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Hello DH,
Long time no chat!
I appreciate the info. and it helps in this research and learning process. Not that I am a expert on religions of the world, but it definitely broadens my perception and presents a better understanding where these religious, faith, beliefs orginated. Not too mention, every culture has some sort of religious interpretation.
Sorry to hear about your late wife!
Tvos

Hello Tvos,

Greetings!  Yeah, too long no chat!  I was wondering how your Native American Research is going. I've been a comparative religion freak for a long time.  I've been studying shamanism for awhile.  While it's found in about every culture, the Native Americans have a strong tradition.

My wife passed in a traffic accident last summer, hit by a guy whose breaks went out.  It's been hard on everyone, including the poor guy who caused the wreck, but life goes on.

Thanks, DH

[Here's a view:

You know when a relationship is new and fresh and exciting? I think a lot of people mistake this for love. And when things settle down and you start arguing, that's where you'll find love. Because either you won't want to be around that person anymore, or you work with them and compromise out of a mutual love for each other. You can love someone else, but real love in a relationship is an unselfish thing that you naturally receive from the other as you unselfishly give it to them. Without the mutual sharing, it might still be love, but it's not the same thing.

It's not about boosting each other's egos back and forth with presents and comments, or an affinity for someone else, or happy to have found someone as beautiful as you, but a true mutual compassion, caring, and empathy for them no matter the situation.]

This is so true, and it's what I mean when I say that love is is choice and not an emotional response, an infatuation.  You have to choose to set yourself yourself aside to build the mutuality.  Sometimes you sure as hell don't feel like it!

[The real Hotei was an example of giving and sharing what little you have with others. Having compassion. Somehow it's been turned around into getting instead of giving.]

Yeah, look at what some of the TV preachers have done with Jesus.

Most Buddhists wouldn't worship Buddha but he has been worshiped by some as an avatar of Vishnu in India.

TVOS,

I spend a lot of time in Oklahoma (which means "land of the red man").  I'm in a part of the state where there are large groups of Creeks, Choctaws, Cherokees and Seminoles.  It is true that their religious practices vary from tribe to tribe. Most of them now have a blend of Christianity and their own traditions, but there are still a few who adhere to ancient practices.  Native American traditions have also been an interest of mine.  My late wife was a Cherokee.  I have found several similarities between their traditions and my own Welsh origins, as far as creation spirituality goes.

Interesting discussion.

For me, true love is a decision to look out for the welfare of someone else, even when it hurts.  It's not about feelings.  I choose to love someone even if I'm not feeling kindly toward him or her at the moment (or ever).

Hi Zorgblar,

I've read both of Buhlman's books and gotten a lot of help from them.  In addition, he has been kind enough to email  me in the past to answer some specific questions I've had.  He's a neat guy.  I think I he is living in China right now. 

Yes, thanks, that clears it all up!   

DH

Well, for now anyway, my view on things is that in my point of view, God has to be more than 'what is', because time and space is a limitation, and 'being' is a temporary (or temporal) condition, and that is something that God, by my definition of God, cannot have and be God.  A God, yes, but not God.  And panentheism is open-ended enough for me not to be too bogged down with rules as to what is and isn't.  So that's about the closest idea I have about what I think God to be.  Or not to be....    .

. 
Yeah, I can relate.  The seminary I went to in the 70's was the hotbed of Christian panenthesim.  After 30 years it still works pretty good for me, as far as theological systems go.  DH

[believe]

Well, I guess it would depend.  Is it a belief system?  Because to me being openminded to whatever comes along can become a belief system but doesn't necessarily make it so, if one contines to stay open to changing it.
For example, I have a belief system now, and it is the one that works for me.  I give it a name, (Panantheism) but I can go on for hours about some detail of it that I don't agree with it.  So I don't know if it is really a belief system, because I don't necessarily believe in some of it, but it makes sense to me now.  However, I feel that some other parts of my belief system are necessary to my survival here, but that's not a belief either- that's closer to a fear.
So it's not that simple, is it?

Hello CFT,

I don't want too go to far off the lighter side of this thread, but I was curious about your interest in panentheism.  I guess if I had to label a belief system for myself at this point in time, it would be panentheism, although like you, I don't agree with some of what panen. writers espouse.  Basically I like it because the idea is that "God is the universe -- plus some."  Pantheists simply equate creation with God  or Mind or whatever you want to call Spirit, but the panenthesitic idea that "Spirit is even more than that" appeals to me more.  The Universe is so complex I guess I just like the mystery of the idea that God is the universe plus more than we can fathom.

DH

I thought Bruce's Mastering Astral Projection was good.  More practical compared to Astral Dynamics.   It also comes with a CD which helped.

DH

Hello Zorgblar,

I personally liked Ultimate Journey the best of all of his writings.  Some of it may seem a bit "out there" but his sections on focus 27 and helping the "deceased" move on in their personal journeys was helpful to me.  His reflections on relating to his "oversoul" seemed to roughly parallel the ideas of others (like Seth) and were very interesting.

Admittedly, the first time I read the book I thought: "This dude is a great fantasy writer!"  But over time, and with my own experience with Monroe's hemi-sync CDs, a lot of what he related has become real to me.

What do you think about the book?

DH

I've been working on core shamanism for a few months and have just recently been able to do some significant journeying.  I use some drumming cd's that are pretty good.  Thanks for the mp3 link.  I'll give it a try.

DH

Has anyone seen anything on how the shaman's journeys into the three worlds relate specifically to the focus states identified by Robert Monroe and others (F-10, F-21, etc)?

DH

i would just like to know if there is a difference between controlled journey and astral projection. the controlled journey im talking about is the one a shaman would take by i think focusing on area and then as you would normally interact when wake conscience you would then interact from that point onwards as i did once.

I know this topic is pretty old but I have had the same question.  Has anyone seen anything on how what shamans experience in their journeys (lower world, middle world, upper world, etc.) relate to the focus states mentioned by Robert Monroe and others (F-10, F-27, etc)?

DH

Jane Roberts (of Seth fame) wrote a couple of novels about the adventures of an oversoul and its various personalities in an attempt to demonstrate what Seth what talking about on the subjects of reincarnation, higher self, etc.  It lines up somewhat with what others like Robert Monroe have written about the higher self.

http://www.amazon.com/Oversoul-Seven-Trilogy-Education-Further/dp/1878424173/ref=pd_bbs_sr_3?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1195183691&sr=8-3

Meditation is a good way to get in touch with the higher self.  Just begin to focus on "Who am I?"

DH

Have to agree!

Hey -- there is life beyond the internet, too!  We go through different seasons in our lives, and sometimes the change leads us to other places.

DH

That sounds interesting...
Now which of Monroe's CDs would you suggest purchasing for the rest of us that needs a bit of help reaching Focus 10?

The first set in the Gateway series is the only one I've worked with thus far.

I have worked with the Monroe Institute's first set of lessons on getting to Focus 10 for several weeks.  I've had great success. The exercises teach you how to do it without the cd's.  I can get in and out of Focus 10 in seconds pretty much anywhere at any time as long as I don't have someone in my face bugging me.  It was tempting to move on to future lessons in the series, but the patience with the first set has paid off.

Synergy,
The website looks great.  Thanks for the efforts.

Thanks for the update.  I pray that things continue to get better.   

I couldn't see why god would bother lying. How are we supposed to punish him? He can do what he wants. I'd say the institutions dedicated to God often lie. Not God himself.

-AM

Couldn't agree more!

Hey thanks for the link.  That was one of the more balanced reports I've read on NDE.

DH

My quote was "the God of Jesus lives in you".  I believe God (or whatever you want to call God) is in everyone.  The God who guided Jesus to be an enlightened man will do the same for all of us if we desire it.