Messages

I've been held down and had my legs grabbed from behind after separating a few times.  Both times I just focused on staying positive without fear and it went away so I was able to continue the projection without problems.  

I may have but I'm not sure because the memory of the experience wasn't too clear after it happened.  It briefly seemed like I was viewing everything in my room at the same time and I couldn't really tell the direction of what I was looking at.

This is a good overview of some reported benefits of AP by William Buhlman.  

http://www.soultravel.nu/info/ENG-benefits.asp

1.   OBEer,
2.   I've been projecting for a little over a year.  
3.   Not yet.  
4.   No, I can't control my projections well enough yet to do that.  I've seen others when out but I've never bothered to start a conversation with them.  
5.   I've kept track and so far I've had 56 full separations, just this month I separated 16 times already. AP seems to be coming on naturally for me now without using a technique as long as I intend on doing it and get enough sleep.  I also did pretty well with remote viewing when I experimented with it.  

I just separated about 3 times but never saw API since I couldn't make it past my family room.

I've try and go on 4/10 at 1:00 PM eastern time.

I think I've only had 1 real-time projection where everything looked exactly the same as the physical.  It was hard to move and my body felt like it was electrically charged and made of pure energy.  The rest of the time I seem to go right into the astral.  It could be because I'm lazy and haven't started energy work yet and I don't do any visualization techniques.

I think it would be good to have a little on how to properly navigate in the astral and advice on things to do once projected like flying or passing through walls.

Thanks for the responses everyone.  I'm starting to think that whatever it is I'm doing wrong is causing my eyes to strain or open ruining the AP.  I separated 4 times this morning and kept losing it when I would try to concentrate my sight more closely on the environment to try and stabilize the experience.  I was able stare at the ground while walking without problems which seemed to help stabilize the experience a little.  

But maybe this keeps happening since I'm expecting it to be a problem it was never an issue in my earlier projections.  Like when I projected this morning I was unsure and debating about how I should try looking around, while the thought of losing the AP came up.  

Treatise on astral projection is a good guide to start with:  http://www.astralpulse.com/guides/oobe/oobe.htm

Also here is a site that I found with a large list of ap links:  http://hostultra.com/~outofbody/linkindex.html

All my projections have been in the morning, but I try when going to bed at night and set the alarm to try it in the morning.  It just seems easier to get my body asleep and mind awake in the morning.

quote:Let suppose that obes are fake and that the sensation of obe it is just a complex sensation that creates the illusion of "geting out". Maybe you can argue "No, that´s impossible because yesterday i get an obe and i sae a red car in front of my house!And i confirmed it!". Well, i will counter-argue now: maybe it was coincidence (a red car it is not something difficult to guess. Strange it would be to never guess it at least once!).

In your example there is more than just the car color that could be confirmed, which might suggest it's real.  There are many other factors that could suggest this kind of confirmation other than color like the make and design of the car (the difference between a truck and van), any unique characteristics about it, and exactly where the car is parked.  With NDEs vertical perceptions can be very detailed.  

quote:Well, lets go to the next leap on this supposition: if obes are fake (suppose) so we are having non-sense conversations in this forum! If obes are fake maybe we are just feeding in our minds the idea that obes are real. With so many topics and discussions on obes, our mind will create the self-illusion that something must be real! - "Obes are real because there are many people discussing about it"- and we look to the many different topics with a very high degree of credibility (i think that most of the topics here are honest) and our believe will be reinforced.

It's understandable that this could influence people's beliefs about the validity of OBEs.  But how could belief by itself make the actual experience and level of consciousness more real?  Many people describe AP as being indistinguishable from this reality, so how could just belief cause that?  One big problem with this is its common for people with no prior knowledge of AP or NDEs to spontaneously have very real experiences with it.  In these cases belief through discussions like this can't be a factor.  It's very common for children to have spontaneous OBEs but it's unlikely that this is because of belief, because they probably never even heard of OBEs.  With the ideas behind the astral plane it seems that belief can have the opposite effect than the physical.  Since the astral is supposed to be thought and emotion sensitive, if you AP expecting it to be unreal these beliefs will probably be confirmed due to the nature of the environment.  It seems with AP regardless if it's real or hallucination people are accessing something already possible, not something generated by belief alone.  

quote:I like my dreams and they are not real. They dont bring me hapiness to m real pysical life. If obes are unreal like dreams the maximum that i can expect its to feel "nice" when waking up...like in a good dream.

Just because they don't make you feel good doesn't make them unreal.  I'm sure that there are plenty of things in the physical that don't make people feel good or have a large impact on them, but that doesn't make them unreal.  NDEs have been proven to be significantly life changing events, just look at through some experiences and the reported changes that many have after it.

Most of the time when I try to project I leave the TV on with no volume.  The flashing in the room from the screen sort of helps me stay aware.  Just in the last 2 days I've already projected 6 times with it on.

It doesn't look like they have any real arguments against it without making huge assumptions without supporting evidence and ignorance about AP.

Couldn't science of the paranormal just go in General Metaphysics?  There is an area of science that studies the paranormal it's called Parapsychology.  
Here's an on FAQ on it.  
http://www.parapsych.org/faq_file1.html

quote:Originally posted by Star Child

I'm new here, what's this OBE program? Could anyone give me a link and some info on it?

It's here.  

http://www.obejournal.com/

This is a good thread.  I'm not scared of being out of body it's the separation that usually gets me.  As for negatives I just don't think about them so I won't end up creating the experience.  It seems no matter what happens when projecting or dreaming you always come back unharmed.  

Just this morning I had 2 interesting experiences relating to fear.  

In one I separated and stayed on my couch in real-time.  I saw what I thought was the face of a neg so I stayed frozen on the couch still looking at it while slightly panicking.  The face looked square, sort of transparent, and it was kind of wavy.  After waking up I realized that it was only the top of my DVD shelf at the same location that I was seeing (probably with real-time sight) but my mind misinterpreted it.  The top of the shelf looks the same as what I saw.  It was probably wavy and transparent because I was vibrating, the covers were blocking one of my eyes, and there were probably reality fluctuations due to my confusion.  After experiences like this I believe that a lot of what seems scary in the astral is due to our lack of control and understanding.

I had another AP this morning.  I slowly dragged my astral body off of the couch.  I then saw a small green skull come up to me and start making odd noises.  I'm surprised that I didn't panic but I just ignored it and it went away.  Once I got away from my body I could move without problems.  Instead of letting that ruin the experience I was able to get upstairs and outside without any distractions where I got to briefly fly for the 2nd time in an AP.  

I agree.  This is definitely what we need in order to get some confirmed meetings.

I think it does.  I have had 2 decent verifications with it but I've gotten more conclusive undeniable verifications with remote viewing.  If you look into NDEs which are linked they are far more suggestive of the afterlife.

Those sensations coming on are a good sign that you're getting close.  I've experienced all of that and they are normal.  It's important to try and ignore it and just passively observe any sensations that occur and to not get excited.  When I first got into AP I was held back because I would pay too much attention to the sensations.

The first time I had an OBE I heard a really loud roaring noise along with a metallic noise.  Sometimes when I'm separating I just hear physical noises around me getting louder like my computer fan.  With practice those have seemed to go away.  There have been a few times when I heard gun shots and loud bangs.

Exercising seems to help me relax when attempting.  But it does make it hard to sleep if I do it close to going to bed.

[every single one of us]

quote:Originally posted by holy realitythere is a ton to consider before you use the fact that people have similar experiences as proof that they are "real"

First of all, every single one of us has heard the cheesy light at the end of the tunnel saying, and "my life flashed before my eyes" saying, and things like that.

So don't you think if you found yourself exiting your body and thought you were dead you might be just slightly (by which I mean extremely) more prone to having either of the two happen?

Secondly, the brain might interpret a loss of sensory input and a dissociated feeling and try it's hardest to represent it into terms we can understand (which is a theory on why we dream, we are interpreting random memories and neural pathways being activated) and thus it creates a tunnel.

I mean if you are conscious and you start losing your vision you get TUNNEL VISION, so I don't think there is really any significance in people seeing tunnels.

I mean for example a huge portion of American NDE-ers will probably see Jesus, or angels, etc... but if you go over to Asia a lot of them will be seeing Buddha, etc....

This does not prove that Jesus and heaven exists, or that those asians were entering Nirvana. It's just the result of collective culture.

Prior to the 70's most people didn't even know about NDEs.  The term hadn't even been coined yet but NDEs and experiences with the light still occurred before that even though it was far from being mainstream like it is now.  NDEs didn't really get much attention at all until Dr. Raymond Moody came out with a book about them in 75.  These experiences with aspects like the light have been recorded throughout history even going back to one Plato documented.  

Children have similar experiences to adults involving aspects like the light and tunnel.  They are less biased and are less likely to know about anything about NDEs but they still have similar experiences.    

If NDE aspects are hallucinations due to expectations then religious views of the afterlife should be more dominating in these experiences.  Religion has a much larger effect on what people expect from the afterlife then what NDEs do.  Most of what is learned doesn't seem to be affected across different cultures and through more dominating religious views.  You can see the extreme consistencies through different cultures and beliefs by looking at the research conclusions at neardeath.com.  

The more impressive thing is the consistency of information brought back about the afterlife.  The average person probably doesn't know much more about NDEs other than things like the light, tunnel, and meeting dead relatives.  Then there are the differences between AP and NDEs.  During my first AP I knew I was going out of body and thought I was dying but there was no bright light.  

It's true that people from different cultures do meet the beings like Jesus that they believe in.  This isn't always the case sometimes it can be religious figures other than what the person believes in.  Information brought back suggests that this is just because the experience is open to perception and is shaped around each individual.  It's most likely that Christians most commonly see Jesus because they will be more open to it and meeting Jesus will make them the most comfortable.  

I've been getting a lot of realistic hypnotic images lately that I can mentally control and I'm also trying to figure out how to get the images more.  There are a few things I've been doing different lately that I'm guessing might have helped me get these images and the vibes more. I'm not doing physical relaxation and I've mostly been working on keeping my eyes relaxed so my focus isn't centered behind them.  I noticed that they usually happen for me right before the vibes come.

This morning I got hypnotic images of a forest and then one of my ceiling zoomed in.  The other day I saw a brick wall with a hole in it and the sun was shining through, right after that I had an OBE.  

quote:Originally posted by Blackstream

The only things that aren't affected by paralysis are eye movement and breathing (some scientific studies have been done on this where lucid dreamers signaled with eye movements from their sleep).

That's odd because I get SP so often that now during it I can slightly move my legs and neck.  Sometimes I have to bring myself out of it by kicking one leg with the other that can move.