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That's a good question, because I've never had an OBE. So...  

I experience them during meditation, when Kundalni clears a chakra or when I manage to stabilize the thoughtless awareness.
I don't know about atoms, but I relate these vibrations to Kundalini manifestations, being so more subtle that matter. When living (our body) is enlightened through Kundalinin awakening, it can feel this manifestation, because senses get connected to it...
Is it the same?

It a bit out of topic, though...

Thanks!
Yea, I am enjoying it. Actually I'm spending some time at tine reading here, and then I feel like sleeping during working hours... hehehe!

Hey, Telos!
I hope this won't turn into a bad joke.
Yesterday I was with some friend in a neighbor town and we were playing some music and have fun and, when we started meditating, a few thoughts were occurring to me and I couldn't get them of of my head. It was mainly that I was number 397 in a group of people and you were number 74. I don't know what this mean, or if it makes any sense to you. I hope it's not puzzling.
Now, it's up to you at which level you want to understand these numbers. Still, I guess it will be a lesson for me, too, if I'm telling you about it.
Enjoy it, anyway!

I suppose that, since you respect her a lot, you might have received her idea in a subtle way, through the subconscious, and that's why you wanted to do the same.
Sometime these inspirations can come from the unconscious, so they are pure/unconditioned/collective/divine, as you may call them. Otherwise they come from other persons we inter react with.

But this wow of silence is an outer expression of what is being called the thoughtless awareness, a state of unconditioned peace, which will neutralize all contradictions and conflicts. Since you meditate, it's more useful to let yourself go into that state of consciousness, instead of practicing something exterior. Even if meditation is not obvious for others, it does work on them.

Good luck!

Faith as small as a mustard seed can move a mountain, but most people can't even move the mustard seed.

Thanks, nice expression!

Faith is there they just need to let it happen. There is not way to really lose this faith, it's the core of existence. It's what makes stars and planets move and it's creating us.
It's how I feel it. (Though   I wouldn't say that I got over all my frights. There was a time when they used to torture me a lot   ).

Anyway...
For me, the no.2 Faith you are describing occurs when we give up searching for thoughts or images (images are also thoughts). So, beyond the thoughtless, there is this pure unsustained  Faith, sustaining everything.

Beyond images and and beyond hopes.

lol,
Ben-Gay, I haven't tried until now! It must be something. Though I'm a girl!  

But when mentioning the cooling sensation and a medicine I meant something subtle, like cool vibrations. Because the kumkum does not give that icy feeling, on a normal physical level it feels like normal paint, on a subtle level it is soothing and relaxing. It is like water or food blessed by a saint person, it can cure or improve the physical side, too. But these get their good vibrations when being blessed, the kumkum has them in it. Still, I have heard that plastic recipients will spoil its vibrations.

There is another substance Indians use for clearing, it's a plant called anjwain. Seeds are used for tea or burned on coal to make smoke (used for clearing a place or chakras on the left side), and the effect is that it improves the moon, dark side of the subtle body. I do this sometime and it's been the strongest plant treatment I have experienced. It's quite amazing what those small seeds can do. But this can heat if used too much, it can heat the liver, which is on the right side.

There are many treatments (even bell jingle might help clear the atmosphere at a place), they can be turned into ritualism, but basically, if used sincerely, they have their results.

The interesting part is that both kumkum and anjwain have cool vibrations if checked (that's why Indians consider them auspicious), still they work in a complementary way, one is cooling, the other heating. The end effect is cool vibrations, anyway.

Hope it helps.  

Hello to you all and thanks for having this wonderful board!

My name is Ana-Maria and I have joined your forum a couple of weeks ago and already enjoyed some discussions, but I still haven't introduced myself.

I've been practicing Sahaja Yoga meditation for a few years, which is focused of self realization through Kundalini awakening and I had some nice experiences. And, according to these experiences, indeed, Kundalini energy can be raised nowadays much more easily that in any other period in the history. I haven't read entirely what has been posted here on this topic, but the Kundalini discussions are some of my favorites...

I discovered the Astral Pulse Forum looking information about the crystal children, which lead me to a Lightworker forum, then here . I hope that I will succeed in tuning myself to the expectations you have here.  

I haven't been dreaming so much lately   , generally when I get a message it happens during the awakened state, in meditation. So I suppose that's one thing I have to get more used to... I was asking myself if this would not be the reason I have found you.

I have some questions, but I'll try to look around a bit more, read more about other experiences and Robert Bruce and other people, and then ask.

So, trying to see deeper what's going on with my dreams and which is the connection between my experiences and the astral projections,        

Yours, Ana

Hey, it can't be that bad as a wound or a tatoo...lol. Indians are, through their culture, more peaceful and balanced people then others. That sindur or kumkum substance has a specialty of cooling and relaxing the Agnya chakra, it has a particular healing vibration. You can see it as a medicine, it is an apropriate definition.
Of course, because it's considered an auspicious substance and an auspicious sign, that red dot it's worn also as a sign of devotion to God. Fanaticism can also occur, as everywhere in a human civilization     , but basically it's sort of a subtle treatment.

I've tried it myself during meditation and it helps, definitely.
Of, course, when the kumkum is replaced by cosmetics, it has no effect.

Ana

Such a nice name you have, Kalratri!

Christian Church has rejected the idea of reincarnation because of losing the capacity to ensure a real practice to redemption. Because reincarnation implies that we come into earthly lives to effectively do something for our spiritual growth. This would mean that a spiritual guide (a priest) should be able to effectively lead us to enlightenment. Which obviously is not the case, since hundreds of years, though there were enlightened priests, and still are some. But the general atmosphere is that they have lost the ability to convey too much of what they are preaching.

So, this absurd idea, that people might go to heaven after only one life, blocks the minds in a confusion and prevents us from pretending too much from priests. (Because it is an absurd thing to believe that many of the people who have lived in the last two thousand years, at least, might go to heaven, judging on their lives and spiritual achievements. )

I just believe that God is neither such absurd or unrealistic, nor such mean to create for his people such a minute and improbable chance to realize their selves and reach a point of pure enjoyment of reality!

 

I was astonished -- and a little bit creeped out -- to hear "my" undisclosed novel characters and environment described in out of body experiences by other people.  I was not at that time talking about my writing.

Wow! Pretty difficult to deal with the copy right, isn't it?      

Though the experience of the collective consciousness can much satisfaction, when managed in the good way! Basically everything what we do is a collective happening, and sometimes living this has the healing effect of getting rid of ego   ... But obviously this was not a inspiring experience.

Illusion does not necessary imply lies. It can be simply a way to the understanding of inexpressible reality aspects. When we say "mysterious are God's way" we do not assume that God is attracting us in some sort of lies, but on the contrary, that he is creating a wondrous path to revelation, that he is creating a play for us to watch and to act in, on his side, and finally become one.  

Truth is one, but manifests having many facets. I suppose it's a truism, but we meditate sometime on such truisms.

I found (as the only "experienced" novelist) that if I focused I could "bend" the group experience so that it was closer to my reality set.  It wasn't that my reality was any more valid -- it was just better organized because of my sense of poetic license and plot.

As long as it's viewed as "fiction" the unconscious mind can extract what's relevant.  There's something that happened when we intentionally moved into the "real" category that bent everything completly out of proportion.

I don't know very much about Jung, what I can relate this to, is the influence Jung had on a German writer, Hermann Hesse (he wrote 'Steppenwolf' and 'The Glass Bead Game'). Jung considered that most of the western authors had fallen on the trap of their Anima archetype, because of not being able to integrate it, and this caused their works to distort reality and be fruitless fantasies. (He even assumes this about Goethe!) So there is an artistic value, but a weak connection to reality.
What Hesse tried to do (both because of his inter reaction with Jung's therapy as a patient and because he was sick of learning about the distinction between a correct perception of reality and artistic creation) was to work on himself and integrate these archetypes and express them as literature only up to the point he had reached in his analysis. (As well as an analyst doctor will not be allowed to treat patients but up to the level he himself has successfully integrated.) Because Hesse sincerely followed this rule he imposed upon himself, he mastered his fantasies and illusion and turned them into inspiring art.
Goethe expressed his despair and suicidal tendencies in 'Werther', which cured him, but this book caused a series of suicide at that time (any teacher of German will accept this as a fact   ), Hesse turned his depressions into elevating and curing art, because he did not let  unfinished the confrontation with the unconscious.

At least for me, this 'Glass Bead Game' worked like a magic writing and made me look deep into myself and balanced me very much.

I DO believe that everything that has been thought, is out there floating around, but it needs the thoughts of the original thinker to continue.  If it becomes an individual thinker, then it is a entity at that point, and I do not think I have the power to create a life....I suppose you could have found my thoughts (but that is a looong stretch), and then continued playing out YOUR thoughts, but I don't believe my characters are out there living some life out..no..

...the power to create a life? At least not at the level most of us are perceiving reality. But there are entities already hovering around, and they may interfere with these remaining thoughts, taking the identity of that character. And then we might think it's something we made up, but it's kind of a double way control. Anyway this does not imply freedom to create, it's not like being master of one's own dreams...

But there is a possibility of creating reality (far fetched, maybe, but as I understood this, I exists). And it is related to our mind being brought back to the perception of it's own source, to that spontaneous existence-consciousness.
The only example I remember now it that of the sage Wishvamitra, an Indian legendary saint, which also appears in "Ramayana". He has reached so deep in his meditation that he acquired this power of creating universes. He was gaining boons though penance and meditation, then he was using these boons for his evolution. But at one point he gets angry (out of too much meditation practice and penance, probably, and starts creating another universe, wanting to replace the old one, which was not satisfying his desires. Of course, the conflict has been solved. (Now, I suppose he hadn't got to that level of spontaneousness, he was gaining power, but it was still an outside source, as he was not entirely satisfied with it.)  
Yesterday I was looking for something on the net and I fond this comment: That in the battle between Rama and Ravana (I don't if you know this story of "Ramayana", anyway, Rama is the positive hero, considered by some a divine person, and Ravana is the demon), Wishvamitra could have, of course, have intervened, because he even had this power of creating universes, so obviously he could have killed a demon. Ravana was also disturbed him, too. But his duty was not to interfere. So he was providing help though his meditation and wisdom, but let Rama fight the demon. I'm not very sure I have understood this...  

About remaining thoughts, they can be... let's say neutralized or retired back into the source consciousness, which, form the perspective most of us have now, can be perceived as thoughtless awareness. Does it make sense? And the power though which this can be done is forgiveness. Not like letting go or tolerance, but forgiveness as kind of a basic 'magical' force, able to change universes/dimensions. This would be a form of recreating worlds. What I mean is: person A has a fight with person B and the tension is still lingering. Person C hears about this and, if C has this power of forgiving, he/she forgives what A or B has done to the other, and this work on the two and dissolve the conflict.
It happened to me, it worked by just telling to someone about some issues   I had for a while. I suppose this is also named 'to know how to listen'. I didn't know how it work, a assume it's also a way of interfering in other people's remaining thoughts and turning then to reality. Because reality bears no conflicts .
Has anyone have a similar experience?

About... non real experiences lol!
It happened to me to communicate or receive information, let's say from a guide, or from a self realized person. Sometimes this information is true (I mean it reflects reality, anyway the expressions of realized persons are always true), sometimes it is are misleading. And this switch point, though which this basically true information comes as such or is being distorted, is somewhere in my mind. So what would by the reason I sometimes accept it as such and sometimes I switch it all around? Because I do believe that we basically have the absolute freedom of perceiving reality and truth, nothing form outside really has the power to impose something on us (this is also an experience I had), rather the reason why we are not taking advantage if this ability we have resides somewhere on the level where we are taking our decisions.

So why am I turning this beautiful truth into lies? Is there a particular reason I cannot bear it? Or... Any suggestions?

Ana

Guide encounters, philosophical conversations with entities, emotionally traumatic experiences, questionable "synchronicities," seeing weird things and not being sure what you saw... all these pale in comparison to stories where people predict the future, read the minds of others, and observe events from afar. Those are the experiences that force us to recognize that we live in a common reality.

As MajorTom said, we all have interesting experiences that are of interest to ourselves, but rarely do we have one that is of objective significance.

Rather it's about transcending (in either the esoteric or non-esoterical meaning of the word) the divisions between subjectivity and objectivity.

For some reason, I think that if someone did transcend the divisions of subjective and objective reality, then they would have fun practicing its power, the way a bird likes to fly and the way a mathematician likes logic games.

Anyone could watch and observe, regardless of whether they were open or closed-minded. They would agree on the facts. That is a bird flying.

But, most importantly, by the standard and measure that it moves humanity forward and improves the quality of life.

Hmm, trying to avoid the 'beginner questions'   lol, this is fantasy, and fantasy is offering us satisfaction and knowledge so far we are capable (willing   ) to understand it's underlying structure and reasons. Like, when one studies literature, for instance, he can read texts, find out what others have said before, come, maybe, with some new ideas, write even books, maybe... but which is the reason we are having literature? Where does the pleasure we get out of it and also its morality come from? Is this maybe a kind of inertia we indulge in, because some write books, have their fantasy projections, books are well read, but in short time they step off the market and that's all. But those who are remaining on the market   have seen the birds flying where others have seen only literature. Does it make any sense?
Psychologically speaking (as Carl Jung for instance put it), the more we confront with our selves and go deep towards our unconscious (which means subjective experience and individuation), the more our perception shifts towards collective patters (which are archetypes and are collective, so objective). We develop then a kind of collective awareness, though we become very much in touch and in control of what can be called our most personal destiny.
About AP and OBE, I've never deliberately tried to have some (I'm new here, as you may see), but still, there is something...
Generally, I would rather try to get thoughtless awareness, so going beyond fantasy, not by suppressing them, but getting to the core generating them, which is beyond form. The self is beyond form. There are also different dimensions, the encounter to which would be rather tricky. But... Yea, I feel this is also related to that profound inner voice, which is the guide... Generally I used to relate mind projection to indulging into attachments, which is not exactly the spiritual path... . And I did have some experiences, but they were not enlightening, rather unimportant, one still scary, made me decide to wake up...
I had still this experience last summer, being in an art camp organized by some yogis, that is is sort of a duty to change the perspective I had upon my body and upon my freedom to move. It is 'freedom', but I wouldn't call the process to achieve it 'getting free' (neither escapism not conflict with the body seemed to me to be the name of the game, rather modifying my perception/attention of my own body and  being and through this the form of my action abilities.) I don't know if it makes any sense or if I am not off topic...
I mean, my previous experiences, which I relate to ridiculous attachments, were that I wanted to be in a particular remote place, because I wanted to be at a particular event I liked so much (a carnival, to be frank       ) or I was missing friends. So I wanted to get out of my body and travel there. Luckily it did not last long.
This summer on the contrary, distance seemed to be only the trigger to make my expand my capacities to grasp a particular understanding or to experience much subtle forms of love. ( In the latter case, distance seemed to be not physical, but a very spontaneously occurred and accepted relation form: like experiencing much more love in a pure and unconditioned sibling relation as I would have wished for or imagined even in a husband-wife relation. Distance and travel can have various significances .)
It was as if I have to be in a situation in which I am forced to make my mind not only perceive more then it would have been comfortable lol, but also to get more subtle, so that physical barriers should not stand between my being and what I have to do and be. I'm still not using it as I should, maybe, (or it's also a matter of timing?).

I feel it's good to share such subtle experiences if one feels they have brought a higher perspective in life. When these experiences shift our attention towards reality (the subtle reality) they create links of joy and understanding of the collective, abstract forms.

Ana-Maria

Cannot this faster human evolution be seen in relation to the free will? Animals have free behavior patterns, whereas humans can shift between different patters (including there the possibility to behave like different animals, let's say dogs, snakes...   ). This freedom is being given to humans in order to allow them to develop a more and more subtle perception of the behavior pattern concept - the moral pursue. (So the acquisition of the free will would be a paradigm shift, too.)

Generally it is considered that genes should have a physical causal evolution, determined strictly by mutations occurred in the reproduction process. And it was considered for a long time that genes remain unchanged throughout the life of an individual.
Now, I've heard in a spiritual context this idea, that genes will not remain unchanged, but are influenced by our behavior. (This would bring the science and the moral-religious views at a common point, and would imply also that particularities as homosexuality, for instance, cannot be blamed on genes, but are the result of an behavior which does not reflect the adequate pattern.) Can this be correct?
Later I found an article in a 'Science et vie' magazine, reporting about a laboratory in Israel (I don't seem to find a related link), where it has been concluded that the DNA structure does not remain intact, but each second segments of it DNA are being hit and destructed under the influence of different cell particles, and of course, these segments are immediately replaced, of course not with identical fragments (is would be impossible), but with what is available at that moment in the particular cell. This was the the report.
Is it now logical to consider that these available substances are directly influenced by the cell activity, by hormones, which on their turn are influenced by what we eat, what we do and what we think? And, of course, by our moral behavior?
It's interesting that, when noticing a major change in the DNA, which cannot be explained by physical causal mutation, scientists assume there must be some bacterias responsible for it. So they always have to look for answers at a physical level. But our emotions and feelings are not influencing our cell condition more then a flue or other bacteria caused diseases or symptoms? This Tree of life has to be always a physical one? It is obvious that for a person whose attention is mainly focused on the intellectual level, the mind activity will strongly influence the physical side and the cell activity, too. At least by adrenaline and endorphins, they might by the most common to think of.
C.G.Jung reports in "Memories, dreams, reflections" (I hope this is the correct English title) about a patient who had murdered her husband, and subsequently, though she succeeded in concealing her deed and had absolutely no remorses, had started being instinctively avoided by her daughter, by friends, even by her favorite animals, who had become aggressive to her. It' interesting, because Jung suggests by this that we inter react at a subtle moral level.
Then, if our moral behavior is being felt at a subtle level by other beings, is it not felt also by our own body? Will it not leave it's tracks on a cell level?
Maybe those 223 genes are the result of a paradigm shift.
And I think that it was M.Foucault who asserted that we are heading to another paradigm shift.

There's something to be said for self control and living without being a mindless sex drone.

I don't want to say anything anything now about Catholics, after all facts are facts and true believers are true believers, and that not only regarding the Catholic church, but all the religions. I'm neither Catholic nor from a Catholic country, but I just fund that comment quite inspired.
And I'm relating it to another moment. A time a go, a good friend of mine told me what her little daughter said to her. She is a 5 year old kid, one of those who can already speak in two foreign languages and have a particular spiritual insight, and often amazes her parents.
(There seem to be born more and more children of this type nowadays, so maybe some of the old prejudices will finally drop off.)
So one day her mother and she were in a tram, and she wanted to make her mother look at two boys, at highschool age, who were sitting next to them. Of course, the mother did not want to stare at them, but she insisted, and she said something like: "Look mum, those boys. They look like princes, because they have no girls. Look!"
It's hard to suspect any dogma or even educational input here. What can a 5 year old little girl know about dogma or boys   . And she has a very normal and non-dogmatic family. But she could feel this and was just enjoying a particular vibration of innocence, which she also wanted to share with someone else. If this innocence is producing such spontaneous joy, then there shouldn't be so many prejudices against it.


When being institutionalized, it may produce hash effects, and still It's just the beauty of human nature.

Of course, if there are special spiritual events taking place now in the world (and there are enough proves of this), then it would by good for Catholics to have a leader who can tune himself to these events.

And, as I am from an East-European country, I can tell that there are people here, very well educated both in politics and spirituality, who feel more gratitude towards President Reagan than the Pope. And there are some good reason for that.

But innocence is what it is, and I believe that there will me more and more people starting to understand and appreciate it.

There is a prophecy I wanted to share with you. It's not referring to year 2005 exactly, but anyway, to our time.
This is an extract from the 'Nadigrantha' by Shantaram Athvale. In this book he gives informations about several different Nadigranthas which are ancient books on astrology (like Bhrigu Samhita, Satya Nadi, Kak Nadi etc.) This extract refers to 'Kak Nadi' by Kakayyar Bhujander, a great astrologer who lived nearly 2000 years ago.

"While Jupiter is in Pisces a great Yogi will incarnate on the Earth. By 1970 it will have become quite evident to many people that a new era will have started. Kaliyuga will end and Krutayuga will start. The axis of the Earth will depress and the Earth's orbit will come closer and closer to the Sun. Human life will undergo a complete revolution. A great Yogi will incarnate at this time. [...]

Until this time a yogi or devotee could achieve the bliss of Moksha and find the ultimate meaning of his life only by following the path of devotion, knowledge and Pantanjali Yoga. But he would have to go through severe penance in order to awaken the sleeping powers of various chakras of his body and finally enlighten the Kundalini Power.

By the new method of yoga devised by the great Yogi, human beings will be able to attain the joy of Moksha within one lifetime. It would no longer be necessary to sacrifice one's body or to die in order to achieve Moksha. The Brahmananda which so far only great saints had been able to experience and then only by entering into the Samadhi state at the point of death, due to his new type of yoga could be achieved by ordinary human beings without entering Samadhi state while dying.

In the beginning it would be possible for one person in crores to attain this Yoga and Moksha. However, after some time the whole human race with the help of this Yoga will be able to defeat itself. People won't have to worry about food, shelter or clothing. While living ordinary lives people will achieve Yoga - Union with God. There will be no necessity for hospitals as there will be no diseases.

In the beginning the great Yogi will be able to heal diseases with a mere touch. Old age with it's destruction of the body will not exist and people will possess heavenly bodies.

Due to new scientific discoveries science and religions would become one. With the help of the science the existence of God and the Soul could be proved. The veil of ignorance and Maya would be drawn aside and Brahmananda, Moksha which could previously only be attained by yogis as a result of very hard work and severe penance would become easily available to many human beings."


This piece of information, about the axis of the Earth depressing, it's quite similar to what geologists have announced after the Asia Earthquake. Nevertheless, this prophecy sounds rather comforting then scary, in all.

Ana-Maria

Oh, I'm so happy for you!  
I'm sure you'll make a nice... no, carrier is not the word! It should be called in another way... ...?

And shackles...?    Maybe that's what you'll do, turn economic shackles into freedom.

 

Wish you all the luck you need!

How will spirituality work at individual level? We are Spirit, everything is the Spirit, the entire creation. God created everything out of himself... So what is the matter? Where appearers the difference between spirit and matter? If God is unique, then the matter is an actualization of the spirit. Or an actualization of the spiritual power/energy. This is consistent with modern physics. The difference is then a question of attention.
Maybe the core of economics is the understanding of the management of matter. Maybe there is no purpose as such of economics, maybe this scarcity is only meant to create an empty space, to draw the attention in an experience leading to the recognition of it's source.
I've heard about the the "axiom of consumer insatiability" in a spiritual context. It was said that all our desires are insatiable, the only desire which can be fulfilled is the desire to become the spirit, to get enlightened.   Yea, though this is too often considered as a very hard task, if not impossible. But it makes sense, isn't it? If all other desires are all instruments of those mysterious ways of God? And can economics then understood as the means to set these desires in a connection to the unique, pure desires, which is their core and substratum? Like establishing links between the two realities? Are these ideas too far from real life?  

Our body is also a good. We are the spirit, and our consciousness has to become spirit / our attention has to recognize it's primal source. So we have to raise to the spirit level, but without giving up the matter; to get detached, but holding to the good. Our central nervous system is the playground for this happening, it is matter, bur channelizes the information released by the self.

Anyway, I found this quotation from Einstein, that: "No problem can be solved from the same level of consciousness that created it."

Related to the issue of leading a life of service, I found today a message on another forum, which might throw some light on it:

http://lightworker.com/messageboards/viewtopic.php?t=4452

It is the third post, by Katy. The other comments are not so relevant...

Especially I liked that part (Uh, I don't know how to use this 'Quote' tool!):

"The 'service' that is being called forth from those whose desire is to assist the earth, comes from the place or the vibration that recognizes 'service' as being a 'vibration' rather than an action. So if you were told, if you knew that the greatest service you could 'perform' in this lifetime is one that is the presentation of a vibration (which it is) you would/might just get moving in the direction of holding that vibration wouldn't you? Your mind might argue but your heart would speak the truth to you. The irony is that when you 'reach' that vibration the world of service opens to you through things, and places, people and opportunities that thrill you. The vibration that we speak of is felt as 'joy'."

Someone forwarded me this link.

www.amazon.com/gp/reader/1564147142/ref=sib_dp_pt/102-4351958-6839316#reader-page

It's about a book titled "Compassionate Capitalism: How Corporations Can Make Doing Good an Integral Part of Doing Well", by Marc Benioff

I don't know whether it can help you.

Yea, it's a matter of discretion. I entirely agree with it!
Basically we have an inborn capacity of sensing danger and negativity, we just have to use it. But sometime we neglect it.
Through Kundalini awakening one will start feeling the vibrations of a particular person, or book or place, so will have the vibratory awareness to decide weather something is good or bad, but until we get to that stage, nothing precludes the use of common sense. I mean, we follow persons with an ideal behavior. Why follow someone who desires destruction or hates?
A master - disciple relation is like wanting to have reflected within yourself the ideal qualities of the master. Because, being a self realized person, the master is a pure reflection of the higher self. Actually this relation is a mere technique of drawing the attention onto some enlightened behavior patterns. If one's attention is not subtle enough to perceive these patters at the level of his own higher self, so this person needs to see them reflected on a more exterior level: and that's the master. That's how I understand the necessity for this relation. When our attention becomes subtle/enlightened enough, we become our own masters, and we will channelize our own messages. Actually there is no place left for channelizing, because there is only one self!

Yea, take care! It can harm.
Mantras can have different sort of vibrations. A mantra can attract negative entities into your subtle body, which can make you feel bad or keep you under their control. You may not even notice in the beginning, but they are really negative. Mooladhara and Agnya are the easiest points in the subtle body through which these entities can be introduced. I've been practicing for some years chakra clearing and opening, together with Kundalini meditation, and I can tell you that there are many people who suffer a lot because of such sort of misuse of the subtle body. Only a self realized (which means an enlightened) person is allowed to give mantras. If you don't like one realized soul, look for another, there are some really good masters, but don't surrender yourself to all sort of forces. And if, still, you have started something, stop it immediately if you feel something like unpleasant feeling, hives, burns, lack of self confidence, panic or any sign that this might be wrong.
One can see sometimes these entities, they are really harming and disgusting. Self realization does never come from such sources. There are many people in this world able to give you what you are looking for. You better desire this! You don't even need more. A true desire will help you more then you might imagine!

Hello, everyone!

I also believe that there is an inflation of channeling today. And not all the sources are reliable. For me this seem to be the major point: whether these messages come from a reliable source or not. Because if it is not, all this information can be harmful and is simply to be avoided, and if it is, then it is to be unconditionally followed, because it comes from a guiding entity which is above our perception. Let's say the source pretend to be the Archangel Michael: either it is really him, and then it is a bit ridiculous to pretend that we can understand so easily the purpose and content of what he is conveying to us, or it is just a fraud and the question arises which kind of person would pretend such a thing . Either one who lacks awareness or one who has bad intentions.
The intention and the degree of consciousness seem to me to be very important.
Because seekers will practice all kind of things, than feel bad or mislead or accuse pains or have burns and hives and these should all be clear signs that what they are doing is not the right thing. They say they raise the Kundalini and they are hit, but Kundalini is their individual spiritual mother, it is the projection of the Holly Ghost inside them, why should it want to hit unless hardly insulted?

The group which practice channeling and which I trust are the Lightworker, because their messages have very good vibrations and the feeling I get reading them or putting my attention on them is of love and peace. I don't feel neither disturbance nor insecurity, but innocence of those people and the truth of their Group. But there are also many sources I encountered which are really ill meaning and fake and harming.

Another method I really trust is this Sahaja Yoga meditation I've been practicing for some years. (And I was wondering if someone here has heard about it or tried it, I'd be really glad to talk about this). I benefited by this technique much more than I could express in words. This is not actual channalising, is more meditation under the guidance of an enlighten, self realised person, with the purpose of awakening the Kundalini and getting self realisation. As I understood, channalising does not have this immediate purpose, it's rather preparing individuals for the event of some collective happening. Though I might be wrong, it might be the same? Is it?

Another experience I enjoyed much in the last month was meeting a Christian priest who has seen many times the Virgin Mary in his life time, she has effectively saved his life a few times. Once she appeared to save him when he had been arrested by communists and sent in kind of an extermination camp, and she literally showed him the way out and the accompanied him while living in a cave for about ten years. I mean, really she was there for him, in long winter nights, when he had almost nothing to eat and... And I believe him, because I went with some friends to meet him and we felt incredibly good during this and after, like lost in peace and gratitude that such people exist. And on a physical level I felt good after going there. That place and that saint gave us all that feeling on increased consciousness. I suppose this is also a kind of channeling, because he head his life under her complete guidance and in absolute surrender, and has also influenced many people. Also, she gave him a short prayer to convey to all those asking help from him. He calls her 'God's Mum'   !

I suppose it is necessary to have such people around, after all the entire human evolution has been lead through the arrivals of special masters or divine persons. At least those who founded the great religions had a irreplaceable role to play.

About personal divination: I've heard someone saying that if we are supposed, let's say, to die on one particular day, and if we get self realisation the day before, than this event of death is neutralized, it won't happen. Because karmas are being modified or erased.        It could be! I like this idea, anyway! That we are not so much slaves, anyway!

I suppose that people who have gone in their awareness beyond duality and conditionings can make their thoughts become reality. Like bringing the ideal pure world of their consciousness into what we call real life.

Hey!
All these chakras have been created/opened in the cosmic body (Virata) at different stages of evolution. The first, Mooladhara appeared with the Big Bang, the next two during the creation of galaxies, the forth when human beings appeared, the sixth with the creation of societies and states... What each of us has to do is to actualise these events within his own subtle body. For this purpose divine persons or great spiritual masters were born at different stages of human evolution. Masters as Lao Tze, Confucius, Socrates, Moses, Abraham, Mohamed or heroes as Rama or Krishna had to fulfill this role of drawing the collective human awareness towards different chakras' qualities and powers and to open a gate for each individual to actualise these qualities and capacities within himself/herself.
Both the opening of the sixth chakra (Agnya chakra) and the creation of a path to allow each human to awaken his/her own Agnya represented the role of Jesus Christ. His crucifixion, death and rebirth created a drama through which this chakra could be awakened and has been awakened indeed. (At a physical level Agnya is represented by the optic chiasm, which is a crossing of nerves in the middle of the brain. ) That's why the most effective mantra for this center is the mantra Christ himself gave to us, and this is 'Lord's prayer'. No matter what our believes or our cultural apartnesses might be, or our relation to the church, it really works, because it is a divine message. If you say it not mechanically, but in a living way, with all your heart and desire to get enlightened, it will surely work. No need to have a blind faith, just keep your mind open to truth, and this truth will manifest.
If you want, here are two links I would recommend:
www.tlig.org/
www.sahajayoga.org/chakrasandsubtlebody/default.asp

The last chakra (Sahasrara or the 'Thousand petal Lotus') is being opened now at a collective level, that is the main task human beings have to assume nowadays . That's why there are so many seekers and that's why this urge for so many of us to find our way into spirituality. Spiritual happening which would have taken in the past years or a man's live, can occur now in a matter or days or minutes. Just see if it works. For myself and for many other people it did.

Wish you all the luck, desire and energy to achieve this!

Hello, everyone!
It's such a great topic. It has been for me an amazement, I did not expected to find such an information. And a bit of too strong, maybe, too... . Thanks a lot Rastus!!!
There is a possibility to know for sure weather a piece of information is true or not, because our true self lies beyond mind, so what mind cannot do, a more deeper rooted perception can. One just need to let that deeper awareness manifest. And if it is true that we are living special times for awakening, this awareness will manifest much easily than ever. It can be also done by checking vibrations, like Legend said he has done. ("The vibrations I've gotten from reading the article typically hint towards the truthfulness/realization of the information.") Is it so? How did you do it, BirdMan?  

A few years may not be so little. I've been thinking at this in the last weeks and the pattern that in my opinion fits this situation the best is an exponential curve... Like the earthquake Richter scale: the difference between 1 and 2 it's small, between 8 and 9 it's huge. Maybe the more clear the mirrors of our hearts will be, and the more people will open their hearts in the desire to be awakened, the stronger the reflection of spiritual energy into all these mirrors will be. Like anyone's love reflected into all other hearts.  
Interesting to me and really hope giving is that in the last month I've ran into such messages and prophecies, from (apparently, of course) totally distinct sources, and they indicate the same years and very similar happenings. An argument more, that these are true.

It has to be the Divine Mother. God the Father is the witness of the divine play, the Mother is the one who creates and nourishes the creation, bringing it to the stage in which it can reflect the divine.
It's nice to have a Mother, too, isn't it?

P.S. Could you, please, tell me where I can find more information about the period between 2009 and 2012 and about Kalki? I have some about Kalki, I'l try to find their English version.

Nostic, I was also dreaming about founding such a school, in which kids could have real food for the soul, not only talking and too much mechanical learning. And were students can also learn meditation...and how to know themselves and how to face reality and what reality actually is. Can this be tought?... It should be different..., I mean our generations have to find this solution, because there have always been spiritually oriented schools, and still the satisfaction is not entirely there. But diplomas are necessary, if one wants to make a change for himself or for others, he or she has to go though it.