((I want to preface these posts by pointing out that these are only a small selection of wonderful posts by Frank which have helped me the most to understand how to achieve his concept of Phasing))The last couple days the topic of phasing has come up.
I just came across this post by Frank which sums it up I think in a slightly better way than Gandalf was able to put together in the Frank Phasing Resource.
Give it a quick read and tell me your thoughts.
http://www.astralpulse.com/forums/welcome_to_out_of_body_experiences/phasing_ap_question-t18361.0.html;msg159124#msg159124
QuoteHi:
I don't meditate at all and I'm not actually sure what meditation is. People talk in conventional terms of achieving a "trance state" and I'm not sure what that is either. All I know is the more hurdles you place in your way the more difficult it will be.
Phasing pertains to a particular model of consciousness. It does not rely upon achieving any particular focus state relating to the Monroe model. Though there are often similarities in experience, and relating certain of these similarities to particular Monroe focus states such as F10, F12, F21 (i.e. the 3 most useful to beginners) can often be helpful, but it is by no means necessary.
My success rate is not something I measure. Phasing to F2 I'd say is 99% provided I can be fairly relaxed and comfortable. So if I were outside in a rainstorm and it was blowing a gale, then I'd have little chance. But lying in bed with no distractions, then chances of F2 are near certain. F3 is about 90% and F4 about 30%. It's not really any harder to phase from F1 to F4 it's just my familiarity with the F4 state is a lot less than the F2 state, because I have been doing it nowhere near as long.
I'm assuming you can fall asleep. In which case, next time you arrange to do so, go to bed an hour earlier than you would normally do and, rather than letting your mind just drift off, simply look within yourself and notice what goes on. You don't need to bother about what your physical body is doing, simply focus within yourself and let that take your attention.
You need to get your imagination working (this is a most important aspect) and create some kind of mental scene within your mind. Keep noticing it. Notice how the picture builds and becomes more lifelike the more you concentrate on it. Notice how your attention wanders sometimes, notice how the internal landscape changes. Notice how you are noticing yourself in the action of noticing. See yourself on several different "levels" of noticing. Notice how it often feels like there are several of you all noticing each other at once.
You need to get your senses involved within you. Notice how you can see things, hear things, touch things, have it all going on inside your imagination while you notice it happening. Then, at some point, your attention will become captured by it. You'll notice changes taking place, people will start talking to you and you will begin conversing back to them. Events will start taking place, they'll take on a life of their own and, for a short while, you will join in. Then, chances are, you will suddenly freak out thinking, hang on a minute, I'm not creating this!
You'll feel yourself "return" to the physical and you will be thinking back to a moment ago, when it was like you were in another world, a different realm of reality (because you were!). This is Phasing. It needs no trance, no meditation, no energy work, and no other "body". There is no feeling of separation, no immense fear, no "out of body" sensations, no vibrations, and no other weird feelings at all. All the while you feel like you are the same you, and all that changed is your environment.
It's all sparked off through the simple act of noticing together with a huge dollop of imagination as a kick-start. It's not something you sit and wait for, it's something you actively work towards achieving. People who sit around waiting usually a) get bored, or b) fall asleep.
Yours,
Frank
Very informative and has provided me with a bit more insight.
Ok... well, as Noy and I were just talking about in the #astralpulse IRC channel... and as Noy says, I just kind of had an Epiphany!
I've been working on having conscious exits for a short time now and I just realized that all my life I've been doing exactly what Frank has said here.
Although, the connection only came after I read this particular post:
http://www.astralpulse.com/forums/welcome_to_out_of_body_experiences/locating_people_or_enities-t18490.0.html;msg159899#msg159899
QuoteAgain, many people fail to realise that it is perfectly possible to shift your perception in consciousness but not actually change your area of consciousness. All you are doing, it sounds like, is shifting your perception within (according to the Phasing model) Focus 2 of consciousness. Here is where most people have their dreams/lucid dreams/astral projections.
And I finally made the connection between that and the daydreaming I've been doing all my life.
I can hardly believe I've missed that puzzle piece the entire time I've been practicing AP! >_<
The connection is that during a daydream I've been shifting my perception in consciousness to F2 oC, but not actually changing my area of consciousness!
I'd be "daydreaming" (at school... home... work... etc) and I find myself "in" the scene I'm thinking about. But I wouldn't realize it until I "snapped out of it" and thought about it the second later. I guess now, I just need to work on "noticing" that moment when the shift happens.
Anyways, I just figured I'd think outloud right now. :)
Please continue on your days. hehe
Thanks xanth this was a good post and it gives me more of a localised area to develop upon
by the way from now on am gonna post the site addy for irc for this site all over the place i think am gonna be a spammer spamming this site address into your brains till you cant open a page without seeing you there
why lmao because we need more people who are liek minded to converse with
so the site addy is www.webchat.freenode.net and as one of the guys said above its #astralpulse channel
sorry for spamming your vote xanth and stookie if you read this you should make xanth moderator of that chat site because he is on it alot and provides decent convo's
anyways see you all later
Quote from: Fourthdimension on April 08, 2010, 19:26:29
Thanks xanth this was a good post and it gives me more of a localised area to develop upon
Yeah, it's really given me a new and renewed focus. :)
Since now, I have an even better idea of what I'm doing and how to achieve it.
Quoteby the way from now on am gonna post the site addy for irc for this site all over the place i think am gonna be a spammer spamming this site address into your brains till you cant open a page without seeing you there
why lmao because we need more people who are liek minded to converse with
so the site addy is www.webchat.freenode.net and as one of the guys said above its #astralpulse channel
Just put it in your sig like I did. :)
Quotesorry for spamming your vote xanth and stookie if you read this you should make xanth moderator of that chat site because he is on it alot and provides decent convo's
anyways see you all later
Unfortunately, the IRC channel in question was created by some unknown individual... perhaps one of the other mods has some idea.
Because of that, nobody can mod it. LoL
Hi Xanth, I used to post here awhile back and I remember you and Stookie being very helpful. Ive read and reread all of Franks post, and found his approach to phasing an excellent resource to start to get a grasp of the concept. However I have never been able to successfully phase myself.
I can lucid dream at will though with the use of rhythm napping, and an mp3 I loaded on my phone. If you dont mind I would love to get your opinion on a couple questions Ive been struggling with.
1. How different in your opinion, since you seem to have some experience with the subject are phasing and lucid dreaming?
2. When you phase do you use a wake back to bed method?
3. Is phasing nothing more than daydreaming, and then using some sort of tactile sensation to fully integrate yourself into the dream scene?
If you are able to answer any of my questions I would really appreciate it Xanth. Phasing in my opinion seems to be a more logical approach than any of the other methods described in out of body books. When I lucid dream Im able to manipulate the enviroment and characters within the dream at will but I know there isnt any real substance to them, and they are all a figment of my imigination. Frank claims to be able to communicate with actual spirits, and carry on complex conversations with them. Its a shame he isnt around anymore. Thanks guys, and good luck.
Quote from: crossfire on April 09, 2010, 03:54:59
Hi Xanth, I used to post here awhile back and I remember you and Stookie being very helpful. Ive read and reread all of Franks post, and found his approach to phasing an excellent resource to start to get a grasp of the concept. However I have never been able to successfully phase myself.
I can lucid dream at will though with the use of rhythm napping, and an mp3 I loaded on my phone. If you dont mind I would love to get your opinion on a couple questions Ive been struggling with.
1. How different in your opinion, since you seem to have some experience with the subject are phasing and lucid dreaming?
2. When you phase do you use a wake back to bed method?
3. Is phasing nothing more than daydreaming, and then using some sort of tactile sensation to fully integrate yourself into the dream scene?
If you are able to answer any of my questions I would really appreciate it Xanth. Phasing in my opinion seems to be a more logical approach than any of the other methods described in out of body books. When I lucid dream Im able to manipulate the enviroment and characters within the dream at will but I know there isnt any real substance to them, and they are all a figment of my imigination. Frank claims to be able to communicate with actual spirits, and carry on complex conversations with them. Its a shame he isnt around anymore. Thanks guys, and good luck.
Hi there Crossfire,
Your name definitely sounds a tad familiar. :)
I've been working lately on increasing the frequency (number of times, nothing mystical lol) of my Lucid Dreams.
I *generally* have at least one every couple of weeks. This last week though I've managed to get two... so that's a nice increase.
I'm doing it by playing around with certain affirmations during my meditations.
Anyways, onto your questions:
1. Phasing is a process which allows you to move your conscious awareness to another area of consciousness... and you do this on purpose, fully aware of what you're doing and where you're going. Lucid Dreaming, however, is a process where you simply awake in your dream becoming semi-conscious to the fact that you are, indeed, in a dream. At this point your Area of Consciousness has already shifted without your awareness. Lucid Dreaming (and dreaming for that matter) takes place in Focus 22 (Monroe model) or in Frank's model, Focus 2 oC.
2. Phasing is a "conscious exit" practice, as such I have yet to be successful. But when I project through a Lucid Dream, I don't know how I return... I just find myself back on my bed. LoL sorry I can't provide much more insight than that. :)
3. I'd consider Daydreaming to be the conscious trigger that enables Phasing (or at least one of them). You'll also want to engage more than just some tactile sensations to enable that trigger... you'll want to try to bring all your senses into it.
I've tasked myself to read EVERYTHING Frank has every written on this forum. I'm currently down to his last 500 posts... and I feel I'm getting a strong hold upon what he's trying to convey.
As for turning your Lucid Dream into a Projection... what I've been doing lately is following Franks model on it. Basically, what he does is once he's Lucid (and understands that he's in a dream) he tries to awaken his "cognitive processes" (his ability to question himself and his surroundings). He does this by focusing on one particular aspect of his lucid dream environment and begins to ask basic questions about it. Ask stuff like, "How did I get here" "What I am doing here" "What am I looking at"... stuff like that. This will awaken that process.
The next point is the important one (well, in the grand scheme of things, at least). Realize that what you're currently viewing as your Lucid Dreamscape is being fueled BY YOUR THOUGHTS AND EMOTIONS. So, what you need to do is close yourself off to your thoughts and emotions... this will cause the current landscape to slowly fade away and the astral proper Focus 3oC to fade in.
But it's all about CONTROLLING YOUR THOUGHTS AND EMOTIONS. At ALL times. Otherwise Focus 2oC will begin to blend back in.
I hope at least some of this helps. :)
I'd like to add this post to further develop the idea of Frank's "rundown".
I view it as a kind of "daydream"... so keep that in mind as you read his "peeling potatoes" rundown.
http://www.astralpulse.com/forums/welcome_to_out_of_body_experiences/focs_chakras_and_vibes-t18559.0.html;msg160897#msg160897
QuoteAndali:
You have hit on the very reason why I call it looking from a distance and that's what I am calling a third-person view. But I realise that my definition is not strictly correct. Technically, it can come across as not quite true third person, but more like actual first-person view but looking from a distance. With some people it can be a true third person, however.
Okay, regarding the sense question: let's choose a simple rundown. You are sitting at a table peeling potatoes.
Right, so you'll be lying in bed, aware of your physical body, yet in your mind you will be imagining there is another "you" who is sitting at a table peeling potatoes. Now, chances are this image will not be too clear at first. If you are like most people you will sense the image that you are creating, rather than actually see it. All you will likely be seeing is the blackness behind your closed eyes. So the image of this other "you" will be indistinct and hazy and none of it will make much sense.
Now, what we do is start to engage the senses of the "you" who you are creating in your imagination. Remember, your imagination is where you want to go to. Your imagination is situated within Focus 2 of consciousness. Once you are there, you can use F2oC as a launch-pad to get you to Focus 3 or Focus 4. Alternatively, you can stay within Focus 2 and have a nosy around, or you can come away towards the physical and have an RTZ experience. It's entirely up to you. But first you have to get yourself within Focus 2, and to do that we need to initiate "the switch".
So what you do is look at the table that you imagine this imaginary "you" is sitting at, see the wood it is made from, and feel the texture of it. In other words, engage the senses of the imaginary "you" sitting at that that table. It may not be a wooden table, it may be plastic. The detail is yours to decide and to imagine. You are not engaging the senses of your physical body lying on the bed. But the physical senses of the "you" who you are creating sitting at that table, in your mind. Doing that causes you to be more creative and shifts your focus of attention towards this imaginary person.
So you've felt the table and to the side of you is a bucket of potatoes and to the other side of you is another bucket with water in it. On the table is a peeling knife. What colour is the handle? See the colour, pick up the knife and feel it in the person's hand. Again, you are not feeling it with your own physical hand. The hand doing the feeling is the hand of the imaginary person you are creating in your mind.
Take one of the potatoes from the bucket and start to peel it. How does it smell, what sound does the knife make as it shaves-off the potato skin? When you have finished peeling then plop the potato in the bucket with the water. Did you hear the splash?
Are you getting what I mean now?
The idea is to create something not too elaborate, but not something so simple that you get bored and fall asleep or give up. Make it something that you enjoy doing, something simple that you can engage your senses, but make it a little repetitive so you can progressively build on the imagery, but not so repetitive that it become tedious and boring. In a rundown example published the other day, a member built a log cabin for himself. This kind of thing is ideal, because you have a series of repetitive actions but you are building something at the same time, which makes it far more interesting than merely doing some repetitive action on its own.
The more you practice this, the closer you will get to initiating "the switch". This happens when your focus of attention is captured by the imaginary imagery. You actually become the person you are imagining. Or you may end up in the same room as them and start talking to one another. This is kinda freaky when it first happens, lol, but you quickly get used to it.
Initially it's a little shocking, or at least it can be. Suddenly it'll be you sitting there peeling the potatoes within the same non-physical reality you were previously imagining from a distance. At which point you'll think, "Aagh, hang about, I'm not imagining this!" This realisation will tend to shock you out of the state. But after a few attempts you get used to it and you'll be able to remain where you are.
Once you are comfortable remaining in the state, then you can change your perception slightly and you'll see the current scenery give way to something else. Then you can practice doing this for a while. Don't try actually moving around. Just stand still and practice changing your perception and having your environment change to suit.
The BIG mistake people make is they immediately go flying off here and there. Unfortunately, doing that just creates havoc that can quickly get out of control, and all manner of misunderstandings can arise in your mind about the nature of the environment.
People tend to want to travel to places in the normal physical sense, so they set off walking, lol. But the secret to successful navigation of Focus 2 of consciousness, is realising you don't have to "travel" anywhere. You experience things by simply standing or sitting still and changing your perception. In other words, have your environment come to you rather than you trying to go to it.
Yours,
Frank
I guess this has become a "Xanth's Must Read" list. ROFL
This one is Frank further explaining and clarifying his "rundown" and what makes a successful rundown.
http://www.astralpulse.com/forums/welcome_to_astral_consciousness/success_with_phasing-t18986.0.html;msg163795#msg163795
QuoteSarah:
An excellent experience that highlights a number of important issues.
Firstly, you say that you didn't think it could be so easy. Perhaps easy is not quite the word I should be using in my narrative, maybe "straightforward" would be more apt for the point I wish to make. Obviously it is going to be easier for some people more than others. But that doesn't change the straightforwardness of the whole thing.
For a while now I have steadfastly maintained that this whole issue has been unnecessarily complicated by layer upon layer of mystical crud that has infected this topic to the extent where there is no longer any cure. To me it's like a rampaging cancer where the only option left is to simply cut the whole thing out in order to try and get rid of it. When you do that, and you learn the basic structure of the wider reality, about how each person truly relates to that wider reality... everything becomes MUCH more straightforward!
The other important point your post exemplifies is the fact that the best mental rundown to make the switch from Focus 1 to Focus 2 of consciousness is simply the rundown that is the best for you. One of the most popular questions I get is, "Frank, what's the best rundown to use?" Problem is, all the empirical evidence I have to date would strongly indicate that there is no universal "best".
There are, however, certain factors that stand out as being more beneficial than others.
I can say that what you need is something fairly simple and repetitive but interesting at the same time. If it's too repetitive then you'll get bored and either give up, or fall asleep. But make it too complicated and you'll lose the thread of it all. You need to engage your senses to as high a degree as possible, but make it personal and direct. Someone said the other week about engaging their hearing by imagining a bird singing in the distance. Well, that's a start but it's not really all that engaging. Why not play a drum? That way you get a sense of feeling, sound and sight... and it's direct. All you need now is to chew some gum while you are doing it to get even your sense of taste involved and hey presto, you'll be making the switch before you know it.
Bouncing on a trampoline is ideal. Perhaps not everyone's thing but it's very engaging all the same. In other words it's a fun thing to do, it's a full on, in your face kind of activity and it directly engages the senses.
The other point I wished to stress I've just touched on in the paragraph above, which is the FUN aspect. I don't know what it is about all these mystical and other religious notions. To me it's almost like anyone wanting to take a more traditional course has to first have a total humour bypass in order to qualify.
Your rundown should be directly engaging and it also should be FUN. Not frivolous, and I want to stress this: we are not engaging in some frivolous act. But it should be fun, all the same. But again I am doubly stressing because I don't want anyone getting the idea that we don't take any of this seriously. I, for one, take this topic very seriously. It has been a part of my life for over 20 years, so I take it seriously alright, but I also have fun while I'm doing it.
The other point you exemplify is the way people are typically jolted out of the state the moment they step into it. Often it is the case that you get jolted out of it so fast that you only really realise that you had made the transition to Focus 2 after you get jolted back to Focus 1. You are left lying there thinking back to a moment ago, realising you had stepped into your rundown and got zapped out of it. Normally the excitement of realising you made the switch prevents you from making any further attempts that session.
After a while of practice (actual time varies from person to person) you become comfortable with the process to the extent where you no longer get zapped out of it. Once you are comfortable in making the switch to Focus 2, then the next step is to learn how to transition to Focus 3 as that's where all the "fun stuff" is. The transition to Focus 3 is not all that difficult. But like the transition to Focus 2, it just takes a little practice.
Overall, it is not the actual doing that is difficult and your post is a perfect example of that even considering you are not exactly a complete beginner. I thing the most difficult aspect of this whole thing has been coming to the realisation of what the wider reality actually entails, rather than trying to sift through all the varying beliefs about what the wider reality entails. Once you realise the structure and that there is a Focus 2, a Focus 3 and a Focus 4, and what you have to do in order to Phase to these areas (though everyone please let's put aside F4 for a while as it's mighty complex, we'll stick to F2 and F3 for now) then the actual doing isn't all that difficult.
Again, strip away all the mystical beliefs that have clouded the simplicity of it all and people will be Phasing for fun in no time. Well, that's what I sincerely hope.
Yours,
Frank
A further addendum to my above post... another clarification from Frank:
http://www.astralpulse.com/forums/welcome_to_astral_consciousness/questions_about_phasing-t19000.0.html;msg164010#msg164010
QuoteHi:
The mind should not be clear of thoughts. I'm not sure where people get this idea. It's probably through some kind of meditation something or other. You need to create a mental rundown in order to make "the switch". Reason being, your imagination is held within Focus 2 of consciousness. This is the area where most people dream, or act out some other construct such as "astral projection", and a whole load of things besides. They all tend to be actions that take place within Focus 2 of consciousness.
The approach I suggest uses Focus 2 of consciousness as a kind of "launch pad" to take you to other areas of consciousness. In particular Focus 3. This is where the fun stuff takes place. Anyone wanting "proof" about "life after death" and such like needs to project to Focus 3 of consciousness. You can project direct to Focus 3 of consciousness but beginners have to begin somewhere and I believe it is far easier and far more understandable for beginners to comprehend the transition to Focus 2 first. Then use this as a launch pad to Focus 3.
So it doesn't just help to use a technique like Sarah described, the whole transition is formed on the basis of it. Otherwise how are you going to make the transition?
You can try "coming awake" within a dream and then attempt to Phase-shift to Focus 3 of consciousness, but this is unreliable due to the fact that no matter how hard you try, most people simply cannot quite "come awake" to the extent necessary to make a controlled transition. So what we do, in effect, is create a highly controlled and highly conscious "dream" if you like. Where you find yourself stepping into your "dream". But you do that fully conscious and fully knowing exactly what it is you are doing. This puts you right in the middle of Focus 2 of consciousness.
Here you have two choices:
1) you can go and fly around, and revel in your belief constructs about whatever it is takes your fancy. Have an astral projection experience, or experience any other belief construct you happen to subscribe to... or...
2) you can transition to another area in your consciousness continuum.
If you want to step outside of the typical traditional mystical experience, then you need to transition to Focus 3. This is the essential difference between what Monroe was typically experiencing in his later work, versus the people who subscribe to the more traditionalist views.
If you are having thoughts that turn into dreams then you are not creating an absorbing enough rundown for yourself. Or you are trying when you are too tired and ready for sleep, or a combination of the two. If you get bored in your rundown then simply make it more interesting for yourself.
Yours,
Frank
So, this morning I used a bit of noticing just to get myself into a lower branch Focus 2oC (Monroe Focus 3).
Then the rundown I chose to use was of my beach scene...
See, I have this "special thinking spot" at the beach nearby me that I used to walk to quite often when I was younger.
It's a great spot right on the beach with a nice big rock to sit on and watch and listen to the waves roll off the lake.
In my rundown I would do this... then engage some tactile sensations whereby I'd start playing in the same a bit... maybe pick up a few rocks and feel them, then skip them into the water.
I found that after a few minutes of this I was 'pulled into' the scene, but as usual, I'd then NOTICE I was pulled in and that snapped me out of it. LoL
This happened a few times actually. I'm ever-so-slowly learning to sense the shift, but I figure it's going to be a bit still.
What I've been doing has directly come about from reading those above "Frank Posts".
Anyways, I just wanted to share that.
Quote from: Xanth on April 10, 2010, 12:53:43
So, this morning I used a bit of noticing just to get myself into a lower branch Focus 2oC (Monroe Focus 3).
Then the rundown I chose to use was of my beach scene...
See, I have this "special thinking spot" at the beach nearby me that I used to walk to quite often when I was younger.
It's a great spot right on the beach with a nice big rock to sit on and watch and listen to the waves roll off the lake.
In my rundown I would do this... then engage some tactile sensations whereby I'd start playing in the same a bit... maybe pick up a few rocks and feel them, then skip them into the water.
I found that after a few minutes of this I was 'pulled into' the scene, but as usual, I'd then NOTICE I was pulled in and that snapped me out of it. LoL
This happened a few times actually. I'm ever-so-slowly learning to sense the shift, but I figure it's going to be a bit still.
What I've been doing has directly come about from reading those above "Frank Posts".
Anyways, I just wanted to share that.
Very nice work you have done by posting these topics of Frank.
I thought you are here just to criticize people, but I was wrong ;) (just kidding)
Lots of love and power to you.
Regards
Quote from: indian on April 12, 2010, 09:02:22
Very nice work you have done by posting these topics of Frank.
I thought you are here just to criticize people, but I was wrong ;) (just kidding)
Lots of love and power to you.
Regards
I do indeed do more than just say hi and criticize. ;)
I've actually had quite a bit of success over this past weekend.
I've been able to "step into" my rundown... the only problem now that I have to overcome is that each time I do, I don't "notice" the shift and in noticing AFTER it happens it causes me to snap myself back to the physical.
So now I have to work on recognizing when the shift is going to happen.
frank groupie
Quote from: personalreality on April 12, 2010, 17:35:26
frank groupie
Damn skippy! :)
I can't help it if he's RIGHT. :D
Technically, I've never made so much progress in so little time than I have reading what Frank had to say.
I finished reading *EVERY* post that he's made here (that wasn't lost) and I'm a much more informed individual than I was before.
I'm working through his newsletters now.
Right is relative.
But you've still inspired me to read Frank's posts.
Quote from: personalreality on April 12, 2010, 19:50:50
Right is relative.
That's why I put the ":D" in there. ;)
However, with that said...
I fully realize that not everyone is going to agree with everything or even some of what he writes about, but everything he writes about resonates with a truth to my soul.
I can't explain it... so I won't even waste the time trying. :)
QuoteBut you've still inspired me to read Frank's posts.
I personally think that everyone should read Frank's posts.
At the very least the last years worth... most of them are gold. Well, at least the ones ABOUT Phasing.
oh.. a rundown, so that's what its called. I was doing a beach scene also where I was walking on the beach sometimes in a loopy kind of way as a way of meta-physical visualization but I am getting somewhat confused as to what the subconscious is actually doing now when we phase. Since we're not actually going anywhere as nonphysical has no concept of distance is it really doing anything other than just letting us view the focus we want to? I know that sounds insanely simple compared to what the result is. I know that I..the conscious I am aware of am doing nothing but requesting to my subconscious to perform some "function", I know that much. With rundowns I gather that we are visualizing in F2 to such a depth that allows our subconscious to with absolute certainty understand that yes, we want to view this focus so it does so. Am I getting there?
Quote from: soli on April 30, 2010, 20:58:57
oh.. a rundown, so that's what its called. I was doing a beach scene also where I was walking on the beach sometimes in a loopy kind of way as a way of meta-physical visualization but I am getting somewhat confused as to what the subconscious is actually doing now when we phase. Since we're not actually going anywhere as nonphysical has no concept of distance is it really doing anything other than just letting us view the focus we want to? I know that sounds insanely simple compared to what the result is. I know that I..the conscious I am aware of am doing nothing but requesting to my subconscious to perform some "function", I know that much. With rundowns I gather that we are visualizing in F2 to such a depth that allows our subconscious to with absolute certainty understand that yes, we want to view this focus so it does so. Am I getting there?
First off, it's important to note that your "imagination" is part of Focus 2.
It's a slightly lower branch of Focus 2, but it's there. This is why we do a "rundown" with the goal of "stepping into" it.
Once in there, it's a much easier hop into the Astral proper.
As for "distance"... that is correct. There is no distance, you're not "going anywhere". You're simply shifting your focus of awareness to somewhere else that isn't here. :)
I'm not sure if I'm reading your question right, but...
The point of the rundown is to create an "imagined scene" whereby you create a simple scenario that engages most (if not all 5) of your physical senses.
The more you relax into it, the more your physical senses turn off and start getting fed from the sense you're creating from the rundown.
Eventually, your entire awareness will "shift" into the rundown... at which point you're off to the races!
I hope that helped.
~Ryan :)
Quote from: Xanth on May 02, 2010, 01:22:32
I'm not sure if I'm reading your question right, but...
The point of the rundown is to create an "imagined scene" whereby you create a simple scenario that engages most (if not all 5) of your physical senses.
The more you relax into it, the more your physical senses turn off and start getting fed from the sense you're creating from the rundown.
Eventually, your entire awareness will "shift" into the rundown... at which point you're off to the races!
I hope that helped.
~Ryan :)
It's amazing when two different people explain the answer to you in totally different ways and both make sense. I know in one of the OBE books I read the author had his own rundown, though he didn't call it that. His technique would be that he'd be in his house and memorize the location of everything in it with exact details such that in his imagination he was in his house. He would walk around and look at and feel the objects which would take away from his physical senses and allow him to project. He probably had no idea what he was actually doing in truth, but it worked for him, so that's what he did! So the more we interact with f2 the more we step into it until eventually we're totally in f2. As right now in the physical we are in a f1/f2 overlay correct? I can think of images with my imagination in f2 right now yet I'm still here in the physical f1.
What I was trying to find out is what is the phasing point for f2. Picture how a water molecule freezes. It can be 33 degrees and very cold but it will not be frozen. Only when it reaches 32 degrees will it change phases and finally freeze. I was wondering then if in the subconscious there is a phasing point where after xxx amount of attention is brought to f2 compared to f1 that we phase into it.
The "phasing point" will depend entirely upon you and how much you can entice your physical senses to "shift" into your rundown. :)
The more you can engage your physical senses from WITHIN your rundown, the greater chances that you'll shift into it.
~Ryan :)
that's what i've been trying to explain to siol in his/her introduction
Quote from: Xanth on May 02, 2010, 13:02:05
The "phasing point" will depend entirely upon you and how much you can entice your physical senses to "shift" into your rundown. :)
The more you can engage your physical senses from WITHIN your rundown, the greater chances that you'll shift into it.
~Ryan :)
Maybe I am trying to make it too much into a logical function where at x amount y happens for everyone. I know the more I entice my senses the greater chances are that I'll shift to it. I just want to know that when I entice to this extent that the shifting will happen. I do agree though that in practice the mind set with the most success will be the one that tries to engage to the greatest amount possible by one's self. I understand now it's probably that due to people's unique emotions and self due to how translation of sense occurs also that there will have to be another variant besides x and y which will be z, the person's unique self. So basically.. the only one who will know my "phasing point" will be me through experience, so I should stop inquiring on questions that only I can solve for myself.
Quote from: personalreality on May 02, 2010, 16:21:21
that's what i've been trying to explain to siol in his/her introduction
Hence the two different people part, lol
Wow this stuff is amazing!You're right xanth it does make a lot of sense!But I think phasing appeals most to us dreamers.Those people who used to drift off in class completely absorbed in a mental world or the kids that played make believe where everything was just so REAL.It's strange though, how easy it sounds now that it's been explained in such a different way.I kind of expected something more complicated though.And when you phase and shift the surroundings around you, can you still choose to wander in your astral body rather than just rotate your location?
Last night I found an interesting thing about rundown. I was not trying to phase (I am taking a break) but I started a kind of rundown in order to fall asleep. The result was the opposite!. So I decided to use "intention" while doing the rundown...and everything changed. As I put intention in the rundown I could feel a change in my awareness almost inmediately. So maybe the formula is - rundown+intention+stop spectations -
From my experiences(which I do add is very limited) doing nothing on any conscious level that you're aware of in f2 will make you fall asleep, doing any conscious activity in f2 then will keep your awareness and do.. the opposite yes. I would go so far as to say that rundowns are the essence of phasing, and nothing else is necessary, so trying to do a rundown is the same thing as trying to phase. I'm pretty sure when you put intention in the rundown it helped to focus on your rundown more which is why it was more effective.
Quote from: soli on May 05, 2010, 08:52:12
From my experiences(which I do add is very limited) doing nothing on any conscious level that you're aware of in f2 will make you fall asleep, doing any conscious activity in f2 then will keep your awareness and do.. the opposite yes. I would go so far as to say that rundowns are the essence of phasing, and nothing else is necessary, so trying to do a rundown is the same thing as trying to phase. I'm pretty sure when you put intention in the rundown it helped to focus on your rundown more which is why it was more effective.
Sure, with intention everything is more effective. But I didn't want to say placing intention in the rundown but in the "goal"...I mean, keep the intention of phasing while doing the rundown. It's like locking a target. Maybe it is obvious for most of you, but I just realized it. I am doing the rundown without placing a focused intent in phasing (just doing the rundown and waiting to phase), and maybe this is one of my pitfalls.
Quote from: Bacterio on May 05, 2010, 09:04:52
Sure, with intention everything is more effective. But I didn't want to say placing intention in the rundown but in the "goal"...I mean, keep the intention of phasing while doing the rundown. It's like locking a target. Maybe it is obvious for most of you, but I just realized it. I am doing the rundown without placing a focused intent in phasing (just doing the rundown and waiting to phase), and maybe this is one of my pitfalls.
not really obvious, If I told you how much I was doing wrong at first you wouldn't even call it a rundown. I understand where you're coming from, when one does something with the thought of a purpose its probably easier for the subconscious to know what needs to be done. I don't know how the purpose thought becomes entangled with the actual rundown though to the subconscious, it probably sees it as one idea, and not a purpose + rundown, but, a purposeful rundown, if that makes sense.
Quote from: tetrabane on May 05, 2010, 02:54:53
can you still choose to wander in your astral body rather than just rotate your location?
You can wander around, yes. But you'll quickly learn that it's a waste of time and energy as even as we use phasing to change our focus of awareness... you can do the same thing WHILE projecting to move between places. :)
Quote from: Bacterio on May 05, 2010, 06:20:20
Last night I found an interesting thing about rundown. I was not trying to phase (I am taking a break) but I started a kind of rundown in order to fall asleep. The result was the opposite!. So I decided to use "intention" while doing the rundown...and everything changed. As I put intention in the rundown I could feel a change in my awareness almost inmediately. So maybe the formula is - rundown+intention+stop spectations -
Yup, you have to not only do a rundown... you have to BELIEVE that you're there, experiencing everything that you're imagining.
Quote from: soli on May 05, 2010, 08:52:12
From my experiences(which I do add is very limited) doing nothing on any conscious level that you're aware of in f2 will make you fall asleep, doing any conscious activity in f2 then will keep your awareness and do.. the opposite yes. I would go so far as to say that rundowns are the essence of phasing, and nothing else is necessary, so trying to do a rundown is the same thing as trying to phase. I'm pretty sure when you put intention in the rundown it helped to focus on your rundown more which is why it was more effective.
Rundowns are but one of the methods we use to phase.
~Ryan :)
Quote from: Xanth on May 05, 2010, 09:27:37
Rundowns are but one of the methods we use to phase.
~Ryan :)
maybe it is because its the only viable method I know that it's currently phasing to me. I haven't really seen any mention or focus on any other methods, could you point me to other posts or shall I go searching myself.
Quote from: soli on May 05, 2010, 09:30:38
maybe it is because its the only viable method I know that it's currently phasing to me. I haven't really seen any mention or focus on any other methods, could you point me to other posts or shall I go searching myself.
Using rundowns are one method.
"Noticing" is another.
Basically, any method that uses visualization would also work just fine.
Quote from: Xanth on May 05, 2010, 12:14:02
Using rundowns are one method.
"Noticing" is another.
Basically, any method that uses visualization would also work just fine.
oh, I categorize them both as "looking within", the only difference to me with rundowns is you add visualization for yourself to "look into", which is easier I think for beginners like me. I just don't want to over complicate it by adding many labels and techniques that in the end are the exact same function with different variants.
They're both designed to entice the same goal... that is bringing all of your senses into Focus 2.
The rundown creates a very real scenario for you to shift your senses to.
The noticing does the same, but in a more passive sense... you're not exactly waiting for something to happen, but you're using all your senses in 'blackness' infront of you and around you to "notice" anything different.
~Ryan :)
Quote from: Xanth on May 05, 2010, 12:34:37
They're both designed to entice the same goal... that is bringing all of your senses into Focus 2.
The rundown creates a very real scenario for you to shift your senses to.
The noticing does the same, but in a more passive sense... you're not exactly waiting for something to happen, but you're using all your senses in 'blackness' infront of you and around you to "notice" anything different.
~Ryan :)
those are accurate explanations, I think its ok if we split phasing methods between active and passive visualization, but nothing more. It's when people start labeling different scenes in f2 as techniques that those reading them start to misunderstand what they're even doing and simply follow the techniques as though they're magic. Like flip a coin twice, do a hand stand then spin in a circle and you'll suddenly be in another area of consciousness. Especially when its an activity they may not even like doing because they don't realize they can come up with their own scene that is more attributed to their uniquely charged emotions and self.
If I am not wrong Frank recomended to start with noticing and then rundown. I am sure I am loosing something.
Quote from: Bacterio on May 05, 2010, 13:04:01
If I am not wrong Frank recomended to start with noticing and then rundown. I am sure I am loosing something.
I incorporate both into my practices.
I use "noticing" until I'm relaxed enough and within Monroe's Focus 3.
Then I switch to my rundown and actually Phase with that.
Although, in Franks Phasing Resource, "noticing" can actually be used to phase directly.
Through his many posts on the forums, I found that his "rundown" is also a method one can use to phase.
Quote from: Bacterio on May 05, 2010, 13:04:01
If I am not wrong Frank recomended to start with noticing and then rundown. I am sure I am loosing something.
well, start with what you think is easier for yourself. Doesn't matter if I think rundowns are easier than noticing, it's what you think :P If you think noticing is easier than rundowns then go for it. If Frank's logic and reasoning for why noticing is recommended resonates with you then don't listen to me. My logic is once you have a stable rundown created to memorize that you'll be able to practice it routinely with visualization that will be learned by the subconscious. Instead of having to constantly notice what changes around you you bring the changes to yourself which will allow you to have a clearer view of what to actually focus on, the darkness behind your eyelids or actual f2 itself. Close your eyes, you see darkness, that darkness is not f2, that is simply you seeing your eyelids with very little light if any at all penetrating through your eyes. So where is f2 then? Think of an image and close your eyes, does it actually appear behind your closed eyes in that darkness or is it elsewhere? Just looking at blackness initially to me, it is hard to know which "blackness" to focus on. However if you create a rundown then you always have a differentiation between the initial blackness of f2 and the blackness that is created by a lack of light being perceived by the eyes. What I am curious of is now since what I perceive is also in f2 is there the concept of the blackness I am seeing from my eyes in the blackness of f2? If so then the problem is we're trying to focus on f2 in a concept within f2 which probably confuses the subconscious greatly.
I have some confusion with the blackness stuff too, maybe I am trying to rationalize too many things beforehand. Anyway, rundowns seems to be good for me so I'll keep working on it and playing with "pretending things" Moen's style.
I forgot to say I use Hemi-sync as a tool for phasing, so I find easy to quiet my mind to a decent level, get relaxed and quite focused within minutes.
If you're using hemi-sync if you haven't already check out the wave 1 pointers post by Frank in permanent astral topics, it gives a guideline as to the depth of imagination that you should have as you follow along with it. http://www.astralpulse.com/forums/welcome_to_permanent_astral_topics/gateway_wave_1_pointers_original_post_by_frank-t25243.0.html (http://www.astralpulse.com/forums/welcome_to_permanent_astral_topics/gateway_wave_1_pointers_original_post_by_frank-t25243.0.html)
Quote from: soli on May 05, 2010, 18:51:00
If you're using hemi-sync if you haven't already check out the wave 1 pointers post by Frank in permanent astral topics, it gives a guideline as to the depth of imagination that you should have as you follow along with it. http://www.astralpulse.com/forums/welcome_to_permanent_astral_topics/gateway_wave_1_pointers_original_post_by_frank-t25243.0.html (http://www.astralpulse.com/forums/welcome_to_permanent_astral_topics/gateway_wave_1_pointers_original_post_by_frank-t25243.0.html)
Thank you. T tried to do the rundown as Frank says, but as I use different Cd's I had to change the rundown everytime so now I start the rundown once the cd leaves you in the free-flow period. I changed some exercises to make them longer (cut and paste) so I can have more than 1 hour for flying.
yeah, I used audacity to lengthen some parts also as at times it feels like it is too rushed and doesn't leave you enough time to experience and enjoy some certain focus states. It's like now you're in focus xxx and then 10 seconds later hes moving on to the next focus already. Also do note you can improvise on what the tape tells you in anyway if you feel it will be better and you don't have to strictly follow exactly what it says.
Quote from: soli on May 05, 2010, 19:33:14
yeah, I used audacity to lengthen some parts also as at times it feels like it is too rushed and doesn't leave you enough time to experience and enjoy some certain focus states. It's like now you're in focus xxx and then 10 seconds later hes moving on to the next focus already. Also do note you can improvise on what the tape tells you in anyway if you feel it will be better and you don't have to strictly follow exactly what it says.
He he..I used audacity too. I find the Cd's are for certain exercises. So for phasing are quite intrusive when start talking. For using at night I have eliminated the return to C1 at the end of the Cd's. As a training in perceive changes in awareness I find useful to use sometimes the exercise they give at Gateway that take you from 10 to 21 with a stop in each level.
which focus do you use for phasing purposes? I use 10 and now I am trying in 21. What I feel is in 21 is easier to "travel" with the mind but more difficult to stay away from physical body...I feel my body very much in 21 if I go straight to that level without staying in 10/12 for at least 20 minutes.
Quote from: Bacterio on May 06, 2010, 06:41:25
He he..I used audacity too. I find the Cd's are for certain exercises. So for phasing are quite intrusive when start talking. For using at night I have eliminated the return to C1 at the end of the Cd's. As a training in perceive changes in awareness I find useful to use sometimes the exercise they give at Gateway that take you from 10 to 21 with a stop in each level.
which focus do you use for phasing purposes? I use 10 and now I am trying in 21. What I feel is in 21 is easier to "travel" with the mind but more difficult to stay away from physical body...I feel my body very much in 21 if I go straight to that level without staying in 10/12 for at least 20 minutes.
the only cd you should really need is the wave1 focus 10, from there in a deep focus 10 you can do whatever you want to try and phase. The less aware you become of your physical body the easier it is for focus to be placed on other areas of consciousness. I don't really subscribe to monroe's focus levels, it's just here, imagination, the astral, and infinity to me, as all previous three focuses exist within infinity.
I was listening to an edited Intro to Focus 10 track the other morning.
Monroe takes you to Focus 10... then, because it's edited, the track and sounds just END.
I thought at the time that my power had gone out or something. LOL
But then I realized I was listening to my iPod and only the track had ended.
If someone could taper the end of the track so it's not so "CUT", then it would be better.
For now, I suggest using the track as a primer for your mind. Listen to it... go to Focus 10... then allow Monroe to take you back.
Do this a few times, THEN try it without the track.
~Ryan :)
Xanth,
does Frank ever write about Focus level/trance level correspondences or ways to identify your focus level?
Quote from: personalreality on May 06, 2010, 09:53:01
Xanth,
does Frank ever write about Focus level/trance level correspondences or ways to identify your focus level?
He differentiated them the same way Robert Monroe did... by how they "felt" and what you "experienced".
Focus 1... physical reality (duh hehe)
Focus 2... your subconscious. Feeling awake and fully conscious, able to relive memories and personal belief constructs... etc... creating objects is done by a thought, but objects fade away fast.
Focus 3... transition area. Feeling awake and fully conscious, able to visit people who have passed and have actual conversations with them... creating objects take a lot more effort, but they're permanent and stick around until you choose to destroy them.
Focus 4... like plugging your mind into a collective of minds. Totally subjective area.
It's all about how they "feel" and what you can "experience" while you're there.
At least that's the only way I can think of to describe it.
~Ryan :)
Quote from: Xanth on May 06, 2010, 09:42:51
I was listening to an edited Intro to Focus 10 track the other morning.
Monroe takes you to Focus 10... then, because it's edited, the track and sounds just END.
I thought at the time that my power had gone out or something. LOL
But then I realized I was listening to my iPod and only the track had ended.
If someone could taper the end of the track so it's not so "CUT", then it would be better.
For now, I suggest using the track as a primer for your mind. Listen to it... go to Focus 10... then allow Monroe to take you back.
Do this a few times, THEN try it without the track.
~Ryan :)
Xanth, download Audacity, it is a very easy to use freeware audio recording program. That way you won't have to specifically communicate to others what you want when you can easily do so to your own tastes. I think you're intelligent enough to understand how to copy/paste selected audio segments with it. I do agree that constant practice in certain focus states will allow your subconscious to develop an understanding of how that focus state is supposed to feel which will allow for a faster focus into that state.
Quote from: soli on May 06, 2010, 23:38:35
Xanth, download Audacity, it is a very easy to use freeware audio recording program. That way you won't have to specifically communicate to others what you want when you can easily do so to your own tastes. I think you're intelligent enough to understand how to copy/paste selected audio segments with it. I do agree that constant practice in certain focus states will allow your subconscious to develop an understanding of how that focus state is supposed to feel which will allow for a faster focus into that state.
It's not only understanding how the feeling is, they say (TMI) you create the neuronal paths in your brain to go there, as any training.
Quote from: Bacterio on May 07, 2010, 06:11:22
It's not only understanding how the feeling is, they say (TMI) you create the neuronal paths in your brain to go there, as any training.
hum.. I'm interested in just listening to focus 10 over and over again now. It seems impossible with constant practice for some structure of the brain to not physically change based upon it, even subtly.
http://www.astralpulse.com/forums/welcome_to_astral_consciousness/wild_vs_phasing-t2832.0.html;msg18784#msg18784
This is a great post to read.
It doesn't deal with Phasing, per se... but Frank does explain how to convert a Lucid Dream into a full blown Projection.
This is the exact method I use to convert my LD's into Projections.
~Ryan :)
QuoteTurning a lucid dream into a controlled Astral projection to a higher focus level is dead easy to say, but ever so tricky to do at the time. A lucid dream is simply where your mind is at the Focus 22 state and you are releasing all kinds of thoughts and emotions that are creating the circumstances you find yourself in. I haven't read LaBerge's work but he is quite correct to say that dreams are created by the person dreaming.
With practice, a person can teach themselves to become more conscious so they begin to see the dreamscape while it is happening, rather than remembering about it after they awake.
Now, it is at this point where it starts to get tricky. Because there are people I came across who experienced lucid dreams to the point where they became expert at creating them. So much so, they concluded that all this obe-stuff was mere emotional interplay. In other words, they got so wrapped up in creating these lucid dreams for themselves, they became blinded to all the other stuff that lay ahead.
What you need to do is when you find yourself in the midst of a dream, i.e. when you become lucid, try and concentrate solely on one aspect of your dreamscape. Then ask yourself a simple question about it. You see, even though you have become lucid, your whole sense of conscious awareness will not all be with you (well, chances are it won't put it that way). So you need to first bring everything on stream.
By asking a simple question, this brings your critical faculties into play together with your senses of logic and reason. Which, in turn, swing into action your short-term and long-term memory banks, and so forth. Once you have full conscious awareness, then you need to become as mentally still as possible. This will have the effect of shutting down all the dreamscape. At this point you can gather a definite intent to travel to wherever you wish.
Within the Astral, Intent is the fuel that drives you from place to place. That's why you need to start from a point of mental stillness. Because whatever you focus on, becomes your reality. So if your mind is flitting here and there, your circumstances, in turn, will be flitting here and there. Which is all mighty confusing.
A handy tip to remember: it is your degree of conscious control that is the key to opening access to the higher planes. So the higher the degree of conscious control you have, the higher the Astral plane you can project to.
In the old days they talked about having to be a spiritually pure person and giving money to charity, and all that jazz, before the higher (in their line of thinking more godly) realms became open to you. When it's nothing of the kind. It's simply your degree of conscious control.
The definition of what constitutes good conscious control is the degree to which you can remain mentally still and emotionally closed. From this basis, you can then "become open" and "become closed" with a high degree of selectivity. Which does take a lot of practise. Monroe was something of an expert at doing this and he even created a list of terms which detailed the switching processes commonly encountered.
Yours,
Frank
EDIT: I just read Ginny's post about her latest F23 retrieval and she gives some good examples of what I'm talking about. Like, where she says:
NOTE: Words in italics are my emphasis.
quote:
this camp or town had attacked the first town I had encountered. I opened up just enough to get a sense for the place and got a strong feeling of hate, an all-consuming emotional need for retaliation.
quote:
It was a constant merry-go-round: attack, be attacked...an endless loop for justice and the need to destroy. I closed these feelings off quickly and moved inside one of the 'bunkers'.
quote:
The man was feeling uncertain...I think having trouble dealing with anything new or anything suggesting any kind of change...so I brought the feeling of love and respect to me and directed the energy to him. It wasn't long before another Helper arrived
quote:
I thought to ask if it would just invite more misery and destruction but kept my feelings to myself as their anger was building to a fever pitch. I was open to finding anyone who was disenchanted but no one there had any desire to want to leave, just gear up for more fighting...so I waved goodbye and departed upward and out.