A question for the veterans

[Steve 2B]

Hi All,

After all the 'tension in the head' ramblings, I've have been making a concerted effort to achieve a stable focus 10. I've been practicing Frank's noticing exercise more than anything else, tho I've had the odd dabble with trying to phase to F2oC.  I've read through Major Tom excellent essay on recognizing a Focus 10, can relate to alot of the things he's said. I get the enlarged space in the head, the loss of perception of body parts, etc...
So my question is; Once you know that you've arrived (figuratively speaking), at Focus10, do you just keep looking/focusing off into the blackness, wait for the shift to happen, or is there something I need to do on a more 'pro-active' level?

Cheers,

Steve

[LOBO1]

Hi Steve, I am glad you posted this question because I was going to posted my self if not.
As Steve I was also inspired by Major Tome essay and decided, to fallow the quest to master F10.
I my mind there is no doubt the AP/phasing is a real phenomena, I had some very real experiences when I was Kid, and some as a grown up, but there were all random.
I tried many techniques, spent countless of hrs, with no results.
After reading M.Tome's essay It made me realize that before running I need to learn to walk, so decided to get a good foundation, no matter what.
So with no expectations in actually achieving a phasing experience, I began to practice only f10 every day.
Well to my surprise after a few weeks of practice, in one session I achieved what I think a good f10, I was there just enjoying the feeling with out trying to do any thing, when this image began to appear, I must say it was no ordinary brain Image it was very 3 dimensional and the colors were very very vivid.
I was inside what looked like a huge temple covered with bluish tiles very beautiful and the designs on the tiles were very intricate. (It was to good to be a product of just my imagination)
And then I did the mistake of trying to look at it with my physical eyes and bam I was back.
The experience only lasted just a few seconds, but made me realize what I believe, Frank said that one of the secrets is to relax the eyes, and to not try to look with them.
So my question is the same as Steve, and If what I went true is the beginning a of a phasing?
Thanks

[Vvid1012]

Hey,
Glad to see this topic also as I am confused myself.  I believe he said something along the lines of using it as a 'springboard' to get to different attentions.  As far as that, I can only guess.  I would imagine once you arrive at focus 10 or begin seeing the '3d darkness' that you obtain the sort of imaginative or perhaps perceptual confidence to focus whatever you were wanting to focus on.  Maybe, once you begin seeing the the vivid images, the trick is to jump into your imagination and take control--resulting in an obe/lucid or whatever you may call it.

As far as achieving focus 27 or beyond, my guess is that you just have to know you are there and you will be.  Unfortunately I cannot focus to that extent yet.  But soon!

[Steve 2B]

Hi,

Thanks for the replies

LOBO1,

Sounds you're at a similar stage to me, like you, have made the concerted effort to practice every day now, am finding the ability to get to Focus 3/10 alot more straight forward.
For the first time last night I was getting alot of sounds, voices(Mumbled conversations) and there was this tune playing off in the distance, though like the voices I couldn't quite pick up the melody. I spent quite a bit of time trying to chase it down inside my head, tho it was proving quite elusive! After I decided to call it a day I looked up at the bedside clock to discover that I'd been there for an hour and a half, instead of my usual forty-five minutes The funny thing is that it seemed like the usual time period that I practiced...So I'm not sure what happened there, but I'm looking forward to trying again tonight!

There is no real correct way to deepen the state further. Once you obtain sufficient "lift" in a deep focus 10, it can either be a roller coaster ride and being castapulted in a completely different environment, or you may progressively deepen the state through focus 12 (abstract forms) until you reach 3d blackness (focus 21).

Tom,

  Well this is the thing I'm aiming for (The 3d blackness), from what you say it sounds like I need to continue tinkering about in Focus 10-12, 'till I get the 'whoosh' off to another "area/focus"

To get that going..a mental run down can work (but only from a deep focus 10 in my experience), or just fool around with images a bit, since it is very delicate blance of left and right brain activation (for lack of a better term), and you do not want to axctivate your left brain too much..prematuraly...

When I've tried doing a rundown from this point, I find it very difficult not to wake the brain up, so when doing this would it be right to try to...err...waft the imagery in, in a dreamy sort of way, rather than calling it to mind in the usual sense?

Cheers,

Steve

[Steve 2B]

Hi Tom,

Thanks again for the reply.

As far as the exact process however, I tend to look at more as an ability to dissociate yourself from the physical. Like grasping a sense of being completely out of normal reality in both mental orientation or positioning, as well as completely ignoring the senses.

It's interesting that you mention this as I've been musing over the last few weeks about the validity of the waking consciousness experience, given what I've been reading about the fact that we're not actually in the body anyway. The thing that I've been trying/tinkering to impress with myself is the sense these other three focus's of attention are as equally valid, in order to try to loosen the hold that my F1 focus of attention has currently. The interesting thing that's happened with this is that when I've spent the day treating what I'm experiencing, whilst awake is not as real, given the wider scope of reality, is me just perceiving actions and movement within consciousness...Subsequently when I try the rundown in the evening the clarity of the visuals in the rundown at somewhere around F3/F10 (Monroe), is markedly sharper and have thought 'wow! That's an improvement!' The other thing I notice is that my thoughts have a direct impact on what I see in the scene, i.e thought=action, so I can only conclude I getting a bit closer...Maybe? I'll try re-orientating my perception of self in relation to my body tonight, whilst on the border, see what happens

Duh...I seem to have been rambling again

Cheers Tom,

Steve

[RooJ]

Hey Steve,
It seems im at the same point as you as far as phasing goes. I can get to the border of sleep quite quickly and easily, but once there i don't seem to get very far. For the last few sessions ive had situations where i was close to entering imagery, but the sudden realisation that the transition is happening inevitably makes me lose it, I kinda flinch with excitement and it drags me out of the state.

As far as the exact process however, I tend to look at more as an ability to dissociate yourself from the physical. Like grasping a sense of being completely out of normal reality in both mental orientation or positioning, as well as completely ignoring the senses.

I can completely relate to this, the few experiences ive had that saw me almost entering imagery happened when, for a second or two i just let everything go, like really sunk my attention deep into the image as if it was my only reality (its actually hard to explain).

Good luck steve and keep us posted on your progress, any breakthroughs you have will likely help others like myself .

>RooJ

[wizzle3]

where would i go to read about these focus levels? and how to acheive the lower ones??

[Steve 2B]

Hi Rooj,

I must confess I'm finding the phasing process quite frustrating at the moment, like you I can get to the border in a pretty straight forward fashion and the method in getting there is pretty reliable...But it feels like I'm standing in the foyer of a movie theater, I really want to go in and see the movie, but I don't know how to open the door (So to speak).

Last night I was lying there quite happy in a good focus three (M), or maybe a light focus ten and it just wasn't playing. No pushing, pulling, reaching, or dis-owning the body, or relaxing the eyes would produce any sensation of the shift. Just as I was calling it a day the house was cooling off from the sunshine of the day and made a loud cracking sound, nearly gave me a heart attack...At that point I threw my hands in the air, with exasperation and went down stairs.
What makes the whole thing even worse is that when I went to bed later I closed my eyes, as normal, and was asleep within ten minutes

Wizzle3,

If you've not seen these threads;

What is Phasing and how can I do it?
What are the focus levels?
What is Focus 10? (Mind Awake/Body Asleep)

You'll find them in the FAQ section;

http://www.astralpulse.com/forums/viewforum.php?f=46

Cheers,

Steve

[Steve 2B]

Hey Tom,

No, I've not tried the early morning sessions as such...I'll have to get myself, or rig myself up a quietish alarm...I can just guess what the comments will be from my wife at the thought of getting woken at 5am..LoL.

Thanks I'll give it a go, see what happens.

My attempts last night were scuppered pretty quickly, what with phones ringing and thunder storms raging overhead...But the interesting thing was when I went to bed. Relaxing my eyes in the way I do when practicing phasing triggered the launch into dreamland almost instantanousely. So it seems there's something I'm doing that's getting in the way...Hmmmm

Cheers,

Steve

[Eagle of Light]

After I decided to call it a day I looked up at the bedside clock to discover that I'd been there for an hour and a half, instead of my usual forty-five minutes The funny thing is that it seemed like the usual time period that I practiced...So I'm not sure what happened there, but I'm looking forward to trying again tonight!

Hello

That's interesting what you said Steve, because this is something that has surprised me on several occasions. One night, I looked at my watch, it was 00:01 am, easy to remember   . I started my rundown and eventually reached what seems like to be Fz due to the kind of 3D feeling, room getting bigger and bigger, and low physical input.
Afterward, I came back to normal waking state and I looked at my watch: I read 02:02am    I just could not believe it, exactly 2 hours had spent for what seemed like say 45 or max 1 hour.

I know that Monroe's Focus 15 is considered to be a "no time" state. Also, Major Tom reminds us just above your post that 3D blackness is linked to Focus 21.  So, is this a possibility that I believe to be at Fz while in reality I would be at Focus 15 ? Or is time 'distortion" a characteristic of Focus 21 as well ? Does the switch from 2D to 3D ensure that I was at Focus 21 ?

I would really appreciate if someone could answer me about this.

Yours,
Eagle of Light

[E3mpirical1]

It was just last night that I found a really great way to sordof disconnect yourself from the physical. I was actually comparing myself to Neo in the matrix about he realized that his life in the begining of the movie was not the life he thought it was. Trying to put yourself in Neo's place and his likely thought of mind when all of this realization occured and act as if that was YOU it may help.... atleast it did for me.

[Steve 2B]

E3mpirical1,

It's interesting you mention this, as for the first time last night I got a real tangible sensation of being seperate from the body. I was doing my usual noticing exercise, tho this time I was trying out something I'd been mulling over, about how to get the eyes to relax without having to constantly battle at a/ keeping them still, b/ stopping them powering back up if something happened to wander by as such.
 I'd been thinking at what point do the eyes normally feel most relaxed when focusing on something, for me it always seemed to be when I'd been looking into the abyss when I'd gone scuba diving, or looking at those deepwater expanses on the nature programs on tv.
So I tried to recall that sensation when looking into something of that nature, sure enough the tension started to drop away quite rapidly. Then I tried adding/wafting a little bit of visualizing, to try to deepen the sensation was quite suprised that the eyes didn't make an attempt to look at any of the images.
At about that point I started to become aware of a sense of seperation. I knew it was still there(body), could hear my breathing if I flicked my attention to it for a moment, but it felt I was no longer bound to it, if that makes any sense. Visually I was getting lots of swirly patterns and some hypnogogic images.
Unfortunately at that point the Mp3 track I listen to ended, so ended my practice for the day.My usual practice is about 50 mins, but it felt only like 25...
Still I think maybe it was a bit of progress. Still waiting for that 'woosh' tho

Cheers,

Steve

[Eagle of Light]

Hi

Thank you Major Tom for your answer.

If I understand correctly, you consider that time distortion is in some way due to losses of awareness. That's interesting and makes sense.

I thought nevertheless this could be also a property of other areas of consciousness. Some people experiencing NDE report time fluctuation longer than the "clinical death" period. Yet, their experience is very vivid and realistic (so much this almost always completely transform their mind about life on Earth). In this context, this is hard to believe that those people had "blinked out" ? What do you think about this ?

Yours,
Eagle of Light

[greatoutdoors]

Steve,

Great posts, very informative! I can totally relate to the sudden sounds trashing any efforts to meditate, never mind the level! Sometimes it happens often enough that I am tensing up, just waiting for the next interruption. Then I can scrap that session!  

I also have problems keeping my eyes relaxed -- they want to try and focus on what I'm seeing behind my lids. I've had moderate success at keeping them still, but will try your idea and see if things improve.

One area (of many) I could use some help with is relaxing my neck and the base of my skull. I can get the shoulders to loosen up, but it seems no matter what I do, my neck is tense. Any ideas?

Eagle,

I wouldn't worry too much about the time thing. If Einstein couldn't figure it out we aren't likely to do it.    Major Tom is right about what he calls "blinking out." I will be well into a good meditation, then suddenly realize that my mind has been drifting in all kinds of directions without my noticing. It's not quite sleeping, just drifting. All I do is bring my mind back and start again.

[Steve 2B]

greatoutdoors,

Thanks for the sentiment. Just vocalizing my inner ramblings, attempting to get to grips with it all, maybe put a few ideas in the collective pot?
Heh..There's this one loud click that occurs somewhere off to my right-hand-side at about the 30-35 minute level. It's starting to get predictable, so much so I begin to wonder if some of these sounds are a product to knock/test a persons concentration? A bit like a 'beware of the dog' signpost, even tho there is no dog!, or maybe a "CAUTION! You're now leaving regulated 'Mindspace"...LoL...
 It's only some wild newbie speculation on my part...But there are some distinctive regulars that make appearances. I can only suppose they might be just another one of those things I need to learn to filter out.
 As for the realaxtion thing..Did you read the article on relaxation that mactombs posted?

http://www.astralpulse.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=20148

I know first hand about the neck and shoulder difficulties as I've had back troubles over the years, caused by a mild scoliosis(aparently alot of people have this without realizing it). Anyway, when I'm practicing I use one of those pillows that has the tiny polystyrene balls in it, not the regular foam ones. The nice thing about these is that you can get the exact shape you want, can go through the session without getting that uncomfortable feeling of wanting to move. Also have a look at Franks posts about relaxing the eyes and the squishy ball technique, as I've now taken to using this method, works really well. Don't bother with the body at all, consentrate on relaxing the face and eyes and the rest seems to follow automatically.

The thing I've been thinking/observing alot in the last week is what I do when I'm going to sleep normally, in terms of the body/eyes/mind and the launch into dreamland. I tried out the relaxing the eyes thing I use in my phasing attempts and 'PoP!' I was asleep in an instant, so I know that part works...I also know what the shift feels like as I notice the sensation as I wake up in the mornings...So I'm asking the question now why is doing that so easy(sleep), and yet something I'm doing, or maybe not doing is making the phasing so bloomin' tricky!?

Yours, still thoroughly confused

Steve

[surfer8]

Hi All,
Pardon me for dropping in on your thread.
I was interested to see Major Tom's comments about "blinking out"  and was wondering if anyone else had been through this.  i.e. is it a phase in development or something else?

I've been using the Gateway series of Cd's for about 12 months now and have recently realised that I'd never really cracked the f10 properly and so recently, I've been going back over the first Wave to try and re-establish a good F10.

What I've found is that the more I concentrate on F3, F10 and advanced F10 tracks, the more I 'blink out' pretty much every time.
I can be absolutely convinced that I've maintained awareness right through the track only to realise that I have absolutely no conscious awareness/recall of whole chunks of "time".
If it wasn't for the fact that I know that Monroe's voice is present at certain stages, I'd be prepared to swear on oath that I hadn't missed a thing.

So, the question here is, is there anything I can do to overcome this? is it just a developmental phase or am I I going to be stuck here for evermore?


What's also interesting is that when i first went through these tracks, if I look back at my journals i can see that i was experiencing a lot more visual imagery then than I am now. Although I wasn't going as deep then.

Anyway, that's my two 'penneth's worth.  Any hints from the more experienced of you would be welcome.

Cheers
Jon

[Stookie]

Jon:

I've been using wave one for a several months, and recently had some success with it:

http://www.astralpulse.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=20281&sid=efe568bde99239fccd4fd4c8daac4d6d

I've "blinked out" many times, but recently have been very aware during the whole thing with little or no visual imagery. I use track 3 most often, as track 2 takes too long to get to focus 10. With track 3, you go to 10, then back awake, then back to 10 again. The second time around is when it really starts to put me there. As mentioned in the post, I do this twice a day, everyday.

[surfer8]

Stookie,
I've been using the CD set (I have all 7 waves) for about a year now, but found that although I had gotten through to the end of wave 4 / beginning of Wave 5, I was getting less and less out of it the further I got.
Also, the less I got, the less I was inclined to practice and day to day life started to get in the way.

That's why I recently decided to go back to wave 1 and start again with F10.

Thanks for you inputs though, it helps to hear that someone else has had a similar experience

Cheers
surfer8

[Steve 2B]

Ahhhhhhhh,

I can't take it no more..LoL Ok, Ok I've just gone and bought the Wave 1 cd's

No but seriously, I've been thinking about getting these for some time now, from all your posts here and other threads I can't resist anymore

Should be delivered Monday. My wife will be away on business for the rest of next week, so I'll be getting into them big time!

Cheers,

Steve

[greatoutdoors]

Steve,

Thanks for the info. I'm going to chase down Franks eye technique as soon as I finish here. The bead pillow idea may be worth trying.

As to what happens when we sleep, for me it seems my mind blanks out before my body does. The trick is holding on to that half-sleeping, buzzy stage you hit right before lights out.  

[greatoutdoors]

Okay, I admit to ignorance. I can't find anything on eye relaxation techniques. Help?

[Steve 2B]

greatoutdoors,

No probs, here's the link to Franks 'Squashy rubber ball technique'

http://www.astralpulse.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=1141

At the w/e I was having a play with that moment just before you fall asleep, kinda ended up in a tug of war. It felt a bit like standing on the edge of a precipice, I'd start to fall over, got that fast sense of movement, would pull back to stop myself blacking out.

On a side note, when I woke up this morning I was making note again of the sensations(In terms of relaxation), which I found quite different from even my most relaxed state whilst I'm doing my phasing practice. I wonder if this is because I'm attempting a different action? Still, my cd's should turn up today. I'm not expecting some 'wonder-cure' to my troubles, but from what I've read from the others have posted here, I'm interested to see what effect they'll have as an effective tool to reach a good focus 10.

Cheers,

Steve

[Stookie]

Steve 2B -

Keep us up to date on how the CD's work for you. You seem to be going at them with the correct mind state ("I'm not expecting some 'wonder-cure"). The CD's don't do it for you, they are assistance to YOU doing it.

[one_each]

I've meditated for many years, but my goals did not include OBE/AP experiences.  At least not until now.  When I first started using the Monroe tapes, I found that I had already reached F3, F10 and even F12 in my meditations.  However, with meditation, you try to keep your mind clear of visualizations and sounds.  They get in the way, or at least they do for the meditation that I was practicing.

Now that I am learning to OBE/AP, I can shift my conscience easily enough, but I don't 'go' anywhere.  Recently, I read Frank's web site and he stated, "They don't actually realize that changing your perception in consciousness, and shifting your area of consciousness, are two very different things."  Well, that was my problem.  I could shift my area of consciousness, but I wouldn't allow my perception to change.

A little more research and I found where Frank talked about his noticing technique.  Just watch the 'darkness' and look for a spot that's not quite as dark, or a sound or a flash of light.  After awhile, your perception changes.

My problem now is that I loose focus.  My thinking becomes more like dreaming then OBE/AP.  Once I start to realize that I've shifted my perception, I pop back to the 'dark' where I was meditating.  There is a fine line that you must maintain and I have almost no practice at it.  A few more days and I should be exploring PF2 with no problem.

[mactombs]

I just got the Wave I CDs as well as the second of Monroe's book (I can never find it in the bookstores). The funny thing is, the very morning before I got the CDs, I attained my first real intentional Focus 10!

The CDs, however, have been helpful in reaching Focus 10. I've reached it a couple times with the second exercise, and a couple other times I've gotten into a really deep state of body relaxation bordering on sleep. Today it was interesting because my legs decided to start twitching a lot, and every time a leg would, there would be a big white electric flash.

I don't do the resonant tuning, I use an alternate method for "energizing", so I can't say I follow the instructions to a T, even so I've enjoyed the CDs so far.

one_each, that's interesting what you say about meditation. I know that a lot of meditation is just as you say about keeping your mind clear, but I had no idea how it related. I didn't have a clue what Frank meant by "They don't actually realize that changing your perception in consciousness, and shifting your area of consciousness, are two very different things" until now. Thanks for that, your post gave me one of those "aha" moments, and this one is going to be useful.