Messages

Congrats Unison.
I did the same type of thing, i started a journal in hopes of getting more lucid dreams and within a few weeks i had about 3. I recently changed this to a phasing journal but so far i havn't had much luck.

Keep it up, and i hope it continues paying off for you.

>RooJ

people...dont you get it...

the past and future are IDEAS. Nothing more. The only real truth is Now.

I agree in some ways with Major Tom. Its simply the wording of the post which basically states "my idea IS right, and i need to educate you". Im sure it wasnt meant like that, and as an idea its quite solid. Its still possible however to clarify that events viewed while projecting to the past are accurate. Pick a point in history you know little about (but thats well documented) and then after projecting there, compare details viewed to details that actually took place. This of course couldn't be done for the creation of the pyramids .

THAT is why its so hard to project into the past/future. What you are seeing could just as easily be a creation of your own mind. Theres literally no difference.

I think you can also add the present into that, the second you project to what you think is the present your running on the same basic creation processes you would be if you thought you were projecting to the past, you see in alot of respects what you expect to see. I think that could be a factor in why its hard to get solid results in experiments.

As for the original post, ive never projected or even had lucid dreams beyond the confines of my bed. Ive always wondered if it would be easier to project in a sensory deprivation tank, anyone tried them?

>RooJ

It comes down to imagination, i have quite a powerful imagination and dont think id ever get bored with the gift you have.
This isnt just like one great video game, this is an infinite amount of different situations, any place you see on tv, any person you ever wanted to meet. With a gift like the ability to project whenever you want (which im guessing you have) you could learn much of the astral... theres plenty of experiments you could do that could give us all lots of insight into the workings of all this.

Ill likely post when ive had time to think more about your post.

>RooJ

P.S. Your welcome to share some of your techniques, it would be interesting to see what you do to project so frequently.

Hey, cool experience, its good to see some of us are on a roll (me not included). Just more motivation to up my practices though. Dont suppose you saw any strange patterns at any point when you were traveling Ludicrous speed   ?
I was also wondering about something else:

I wandered around feeling like I was on the edge of phasing, I didnt feel totally there.

This would be an f1/f2 overlay experience then? When you found yourself at the school was that via overlay or did you actually enter the scene?

Thanks

>RooJ

Im not really sure on your question as ive never really put much effort into learning about the different astral planes. Dont quote me on it but I think frank stated that all these planes where actually found in F2oC of the phasing model, so it would be hard to place F4oC from that perspective (i guess it wouldnt be found in the astral planes).

Also, I dont want anyone telling me Im acting like a mystic or something

I really dont get the whole anti-mystic movement thats going on. Ive never approached projection in a mystical sense and ive never had the urge to slander anyone (thats not aimed at you NickJW). You can see its gone to far when people become fearful of asking questions incase they get "labeled" as a mystic.

In franks model F4 is the highest (I dont think frank would use the word "highest") it goes. I tend not to follow models exactly as there's still so much we dont know. If frank turns out to be wrong in some ways about F4 being a limit then it might unnesessarily hamper possibilities. I try not to actively imagine barriers infront of me that might not exist. However saying that, Frank has done some excellent work laying down the foundations for many of us to make great progress so all credit to him .

Hope that in some way helps, good luck.

>RooJ

Not sure on the location of beating, i tend to ignore it in most cases as to me it seems counter-productive, i associate it with losing the experience due to excitement . Thanks for the advice however, depending on my progress I may look into chakra's in the future, but for now im approaching it from a slightly different angle.

Yeah, your view of how im currently going about it seems right. Im basically allowing myself to go through the normal processes before sleep but remaining aware. Eventually when im at the stage of images being very vivid ill go about experimenting and trying to enter them. Looking back over some of my bookmarked posts (before phasing had really kicked in) it seems alot of people where already having these experiences. Interesting thing is ive been reading alot about how people "willed themselves in", or how they took hold of an object in the image and just pulled themselves in. Just means my "to try" list is getting bigger .

>RooJ

Hey Steve,
It seems im at the same point as you as far as phasing goes. I can get to the border of sleep quite quickly and easily, but once there i don't seem to get very far. For the last few sessions ive had situations where i was close to entering imagery, but the sudden realisation that the transition is happening inevitably makes me lose it, I kinda flinch with excitement and it drags me out of the state.

As far as the exact process however, I tend to look at more as an ability to dissociate yourself from the physical. Like grasping a sense of being completely out of normal reality in both mental orientation or positioning, as well as completely ignoring the senses.

I can completely relate to this, the few experiences ive had that saw me almost entering imagery happened when, for a second or two i just let everything go, like really sunk my attention deep into the image as if it was my only reality (its actually hard to explain).

Good luck steve and keep us posted on your progress, any breakthroughs you have will likely help others like myself .

>RooJ

Thats a strange experience, Id agree that maybe your just not meant to know right now.

I havn't really thought to ask people questions like that. I have had conversations in lucid dreams were people have told me crazy things though. Such as once when I had a cloaked guy who spent a good 5 mins of my dream telling me that earth was once a moon of jupiter and somehow, (something to do with saturn), it was dragged away from jupiter and ended up in its current orbit, then ice on the planet melted kick starting life.

I look forward to other peoples responses on the subject though, as i find conversations like these in altered states very interesting.

>RooJ

Yeah i suppose everyone has to find there own way, I feel im definitely making some progress though. During my last attempt a few hours ago i became frustrated at the way the images were appearing 2d, (i was in later hypnogogic stages, so with some creative power) I imagined falling through a cuboid shaped tunnel, each side being made out of a large elongated TV screen. This worked, and at first all 4 had different random images on, but very quickly all the images syncronized and became one large image between them. The image was of grass, and quickly the connections between the screens dissapeared and for a split second i was free falling headfirst towards the ground no longer in a cuboid tunnel but actually falling. This made me jolt awake .
Only a few minutes after the above happened, i was viewing images of a dark room. As i watched, the room began to darken more as i became engrossed in it and my mind shut out the light from the window of the room i was trying to phase in. Once again on realising that i was starting to shut the real world out and enter the image i quickly snapped out of it.

At least i know what i need to work on eh.

>RooJ

To be honest, ive never really been interested in the whole chakra thing, and maybe because of that i dont usually feel it.
Ive had increases in heartbeat, usually due to seeing really cool imagery and thinking i was on the verge of phasing.
Once i get deep enough into hypnogogia, when im seeing really clear images, then i move to trying to enter them(usually any deeper and im asleep). The only vibrations ive had happened in the later more clearer stages of hypnogogia.

Hope this helps

>RooJ

Hi Sleepwacker,
Cool experiences. Sleep paralysis seems to be pretty common, the body is naturally paralyzed during sleep to avoid you acting out dreams. As far as i know it seems you simply beat your body to a waking state, your mentally conscious but your body is still in a sleep state.

There isnt anything to worry about, i believe you simply have to wait it out (unless someone else knows methods that help relieve it?).
>RooJ

Thanks for the reply, I look forward to more accounts of phasing experiences from you.
I had a good attempt last night, everything was going well and i was getting really good imagery. At the point where i felt i was starting to really enter the imagery, and my field of vision was growing to take up my full sight, i was interupted by hypnic jerks. This happened 3 times in about 5 minutes and contributed to me ending the practice .
Ever had these during your experiences?

Thanks

>RooJ

knightlight,
Congrats.. amazing experience.. Did you remain fully lucid the entire time?
Im at a similar stage as you, getting really good hypnogogic imagery every practice, so hopefully i'll be next .

Thanks for sharing

>RooJ

Ive had a number of dying dreams, but the one that stands out most to me was a long dream that ended in me running away from a gunman.
As i ran i was shot in the back of the neck, then in the back of the head, i felt no pain, as i fell and hit the floor.
Id never had problems with death dreams before, but I found this one quite distressing. My vision slowly blurred and it then became completely dark, I thought I was fighting to stay alive but in reality i was simply fighting to stay in the dream. I could feel my awareness, my conciousness slipping away (like waking out of a lucid dream) and i tried my best to focus but i couldnt beat it, it wasnt within my control. I dont think i really thought much of anything during this, I didnt question what was happening i just kinda panicked and didn't want to die.
Anyways i cant remember if i woke after that or whether i moved onto another dream.

Telos, there are many examples (some quite gruesome) of dream dying experiences here:

http://www.astralpulse.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=9045

Thought you might find them interesting.

>RooJ

Hi Giselle,
I dont have any links to the arm trick but its easy enough to describe:

Basically you just hold your forearm perpendicular to the bed. So from your elbow, your arm will be going straight up into the air (go for a nice balance and you wont actually feel like your holding it up). This may sound annoying but after a few seconds you forget about it being that way and it really doesnt bother your concentration or engagement in rundowns (in my experience).
Now the reason this is used is so if you drift off to sleep your arm will fall and wake you, but i've found i can get much deeper into hypnogogic imagery without falling asleep, like somehow when you have your arm up your brain knows you dont want to completely fall asleep :S.
Im aware that if you phase while doing this your arm is likely to fall just the same, but im just happy with the practice of getting that deep.

The writer Robert Louis Stevenson was one famous person to use this trick (he used it when writing books), here's an extract from "Exploring the world of lucid dreaming" by Stephen Laberge:

At least one well-known man of letters, the writer Robert Louis Stevenson, created his own dream workshop replete with assistants-his "brownies," as he called them, who helped him produce many of his most famous works.

<Part deleted>

Stevenson was not explicit about whether his brownies were characters of lucid dreams. It appears from his reports that they were mental images that appeared during lucid hypnagogic reverie. The technique the writer used was to lie in bed with his forearm perpendicular to the mattress. He found that he could drift easily into his familiar fantasy workshop, and if he fell into a deeper sleep, his forearm would fall to the mattress and awaken him. Stevenson credited his brownies with coming up with the plot for his famous story, the strange case of Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde.

I hope you find this technique useful as i find it invaluable, it really has helped me alot and is worth putting into practice.

>RooJ

From one point of view it can seem to be harder... but id say it could actually make it easier. For instance if you practice lucid dreaming using methods such as reality checks, you just need to focus on real life events. An extreme example (and one which would likely annoy you greatly) would be to reality check everytime you passed through a doorway. In more realistic and less mystical dreams you'll likely do this more, which would increase your chances of lucid dreams.

For people like me who have a mixture of dreams, its harder to pin down "weaknesses" in dreaming to exploit with reality checks. If i were you id pick something that happens often in your dreams (probebly something that happens alot in life, as your dreams are more realistic) then id focus on reality checking and see if it gives you any breakthroughs.

Good Luck,

>RooJ

I know this topic has came up a few times before, but this is the stage causing me most problems. If possible i want to know others findings on this:

Recently ive been exploring the stages building up to F2 (or sleep) in hopes of finding an easier way to phase. The stages for me seem to be:

Laying awake - usually thinking about things conciously

Hypnogogia stage1 - a light hypnogogia, i usually hear the odd sound and see colours and blobs of light aswell as the occasional face etc.

Hypnogogia stage2 - after a certain amount of time in stage1 i find i get much stronger and clearer images that last a few seconds before switching like a slideshow.

Usually if i stay too long in stage2 i lose conciousness for a small amount of time. When i come back round I feel really groggy/tired and usually give up practice for sleep.

My guess is that stage2 in the above list is the gateway to phasing (at least for me).. Also does anyone have any good idea's on what methods i could use once at this stage. I manage to get there every night but havn't found a way of taking advantage of this , Ive had a few close calls but nothing more.

Thanks for your patience

>RooJ

Congrats Guthwulf!,

First ones usually the hardest, keep up practice and you'll be having them regularly in no time .
Its a great feeling finally experiencing it for yourself, i remember my frustration reading peoples accounts of lucid dreams and wondering what it felt like.

before it was in normal, and it suddenly became high definition?

Yep.. when going from normal dreaming to a lucid dream theres a definite shift that almost takes your breath away. Everything suddenly becomes crisp and clear. When i origional speculated at what lucid dreams would be like (before id had one) i always thought back to my dreams and the way they were kinda dull etc. In actual fact they seem (at least when your experiencing them) to be almost perfect copies of the real world.

Anyways, congrats again,

>RooJ

Im the same, dont know anyone interested in the subject. Ive brought up lucid dreams a few times with friends but even then its obvious they simply dont want to listen. Its strange actually, im not sure whether they simply dont believe me, or more likely are just not interested. I cant understand how someone could hear about lucid dreaming and not be interested .

>RooJ

Hi Shinobi,
I too have thought about this subject alot in the last couple of days.
Id say my primary focus was more visual then anything else but i tend to have a balance (according to tests ive done).

For the last few weeks ive been falling alseep during practices, and in the last few days have reverted back to using the arm trick to stay awake. Anyways ive noticed that after a certain period of time i get very vivid imagery without having to focus on it, but the imagery will only last for a few seconds before switching, kinda like a slideshow. So for a second or two ill get an image of a landscape and then without warning it changes to a closeup of wallpaper etc. Ive found that if i try to focus and hold these images they'll stay for slightly longer but will eventually (after only a few seconds more) fade out into a blur and make way for others.

So ive now decided not to focus on imagery at all, but instead allow the normal imagery to take hold and then act on it when it appears. An example:
Last night while practicing i got a very vivid image of a lake with an inflatable boat at the shore. I ran my hands down the side of the boat and felt the rubber against my fingers and heard that friction sound you get. Now doing this i found that the image stayed there for longer, as it did when trying to just hold the image, but i find it much easier to imagine sounds and the feel of textures then i do keeping an image in mind. Also i found i almost entered the image and phased but excitement stopped the attempt.

Another trick ive found works for me is the use of kinesthetics. About 2 days ago while trying to phase i had an image of a room with an object on a table infront of me. Before the image had chance to dissapear i imagined walking towards and around it, as i did it took on a 3d effect and i realised id entered the image for a split second (sadly this startled me out of it). This experience also brought on what i believe to be "the vibrations" but as id never experienced them before i wasnt sure.

So far I havn't really experimented with gustatory or olfactory senses as they dont really play a major role for me in my experiences (only in extreme circumstances such as when i notice a really potent smell etc.)

Keep up the experimenting and be sure to update us on any breakthrough's.

>RooJ

I would have the same opinion no matter were in the world this had taken place.

My overall point is though that London/England is the next one on the list for cities that will soon be infested with Fear.

I dont doubt that, but as the shooting happened just a day after 4 attempted bombings, and only 2 weeks after 4 successful ones i would expect a small amount of fear and suspicion.

If armoured policemen came at me with guns, telling me to 'stop' even though I dont speak their language well, my impulse would be, well to run. I dont like men with guns near me.

Then i feel for you, because no matter where you are in the world if an officer signals to you to stop and put your hands in the air you can expect consequences if you just "run away".

Im going to ignore the baggy clothes statement because its simply stupid .

I dont think he was really processing all that was going on in his brain, a sudden panic attack does that to a person.

It doesnt make any difference what was going through his mind, the police have no way of seeing that. He could of just as easily been running looking for the nearest crowded area to set off a bomb vest. I think it helps to look at every aspect of this, yeah its sad the guy was killed, but if your pursuing a guy that came out of a house watched for links to terrorism, who fails to stop and sprints for the nearest crowded train.. well what would you be thinking?

I dont think we should like 'attack' the police who did it, but I think holding him down arms out, and shooting him 5 times in the chest was quite quite quite unnessacary.

The reason they opened fire was because theres more ways to set off explosives then using your arms to reach to a bomb vest. They can be linked to hand devices etc. Shooting him 5 or 6 times in the head WAS unnessesary, but you often find that whether you shoot someone once or 6 times in the head it tends to have the same outcome for the victim.
I have no doubt the officer who shot him believed at that moment that he was saving his own, his colleagues and the lives of everyone on that train.

>RooJ

PS, I realise re-reading the above that it can come over as somewhat aggressive and its not meant to, so please dont take offence by anything ... just my opinions.

The reason they shot the guy was because firstly.. he came out of a house that was already being watched because of links to terrorism... He was wearing a rather large padded jacket... After following him and asking him to stop (because they saw he was headed for a train) the guy apparently ran.
Now firstly, in a city that was recently bombed, if 3 armed police suspect you of being a suicide bomber and ask you to stop the last thing you want to do is run onto a crowded train.

Of course it was a misunderstanding, but it sends a message to everybody: the london police are out to kill, and you better hope they got 20/20 vision because if they suspect you of anything, they will
1) shoot you at a distance
or
2) chase you down and shoot you at point blank range

Im going to presume you were being sarcastic, but if not i dont think it takes me to point out that your talking out your %&* here. If he had of been a suicide bomber the police would of been criticised for not shooting him just the same. They didnt just shoot him, they asked him to stop... at the point where he was on the train in my opinion they were out of options, if he had a bomb linked to some hand device he could potentially set it off at any time. It was a hard choice, and i really feel for the officer that had to make it, just as i do for the victim and his friends and family.

A very unfortunate set of circumstances i suppose.

>RooJ

Hey lee,
Cool dream, ive had a few like that.. The type where you wake and have that weird feeling from the dream hanging around most of the day.
Id love to try and guess at what the dream meant, but ive never been the type of person to try and work out what dreams mean, probebly that you watch too much x-files or something .

>RooJ

Kazbadan,
As you said, computers freezing can be caused by almost anything. I had it happening to my machine not so long back, i eventually found the problem was my cd drive. One of the times it locked up i opened up the pc and pulled the ide cable from the cd drive, instantly started working again.
I would suggest creating a windows 98 boot disk from http://www.bootdisk.com, then booting up with it. If it freezes when your using the boot disk you can count out a software issue.

You can also get lots of free software from www.snapfiles.com including tools to check for memory errors and for general system maintenance.
>RooJ

You all have to try this... rollercoaster flying.
I recently went to flamingo land (theme park) which greatly reinforced my love for fast rollercoasters. During a very long lucid dream today i decided i would fly (before that i was just following the dream lucidly). Mid-flight i suddenly thought about my enjoyment of rollercoasters and decided to try and replicate the experience. Do the following:
Fly like neo, put your hands beside your body and fly headfirst, get a decent height and then dive fast towards the ground, remember to arch your body as you get closer to the ground in order to arc back up into the air. Aswell as drops theres also loops, corkscrews etc.
I was almost addicted, did this for a good 5 minutes, flying fast between tree's and around chimneys, down the sides of house roof's touching the guttering as i passed . Lots of fun and the sensations are the same, feel of the air against you and i also had that feeling you get in your stomach when you drop fast. It eventually ended just as i was flying really high to try a much faster fall ...

I think its safe to say Ive found my dream hobby.

>RooJ