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Man, I'm jealous of your progress!  I've been trying to get from focus 10 to focus 12 for 2 1/2 to 3 months now and haven't been able to do it yet. 

Yes, both are quite enticing.  But since I haven't actually experienced the outer realms for myself I guess I have no frame of reference to know how awesome they are.  To me it sounds pretty awesome to explore the Congo, or the Oceans, without fear of getting eaten by monsters.

I am very interested in larger "astral realms".  I do also have quite a bit of interest in exploring the RTZ though.  Is there a good method to be able to do both?  Or do you sort of have to divide between methods to do whichever you want to do at the time.

My opinion is that neither of the two is particularly effective.  Monroe's technique is tedious to say the best, very machannial, not taking into account of the subtle conditions which the mind and body are at during different time and situations.  Bruce, on the other hand, make you go through the whole process of training for visualizations, chakras, and so on, which in reality has nothing to do with phasing.  It does have the effect of strengthing your subconscious so you will have a more stable OBE experience, but the amount of effort spent to achieve that is not so worthwhile.  When I tought people how to phase, I led them to discover what's most natural to them.  This way, on average they learn to induce the experience at will, with near 100% success rate, in as little as two months.  Phasing, is a matter of mind/body conditions, and has nothing to do with souls, energies, and etc, IMHO.

So is the phasing technique you use the standard staring into the blackness and concentrating on the images that everyone else talks about?  That's what I currently do, and I feel all kind of gnarly physical sensations, I just haven't broken through to the other side. 

In everyone's opinion, who has the better method of AP'ing.  Robert Bruce seems to concentrate on actually getting outside of the body by concentrating consciousness into an astral body and projecting that way.  Where as Monroe's method is about achieving a consciousness phase shift by concentrating your consciousness somewhere else until you phase away from your body. 

I've been working on phasing for a few months now, and haven't achieved a phase shift yet, though I did actually have one AP about a month and a half ago, while I wasn't trying to have one either.  So who has the best method?  Should I continue to try the phase shift as I have been doing?  Or should I try the techniques put forward in Mastering Astral Projection in 90 Days?

What do you guys think?

I like the diagram.  And yes, the thing at the end does sort of look like a mason symbol.     Another question I have is, does this vortex have to be something you wait to happen naturally, or can you actively create it yourself through force of will somehow?

I might give that book a look through.  Visualization is always a problem for me though.  I tried Robert Bruce's method a couple years ago, and had minimal success due to the fact that he requires you to do the visualization and movement and feeling memory stuff.  But with his method I was very effective with energy raising and movement.  So effective in fact that after a few weeks of working on it, my crown chakra would buzz 24 hours a day.  I mean really buzz!  It was distracting and I don't know what the reason for that kind of buzzing is.  So I gave up on his method for those reasons.  Then not long ago I discovered the phasing method and that sounded alot easier.  And as I stated earlier, I have had some success, and feel like I could make this method work for me, I just am having trouble getting over that last hump to get into focus 12. 

Also currently reading My Big TOE by Tom Campbell.  Any other recommended readings?

Usually before trying to go to sleep.  Which I have always had alot of trouble with by the way.  I have pretty profound insomnia.  So I usually make these attempts with the intention of going to sleep afterwards.  But I sometimes find that after I'm done with them, that it is actually harder to go to sleep than it would have been if I had just gone to sleep in the first place. 

I've also tried doing this when I first wake up, but I find almost no success that way.  My mind is usually alot harder to quiet down when I first wake up and I generally have no success at that time.

So I posted about a month and a half ago about the problems I was having, and took everyone's advice and went on to try new things.  So this is how my attempts currently go down....

I lay in bed and it usually takes me between 5-10 minutes to get comfortable.  Then after that I begin staring into the blackness behind my eyes and either reciting a mantra or humming a short, repetitive instrumental tune (not sure how advisable this is?).  After about 5-15 minutes I start to feel vibrations and heaviness.  At this point I usually opt out of the mantra and just work on swatting away any stray words that enter into my mind.  Sometimes this works and I continue this way, sometimes it doesn't and I go back to the mantra.  I continue these attempts usually for about 30-45 minutes at a time.  Usually only once a day but sometimes twice.  I have skipped days though, and sometimes have skipped a couple days at a time.  Sometimes the vibrations get very intense.  I used to smoke alot of cannabis and would also get intense vibrations then.  I've been sober of cannabis for about 10 months now, and these vibrations that I feel when I'm doing my phasing attempts feel identical to the ones I used to feel whilst smoking cannabis.  It's like a swirling immense energy inside my body.  I guess it's what people call their "astral bodies".  Sometimes they get so intense really quickly that they feel like they are building towards a climax, like an orgasm (but not in a sexual way at all, that's just the best word I can think of to describe the feeling) but it never quite hits the peak or goes through to the other side like I wish it would, it always fades away and recedes before that point.  Usually when I get that deep any sounds that might happen seem much harsher than they normally do.  It is a little harder to muster up the will to move physically but it is always still very possible. 

Sometimes I see shapes and things behind my eyes while I'm staring and sometimes I don't.  I always feel like I go deeper when the shapes are there and more pronounced, because it's easier to concentrate on them and not other things, but like I said, I can't always see anything.  It's fairly clear to me that whenever these things are happening that I am in a light focus 10 state (I think that's the right one) but can't figure out how to push deeper into the state, and can't figure out how to push further into the focus 12 state that I'm trying to reach. 

Now for the one truly bizarre experience I had.....

This must have been a month ago now.  I was laying on the couch, asleep while my fiance was watching tv.  Suddenly I snapped awake in the sleep paralysis mode.  I was fully concious, but I couldn't move.  Then I felt someone reach up and grab me by both shoulders, and pull me down through a tunnel, or portal of some sort.  At this point I was free falling, like out of an airplane or something for about 5 minutes time.  It was quite intense.  All the physical sensations of free fall were very present and very real.  I couldn't really see around me.  Everything was very cloudy but I was very concious.  Sometimes I would swoop in a different direction for a few seconds and then go back to falling.  Then after about 5 minutes I slowed back down and halted, at which point I was back on the couch and able to get up and move. 

Does that sort of experience happen to anyone else often?  Now I'm seeking advice on how to go further.  I'm totally committed to making this happen and will not give up.  It seems important to learn how to do this not just for myself but for the sake of evolution of the species as a whole.  So if anyone has any further advice I'd be very grateful.  I'm fairly frustrated at the moment that I've been reaching the same state at almost every attempt for about a month, but just can't seem to get any farther.

I have a related post to make so I'll just post it in this thread rather than starting a new one.

So I have been working on phasing for quite some time without a whole lot of success, but I have now started to just learn to meditate first.  I've been working on that for about a week.  So tonight I was going to take a nap on the couch with the tv on.  During my nap (basically the entire time) I become aware of myself.  I know I'm asleep on the couch and it seems to be a sort of sleep paralysis because even though I'm aware I can't move at all.  I also couldn't really see a whole lot most of the time.  Sometimes it seemed like I could open my eyes and look at the back of the couch in front of me.

Well, anyway, after a few minutes of awareness I got this very strange sensation.  My "astral body" was buzzing quite a bit and I got the sensation of someone reaching out and grabbing me, then pulling me down a hole or portal of some type.  I then proceeded to free fall for what seemed like a very very long time.  It was a full on, fully aware physical sensation of complete free fall.  Occasionally my awareness would swoop up and start falling again, or start flying in a more straight direction, but then go back to the free fall.  It lasted for what seemed like about 10 minutes before it slowed down and I was just back to laying on the couch.  At that point I began trying to exit, but am really not practiced enough for that yet, and don't really know how to do it.  Eventually when my fiance was ready to go to bed she woke me from whatever state I was in and I retained full memory of what happened.  It was as real as reality, and pretty cool.

Anyone else have a similar experience?  Or know which focus level I was actually in?

I was actually thinking about this last night, and then again today.  Last night I was watching Lost, and someone got blown up with some dynamite.  I was then thinking about what an extremely rapid death that is.  If you are transported somewhere else when you die it would be like blinking, and then when your eyes open back up on the blink, all your surroundings would be different.  How bizarre would that be? 

I had tonsil surgery when I was 4 I think (I'm 27 now) and I don't really remember anything about the anesthesia.  The last time I had surgery of any kind was when I was about 11 and I had some teeth pulled.  They gave me nitrous oxide for that instead of putting me to sleep.  Now that's a whole other experience all together. 

But yeah, I have thought about people who might not know they've died.  That would be a pretty strange realization all of a sudden. 

I've heard people who have done both say that it feels exactly the same on the come up, like an exit.  Same with DMT.  I personally think that that is the reason that these plants exist, to give us a glimpse of what is out there.  But it also seems like once you experience that, a person should move on and learn to do it without drugs.  After all, isn't it better to be able to do it anytime, anywhere, with having to have a manual input that you might not be able to get? 

I have yet to have a projection.  But I am remaining free of all substances to learn how to do it on my own.  I'm not even eating food with preservatives or hormones anymore on the notion that it could be a hindrance.

I'll update on the last couple of days.  I decided to try a mantra instead of music and it seems to work better.  I decided on "Foo-sho-rah" which comes from the game Skyrim but means nothing to me.  I find that it is pretty good at keeping chatter away for awhile and then eventually I can sort of stop saying it and keep the chatter away on my own.  By I still haven't seemingly reached a "point consciousness" state of meditation yet.  However I do feel alot of interesting physical effects.  After awhile my lower body particularly gets pretty heavy, though I never lose the ability to move.  Eventually I get very tingly all over, what I guess is my "astral" body.  I also eventually a fairly constant state of mild vibration.  And also the sort of "floaty" feeling that I mentioned previously, as if floating or swirling in water.  It's very hard to not become aware of this when it happens though and it always seems to quickly fade away.  (The floating and swirling, the tingling and vibrations seem to remain). 

Also I'm reading My Big TOE by Tom Campbell, since so many people here seem to be such big fans.  Something I'm curious about is why does he demand 3-6 months of meditation before moving on to something different, or bigger, when he himself says that he was able to achieve the "point consciousness" altered state on his very first attempt. It's especially puzzling when people like Robert Bruce claim they can teach you to master astral projection in 3 months (his method requires far too much visualization for me, which I cannot do at all) and so many others say that projection through phasing is something that can be learned realistically in just a few weeks? 

Well, I have read xanth's primer, and some of frank's posts, but that was months ago I suppose.  Haven't read Contenteo's primer yet though.  I'll get right on that one.

Also I gotta ask, for meditation, what is a good mantra for a beginner, or where is a good place to get a beginners mantra?

I'm not sure if the exfoliating wash will help with the itching but I will give it a try.  The itching comes more from being uncomfortable sitting still for too long.  I read where someone else had said that they have a problem with their joints getting uncomfortable after sitting still for too long.  It's sort of like that.  My joints get uncomfortable too.  That's good advice about rubbing the hands together during the next experience.  If I am cognizant enough to remember it, that is what I will do.  

@Xanth: Yes, when I notice the physical sensations they do usually tend to fade away.  Though not always.  Sometimes they can get pretty strong.  And yeah, I know about sleep paralysis.  I have a friend that experiences it quite frequently.  It was just the first time it happened to me so it was quite strange.  I was certain there was someone standing next to me watching me.  Though I had a strange sense that it was a burglar, because I thought I had heard someone open the door, which I had locked.  But it only lasted what I think was about 30 seconds or so before I woke up.   The same with the other experience where I walked to the bathroom and couldn't figure out how to turn on the lights.  Lasted about 30-45 seconds and then I woke up in bed.  I'll look over that Tom campbell stuff and hopefully that will help out.

What about the going over music in my head to keep the chatter at bay?  Good idea?  Bad idea?  It seems the same as a mantra to me.  But I'm a huge noob at this stuff so I really don't know.  

But I feel like it's important to learn how to do this before the year is over.  It seems important in case something big does happen at some point this year.  Thanks for the help.

So I've been attempting the phasing method for several months now and there are some road blocks that I have noticed, that I have no idea how to get around, and thought I would ask you guys to help.

1.) No shapes appear-Sometimes I can lay in bed and stare for 45 minutes and nothing appears.  Some nights when I try shapes are immediate and pretty solid.  The most common thing I see is a sort of jagged vibrating circle that starts in the entirety of my vision and dwindles then disappears in the center of my vision.  This repeats over and over again and is usually either a whitish/yellowish color, or a sort of bluish color.  But sometimes I just can't get anything to appear no matter how long I concentrate and stare.  This makes it VERY hard to stay focused and I get bored and lose my concentration. 

2.) As soon as I lay in bed my mind starts to race like crazy.  This is a problem I have always had ever since I was very young.  Sleeping has always been a problem for me.  I used to take cannabis to help me sleep, but that's not an option at the moment, so I instead take antihistamines.  Most usually benadryl.  I usually make my phasing attempts before it kicks in though, because after they do sometimes it gets very hard to focus and I just say "screw it" and go to sleep.  I know people say that getting rid of dialogue in your head is absolutely essential to success, so to combat this I usually play instrumental music in my head.  This is sometimes pretty successful at keeping the dialogue to a minimum and sometimes makes it non-existent, but sometimes it still creeps in and when it does it usually takes over.  The music I play over in my head is usually something that is short and repetitive so that I can loop it over and over again.  My most used is "Farewell to Cheyenne" from Once Upon A Time in the West.  How good of an idea is this?  It seems like the same idea as a mantra to me, but I could be very wrong about this.

3.) My third and biggest problem by far.....random body itches.  I've always been a physically uncomfortable, twitchy, itchy guy.  I'm pretty short and skinny.  So when I lay in bed, and lie still I always get random itches somewhere on my body that builds to a point where I can't ignore it anymore and have to scratch it.  And when there is one, then others always follow.  I have found this problem to most likely be my biggest roadblock

This isn't to say that I haven't had some success.  Whenever i am able to lie still, not talk to myself in my head, and stare at shapes behind my eyes, I usually get strange physical sensations.  Most notably for a few seconds I will feel like my body is swirling, or like I am floating on top of some water, if that makes sense to anyone.  Also I will eventually feel heavier, and my body will tingle pretty strongly.  I guess I can feel what people refer too as their "astral body".  Sometimes I become very aware of it.  But I can always still move my body.

Also about 2 weeks ago, during an attempt I think I actually did have a projection.  I remember once I was laying in bed but couldn't move.  I then had the overwhelming sense that someone was standing next to me, just staring at me while I layed there.  It was sort of uncomfortable actually.  Then I seemingly woke up and could move again.  I instantly made another another attempt.  I remember getting out of bed, walking through my bedroom door and into the bathroom.  Then I found it very strange that I couldn't turn on any light switches.  After about 30 seconds of this I woke up in bed.  I'm not entirely sure if it was a projection or not because it all felt very dreamy and if it was I clearly fell asleep during it and so the memory of it was hazier I guess.

So does anyone have these problems too, and have any advice?  I would greatly appreciate it.  Sorry about the length of the post.  I tried not to make a wall of text though.  Thanks in advance.

I'm curious as to how long some of you attempt a phase before you decide it is time to give up?  I haven't achieved getting into the phase yet, but I still am feeling something.  I usually do attempts from around 15-30 minutes.  Is this too long, or not long enough, or just right? 

I'm a musician as well.  I play guitar in a cover band and am used to standing up and playing for hours on end, so holding concentration for extended periods of time isn't really that difficult for me, if what I am concentrating is interesting.  This is also why I have trouble keeping music from playing in my head all the time.  It's pretty constant.  Over the last couple of days I have gotten better at keeping my mind empty for longer.  But I can still only do it for about 10-20 seconds at a time it seems before I find myself talking about something to myself, or running some tune over in my head.  But I'm not sure that the music is impeding my progress because like I said, I can usually see many shapes and movements behind my eyes, and even feel like I'm physically moving along with them after awhile.  But then as soon as this starts to happen it is very hard not to get excited and start concentrating on the body again. 

Er... please tell me where it says that.

I don't remember where it is exactly.  But I remember a spot where he says he regularly meditates in deep space for hours at a time. 

And it's good to hear alot of people here can phase for lengthy periods of time.  Ten minutes isn't really enough time to watch a pack of velociraptors hunt a hadrosaur.  But I can see the need to keep it short and simple in the beginning. 

I have a question about the time a person can spend phasing.  It says in Michael Raduga's guide that a person can only phase for around 10 minutes.  How is this enough time to do some of the incredible things that people talk about doing, like exploring the RTZ, and deep space and things of that nature.  How does that allow time to search through the Akashic records and other such phenomena?  How does it give you the time to go back and reexperience memories from the past?  It is just a confusingly short amount of time.

While reading Mastering Astral Projection in 90 days by Robert Bruce, he makes it sound like you can astral project for hours on end, and do it anytime you want.  What is it that I'm missing here?

Hey guys, I'm new and I have a question that pertains to this very thing.  I have been trying to phase off and on for a couple of weeks now, and I have read this same guide by Raduga and have a question about the indirect techniques.  I have acid reflux and waking up almost always means an hour of nausea, which does not seem like an ideal physical state to be able to do this.  Even if I am not nauseous I always have to get up to go to the bathroom without exception.  This always wakes me up enough to make my mind race when I go to lay back down and try to phase.  I am afraid that if indirect techniques are my only option that it might not ever work.  But at the same time this guys guide says that trying direct techniques first can lead to serious road blocks.  What should I do.

Also is it really ill advised to try more than one attempt per 24 hour period?  Is it not ok to try a direct technique before bed, and then an indirect one when I wake up? 

When I am laying in bed trying the direct technique (which for me is the noticing) I never have any trouble finding shapes behind my eyelids.  They show up immediately.  And during several attempts I have gotten swirling light that actually made me feel like I was physically swirling with it a bit.  Very odd sensation.  Could this be an indication of impending success?  It's also very VERY hard not to notice when my body starts to feel heavier, and gets very tingly.  (like my energy body.....I tried Robert Bruce's book for awhile but this seems far more fruitful and makes more sense to me.)    Also is it ok to play instrumental music in your head to keep the dialogue away?  That stuff is pretty hard to combat, especially when you are drowsy. 

Any advice on what I should do?