Hi :-D
So i been practicing and practicing and i achieve nothing :-P so i thought it is time to change something
So now im mainly spinning around :
*Bedeekin's method - for SP after nap ( no luck )
*Visualization/Mental Rundown technique
*Im always listen to music for ambient noise just to some random sound didnt scare me
*im now going to bed at 1am waking up at 3am i do my attempt, after that back to bed, waking up at 6am doing attempt, i stay all day till 7pm then nap after nap wait hour and attempt at 9pm and last attempt at midnight without nap
* and im back with reality check for LD ( i had LD in past so i will have ap anyway soon Finally :-P but in the long term i dont want to induce ap from dream )
so i went back and i started searching what i was missing, there is no secret that sleep paralysis is helpful to achieve ap for some people and most people are saying that time after sleep is the best time for attempt
thats why i changed everything
Obviously im much more tired but im able to fall asleep at 7pm now
I never had sleep paralysis consciously , i never wake up with SP
Bedeekin's method and waking in the middle of night did not help
( i understand that SP is not required to project and some of you think that it even interfere with projecting but i will go with the majority that says that sp helps alot )
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First Question
Is everyone able to "consciously induce" sleep paralysis ? or some people just cant do that ?
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So when im doing my attempts (im tired) i listen to music ( 1h mp3 ) and i visualize and i fall asleep ( what is new to me ) before i changed my attempt routine i could visualize for 1-2 hours easily
and time pass very quickly now 40 min attempt seems like 2 hour. What is weird and when i say weird i mean really really weird is that im waking up ALWAYS after 40-49 min from beginning of attempt ,
i dont know when i fall asleep maybe 10 min after start or maybe 25 min but i always get my conscious back after 40-49 min never 39min or 51min or 50min or 37min and
i can tell because when i wake up i get up turn off music and i see on clock 43:00 /1:00:00
Today i get my conscious back but i didnt get up and turn off music i decide to stay and see what will happen because when i get my conscious back i always stay still anyway.
So i sit still and quite quickly my body parts start to jump. I never had hypnic jerks like that ( btw Xanth stretching didnt help me ).
after that i get up turn of music and i see on music clock/timeline 40:00, wtf
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Second Question
That "nap" when I fall asleep during attempt is this something that can prevent me from projection ?
Im asking because i use to get up immediately after i become conscious again and i thought well i f* up again ( dont ask why i dont know why i was thinking that )
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Third Question
Do you meet someone with 45 min sleep cycles ?
Im asking because i read that average sleep cycle is 1.5 hour and when im doing Bedeekin's method i go to sleep at 7pm I set the alarm to wake up hour later and i wake up after 40-45 min
I saw that Bedeekin's method work for people and i dont know why it dont work for me
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Fourth Question
What is with these numbers 40... ? :-P
I literally thought right now: i will look on my watch and i will see probably 40 something, its 1:45pm
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Fifth Question
Why my perception of time has changed ?
"...before i changed my attempt routine i could visualize for 1-2 hours easily and time pass very quickly now 40 min attempt seems like 2 hour "
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I thought that i will write everything down maybe someone has some cleaver suggestion :-D
Thanks
Stan
A few things to consider
Are you asking/allowing God/higherself/guides to lead this process? Every time I (my conscious self) gets too much in the driver's seat, my progress halts. Then I turn back to spiritual intuitive guidance and something will be shown to me -in the form of visual instruction, a 'knowing ' about how to proceed or an energetic type of help. (energy sensations) So -put this all in the hands of higher guidance and expect some help that is anywhere from subtle to shockingly mysterious.
Try without the music. I can only project with music if it's extremely repetitive/hypnotic and even then it can be distracting. It could be interfering with the delicate empty-minded trance state.
Are you spending too much time lying down during the day? When I do, it makes projecting harder. Keep a good balance of physical and mental activity and rest. That will help with your hypnic jerks too -which can be a direct sign of too much inactivity. Your muscles want to be used.
When you visualize, are you making it to the point where the scenes are no longer your conscious creation? Right before a projection happens, there will be period of a minute or two when scenes start to unfold on their own. Many people never make it this far -they fall asleep before that happens. Work on your ability to stay awake that long. Once those scenes start to unfold, hang on just a little longer-you're almost there! :) Keep in mind I'm not talking about just the regular blobs of color etc. that people see the whole time they are in trance. What I'm talking about is a very specific few minutes of 'mini- movies' right before you will project.
Maybe you should set your alarm for 4 hrs. after you go to sleep at night. Everyone has their 'easiest' time for projecting. Mine happens to be 6 hrs after I go to sleep. Maybe the "4" thing is coincidence but worth a try! There is so much guidance coming to us all the time that most people miss.
Let's go through this step by step. What I'm aiming at is control not spontaneous projections
1. Let's do practice when your wide awake. You focus sucks when your tired and focus is the main thing that's needed for success.
2. Kill the music it only draws you back to the physical. Use earplugs the silicone ones are best if sounds bother you.
3.First question Sleep paralysis is a description your body feels like wood. It's different with everyone. WIth me my body just feels numb like a limb has gone to sleep. I can induce this most of the time when I try. You are focusing on sensations. This will kill the projection you cannot focus on anything but going deeper within. As you deepen within your body goes numb. It's not always the same sensation. It's more noticible with me when I come back out. I'm so focused on deepening I don't really notice what I'm feeling in my body.
4. Your second question. Naps help your focus much of the time. Practice when your refreshed
5 third question I'm not sure what your talking about there you may clarify if you want to.
6 last question when your attempting you should not even think about time.
What you should be doing is focusing on going deeper within. Do not waver the focus at all. If you feel odd sensations igore them and keep going eventally you'll get there. Your very young so focus may be quite difficult for you try working with a mantra Xanth suggests based on Campells work to make up a non sense mantra to learn how to focus your mind on one thing at a time for a legnth of time. It takes time to learn this. Patience and persistence are important. Regular practice times are important. I also avoid caffiene and alcohol and anything else that alters the mental state.
Quote from: soarin12 on September 22, 2014, 10:48:38
A few things to consider
Are you asking/allowing God/higherself/guides to lead this process? Every time I (my conscious self) gets too much in the driver's seat, my progress halts. Then I turn back to spiritual intuitive guidance and something will be shown to me -in the form of visual instruction, a 'knowing ' about how to proceed or an energetic type of help. (energy sensations) So -put this all in the hands of higher guidance and expect some help that is anywhere from subtle to shockingly mysterious.
countless times i asked for help
Quote from: soarin12 on September 22, 2014, 10:48:38
Try without the music. I can only project with music if it's extremely repetitive/hypnotic and even then it can be distracting. It could be interfering with the delicate empty-minded trance state.
I tried 4,5 months without music, plus i fall asleep listening to it so i dont think so it is distracting me
Quote from: soarin12 on September 22, 2014, 10:48:38
Are you spending too much time lying down during the day? When I do, it makes projecting harder. Keep a good balance of physical and mental activity and rest. That will help with your hypnic jerks too -which can be a direct sign of too much inactivity. Your muscles want to be used.
i dont lay during day in order to do bedeekin's method at 7pm if i lay during day i could not fall asleep
Quote from: soarin12 on September 22, 2014, 10:48:38
When you visualize, are you making it to the point where the scenes are no longer your conscious creation? Right before a projection happens, there will be period of a minute or two when scenes start to unfold on their own. Many people never make it this far -they fall asleep before that happens. Work on your ability to stay awake that long. Once those scenes start to unfold, hang on just a little longer-you're almost there! :) Keep in mind I'm not talking about just the regular blobs of color etc. that people see the whole time they are in trance. What I'm talking about is a very specific few minutes of 'mini- movies' right before you will project.
no, i fall asleep and hypnic jerks wake me then i remember that i saw some scenario that wasn't my creation
Quote from: soarin12 on September 22, 2014, 10:48:38
Maybe you should set your alarm for 4 hrs. after you go to sleep at night. Everyone has their 'easiest' time for projecting. Mine happens to be 6 hrs after I go to sleep. Maybe the "4" thing is coincidence but worth a try! There is so much guidance coming to us all the time that most people miss.
interesting observation :-D
Quote from: Bluefirephoenix on September 22, 2014, 12:00:22
1. Let's do practice when your wide awake. You focus sucks when your tired and focus is the main thing that's needed for success.
if thats true how people wake up in the middle of the night and have oobe, when i wake up in the middle of the night im zombie and i assume some of them also
plus bedeekin's method requires you to be tired
Quote from: Bluefirephoenix on September 22, 2014, 12:00:22
2. Kill the music it only draws you back to the physical. Use earplugs the silicone ones are best if sounds bother you.
there are lots of guided mediation that helps people to project , how my music draws me back to physical and guided mediation doesnt ?
Quote from: Bluefirephoenix on September 22, 2014, 12:00:22
3.First question Sleep paralysis is a description your body feels like wood. It's different with everyone. WIth me my body just feels numb like a limb has gone to sleep. I can induce this most of the time when I try. You are focusing on sensations. This will kill the projection you cannot focus on anything but going deeper within. As you deepen within your body goes numb. It's not always the same sensation. It's more noticible with me when I come back out. I'm so focused on deepening I don't really notice what I'm feeling in my body.
someone said on this forum that sp is when you are literally nailed to bed you cant move, this is what im talk about, i can make my body numb easily but numb is not paralysis according to most people
when im numb i dont feel like some on siting on my chest i dont hear any thing etc my body is just numb
And i dont focus on my sensations i did about 450 attempts so i had time to notice some things
( when i listen to music and visualize i never focus on my body )
Quote from: Bluefirephoenix on September 22, 2014, 12:00:22
5 third question I'm not sure what your talking about there you may clarify if you want to.
Bedeekin said that you need take a nap 1-2 hour long and you need have "REM interrupted sleep" well i wake up after 45 min had normal dream and it wasnt interrupted ( 15 min before alarm goes on )
Quote from: Bluefirephoenix on September 22, 2014, 12:00:22
6 last question when your attempting you should not even think about time.
What you should be doing is focusing on going deeper within. Do not waver the focus at all. If you feel odd sensations igore them and keep going eventally you'll get there. Your very young so focus may be quite difficult for you try working with a mantra Xanth suggests based on Campells work to make up a non sense mantra to learn how to focus your mind on one thing at a time for a legnth of time. It takes time to learn this. Patience and persistence are important. Regular practice times are important. I also avoid caffiene and alcohol and anything else that alters the mental state.
again i dont think about time, i did about 450 attempt so i had time to notice some things
i work with mantra but i put it away, i was focusing on my body, visualization is only thing when i will not think about my body
i dont drink or use
Quote from: Bluefirephoenix on September 22, 2014, 12:00:22
Your very young so focus may be quite difficult
how old you think im ?
You're so analytical.
That kind of works against you. :)
Just saying... analytical minds (I'm the same way!) have the hardest time letting things go and ALLOWING the experience to unfold on its own.
One of the most important things you'll have to learn is how to allow your analytical mind to step aside.
Unfortunately, this really can't be taught, you have to figure it out on your own.
Quote from: Xanth on September 22, 2014, 14:02:29
You're so analytical.
That kind of works against you. :)
Just saying... analytical minds (I'm the same way!) have the hardest time letting things go and ALLOWING the experience to unfold on its own.
One of the most important things you'll have to learn is how to allow your analytical mind to step aside.
Unfortunately, this really can't be taught, you have to figure it out on your own.
yea thats true, i just like to understand and know everything,
it works sometime against me but at the end of the day when im doing something i know exactly what to do and how to do it good
anyway
Thanks Xanth, I will figure it out eventually
Quote from: vstachu on September 22, 2014, 15:07:51
yea thats true, i just like to understand and know everything,
it works sometime against me but at the end of the day when im doing something i know exactly what to do and how to do it good
anyway
And that's where the problem lies.
You'll never know everything...
And in regards to projection specifically, you will NEVER know everything.
And to make matters even worse, you won't begin to know anything until you stop trying to know everything.
You won't know exactly what to do and how to do it good until you do it. <-- do you see the problem there?
It's the chicken/egg problem... which came first?
This is why you have absolutely no choice but to get the seeking out of the way. Stop seeking.
But then, saying that, you're built to seek... you're here TO seek... you won't stop seeking until you've become so utterly frustrated with the seeking that you'll give up.
And in that giving up, you'll find your answer.
Adyashanti uses a good analogy of this... he uses the example of a jogger, constantly jogging in search of "rest".
He'll keep jogging around everything looking for this thing called "rest", yet he'll never find it until one day the jogger gets very tired and frustrated and stops jogging... finding "rest".
That's probably a really poor recanting of it, but it's there. ROFL :)
And so the same holds true for figuring out how to Project. I can tell you to "stop jogging" a million times, and you can even intellectually understand it... but until you actually DO IT, you'll never really know it.
QuoteThanks Xanth, I will figure it out eventually
I have no doubt of that. :)
Hi Vstachu,
Here's a beginners advice.
Try the wake back to bed technique (WBTB) in the morning and set a clear focused intent that you'll be aware in your dreams as you fall asleep.
You should get a lucid dream sooner or later if you do this technique often.
And even though it is not a full awareness OOBE it will give you confidence.
It works best for me if I get more or less a full nights sleep before trying WBTB.
You can find more info on WBTB on this forum.
Regards
DanishGuy
Quote from: DanishGuy on September 22, 2014, 16:02:31
Hi Vstachu,
Here's a beginners advice.
Try the wake back to bed technique (WBTB) in the morning and set a clear focused intent that you'll be aware in your dreams as you fall asleep.
You should get a lucid dream sooner or later if you do this technique often.
And even though it is not a full awareness OOBE it will give you confidence.
It works best for me if I get more or less a full nights sleep before trying WBTB.
You can find more info on WBTB on this forum.
Regards
DanishGuy
Thanks DanishGuy, gonna do this
What I'm trying to get at is this...
So many people come here wanting (demanding even LoL) to be taught how to Project... how to experience the "ZOMGZASTRALPLANEZ" (I'm being overly dramatic here for a point. LoL :)).
The understanding of how to project is only a minute part of "being".
The point of learning to Project is to learn about YOURSELF. It has nothing to do with finding the right method or technique... it's about finding YOURSELF.
There's some irony in that statement too...
For when you find yourself, when you TRULY find yourself... you'll not want to Project anymore. You won't have to Project anymore.
It's at that point you begin to realize that we have 18 other sub-forums that need your attention more than the top 6 and that the term "Astral Projection" was just a lure to get you here in the first place in order to figure that out.
The next piece of irony is that you'll obviously need to figure this out on your own. LoL :)
Quote from: Xanth on September 22, 2014, 19:16:07
.
For when you find yourself, when you TRULY find yourself... you'll not want to Project anymore.
Unless you want to use it to help people -like retrievals- Then you'll still want to project. :-) (provided you are reasonably convinced that retrievals are not just an imaginary phenomenon, of course!)