Gimme a break man.

quote:Pressing the subject of 'truth' is found in everything so you really don't have much there.

Actually, I think you can conclude something there. If someone repeatedly tells you "But I'm telling you the truth!!!", is most likely shitting your brains. If someone WERE telling the truth, they would rely on the evidential support / verifiable information and let YOU be the judge. But thats just MY view. For most people, adding "this is the truth" just adds the weight to what they say, so the aliens are not hesitant to use that.

I should also add that my view of this article is biased, since I learned a while ago that:

1: Aliens (or some higher force manifesting itself in the form of aliens/UFOs) exist.
2: They are full of excrement (in terms of the information conveyed to the contactees)

If you would like to read up more on the phenomenon, Jacques Vallee's works is a good place to start.

In case anyone cares, my genetically engineered bull$hit detector gave me a red flag on that article. I'm not doubting the writer, but the "reptilian".

If anyone here is serious about UFOlogy, and the study of the contacts of the 3rd kind in particular, that person will confirm that we have a classic case here - an alien being contacts a single person and gives an absurd pep-talk, which usually contains following themes:

-humans are dumb, worthless and insignificant
-everybody except me is a liar
-all human knowledge about anything is WAAAY off
-i'm telling you teh truth!
-we are good, and they are bad
-listen to me carefully, because I give you teh ultimate truth here!
-some REALLY bad things are going to happen REALLY soon
-did I mention that speak teh truth?

Such speaches usually contain little or no factual information. If there is any, it is usually complete nonsense (the being conveying this information knows that information is invalid, yet the contactee is not aware of that).

[Jeff_Mash]

The deal with pwds is not necessarily optimal in terms of carrying it out, but it technically disalows falsification.

For example, if parties A and B use person C as medium, C technically could lie (I understand that its not gonna happen, but the point is that it can). In addition, it requires additional person as medium.

quote:you could simply just write it down in a text file (using Notepad, Wordpad, Microsoft Word, etc) and save it.

Jeff_Mash
FYI, this information applies to local drive. I.E. the date of the creation will correspond to the date the file appeared on your hard drive - the day you downloaded the file. On the other hand, if you use archive, the actual timestamp information is included there.

jc84corvette, the point of this "excercise" is that even though several people are agreeing on something, this may be due to the fact that they subconsciously convinced themselves and each other of something that might not have happened, unless they exchanged information carefully in a way that prohibits such error.

Thus, that "disagreeing" person may be in fact the only one telling the truth.

Load of books on yoga. Knock yourself out. []
http://www.sivanandadlshq.org/download/download.htm

If "Sight NOW" does not work, try "Main screen turn on!"

<rolls_eyes/>

Take it step by step then.

1. Relaxation
2. Deeper relaxation
3. Light trance
4. Deeper trance
5. Tingling sensations
6. Light vibrations
7. Strong vibrations
8. Partial separation / feeling of floating
9. Full separation into RTZ
10. Exploration.

Nobody said you'll be awake, and the next thing you know "whoa, I'm out of my body!" - there are doable steps that you can go through and verify them yourself.

This site will help you with your problems:
http://scottishcorpus.ac.uk/aries/

Been there, done that, as they say. I'm sure many people here experienced such encounters as well.

In fact, these SP attacks were responsible for my involvement in AP-ing.

Regarding these bad guys: one theory is that they are hallucinations and producs of your own imagination. Another possibility is that they are cases of "negs" - actual astral entities that are not so friendly.

In my case, I learned to deal with them by engaging, what R.Monroe calls "resonant energy baloon". Even though I don't know whether it is actually "for real", it is good enough to keep these guys away. The last time I got such a visit, I engaged the shield and told the entity to f$ck off. Unfortunately, I haven't been able to test the effectiveness of this method further, since the attacks stopped after that.

One thing to remember is that any kind of fear is effectively eliminated by related knowledge.

Here's a source which will make you feel ordinary and unspecial with regard to your experiences.
http://www.arts.uwaterloo.ca/~acheyne/S_P.html

What makes you think that your symptoms are in any way related to OBE? These symptoms could be caused be absolutely anything, from apnea to lead poisoning. I think it would be a good idea to eliminate more probable causes, rather than suspecting OBE, as I haven't heard that OBE had any effect, whether positive or negative, on the performance of the physical body.

Some people here will probably tell you that you might have a hole in your aura and you are leaking energy, or you have a non-physical entity leeching energy off your energy body, etc. To comlement that, I'm suggesting you not to dismiss possible down-to-earth causes of your problems.

Nahaz, what if the SG does not "answer to" Christ - wouldn't it make the spirit roll eyes and think "Not again"?

"they must answer you truthfully by the third time you ask" - err.. What's the source of such info? I thought nobody in the astral "had to" do anything. If the being is good, why would he/she/it lie? If its a neg, what would prohibit it from bull$hitting all the way through?

"If a being does not follow these rules, then they are probably not your guide" - yeah, but how would you know? If I tell you, in the name of Christ, that my name is John (three times) - how do you know whether I'm lying or not?

In order to get faith you should do the following: obtain as much information on the subject from various sources, and see what's common about it. Read books by Bruce, Monroe, and others, and read common folk's experiences here. What are the chances that they are all full of excrement?

Another unrelated example. Suppose you are a beginning UFOlogist and you've found an alien abductee who spends 2 hours describing the experience in all details. Your reaction? - The guy is crazy! You don't believe a word of it. But as you go along you may find people who are telling you exactly the same details they couldn't possibly know, and some of the people may live in secluded places, have no TV or education, and they genuinely believe that they are the only ones who has had this experience.

The point is - even if any particular witness acount of anything may be BS, all of them are unlikely to be.

For example, suppose that the probability that any person who tells you about his/her OBE experience is lying is 95%. If you listen to 50 different people, the probability that they are all lying is .95^50 = 0.077. There are thousands (if not more) of accounts of people OBEing on the regular basis. If you still deny the existence of the phenomenon to yourself - you are in, well, denial [].

You can't argue against the numbers, man. The numbers may make you believe, but in order to KNOW, you must experience it yourself.