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if you have problems ap'ing the best technique to silence the mind or keep it on one thing is to give it a question it cannot answer which is called a koan.  for example pretend a tree is hanging over a cliff with a rope and you are holding onto it with your teeth with your hands/legs tied behind your back and you try to find a way out which there isnt but you try to figure things out ie swing around then stand still and hope an answer comes then if mind gets chattery again keep doing it over and over again til the mind is completely quiet.  Two times I managed I think conscious ap's from it one time i had a falling sensation then i slowly crawled out, second time I felt like my physical body could move a bit but was difficult but it wasnt my physical body i imagined the roll technique bruce says and i rolled out turned around saw myself on the bed so this is a wonderful technique give it a shot if all fails.

I found the most effective technique for ap.  They say if you can keep your mind on one thing while drifting off to sleep you can ap.  Only problem with this is your mind wanders or thoughts enter the mind a lot.  You should check out the koan and duality techniques that are offered at mysticweb.org investigative course after you taken astral/self knowledge/journey to enlightment you can enrol in the investigative course.  To make a short story short the koan technique is to give your mind a question or situation that it cannot answer and it will silence itself as a result duality is like substitute the opposite of any thought that enters the mind to neutralize it.  If you want to learn what the techniques are in detail best to enrol in the course.  I can't believe I was able to do it even my awareness was low ie I ap'd but I was drowsy cause I projected before I went to bed but somehow this silencing of thoughts technique is what did it the other techniques are like awareness think at one thing at a time can also help you ap as well.  I did the koan I had a few thoughts I neutralized it with duality technique I had the falling sensation which meant my body was falling asleep then I knew at that point I can just walk out and I did.  This I have to admit is my first conscious ap and I was lying down in bed, other ap techniques that helped before was going to sleep 4 1/2 hours wakeup wash face stay awake and aware drop back to sleep with awareness of one thing ie visualize an object or something then have it in the mind etc..

I was reading up on the different type of biofeedback devices the most expensive is the eeg machine that reads beta/alpha/theta brainwaves they say if our mind is in alpha we are in deep meditation/relaxation and focused attention.  the second best and the least cost is the GSR unit galvanized skin resistance where volts go through your fingers and the more resistant means more tension etc..  Now the cheapest only cost a few bucks is taking your temperature of your fingers.  They say if our fingers give off 67-75 degrees farenheit means we are very tensed have anxiety etc.. 75-80 is neutral 80-85 is little calm/alert still 85-90 is calm (blue color crystal) and 90-97 (dark blue color crystal) is deeply relaxed so the more warm our hands are are an indicating we are very relaxed.  you can buy a mood ring crystal that changes color according to temperature of finger that goes from black (worst), green (neutral) and blue/dark blue (calm/relaxed).  I know if we keep our mind calm relaxed throughout the day the stone should stay blue also I think will help in ap's since alpha state is a relaxed state also if your mind is not blue then we can bring it back to blue with awareness (be aware of what you are doing at the moment ie staring at a candle or washing dishes etc..) or concentrating on one thing i believe quiets our chatterbox mind down.  Just thought I share this since that is what AP really is keeping our mind on one thing so our ap's can happen and last longer and be more clearer.  Mood ring only costs like $2-4 or a stress card where you put your fingerprint on it for 10secs and shows a color, or $15 for a temperature gauge measurer. you can buy a gsr device (gsr2 or thoughtstream gsr) for like $60-120 which is really cheap compared to an eeg ($1000).

I was reading of this ganzfeld technique which rarely anyone in this forum is talking about and many science laboratories use to induce altered conscious experiences.  It's called ganzfeld mainly the monks used to stare in clear skies or in white snow and in minutes shift their mind to the theta state.  They say within minutes your mind goes into the theta state.  All you have to do is buy ping pong ball cut it in half make sure no logo on it put it the eye where it completely covers it and lie down make sure the room is lit and the balls are white and also listen to static noise ie a untuned radio station noise.  I feel this sort of silences the mind, I'd like any feedback anyone managed ap's with this.  They say they also use this for psi stuff people who guess an image in another room normally its 1/4 chance but when they did this method their odds were 36% instead of 25% to indicate this increases your psi.  I think it maybe as good or better than concentrating on the candle technique and I noticed many science psychology/psi labs use this techniques.  

here are some links about it
http://shadowboxent.brinkster.net/lemurtheta.html
http://www.brainmachines.com/body_ganzfeld.html
http://skepdic.com/ganzfeld.html

just came across another site www.path-ways.com that teaches astral projection and many other topics this is more elaborate than say mysticweb's mysticweb.org but i don't believe in all of it though ie mediumship which mysticweb and robert bruce says is no good to do and reasons why but other than that it feels as though a lot of sites are popping up in this nature recently and of course these sites are free.

New astral book, if you go the amazon isbn 0974056006 type that it's called astral projection 8 week course it's similar to the same free courses offered at mysticweb.org from the same author.  It's interesting because they take a different approach to astral projection and have to say some of those techniques will get you projecting right away.  What I really like is they talk about awareness a lot and ego's and such and how to abolish them which I think is the most important thing not only for AP but many other things to free up the subconscious and have more conscious and the author himself said he is now a V.M Venerable Master because he managed to free up 50% of his subconscious/ego's and able to be more with the divine as a result and he says we use only like 3% of our conscious daily the most and most of it is 97% subconscious ie daydreaming/thinking emotions etc and not doing any awareness at all.
Two techniques that always work is sleep technique sleep 5hours wakeup wash face stay alert 30mins then drop down to sleep when you are aware you are dreaming do your awareness/observing at objects/things then the dream will shut down then crawl out of bed it works 50% of the time, those two are mentioned in the book.  It's a good book you will learn new things from it, and if you don't want to plunk down the money at the beginning go to his website and signup for the free course.

Another good website is lucidity.com they talk about dreams/lucid dreaming and the science/probability i like about it but they don't go much into astral projection unfortunately but you can learn a lot more things from dreams with this book as well called exploring the world of lucid dreaming by stephen laberge and of course robert bruce's astral dynamics is really nice book I feel it's more of an intermediate book than a beginners but still an interesting book to refer to after you manage to astral project and want to advance more.

I'm just wondering has anyone done or heard of sulfur bathes?  I have heard stories of mountains or places where there is spring water with sulfur in it and that people who have had say diseases were cured from it because the sulfur somehow goes into the body through the skin and disinfects the body and cleanses it.  I also read in practice self defense book that sulfur is burnt in the house and is the most strongest incense to expel neg entities.  I never heard robert say if it's any good bathing in it especially in hot spring places where there is naturally occuring sulfur in it.

I've had many successful methods which I attribute to http://mysticweb.org they offer a free course no strings attached.  I finished the astral projection course and going into the self knowledge course which just started this week I think you can still apply this week.  What has worked is the sleep technique mentioned there and also concentration, what I also like they have a private forum for students who are enrolled in the course to ask questions and get responses from masters at it.  For one thing nobody told me what the ego is or I didn't have an understanding now and why you have to do these concentration exercises basically what it boils down to what you do in the physical is carried in the astral/dream state and you want to carry that awareness with you, or what is the projection of the mind versus seeing the true spirit world its really good and thorough course.

I started doing the NEW system body awareness and this week some pains I was getting in my head, I only get it when blood rushes to the penis (ie masterbate/sex) first it was at the chakra (top of head) then second time i tried it it was in the front of my face/teeth/cheek third eye, after I you know i get an extreme soreness in my head that lasts many hours.  I stopped doing NEW I'm wondering will this subside and what is going on here why is it doing this to me did i over stimulate my head or is it getting used to more energy and I know when you have sex your brain must be creating a lot of energy or burning ie (ie body heat etc..) thats what I also notice when i start feeling the body heat the pains starts to kick in a bit then afterwards a lot when i ejaculate.

I happened to prolong a lucid dream, amazing technique discovered by stephen laberge of lucidity institute lucidity.com read the faq.  It didn't work the first time but now i am getting the hang of it this is my situation.  I wokeup in my bed and thought i was awake but did a test i moved out slowly i can't see (problem for most people til they move away from the body) then i hit a wall.  I did a technique someone mentioned to make the SHH sound (not SS but SSHHH) while walking through a wall and it worked i went through the wall outside my porch the SSHH sound disrupts the brain somehow and doesn't think its a solid wall.  I went outside anomalies kicked in a bit its ok but I felt like I was becoming drunk again (losing my awareness) a bit so I breathed slowly/calmed down that helped for a short bit then i turned back to walk to my house i was getting really drunk i knew i was going to phase out completely which is what was happening things were blacking out so to speak so i did the spin technique.  This is how i did it properly i imagined i stretched my hands out like a T then spun but remembered how it felt to be on those playground wheel things that you stand onto and hold onto a metal bar and someone turns you around thats how i was feeling like i was turning around on one of those things (without holding to the bar stretching arms out instead) and at same time imagine wind flowing through me so fast to indicate i was spinning fast.  First time i did it for a few seconds didn't work still everything was black.  So the second time I did it but I also kept awareness of where I am this time, so I kept my awareness (remember/imagined where i was) where I last blacked out outside my house then I stopped spinning then all of a sudden the picture broke back in and I felt like I wasn't drunk anymore had my awareness back so I started to go into my house, then I moved objects (Which weren't there anyways) thought I wakeup see if i actually moved them but I could of kept on and on with thise techniques its an amazing technique they say it works 95% of the time if you do it right that is.  Amazing I wonder if this spin technique works for conscious astral projection cause it works real darn good in lucid mode, I'd love to try it in conscious astral projection mode see if it works as well.

I'm having so much success getting out of my body early in the morning when I wake up few hours earlier, stay awake 30mins then go back to sleep trying to keep my awareness as I dose off to sleep, this time I said to myself I will not concentrate on the hypnagogic only myself and my breathing.  Somehow I fell asleep and don't remember dreaming at all but was in my bed trying to seperate.  When I tried to seperate my body I had some part of me stuck so I didn't panic or force it I said I will breath slower so I am more relaxed and also imagine being more relaxed and be patient as I seperate, so it worked I felt myself slipping out.  I went out, outside to the front yard then I said I wanted to visit my parents who are at work, I tried imagining the place they work but still my subconscious drew an object of the dashboard of the car in front of me instead, how are you supposed to get to other places if the mind doesn't correspond.  Also I have never flew before when I go out the window I just sink to the ground level, how do you fly?  I wokeup tried ap again it worked a second time I saw some person sitting in a chair in my room and another person outside with a dog at the deck.  Just to be certain I said in the name of our Lord begone problem was I tried saying it my voice went mute/low I said it second time it cracked/broke in and heard it, then they disappeared I went outside and started to see some spirits (could be same ones or maybe others heard it) they were in blurr/vibrate/convulsing (like the road runner but blurrness), I wonder why does the voice not respond is there some resistance if there is negative entities present cause I had another scenario like this same as before only worked second time I said it? I also tried this a third time again, problem the subconscious was catching upto me and then started messing things up when I went to go out the window the window drywall crumbled and I started to be afraid of going out, then saw behind the drywall crumble was all glass behind, weird nonetheless.

I went to this site:
http://www.globalpsychics.com/lp/angel_messages/paradox.htm
talks about the exercise called tibetan paradox for spiritual enlightment.  It's getting your brain to do 4 things at the same time, whole brain development.  I'm wondering has anyone tried this before and benefited and in what way?  I haven't heard anyone talk about this method but you know the tibetans they know lots of good techniques for meditation.

I had an interesting scenario today, I was able for the first time to control my hypnagogic but not fully.  I did the 5hours sleep 30mins awake then fall asleep technique to stay alert.  As I was falling asleep I was paying attention to the images that was going to flash in my face (hypnagogic).  I literally felt the transition from wake into the dream state, I tried not to interact with the images in front of me, I did not want to see the images in front of me anymore so I said astral project, then all of a sudden I partially wokeup trying to get out but I wasn't in deep relaxation/sleep yet so I couldn't get out completely then I woke up for real.  Whats freaky I tried it again and again I saw the exact same dream scenario (where I usually work in real life), I started to interact then stopped and wanted to astral project so instead of astral projecting I just woke up.  This is very annoying because it looks to me I am getting a partial control over this conscious projection stuff the only thing is what was I supposed to do in this scenario if I was alert and I couldn't shutdown the hypnagogic images/first dream scene when I was fully alert and could of commanded anything in order to do a conscious projection from this?  I recall a conscious obe from a lucid dreaming you need to go into a state where you see through your closed eyelids on your bed and feeling your body paralysing even more before you come out (happened once) just that this time it would not take the command fully, I wonder if there are any other techniques that will almost guarantee a full blown obe like a conscious obe from this.  Its just annoying when you are going through what robert bruce says in order to astral project and still there are stumbling blocks not explained about.

I'm beginning to wonder after reading robert's book again, its not explained exactly what the point of awareness is?  (scenario #1) I've been doing it this way just imagining energy running through my body and my point awareness is at my head feeling the sensation running through my body is that the proper point of awareness? This sounds sucky because it feels like you are in your physical body as being the dominant thing/thought and the body awareness/energy as secondary.  (scenario#2) The other way I'm thinking is if you imagine you are completely and entirely at the spot ie say at your feet and no other thought/feeling you allow come into your mind or push it aside that you are at your head feeling the tingling at your feet?  In this scenario you're allowing your dominant thought of the stimulation all at the point and secondary be the least to even think of being at your head feeling tingling at your body part.  I'm just wondering which is the better scenario is it #2 where you imagine you are completely at that point or another way of putting it if you were in your etheric body the entire etheric body would be at that point that is being stimulated and completely or almost completely forget you are at the point of your physical head feeling the tingling throughout your body parts?  I think scenario #2 is powerful because you concentrate less on the physical body because its similar to imagining that you are standing next to your bed or some other point outside of the body and forget the thought that you are lying on your bed, same as the body parts you imagine you are at that spot of the body and not in your physical body feeling the heart being stimulated, so thus you are shutting down the sensory input from the rest of the body parts cause you're awareness is just not there anymore. I heard people obe just by concentrating on one physical body part of awareness ie the heart for example?  Just want some input on those who successfully obe and tell me which scenario you choose, I think I've been doing the wrong scenario (#1) for a long time now and I realize why I haven't produced a lot of good results, mind you I have produced some results with scenario #1 but only when my body was in a drowsy/alert state.

What makes me wonder is how can I do scenario#2 if its supposed to be the most powerful with split awareness. Its easy to imagine energy running through your body starting from legs upto hips/back of head, hands upto back of head then down the front of head to the naval (scenario#1). But in scenario#2 when you are exactly at the point of awareness and then you have to imagine you are at two points or four points at the same time ie both your legs and at the same time as you move up there are two more point of awarenessess then as you move up two more points are added ie now the two hands and feet at the same time) tricky stuff/imagination there, how do you pull it off in scenario#2? The only way to pull it off is to imagine the two points of awareness of the legs go upto the hip then merge into one point of awareness. Then as you move upto the back of your chest with only one point of awareness you imagine both your hands to your arms merging with your back of the chest awareness and then as one awareness going up around the head to the naval is that the best way to do it if its scenario#2?

I just signed up at http://www.mysticweb.org there is no catch they actually offer online free courses on effective methods of astral projection (20 page course per week, 8 week course with lessons/practice/theory), some I already know but I bet there maybe other methods that I don't.  They just started with the 1st week online course today, I think you can still register to get it this week otherwise you have to wait after 8 weeks to start again.

I don't know but anyone has any techniques to force a full blown obe from a lucid or low level obe.  I only twice in my lifetime had a full blown obe both from a conscious state and lucid state.  It's easy to do a fake obe if you do the 6 hours awake 3 (stay up 1 hour) then go back to sleep this way mind is awake/alert a little doesn't fall asleep to the dream.  Many times I was able to manipulate my dreams ie I see something (hypnogogic) but then I would imagine myself standing by the bed and all of a sudden I feel like tingling in my body and also movement and if I keep the thought for 5-10 seconds bam I'm out feel myself in that spot but it's all false and not the true obe (ie no static noise, no body heaviness like one time and no spirit/entities and many anomalies).  I would come out and see myself on the bed then I'd be making funny signs at myself on the bed instead of lying asleep or I go outside and see many anomalies and no ghostly spirits, it's almost a dream.  I even try to say something to get myself into a higher alert or real obe like saying astral project and it would not work or I would say the function commands for self healing would not feel any response but if I was FULLY alert into a dream one time I said I want to go out it did it automatically also said the function command felt a response it's like a VERY VERY low level obe or like not much external input and mostly mental construction/imagined but it annoys me because I know I am dreaming but I am trying to give my mind commands to make it a full blown obe and it will not respond except for getting out and moving around thats all it does.  There has to be ways to make the mind more alert in a dreamstate anyone know what they are?  I'm thinking of trying some from labarge's lucidity ie make a lucid dream last longer try spinning or rubbing hands etc.. I dunno if it would work for obe's?

i saw a weird device at http://www.futurehorizons.net/time2.htm you attach to your head and naval and it sends alpha signal of 7.8 to your body to help you astral project but whats even weirder it has a time dial so you can set which time past/future if you want to astral project.  I can understand the first part about 7.8 alpha waves in brain being valid but does this device really work or joke money scheme?

I'm just wondering I pulled off my first obe by doing body awareness exercises (with the help of hemi-sync tapes/immunizing/focus 10 by monroe institute).  Just wondering when I had my first obe I did not do anything but body awareness exercises and the feel of good energy channeling through my body all of a sudden I had a surge to my left lobe then hit my chest a lot I continued then instantly when I channelled energy through legs to the head then to the third eye/chest/belly/naval I heard a static noise then I was free automatically except my legs.  I used other methods when my feet were stuck (ie do awareness on feet then I Was completely free).  I thought this can also be used for physical energy as well (if you have a physical ailment ie immune system boost) but nothing happened in that aspect when the energy surged.  From what I hear from robert bruce you get two added benefits of body awareness exercises which he says we should do atleast an hour or so a day the benefits are you open your energy centers channel more energy to them so in a sense you increase your body's immune system/energy?  Just wondering anyone who obe'd did they just do body awareness exercises alone to obe and for those who use it for physical healing when did you start seeing results?  So in other words anyone here who has done robert's new system body awareness if you had any physical ailment what was it and how much did it help and how long you've been doing new?  And for those who do obe was body awareness alone the most important thing to obe and the others are just in case you're stuck to your body?

I can't believe it this is my first conscious obe took me only 1 hour and a bit. Before I would have obe's from lucid dreams (but no spirits in them) now I was able to pull it off at the conscious level and it was so darn easy.  This is what I use I use the helichrysum oil to increase my physical energy so I actually feel electricty through my body when I do body awareness exercises, I use it like a mental marker so I know if I am focusing right if I am I will feel current/sparks if I focus super well some sparks will spark so much it'll start to itch in that spot.  The positive attitude I keep is in a desirous mood like sex (minus the private parts) saying boy does this feel (as a feeling not a verbal thing) or would feel good current running through my body it'll feel so good when I keep running current through the body to see if I can run it even more current with my desire/will.  Also today I only slept about 5 hours so I was a bit drowsy that helped a little but still my mind was alert (think it was those monroe tapes sharpens your focus).  I also use monroe institute immunizing cd (physical energy) (not as expensive as the gateway thats all you need though for hemisync) and tommy's vibration starter (bwgen.com preset) which has one part similar to immunizing (beginning/end of tape sound) just the beat slows down more as you listen to it, no dialogue.

So this is what I did and what the outcome was, I played the immunizing exercise, the way I breath in when I do body awareness I take deep breaths where the air goes all into the stomach stomach bloats through the nose I take it in and then let it out through the mouth at a slow pace or at the pace of the beat slowly, when there are parts where the man doesn't dialogue I keep even more aware of the electricy and body parts running through my body sometimes if I don't feel energy running through I do the stimulation thing in that part from robert's book.  After I finished the immunizing cd I played tommy's vibration starter did body awareness exercise more aware again then the cd stopped after 30mins I kept on doing it on my own.  Then after a little bit all of a sudden BIG rush of energy shot into my head at the left lobe and then felt it in my chest (thought this was physical energy to self heal) so I said wow I have to keep doing this so it gets even more intense then all of a sudden I was getting out of my body but my feet were stuck to my body so I said I better relax them then I did some awareness on my legs to get them unstuck then I said let me push myself upwards to the ceiling instead of forward motion going through the wall then all of a sudden it worked I got out then I had my sight as well rooms upstairs were dark like in real life, I went right through the wall and I swear I saw a spirit being in transparent white almost exactly the picture at the astralpulse website the woman at the top left hand corner saw this little girl in transparent white running down the stairs I think she saw me then was walking downstairs away from me I ran after her when I got halfway downstairs I saw other white/transparent spirit beings in the other room of the house I think she was walking towards to them then I thought I would get a little afraid talking/seeing these other spirits for the first time (first time to see in my obe's transparent spirits cause this was the real deal obe) so i aborted told myself to wakeup.  

Is that how spirits look in transparent bright white identical to the woman picture at the top left corner of astralpulse website?
I wonder why I never had them (spirit beings) in my lucid dreams, was it because I had more energy/awareness since I did it at the conscious level obe?

And there were anomalies the top floor was dark (lights shut off) not the bottom floor in real world but in the astral it was all dark even the bottom, maybe my perception was of my room upstairs (viewing angel from upstairs) felt the whole house was dark cause I came from upstairs and stayed halfway upstairs (didn't go down the stairs all the way).


Also when I was trying to get out (energy rush that shot through my body) I heard noise which did not come from my stereo set (knew it was shut off) like static or something came for few seconds then shut off I knew it was made up noise (like in robert's book mentioning this) didn't scare me a bit.

I believe reason my feet were stuck is I felt the energy in my left lobe and then it hit my chest it didn't go to my legs so I had to do the extra awareness to get my energy raised at my legs so I can obe when my feet were stuck.

Another weird thing is sometimes when I listen to the hemisync tapes and concentrate on the body awareness exercises the volume goes mute for a second. I know the tapes are fine I believe my mind is so focused on the body awareness exercise somtimes I enter a split second trance state then get out of it.

I believe the hemisync tapes work because with the helichrysum oil as a marker I feel more energy after I do it and are more relaxed but thats all they do though relax you as if you did a good meditation.

I can't wait to pull off another obe I've only been listening to monroe's/tommy's vibration starter stuff for a week now I think these helped a lot as tools.  I'd have to start to build my courage to confront these beings and talk to them, its scary cause its my first time and in real life you just don't see them in your house any tips on that?  

I was searching the internet with a fine tooth comb on eeg machines because I first got interested in the hemisync monroe tapes they talked about theta/alpha states is where to get the mind at to achieve obe theta is for near the brink of sleep lucid dreaming but spikes of alpha are good for some alertness/awareness like the hemisync wave1 intro to focus10 does with those sound spikes.  But anyways I found out its even more powerful to have a biofeedback machine that tells you or records your eeg readings so you know if you are in alpha/theta (shut off the chatterbox beta) so then with time and training you can do it with your will.  Only problem these machines are for practitioners only they cost an arm and a leg to buy one from $1k upto $8k.  However there is a group now in interest of having it public domain for its called the openeeg project http://openeeg.sourceforge.net/buildeeg and mailing list at http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?forum=openeeg-list
they have several software written for the hardware device and schematics how to build one it only costs $200 (in parts assemble yourself) if you source the parts from 4 vendors they say if they can mass produce these things they can get the price down to $100.  This is a major breakthrough a lot of people can own this device for personal use very soon in the upcoming months some vendors will be selling them already assembled but if you can't wait you can buy the parts and assemble yourself.

I came across a site that explains binaurial sound beats how they can help a person train their brain to go into a trance state quickly heres the link
http://brain.web-us.com/thescience.htm

I've tried brainwave software and as it drops frequency from alpha (12 to 8 mhz) to theta (8 to 4mhz) and stays at 4mhz theta I get very relaxed I wonder if this can help someone accelerate to obe because it actually helps condition the mind to relax a lot? That is also what the monroe institute teaches and sells those hemi-sync tapes which are pretty much binaural sound beats.

I came across this site: http://www.innerworlds.50megs.com/shakti/intro_page.htm
that talks about shakti the electromagnetic signal helmet sends the signals to the brain that produces spiritual experiences it costs $250 and $40 for 6 months tech support they say it works in almost everyone and its licensed by michael persinger who was the pioneer of this device and now this is the second generation has anyone even tried this device?

has anyone tried this affirmation I read it from this website http://mymysteries.net lesson#1 on mystic awareness or conscious awareness raising?  Like you affirm it with feeling and of joy for a few weeks the word "wake up!" to yourself in a mirror and to the family or to the world you view etc..  I think this can trickle down to the subconscious and then start triggering things like being aware you are dreaming or maybe even be intuitive on situations etc..  I know this kind of thing does work because one time I did body awareness exercises fell asleep and realized in one dream sequence I said to myself hey this is not real I'm in my body in my bedroom doing my body awareness exercises and became lucid and aware of it but its freaky to use this "wake up!" affirmation because it can lead to many possibilities besides lucid dreaming to obe.  any comments on this?

They weren't joking when they say that this herb can make you lucid a lot.  The first night I didn't lucid at all but the second night I was luciding like crazy whats amazing I had control over it and even remembered all 6 obe/lucid sequences where I was in my room coming out of my body 6 times in a row.  It really puts your mind in a sleepy/drowsy borderline state for a few hours.  It was wild because it looked real like I obe'd but it also had people I know in it so it was part obe part dream but I had full control of it, for example I said the moon was going to crash towards earth and it did or I said the moon was going to move back and it did.  It feels like I slept for hours I wasn't really tired slept only 3 hours and had 6 obe's/lucid sequences in 3 hours and remember them ALL!.  Just wanted to report this, I thought gotu kola herb was the best I would have some obe/lucid's with this but this is the best its called Wild Lettuce you can buy some at herbco.com or other places on the iternet just put one teaspoon  and boil it steep it out, I think you can only make it as a tea not in capsule/powder form.

I found a really neat visual/subliminal message I'm going to try it out tonight they say watch it 20minutes before going to sleep most people said they atleast were able to remember their dreams and others say they went lucid. link is at http://handyhub.smokepit.cjb.net/lucid_dreaming/lucidsub.htm here are posts about it at this site:
http://www.xs4all.nl/~pasquale/TTM/r1/index.html