Messages

Hi,

I'm sure Danielle Graham is more than happy to share all the data to interested parties. As the SSE scientists said, all she needs to do is double check the scale to be absolutely 100% certain that it's not due to body weight shifting. It is highly unlikely that it's due to weight shifting considering they had roughly $80,000 to spend on this project. I mean, even a _decent_ bathroom scale should not shift several pounds by slightly shifting the body.  Can you imagine a boxer fooling the scale at a multi million dollar boxing match?  I think professional scales have overcome weight errors from body shifting.  Additionally, the person that is being weighed, the guy meditating, is sitting down thereby placing his center of gravity near the ground, which greatly reduces body weight shifting. Also Danielle Graham mentioned that the meditating guy did not move or at least she could not see any moving.

Even so, a professional scale should not change 1 pound from any body shifting.

Personally I think the experiment is legitimate, but I have a feeling that since the collective is not ready for such global proof yet that this experiment and research will just collect dust.

Inward

I would be wary, as the header says the "American Antigravity Institute". This sounds like a goofy name a commitee gave themselves, rather than an actual governmenrt funded project.

I would only encourage you to spend a little more time investigating topics that may oppose your present beliefs. Remember, ones thoughts become their future reality. The scientific source has nothing to do with American Antigravity. American Antigravity merely posted the video at google. American Antigravity also interviews scientists. If you have issues with American Antigravity then perhaps you should send them an email.

The project of this research is lead by Danielle Graham the Executive Director of Northwest Frontier Research Institute. NW's work was presented at SSE, Society for Scientific Exploration. The 1st stage budget was ~$80,000.

http://www.scientificexploration.org
http://www.rabbitholeresearch.com


Did anyone listen to Dean Radin on Coast To Coast AM last night?  I sense that the collective is gearing up for global proof within the next 20 years. Dean Radin, a major player in the Princeton University Global Consciousness Project, announced hardcore scientific proof that mind affects matter.  Eight years of data has revealed the overall odds against chance are roughly 300000 to 1.  Dean revealed a major breakthrough in the data analysis, which reveals a 2-hour precursor to global events.  Furthermore the effect seems to attenuate relative to distance.

For those not aware of this eight-year scientific project, EGGs are purely quantum random number generators connected to computers through out the world at universities. During key events, the random quantum generators become non-random. According to Quantum Physicist there are no known fields in nature that should cause a random quantum generator to become non-random. Eight years of data clearly shows this is associated with global events.

Several years ago Dean performed a live experiment on Coast To Coast AM (C2C). He asked the millions of listeners to merely focus on the EGG devices. Over the following days the scientists at GCP compiled the EGG data. Dean went back on C2C and posted the graph of time over data. It clearly showed a huge spike in the EGG's during the time when C2C listeners focused on the EGG's.

This type of data is consistent time after time. Does anyone really know how high a 300000 to 1 odds is. You would be a guaranteed rich person if you took those odds to Vegas. Heck, you would be rich if you had 2.001 to 1 odds.

This statistics is based on recording EGG data coming from universities around the world non-stop for eight years. That provides some real good statistical averaging.

IMHO consciousness is the fundamental force in nature.

Global Consciousness Project
http://noosphere.princeton.edu/

The official Dean Radin home page
http://www.deanradin.com/NewWeb/bio.html

Dean Radin book "Entangled Minds"
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/1416516778/ctoc/104-6985477-7786346

Inward

Has anyone seen this study?

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=1931677431609629982&q=levitation

Inward

Hi Fuse,

I don't know how old you are, but after hanging out with a wide range of people for years you should begin to clearly see a pattern, which is a few people have constant good luck.  Perhaps you've simply have not met the right person yet.  I know several people like that.  I mean, sure bad things happen to them on occasion, but some people are so obviously lucky there's no chance it's by accident. I mean, after knowing someone as one of your best friends for a decade then you know if it's just a lucky streak. What I'm talking about is just out right good karma.  Usually people will have positive karma in some areas, but negative karma in other areas. For example some people might have negative traffic karma. That might find every traffic jam, lol.

Inward

I should add that some would say it gives your subconscious brain time to recall where the misplaced keys are. Regardless, the idea of being positive and focusing on what you want does seem to help as long as you give your self a periodic break to relax and take it easy. They tell beginners to try and project 6 times per week, leaving one day per week as a day off. It really seems to help in most cases.

Inward

As most people know, the way to get rid of something in your reality is to not focus on it.  It's been said time after time that you should focus on the positive and want you want.  The car keys often reappear not because you duplicate it or anything, but because you appreciably take your focus off it.  There are many interpretations as to why this often happens.

Inward

[but realistically the positive aspect rarely happens.]

I find all of this incredibly interesting, but i dont get some things, "concentrate on what you want" this will just make your desire far more greater for that thing and would mean that you are going to live in pain thinking about things that you havent got. I mean, i try to be a positive thinker but realistically the positive aspect rarely happens. And so what other alternative do i have if the negative things happen? I mean id love to believe in the stuff like this really i would but my beliefs and expectations are rarely met no matter how hard i try, maybe i set them too high, but i cant help it.

Also another interesting thing is i find people who are things will always go right for people who are genuinly overconfident (who dont just say it but actually mean it) and for people who are underconfident, nothing will go right for them. Is this the power of belief that make overconfident people succeed or am i just completely missing the point here lol.

I can only speak of personal experiences and the lives of other people that I've analyzed, but realistically the positive aspect usually happens. Are there people who have bad luck / bad karma? Sure, but they should never give up on positive thoughts.

Inward

Hi Joe,

There are a lot of people who never knew about the vibs, but got it anyways. When I was younger and knew nothing about this stuff, never heard about it, I had really strong vibs and left the body. Now a days with the Internet it does not take long before a person hears about the vibs even before they first project.

Anyhow, the state of mind you should be in as a beginner should be calm, no solving puzzles, etc. lol. As soon as you start using that old physical brain then for most people you'll be sucked back into the physical. Later on you can learn to use the physical brain, if you want, and remain out of body. Also, stay calm and do not get emotional.  There's nothing to fear. You WILL have invisible helpers watching over you. Any experiences you have will be for a purpose.

The heart rate in nearly everyone goes down during projection because the circulation and muscle tension really binds the astral body to the physical. It may seem like your heart is increasing, but this is your energy body currents and vibs. It is possible to get the heart rate going, but this would be highly uncommon.

At first you most likely will not encounter too many beings out of body. Most beginner projectors are in their own little space / reality. So there could be a party of deceased people right next to you and you would not even know it. You might fluctuate in and out and you could sense these deceased people as who knows what ... perhaps eggs lying on the floor, or even a bunch of pillows. Eventually you'll learn to sync into what ever reality you want, just not your own self created reality. That could be the Earths _present_ real time zone, or one of the infinite astral planes, and perhaps one day when you really get good the immense mental realms, which is higher in vibration than the astral.
Eventually you could meet people who are in a physical body, people who have died, who eventually becomes helpers, you could meet the angelic kingdom, and if you're really fortunate a real living Archangel. You'll find the universe has nearly unlimited life in the astral and beyond. Dogs, cats, all animals, to all the way to really really strange stuff. You can even travel to the bottoms of Earths ocean. When you achieve a state of being where you become responsible then you'll even be allowed to view real living physical life forms that present humanity knows nothing of. There are other beings on Earth right now besides Dolphins on Earth that are also part of the human kingdom that we don't yet know about that live at extreme depths in the ocean. That's just the tip of the iceberg.

You can to many places out of body. There are places on Earth that are guarded, but for the most part you can go just about anywhere on Earth and most of the moon. To be truthful, traveling to other solar systems, galaxies is most likely not real obe. Rather it would be a self created reality. Only the Soul can travel to such distances. You can travel to planets in our solar system, but it would be in the astral, not RTZ. To see the physical planet Mars would require Etheric travel, which is limited to the speed of light. If you were advanced then you could travel to mars in the astral and then lower your vibration big time, into the Etheric. Most people do not realize that even your physical body can be raised in vibration to even the mental planes, but it requires such a constant force that it's deciduous. I cannot do it, but it is possible. I have had teachers take my astral body into the mental realms, but the astral cannot remain there. As soon as the force is removed then the astral falls back into the astral planes. So, yes, you could even travel to another galaxy in your mental body or even Soul, then your Soul could easily lower its vibration to even the physical level it is so wished, but that's probably not going to happen anytime soon, but you never know. As you might know, you have a material body, etheric body, astral body, mental body, and beyond the mental body you have a Soul. Within the Soul is the Spirit.

So there are nearly infinite interesting places you could realistically go. You should know that you need to be responsible. You just can't go around peeking in other peoples homes, having astral sex all the time. Sure, if you want lucid dreams, then that's fine, but the real astral has laws also. Just be responsible otherwise you'll find it quite difficult to project anywhere. Projection is a gift given to you by your Soul and helpers.

Yes, you can travel back in time, but to be accurate you need to learn to not create your own self-reality. I believe Jerry Gross gave an average time of about 5 years of good projecting. Traveling in the future is also possible, but this is projecting into probabilities. I do not know of anyway testing this theory, but it seems these future realities do exist and do contain real living Souls, but there are countless future possibilities from what I've been able to ascertain. Who knows.

Inward

Whatever you do mjolnir_knight PLEASE do not give up!!!

Inward

Here's another,

"Do not personally give any more conscious consideration"..."to events that you do not want to happen. Any such concentration, to whatever degree, ties you in with those probabilities, so concentrate upon what you want...

Inward

Here's an interesting quote from Seth,

You create your reality according to your beliefs and expectations, therefore you should examine these carefully. If you do not like some aspect of your world, then examine your own expectations

Inward

I think the vibs felt during liftoff versus vibs felt during inspiring moments in life are of different nature, but I'd agree that they both originate from the energy body. For me, astonishingly inspiring moments generate billions of current fluctuations through the web of energy body. Vibrations caused by projection are also energy increases in the energy body, but they're for the purpose of getting the astral body away from the physical body.

From what I've learned, there is an enormously strong attraction between astral body and physical body. When you have a _real_ obe then try and walk up to the physical body. Chances are you'll be sucked right into it. If you're able to maintain the obe while up close to physical, then try touching your physical bodies face with your astral body, lol. And that's just one tiny finger barely touching the surface of the physical face. Just imagine if your entire astral is inside the physical body!!!

Therefore, we should all have a little respect for what our Higher Self does for us each and every night as it's quite a task to raise the vibs high enough for separation.

Inward

Think about this: if the brain and body are indeed the channel of our soul when it comes to express itself in the physical plane, no supernatural feats are possible without coinciding changes in brain and body.

I would have to agree with that. Since the physical brain is linked to the higher bodies then any change / effect on the higher bodies with effect the physical brain. The only problem I have with that is it seems impossible to understand _everything_ that is occurring on the higher bodies simply by looking at the physical brain. Consider the following analogy. Take a color image file. Then convert the image to jpeg. Higher compressions equate to more data loss. So you could equate the astral with the original image file and the compressed jpeg as what's sensed from the physical brain.

Also, I have a problem with setting limitations. For example I just don't see why we need to place a limitation such as "vibrations can only occur while the brain is in deep sleep." Not that you or anyone said that, but To me that places a limitation. I really think it is possible and even occurred that a person could be eating breaking and suddenly get vibrations, lol.

Inward

Hi GANAMOHA,

That's a very interesting point. I have no idea since IMHO this theory could never be proven. So really it's just an interpretation. How could anyone ever test or know if a person levitates because they are manipulating energy or if they simply went to time stream where their body is levitating? Although I think anyone could _eventually_ find enough substantial proof. For example, say in 1 billion years from now in your future you learn to do anything such as create galaxies, etc. How could one single individual muster up enough energy to such things?  It seems easier to believe that it is simply reality. Not that you are changing the universe, but you would be attracting to yourself the universe (time stream) that you want.

I know Quantum Mechanics MWI talks about _infinite_ universes. So, in that sense, there would simply be a blending when changing time streams. You know what I mean? Also, in QM there is a quantum unit of time. So if there are finite time streams then perhaps the Soul jumps from one time stream to the next in quantum time frames.

If there are _infinite_ universes, then there should be a universe where you are levitating right now, or a universe where you just instantly created a physical mountain.

So if true, then psychics and intuitives are not predicting anything since the outcome they are predicting already exists. If they want to predict, then they simply need to enter that particular time stream.

Inward

Ha ha, I love this topic. This reminds of the most popular Quantum Mechanics Interpretation called, MWI, which stands for Many Worlds Interpretation. Most great scientists such as Stephen Hawking follow MWI. You should read it,

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Many_worlds_interpretation

Personally I don't think it is entirely correct, ok, not even close, but it does seem that some aspects are very close. Basically, what it seems to be, as far as my research has revealed, is there are infinite parallel universes of energy. There's a universe where you moved your hand left and there's a universe where you moved your hand right, etc. Supposedly there are all combinations, infinite universes. So what I believe or what is seems to be is that your consciousness is like a train riding the time streams that split here and there. So your consciousness rides these time streams and consciously decides where to go where belief is simply the limitation. My theory is that we can traverse to nearby time streams such as moving your arm and such, but it requires a jump, a jump in faith, to move to farther away time streams where you can levitate or even traverse to an entirely different time stream where Earth is a utopia.

It really seems like this is the way it is. It would be very cool if true and it would explain certain coincidences. So what makes more sense -~->

A person is driving on the freeway. The person then concentrates enough to the point where the traffic appreciably clears up.
1) Did the person actually influence the lives of thousands of people. Did this single person actually overpower the negativity on thousands of people on the freeway.
2) Did this person simply traverse to another time stream where the traffic became cleared up.

Perhaps modern science is on to something huge in that perhaps there are infinite parallel universes. It is my theory and surely the theory of many others who believe consciousness traverse along time streams and consciously decides its own destiny. The saying suddenly makes sense, "Change yourself, and you change the universe."

Inward

I would like to share what I have been taught by liberated beings. Soul & Spirit definitely have purpose for the lower self. So IMHO it is very incorrect theory to believe that no matter what you do it is fine! Such advice and thinking is very dangerous advice to give, irresponsible, and a lot of negative karma can occur. For example, people practicing Kundalini raising can, if persistent, cause a literal nightmare of pain and panic attacks beyond comprehension. This is no joke. The Soul in most people is not in contact with the lower self. Causing such damage to energy body and physical body can cause great limitations in a persons life not to mention emotional and mental scars for life.

If a person wants to become a doctor, then do you not think it is wise for example for a person to go to college to become a doctor??? Teachers are good. Yes, there are perhaps far too many fakes and fraudulent teachers who just want your money. Finding a teacher requires work.

This theory of following what one _thinks_ is the accurate information from their higher self is dangerous for nearly all people on Earth. The theory goes that the higher self is the best teacher and indeed this is true. I personally have researched many people who thought they were in contact with their higher self. They say things that their higher self claims is true when I know it is false. For example, the last person I studied said that I work with a lot with file cabinets. I never work with file cabinets. Yes, this person directly claims to be in contact with their higher self. This is not the voice of the higher self. Some of these people even use such so-called gift to judge others, but their judgment is usually wrong. They sense that they should stay away from this person or that person, etc.

Fact is, nearly all of humanity has not developed the ability to accurately sense and interpret intuition or accurately understand the higher self. Also when a person links with the higher self then they become a new being, like a god man. I do not wish to sound harsh, but this is a serious topic for those who dabble around with this.

Find a teacher that does not charge money! Donations are fine, and even if you do not donate then such a teacher should not cut you off. A true teacher can see your present development, your energy body, your karma, your past lives, and your present path. They have treaded the path. Also everyone has teachers in the astral and higher realms. So they can help guide you on your path subconsciously, but there is no substitute for a teacher in the flesh. No, it is not require as your astral and soul teachers can usually reach your consciousness well enough, but this depends what state of being you are in. If your life is hectic and your vibration lowers too much then your spirit guides and teachers cannot appreciably reach you.

In short, I just wanted to say that trusting any such voices that a disciple hears or senses could be dangerous! Please, at least test the spirits first. Do not be afraid of offending them, lol. If they are of the light then they would want you to test them. Unfortunately after appreciably testing them, most people will be disappointed to discover this voice is not accurate by any means.

Inward

I think this is good exercise and it's very possible to move it with thought & emotion. You should make sure it's side a glass container and make there's no way wind can get inside. Try blowing underneath the glass container and see if the pin/needle moves as a test.

Inward

But that is just my .0002 cents  

Can you spare a dime, lol.  Just kidding.

Hi,

You can _perhaps_ liken the Soul as the cpu, the memory chips as the mental body, and the astral body as Microsoft Windows, lol. That's probably a terrible analogy though. The mental body is always connected to material body otherwise the person would be a zombie.

I might end up with a different allocation but that doesn't matter. Every analogy or conceptualization we made would help us to have a better grasp on otherwise untouchable things. It is like accepting an irrational symbol, hypnagog picture in deep meditation as a valid representation of my goal then manipulating it with purpose.

The point was that an oscilloscope couldn't physically probe inside a cpu or memory chip. To probe inside the cpu you would need a computer programmer.  The oscilloscope is likened to any material tool that scientists presently have. The computer programmer is likened to instruments beyond the material plane.

Inward

Hi upstream,

Actually I was talking about when a person gets really really really awed, the goose bumps and all to the point where heavy strong vibrations run up and down the spine. I've felt it on occasion and was wide awake, walking and talking.

It is also possible, although highly doubtful, that these vibrations are not related at all.

One thing is for certain, a person who is wide awake, can even be running laps around a track, can almost instantly get these heavy vibrations running up and down the spine. It seems obvious to me they are chakra energies just as obe vibrations are chakra energies.

I am trying to understand where you are coming from. Are you trying explain away any non-physical energies such as chakras and the astral body? This from my POV is futile since I have personal witnessed supernatural feats that are entirely impossible with any physical brain or body.

Inward

Just my 2 cents!

just my 0.02

LOL, hehehe, we're big spenders.

Inward

[Is this all a religion?]

I guess it's cooling off now?

I had a few things to say, to voice the reality that I have experience, mostly to people who might one day give up, who might be turned off by teachings on realties of astral and mental realms, etc.

First, analyzing higher realms beyond the physical and astral by no means makes it a religion. As I've said before, the latest Quantum theories and Interpretations have surpassed most religions in the weirdness factor.

From what I was taught and experienced, the astral is a different realm that is ruled by different laws. For example, on the physical plane positive and negative attraction rules in a lot of areas; i.e., opposites attraction. On the astral "like unto like" is slightly stronger than opposite attraction. I use the word "slightly" because it is not consistent across the board, but overall it is slightly stronger. In some areas such as beliefs and philosophies it is ruled by like unto like. As far as intimate relationships, if you'll have any, then the law of attraction is still stronger. Due to this law of like unto like, deceased astral people end up in a group/local of similar people. Astral locals are created by groups of beings. When all the people of that local eventually leave (no longer needing it) then the local continues to exists, but fades over time. The leaves on trees and plants begin to lose their color and eventually die. Then the buildings and everything wither away and eventually there is nothing left to see.

Are there astral hells? Any advanced projector should know there is. Sorry for anyone who does not want such things to be, but so long as there are murderers and evil there will always be astral hells. Thankfully there are also astral heavens.

What's above the astral? As Hagethuriel said, above the astral are the mental realms. This is the home of the Soul, that is the higher mental realms.

Is this all a religion? You know, there's a thing that when you look at something totally different than what you were taught and brought up, then it looks kind of iffy and weird. From viewing something from such a far distance it seems so obvious that it's wrong. Yet as many people know, when you begin to really dig into a topic open-mindedly and familiarize yourself with it, then all the darkness disappears. After a while, for those very persistent folks, they begin to see how all the puzzle pieces go together. I apologize that modern society has programmed into most people into being repelled by hardcore scientific spiritual truths. It is not a religion. I would wish that everyone kept working on obtaining hardcore scientific personal proof. It is obtainable.

What if one day after years and years of projection practice you were able to project to distant places on Earth and then later verify these places, objects, etc. in the physical body? At first it might take 100 attempts to get it right. If you wanted to be a runner in physical then you are not going to run a marathon anytime soon. It takes time and effort. What if one day you wanted to verify the astral realms? So you projected to an astral local with the intensions of searching for an advanced astral projector such as yourself. What if you and this other person exchanged information in the astral local, then you and the other projector contacted each other on Earth in the physical bodies to verify that astral local? What if you repeated this experiment on an even higher realm such as the lower mental realm?

It's my wish that everyone discover these truths on their own accord, with the aid of their helpers of course. It is close to meaningless for me to tell you that I know for certain other people have achieved these experiments other than it gives encouragement to some of you. Nobody is here to hand you person proof, and for very good reasons. Just don't give up hope, keep treading the path. Really that is all that I am here for. It is a pity, a spiritual crime that so many have abused spirituality by selling their so-called gifts and taking peoples money!!! One thing I will tell you for certain, RUN THE OTHER WAY if someone is asking for your money for anything related to metaphysics or spirituality! Although there are some really nice folks who ask for donations, just be careful. You have plenty of helpers in the astral unbeknownst to most people. If or when you can appreciably benefit from a true teacher in a physical body, then it will happen.

In short, just continue on the good path, be open-minded, listen, research, and accept the very good possibility that the universe is far weirder than you and I could ever imagine.

just my 0.02
Inward

[spiritual]

to:
Inward
I will look into your statements and related posts
What exactly do you mean by the following?
>Could a person muster up enough willpower to prove life after death to another person? Yes. I'd sure pity that poor Soul that accomplishes such a task. Wow what karma they will gain!
why would karma be effected?

Hi deeplyconcerned,

There are people who can prove obe's to skeptics and disbelievers. It takes a powerful and advanced person. If a person over powers and drastically mistakenly changes the spiritual path of another person who is not ready for such a change then they cause a negative effect. You can call this effect "karma" or "reaping what you sew" or the "law of cause and effect" etc. Regardless, this effect will eventually need to be dealt with on this plane. In such a case we're talking about a spiritual crime. Also remember that what a person thinks is best is not by any means best. There is a higher aspect within each person that knows what the best path is.

Perhaps one of the most difficult concepts for the lower self to accept is that "knowing everything" is not by any means the goal and purpose in Earth physical life. Remember, we all come from spirit, a place where such things are already known.

There are very specific reasons why the Soul places a veil over the lower self during this period on Earth.  On the other hand, there are of course people who are ready for such information as proof of obe's. Those people are usually guided by their Soul to a group, a book, or a situation where they will eventually find their own personal proof. In the rare case, some people have even earned the right to witness such supernatural abilities, but witnessing such things does very little for the person. Yes, they gain information, that they already knew before birth. Yet by removing such a veil by knowing of such things the person is now limited in what she or he can gain in the rest of his or her present lifetime.

Let me put it this way. Take a person through a jungle experience. They learn how to survive, what type of animals to not approach, etc. Now remove their memories. For the most part they would need to re-learn everything again. Yet, to some small degree, deep within their psyche they will intuitively know some things. Now once again put them through the jungle experience and then again erase their memory. Keep repeating this over and over. Eventually the experiences will be embedded so deep that they will recall the experiences as it becomes second nature. This is going from "knowledge" to "second nature." That's perhaps a bad analogy, but it may give you an idea why the Soul places a veil over the lower self on Earth.

Are there planets where people incarnate without the veil? Yes! Your Soul & Spirit chose, for very good reasons, to incarnate on this planet.

Through pain and suffering people learn at a very deep level the lesson of compassion for other beings for example. It is a choice we all made for our self, even though we do not remember.

Inward

[suggestive]

Hi learning,

I have my hardcore scientific personal proof. As mentioned numerous times at this forum I spent a great deal of early obe's on scientific experiments. Perhaps you too have your hardcore scientific personal proof, but I went through everything you mentioned in your post and while all these people are wonderful great people not a single one can successfully take any projector and prove obe's to the mainstream science community. I'll start with Charles Tart.

university of santa barbara, duke univ. etc.  Charles Tart studies were famous too.

I love Charles Tart. He's a great Soul! Below is a list of his science papers, but now where will you find any hardcore evidence. Even in the words of Charles Tart, "Two incidents occurring in the laboratory provide suggestive evidence that the out of-the-body experiences had parapsychological concomitants." Charles Tart is an honest man. He will not tell you there is hardcore scientific proof for the world that obe's are provable, yet. Yet one day it will happen. The world is approaching the time when such hardcore proof of life after death on a global scale is known fact.

Science Papers by Charles T. Tart
http://www.paradigm-sys.com/ctt_articles1.cfm


Some Methodological Problems in OOBE Research
http://www.paradigm-sys.com/ctt_articles2.cfm?id=51

Further Psychophysiological Study of Out-of-the-Body Experiences in a Gifted Subject, Robert A. Monroe
http://www.paradigm-sys.com/ctt_articles2.cfm?id=4

Psychophysiological Study of Out-of-the-Body Experiences in a Selected Subject
http://www.paradigm-sys.com/ctt_articles2.cfm?id=31

Second Psychophysiological Study of Out-of-the-Body Experiences in a Selected Subject
http://www.paradigm-sys.com/ctt_articles2.cfm?id=32

Six Studies of Out-of-the-Body Experiences
http://www.paradigm-sys.com/ctt_articles2.cfm?id=50

"projectiology" by waldo vieira has 5000 references.  it is actually 1200 pages, very heavy.

I love Waldo Vieira's work. I mentioned Waldo at this forum few days ago. In fact I've been re-reading his book for the last week. Waldo definitely has his hardcore scientific proof, but it is personal proof.  He did not bring hardcore proof for the world. Probably for the exact same reasons that when I tried to prove obe's to several friends that I ran into a brick wall, figuratively speaking. Yet, I can prove time after time to myself using very hardcore scientific experiments.

there are many others, like some Monroe Institute studies, etc.

Yes, just about everyone here knows of Robert Monroe. Charles Tart studied Monroe giving him the task to read a five-digit target number, but as we all should know Monroe failed the task. There are groups that have succeeded such scientific experiments. The problem is when they try to replicate the exact same experiments in a largely publicized group of mainstream scientists.

amazon.com sells "projectiology", just type it on amazon.com.

Yes, you mentioned Waldo's work above.

i mean even governments use psychics and astral projectors for espionage, so it's real.  it is as universal, as the laws of science.

Yes, I agree. Jerry Gross is one such individual.

George Meek did a lot of studies too.  'After We Die What Then' book is nice too.

About a few decades ago I purchased just about all his infolios/newletters.  I believe last year'ish Art Bell played a live recording of George Meek spirit conversations from the spirit world. Really awesome stuff. Now if they wanted hardcore proof for the world then they would design a scientific experiment and get the mainstream science communities approval of the design and then demonstrate it to notable scientists. Broadcasting on a radio show doesn't count as hardcore science experiment.

People like ourselves do not need such proof because we have already found our personal proof. IMHO it's misleading to people to tell them there's hardcore scientific evidence that has been proven on a large mainstream scale. There are groups of people who've succeeded and if one is fortunate enough to find such a group the great or if one puts forth the time & effort they too can achieve obe's and eventually become adept enough to prove it to themselves.  Looking at tons of papers that provide suggestive evidence is misleading when viewed from a distance and IMHO it's wishful thinking to believe the evidence on a global scale is there. That's why I push and push for people to achieve personal proof because that is presently a viable path. It simply takes time & effort, but time very very very well spent.


Inward

Hi MisterJingo,

Actually I was talking about when a person gets really really really awed, the goose bumps and all to the point where heavy strong vibrations run up and down the spine.  I've felt it on occasion and was wide awake, walking and talking.

many EEG experiments have show people can be awake and active while experiencing even Theta brainwaves.

It's really nice to experience some good meditation when body is asleep and mind's awake. On a material body level I think it's difficult to see what's exactly happening because the material body is so connected with the etheric, astral, and mental bodies. The doctors are seeing just one end of it. So they can trace it down to a certain place within the brain. It's somewhat like analyzing a computer motherboard with an oscilloscope. You can place the scope probes here and there, but you can't get inside the cpu. You can _perhaps_ liken the Soul as the cpu, the memory chips as the mental body, and the astral body as Microsoft Windows, lol. That's probably a terrible analogy though. The mental body is always connected to material body otherwise the person would be a zombie.

I'm not sure that clarifies anything, lol, but just thought I'd throw that in there.

Inward