Messages

quote:Originally posted by lau_lauz

yeah or no?you can make me believe if u do it! that goes to anyone who reads this aswell!!!!!!!!!!!

Do you have dreams?  Do dreams really exist?  I don't believe you.  I want you to prove to me that you have dreams.  

Do you see how silly that question is?  I can't prove to YOU that OBE's are real, just like you can't prove to me that dreams are real.

The simple fact is that those of us who have had an out of body experience KNOW that it's real, because we are the ones who experiences it firsthand.  If you would like to know that it's real, you cannot, I repeat, cannot have someone simply draw you a picture, or explain what it is like in detail.

First, you have to believe in that which you can't see, or have never experienced.  Once you believe that it's true, then you will be more apt to seek for it.

Then, continue to read any books or online articles relating to OBE's, all the while telling yourself that you believe that even YOU can experience these things.

Then have an open mind, practice practice practice, and perhaps one day in the near future, we will be reading about your experiences.

Just remember, for some people, they have an OBE within a day or two after trying.  For others, it may take years.  There is no set of rules which always apply.  

But my point of this post was to convince you that no one will ever be able to convince you that it's real.  You must accept that they are real, just as dreams are real, and then you must accept that you can have one.

Like Syke said, mine happens to be 12 as well (9-8-1975), and there is no info on me.  

Now I don't know if that means I'm highly spiritually advanced, or if I'm an astral pee-on with no purpose in life whatsoever!

[I]

quote:Originally posted by zukasil
[i just thought of something.. if im getting sensations without trying then mabye i just dont do anything at all... eventually i will project and the sensations will take over by themselves right

Yes, you said something very wise right there, although I'm not sure if you even realized it.

Most beginners read all about HOW to have an OBE.  They know what the body is supposed to feel like (numb, vibrations, etc), and that's about it!  What next?

So what ends up happening is that you get your body in this super relaxed state, and then you start thinking to yourself, "Ok, now what do I have to do to have an OBE?"

Now, while it's true that YOU have to do some mental exertion to separate from your body at times, there is a small transition that you have to go through where you don't do anything.

As an example, I will briefly tell you about a small projection I had this morning.  I woke up and decided to remain laying in the same position in bed.  My body was completely relaxed and numb, much like you try and achieve when you practice OBE's.

If I would have tried to move an astral arm, not only would nothing have happened, but either my physical arm would move, or my physical body will feel a bunch of energy go through my arm and I will lose the perfect balance of relaxation that I had going.

Instead, when I am in this situation, I usually try and pick a THOUGHT and sink into it.

In this instance, I decided to focus on my hearing, and I thought I heard some noise, like a high school soccer game (crowd of people, whistles, shouting, etc).  So I focused on this noise, and I noticed that as I focused on it, two things happened:

1) The noise became louder
2) As the noise became louder, I felt my body almost melt into the familiar vibrations where I can separate my astral body from the physical one

You see, what ended up happening is that I focused on a NON-PHYSICAL thought, in this case, it was some sounds, and that took my mind off my body and drew me right next to that fine line between your imagination and the astral realms.

Remember, you need to be aware of your body only up to a point.  Just focus on it long enough to get it relaxed.  That's it.  From there, you must focus on non-physical things to go further.  Whether those non-physical things are hypnogogic imagery, or astral sounds, that is up to you.

I hope this helps.

quote:Originally posted by Arisen

Hi,
I started practicing Astral Projection a week ago. Ive been practicing twice a day, each practice being 10 minutes long (I cant really stay concentrated more than that, at the moment [V]).

In my opinion, ten minutes is not enough.  It usually takes me at least ten minutes just to relax my body.  You have to relax your body first, and then comes the hard part: relaxing your mind!  Your body could be 100% relaxed, but if your mind isn't conditioned, it will all be pointless.

quote:
The problem being, I always get to the light trance stage quite easily. Then I get the light paralysis. Then I get a sort of heavy feeling.

Good....those are all good benchmarks for physical relaxation.  That means your body is doing what you want it to, but it still sounds like your mind is too focused on the body (and on results) that you're missing the mark.

quote:
But I never get any further than that. The feelings always die down. What could I be doing wrong? Or do I just need more practice? Or more practice time?

I would say more practice and more practice time.  Shoot, I've been projecting for over 5 years now and even I need more practice!  I don't know if you ever reach a point where you go, "That's it!  I've finally come to the point where I don't need anymore practice!"

quote:
Another question: Before, when I was doing AP (about a year back), I started to remember my dreams. Sometimes, I also had Lucid dreams.

But this time, I cant remember them as I used to. Last time, I started to remember them after 2 practices. Ive had well over that, and still cant remember them.

You know, one of the things that really helped me, both in recalling my dreams AND with my OBE's was the act of writing down my experiences.  

If you have a dream, no matter how small, write it down!  And especially if you have an OBE, you should definitely write that down.  

What this does is train your mind to focus on the non-physical memories that you have when you come back to your body, and the better you get at that, the more proficient you'll become when you try and focus on your thoughts and astral projection techniques.

Go to my website to download this tool which will help you log all your experiences into it, and then it will analyze them for you: http://www.obejournal.com

Hope that helps.

Hmmmmmm, I guess I'll try and take a stab at this one.  

Astral vision, to me, is what I see when I am in the astral realm, or when I am seeing the astral realm.

For example, if you have an astral projection, then you will be using your astral vision to percieve what is around you.  However, you don't HAVE to be in a projected state to see the astral environment.  It's quite common to be relaxing in bed, on the borderline of sleep, and all of the sudden, you realize that you're seeing through your closed eyelids!  In cases like this, you're actually seeing with your astral vision as well.

As far as auric vision goes, I usually associate that with a non-projection.  For example, I could use auric vision right now and look at your arm, and 'see' your aura.  I don't have to be in the astral realms to do so.

Hey there, Girly!

quote:Originally posted by GhostGirlyNY
I could DEFINITELY feel my body moving in the way that I wanted it to move, particularly my arms and upper body.  At one point, I almost felt as though my body were sliding right off of the bed, but my physical body NEVER moved.  Does this mean that I actually managed to project?

Yes, you were projecting.  Congratulations!  I know that sometimes, vision is one of the hardest things to get.  At least it was for me.  The trick is to stay calm, and like you said, just face those fears.  You'll end up laughing once you get good and see that you were only scaring yourself this whole time!

quote:
 I still think that I was stuck between the two worlds, because I wasn't able to fully get out of bed and move around.  I really can't describe it.

I know exactly what you're talking about.  You knew that you were controlling your astral body, but you didn't have much control.  That's perfectly normal in the beginning.  

The more relaxed you become, the easier it is to progress and move away from the physical body.

quote:
 I also recall looking at the clock and seeing that it said 1:55, which freaked me out, because I thought, "Oh no!  I slept through my alarm."  So, this experience was obviously very real.  I laid in bed for a few moments, struggling to move and feeling as though I was, but never moving out of the bed.  I finally became frustrated, and I immediately woke up for real and saw that it was only 12:05.  Freaky stuff!  What should I make of it?

I wouldn't trip too much on the time thing.  You'll find that when you're projecting and you try and look at any things like headlines, clocks, books, etc., that things almost always look different.  Clocks may say a different time (since time doesn't really exist in the astral), and text may look garbled or twisted around, like you've got some form of astral dyslexia!

Congrats again!

quote:Originally posted by jc84corvette

I can not meditate for long periods of time because of the family. I would try it in bed but thats when I try AP.

For me, meditating and trying to AP is the same thing.  At night, when I would like to AP, I start by meditating, which is nothing more than quieting the mind while achieving a relaxed state.  At least, that is how I define meditation!

From there, you're going in the same direction as most OBE/AP techniques.

Another thing to remember is that is can be more distracting trying to ignore the noise instead of simply focusing on it.

For example, let's say there is a barking dog outside.  If you're trying to meditate, it's going to seem damn near impossible if you keep mentally saying, "I'm going to ignore this dog."  

BARK BARK.

"....I'm ignoring this barking noise.  I am not listening to.."

BARK BARK  

"AGGHHHHHH!"

You see, sometimes what I do in situations like this is tell myself to do the opposite.

"Ok, you little bastard.  You want to bark.  Fine, all FOCUS on your bark instead of trying to not focus on it."

Then what I do is associate the bark with a part of my relaxation.

"Everytime I hear a bark, I will become more and more relaxed."  Then for each bark, I may focus on a part of my body and imagine the bark relaxing that body part.

This technique can work for almost any annoyance, like a dripping faucet.  Granted, it may take some practice and patience, but it's a great way of turning around the distraction to work in your favor.

There really isn't much you can do to stop outside distractions.  Hopefully, though, you can work around them.  Here is what I have done.

1) Get a fan or some kind of white noise maker.  If there is some outside distractions going on (in my case, I live behind a high school), then a fan humming or a white noise maker is enough to keep my mind focused on that and at the same time, not distract me from my meditation.

2) Get earplugs.  These are only a few bucks, and they provide a good layer of insulation from the outside world.

3) In extreme cases, you could always set your alarm clock to wake you up in the middle of the night after you've already been sleeping for a few hours and try to project then.  Chances are the only distraction you'll have is your mind wandering back to dreamland!

quote:Originally posted by Skudgett

Hi everyone i just got a concern because my form tutor today in school is a christian and he said that astral projection is bad as it isnt featured in the bible! is this true?

I'm sure your tutor would say the same thing about reincarnation and near death experiences.  Well, check out this link to read all kinds of Biblical support for paranormal experiences:

http://www.near-death.com/origen.html

Hehe, I agree with Beavis.  For me, OBE's have changed my life in the fact that I no longer look at the world the same way.

I used to be highly indoctrinated in the Christian religion (born again), and now, my outlook has completely changed.  I also feel that I'm a much more patient person now then I was before.

quote:Originally posted by beavis

I agree that dream = OBE, with different levels of awareness. But not all parts of a dream really exist. Some of them are made by your brain.

You know, I used to think this way....but my viewpoint has changed since then.  

I am now of the mindset that the brain itself is not capable of any thought.  Imagine, if you will, the brain as being a computer processor.  All it does is process the thoughts which come into it from the nonphysical realm.  It does all the translation work, the same way wine doesn't come from the distillery which bottles it.

So as these thoughts (which are themselves a form of energy) enter into our processor (brain), the processor decides what they mean and how we interpret them.

With that in mind, I believe the brain is nothing more than a highly complex organ that is used by us to translate things, not to create things.  Dream thoughts don't originate from the brain, IMHO.  The brain just interprets them into an array of images, scenes, colors, etc.

Hi Shaman....

Good post.  I think I agree with most of what you're saying, but I would like to comment on it some more.

Many people ask themselves, "Just what exactly are dreams?"

To me, dreams are nothing more than conscious memories of an unconscious experience.

Lucid dreams are conscious memories of an experience where you know that you're dreaming.  That is, you know that this isn't "real" or "real life" as you know it.

OBE's are conscious memories of a conscious experience where you know that you're awake, and that you're body (shell) is left behind somewhere...on a bed, on a couch, etc.

Now, in all three cases, since we possess a certain varying degree of consciousness, we percieve things differently.  Since all things are made up of energy, we decipher what that energy is and assign a shape or form to it.

So complimenting your theory, when OBE, if you see someone who says something that doesn't seem to make sense, or you see an event which you don't quite understand, you may not want to take that literally, but instead, look for the deeper meaning.

Now, that's not to say that OBE's are not real, just like dreams are not real.  OBE's and dreams are equal in terms of their reality.  The only difference between the two is the amount of conscious awareness is present AT THE TIME OF THE EXPERIENCE.

You see, you only remember dreams AFTER you wake up.  Therefore, you're already filtering the experience through your brain (and through your sleepy mentality), and often times, your dream memories get really fuddled up.  

When you're OBE/AP, you experience things AS THEY HAPPEN, and you process the thoughts on the spot.  This makes things a lot more 'real' than dreams.

However, back to your point (sorry for rambling), I don't think we need to take all things in an OBE as symbolism, just as we shouldn't take all things in a dream as symbolism.  But, there are some things (namely when you see or hear things you don't understand) that I think you should look for other symbolic meanings before taking them literally.

quote:Originally posted by jallyn
Is there hope...or should I take up drinking? -jallyn

There's ALWAYS hope!  I would suggest you hang around here and interact with everyone on a daily basis to help keep your mind on your intent.

Plus, it's always good to read about other people's advice and experiences.  As far as wondering if you SHOULD try and get out because of your track record, well, just remember that 'what goes around, comes around,' so try and don't do anything stupid just because you can.  =)

I know that for me at least, the temptation to mess with people while 'out' is highly temping, because I've done it before.  But over time, you start to realize it's kind of pointless, and that we should probably be doing more constructive things with our time.

I would say one of the two possibilities could have happened:

1) You're astral body was REALLY talking to your physical self, but your physical self doesn't remember.  Mainly, I'm thinking about the time Robert Bruce projected and was both consciously "awake" in both bodies.

2) You were talking to another facet of your consciousness.  Since we are all multi-dimensional beings, is it any surprise that we can exist on a multiple of levels?  All of us have "conversations with ourselves" everyday in our heads.  Only in the astral, its possible to actually HAVE that conversation with that part of yourself.

Remember, just because things are not what they seem when you project doesn't automatically make the experience an LD, or something "not real."  The way I classify a true AP or OBE is that if I'm AWARE that my consciousness is away from my physical body, meaning that I KNOW I am separate and that somewhere "back there", my body is laying down, then I'm having an OBE/AP, regardless of how strange and backwards the environment seems.

You also have to keep in mind that you aren't SEEING so much as you are PERCEIVING.  You may percieve the energy of a being and your mind will translate that being into looking a certain way.

This is true for many things.  You may project into the RTZ and see a pile of garbage on the floor, only to return to your body and find the garbage is actually a jacket.  Why did you see garbage then?  Simply because at the time, you picked up on the energy and perceived it to be a pile of garbage, because your mind automatically associated it with garbage.

This is why I usually suggest people don't use drugs to get OBE, because it affects your body which affects your mind which you bring with you on your astral journey.

quote:Originally posted by Shadow20205

Well I have had two more obe, but lately when ever the vibrations come I get excited, Like "I'm about AP", and they disapear this has been happeningevery time I try can you help.

What Shaman said above is good.  I'd like to add on that.

As hard as it may seem, you should try not to focus on all the little things.  In a way, that seems contradictory, because we're always told to look for signs like vibrations, energy movements in our body, shifts in consciousness, etc.

While this is true, there is a difference between LOOKING at signs and being AWARE of signs.

The process goes in this order: Awareness -----> Looking.  In other words, as an everyday example, you're aware that someone is behind you, and then you look.  You're aware that a car honked at you, and then you look.

The same thing applies when you're trying to project.  You become aware that your about to project....HOWEVER, DON'T LOOK!  In other words, don't focus on the fact that you're projecting when you're a beginner.  Just relax and go with the flow.

It's just like walking.  You're aware that you're walking, but you don't look at each muscle that is being used to take you from Point A to Point B, right?

Likewise, when you're projecting, just be aware, like, "Ok I'm aware that I'm about to project and I trust in my Higher Self to know what I'm doing" and then don't think about it.  Just do it, the same way you don't think about walking.

That's the best way I can explain it.  You may need a few of these "almost-OBE" experiences before you convince yourself not to get excited, and just be passively aware of the process.

Hope that helps.

quote:Originally posted by Zarklon
Besides the wierd stuff that followed , I thought back on the exit and how I was able to induce the paralysis state.. Was it because my body was already sleepy from just being woke up ? I'm not sure.. I've tried to project like that before but to no avail .. maybe listening to these imagery noises and mentally repeating and willing them on could have done something to bring on the paralysis/projection state.

Usually, most people recommend that you try to project when you're waking up from a sleeping state.  Why?  Because like you discovered, your body is already completely relaxed, and your MIND alone is becoming aware.

So once you reach that threshold where your mind is aware and your body is still asleep, then at that stage, you can do almost any OBE technique and it will work.

The hard part, as you also discovered, it staying awake!  Most of my OBE's have happened after I was asleep and then woken up without moving around.  If this happens enough, you begin to recognize the signs and it becomes easier to not fall back asleep afterwards.

You're on the right track!  Keep it up.

quote:Originally posted by LogoRat

Well, i was not talking about looking at a clock, i was talking about the experience of time.

Yes, we were responding to electricdreamer who was responding to you. []

quote:Originally posted by Jhun

I was lying down last night before bed so I decided to try astral projection. So I layed there with hands to my side clear mind fully relaxed. When I heard the buzzing sound about 2 minutes into it and I concentrated on it. After a short while of doing this I did'nt reach the vibration like I did that morning. It was like my astral arms just started to come out it felt like a tingle sensation. As it started from my hand and then my hand jerked and I felt my astral hand was free. It then went up my arm and the samething happened then my shoulder. Then I felt my chest raise slightly and my feet did the same. Then I lost concentraion as I think I got over excited. Do you think this was a succeesfule?

I think it all depends on what you label "success."  I would say it was a successful disassociation of the astral body from the physical, in relation to your awareness which was focusing on the astral body separating.

To others, they may say you really didn't leave the confines of the physical body, so to some, that wouldn't be a successful projection.  However, I think anyone is successful if they become consciously aware of their astral body and are able to move about in it, whether they're simply moving astral arms, or travelling through the astral realms in a full blown projection.

quote:Originally posted by Josh

where are the techniques

Do a search on this forum for "Triangle Method."  It was posted by Birm and it's very useful.  You can use the "Search" link near the top of this page.  Or look up Birm in the .....

Ah screw it.  I did it for you.  Just click here:

http://www.astralpulse.com/forums/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=6762

quote:Originally posted by electricdreamer
I once looked at my digital alarm clock during an OBE and the numbers looked backwards-I have no explaination for this except that my astral double is dyslexic

You will find that this is extremely common.  It's damn near impossible to read anything while projecting.  In one of my last projections, I read something, then looked away and tried to remember what I just read.  I forgot!  So I looked again, read it, and then looked away, and again I forgot what it said!

So you'll find that even if you COULD read, it may be difficult to retain that knowledge.  But chances are, no matter what you try and read, the letters will become inverted or just look like nonsense.

I think this may be related to the fact that we're using different senses than we're used to.  When projecting, you're actually relying on your inner senses instead of your outer physical senses.  This usually reverses things a lot.

For example, I have had many projections where my own house looks to be inverted (eg. I turn left to walk down my hall instead of right, my door is on the opposite wall, etc).

Not only that, but does this happen to anyone else: As soon as I return from an OBE, I ask myself, "What side of my body am I laying on?"  If I'm on my left, I seem to think I'm on my right side!  I think this may be because I'm FACING the right, but laying on my left, but my brain doesn't know how to process my question until I think for a minute!  It's almost like getting my physical brain jump-started again.

Hi there Neo,

I'm not sure if I would be classified as an "experienced" projector, even though I've had well over 100 experiences in the last five years.  However, I will try and answer your questions pulling from my own personal experience:

quote:Originally posted by Neo Schiavo
1.  The illustration on the back cover of the book (Astral Dynamics) depicts the astral body as being unclothed.  Is this the case during all OBEs?  Or does your attire depend on what you were wearing before the projection?

Your attire while OBE depends on what you're projecting yourself to be wearing.  If while projecting, you think about wearing a tuxedo, then chances are when you look at yourself, you'll be wearing one.

To be honest, most of the time, I never think about looking what I have on my body....the same way I don't think about what I'm wearing when I get out of bed in the morning.  I just do it.

You will find when you project, that the thoughts about clothing and attire really take a backseat to other things, like flying and walking through walls!

quote:
2.  The term "astral sex" was briefly mentioned in the beginning of the treatise.  Interested with this concept, I searched the rest of the treatise for additional information.  But no avail.  Alternatively, I searched the web and yet, having read numerous articles regarding the subject, I have found no useful results.  Therefore, what exactly is "astral sex?"  The absence of physical organs has made me curious as to how it is performed.

Sex in the astral is not like sex in the physical.  In the physical, we have physical organs and we need physical contact.  In the astral, you no longer have a physical body.  You are, for lack of a better expression, an energy body.  You have shape and substance, just as that dream car (or house, etc) has substance in your mind right now.

So on the astral, having sex isn't about sticking your astral genetalia inside another person.  It's about melding energies with another person.  A transference of sexually charged energy. Imagine hugging someone and feeling an extreme rush of sensual energy passing between you two, something more powerful than a puny earthly orgasm.

Now, I have to admit that I have never experienced full blown astral sex before.  In most of my projections where I've encountered female entities, I usually get lustful and start to let my hands wander on their body.  While this is in itself an extremely powerful and erotic experience, if you're not careful, it can usually END your projection because you become too excited to maintain control of the situation.

I really haven't found anyone on the astral that I could truly "sexually" connect with on a full blown scale.

quote:
3.  Ever since childhood, I always wanted to "fly" into the TV, and experience the events of the program, first hand.  Of course, I knew it would be impossible, or so I thought.  After reading up on VRP (virtual reality projection), the idea came back to me.   Projecting while a TV is on, is it possible to fly into it and experience the events of the program?  In any case, would this even be considered a VRP?  Or would I be transfered to the site where the program was filmed instead?

While I have never flown into a picture or a TV, I would say you would probably be transported to a virtual reality type setting. However, it all depends on your mind, I suppose.

For example, consider the following possibilities.  When I project, if I see something on the TV and decide to fly into it, many things could happen.

1) I could simply fly THRU the TV, because my mind knows that I can pass through solid objects.

2) I could fly into the TV, everything becomes black (void-like), and after a feeling of motion, I could end up in an infinite number of places.

3) I could end up in a scene just like the one on the TV.  For example, if there was a nature show on right now, I may step into a forest or something similiar.

There are many different possibilities, and all of them are only limited by your mindset.

quote:
4.  In the book, it was stated that any metallic and or gemstone items on the body during a projection attempt would most likely cause that particular body part to become "stuck" during the separation.  Well, does that mean I will have to wait for my dental appliances (braces) to be removed before I can successfully project?  Or is there another way around this unfortunate circumstance?  (On a side note, is someone whom has had dental fillings and or metallic plates implanted within their body incapable of ever projecting within their lifetime?)

You know, my view on metal objects is the same for any other object.  If you FEEL or THINK that an object is a hinderance, then it will be.  For example, I personally don't like to wear any metal (jewelry) on my body when I sleep.  I think this is more of a ritual than a rule.  Many of us have these rituals without even knowing it.  We do certain things because we think that it helps us achieve a certain goal.

So back to OBE's.  I used to think that wearing metal jewelry would prevent OBE's....until I had an OBE while wearing some!  Same goes for certain clothes.  People may tell you, "You shouldn't wear such and such."  Or positions: "You should lay with your head facing the North."  You're only hindered by your mind and what you believe.  

In my experience, I have had projections wearing jewelry, facing every geographical pole, and in almost every position (except sitting or standing!).  But if you BELIEVE that something is going to hinder you, then it probably will.

That was a really good post, Zarklon.  I like how you went into so much detail in order to explain what position you were in, and what to concentrate on.

A lot of my recent projections (if not most of them) seem to happen when I am laying on my arm (whether it be my arm under my head, or my arm under my body).  This reminded me of what you suggested, about sitting on your leg.

Anyway, great post, and I look forward to reading more of your astral experiences!

quote:Originally posted by Ceriel N
I do know that it's my AB that is loosening, but should it be so violent? Like I'm going to be tossed out from shere momentum?

Hey there Ceriel....

Think of the vibes like a river's current.  If you have ever stood in the middle of a flowing river, and face the current, what happens?  It can be violent, because the force of the river is running against your efforts to stand still.

On the other hand, if you face away from the current and flow with it, it will carry you gracefully down the river.

When you feel vibrations, usually newbies will just sit there in that situation, much like a person who would stand in the middle of a river's current.  This is usually because as newbies, you don't know what else to do!  It can be quite a shocking experience!

However, the next time you find yourself going head-on with the vibes, just tell yourself to relax and "go with it."  If you don't fight them but instead, merge with them, not only will they get more pleasant, but you'll be able to separate from your body with ease.

Hope that helps.

Maybe it's because you're nothing but a Fat Turkey.  []

Anyway, you have to learn to have the attitude of "No one is going to help me if I don't help myself."  That goes with everything.  No one is going to compliment you if you don't compliment yourself.  No one is going to give a sh*t about you if you don't give a sh*t about yourself.  See the pattern?

No one knows you better than yourself, and if you have a poor self image (or attitude about your life in general), then how can you expect others (who don't know you as well) to make you feel any better?