The Astral Pulse

U speak as if humans were capable off agreeing on a standard rational language (which english is n0t). If evrybudy nos wut it meens, wy duz it n33d 2 b changd?

Great post. Learn some english for christ's sake.

Oh and, how the hell can people take you seriously if you can't spell or use grammar properly?

I mean, how many retarded girls have you met online who talk like that, and they end up being materialistic bimboes with no other purpose in life other than to screw boys and be popular.

I agree with Squeek. Enough is ENOUGH!! This is a site about astral things, metaphysical things, etc., not f*ggin "i'm a pyro look at me i'm so cool cuz i cant spel"

First the ki krowd, now this.

The Astral Pulse is tainted...

~FT

Okay, let us see WHY it is so necessary beavis...

First off, notice what happens in your mind when you read. That's right, internal dialogue. It recites it back to you in a voice that you give to the person who wrote it, or the person who is speaking in a story.

Now, as sun as u strt 2 tlk lik dis, that internal dialogue gives you the voice of a retard. It's usually stupid bimboes who talk like this to me, so I always seem to have the image of a materialistic B*TCH in mind when a girl talks to me like that. Not a very nice first impression. And as you know, first impressions are VERY important.

I mean, do you want to look respectable to a rich crowd by wearing sleezy or even homeless-people clothes? Same's with typing. If you want to be taken seriously, present yourself as at least a decently literate person, not some protard who will never be taken seriously, simply because of his typing.

Look at those ki sites. More than half of them have the spelling of 4 year olds, and their grammar is even worse. Sure, there could be some kids who really want to make a difference, but will they be taken seriously? No.

You think Robert Monroe and Robert Bruce would be so renowned for their research if dey talkd like dis? Don't think so.

~FT

Ok i agree with you on the bad context of posts, but i think you might be holding too high an expectation of your fellow board members with the spelling. Sure replacing words with numbers and stuff is annoying, but the more understandable mistakes (they're/there/their) i think are completely acceptable. Remember, not everybody on these boards are English experts and there are some who don't even have English as a first language.

Having said that, there is also one common grammatical mistake that REALLY gets to me as well.
It's NOT "i could care less"
It IS "i couldn't care less"

"I could care less" implies that you really could care less about the subject than you actually do, which means that that you actually do care about it to some extent.

"I couldn't care less" means that there is no caring going on at all.

Yes i'm a hypocrite, but i just HAD to point that out. It drives me insane!

Edited for spelling mistakes [:P] (the ones i could see anyway)

Reminds me of a rant on Maddox's site about how the average intelligence level of the average computer user is dropping like a rock.
http://maddox.xmission.com/aliens.html
Funny site, makes you look at a lof of things for what they really are. I don't understand all this abbreviation at all. I mean things like LOL and GTG are acceptable, most of the time I don't feel like writing out Laugh Out Loud, and it just sounds weird. But with all the little letter abbreviations, I had a race with one of those people who do that, typing a paragraph, them using the abbreviations and me typing normally, and I beat them. I say if you're going to use a keyboard for that much of your waking hours of life you should get an idea on how to use it. It's also great practice for typing essays, and I don't think you will get the job interview with "20 resuns y i am a gud wrkr an u shuld hir me it wll b gr8!!!"

Oh, my God, Squeek! I love you whole-heartedly! I completely agree with you. I just can't stand when people type like that. I mean, come on... We go to school and learn this stuff for a reason. The Internet seems to be the biggest reason, so far, but people slack off and say things like "im not n skewl i don ned 2 use proper english," and boy, do I wish I could just smack some sense into them.


Well, since you're going to get some of the people who do type like that to yell at you (well, that's what has happened on everyother forum I've been on when someone rants like this, but this forum is different, so it might not happen), I'll start:

Oh, by the way, uh, aren't proper nouns supposed to be capitalized? Aren't proper nouns the names of things, places, or people? Isn't a language a thing? Oh, so, then, uh, wouldn't it be "English?"

"Word." Hmm. I get a "W" sound when I say that word. Why'd you put an "an" in front of it?

People can never let your minor mistakes slip by when they foresee your actions as a direct assault upon their foundation.

Thanks for the topic Squeek. I do agree that using proper grammar is the way to go. There are a number of reasons for this of course, not the least of which is to properly convey what one is trying to say.

In the environment of school or the workplace it is very important. Just how well you succeed can rest heavily on writing and communication skills. Why not work on improving those skills here as well?


All the best,

Oh please, chill out! Language is a tool to get what you are saying across to the other person/people. If job has been achieved, nomatter how much "language" is truly used, who cares? And what does it bother you if those people really CANT spell?? So long as you can vaguely understand them......although you sound like you dont want to know what they are saying anyway........

c u l8r!

R

Too fuc*ing bad.

1. This is the net! ITs not a classroom where we all must be gramaticly correct!

2. As long as it is readable, its fine!

3. Im sorry if other people and I do not have the time to post a 4 paragraph reply. Reasons are we do not have that much content or its just opinion.

If you can not tolerate this, then too bad! People that type correctly are a minority online. Visit other forums, there are few people that type right.

Also about IM's. I wont type correctly in a IM. Its just dumb. You type like How r u doing man?


I get a 96 in English. Think I use all 'em skills online? NO.

Personally I think it is about time that you literalists start realizing that the alphabet is not absolute.!!!I am presently researching the alternative interpretation of it and have found out that the literal interpretation is a modern and very narrow minded approach. Words like Dude bum and chick and yo has alternative meanings and it is clear that this alternative meaning is the ONLY way to use the alphabet, if one wants to reach a deeper meaning of the language that is.

Take fx for an example YO ! There was a time that yo was used only in the word YO-YO. The YO-YO was an ancient device used mainly in Coca Cola (ancient beverage)  sponsored contests to prove manhood, and it became a cultural phenomena in  past times. When the tradition died out as new forms of entertainment became more the norm, MTV comes to mind here, the word "YO" emerged instead, as a common form of greeting , often with either hostile intent, such as "yo my man, watsup!!!" (threat), or the feminine "Yo boy, watsup!!" (sexual connotation) .

To this day it is common to see especially younger members of society using this term and , still flicking their right or left hand with their thum, pointing and little finger downwards, as if spinning an ancient "YO YO" in their ancient rituel manhood contests.

All this goes to prove that the language evolutes and cannot be taken literal, not even the spelling of it. I sure hope you will start to see the wisdom of my interpretation, and embrace the truth and start to use this knowledge to expand your vocablary. The Alphabeth and language is much greater and vastly more complex than you imagine, and infact you can make up your own language if you want to. Your own universe in which YOU alone decides what a spade is!!!A spade is not nessesarily a spade. Nor is a shovel always a shovel. If you choose to change things around and substitute some words and meanings of words you alone will be a master and God of your language. The only problem is noone will understand you as they also have their own languages. The other night fx I took my wife out and ordered in Mustardseedish (my language) 2 steaks and fries, but the waiter brought me 5 oven fried forks and 2 roasted monark butterflies. However this is a small price to pay for being able to say

"I make my own rules and no one tells me what anything means"

With all the best as you expand your horizon and develope your own unique language and become the creator of "SQUEEKISH"

Regards Mustardseed [;)]

It's sad to think that it's true...

That proper grammar has become the "minority" online.

quote:

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1. This is the net! ITs not a classroom where we all must be gramaticly correct!

2. As long as it is readable, its fine!

3. Im sorry if other people and I do not have the time to post a 4 paragraph reply. Reasons are we do not have that much content or its just opinion.

If you can not tolerate this, then too bad! People that type correctly are a minority online. Visit other forums, there are few people that type right.

Also about IM's. I wont type correctly in a IM. Its just dumb. You type like How r u doing man?

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1. It's a classroom setting to me... I mean you've got the people interested in learning, and the people that supply the information.  How is this not a classroom setting?  Sure, it isn't your school, but you aren't competing for grades here.  You're competing for credibility.  In recent days you and beavis have immensely lost all credibility you once had.  Sorry if this comes as a shock to you both.

2. As long as it's readable?  "thsisi barley rdabl 2 me."  Why are we conforming to this in the first place?  This is the reason I have put my foot down on this issue.  I'm done with being forced to know two different versions of English!  I want to know the one and only version: The right one.

3. Don't have time?!  What's stopping you?!  I share the internet with my sister.  It's a 28.8 modem.  I go so slow that it takes at least 50 seconds to open a single page on this site.  Any pictures, and it doubles the time.

Follow-up.  This place used to be one of those places that people used English the way it was meant to be used.  Somehow within the last 5 months it has all dramatically dropped to the other end of the spectrum.  And I hope the "You" referred to the general public, and not to me, because you've talked to me on AIM and you know I do not do that.

Like I said, it shouldn't bother me, but it does.

And Risu, thanks for pointing out my errors.  Proves to you that I'm not perfect, but I strive to be.

Let's see some more posts [:)] Particularly about how this all came about.  I want to see if other people think the same thing I do.

~Squeek

Well, I am ALMOST too scared to post ever again!  

I make mistakes all the time, you know this Squeek, we chat alot!  But does that make me a idiot or not a good human being?  And I like using LOL!......and my dots.....don't forget my dots!!!

Eh, whatever.. I hope you will chat with me still, even tho I make the exact mistakes that you put in your post..

*walks away, feeling pretty low about herself*

Nay [:(]

Dots? You mean periods?

Hehehe..yes..duh, it is a inside joke between Squeek and I [}:)]

Not to jump on the bandwagon, but I agree wholeheartedly.  Let me preface this by saying that there's a difference between an accidental spelling error, and intentionally typing like a monkey.

I don't mind when people spell certain things wrong (like there, their, etc) because sometimes English is their second language.  It's when people say "4" instead of "four," "wtevr" instead of "whatever," etc.  That is what bugs me.

And one more thing which no one else has mentioned.  It's somewhat annoying when people make a long post, and they don't use a single friggin' carriage return.  To put it more bluntly, USE THE ENTER KEY!

I like reading people's posts and trying to help, but to be honest, when I see someone with a question and their post is half a page long with no new paragraphs, I simply skip it.  Plain and simple.  Why?  Well, call me shallow, but it's too exhausting for me to read this huge block of text without some kind of nice formatting.  I would rather spend my time contributing to other threads which are easier to read.

Just my 4 cents.

Mongoose in plural is polygoose.

One thing that really bothers me is when people write in ALL CAPS. (Then the when pointed out, replied to with "sry didnt see") The little voice in my head is shouting when I read it, and eventually I get a headache.
Another thing is the broken punctuation, Return, Shift/Cpas Lock key. The entire message is one long sentence without any interruption, and as a result the little voice in my head suffocates! [:(!]

Oh, and I've got a license to screw this crud up since I'm not a native English speaker. [:D]

squeek 1. It's a classroom setting to me... I mean you've got the people interested in learning

We are learning the new uses of letters and words.

2. As long as it's readable? "thsisi barley rdabl 2 me." Why are we conforming to this in the first place? This is the reason I have put my foot down on this issue. I'm done with being forced to know two different versions of English! I want to know the one and only version: The right one.

ths is, not thsisi, because it doesnt make the sounds of the words. Its barely readable for the same reason foreign languages are barely readable, because you rarely see them. You think english is better because its used by many people, but its a crappy language and should be changed.

3. Don't have time?! What's stopping you?! I share the internet with my sister. It's a 28.8 modem. I go so slow that it takes at least 50 seconds to open a single page on this site. Any pictures, and it doubles the time.

i Hav tym, but eye chose not 2 use it to standardize my responses.

What about eloquence? The English language can be made quite beautiful if you put some time and effort into it.

Squeek - well said!!!

Emoticons aside, the best way to convey thoughts and feeling in writing is through correct and proper use of ones native written langueage. To be thoughtfull of grammar, punctuation & spelling shows that you have an intellect capable of conveying your ideas and emotions clearly  thoughtfully.

This is a FORUM, not a CHAT ROOM!

For ideas to be discussed and debated properly people need to know what it is other people are talking about.

It is our written language that forms the foundation for the communication of knowledge. It is a valuable tool. More so if it is used properly. The internet and email should not bee seen as excuses for lazyness here. Rhetoric changes as the years go by, but correct spelling and sentence structure shouldn't.

James.

My goodness I feel like I am bach in school. [;)]

Thanks for all the awesome people who think this is a problem that have replied!  You rock.

Beavis - It's not just the fact that you can remove some vowels in words to "simplify" it, it's that the word changes meaning when you do so.  I pronounce words the way they are written.

Two buh are not two buh.  (2 b r not 2 b)

You cannot use a B alone in this context.  Since this is incomprehensible, I must pronounce it the way I see fit.

buh four oo ih ee dant ivve key err (b 4 u i y dont ive c r)

That's how I pronounce your letters.  Correct me if I'm wrong.

Look.  I realize that some people just don't have a lot to write about.. but I'm asking if we could just make it relevant and readable.  I see these posts and I just skip over them, because I know the person has no valid input, and reading it will only further my annoyance with them.

It shouldn't have gotten this way.  Nobody should have these "simplifications".  (Note how I always say this in quotes.  I say this because what is "simpler" for you is actually much harder for me.  It's not easy breaking the rules of English.)

I don't want to blame this on age or maturity, I want to blame it on the Internet.

~Squeek

PS - If anybody was ever wondering about my colors, it signifies that I have spent the time to type out the post, and had some extra time to add in a bit of flair to the message.

English is one of my non-native languages. I learn English by reading English. Ever since logging on to this forum, my English skills have deteriorated. Consequently, I now skip posts with a lot of errors.

What kind of attitude do you "don't give a f*ck cuz i can spell correctly if i want to but i don't care" people convey to the kids and foreigners on this forum learning English ?

If you have something important to say, it's probably worthwhile making sure that it is also understood. If not, how can you expect a fruitful discussion ?

Here's some useful links:
http://dictionary.reference.com/
http://www.spellcheck.net/

Thanks for bringing up the topic, Squeek !

A lot of you really have no clue who I really am..what makes me tick, how I operate.    

^ arrogant

mobile phones and chatrooms are to  blame for all this shorthand english,  its ok to  use as a  quicker way  of communicating, i mean  who wants to  keep typing "hello,  where are you from, i am from england"   whenever they speak to anyone  new,  this shorthand is just a natural progression in digital communication, and thats ok.

BUT.. when it begins to pollute "proper"  english thats when its irritating.   I see advertisments in the street, completely  unrelated to mobile  phones  but will still use mobile shorthand (some  kind of loan offer like "u in need of a loan".  This shorthand is becoming a more mainstream use of communication than proper english.

no use complaining about it though. As  long as what  we mean to communicate gets communicated, i think thats all that matters.

typing without using proper english is much quiker. Id rather be able to talk to someone online in a few seconds rather then a few minutes. Its trying to send the person the message as quik as possible and try to make it almost as quik as actualy speaking to the person. Also, theres really no reason for proper english online, maybe when talking to strangers or to people who are in higher rank then you such as bosses and teachers, but not when talking to friends or joking around. Or even when the on the internet, all that matters is the point gets across.

quote:

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Originally posted by Jeff_Mash

Not to jump on the bandwagon, but I agree wholeheartedly.  Let me preface this by saying that there's a difference between an accidental spelling error, and intentionally typing like a monkey.

I don't mind when people spell certain things wrong (like there, their, etc) because sometimes English is their second language.  It's when people say "4" instead of "four," "wtevr" instead of "whatever," etc.  That is what bugs me.

And one more thing which no one else has mentioned.  It's somewhat annoying when people make a long post, and they don't use a single friggin' carriage return.  To put it more bluntly, USE THE ENTER KEY!

I like reading people's posts and trying to help, but to be honest, when I see someone with a question and their post is half a page long with no new paragraphs, I simply skip it.  Plain and simple.  Why?  Well, call me shallow, but it's too exhausting for me to read this huge block of text without some kind of nice formatting.  I would rather spend my time contributing to other threads which are easier to read.

Just my 4 cents.

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Yes great point! Always use the ENTER KEY and periods!

THANK YOU SQUEEK!!!

All the "wants" being spelled wan't was driving me crazy...

quote:

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Originally posted by General-Army

typing without using proper english is much quiker. Id rather be able to talk to someone online in a few seconds rather then a few minutes. Its trying to send the person the message as quik as possible and try to make it almost as quik as actualy speaking to the person. Also, theres really no reason for proper english online, maybe when talking to strangers or to people who are in higher rank then you such as bosses and teachers, but not when talking to friends or joking around. Or even when the on the internet, all that matters is the point gets across.

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Thank you! I was about to say that very same thing! People read what the General said! It makes a lot of sense.

Can we all just learn Dutton Speedwords? [:D]

I mean reducing English words down to a single syllable in most cases would fix both ends of the spectrum; almost to a point of not needing acronyms anymore!

Anyone up for this, or at least a language section somewhere on here?

A classic: [;)]

Aoccdrnig to a rscheearch at an Elingsh uinervtisy, it deosn't mttaer in waht oredr the ltteers in a wrod are, the olny iprmoetnt tihng is taht frist and lsat ltteer is at the rghit pclae. The rset can be a toatl mses and you can sitll raed it wouthit porbelm. Tihs is bcuseae we do not raed ervey lteter by it slef but the wrod as a wlohe.

if inglish waznt sutsh a stewpid langwidge evry won wud spel it ryt

general army :

quote:

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Or even when the on the internet, all that matters is the point gets across.

---

This is precisely why people should spend time thinking about what they write on a forum. It is NOT a "chat room".

Why should I bother reading someone's post if its clear that they put no thought into it ?

If you post a topic or a response and you wish to get your point across quickly, or by using ridiculous acronyms, then there's a good chance that
a) people won't understand your point fully, or
b) people will just ignore your point.

Back in the "good old days", 99% of posts on this site were quality contributions ! ah....those were the days...

zx

clandestino Why should I bother reading someone's post if its clear that they put no thought into it ?

They put no thought into english grammar and syntax, but thats not what you're looking for. You are here to get the content of the post. Would you think I was stupid if I said: I like to eat at Wendys restaurants, but I refuse to go through their drivethrough because their parking lot does not conform to federal standards, even though I still know how to use it.

The way I look at it is this.  I was forced to take English classes all through High School, and I'll be damned if I went through that hell for nothing!  

To learn all the rules of English and then purposely tinkle on them is like being forced to drive a car and then steering it off a cliff.

Jeff, that argument doesnt hold up if you dont like what they taught you, like if it was an anal sex class.

No beavis, that's almost perfect.  It's the other stuff that makes me cringe.

You used capitalization and near-perfect punctuation.  Only one word is spelled incorrectly, and it's just a hyphenated error.  All of the commonly-confused English words are written correctly.  It has meaning to it as well, as it states the reason you don't go to the parking lots at Wendy's Restaurants.  If there were a topic concerning this, it would fit in quite rightly.

Did it honestly take you longer to type it out the "right" way?

Rodentmouse... it's not arrogance if it is simply a statement of the truth.  I put online the things I want people to know about me, but the rest is a mystery.  I didn't want to come off as arrogant, I wanted to lead the reader into the depths of my biggest annoyance.  If I just opened the topic with "LEARN TO SPELL!"  Nobody would be posting here with positive comments.

And I appreciate the people taking the time to "fix" my posts. [:)]  Like I said, nobody's perfect.

~Squeek

PS - James, thanks for locking that topic.

Dear Squeek
I put a post down earlier that you did not acknowledge (I thought it was funny but then again my kids rarely laugh at my jokes [;)]). It was intended to lighten up this subject and your own view of yourself. Since you did not think it was funny I will explain my point in plain english.

I totally understand your feelings and agree that people should try to write and spell according to the rules of the alphabet.

However maybe you and all you others who have posted need to ask yourself why you are allowing this to bother you so much. It is said that you can tell a lot about a person by the things that bother him or her.!!!! At your age I would recommend that you practice not getting bothered by little idiosyncrasies like that. Mention it by all means but if people still do it....ignore it. Be a sample yourself and maybe you will rub off on someone.

You cannot legislate righteousness, and if you at your age allow yourself to get so worked up over trivial matters like that, then I have a few suggestions that you should carefully consider.

1.Dont ever get married, she will drive you nuts, I know it becourse people are wierd and do irritating things.

2.Dont ever have kids. They do annoying things all the time too.

3.It is too late to tell you not to have parents, (that would mean dont get born) but an alternative might be .....become a hermit, that way you would only have to contend with ...yourself. [:)]

Now you might say that this is extreme and ....it is , but this is only the beginning of irritating things in life that you can do ABSOLUTELY NOTHING ABOUT. Just you wait there will be more , a whole life full of it, and you will have the chance to continue to be bothered irritated worked up, or simply learn to rise above and let it roll off, like water on a duck.

Just a little advice.

Regards Mustardseed

Squeek... I too prefer people to keep their bastardizations of language to a minimum, however, there are so many other sides to language that you're missing out on.

On of the great things about language is that its essentially a dead thing.  What we call speach and language are just symbols for abstract thoughts and feelings that are coming from within ourselves.  And yet, language is alive because it comes from the living.  It evolves and changes to suit its function.  Here on the internet people are existing in a totally new culture.  You will meet people from many different areas of the world and hallelujah.  With all of these languages and cultures colliding new ways of communicating arise.  The internet has a burgeoning language of its own where u=you and b=be and h8=hate.  

I think that instead of seeing this as defacing the English language you should see the creativity behind it and the life of communication.

Although, I have to agree I think some of it is irritating as well.  Especially when no abbreviation is meant and what is being displayed is mere ignorance of the language.  However, when abbreviated sentences and words are used in a creative and efficient manner, I can really dig it.

quote:

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Originally posted by beavis

Jeff, that argument doesnt hold up if you dont like what they taught you, like if it was an anal sex class.

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Beavis, my arguement DOES hold up, if you keep it in context.  To use your example, if I was forced to go through an anal sex class all through high school, even if I didn't like it, I wouldn't come to an online sexuality forum for anal sex and post about other positions.  

Errrrr......what the hell were we talking about?

Very interesting how there are so many mispellings and grammar problems in your own writings.  Not everyone in here is an english major, and for the most part no one gives a damn.  I suggest sucking it up and continue to pull your hair out, because it will never change!

1 7|-|1|\||{ $¶33|{ $|-|0µ£Ð $|-|µ7 1$ |\/|0µ7|-| 4ß0µ7 7|-|1$ 70p1(. 17 1$ 4 \/\/4$73 0ƒ 4|° |-|4®Ð Ю1\/3 $p4(3!! [:(!]   Desipher that! I use that daily! The language of course.

I am really surprised I could make out most of that..wow!  I won't tell, so as not to ruin it for others

Nay [;)]

quote:

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Originally posted by jc84corvette

1 7|-|1|\||{ $¶33|{ $|-|0µ£Ð $|-|µ7 1$ |\/|0µ7|-| 4ß0µ7 7|-|1$ 70p1(. 17 1$ 4 \/\/4$73 0ƒ 4|° |-|4®Ð Ю1\/3 $p4(3!! [:(!]

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My sentiments exactly. Thats why I think we should all get off our lazy asses and figure out how to mass integrate telepathy so we will never have to use keyboards or mobile phones ever again! But in the mean time I still think typing skills is a reflection of intelligence levels.

Well I do not type that 24/7. Thats how I type when I chat w/ some friends.

I have seen this same basic post on other forums as well.

I doubt that at any time in history the average person had perfect language skills. To expect that it is going to happen now, or to allow it to drive you crazy is to be at odds with reality.

I care about what people say, not how they get their point across. I am not their mother, their teacher , or any better because I can spell most of the time. They are not here to live up to my expectations.

I think the basic thrust of all such posts is , "Will you people get with the program and do things the correct way, - MY WAY !!"

No. No they won't. Not ever. They are people and that is the nature of the beast.

I think all you can do is start teaching grammar classes in your area.

The thing that struck me about this post was the inordinante amount of anger, hostility and frustration. It seems really unhealthy.

Rage like that should be reserved for things like : war, injustice, poverty, crime, and so forth. Not grammer.

That's how I know it's a red herring. What's going on in your life that's making you "angrier every day" Squeek? Because it isn't spelling.

The mind plays this little game: when something upsets us and we feel powerless to confront it, the mind uses a diversionary tactic and focuses all that unvented anger somewhere else.

A psychological "kick the dog" if you will.

You need to sit down and think about what's really making you so mad. Get to the root of this problem so you can focus you anger where it really belongs. Maybe you can't fix the problem, but you can at least confront it. When you do that you'll notice yourself caring a whole lot less about other peoples grammer.

I must say I can get annoyed at people who misspell words such as there/their/theyre.

For instance... I have a friend who constantly uses "were" instead of "where" and that there/their/theyre thing. He wrote a story type thing the other day and it was FULL of disgusting grammar and spelling, so I just told him to send it to me or another friend to fix it before sending it to everyone else.

But you can't get angry at people who aren't geniuses.
I personally keep a dictionary on the computer desk, so incase I'm not sure of a word i can get it. Also, if I don't have a dictionary handy I'd open up microsoft word and type it in there first to get the correct spelling.
Others can't be bothered going through all that.

But as James' signiture says: "In life you have two choices - to be right, or to be happy."

This is one of very few times that I've used capitalisation and complete punctuation in online forums.
-Syke

Truth be known, this only bothers me because I see it as a lack of care amongst those who do such things.  This lack of care stemmed from their lack of care for the education system, and so the proper forms of English are lost upon them.

For some reason I have always been a stickler for this type of thing.  I don't know why.  When I was in elementary school I had the school record for winning the most spelling bees in my 5 years there. (I won 3, went on to districts... They were supposed to give me a plaque.  They lied.)  My spelling / grammar / vocabulary has always scored me easy A's in English all throughout my time in school.

My first statement still comes into play here Leyla.  I shouldn't care so much, but I do.

I overly-exaggerated the fact that I get angry about this.  Sorry about that.  It just bothers me to see these kids not getting the most out of their education, that's all.

Mustard - I read your post but didn't quite understand what you were talking about at first.  I don't intend to make a new language to adapt here.  To answer your non-interrogative questions, I don't plan on marrying, having children, or even entering the dating world in general.  Sad, but true.

Corvette - That's leet.  That's not English, it is just a derivative.  Hackers use such language to avoid being traced.  Now everybody knows about it, thus making it devoid of its privacy.

One reason I don't like this whole situation is it forces me to stoop to the level of these people in order to get my message across.  I want to be able to use the vocabulary I know without the other person having to look up the words I say on dictionary.com or something.

If I were so inclined to post an eloquent statement, I would leap at said opportunity.  Blah.

I'm not angry. I don't stress out about this.  Just let me enjoy my pizza. [|)]

~Squeek

Frustrated FT. You´re frustrated.

Is that what you care about? Like there aren´t other things to care about.

What matters is that people get to the point that they express themselves in the way they like.

Who cares about a few spelling errors if someone is eagerly typing a post, and in his or her enthusiasm misspells a few...

Hi!

I´m a bit surprised really. I really dont know what to say. This feels kinda like a punch in the stomach.

You see, I´m from Sweden. And it´s almost impossible for me to get everything "right".

I´m actually a bit saddened by this post.

Flummox.

I specifically did not target people who know English as a second language.  Sorry if that wasn't made clear to you.  I apologize for making you feel the way you felt, and let anyone else know the only concern I have with this is for the people that have English as their primary language.

Don't feel sad. [:)]  No criticism was meant towards you.

~Squeek

Squeek Did it honestly take you longer to type it out the "right" way?

beavis Jeff, that argument doesnt hold up if you dont like what they taught you, like if it was an anal sex class.

Jeff that arg not hold up if u dont like what they taught , like an anal sex class.

Ys it tuk longer 2 type currectley.

Jeff Mash The way I look at it is this. I was forced to take English classes all through High School, and I'll be damned if I went through that hell for nothing!

Beavis, my arguement DOES hold up, if you keep it in context. To use your example, if I was forced to go through an anal sex class all through high school, even if I didn't like it, I wouldn't come to an online sexuality forum for anal sex and post about other positions.


In my example, you will use your new anal skill because you dont want to have gone "through that hell for nothing".

... receiving or giving?.. lol.

bugger it. im just gonna type the way i feel comfortable.
yes i've taken english since i started school (i've failed since year 8 due to lazyness) but even if i type without the use of complete punctuation or capitalisation i think i still get my message aross quite easily.

Squeek, you say this is only targetted at those of us who have english as our primary language... well if it's such a big deal why don't you want other people speaking their own language correctly. they spent just as much time learning it.

some of you are speaking as though english is some holy, superior language. you want those who have been learning it since birth to type it perfectly and those who havnt to try their best.
do you go about your every day activities speaking with perfect crisp pronounciation?... if you do, you're a rare find as there's no point if you are simply comunicating with your fellow man

the point im trying to get across is that english is just another language. no specialties about it. as long as the majority of the readers can understand it, there shouldn't be a problem.
-Syke

English isn't a superior language, but it is the one we use here at the forums.

And with your example of pronunciation, I say yes.  There shouldn't be a time when the language you know best is used less than any other time.

What I don't like is the primary counter-argument.  The majority of the defense is "...as long as people can read it..."

This in not read can be though it order is.

Nobody types like that, but the point is, that's proof that it's still readable, but it makes no sense.  I could find examples for you, but why don't I just let you do that for yourself.

This topic was aimed towards finding the source of the problem and resolving it.  I didn't want to start another debate.

~Squeek

I think if tyou can read it, then its ok. My opinion.

when i said readable i meant understandable as im sure other people who used that 'defence' did.

im not sure what you were trying to prove with that highlighted example.
yes each individual word was readable in itself, but the sentance wasnt, so the point wasnt received by the reader.
but when people use sentances like "ud h8 2 b lyk dat wouldnt u" the entire sentance is still understandable so everyone knows what youre saying.

stop being such a square and get over it. just continue typing the way you like to and put up with the way others do. you cant change everyone to be more like you... ive tryed [;)]

-Syke

Short and Sweet.

I will NOT conform to the wrong way.  Don't even make that suggestion!

Numbers shouldn't have ever replaced full words.  Full words shouldn't have ever been shortened, especially since most of the words you've shortened were about three letters long in the first place!

Grr...*shakes fist*

~Squeek [|)]

Syke continue typing the way you like

Squeek I will NOT conform to the wrong way. Don't even make that suggestion!

Once again you've missed the reference point here beavis.

quote:

---

stop being such a square and get over it. just continue typing the way you like to and put up with the way others do. you cant change everyone to be more like you... ive tryed

---

Does it make sense now?

Once AGAIN!  This is NOT MEANT to be a debate! Don't make it one!

Read carefully to find the main point of this topic.  It is in the last line of one of my posts.

~Squeek

See if I can put this more objectively....

Since reading my first Dr Seuss book, I have learned to read english in it's standard accepted format. Even considering the change in rhetoric and addition of new words over the years, the syntax of the english language, whether it is right or wrong, has remained constant over the past few hundred years.

Admittedly compared to other languages, English is badly messed up, but it's what is used here, and is what has become the world's defacto international business language, so lets just accept that and get on with it.

The advent of SMS & text messaging hasn't changed the english language. What it's done is add a new dialect to the language. Just like Jargon, it is a more specialised form of the language used for a specific communication medium.

When I open up a novel, I find it easy to read because it is written in standard english. When someone sends a text message to my phone using SMS jargon, I have to concentrate more on reading it because I'm effectively having to interpret it. I also find it much harder to read sentences, paragraphs, or in some really bad cases I've seen here, entire posts that have no proper capitalisation or punctuation, and poor spelling. It becomes so hard to read that I just give up on it and go on to the next post. It's a shame because that person might have written something of real value to me, but it's just to hard to read.

Because we have ample text entry abilities on this forum, it is not necessary to use the SMS style abbreviated dialect. The main function of this forum is to pass on and discuss ideas. Isn't presenting that idea in a clear and easy to understand manner more important than how fast it is typed?

Consider also the number of people we have on the forum to whom english is their second language. They already have to mentally interpret what people are writing, so why make it any harder for them?

Actually most non-english speaking members of this site write in much better english than many others here, simply because they take more care about what they're doing to translate their thoughts correctly.

Now to be less objective - I think it is unfair that people wan't to beat up on Squeek because he want's to see the level of communication here improved. I don't wish to sound like a snob, but most members are here because they are thinking people, typically with higher than the average IQs. There should be no excuse for people to write like they have single figure IQs, especially when you look at the complexity of some of the issues discussed on this forum.

It's not about conformity, it's about communicating.

Regards,
James.

I don't see a problem here.  People just lazy at the keyboard that's all.

Squeek I wasn't telling you to conform to anything. I was telling/asking you to stop trying to get other people to conform to the way you want them to be.

I was saying that you should just get over the fact that people are different and put up with it. Not that you have to become like them, just don't diss them.

-Syke

Wut did jOO say 2 meh?[:P]

Hello all

It's been a long time since I have been here & out of all the posts I could have read this is the one that caught my attention. A strange thing on this type of forum, since everything to do with the main subject of this forum/site (OBE's & AP's etc)being very abstract & imprecise things in themselves. Semantics, is just as futile a subject there as it is here on the physical.

You can quite easily change yourself, but you can rarely change others.Unless they want it.

Squeek, I thank you for bringing up the difference between "loose" & "lose". That is something that really annoys me & it's funny that in this world of ever increasing acronym & abbreviation usage, that people actually make the word "lose" longer! by spelling it "loose". Hell, they could have saved themselves an "o"! [:P]

I also thank you squeek, for showing me that this is not just an American thing. As it is Americans I most often see spelling it this way.

However, as you would know, being either a teacher or journalist or one in training. The "English" language has changed so much since it was first used as a written language & we don't exactly walk around saying "Egad, thoust hath smite me!" anymore do we?

If anyone should be complaining about the use of the "English" language, it should be the English. When you say that people should take the time to learn the "correct" way of writing "English". Do you mean the American way of writing "English"? As it is the USA who has already done away with the "correct" way of spelling a word in the "English" language & decided it would use it's own way of spelling things.

Here in Australian schools & Universities, when you type something in a word document,we/they have the choice of using an "English", "Australian English" or "American English" spell check. Just out of curiosity, do Americans only have an "American" spell check?[:D]

I pity newcomers to the "English" languange, as they have to learn the proper meaning of many words that all sound similar e.g. where, wear, we're & hear,here & there,their, they're, all meaning different things, but all sounding the same. A child born into the language already understands the meaning & only have to use the spell check to correct themselves once something has been written. Never needing to really know the correct way, unless, they choose a job that requires them to type or write without the aid of a spell check.

I remember my Grandfather saying to me (because of his lack of understanding at the time). "What is the use of writing on a computer, as opposed to a type writer? Look at all the complications added to what should be a simple task. You have your keyboard & about a hundred extra tools to supposedly help you in writng a letter!"

He would have scoffed at his great grandfather saying to him "what do you need a contraption (a typewriter) to push letters onto a page for you? When you can just write it with your hand?"

Are we looking at ourselves now, in this time, as resistant to change as our predecessors were? Fast forward the button of time a few hundred years & do we think we will still be using keyboards? I'm sure if everything isn't by that stage mind controlled, it will be at least voice & motion controlled, largely doing away with our need to write "anything" correctly. I wonder if the ancient Egyptians scolded each other for leaving the tail feather off a dove in their heiroglyphs? Or do the Chinese concern themselves with someone not drawing a line a smidgin longer than it should be?

Squeek I am wholeheartedly with you on the lack of some peoples spelling abilities (people who do not use english as their first language are exempt),grammar & syntax. But I wonder, are we just people resistant to change?

Good journeys all

Mobius[8]

Squeek, good for you for expressing the thoughts of many of us! Stay the course![:D] I don't worry about posts that contain a few "typos"; we all make them. But when I see a post that looks like a 3rd grader's work I have two reactions:

First I check to see if the writer is from an English-speaking country. If not, I cut them a great deal of slack and admire them for their second-language abilities -- I am an "English only" moron and not proud of it. (I know, of course, that you aren't addressing those folks anyway).

Second, if the writer is a primary English speaker, I assume he/she is either very young or very ignorant and in either case dismiss their thoughts as useless at the very least.

I think it was you who said that people are judged by first impressions and made the point that this also applies to a written impression. That is absolutely true.

Syke, you certainly have a right to speak/write in any way you wish. Just realize that the more you do it, the more it becomes a habit and habits can be horrendously hard to break.

Mobius, I recall reading something a long time ago that dealt with Chinese writing skills. It indicated that they do, indeed, pay a lot of attention to accuracy and, as a result, written Chinese is a very hard art to master. I agree with you that our word processing abilities will keep evolving (so long as we don't destroy ourselves too soon). But the lazy among us will likely always find a way to mess it up. [:)]

I agree, too, about the difference between American English and English. "Sulphur" vs. "Sulfur" comes to mind. But, hey, we have to play the hand we're dealt! I just believe we should play it as well as we can. [;)]

Jeff, I totally agree with you on this one, and it's a pity because people lose out when it's so hard to read their posts.

Notice how I got their right, he he.

English is a beautiful language is'nt that enough of a reason to keep it as it is?
We have certainly lost enough beautiful words already, condemned to dictionaries and old novels.
Read some Jane Austin and see the difference, there was so much eloquence in speaking, such a descriptive language.
I would say that other languages also posses this quality too of course.

So all I want to say is, lets just try and keep the language beautiful!
If for nothing else but that reason alone!

Hey Squeek, do´nt lose your mynd our you wil start getting crazy...truli. [:D]

Now, talking serious, you must remember that there are many people like me that doesn´t speak english. I learned some english in school at some years ago, but i forgot important rules and i´m always making confusion with some basic rules (specially in the verbs).

Maybe we should learn Esperanto, the universal and easy to learn language. I started at some time ago and i know to say some basic things:

La kukoj estis bonaj! translation: The cookies were good!
Mi estas Kazbadan. I´m Kazbadan.

Learn it, it´s fun and easy.

Just for the record, writing without paragraphs is a valid form of writing.  It's called free-writing, in which you simply spill out what you are thinking without pausing or creating a new paragraph for each thought.  It's even taught in college english.  The english language is the hardest to learn for other nationalities because there are so many different ways of saying things.  Fact of the matter is, proper grammer is not actually proper in the english language.  So though you may get upset because some don't start new paragraphs ,or may use slang... it's all still the english language.  Suck it up!

I haven't read this entire topic, so bear with me, please, if this has been said before:
There are only two good reasons for speaking/writing bad english:
1) It isn't your first language.
2) You're an American. Because everybody (read: nobody) knows that mercilessly butchering the English language is right up there with: letting their government decieve them, possessing 2.3 (made up number) guns in EVERY household, and bashing the religion of their nation's founders, on Wyzeguy's Unofficial List of Things Most Americans Do Best.

Personally, I try to type English as best as possible.[8D]

Hi all

The AO, you are absolutely right about free writing with it's lack of paragraphs. Some people just dont feel the need to break their writing up into blocks of sentences & I believe that is their perogative.

While I agree with those who say they find it difficult to read when people write like that & often skip the message altogether. It's really just my own lack of adaptability that has stopped me from paying attention to something that is there. Because it's not what I am used to, or it's not the way I have learned it myself.

After examining some of these posts in question. I find that most of the spelling "mistakes" are really just people who have spelled the word phonetically. That is, they have spelled the word as it sounds.

I gather the reason the word "lose", doesn't get spelled like "looze" or "looz", is because the people that are spelling like this, have had at least "some" education & know that the word contains an "s" & not a "Z", so they spell it "loose".

Wyzeguy????!!!! *Mobius rubs his eyes & read Wyzeguys post again*. Are you a real American? Or are you an immigrant? I thought that putting down your own country was a right that was reserved for us Australians, the British & Canadians. Don't tell me you have been infected!

I am honestly curious about this, so can an American please answer my question in my last post? Do you guys only have an "American" spell check in your word documents? Or is there provision for "English" spelling in there?

Wizeguy, I am also surprised to see your reaction to guns, being an American & all. Not that it has anything to do with this subject, but for yours & anyone elses information. We had a great gun debate on this site about a year ago. I was one of the few who were against guns & the majority of members (mainly Americans) were pro gun.Peaceful Warrior was the main backer of the need for every peace loving individual to stock up on an arsenal of weapons. Check it out, twas quite entertaining, however, war won the day against peace & I walked away with my tail between my legs.[B)]

A few examples of the difference between American spelling & English spelling.

English spelling American spelling
authorise authorize
aluminium aluminum
organisation organization
criticise criticize
centre center
metre ( as in kilometre) meter
wharfe wharf
colour color
axe ax
arse  butt (lol)

Ok, good journeys all

Mobius[8]

I like how simple it is to take a global issue such as this and centralize it down to just one country.  There are the three major English speaking only (or so... whatever) countries here: The UK, The US, and Australia.  These are my primary targets, not just America.  I agree that we have a lot of stupid people here that could care less for the English language as it is, but then there are the radical teenagers such as myself who really do care for the words I proclaim across an entire planet.

Speaking of which, the problem did not originate in the United States, the problem originated in the Internet.  How could "simplified and faster" text have come about if there were no reason to type "faster"?

And just for kicks... I don't have a gun in this household, I don't care for any religion, and I do not mercilessly butcher the English language.  I don't like to be associated with those who do, so thanks for the "most" in your sentence.

I have taken a quick look around for the newest set of errors and have located this error.  It takes place in the transition of contractions to text.  While it is easy to say "Would've", you really pronounce that broken word as another real English word.  This is the root of the problem in this situation, where the partial " 've " has become "of".  Would of, could of, and should of are all wrong...  It's just the way it goes.  Would have, could have, and should have.

One more thing, Even though you pronounce "Used to" without the double d sound, you don't spell it that way.  Throw that D back where it belongs in the word "used", and don't leave it as "Use to".

Let's keep it going! [|)]

~Squeek

Hi all

Hahaaaaaaa!!!!!! Squeek.Tis quite funny your discomfort at slight mistakes in grammar. Shows how pedantic this subject really is. First it was the spelling, now it is the grammar. Next it will be syntax.

I took the liberty of writing my posts in a word document & then pasted them in here. After using the spell check, I re-worded the posts & removed something from here & there. So my question is, why pick on poor ol "used to" (use to)? .

What about it's (its) or don't (dont) or else's (elses) or perogative (prerogative) or heiroglyphs (hieroglyphs) or hey, I've got a good one! I spelled "Squeek" wrong (squeak), oops! But then again, so did you. You chose a mispronunciation as your name, cool.

Since we are going to get pedantic about the subject. What is with your lack of understanding of how nouns work? Why do you spell "English" as english?. Would you do the same for america (America)? [:D]

quote by squeek

"This problem lies in proper use of english"

Dont you mean the proper use of american?[:P]

I noticed that you decided to use the spell check on your post after your first couple of entries. So why the change now?

Quote

"Speaking of which, the problem did not originate in the United States, the problem originated in the Internet". I wonder who invented the Internet?

You are right however, that this is not a problem that is unique to America. I just about have to run my little sisters emails through an online translator to decipher what they are saying, so I know its not unique to Americans. I just found it ironic, that an American would get so wound up by everyone else's use of the English language.[;)]

Watt is the point anyway? Wood you mined if I rote like this, but the spell cheque was run threw it and found no mistakes? [:D] Wood that make it write?[:P]

But hey, I am glad to see another American (or anyone ) say that they that dont have a gun. But I guess that's not to say you dont want one, can't afford one or dont support their use in resolving conflicts (this is exciting, maybe I should dig up the old gun debate post again to see how it ranks now that the Iraq war is over). Lesson learned there Wizeguy. Most is similar to saying the majority. We can't pretend to speak for everyone (politicians & board of directors excluded). They only need 51% of people agreeing & that is a majority. Who cares about what the other 49% have to say, they didn't win.

Edited by Mobius for maximum spell check devastation.[8D]
Good journeys all

Mobius[8]

Chill out about the use of language on a online forum...were not all her to impress eachother with who can post the most intellectual and grammatically correct post..atleast Im not. I have found something like everyone else in here that I think is completly amazing (possibly the next step in the evolution of the mind) and if we are going to hinder peoples sharing of ideas because they now feel intimidaded to post them then that is negatively effecting us all. I am very clevor college student (despite my slap-dash post) and sometimes, like right now, i do not feel the need to act so intellgent and check every word i write. i just want to share with all of you and learn from all of you. So I think if its that much of a petty problem about run-on-sentences and such  then start by questioning the meaning of language in the first place.... i think its to share and profit from eachother.. and in that case the rules of grammar are caging  us in sort of speak in the ways we can express our ideas. I HATE RULES

Hee hee!  You forgot Canada, Squeek!!!!!! [:P]

Anyway,  THE 1st CARDINAL RULE OF WRITING:  CONSIDER YOUR AUDIENCE!!!!!!!!!!!!!! This could be translated into:  BE CONSIDERATE OF YOUR AUDIENCE!!!!!!!!!!  And who, exactly, is the audience at Astrlpulse? The whole globe of English-speaking people!  People of any age, nationality, IQ, political affiliation, religion!  We have a lot of ground to cover.

English newspapers, knowing their audience, take great care to keep their communications to a clear, concise, 8th grade reading level, because they want to reach as many people as possible.  I suggest we try to do the same here. In fact, it is immature and self-centered to communicate in ways that put a burden on the reader.

Squeek, I think you'd enjoy these books by Karen Elizabeth Gordon:

The Deluxe Transitive Vampire
Torn Wings and Faux Pas: A Flashbook of Style, a Beastly Gide Through the Writer's Labryinth
The Disheveled Dictionary
The New Well-Tempered Sentence
The Ravenous Muse

I had the pleasure of "chatting" with my 11-year old daughter this week on the internet (she was writing from her school library), and she typed in the same annoying shorthand that other young folk do, using "k" for okay, etc.  Teachers have a difficult time convincing children that their essays need to be written in REAL english, not internet-chat-speak, because many kids don't even know the difference.  

Unfortunately, I think us old folk are going to lose this battle within a decade or two.  Soon, "k" will be in Webster's Dictionary, along with ROFL, IMHO, etc.  After all, McJob is already there!

(I guess I'll weigh in on the gun issue:  Where I live, I don't need one.  However, if I moved to a scarier place, whether a dangerous inner city, or a remote forest with large wild animals, I'd own the appropriate firearm for the situation, and I'd know how to use it.[}:)])

I heard about McJob going into the dictionary, and that was the funniest thing I've heard since "phat" and "yadda yadda yadda" were added.

I want to attend one of these meetings where they vote on new words to be added...  That would be so cool.

Anyway, sorry I left out a few other contractions and other commonly confused words; the ones I listed were just the ones I've seen more of in recent days.  Of course those are valid as well.

I apologize to Canadians. [|)]

~Squeek

I find that the method of communication Squeek criticizes rather refreshing and it is certainly unique and creative both in style and use.  I am neither old fashioned nor overly modern but rather someone who appreciates creativity and style.

The only observation I have thus far on Squeeks comments is that he missed commenting on the frequent use of a level of vocabulary that can only be described as unfortunate.  There are certainly better ways to use ones communication skills to uplift, rather than degrade, with the infamous four letter word and its variations. Let us not forget the young minds that may have access to this forum.

Jack

Thanks for the grammer lesson it will help me in english lol

A lot of you really have no clue who I really am..what makes me tick, how I operate.  Well, it's complex.  But there is one thing that just manages to get me angrier and angrier by the day.  It's so trivial and menial that it shouldn't even matter, but to me it's the biggest deal in the world.  I can't even explain why it is...it just is.

This problem lies in proper use of english.  I look around the forums and all I see is words used incorrectly... Run-on sentences... and "acronymed" words.  You have no idea how much this kills me.  Everyday I grow more insane because of it all...  I'm tearing out my hair trying to conjure up a reason for it all, and I can't find one!  So I've posted this topic here to figure it out.  I want to know why this is.  I want to know how it got this way.  And I want to know how to put a stop to it.

I also wanted to let people know of the mistakes they so commonly make these days.  I'll try to tone down my violent rage ([:P]).

Lose/Loose - I know you pronounce lose in a way that makes it sound like it is two "o's", but I can assure you it isn't.  Two topics I easily found display this:

Can you EVER loose yourself???

What causes us to loose awareness?

I know it may sound right, but it isn't.  It's lose.  Loose means not secured down, not fastened.  Lose means it's gone, you lost it.  

Truly - This is the only correct way of spelling truly.  It is derived from true, yes, but it drops the E when it goes adverbial.  It is not "truely" or "truley"... or any other crazy way we can tack the E back on there.

There/Their/They're

Let's just easily define these...

There - Location.  If it's not here, it's there.  Also an word to desribe "Where did they go?" There they go.  Still location. Always location.

Their - Possessive.  Who's what.  It's their toy, their money, their time.  Nothing more.

They're - They are.  If you're trying to say they are, this is the word to use.  Never anything else.

And lastly, I would just like to make this statement.   Sure, people will hate me for it.  They shouldn't, but they will.

I would like for an end to the letters "u, b, y, c, k, o, and r" and the numbers 1, 2, 4, and 8 as replacements for whole words. I've also noticed marks used as entire words, like "?" Suddenly becomes "question".  No... "?" is, and always has been, "question mark".  I feel as if this started with a simplified version of english, but I fear the results.  I have already calculated a version of what I think will happen if this continues to take over more words.

It goes from ->

Haha! Aren't you so cool!    -to-

lol! rnt u so col!   -to-

l! r u s c!

This can't happen.  I know there is no way to permanently stop the simplification of english words to nothingness everywhere, I just hope I can halt it here.

Along with this problem lies another "pet peeve"...  Somehow in my time here I have brought about look-alikes attempting only a post count.  I have realized the stupidity of my actions and have halted irrelevant postings around the forums.  Nowadays I see copycats of my old actions, and needless to say, it is actually very bothersome.  I hope there lies an end to this as well.  Posts should be posts about the topic, not random gibberish.  Topics are the same... topics should be relevant as well.  I have examples of such irrelevant topics. (Also herein lies the spelling madness I spoke of)

http://www.astralpulse.com/forums/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=8312

I had lots of fun pronouncing these words as they are written.  If it has no apostrophe, how can it be a contraction? If it has no capitalization, how can it start the sentence?

I appreciate anybody who took the time to read this, and I apologize to anyone I may have offended.

~Squeek

Ps - This site rules for learning proper english.

http://a4esl.org/q/f/index.html