Messages

quote:Originally posted by Guhan
When we dream we don't know we are dreaming and think that it is the reallity.

This is incorrect.  It is true, most people fall into this catagory.  However, those whom are able to progress far enough on the Spiritual path are able to retain their WAKING consciousness when they sleep.  Ergo, they can position themselves to get a lot of work done when they sleep, too.

quote:Originally posted by beavis

I dont want to go to heaven, if there is such a place, except to laugh at the conformists, because there are better places that I have already been to.

Heaven is not a place- more materialism.  I understand what you are pointing, though.  More precisely, the dogmatics would spoil your party...understood.  It is more correct to view these souls as underdeveloped, in the same way that the animal kingdom is less developed than we are; the Angellic kingdom is higher than we are.

However, I disagree with need to laugh at another whose development does not equate to your own.  After all, the one who laughs last, is usually the dumbest one on the block. [)]

quote:Originally posted by shadowatcher

Everything fun in life is a sin, so why would you want to go to heaven? Its free of sin...

One does not "go to" heaven.  It is not a place- that is materialistic thinking.

Everything in life has a polarity and it is up to us to find the balance.  Having too much fun can introduce the same "balance" issue that your post introduced.

The whole idea of "sin" is handled through the natural laws of Karma.  Jesus taught this, however, materialists have to read the actual sentence in a material book before they will believe, as they have no understanding.  When one understands these natural laws, one is in a position to deal with sin, as opposed to being affected by it out of ignorance.

quote:Originally posted by Gandalf


btw, I just felt i had to mention all this, as I have just fininshed reading a newspaper article about all the 'good' work the church has done recently to combat those traumatised by dabbling in the occult and it really annoyed me, especially as the church is at the root of these problems!

Regards,
Douglas

Gandalf,

I concurr.  A classic example of this (although there are many!) ocurred when Mesmer introduced the principles of magnetism to the human race.  The Church (i.e. Roman in this case) condemnded him, only to begin adopting the same practices themselves 17 years later.  What a curiosity?  According to the Church, they could use this "power" to bring those who are "lost" back to the Church!

The same condition applied to Freemasonry.  The Church condemned it, however, MANY of its members (clerks, clergy, etc...) were Freemasons.  It wasn't until the war came about that the lodges emptied.

Inconsistency is the root of confusion...

quote:Originally posted by Tab

The western view of EVERYTHING is sad

Everything from the West is as essential as everything from the East.  The truth is: The West would be sad without the East and verse visa. []

quote:Originally posted by fallnangel77

quote:Originally posted by DjM

Sex can actually lead to insanity.

How so? Unless you are referring to one that becomes so obsessed with it that they loose all sense and interest in other things, I do not understand what you are referring to. Of coarse this is true of all obsessions, and it is the obsession and not the act that is harmful.

Sex, like all things, is what you make of it. Sex can be very helpful to your health, both physical, emotional, and relationship wise. If one sees sex merely as getting off and as a temporary physical high, then it is not going to be very productive. But sex can be so much more. Sexual energy is very powerful and if cultivated and stored instead of expelled can be used for your own health. It can be used to bring two people closer together, for it is an intimate act that when the sexual energy is shared can increase the bond. The Western view of sex is really quite sad compared to what its potential is.

It is obvious that you have not come to an understanding of what sex is intended for.  Please bare in mind- this is the world of effects.  In order to understand the world of effects, we must study the world of causes.  The details are up to you.

(I am not condemning; I am simply stating.)

FYI: there is a tradeoff of energies when they are expended for sensual gratification.  One approaches these matters as one moves upward.

Pleasure is a perspective.  I do not subscribe to your point of view.  However, I respect your opinion and wish you well.

One whose Spiritual eyes and ears are not open cannot claim to possess understanding of a Spiritual book, simply put. [)]

Isn't it a curiosity that those who constantly mention "Satan," have never heard of Ahriman.  What a curiosity?

One would be well-served to concentrate on positive thoughts and not be pre-occupied with one whose job is to place obstructions in their way.  These obstructions only make us stronger.  The more I die, the better I live. []

It is wise to understand the Hierarchies and learn to work with them.  In esoteric Christianity, they are: Angels, Archangels, Principalities, Powers, Mights, Dominions, Thrones, Cherubim, and Seraphim.  The human race follows on below. [8D]

Many ignorant religions teach that there are no beings between the human being and God.  This lazy mode of thinking will never promote a real understanding of the world; it will never give one a real picture of world evolution.  This is why humanity has lost its understanding of the world; and materialistic ideas will time and time again be able to out-argue that part of religion that rests soley on sentiments and dim feelings.  The Spiritual scientific world view, by giving people a new opportunity to hear something about these beings, is opening up an understanding of the world again.  A criterion is being established to set against this denial of a higher world.  The people who are resisting the recognition of this world today are preparing the soil for the most insipid and devastating materialism.  The materialists themselves are actually themselves the victims; the real instigators of the process are the ones who are complaisant enough not to want to know about what exists between human beings and God. [}:)]

Ignorance is the enemy- not individuals.  So let us balance the ignorance... [^]

quote:Originally posted by Allanon

I am sincerly sorry to anyone here that has got hurt feelings because of my proclamations. I really dont hate anyone and I just want this world to be remade through the Power of the Holy Spirit. My purpose here was simple. To plant seeds in your minds that may one day sprout into good fruit. Jesus is the Way, Truth, and the Light. May the Lord help you in your search and may it one day come to rest in Christ.

My friend,

We love love you.  Most of us used to come across just like you.  We realize that your intent is good and God.  However, you would be much more well-served to demonstrate to us that you understand the quotaions that you place AND can (and have) bring them to life.  The truth is: none can understand the Bible without the keys- period.  It doesn't make a difference what church you go to, what you were taught when you were young, or how strong your sentiments are.

It is more important to have an open mind and tolerate other people's beliefs, even if they don't corroborate with yours...just like I am showing you.  I admire your devotion!  If you add some understanding, you can be the servant that you hope to be.  However, one can not help another out of the mud, if one is also stuck in the mud.

Didn't God (i.e. the Hierarchies; keep it simple people) create nature?  He did.  One should be able to interpret nature to VALIDATE that which God is and does.  FYI: many of us are here on this site to acquire/sharpen those skills.

I used to sound just like you.  I was trapped in the box and couldn't get out.  I was petrified!  Being a cheerleader for God (without understanding) helped me balance my ignorance...it made me feel like I was doing something for God, when in reality I was alienating people from me and being everything that love isn't.

One of the difficulties in this world is that our thinking becomes increasingly materialistic and eventually crystalizes.  One cannot interpret a Spiritual book materialistically.  This is what's holding you back.  The book of Revelation is about the 7 Seals of the Christian Initiation.  A materialistic interpretation will tell fantastic stories of an entirely different version.

Jesus was an Essene (since age 12).  The twelve disciples were all initiates of varying degrees- that's why we have four entirely different versions of the Gospel.  They are NOT conflictions; they are an initiate's version of what happened from their perspective.  John was the highest level initiate, which is why the words of the Gospel of John work on the soul moreso.

Take the advice of the Lord and approach everything with "eyes of a child," and THEN you will learn to see.  This is not to be foolish, but wise as the serpent and gentle as the dove.

You have the right intent to spread the word, however, you have not made the effort to understand it properly.  We must strive to understand wisdom and not simply repeat it verbally.  This is what we are all here for...the experience with the task of developing our understanding.

It is all too easy to believe the fabulous stories that many religions tell and continue to update for membership.  However, one must eventually take a stand, as these misinterpretations do NOT enable one to bring spiritual currents into our soul life.  Instead, they make it OK to concentrate ONLY on the material world.  The truth is: there must be a balance.  We must gain our experiences in the material world and continue to learn and associate with the spiritual world.

We cannot be ignorant and cling to stories by fantastic dreamers who seek to control us through this device.

Your current state is a reflection on our past state.  I have no problem with you personally.  Ignorance is the enemy.

You are not going to go to hell and burn in a fire.  If one tried to explain this logic from the standpoint of the Spiritual world, one could not.  However, the materialist will say, "See, see- it's right here!  It says..."  This is all wrong!  It's simply a materialistic interpretation of a Spiritual book.  Although, many churches will back you up.  They have to!  At 10% a pop, they would lose bigtime.

My hope is that you are able to move UPWARD.  What did Jesus do?  He did what a lot of us are trying to do.  Many of us are trying to become followers.  Worship is a stage to becoming a follower.  The first step in spiritual progress is REVERENCE.  You have that now.  If you choose to develop it, then you're on the way...[]

When we ask trivial questions about something, we trivialize the subject matter.  It is important to understand the ENTIRE process of life between death and rebirth.

It is true: the family is selected for the recipient after the fetus has begun to grow.  In fact, the recipient is already aware of the tradeoffs BEFORE entering the womb.

By understanding the entire process of life between death and rebirth, ALL of these questions are answered AND connected to provide a complete understanding.

quote:Originally posted by Treaty_Angel

the meaning of life...the ever searched for answer. wut do u think the meaning of life is for? to die and rot into the gorund to support the earths needs?

This theory would assume that there is no spiritual world, which is materialistic and not logical. [xx(]

quote:
na. wut do u think the emaning of life is.[]telling u a tip would be breaking a promise.

It appears as though you want to exchange sentiments for opinions.  Would you trade $100 bills for wooden nickels? [:I]

It is encouraged that one ask questions, but one must ask the right questions to get the right answers. []

The life between birth and death is an EXTENSION of our life between death and rebirth. [^]

Sex was never intended for sense-gratification.  Although, it's easy to see that we have it all wrong in this world.  When one progresses on the spiritual path, one is no longer "held back" by the LOWER urges that the sex act craves.

If one were to "pie-chart" their own attention span (i.e. word, thoughts, deeds) to the sex act, one would probably find that quite a large slice of one's life is devoted to something that is, in fact, fleeting.  FYI: the entire reproductive scheme will change in the future...I'll leave the details up to the serious students.

NOW, how could one spend that big slice of the pie that says, "SEX?"  How would your own life have been different thus far, had you not been so dedicated to the fleeting sex act?  This is a good question for all of us.

Sex can actually lead to insanity.

Pertaining to same sex applications...this would be explicitly for sense-gratification, as there is obviously no procreation going on here from the human evolution standpoint.

The one who progresses on the the spiritual path is not a sense- seeker; one who looks for self-gratification; one who looks to benefit one's self. [}:)] The one who progresses on the spiritual path is one who looks (and understands) toward the evolution of mankind and positions one's self to contribute positively. []

Adrian,

I had no idea that these items were being offered on Amazon.com.  I just checked their site, and didn't pick up The Rosicrucian Cosmo-Conception.  However, I was able to catch another (by Max Heindel) in the same search.  Hmmmn...they operate their own presses.  I would guess that they are no longer offering the book on Amazon?

I had been exposed to a lot of the material in that book (RC Conceotion) via Rudolph Steiner's books.  However, Max's style is much more straight-forward.  Honestly, it was like getting the exact same info in another format.  (I believe that Dr. Steiner was also a Rosicrucian.)

All the best.  []

quote:Originally posted by RJA

It should also be noted that the Christian church has a long history of mysticism (St. John of the Cross, St. Teresa of Avila) who clearly have had OBEs.  There is a current re-emerging interest in a form of "centering prayer" that Catholic monks have practiced for centuries (look for books at Amazon on Centering Prayer, or by Thomas Keating).  In one book I read it sounded like among Catholic monks various phenomina like OBEs, levitating, speaking in tongues, etc. are all very common - which is not suprising since in every spiritual tradition continued practice in quieting the mind and meditating seem to lead to OBEs.  

I'd just like to elaborate on this point a bit...

The RC Church assumed an ambiguous position regarding magnetisim.  At first it comdemned it in 1841, but adopted a more open policy in 1856.  In Le Monde occulte ou Mystereres du magnetisme (The Occult World or Mysteries of Magnetism; 1851 and 1856), Henri Delaage felt that magnetism was a proper means for bringing back unbelievers to the faith.  His book was prefaced  by the celebrated Father Henri Lacordaire who, from 1846, spoke favorably about this science after having assumed the pulpit at Notre-Dame in Paris.

In the 18th century, the Church did not preoccupy itself with condemning magnetism.  It was more resolute toward Freemasonry, because the infatuation with esoterism had caused many Christians to seek entry into the Lodges.  Freemasonry was denounced in a papal bull (In emineti) of 1738, renewed by the bull of Benedict XV (Providas) in 1751.  Yet this interdiction remained ineffective, and the lodges expaneded nearly everywhere in France.  Freemasonry was even found in monastaries.  Jose A. Ferrer-Benimelli estimates that nearly 2000 clerics frequented the lodges.  In this period, nearly 650 Masonic workshops were distributed around the country.  With the onset of the Revolution, nearly all of them went inactice.

quote:Originally posted by WalkingThePath

Hey

Thanks for ALL the replies here
I am a born- Christian, but somehow what people told me about my religion and Jesus, felt "wrong". Now i know.
I feel love and admiration for Jesus, who died for what he believed in, for managing to "change" the system. Unfortunately, it seems, his name and words were manipulated from people who wnated to make the best of a situation or weren't ready to understand or accept his words.
I don't believe Jesus' plan was to create a "religion", to plant the fear of God, Sin and Devil in peoples' hearts, but rather to give them "freedom" from the paradigm of those days.
It is sad how things turned out.

Malvina

It's very refreshing to come across Christians who come to a greater understanding of their faith without being angry and refuting it all.  FYI: 95% of today's Christianity is incomplete and incorrect.  However, this does not mean that we should throw out the whole of it and start Jesus bashing, as many do.

As your understanding grows, EVERYTHING will make perfect sense.

I hope that you're able to find all of the answers that you seek.

All the best.

Please bare in mind that the Roman Catholic Church kept the Holy Bible under lock and key until about 1840-1850.  The Masses were spoken in Latin for many years, so many people could not understand what was being said...just showed up on Sundays and made a contribution.  With the advent of the printing press, it was reprinted and distributed to the public.  It was shortly thereafter that many Protestant religions came about, as people coule now read it for themselves.  The problemn was that they interpreted a SPIRITUAL book MATERIALISTICALLY.  This created misunderstandings that exist today.

You have asked what appears to be a simple question.  However, it is not.  There are countless stories, reportings, etc... that support the impetus for your question, though.

Most people are looking for ONE singular truth that is all pre-packaged and ready to be read/explained.  HOWEVER, this was never the case, nor will it be.  The truth is eternal.  It is changing as we currently exist, as the universe itself changes.  We are ALWAYS seeking the truth...

FYI: most of the true and tried methods are only communicated by word of mouth (i.e. Mystery Schools).

In addition, the METHODS taught by any/every Mystery School are NOT to be taught to anyone who is not a student...there are very good reasons for this.

I am telling you this so that you may be able to judge more appropriately what may be placed on your table.

All the best.

quote:Originally posted by LA FORET MAUVE
[br how can you judge it without having tried it ? [][]

I believe that this statement is incorrect.  How can one judge at all without the proper WISDOM?

I know that poison will kill my body if I injest it.  Ergo, I am not going to try it so that I can...judge its affect later on.

It is true, we should not be jaded in our thoughts.  However, we cannot be foolish and try things that we have summized will hurt us.  Memory serves to enable us to profit from our past experiences, else we would be apt to repeat the same mistakes over and over (i.e. the definition of insanity).

Adrian was simply pointing the difference between white and black magic rather politely.  Personally, I wouldn't advise someone to head down a path which might well land them in a hole so that they might judge it for themselves.  In addition, I wouldn't forget to tell you that there's a hole over there.  This is perfect wisdom: to not put something in someone's way or leave something in their way, either.

[Why do people believe this? It's because that's what they want to hear- period.]

There is a reason and purpose for everything.  Don't think for one reason that Allonon does not come onto the Astral Pulse site out of curiosity.  The way Chrisianity is taught today cannot provide answers to the questions that people have.  In addition, it cannot provide people with what they need to bring to life in order to lead a successful soul life.  This is NOT to say that Chrisianity is not the religion of the future- it is.  HOWEVER, about 95% of what is taught in the average Christian church does not reflect what the founders intended.  FYI: a period of 2000 years was to transpire in order that souls would see the value in 1 single human life.  NOW, we are moving UPWARD and this older condition is being left behind.  More specifically, people will (once again) understand REBIRTH and how it relates to the evolution of mankind.

It is not proper to state that any particular religion is unnecessary.  However, it is certainly deserved to start making corrections on the older model and moving it UPWARD to the level that it once held.  Unfortunately, many of the "churches," which have financially gained, will fight the process vehemently!  They will call everything and everyone "SATAN" who does not comply with their views.  In fact, they will also inform the masses that they are doing the world a favor by getting us out of the way...as was done repeatedly in the past.

The ideal of setting up a system that NEVER changes, conflicts with EVERYTHING that nature tells us.  If one cannot look to nature for answers, one is bound to be filled with untruths.  After all, everything else is man-made.

Our friend Allonon believes that he is "saving us."  It's their way of putting up points on their personal ledger sheet to compensate for their guilt.  In addition, they can say to Jesus- "See, do you see what I have done for you!"  Although, Jesus was quite clear on this...that those who claim to preach on his behalf would not know him.  What does this mean...to know Christ?  Hmmmn...do you think he might have pointed at the difference between worship and following?  How can any kingdom be built if everyone is always on their knees worshipping?  It cannot.  At some point, individuals MUST become FOLLOWERS.  What is a follower?  Is it someone who goes around like a parrot and babbles phrases from a physical book without understanding?  Surely, not!  What then?  What's the answer?  How do we know who Christ is if Christ is no longer in PHYSICAL form?  Those of us who are studying the Mysteries...we are finding out.  Those of us who are not, are left behind with their own sentiments (not to be confused with a researched opinion).

To believe that one understands it all is quite foolish, indeed!  The fact is, that the current capacity of the human being cannot understand it all.  Ergo, we are progressing in steps...like EVERYTHING else in evolution.  In fact, nature tells us this is true.  We can understand PART of the truth in our current state.  In the future, we'll understand more.  However, we have to deal with our current life and work from there.  So, whenever somone comes about who claims to have it sewn up in one little bit (i.e. give your soul to Jesus; say these "magic" words...a little magic going on there; POOF- you're saved!; NOW, you can do whatever you want and you're going to Heaven)- they are always wrong.  If this were true, Jesus's job would have been easy!  He would have just gone around town and told people to "say the magic words," etc...  Why do people believe this?  It's because that's what they want to hear- period.  Just tell me what I want to hear and I'll go along with whatever you're selling.  In fact, if you throw in a few flattering remarks, I'll make a donation, too.  

The bottom line is: if you tell people what they want to hear (i.e. make things simple and easy so that they don't have to think), they will buy it.  (Where were you when I was selling used cars? Have I got some land for you!)
 
The key is understanding.  Ignorance is the enemy.

There is no religion greater than truth...

The movement you need is on your shoulders...

If you and I were to see something in the spiritual world, we would both describe it differently.  Ergo, my understanding of heaven might not match yours.

I can tell you this: Heaven is not some physical place that we hang our hats at to sit around, relax, and do nothing.  Isn't it a curiosity that this is often how it is described?  It's as though people want death (unrealizingly).

The first step is asking questions.  So, if you're here (i.e. on this board), you've already moved in the right direction.  The next step is learning to ask the right questions (if you ask the right questions, you'll get the right answers).

quote:Originally posted by starjasmine88


If salvation is meant of us, I'm happy and pleased about that.
Just wondering if anyone ever successfully retrieve the most original version of the two testaments and translated them correctly enough in any of the languages.

thanks in advance for any infos.

It's not about translations.  It's about having the occult keys to unlock that which has been presented.  FYI: the Bible is an occult book (i.e. contains many references to occult activities, etc...).  The word occult has many meanings as the does truth.  One of the intended meanings in this instance is: secret or known only to the initiated; not visible to the naked eye.

Most people get angry when they realize that they have to "do something" to understand the Bible- that's the intent!  They want to read the Bible like an ordinary book- wrong!  One MUST have the keys for understanding- any language; any translation.

People seek translations because they believe that another translation might read easier.  This is not correct.  The BEST source is AKASHIC- period.

NOBODY will ever translate the Bible into a complete understandable book that reads like any other.  The Bible was NEVER intended to be read like that and was intentionally written the way it is.

Those who choose to follow the path will find all the understanding they seek.  Those who don't, will only be able to express their sentiments (i.e. I know what I like on my food; I know what my favorite movie is; etc...).

Once again, one MUST have the occult keys to unlock the Mysteries of the Bible.  If you don't have the keys, you don't have understanding.  It's a simple as that.  FYI: the keys are earned by degrees; one would not send a first grader to high school.

Also, the term "salvation" is often misunderstood.  The ignorant believe that everyone who does NOT conform to their beliefs will be tossed into a PHYSICAL fire- how silly!  However, THIS is how a materialist will interpret the Bible.  How else would they?  FYI: this (intentional) misunderstanding has brought many "churches" countless fortunes and murdered many good people who were sent to the world to tell the truth.

[underdeveloped souls]

Ignorance is the enemy- period.  It's not any particular group and/or person.

One who has understanding, understands how these groups (i.e. there are also black panthers; La Meche...if I got the spelling right; etc...) came about and why.  I'll leave the details up to you...

The goal for mankind is: Brotherhood of Man.  Anything that divides us, will hold us back from this goal.  It's rather backwards to say that racisim is bad.  It is more correct to say- "Brotherhood of Man is GOOD.  (the later is positive)  However, this is how evolution progresess.

We are NOT all the same- period.  You reap what you sew.  People don't understand this and choose not to because it's EASIER.  Everybody wants to believe that they are going to get what everyone else gets- WRONG.  In the same way that tomorrow will be planned by today, you next life will be planned by this one.

The fact that some people are concentrated on race (i.e. see ONLY their own; help ONLY their own; associate withe ONLY their own) identifies them as underdeveloped souls.  FYI: if you don't understand this, you haven't done you research.

So, here's what I reason (NOT think): kkk, black panthers, la meche are all groups of people who are less developed souls than those who would not behave that way.  It is imperative that one understands the influence of the Race Spirits and their connection to the evolution of mankind (i.e. research).  In addition, it is essential that one understand the purpose and differences of the races.

Personally, I don't trade opinions for mere sentiments.  Ergo, if one has not researched a matter, the best one can do is offer sentiments.  (Would you trade dollars for pennies?)

Adrian,

Thanks for listing this information in a sticky.  Apparently, you found a LOT of good reading material at the link I sent you (LOL)!

FYI: most of the information that is now made available to the public was not made available to non-members.  

The Rosicrucian Cosmo-Conception is worth every penny.  The quality of the book itself is fantastic.  The Rosicrucians run their own printing presses, etc... and simply do an outstanding job, which is par for the course with Rosicrucians.

Some of the reasons why people pursue spiritual development are: curiosity and personal development for self-gratifiction.  Both of these will retard the growth of the individual AND impair the evolution of mankind.  It is wise to (seek to) understand what the evolution of mankind is all about (i.e. where we came from; where we are; where we are heading), before seeking to increase energies.  We are each responsible for what we bring to the world.  Why incur a bunch of unnecesary debts out of ignorance?  "You reap what you sew."

All Mystery Schools are taught be degrees for a reason.  (One would not send a 5-year-old to high school.)  To attempt to learn what these schools teach on your own is a risky proposition...  It is best to learn the right way and to learn WISELY.

The FIRST step in these school is always- STUDY.  More precisely, one is NOT taught how to raise energies before becoming educated.  One must learn reverence for the spiritual world BEFORE one is shown the door.

It's not about charging the physical body with energy and acquiring powers for self-gratification!  It's about developing properly so that one can make a worthy contribution for the benfit of mankind.

Spiritual Science, Freemasonry, and Rosicrucianism will lead you in the right direction.  All the best.

THIS is not here...

A materialist sees ONLY the physical body and ignores the other bodies that are just as much a part of our development.  For example, the average grade school teacher completely ignores the etheric body which can cause complications for the poor souls who do not receive proper understanding.  Many of these complications can result in heart attacks later in life (40's-50's), as the eurythmy of the individual becomes upset at such a tender age.  The human embryo cannot withstand the outside environment for the first 9 months.  Ergo, it stays inside of another body (i.e. the mother).  The other bodies have to be treated correctly to develop correctly before/when they are released.

"Know thyself."  To know ONLY the physical body is NOT to know thyself at all.

FYI: Many cults use the raising of the Kundalini as an inducement for membership.  It is important to understand what one is doing and why.  If it's done too often, one can resemble a crack head (i.e. harmful physical signs)!

A high level of spiritual development understands that sense gratification (as many people use Kundalini for) is not on the menu.  When one raises their level of consciousness, the urges go away.

The supression of the ego is, in fact, the apex of development.  In fact, Jesus of Nazareth was able to supress his ego for the Christ to dwell within him.  He is known as the world's greatest initiate.

The physical body is the most perfected of the bodies.  One would do well to learn of the other bodies and how to work with them.  Spiritual Science and Rosicrucianism are two sure paths to doing it right.

Reason it out: if spiritual development were ONLY about doing mere physical execrcises, we'd all be done!

One must pursue wisdom and bring it to life.  This requires many lives.  The search for truth is eternal...