Messages

[Are you also a fan of founding fathers such as Thomas Jefferson, John Adams, Thomas Paine, James Madison, as well as perhaps Benjamin Franklin, Oscar Wilde, George Bernard Shaw and James Knox Polk?]

Are you also a fan of founding fathers such as Thomas Jefferson, John Adams, Thomas Paine, James Madison, as well as perhaps Benjamin Franklin, Oscar Wilde, George Bernard Shaw and James Knox Polk?

Funny you should mention benjamin franklin, the fellow was a satanist.

the latter

Oh, and also if you asked about contacting Satan you'd probably get a whole lot of white wash fluff 'ye must not contyct the evyl one! systers of karma wyll be down upon ye!' or just christian dogma.

[Well okay... so this means if I were to want to ask about contacting Satan, Pan, or Allah, I could put it in the Communications forum too?]

Well okay... so this means if I were to want to ask about contacting Satan, Pan, or Allah, I could put it in the Communications forum too?

ooooh, the evil gods    you do realise that allah is exactly the same as yahweh/jehova?

[What's wrong with devil worship? some of teh most decent, loving, people I know are satanists. And no they don't sacrifice children, or have orgies.]

What's wrong with devil worship? some of teh most decent, loving, people I know are satanists. And no they don't sacrifice children, or have orgies.


Many Satanists do have orgies, because Satanism celebrates carnal desires and pleasures and does not deny the carnal, true nature of man but rather embraces it, celebrates it and indulges in it.
As for 'decent', whatever words like these are always from a judeao-christian perspective, in this case 'decent' entires someone who isn't proud, arrogant, who doesn't swear or get angry, etc, and this is untrue to Satanism. A Satanist has no problem swearing to express themselves, to verbally attack someone or vent anger or frustration, they certainly beleive in pride and thus are to an extent arrogant, and they do most certainly get angry and express and vent these emotions.

The way I see the left hand path is that it revolves quite a bit around the self. It does not deny or supress the self. The self and the ego are considered to exist and to be important. There is a controlled seflishness in the left hand path. The left hand path does not deny that man is simply another animal, not neccesarily any better then those who walk on all fours, and thus it does not deny the carnal nature of man and the carnal desires of man. Lust, hate and anger are not denied or supressed. Sexuality is not suppressed or denied and is rather indulged in. Sexuality is considered to be important. While the right hand path might deal with ascending energy through the crown chakra and becoming one with 'the all, the one and the all' or 'the source' and being absorbed into a huge energy void the left hand path considers sexual energy to be raw life force, and coiled at the base of the spine it is uncoiled, ascends to the crown chakra and godhead, personal godhead, is acheived.
With regards to magick, magick in the left hand path is used to acheive one's own ends, whatever they may be. The magician tries different techniqes and whatever works best for them then they put that to use, they try whatever they want and anything that they have found to bogus or useless to them they discard. This is chaos magick. There is not really any concept of 'black' magick and 'white magick', at least not in the popular perceptions of the words, nor is there any concept of 'good' or 'evil' and magick is not considered to come from any source or diety.
Does a left hand pather beleive in revenge and vengeance? Most certainly! That is why destructions rituals or 'black magick' is employed in the left hand path. The left hand path definatley involves a beleif in revenge and justice and a fullfillment of these beleifs.
The left hand path is also about wisdom, intelligence, strength, the individual, indulgence, free thought, free opinion, free choice, individualism. Death to the weak, victory to the strong. Weakness and stupidity are looked down on. Being a goat rather then a sheep of the herd mentality, or a wolf; adversary and enemy of the herd menality, predator of the sheep.

The right hand path is more about bowing down and worshipping, prostrating oneself before a certain image or diety, about denying the self and the existance and reality of carnal man and carnal desire, and the denial of sexuality, hatred, anger, lust, etc.
It's more about being a sheep and the herd mentality, accepting whatever you are told from this diety or leader as a truth and not questioning the truth or falsehood of any such statement. It's the 'inherent sin' attitude where the carnal or primitive man is considered evil as is knowledge and power, and we need to be innocent without any strong will so that we do not question whatever 'God' or whoever tells us.
It usually denies sexuality and lust, or the duality of male and female. Sexuality is considered irrevelant and instead abstinence from these sorts of things is encouraged. Rather then ascending the kundalini or sexual energy to acheive godhead, its about sacrificing the self and the ego or ascending energy through the crown chakra to become one with 'the all, the one and the all' or the source. It's not about acheiving Godhead or anything like that because then thats desire and power, which is considered evil. Instead you must sacrifice all of your natural and carnal desires, to try and get rid of the self so you can become one with some sort of a higher plane. With magick, its more about being not using magick for yourself or personal gain unless that personal gain is earnt from helping another person. Its like using magick for others or the 'good or betterment of mankind'. But, one man's pleasure is another man's pain, who's to say whats 'good' or 'evil' especially for mankind? . A right hand path magician thinks himself to be a 'white' magician and profusely refuses any sort of what they call 'black magick', any ties with a destruction ritual or revenge, or using magick to meet one's own ends.
A right hand pather usually carries the attatched stigma from something like christianity into magick and the occult and will only ever deal with an external being who talks about being an 'angel' or a part of the 'god consciousness' or something to that effect. The usually take a base idea from montheism or abrahamic religions with 'God' and the abrahamic concept of 'good and evil' and 'angels' and then try and evolve it into something so that they can lump all religions together and claim that they all conform to this idea. They will of course take out anything they don't like and keep anything that conforms to their idea of the aboslutely right religion, which is usually something like 'new age' or what they call 'spirituality' which is apprently something totally seperate from religions.

^^
yeh, I personally know the individuals who were attacked, I know many others who were attacked as well and I myself have been attacked.
Or if you want then you can read about angels mass murdering people in the bible.

Forgive me james, I'm a little confused.
From your posts you seem to be a neo-pagan and quite anti-christian so what is it with all this 'angels' stuff?

Use viking runes

Aliesiter Crowley can beleive what he wants to beleive. But so can everyone else, and he's not forcing his beleifs down other people's throats, and thus others shouldn't just swallow everything he says. People should decide what the goetic entites are based off their own experiences and the experiences of me and many others tell us they are independant, individual beings seperate from our own minds and extremely powerful, intelligent and ancient. If they are projections of our unconscious mind, then our unconscious minds must be very powerful since someone can burst into flames from a Demon being around if there is enough energy and they are not strong enough.

Some of the replies I have read come across as judeo-christian fantasy imo, Well, as I said in an earlier post, i dont believe all the soloman mumbo jumbo attatched to the goetia but if you feel that it adds to the mystery then fine, but I see no reason to suppose the goetic manuals are any earlier than the 15th century (with the Lessor key dating to the 17th!), no matter what the unknown author may claim.

I also believe that all the 72 'demons/angels' are in fact pagan gods, most of their names have been corrupted over time, ie 'Astaroth' = Ishtar.

Therefor I dont divide them up into 'good' or 'evil', and I dont view them as demons in the christian sense. The christian church from an early stage rebranded all the pagan gods as 'demons'.
So pretty much every 'demon' you have ever heard of is in fact a pagan god , once worshipped by people around the world or invarious region (including 'Lucifer', a minor roman deity of little account before his christian 'makeover'.).

The judeo-christian mumbo jumbo surounding the goetia means that you percieve all these deities through the judeo-christian lens which distorts them imo; again if it works for you then fine, but many other people like to strip away all the crud and get on with the mechanics of invoking the deities themselves.

I am still unsure as to whether the deities have any independent reality and are sentient in some way or if they are projections of your own subconcsious, although I lean towards the later interpretation.
It doesnt really matter at the end of the day since the resulting effect is the same as far as the magician is concerned.

Doug

I pretty much 100% agree with you. But the word 'lucifer' is latin I think for light bearer, bearer of light, morning star. It was attritubeted as a descriptive name to the hebrew angel Sammael who did lead a war and rebellion against god and was cast out of heaven. Sammael was described as the morning star or bearer of light in hebrew, or something to that effect, which is why he was given the name 'lucifer' in latin, and I don't think that it was taking the name of the minor roman God of light or a demonisation of him.
About solomon, I personally cannot say whether he definatley existed or definatley didn't, but the Gods were definatley bound under a curse of some sort but have now been freed by energy workings. That the judeao-christian fantasy of 'Demons' is merely a result of demonizing pagan gods is true, but I don't beleive this was simply limited to people, I do think that the angels and jehovah-whatever he may be, exist. And I think that the goetic Demons or Gods rather exist as well and angels/jehovah are their enemy. And, I also beleive that lucifer/satan exists as well, and I think that it is very likely he was a pagan God as well, ptah of egypt or enki of sumeria, and that he and the 'Demons' were the true and original Gods of humanity and the 'jehovah' and the angels are the enemy. And I do not think that jesus exists or existed.

I, personally, doubt you are amused.  

gothpyre,
schizoid personality disorder is where one experiences some characteristics of a schizophrenic personality, like delusion and being withdrawn, but not enough to be schizophrenic.
Schizotypal is just where you don't show much emotion and where you are sort of indifferet to social relationships, something like that. Do a search on these two personalty disorders you will get a more detailed and probably more accurate description.
The thing is, I don't see why one can't be a schizophrenic, or have any of the two aforementioned personality disorders and still be involved with magick. The delusions should be obvious to someone who is suffereing from a psychosis and the hallucinations will as well. There is treatment and therapy. A psychosis is where someone has delusions and/or hallucinates, most of the time its both and this psychosis can be a result of many things including schizophrenia. The psychosis is not constant and all consuming, the symptoms happen and pop up every now and then and are not curable neccesarily --- but treatable.
You can distuinguish between 'reality' and delusion or hallucination, especially with hallucination.

I used to be a New Ager and thought that christianity embraced reincarnation before it was edited out, but now I realise what nonsense that is.
I think this is a must read for all New Agers.
It is clear to me that New Age or at least some to many of its key elements are a result of venturing into the world of the occult and estoricism but carrying the attatched stigma and not being able to let go of christianity despite trying to act as though they are against organized religion.

Hello Arayan Knight
You really do not know the methods I use to exoricise things. Demons are sentient but do not have our emotions any more than angels. You can be sentitent and not have certain emotions.
Now for your experience with angels everything is subjective. We could discuss the differences in our opinions for ages. I do know that the people I have helped have as many people who were LHP'ers as RHP'ers. Some never did any magic at all but moved where magic had been done improperly.
All of the ones who had tried to conjure demons were mentally unprepared to do so. They thought they were ready but they were not by the results that they achieved. It is not about what is LHP or RHP but about what the results were that happened.
I have had one instance in 34 years of a goetic demon not listening to me. Again this is exorcising them when they do not want to leave. They can not live here without someone to obsess or possess so they can clothe themselves in the energies of this dimension. It is why they do these things because they do not like where they exist. It is not about competence but the fact that the people who start out using this method have a chance to get in serious trouble using it. They should read about other methods and research them.
They should learn to control and understand themselves first and then think about any conjurations and rituals. Every system has its drawback but the Goetia has a lot of big drawbacks.
Nita

And where do they exist that they do not like?

There is no such thing as good or evil, pure good, or pure evil. It is a relative concept. There's is no good or evil; only sentiancy.
In other words, beings cannot be purely good or purely evil. They can only be Sentient. As for beings who aren't Sentient, well, I'm not sure what to make of that.
I am more comfortable with an entity who will openly say 'I do not love you becaue I do not know you'. A being who says 'I love you unconditionally' is obviously not a Sentient being. He may understand Sentient beings, which is why he says that in the first place (because with love we are most vulnerable, we make the most mistakes and the most energy is given with love and of course 'I love you unconditionally' is what we want to hear) but he is not a Sentient being himself and never has been, he can only asses Sentient beings and figure out how he can use them to his advantage.
People assume a spirit is evil just because it lashes out or gets angry when it is insulted or abused. What nonsense!
I trust a being who greets me like a human greets a new acquaintance when they do not know me yet, and gradually get to know me and to like me before they say that they love me. Love is a two way thing. Beings who are more like humans are obviously safer for humans to trust.
And beings who are not like humans at all; then it might be understood why they have persecuted and abused beings who are more like humans.
When using a Ouija board for example, there are some beings who are just calm and placid. The planchette moves slowly and calmly and there is no emotion or movement in it at all. This is cold. A warm being who is Sentient, then you can actually feel emotion and movement.
You ALL would happily abuse and insult a Goetic spirit, and for this it would get angry and lash out at you probably. That's why it must be evil, musn't it?  
What about insulting and abusing angels? They're meant to be good and all loving so what would they do? well of course you've never tried because you'd never think of doing such a thing!  

I have dealt with Angelic beings before when I was on the RHP. It was like
'Do you love me?'
'Yes' it responds calmly and unpassionatley.
'Really?'
'Yes'.
........

Now, when I dealt with them on the LHP path, that was a very different story. I had just dedicated one or two nights before and was attacked in a hotel room by some obviously very angry individuals because of what I had done. When the goetic spirits were being freed with energy workings by some high preists and preistesses, they were physically attacked by angels. Including the Angel micheal, who pushed someone down a flight of stairs. They made many attempts to get them to stop and to convert, bribes and the like, and even just down right pleading.

As for angels, what exactly is it they give you 'out of the goodness of their own heart' as you speak of? Would they win someone's freindship or love for you? would they give you the winning lottery numbers? I'm assuming they wouldn't do anything of that sort for you because 'it is not important in the long run' or 'those sorts of things do not matter and it would be blah blah blah'

Do you honestly think, in summong demons who have been bound by their own enemies, using the names and curses of their enemies, insulting and abusing them, chiding them with a magical weapon and treating them like time bombs, that they are going to give you something 'out of the goodness of their own heart'?
It seems like they're going to be extremely reluctant to do anything at all for you but in these days when they were bound and cursed I guess that they didn't have much of a choice but they would have demanded you do something for them in return, rightfully so, since wouldn't you?

Now days they are no longer under this curse but, think about it this way, if someone does you a really big favour for you just because you ask them do you think you owe them something? of course. Would it be uncourteous to not show them a token of you gratitude or to do someting for them as a thanks for their services? Yes!

My advice to anyone on the RHP; don't summon demons, period. Your very presence and notion of summoning them is an insult to them, thinking that they are 'lower astral entities' and treating them like poison, obsessing over having protection and take all these sorts of precautions and calling them up in the names of their enemy. You are only inviting disaster.

]]

Karmaless? I don't think so.
Anyway, if by treading it in its fullest you mean, reaching the 'higher consciousness' and being a adept and all of that then no, but I have trodden the right hand path as fully as anyone else has on this forum (except for perhaps people like robert bruce) so as much as you have.

They are in the 4th dimension. They were expelled from their original abode in this 3rd dimension by Gods who they gave their power over to.

You sort of missed the point of my previous post a little bit. You have studied Satanistic material and literature. But it is still dogma if you have not actually fully experienced this first hand. People often do this. They swing from one extreme dogma to an opposite one. The only commonality is the extreme of the pendulum swing. My guess is that you did not have a moderate Christian background but rather it was forced on you (or heaven forbid pummeled into you) which would explain your strong swing in the other direction. Have you been face to face with a demon yet? What level of 'demon'? What are your experiences thus far with Satanic practices? Sorry for all the questions. I am just very interested in knowing about your direct experiences and choices.

I don't consider myself to have studied 'satanistic literature'. I've read things, like the Satanic bible, though.
I also consider myself to have fully experienced it first hand. And I'm not quite sure what you're talking about anyway when you say 'experienced it' but the 'Satanitic Literature' I have read doesn't really talk about things which I have to have experienced or not, if you know what I mean.
I had a moderate christian background or perhaps a less moderate christian background. I never went to church, not even on easter or christmas, and have only been to a church a couple to a few times in my entire life. My mother is what could be described as a very liberal christian, but more accuratley a new ager or agnostic, or just not very religious at all. I didn't really have a christian upbringing. Unless you consider being brought up in a judeao-christian society a christian upbringing, which is basically the entire world except for israel and islamic countries. But I was voluntarily a christian, at a very young age. And a new age god/angel beleiving/loving type person as well. I was also a muslim as well.
If by being face to face with a demon you mean literally as in being face to face to a physical manifestation, then no. On the other hand if you don't mean it like that then the answer is yes, high ranking demons as well, including intimate experience with a crown princess of hell.

[is]

Aryan knight, and remember this is just one person's perception, not necessary reality (but perception is 9/10ths of one's own reality unfortunately)... that you are merely on the opposite end of the Christianity pole.

You are correct. I am at the opposite end of christianity, because I do not live in fear. When I am presented with information and statements, I question what I am given and what I  question what I learn. I do my own research and I decide what is correct and valid. I am an individualist, and I have an iron will. I am a wolf, and not a sheep. I do not deny my carnal instincts and nature. I do not deny myself or my needs, I do not deny life. I do not leave any of the parts of the mind shadowed and I freely have my own ideas and opinions. I do not lesser myself and try to get pity from anybody, I do not pathetically beg and gruel. I am not of the herd mentality, but at the opposite end. That, and all of the aforementioned, means I am at the opposite of christianity.

Mind games can be played with equal skill on both the RHP and LHP. It is easy in most people to stir discontent, desire, aggrevation, argument. As soon as we achieve argument level we have now become a puppet on the string. We do not want to be puppets on a string but all too often we become just that -- ponds in a war of consciousness.

I agree with this, as well. You are a puppet on a string.

You do not fully understand the right hand path. You have not walked it in its fullest. You confuse it with religion and New Age Beliefs

Here, I am going to disagree with you, for I do understand the right hand path, and I have trodden the right hand path, 'in its fullest'. New Age is a religion, and that is a fact.

You do not understand that in the later stages of the RHP it is about peeling away beliefs and finding the true essence of the original energies and consciousness.

Show me one person who is in the 'later stages of the RHP' and who is finding 'the true essence of the original energies and consciousness'. You are certainly not, nobody on this forum is, nobody who I have ever met or heard of this. No one is.
The Right Hand Path also includes christianity, judaism and islam, in fact they are the corner stones of the right hand path, and do those paths, in the latter stages of treading them, come to peeling away beleifs and indulging in new age dogma like you suggest? No.

The LHP digs much deeper into countless forms of energies and consciousness. If one is not spiritually strong it is easy to get swept away or overly intrigued (curiousity did eventually do something to that darn cat) or enthralled by the extraordinary expressions energy and consciousness can take on or be manipulated into. I feel one should understand the beauty of the original energies and consciousness before delving into that which was created from this. But that is just my opinion.

You do not have to have any sort of spiritual reality at all to tread the left hand path (Modern/Laveyan Satanism, COS, Athiesm).
You say you would rather deal with what created the energies and consciousness before delving into the energies and consciousness(s) themselves, but why does there have to be a creator? Is it a fact that there is a creator? No, that is a beleif.

From what I can see, you (thats a collective statement) hold your beleifs to the judeao-christian god and then venture into the occult. As a result, he and the angels excrement on you. Why do I say this? Look at the psychic self defense forum. Neg attack, Neg attack, Neg attack. So and so meditates an arch angel, who says everything in riddles, then he feels ill and exhausted afterwards.  Do I, a follower of the left hand path and a dedicated satanist, have to deal with neg attacks constantly? No. Never. And here is you saying that neg attacks are all because of Satan and the Demons.

Hello Arayan Knight
God is non-denominational and has many faces or names. What you say about demons is incorrect if you are using the Goetia. You say two things at once if you compare your prior messages.
What I believe in as a religion is not up for discussion. It was do I know about demons. I do and let us hear about your qualifications. How much experience do you have, how many have you dealt with, and what makes you feel you are an expert. It is not about philosophy I am talking real life experience.
Nita

Hello Nita,
I have had intimate experiences with the Demon Ashtaroth/Astarte/Inanna/Ishtar. The Demon Guison I beleive is my guardian although I am not 100% sure. I have invoked Guison and he has spoken through me to do a reading for a member of the Astral Pulse (Sentential).
I have spoken to Barbatos and I have spoken to Amon. I have envoked Bes/The Bes/Legion.
I personally know many people with far more experience then me with the Demons and their Guardian Demons. I do know personally one or two people who would have summoned every Demon of the Goetia.
It is not a simple philosophy that they are no longer under a curse, it did literally happen and they were freed with energy workings. I know some of the people who freed them.

Dear aryanknight666,

Well, it is claimed he did torture and murder his cat horrifying his poor mother. If this is true and since I love cats I would call Aliester Crowley a Satanist. Much of his work was focused on power, ego and working with the darker forces. Aliester's ego was legendary. But then it is all a matter of definitions. How do you define a satanist?

So -- if I torture my cat that makes me a Satanist?
I define Satanism as it is factually so, not relying of phoney SRA cases, bovine excrement sterotypes and christian propaganda. I am a Satanist. You , as it is the nature of the right hand path, have made an assumption without any real knowledge or experience with or of what you speak of, and have simply accepted what you have been brainwashed to beleif, thus is the sheep/herd mentality.
If you want to educate and enlighten yourself on Satanism,
then I suggest

www.churchofsatan.com
www.temple666.com
www.joyofsatan.com

and use search engine and look in the links section of those sites.
It is also obvious that crowley didn't horrifyingly torture his cat, this is obviously christian propaganda which you have swallowed.

New Age is the correct label. It refers to the beleif held that everyone will ascend to a state of godliness and 'christ consciousness' as predicted by grays, angels and spirit guides through channeling.
From what I have seen, this sort of religion is a result of wanting to venture into the occult, magick and psychic phenomana but keeping the attatched stigma. It is rejected the church and organised religion but not being able to let go of the monotheistic culture they have been raised in -- 'God' is just too deeply ingrained, people have to try and convince themselves that 'God' exists as long as they can take away the bits about it they don't like and keep the parts they do. It's also a rejection of christianity but being unable to accept a different religion again because of the ingrained christian predispositioning. They cannot bring themselves to turn their backs on christianity, so they simply conclude all religions lead to the judeao-christian 'God' and what they don't like in the bible isn't true, what the do like is, and that the bible was edited so all their new age beleifs like reincarnation and stuff were taken out.
The 'ancient religions' you speak of -- it would appear that the new age/spiritualism crowd have a very poor knowledge of all the religions they try and hodge podge and join together to form their own dogmatic and self-righteous religion.
I am a proud follower of the left hand path -- and what do right hand pathers have to say?
'Never venture into the left hand path/"dark side" it is evil! once you enter you can never go back and there are many pitfalls and traps in it!!'
What experience have they had with or in the left hand path?
Zilch.
They just rely of their own pseudo-intellectualism and assumptions that they are correct regardless of whether they have had any exerience with what they so sure footedly speak of.

Hello Arayan Knight
Now for the second comments. The bible has been rewritten so many times that no one knows what God really told Adam and Eve. I am sure Lucifer was twisting things and lying because that is what he is the Father of lies and also Lord of Flies.
Demons have pride and ego. The problem is the pride and ego normally is about how much they can twist and say to make people believe them. I do feel that people should realize that demons can not give them anything that God and hard effort can not give them.
Nita

If you want to then you can read the hebrew versions of the Torah.
Yahweh still told adam and eve that they would die if they ate from the tree of knowledge. It does not mention the serpent as Lucifer or Sammael as the hebrews called him, but neither does the christian bible. It calls him SATAN, that means adversary. In egyptian, SATA-N means serpent or snake. The serpent or snake is seen all over egypt and represents the God Ptah. The hebrews word for 'adversary' was the serpent or snake because this image of the serpent or snake which represented Ptah and Egypt was their great adversary. Ptah is the sumerian god ENKI. Hebrew mythology is taken or stolen if you may from sumerian myth except twisted around a little bit. The story of the deluge is taken from the epic of gilgamesh. And the story of adam and eve and the serpent is taken from a tale where ENKI represented by the serpent comes to adappa and eve in the garden of eden to advance his children. Another God does not want them to have knowledge or power, and he doesn't want them to become as Gods like ENKI does.
The serpent in the garden of eden in hebrew mythology speaks and acts like an intelligent being. It is obvious that this serpent is metaphorical, and this is also a tale of how the serpent lost its legs. The serpent represents many thing but does the kundalini energy (thats the tantric word for it) which rests at the base of the spine but ascends and the beholder acheives Godhead. If a serpent has legs it can easily climb up something. ENKI wanted humans to become as Gods, just like he and the others.
Nothing that the Demons or the Gods can give to people can jehova give to people.
All jehova does is order to stone to death anyone who exhibits any supernatural ability. He condemns the supernatural, the occult, sorcery and psychic phenomona and forbids his followers to have any of it.