The Astral Pulse

I'd sign up.

Although the bit about reading the potential crew's mind may not be such a good idea.
It could potentially undermine the necessary trust between crewmembers.
At least the fact that the crew were probed would ahve to remain in absolute secrecy from the crew.

2cent & L&L

jouni

If you haven't read "The Truth Machine" and "The First Immortal" by James L. Halperin, I'd suggest it. The issues of secrets and privacy are dealt with extensively. Books like these changed my mind on these subjects.

Ayn Rand has a few things to say about people working together even without mind reading or more conventional tools. "Atlas Shrugged". It is about an end to life of earth as we know it and a new beginning.

Any thoughts on where such as ship should go and on how things like spare parts for mechanical breakdown can be found? There is no way that everything could be brought aboard which would be needed before the end. Space is full of atoms, ions, and small molecules, but they are not close together.

Why go anywhere. Just orbit the ships near the asteroid belt. Or better yet, earth's solar orbit. Digging an installation on the moon would be even better with the added benefit of having raw materials for the taking.

2cents & L&L

jouni

A starship being built today would not be capable to colonize a planet, it would require a mass amount of technology and resources to even begin the process.
A starship could be built now, it would take decades but its lack of global  policy on space technology development and financing that is preventing it, the next step in space exploration will be corporate, large corporations fighting against each other to produce more advanced space flight to commercialize it and make money.
The besy bet would be to build habitats into asteoids as already mentioned but if you really would prefer a ship at least keep it within the Earth star system, resources wont last long enough to even get a crew of humans to the nearest star Proxima Centauari, staying within the solar system means plenty of resources to obtain.

Can you tell me again why we need our physical bodies? I don't like the idea of getting a large group of people together to live off of the energy from living beings as ghosts, exactly, but can a mechanical substitute be found? I seem to recall something about a box made with layers of metal and wood to gather and collect energy.

Actually, we wouldn't be living off the energies of spirits. And the reason for going out of the solar system is that someday the sun will explode and destroy all the planets. So I figured it would be better to start colonies on planets similar to earth and find a way to NOT exploit the planets. I think even if this starship thing was possible, there's no way today's politics would allow it to happen (legally). We'd be taking a rather large chunk of earth's resources with us and we'd have to find a way to replace them. And who's to say the world would allow us to take these resources? And as for the mind-reading of the crew, well, yeah it would be secret but we'd also have the psychics probe each other so that nobody has too much power. Corporate/capitalist mentality is not the best thing to have for this sort of thing. And I think it would be a nightmare if corporations got that involved in space. They're already out of hand on earth.

I definitely have to disagree with Hephaestus on the idea that it's not possible to build a capable colony starship to spawn human colonies across the universe. I believe it is possible (provided we get all the resources required, and there are a lot of them), but it will take forever to build it. I admit it would be EXTREMELY difficult to do. My friend and I have thought about the fueling systems, electrical systems, water, heating, and everything else and are coming up with ways to do it. We've also been thinking about ecologies and lifeforms on earth that can work together to create some sort of "natural" environment where we can grow food without having to bring stuff from outside to resupply the plants and animals with food and other things.

The other main concern I had was that mankind has a spiritual bond with earth, and I don't want that bond to be lost. We'd be taking just about every species with us on the starship, seawater, and many other things. But the plants and animals may also have a spiritual bond with earth, which means they'd probably die after awhile. The journey would have to be taken in stages. First, we get off the planet, set something up on the moon, do more research, modify the starship, get to Mars, where we can do more resaerch. Then we spread out to the asteroids after researching how to avoid collisions with other asteroids while we're there, then from there we start a network of science labs and experimental colonies. After that, when we're finally ready, we can start the journey into space, and all the while we keep the colonies we have started. We don't want corporations too involved in this.

The ship would be made of lots of small units which could be fitted together, similar to LEGOs or something. It's sort of hard to explain but each unit would contain part of the heating, electric, water, waste systems, etc. Most of the research for the starship will go into these units, as they must last us until we can find a way to easily modify and replace the units and the starship. The point of designing the ship this way is that we can add-on to it later very easily. As for air-tightness, a shell will be placed on the ship. The ship will have small factories on board where we can replace any of the units. We can land and pick up all the resources we need if we come across any asteroids if we are not near a solar system. We would not leave the galaxy for a long time so we don't need to worry too much about not running into asteroids. We do this when we have used up a certain percentage of the materials on board. We would recycle everything we could.

Anyway, that's all I can think of for now. It's really too complex a thing for just one or two people to design. We'd need scientists, lots of them. And they'd need to have corresponding views and morals to the crew and passengers.

There's so much to talk about here.

"Everything you see or hear or experience in any way at all is specific to you. You create a universe by perceiving it, so everything in the universe you perceive is specific to you."

By the way, Tom, this box thing you mentioned sounds interesting. You do not know what it is called? I'd like to know more about it. Where did you hear about it?

"Everything you see or hear or experience in any way at all is specific to you. You create a universe by perceiving it, so everything in the universe you perceive is specific to you."

one other thing I forgot to mention- Has anyone ever heard of tachyon antennae? They are supposed to be beneficial to your health but I only saw one article about them, I believe on Spirit Web. The box thing that Tom mentioned and the tachyon antennae could be very useful if we can determine that they do in fact work.

"Everything you see or hear or experience in any way at all is specific to you. You create a universe by perceiving it, so everything in the universe you perceive is specific to you."

Since you asked, I looked up the box. The "orgone accumulator" by Wilheim Reich. He refers to energy as orgone.

http://inventors.about.com/library/weekly/aa031497.htm

I want in on the project.

I dont know anything about this Tachyon Antenna but I can tell you that Tachyons are theoretical and have never been detected so there is no proof to their existance.

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Originally posted by EnderWiggin:
I definitely have to disagree with Hephaestus on the idea that it's not possible to build a capable colony starship to spawn human colonies across the universe. I believe it is possible (provided we get all the resources required, and there are a lot of them), but it will take forever to build it. I admit it would be EXTREMELY difficult to do. My friend and I have thought about the fueling systems, electrical systems, water, heating, and everything else and are coming up with ways to do it. We've also been thinking about ecologies and lifeforms on earth that can work together to create some sort of "natural" environment where we can grow food without having to bring stuff from outside to resupply the plants and animals with food and other things.

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Colonising a planet via building habitats to live in would be possible, in my post  I was refering to terraforming a planet for human colonisation, I wasnt sure which one you meant, whether you meant building habitats or terraforming.

Avoidijg hitting asteroids is fairly easy. Just fly to the north or south of solar system. Most asteroids etc. orbit along or near the plane (drat can't recall the term). Also steering away form large bodies would reduce the probability of a hit as gravitation tends to cluster bodies together. Thus leaving the gaalaxy might actually reduce the chance of getting hit.

Saving the invention of faster than light travel th ebest option for colonizing th estarts is the seed ship described by A.C Clarke in the book "Songs of a Distant Earth."
Sending and maintaining living human beings is too complex to be sustained in isolation for several centuries that any meaningful travle to the stars would require. The more complex the ship becomes the more likely something failing becomes. Essentially the probability of a fatal malfunction or calamity approaches certainty very quickly.

Now how would such a seed ship grow functioning humans from the stored embryos or genetic material. Education? Psychological sustenance?

2cents & L&L

jouni

Well ... I prefer to stay here and do what little I can in the space of time I have.

But ... please do send a post card!

The Schema Exists in All, and In the Schema, I Am

We will probably have the technology in a few hundred years from now, before the 1900s there werent even cars, now we are in space before the turn of the century, maybe we will get this to work, but, we would have to have the colony huge, about the size of a few football fields or more. Half of it would be dedicated to completely farming and raising animals to eat later. I would think the colony would have to be the size of a town, but a few football fields the smallest. We would have to have the technology to have a shield, or something that could block Gamma rays.

Now you COULD jump off a building, but.... youd die.

Well,  I don't think we should build ships and leave for other planets. We should just built giant colonies in space, close to earth, capable of supporting life, then move there. Then, like, we could build mobile suits made out of Luna Titanium or Gundanium, as it is also called.

We could develop some sort of microtechnology, make that into a suit, which would copy all the moves of the pilot, or mobile fighter.

Every four years there could be tournament, or Gundam Fight to decide who would all of space for the next four years!

That sounds cool.

So I stabbed him in the face with a muffin.

Je suis tombé dans le puits.

Hmmm.

Will compasses still point north or south out of the solar system? ;-0

I am in as soon as someone figures out how to get past the Van Goetton (spelling?) radiation shield.

As far as the corporations, just show them how to make money, and they will be on it. Maybe throw in tax expemption for a couple of hundred years.

Don't think we will go in a nuke though, more like we will get thinned out to about .0001 percent of the population. (You know, didn't make it, try again).So if we could build a big enough spaceship, we could just remove the excess people, and save everyone a lot of heartache. That would allow us to colonize a lot of places without overloading the population. Now if we could just remember the lessons.....

LOL you think we can escape our own making that easy MUHAHAHAH (walks off stage to dreary organ music)

Ok- Here's the deal: The faster we go, the less resources we need. We just need the resources to build the ship and sustain us throughout the journey to.... wherever it is we end up.  It's too bad aliens won't give us their technology. It could make things a few million times easier. Why don't they just GIVE us one of their starships? Then again do you think they really want us out there?

"Everything you see or hear or experience in any way at all is specific to you. You create a universe by perceiving it, so everything in the universe you perceive is specific to you."

-Douglass Adams

"Shaolin men and women NEVER give up!"

Perhaps you mean the Van Allen belt? No worries. Just fly through. Only the ship needs to have shielding from solar radiation.

Planetary evacuation?
First we'd need to recude global population growth rate to zero or less. We breed too quickly. Cart one load off planet and two new loads have been born
The figure out how to maintain livable environment on a huge scale in an ark ship thingy.
Find aplace to set up shop ie. are we going  to Mars? Europa? Moon? a. Centauri?

With the way us humans are doing business at the moment I, were I an alien, would make damn sure mankind stays nicely put on planet Terra. I can just imagine what would happpen if mankind got mixed with all sorts of aliens. We can't even get along with other humans if they aren't exactly like us.
Now if an alien race were dumb enough to give us technology to allow interstellar travel I'd be wary of getting on such a ship. That'd be just too nice a way to get rid of the homo sapiens infestation in these parts.

Here's what I suggest mankind do.
Learn to get along with our own kind first. There are resources and knowledge on this world to protect us from most natural threats, even asteroids if we so shoose.
Provide an environment on earth that maximizes every individuals potential for growth, physical, mental and spiritual.
If we are still here, think about how to spread what we have accomplished to the stars or whatever.

But I'd still sign up on enders Lego space cruiser. Always wanted to go into space

2cents & L&L

jouni

Has anyone ever heard of carbon-60? It's a very remarkable substance. It's a substance that can be made into a nanotube, super-strong cable, and it could also do a very nice job as a shield against many things, including radiation. Look up "Buckyballs" and you'll see what I mean. I think this substance could go on the outermost layer of the starship. If I could save up all of the conversations my friend and I had, you'd see how far we've come. The idea was to have the ship be a tube-like shape, rotating to produce artificial gravity. The center of the ship would be the main power/utility facilities, where we can work easily to fix things in a weightless environment. The weapons systems would be the thing closest to the center. It would consist of long tubes running just about the lenght of the ship. From these tubes, we would launch  large, accelerating iron balls to great speeds through the use of electromagnets. The balls would have a magnetized rod in the center, and the electromagnets would pull the balls up through the tubes, and then they would be launched to destroy anything in their path, such as meteors or hostile enemy ships. We would also need great philosophers/thinkers to be our defense against more intelligent species, so we could convince them not to attack us.

One thing about getting people on the ship- We want as many different kinds of people as we can get, but we want to make sure they can handle the differences of others, while not allowing themselves to be manipulated into some sort of evil scheme.This is going to be hard to do. There are few great people in the world. I am likely not one of them. But I'm not among the worst, either. I'm right in the middle, like most people.

By the way, Tom- Of course you're in on the project. I want one of those Orgone Accumulators. Or at least the knowledge of how to make one. I read the article you posted. That's another reason I want to get off the planet. Too much politics. Esp. in the U.S. This country is no longer free. It is run by corporations and businesses and money, and the government has ways of checking into our computers, which, in my opinion, is a direct violation of our right to privacy. Speaking of computers, another thing we are going to need is a bunch of really good hackers to get all the information we can from the Internet. We should have a very good main supercomputer on board to store every last bit of information from the Internet in existence. This way, we can supply ourselves with knowledge for a very long time. We should also find a way to update the system every month or so to keep up with the world and what's going on.

As far as getting people on the starship, I think we should take a very small population and continue to breed. This way, we can ensure that the population will survive. But we should go with a self-replacement policy- No more than two children per couple. We will establish colonies/research outposts in the following order: The moon. Mars. The Asteroid Belt. Europa. Alpha Centauri (much later, when we have discovered how to make our ship travel at interstellar speeds). Basically whatever's closest is where we head next.

"Everything you see or hear or experience in any way at all is specific to you. You create a universe by perceiving it, so everything in the universe you perceive is specific to you."

-Douglass Adams

"Shaolin men and women NEVER give up!"

I'd lose the railgun type weapons. If that's the best we can put on the ship it's better to have none at all.
Any shrapnell from an oncoming asteroid hit by this weapon would still mostly come right at th eship and I'd go by the assumption thhat any aliens encountered would have something way beyond kinetic weaponry and in any case be able to manoeuvre around our shells. Best to be harmless.

To avoid getting trashed you'd want to be useful and/or entertaining. Reasoning and diplomacy requires some common ground that would be next to impossible to discover in time to prevent an attack.

Outer skin? Sodes could be any subtance capable of withstanding reasonable stress. Nose would ahve to be capable of taking hits from small particles at high speed, maybe ice as per Mr. Clarke's suggestion? Replacable, cheap and you can use it to produce water&oxygen if needed.
I doubt carbon's capablities as a radiation shield as the primary property of such a material is density. Cadmiun and lead sheets would be better. But since we're buildig the ship to take us to the start how about a magnetic shield? Divert radiation altogether?

As for population. I'd make the ship run itself and send cave men, so to speak. People who can carve out a living form basic materials and items at hand. With a library on the ship acccessible to them when the current level of technology can utilize the knowledge our level of technology could be regained form first principles in a matter of a few generation at most.

I'd prohibit breeding of living individuals, unless the population is large and well screened for recessive genetic faults, and utilize in vitro fertilization with some genetic material from either living partner and some from a sufficiently large gene bank to avoid inreeding and the resulting genetic problems.

Go in waves. First wave to set up shop on moon. Second to buld bulk, third to go to Mars, fourth to replenish moonbase, fifth to build bulk on Mars etc. Basic mountaineering campaign really.
Also for the really long hauls, send several independent ships. There is no way of telling how one crew will function together. Some will fail, some may succeed. Only sufficient redundancy will quarantee succes of the mission.

Given contact with a sufficiently advanced alien race, do anything at all to hitch a ride and /or form an alliance, even master/slave.

2cents & L&L

jouni

One absolutely major issue about the ship... Funding. How are we going to get the money to make this happen? Unless we sign an agreement saying we'll replace all the materials we take with us from earth, we need a way to get the materials.

"Everything you see or hear or experience in any way at all is specific to you. You create a universe by perceiving it, so everything in the universe you perceive is specific to you."

-Douglass Adams

"Shaolin men and women NEVER give up!"

Well, I don't want to live in a future where we live in space if we don't have Gundams.

So I stabbed him in the face with a muffin.

Je suis tombé dans le puits.

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I think that would require the help of psychics who can read peoples' minds. They'd have to read everyone's mind who was trying to board the ship.

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What human beings would need to develop is a sharp auric ability, then picking our leaders would be an easy task!´ Heck, even someone as untalented as me have learned to see them to some extent, learning it myself...  imagine children learning themselves seeing and reading auras at a young age, at school through a trained pedagogic teacher - but god forbid, they might really learn something worth knowing - horrid thought for the rulers, they might grow and challenge the "movie" we are living in created by the rulers via media....  No one as far as I understand can "mask" their aura.

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...resources wont last long enough to even get a crew of humans to the nearest star Proxima Centauari

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Hmmm... you are accepting the limitation of nothing can travel faster than speed of light I reckon´? IF that limitation was real we likely would never had been visited here on earth...  You know you can bend the space/time paradigm and through this exceed the lightbarrier with, well unlimited times - there is really no "speed" limitation once you understand the "physics" of the universe, as far as I understand. So when the right knowledge is posessed one might go from Earth to Proxima in 7 secs, I think resources would last that long don´t you? ;)

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It's too bad aliens won't give us their technology. It could make things a few million times easier. Why don't they just GIVE us one of their starships? Then again do you think they really want us out there?

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If aliens would hand us their technology, and give us one of their starships - they would give us a ticking bomb, it´s like them saying: - "Here you go, I wonder how much faster it will take you to blast yourself into oblivion now, seems the nuclear toy- weapons takes a few more years to do the job....", because it would be like giving a a child a loaded gun would it not.
With the present human mindset, we would immediately start figuring out how this advanced propulsion system operates and all that goes with it, and once it is understood we would transform this hard to imagine power into a brand new weapon system, the most terrible one ever found on this little round ball of ours - making our nuclear monsters look like unharmful toys...  and if they would like us to meet such a faith, they would already had blast us up a long long time ago!!´  But no, they are not like us, they have a Real with a capital R, understanding of the universe and how everything is connected....  they know what brotherhood means, and why blast their brothers and sisters on earth up because they are currently running completely mad!?  They know why we are mad, I am sure...  they understand we being cut out of the truth is the reason, and the way we are being programmed by the invisible rulers of this world (humans, yea, not aliens)....  2 and a ½ cents
  Be well my friends, Qui-Gon

- Your focus determines your reality -

A friend brought this to my attention which is why I say if we are going to act, we better act now. First thing's first. Let's worry about the funding.

http://ens-news.com/ens/dec2002/2002-12-09-06.asp



"Everything you see or hear or experience in any way at all is specific to you. You create a universe by perceiving it, so everything in the universe you perceive is specific to you."

-Douglass Adams

"Shaolin men and women NEVER give up!"

How is the project to build at least one ship being organized? It would not do well to have experts on financial matters and laws working on designing an engine or working on fuel conservation. It would also not work well to have everyone working on more interesting matters and finish the project with no toilets. And, just to throw it in, what would the legal status of recreational drugs be when all the nations of the world and their laws are left behind? A few decades in space can get boring.

Artificial gravity through spinning is not a bad idea, but while the engines are running it is redundant. The gravity we are accustomed to is an acceleration of 9.8 meters per second per second. It does not matter how fast the ship goes. If the speed is increasing at 9.8 meters per second per second then we have our fake gravity already at normal strength. We might even be able to adjust to higher levels of gravity (acceleration) to allow faster speeds. It would only be while maintaining a constant speed or unusually low acceleration that spinning might be necessary to some extent.

It seems to me that if the world's governments and communities were all able to get toether to make such a venture possible, then the need to escape the earth would no longer be there.

What is it Tisha says? -  "Wherever you go there you are."
Unless we do learn to live with each other without wanting to blast each other into sub-atomic particles at the first racist comment, then all we're going to be doing is carying all our aggression and other unwanted traits with us into a larger arena. We'll be nuking each others colony ships instead of each others countries. Escaping the problems of earth won't make the problems go away. Lets face it, we humans ARE the problem.

I'd love to be able to venture out among the stars, not because I had to though, but because I want to. Lets get out problems sorted out, then go amongst the stars.

By the way EnderWiggin, Who'se this goose who has come up with a Tachyon Antenna? Sounds like another one of those hair-brianed "it sounds hi-tech so it must work" scams. As Hephaestus touched on, a Tachyon is a theoretical faster-than-light partical. We can't yet detect these particles let alone build an antenna for them. Just what is it supposed to do, aside from allowing the "inventor" (and I use that term losely) to take money from gullible people?

James.

Alright- First off, we are trying to create a different environment for mankind in which we can work together.  As they say, one's environment determines one's personality. I believe there is a lot to take into consideration here. for one thing, genes are a very powerful influence. Another thing is one's upbringing. Take the KKK, for example. Children of the Ku Klux Klan will more than likely become racist adults. Why? Because their parents teach them these things. Another thing has to do with religion. Have you ever heard of the Tower of Babylon? I suggest doing some research. We have to learn to not hate each other, and I think the starship would give us a good chance to do that. It's not like we're going straight out into a star-trek type mission "to bodly go where no man has gone before," rather it is a mission for the salvation of mankind. We must learn on this starship to work together, and what we need are people who can not lose sight of this, no matter how angry they get. Have you ever heard of Shaolin kung fu? they have a saying, like my quote. "Shaolin men nevr give up." And we need people to NEVER give up on the mission, no matter what. That's what it's going to take. People so passionate towards mankind in general that they are willing to sacrafice their reputations in order to keep the peace. I have faith in mankind but right now, things are controlled by evil people, and you never know what could happen with evil people. That's why we need to get off this planet. And it's not like we're sending several starships at once. They go in waves, to ensure that eventually, even if the first however many fail, someone WILL succeed.

Despite the problems we have now, we must maintain hope that we have a chance of getting along. It's not like everyone's going to hate each other right off the bat. We need to learn to be open with each other. There are certainly going to be standards that we set in order to make sure that we are going to get along. There are many things I like about the U.S. constitution but there are also things I disagree with. I like the ideas of having freedoms such as religion,  voice and opinion, etc. However, all this loop-hole bullcrap is what allows corporations to run this country rather than the government itself. And the fact that we can sue each other for stupid reasons like some lady having her coffee being made too hot at McDonald's restaurant, that's a waste. She should have put in a suggestion first before wasting so many peoples' time.

As for recreational drugs, I would only allow marajuanna and alcohol to be legal. I am fairly certain that marajuana is healthier than alcohol, but anything beyond that I don't think I could allow. People die from some drugs. I have never heard of a case where anyone has died of marajuana overdose. But we have all, unfortunately, heard of people dying because of alcohol-related problems and accidents. The marajuana on-board would be totally natural, unaltered in any way whatsoever. And, now that I think of it, peote would also be legal, since it is cactus. The reason that I do not allow mushrooms is that they grow on feces. I don't want to make a decision on this yet because I feel that it is distasteful, although, I do not agree with our constitution's outlaw of certain drugs because it's "distasteful." That would not make me any better, would it? One thing we MUST NOT ever do is corrupt the truth. That must be the most important thing to keep during the mission and always, coming even before keeping the peace. Our illusion here on earth is that peace will make everything all better. But what about honesty? What about when people find out they've been lied to? What do they think then? They become angry and sometimes even violent. So trust MUST come first. Hence the psychics reading the crew's and passesngers' minds to ensure that they are good people that are boarding. A terrorist could go to extreme lenghts to kill many people. I won't tell you how extreme because I think we all know. They'll kill their friends and their families to die for their cause. We MUST get the help of psychics for the mission to be successful.

Right now I am out of ideas, but I will say that we need the funding FIRST. And I agree with Tom and have thought about who should be doing what for the mission. First thing's first. Psychics. Funding. Researchers. Financial advisors. Constructors/builders. Government. Crew. Passengers. Then the mission can begin.

"Everything you see or hear or experience in any way at all is specific to you. You create a universe by perceiving it, so everything in the universe you perceive is specific to you."

-Douglass Adams

"Shaolin men and women NEVER give up!"

Chi kung would be helpful. Medical supplies tend to be expensive and health is easier to maintain than restore. It also helps to have people starting out with unusually good health if things do not go as well as planned in the beginning. The energy produced by chi kung exercises will also help to increase psychic abilities like reading auras. It would be better to not have psychics as a small minority but instead to make sure everyone has some abilities after training.

Tom-

You are definitely right. With psychic abilities we may not even need weapons. Medically speaking, we could heal many diseases this way. Have you heard of Empty Force? Look it up on the internet. It's a style of chi kung used for fighting. It's very powerful. It takes years and years to get to that level. But those who are born to parents who are martial artists start out with more chi than most people. So each generation will get stronger and stronger. Also, I was thinking we could hook up devices to the beds and lights to use heat energy to power electricity. We could put these sensors in any place where heat energy is abundant.

About the drugs- It is said that drugs lower one's psychic abilities. So I think that we should keep them legal but let people know the truth about them and their effects on the body and the mind. And we'll do the research ourselves. We can't necessarily trust anything the government says because they keep the drugs illegal to make money and they don't always tell people the truth. Personally I like to toke it up once a year when summer starts as a sacred, ritualistic event. But I don't like getting stoned all the time. What we could also research is how it affects people when it is used different ways, i.e. smoking it vs. eating it (in "special" brownies). The drug issue concerns me because if we are going to have everyone go through the training, we don't want to inhibit their psychic ability with drugs. But I guess it's like I said before- We tell them the facts and leave it up to them to decide. But we won't make drugs illegal unless people are pregnant or if it affects other people somehow. We could make smoking anything illegal, for example, but let's say since you can't smoke marajuana, you could ingest it. Smoking it affects people around the individual, but eating it does not. And we'll have to watch people with alcohol, as it has been known to make some people violent. We can outlaw the drugs until we are able to tell people all of the effects of every last one of them, in every way.

A lot of problem-solving is simple common sense. I say we should also have a class in developing common sense skills for anyone who does not have a lot of common sense.

"Everything you see or hear or experience in any way at all is specific to you. You create a universe by perceiving it, so everything in the universe you perceive is specific to you."

-Douglass Adams

"Shaolin men and women NEVER give up!"

Financing a ship of this sort would be amazing. It helps to pick a few numbers to start with so we can get a clear picture of what it will take. Without written goals this project could remain all talk.

"Yet here we are, 30 years after the first manned landing on the Moon, struggling to launch the Space Shuttle 6 times a year at $500 million per flight, and no one talks about making the development of Affordable to the Private Individual Space Flight a primary goal of NASA."

http://www.affordablespaceflight.com/home.html

Common sense is not common. I'll be one of the first to sign up. Who will teach?

Drugs are, themselves, not especially important. What matters more is the idea of legislation. We will have people from several countries around the world. Who will be in control and to what extent should the leaders be able to tell everyone how to behave? When we consider all of the cultures and religions involved, it becomes more complicated.

There is a lot to say on the subject of space flight. We could even make astral projection in the real time zone a tool for the ship, to look ahead to see what we will run into. Even so, with so much to talk about it seems like a good idea to find somewhere else to discuss this. There is enough material to have an entire set of forums, with topics like: preventative medicine, raising money, growing crops, recycling materials (composting?), properties of new materials, environmental control (negative ions in the air are very good), magnetic fields, radiation, electricity... :)

I suggest you all come right back down to earth right now and stop surfing the sect ridden bull sh*t internet and get on with your physical, astral and spiritual lives.
99.99999% of what you read on internet is total rubbish, build a life not a spaceship.

Alchimiste

Retaliate, you'll feel better for a tiny amount of time.

"Everything you see or hear or experience in any way at all is specific to you. You create a universe by perceiving it, so everything in the universe you perceive is specific to you."

-Douglass Adams

"Shaolin men and women NEVER give up!"

Alchemiste- One word for you:

Nope.








"Everything you see or hear or experience in any way at all is specific to you. You create a universe by perceiving it, so everything in the universe you perceive is specific to you."

-Douglass Adams

"Shaolin men and women NEVER give up!"

Another reason to move this discussion to a place more specific to it. I'd like to start getting exact values and timetables for financing a trip into space. The more I read about it the better it sounds and the more reasonable it seems to try.

Where should we move this discussion to? I don't have any ideas in mind right now but forums record the conversations and ideas for us, so I suggest keeping this in a forum sort of format. We're going to need some real professionals to help us out with this project. The timetables and specific figures and values are something that I would have trouble putting together. I think we should first make a summary of all the things discussed so far. Then we can go from there.

"Everything you see or hear or experience in any way at all is specific to you. You create a universe by perceiving it, so everything in the universe you perceive is specific to you."

-Douglass Adams

"Shaolin men and women NEVER give up!"

I'll get around to making the summary after my finals or on a day when I can afford to. I don't have the time or energy to do it right now.

"Everything you see or hear or experience in any way at all is specific to you. You create a universe by perceiving it, so everything in the universe you perceive is specific to you."

-Douglass Adams

"Shaolin men and women NEVER give up!"

I've got a question. Would anybody be willing to be part of the crew/passenger population of a colonial starship, if it were possible to build? It's just a theoretical question but lots of stuff has been on my mind lately about us nuking ourselves out of existence. I thought a starship would be the way to go if we were going to escape some worldwide catastrophy such as that. Let's say the starship is being built to spawn colonies on other planets. The starship wouldn't have too many fancy things such as warp drive, seeing as how that's not quite possible at this time; it would move slowly but we'd have enough stuff to replenish people who die on the way. We'd grow our own food and stuff. I think it's definitely possible to build one if we do things right. What do you think? My friend and I have been discussing this and we think it's possible. We've been looking into every realistic situation possible. I'm not a star trek fan or anything but I definitely think it's possible and worth looking into. The thing is, we'd need to get the right people who can work together, and I think that would require the help of psychics who can read peoples' minds. They'd have to read everyone's mind who was trying to board the ship. I think this is an interesting topic to look at from an astral mindset/viewpoint. Think of all the stuff people probably haven't thought of in this way. I want to know what you all have to say.

"Everything you see or hear or experience in any way at all is specific to you. You create a universe by perceiving it, so everything in the universe you perceive is specific to you."