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[Originally posted by weagle:]

quote:Originally posted by weagle:
Can you actually do the same scenario that is stare at objects  as you described while conscious or it has to be while sleeping?

I try and do this while I am in a trance-like state.  Lately, I've also done this when I first lay down at night.

You see, when I first lay down, I've found that when I immedietely close my eyes and try to relax, it takes me a long time.  Instead, I am leaving my physical eyes OPEN but I don't look at anything in particular.  I simply stare out into the blackness of my bedroom.  The more relaxed I get, the more my eyes begin to close.....I am aware that my eyes are closing, and when they do, I keep my mind focused.

So by the time my eyes are closing/closed on their own, my mind is pretty relaxed and my body is nearing sleep.  I then begin to bring my conscious awareness closer to the astral realm by watching the hypnogic imagery that passes before me.  When images or scenes begin to stay longer in my site of vision, I stare at them, which only further engulfs me into this altered state of reality.

I hope that made sense, and doesn't come off like a bunch of new age garbage!  It's easier done than said, for me!


Keep smiling,

Jeff Mash, Founder and Editor
MyJokeMail.com - Jokes and Humor
http://myjokemail.com

Thanks for posting that experience.  I look forward to hearing more from you in the future!


Keep smiling,

Jeff Mash, Founder and Editor
MyJokeMail.com - Jokes and Humor
http://myjokemail.com

quote:
"Sometimes patients describe looking down on their own bodies, and that experience is actually an aura or a warning that a seizure is about to occur," said Dr. Cindy Kubu, a neuropsychologist at the Cleveland Clinic Foundation. She has worked with patients with epilepsy for more than a decade.

That sentence alone made me roll my eyes and laugh.  It neevr ceases to amaze me what the scientific community will grasp at in order to explain the inexplainable.


Keep smiling,

Jeff Mash, Founder and Editor
MyJokeMail.com - Jokes and Humor
http://myjokemail.com

[Originally posted by Frank:]

quote:Originally posted by Frank:
I've read and experienced the so-called melting hands phenomenon. But I'm sure I have read somewhere that, under some circumstances, they don't.

It's just that this morning, I was on my 3rd projection and I think my physical body wanted me back for some reason (maybe it was missing me ). I felt my clarity fading and the idea of glancing at your hands for a moment, that I'd read in AD, suddenly popped into mind. So I looked at my hands, and looked, and looked, but nothing melted. Ideas anyone?

Yours,
Frank

I have had experiences with both, Frank.  There have been times when they have melted, and other times when they didn't.  I never really considered a reason why.  I just lumped it in the same category of "Why was my furtniture slightly out of place last time I projected and this time it looked fine?"  

What are your thoughts on this?  Do you think that sometimes we are more grounded in an "astral body" which appears more stable?  Maybe when we have a strong pull with the physical body, it's tougher to make them dissolve.....whereas in higher realms, where sometimes an astral body is completely discarded, this melting phase is easier to observe.

Just tossing out theories!


Keep smiling,

Jeff Mash, Founder and Editor
MyJokeMail.com - Jokes and Humor
http://myjokemail.com

[Originally posted by weagle:]

quote:Originally posted by weagle:
jeff what is the difference between obe and a virtual obe?  Like what exactly happens when you stare at something does your body start to vibrate and the scenary changes?  Do you hear any sounds like a pop/click/noise sound I know when one seperates from the body a noise sound happens.

I'm sure I would hear sounds if I focus on them.  Basically, what happens is that, after staring at something, I am drawn into a black void.  I literally feel motion.  If I were to remain calm and focused, I could probably step right into an astral realm.

Instead, I always become aware that my physical body is laying in bed.  I then roll out of my body onto the floor and crawl away from it.  About 10-12 feet away, my sight kicks in.

Keep in mind that when I "stare" at something, I am not aggressively doing it.  My physical eyes are not trying to focus on an image to make it clearer.  It's more of a passive observation of something.

For example, sit in front of a blank wall.  Now put an object (cup, phone, etc) in front of the wall about 8 inches away.  Now stare at the wall but be aware of the object.  I don't know about you, but I start to space out a bit, and before I know it, I'm no longer aware that I'm even staring at the wall.  I'm simply in my own little world, aware of the wall and object, but my eyes are pretty relaxed.

This is what it's like for me when I try to project, except instead of an object in front of a wall, it's an image in front of a black canvas of darkness.  I'm aware of the image/object, but I continue staring passively.

Eventually, you're so engulfed in that state of mind that your body isn't even in your thoughts.  You start to feel motion and, as long as you're calm, you can shift right into a projection.

Hope that helps!




Keep smiling,

Jeff Mash, Founder and Editor
MyJokeMail.com - Jokes and Humor
http://myjokemail.com

Right on.  Let me know how it goes!


Keep smiling,

Jeff Mash, Founder and Editor
MyJokeMail.com - Jokes and Humor
http://myjokemail.com

[Originally posted by Patty:]

quote:Originally posted by Patty:
Jeff - any good tips on how to increase conscious awareness? Buhlman's tips don't work for me.

Patty.....

The main technique that I have used in dreams is to STARE at something.  100% of the time when I do this, my awareness increases instantly and I am pulled out of my dream and into my OBE.  

This staring technique is similiar to the same technique I do from a meditative state.  While looking at the hypnogogic imagery, I detach myself and stare at these images until eventually, I become so engulfed in the experience that it "pulls me" into them.

Note: although this staring technique from a dream environment works every time for me, the HARD part is getting myself to remember to stare at something!  In the past while dreaming, I usually did this when I was reading something.  I would have a book or newspaper in front of me......then suddenly, while reading, I told myself to just stare at it.  This automatically increased my lucidity, the dream environment faded, and I found myself in a projection!

Hope that helps!


Keep smiling,

Jeff Mash, Founder and Editor
MyJokeMail.com - Jokes and Humor
http://myjokemail.com

I believe the only difference between what you have experienced and what you call a full-blown OBE is your level of conscious awareness.  

For example, let's just say for arguements sake that you were only dreaming.  I have had many dreams which 'seemed' real....which suddenly forced my awareness to increase and BOOM!  I found myself out of body!  

Why did that happen?  Simply because while dreaming, my awareness wasn't that clear.  The experience was just real enough for me to follow along, but not real enough for me to interact with anything.  Once I started to become aware, I found myself out of my body with my full waking consciousness with me.

Think of it this way.  Right now, as you are reading this, you think of yourself in the physical world.  So where is this astral world right now?  Does it not exist?  Of course it does.  So why aren't you able to see and interact in this astral world right now?  Simply because you aren't aware of it!  By relaxing our bodies and meditating, we bring ourselves closer to this threshold where we can project into this other world (which is really layered right on top of the physical world).

Just my two cents!


Keep smiling,

Jeff Mash, Founder and Editor
MyJokeMail.com - Jokes and Humor
http://myjokemail.com

I know exactly what you're talking about.  Many times for me, I go throughout the day just anticipating the chance to lay down and have an OBE.  Then, 10 hours later when I get that chance, I've noticed that my desire has significantly dwindled!

This is why one of the key things to having a successful projection is to have a strong desire!  I find that this takes immersing yourself in OBE-related things....like reading this board everyday, reading books on the subject, working on techniques every time you lay down, etc.

By doing that, you will slowly program yourself to always desire an OBE and increase your chances of having them more frequently.


Keep smiling,

Jeff Mash, Founder and Editor
MyJokeMail.com - Jokes and Humor
http://myjokemail.com

[Originally posted by kifyre:]

quote:Originally posted by kifyre:
Question (1) - Are there people out there who can breath as easily through their nose as their mouth while they're lying on their back?

Do you snore?  I think a lot of people who snore may have this problem.  I woudn't know though, because I sleep as quiet as a dead person.  


Keep smiling,

Jeff Mash, Founder and Editor
MyJokeMail.com - Jokes and Humor
http://myjokemail.com

[Originally posted by andy:]

quote:Originally posted by andy:
For humor check out jeffs joke page,personally I find  most of it funny."
MyJokeMail.com

May peace be with you!

Thanks for the endorsement, Andy!  I'm glad I could provide free (and often original) humor to so many people.

Patty, I'm sorry to hear about you being down.  I know how draining having kids could be.  Here is a little something that I think you will enjoy.  It's from a book I wrote called "Demented Thoughts" which I still have to get published somehow:

Never Give Up

You know the old saying, "Don't ever give up?" Well, boy, is that a good saying to remember. I remember one time, my daddy told me that I should always follow through with whatever I did, never leave a job half finished.

So one day, I decided to surprise him by playing mechanic on his brand new car. He was always so proud of this car, like it was a part of the family. `What better way to show my love for my father than by doing something good to his car' I thought.

At first I was only going to reprogram his radio settings to all the cool stations (since all daddy listened to was boring music). But once I finished replacing his stereo settings, I began to notice many other things wrong with his car.

For example.....his brand new paint job was way too bright. That would surely attract the attention of every highway patrol officer in the county. I had to take care of that, and I had to do it fast. With no other option, I took a black can of spray paint and began to work my magic. I was only able to repaint the passenger side door before the spray paint was all used up. `Crap' I thought. `Nothing I can do about that now.'

Then, I noticed that his tires were filled up with way too much air. Heaven knows what would have happened if I didn't take care of that problem. Not wanting to let too much air out of his tires, but not knowing how to do it, I decided to put on my thinking cap. Then an idea occurred to me that would have made Einstein marvel at the sheer brilliance. I decided to take a small razor blade and make tiny little incisions on the surface of his tires. Yes, I know what your thinking: `That won't do anything.' But I assure you, after a couple hours, those tires were flatter than a pancake.

I was just about finished, but something *still* didn't appear right. Then it dawned on me......what better way to make daddy happy then by making his car go faster? It was almost time for him to go on his afternoon drive, so I had to think quickly. Being the smart kid that I am, I knew that the heavier an object was, the more energy it would take for it to move. So therefore, if I made his car lighter, it would go faster. Gosh, sometimes I shock myself with my superior intellect.

With no time to spare, I opened my daddy's hood, and you will never believe what I saw. Wires. Nothing but lots and lots of wires. No wonder daddy always drove that precious car very slowly. He used to tell me that he drove slow so that his car wouldn't get scratched, but now I know that this was just an excuse. He just didn't want to tell me that his car was too heavy to go any faster. So you can imagine what I did next. That's right. I began to yank out every wire I could see. Some were tougher to get out, so I had to cut them, but thank goodness, after 10 minutes, there wasn't a single wire left in that engine.

And you know what the best part was? The best part was watching my father's reaction as he walked into the garage. First, his face turned white, almost as if every drop of blood quickly left his body. Then his mouth fell open like a sack of bricks. Right before he fainted, all he kept saying as he lost consciousness was, "You......you......you......"

That's right dad. It's your son, and you don't need to thank me. Honestly, it was my pleasure.

But after seeing his limp, unconscious body laying on the floor of my garage, I started to think that playing mechanic wasn't such a good idea. I walked over to him, looked at his motionless body, and suddenly realized: Oh goody, now I get to play surgical doctor! Now where did I leave my razor blade scalpel?




Keep smiling,

Jeff Mash, Founder and Editor
MyJokeMail.com - Jokes and Humor
http://myjokemail.com

PATTYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY

I missed ya!  Hurry up and get your astral butt back in here!  


Keep smiling,

Jeff Mash, Founder and Editor
MyJokeMail.com - Jokes and Humor
http://myjokemail.com

[Originally posted by fallnangel77:]

quote:Originally posted by fallnangel77:
It is very difficult to do at night, if not impossible, unless you are one that sleeps during the day and is awake at night. You should try during the morning or afternoon and you should have a lot more luck. Increasing your concentration will help a lot as well, but it will still be easier to do during the day.

Although I understand what FallnAngel is saying here, I have to point something out.

Although it may be EASIER to practice during the morning (due to your body being extra relaxed from a few hours of sleep), this in no way should discourage you from trying at night.

I ALWAYS practice my techniques at night.  After all, even though you usually fall asleep, it's a perfect opportunity to get familiar with the way our thoughts swim around in our heads, and how we can slowly quiet them down.  Every time you lay down, you can use that opportunity to practice your OBE induction techniques.  You'll be able to get to Focus 10 easier and, as Frank mentions, direct your thoughts higher up the "consciousness cone."

But I do agree with FallenAngel....practicing at night usually results in a failed projection attempt; but each time you think you fail, you're actually learning from your experience and making internal corrections for the next time!  Best of luck...



Keep smiling,

Jeff Mash, Founder and Editor
MyJokeMail.com - Jokes and Humor
http://myjokemail.com

I can't even count how many experiences I've had where I've had blurry and/or no vision while projecting.  What I usually do in this instance is:

1) Make sure I am calm, take a few astral breaths, and imagine my vision getting clearer with each inhale.  Almost as if drawing energy up through yourself to your vision.

2) Requesting "Clarity now" while out.  

I usually do both of these at the same time, and my vision fades in without anymore problems.


Keep smiling,

Jeff Mash, Founder and Editor
MyJokeMail.com - Jokes and Humor
http://myjokemail.com

[Originally posted by Frank:]

quote:Originally posted by Frank:

quote:Originally posted by overworked:
I've noticed that at some point during my meditation that the blackness behind my eyes seems to expand.  One time the blackness seemed to become more denser and almost look as though it was solidifying.

Where exactly does this sensation fall within the steps of projecting?

Jeff_M should relate pretty well to this as he describes the blackness in very much the same way. With me, I describe it as taking on a 3D effect. This is the start of the projection process (in more of a modern-day sense).

Hi Frank and Overworked!

Sorry I haven't been around for the last few days.  The 8th was my 27th birthday.  The 9th was my anniversary.....and the 10th kept me pretty occupied with my new online Movie I made for my website.

I can't really add to what Frank said.  I too see the blackness before my eyes start to coagulate into dense shapes.  This only happens when I am extremely relaxed AND my normal, day-to-day thoughts are quiet.

Like Frank said, if you can passively hold this image, you can use it as an astral doorway to step into.  As for me, I usually fall asleep around this stage (because again, in order to be at this stage, you're already incredibly relaxed).  However, as long as I've properly affirmed my intention to OBE, I usually will wake up sometime later and roll out of my body into the Real Time Zone.

Keep trying.  You're almost there, my friend!


Keep smiling,

Jeff Mash, Founder and Editor
MyJokeMail.com - Jokes and Humor
http://myjokemail.com

In case anyone is interested, I made the following movie:

For DSL and Cable connections:
http://myjokemail.com/movie/WeRemember_Med.wmv

For 56K connections:
http://myjokemail.com/movie/WeRemember_Low.wmv

Let me know what you think.  


Keep smiling,

Jeff Mash, Founder and Editor
MyJokeMail.com - Jokes and Humor
http://myjokemail.com

Coming from a born again Christian standpoint who is n o longer a practicer of the faith, I would like to tell you a little example from my experience.

My parents are strict, bible-thumping born again Christians.  The ironic part is that it was ME who converted them and turned them onto it.  However, since I started having OBE's, my complete spiritual outlook has been turned upside down.  

Now, I still have to deal with the whole family/religion thing.  However, whenever I see my family, I don't act rebellious or tell them that I don't believe in their traditions anymore.  I go along with it.

The Bible says, "When in Rome, do as the Romans do."  I think that's in there somewhere, right?  Either way, would it HURT you to go along with your confirmation for the sake of your family?  It sounds like you are spiritually developed enough to know that this is simply a tradition, and it won't hinder you in any way concerning your beliefs.

So if you're able to, avoid strife and dissention amongst your family and do the confirmation.....but in your heart, know that you're doing this out of love for your family and not out of a spiritual desire.  

But I am not Catholic so I don't know if that is a good suggestion.  Just trying to put in my two cents.


Keep smiling,

Jeff Mash, Founder and Editor
MyJokeMail.com - Jokes and Humor
http://myjokemail.com

[Originally posted by Tisha:]

quote:Originally posted by Tisha:
My "blackness behind my eyes" develops a little hole of grey white light in the middle, and then that hole expands in a wobbly shifty kind of way before disappearing in about 2 seconds.  Then the process starts over.  

It's almost as if it is inviting me to step on through it.  I've never been successful at doing this . . . but then again, I haven't tried that hard.

Tisha, this happens to me occasionally too!  Except by the time it happens, instead of going along with it, my mind goes, "Oh hey, that little light looks like its getting bigger!"

And with that, it disappears and I am back in the darkness!  Whenever I get to that stage though, I'm consciously aware that I am on the right path.  This is because I am now visually experiencing things that I am not creating, and I recognize that fact.  If I allow myself to remain calm, I go further and further without losing the image.


Keep smiling,

Jeff Mash, Founder and Editor
MyJokeMail.com - Jokes and Humor
http://myjokemail.com

[Originally posted by Frank:]

quote:Originally posted by Frank:
Jeff, yes, it's the point where it becomes 3D that you are right on the edge. I think you are very much more "visual" than a lot of us. All I see when I close my eyes is blackness. My experience on this is more like Xehupatl's desciption of it being in one's head. But there have been times when all I have seen is blackness, but then the blackness has taken on a 3D effect.

Frank,

I know what you mean.  When I FIRST lay down, all I see is blackness with occasional flickers of light.  I attribute that to after image effects...something we all experience after closing our eyes after using them all day long.

When you said, "the blackness has taken on a 3D effect," this is EXACTLY what I am referring to!  Although I didn't quite word it that way.  This blackness would start to "clump" sometimes into a shape.  This shape, when I stare at it, begins to draw me into it.  I believe it is at this moment that, as long as I go with it, I continue to shift into the astral realm.

Unfortunately, during this "drawing in process,"  I usually become aware of it happening, and I'm back in the RTZ, where I proceed to roll out of my body and move about that way.

The more I get to this threshold point, though, the better I'm getting at it.


Keep smiling,

Jeff Mash, Founder and Editor
MyJokeMail.com - Jokes and Humor
http://myjokemail.com

[Originally posted by Leyla:]

quote:Originally posted by Leyla:
Spontanious. All of them. About four times a year since I turned nineteen. I have heard that after thirty of them or so, you begin to do them consiously.

I don't know who told you that, but it's complete rubbish (as my English projectors may say!).  I have had well over 100 of these, and I still can't do these at will.  All I can do is prepare for them, and have a strong intent.  I can usually "get out" once a week or so.

While there is no doubt in my mind that these can become easier with frequency, I don't think that 30 is a magic number which allows the projector to suddenly leave their body without losing consciousness.




Keep smiling,

Jeff Mash, Founder and Editor
MyJokeMail.com - Jokes and Humor
http://myjokemail.com

[Originally posted by clandestino:]

quote:Originally posted by clandestino:
nice one Frank - we do appreciate the time you put into that post !!

Even though I did feel I had some success in trying to project after using the CD a few times, I suspect that this was just coincidence, and I posted it because I was quite excited ! The pointers that Jeff Mash suggested (staring at an image) are in no way related to the CD.

I should mention right away that I have never tried any of those CD's, so I hope that my example of 'looking at an image' didn't sound like I was trying to sum up Monroe's process.  It's just the technique I use.

However, although my description was simpler, I find that I utilize a lot of the SAME techniques that Frank does, just in my own way.

For example, when I first lay down to project, I have to deal with a lot of THOUGHTS. This is because my mind is till buzzing with all the thoughts that I've been focusing on in my physical, day-to-day life.  

"Who is going to win American Idol?"
"I wonder what work will be like tomorrow."
"What am I going to do for my birthday this Sunday?"
etc......

After I QUIET my thoughts, I end up seeing fleeting images.  My mind is still a bit active, but the thoughts turn to quick images.

"Oh look...bright color!"
"Hey, that looked like a fish or something!"
"Are those stars?"

As you can see, I've now moved into a point where I'm no longer concentrating on my day-to-day thoughts, but I moved into a more visual, abstract mindset.

After this, my mind begins to quiet as my body goes to sleep, and the images become more stable.  Instead of seeing a quick flash of something which looks like a bird or a book, the image remains there longer.  My mind no longer says, "Wow, look at how real this image appears!"  Instead, it passively acknowledges that it's travelling further and further up the "consciousness cone."  This is what Frank talks about....the stronger  your imagination becomes, the closer you are to the astral.

The stronger these images become, two things happen for me:

1) They remain longer in my field of vision (without disappearing or changing)
2) They start to take on a three dimensional aspect

I believe it is at this point that you can melt into the background, or phase your surroundings to step right into the astral.  Usuaully, what happens to me, is that I lose consciousness for a specific amount of time (sometimes seconds, sometimes hours).....at which point, I quickly SNAP back to my conscious awareness.  My body is completely asleep, but my mind is wide awake (thanks to the process I went through in the previous paragraphs).

From there, I'm aware that I'm in my room still, and I simply roll out and find myself in the RTZ.  I have two current goals:

1) Don't lose consciousness, but simply meld into the astral by shifting my awareness.  This would bypass the RTZ altogether.

2) Contact my guide/higher self, no matter which plane I find myself in (astral, RTZ, etc).

Anyway, I notice a lot of similarities between my technique and Franks, so I thought I would share that with you guys (and gals!).


Keep smiling,

Jeff Mash, Founder and Editor
MyJokeMail.com - Jokes and Humor
http://myjokemail.com

[Originally posted by clandestino:]

quote:Originally posted by clandestino:
hello there, just thought I'd let you guys know - I tried the focus 10 exercise for the 5th time last night at about 4am.

However, this time I laid down on my SIDE, the most comfortable position that I assume when going to sleep. I had a pre-conceived notion that you have to lie on your back, but I kept getting distracted by discomfort in my neck....anyway, I found it much easier to concentrate on the task at hand - I felt my body was completely asleep, with my mind awake. I've still got to work on forgetting about my body completely, so I couldn't progress..

So, I turned off the CD, lay down to go back to sleep. I found it tricky to do this. It was at this point that I remembered Jeff Mash describing how he passively observed himself going to sleep. After a few minutes of doing this, vibrations began, I could feel one of my legs "seperate".

I tried to just relax into it and go with the flow; nothing was really happening, but the vibrations were becoming a buzz, my heart was pounding more quickly. Then, all of a sudden, there was what I can only describe as an Inaudible "pop", .....and then, nothing !! I was still lying in bed, in a normal waking state.

Ah well....I shall keep persevering !!!

ps : Franks quote :
"Okay, tell me what are you imagining when you go from the energy conversion box to Focus 3?"

In my case, I was trying to concentrate on an image that I could see behind my eyelids, I think that Mr. Jeff Mash mentioned this in one of his posts.

I just wanted to say how happy I am to hear of your experience.  You were right.....the thing I do is be passive and focus on an image behind my closed eyelids.

You know, ever since Frank mentioned how THIN the buffer zone is between the imagination and the astral, I have been having a lot of success lately.

You see, whenever I close my eyes when I lay down, I usually see a bunch of fleeting images.  They go this way and that, and usually disappear with 1-2 seconds.  Sound familiar?  I consider these images to be conjured up by my imagination.

However, after I get relaxed, I start seeing more stable images.  These images don't disappear quite as quickly, and they start to take on a 3 dimensional feel to them.  I believe that this is where you start to approach the buffer zone and begin to see things in the astral realm.  I could be wrong, but this line if thinking keeps me focused enough to recognize just how far along I am in my projection technique.

Perhaps Frank would agree with this line of thinking?  All I know is that there appears to be a clear difference between the quick, fleeting images when I first lay down, and the more solid, multidimensional images as I go further into my meditation/trance state.




Keep smiling,

Jeff Mash, Founder and Editor
MyJokeMail.com - Jokes and Humor
http://myjokemail.com

Well, I think we'll all find the answer to that after the party takes place, now won't we?


Keep smiling,

Jeff Mash, Founder and Editor
MyJokeMail.com - Jokes and Humor
http://myjokemail.com

Yes, it can.  Like I mentioned before, some people will use that ringing sound as a thing to focus on.  By focusing on the ringing sound, they move their awareness away from the physical body and onto something else.

Personally, I am more of a visual person, so I don't use this technique.  But it CAN help you to focus on one thing instead of letting your mind flutter all over the place.


Keep smiling,

Jeff Mash, Founder and Editor
MyJokeMail.com - Jokes and Humor
http://myjokemail.com

If you THINK something is going to be there, chances are it will be.  Your fear could very well attract some unwanted entities, which would otherwise not be there if you weren't so frightened.  Most of my OBE's happen at night, for the simple fact that I am sleeping then, and I have neevr encountered a negative entity.  Then again, I don't have the fear that you seem to have.


Keep smiling,

Jeff Mash, Founder and Editor
MyJokeMail.com - Jokes and Humor
http://myjokemail.com