what do you eat?

[kurtykurt42]

Yes, actually, in the sense that there is less engergy and signifcantly less food to go around while supporting a livestock system, by the nature of engery passed on at each level of the tropic food-chain. For every person you can feed with the engery and labor needed to raise enough animal weight to feed them, you can literally feed dozens upon dozens, and potentially even hundreds of people, based upon what crops are grown with those same resources.

It is a shame... But I don't see how me not eating meat and promoting global awareness on the topic is going to help much.

When you eat meat you are taking fear and slaughter into yourself.

You guys are the ones that are afraid to eat meat... 

[blis]

To step into sci-fi for a moment: if we had replicators that could freely make meat that was just as "tasty" and nutritional as real animal flesh do you think it would then be considered cruel to keep killing animals for food?

[personalreality]

depends on your perspective.

like you mentioned, absorbing the energy of what we eat and all.  for some who were raised (like myself) to revere and thank the animal that gave it's life for you to eat, perhaps the absorption of that energy would still motivate eating living animals.

but you make a legit point.

[WalkerInTheWoods]

I think it is necessary to twist a lot of the facts in a grievously biased way, however, to say that it is the same to eat plants and animals, and that the treatment each receive are equivalent. As has been mentioned, animals kept on most farms are more or less in constant torture. And people do differentiate between how they treat lifeforms of different kinds of development, based on their perceived mental experiences; case in point- most people don't feel bad about stepping on an ant, but would think twice about crushing a dog under a giant dumpster.

There are economic arguments to make as well. Consider all the bio-matter that must be cultivated, transported, and distributed in order to feed and raise an animal to kill. The cost of all the produce it eats is hundreds of times the nutritional value of its meat. If we put the same resources we put toward raising livestock into producing vegetables and grain, we could feed the entire world many times over, rather than just barely, and having many in constant starvation. There are also massive quantities of energy consumed and pollution resulting from keeping the volume of livestock we do. It has been said that given a choice between getting rid of every motor vehicle in the country, and getting rid of the livestock industry, the latter choice would be vastly more beneficial in terms of energy and pollution.

It is indeed a lifestyle choice, but I think it is a vast misrepresenttion of reality to say it does not matter which you choose, and that there are no other consequences for the world.

I use to be a vegetarian (and at points vegan). I read all their propaganda. While this is true to an extent, that extent being only looking at factory farming, it isn't entirely true. Environmentally speaking factory farming is devastating. However this is true of raising fruits and vegetables as much as it is of raising animals. Is having toxic waste lands of fields of genetically altered crops where fields are sprayed with all kinds of herbicides, pesticides and chemical fertilizers really any better?

The problem is not with the animals, or the vegetables, but how it is done. A system that is as close to nature's way as possible is the best system. I have done both, raising food with no animal input. Both the animals and plants thrive and produce healthy food when they are combined.

In fact, meat (especially beef) can be one of the most environmentally friendly food sources if done naturally. Cows on pasture need very little to no outside input. As long as they have grass to eat and water to drink they are good to go. They don't need anything else brought in. They eat the grass and fertilize the field. It is a beautiful system.

Put some chickens out there with them and it is even more complete. Chickens eat bugs and seeds in the field. They love to dig through the cow poop looking for bugs and seeds. This aids in the fertilization by spreading it around (and providing their own). Also they help control flies by eating their larva in the cow poop.

Ok, maybe more information than some wanted so I will stop there. Eat a vegetarian diet for any reason you want, but don't think you are doing so for the environment. If your food source is factory farms regardless of what the food is, it is not good for the environment. The most environmentally friendly food system is one that mimics nature and nature uses both plants and animals.

I think the best diet is one that is local, fresh and natural. That can and is going to vary depending on where you live.

[personalreality]

nice response walker.

good to see you here.

[CFTraveler]

I use to be a vegetarian (and at points vegan). I read all their propaganda. While this is true to an extent, that extent being only looking at factory farming, it isn't entirely true. Environmentally speaking factory farming is devastating. However this is true of raising fruits and vegetables as much as it is of raising animals. Is having toxic waste lands of fields of genetically altered crops where fields are sprayed with all kinds of herbicides, pesticides and chemical fertilizers really any better?

The problem is not with the animals, or the vegetables, but how it is done. A system that is as close to nature's way as possible is the best system. I have done both, raising food with no animal input. Both the animals and plants thrive and produce healthy food when they are combined.

In fact, meat (especially beef) can be one of the most environmentally friendly food sources if done naturally. Cows on pasture need very little to no outside input. As long as they have grass to eat and water to drink they are good to go. They don't need anything else brought in. They eat the grass and fertilize the field. It is a beautiful system.

Put some chickens out there with them and it is even more complete. Chickens eat bugs and seeds in the field. They love to dig through the cow poop looking for bugs and seeds. This aids in the fertilization by spreading it around (and providing their own). Also they help control flies by eating their larva in the cow poop.

Ok, maybe more information than some wanted so I will stop there. Eat a vegetarian diet for any reason you want, but don't think you are doing so for the environment. If your food source is factory farms regardless of what the food is, it is not good for the environment. The most environmentally friendly food system is one that mimics nature and nature uses both plants and animals.

I think the best diet is one that is local, fresh and natural. That can and is going to vary depending on where you live.

Hear Hear! 

[Stookie_]

Remember when Travis Barker and DJ AM were in the plane crash and got burned? Here's a quote from him then:

"Because I was a vegetarian, for my first three surgeries, it was hard to get any of my grafts to take to my real skin. I have such low levels of protein. I need protein from food rather than just protein supplements. I changed my diet. I would do anything I possibly could if they said like, 'There's a possibility you might heal faster if you do eat meat or just change your eating habits.' So I did. I don't regret it at all, I feel so much better."

Personally, I go for a healthy balanced diet. And CF convinced me of the importance of buying organic, not just for heath, but for the industry.

[personalreality]

that's what my neighbor says stookie.

he says he shops with one simple rule, 'does my food need that?'

what he means is, anything beyond the ingredients that are necessary to make that particular food is unnecessary and he doesn't eat it.

even "organic" foods can have preservatives and the like in it. 

so he reads the labels and if there are any chemicals that he doesn't recognize as integral to the meal, he doesn't eat it.

he is a vegetarian, but that's because he just never has liked meat, but he's not opposed to meat when it's raised and slaughtered properly (as opposed to the mass slaughter and poor treatment).

[Lexy]

Remember when Travis Barker and DJ AM were in the plane crash and got burned? Here's a quote from him then:

"Because I was a vegetarian, for my first three surgeries, it was hard to get any of my grafts to take to my real skin. I have such low levels of protein. I need protein from food rather than just protein supplements. I changed my diet. I would do anything I possibly could if they said like, 'There's a possibility you might heal faster if you do eat meat or just change your eating habits.' So I did. I don't regret it at all, I feel so much better."

Personally, I go for a healthy balanced diet. And CF convinced me of the importance of buying organic, not just for heath, but for the industry.

I remember that, he could have gotten plenty of protein from plants but it doesn't look like he knew how to go about & instead relied on supplements for all of his protein.

[Xanth]

Does that work?  Relying upon supplements in that fashion?

[Lexy]

Does that work?  Relying upon supplements in that fashion?

I don't think you can rely on supplements for all of your nutritional needs. It's better to eat lots of unprocessed foods, mostly in the raw state.
The more denatured the protein powder is, the less likely it's going to be absorbed, the body doesn't recognize it as actual food, making it difficult to digest.
You have to make sure you have high quality natural raw supplements which is expensive but it still shouldn't be used to replace healthy food. 

[Lexy]

I use to be a vegetarian (and at points vegan). I read all their propaganda. While this is true to an extent, that extent being only looking at factory farming, it isn't entirely true. Environmentally speaking factory farming is devastating. However this is true of raising fruits and vegetables as much as it is of raising animals. Is having toxic waste lands of fields of genetically altered crops where fields are sprayed with all kinds of herbicides, pesticides and chemical fertilizers really any better?

The problem is not with the animals, or the vegetables, but how it is done. A system that is as close to nature's way as possible is the best system. I have done both, raising food with no animal input. Both the animals and plants thrive and produce healthy food when they are combined.

In fact, meat (especially beef) can be one of the most environmentally friendly food sources if done naturally. Cows on pasture need very little to no outside input. As long as they have grass to eat and water to drink they are good to go. They don't need anything else brought in. They eat the grass and fertilize the field. It is a beautiful system.

Put some chickens out there with them and it is even more complete. Chickens eat bugs and seeds in the field. They love to dig through the cow poop looking for bugs and seeds. This aids in the fertilization by spreading it around (and providing their own). Also they help control flies by eating their larva in the cow poop.

Ok, maybe more information than some wanted so I will stop there. Eat a vegetarian diet for any reason you want, but don't think you are doing so for the environment. If your food source is factory farms regardless of what the food is, it is not good for the environment. The most environmentally friendly food system is one that mimics nature and nature uses both plants and animals.

I think the best diet is one that is local, fresh and natural. That can and is going to vary depending on where you live.

In terms of environmental impact, I think it's more a factor of excessive consumption. It's not necessary to eat a pound of meat everyday to live. It's just too much. They have to cut down rainforests just to make room for more & more cattle. People eat more meat then what is needed or even healthy for the body or the planet.

[Summerlander]

I eat pretty much everything that's edible. I'm definitely omnivorous and proud. I also try to eat things that are rich in tryptophan so that an abundance of tryptamines is maintained in my system which appears to aid the vividness of my otherworldly night life.

[Bedeekin]

I'm a fish eater... no non-fish... although I eat eggs and drink milk.

I take zinc as a supplement.

[personalreality]

your body absorbs supplements from food differently than it does if you take a supplement pill.

plus there's always something to be said for the life energy in the food that isn't in a pill.

[WalkerInTheWoods]

In terms of environmental impact, I think it's more a factor of excessive consumption. It's not necessary to eat a pound of meat everyday to live. It's just too much. They have to cut down rainforests just to make room for more & more cattle. People eat more meat then what is needed or even healthy for the body or the planet.

This isn't just about producing meat. Land has to be cleared for new fields to grow produce as well. This is more of an effect of people being disconnected from their food. It wasn't that long ago when most people grew atleast some of their food on their own land. Within a community almost, if not all, of the people's food was grown. It was consumed fresh and at its peak, supplying the best nutrients as well as energy.

Now few people, atleast in the US, grow any food at home. It isn't that they don't have the means, it is that they just don't. I drive around and see acres and acres of nicely mowed lawns. There are houses sitting on atleast 1 acre, though many times a lot more than that, with nothing but grass on them. What do they do with that grass? They just mow it. What a waste! If they wanted just grass the least they could do would be to put a cow or goat (or a few) out there to eat the grass and keep the 'lawn' trimmed and neat. Then at the end of the season they could have some meat, or have milk most of the year. A few animals do not require a lot of space.

If they wanted to, they could be growing atleast some of their food on a small patch of that, or all of it. In the time they spent mowing their yards they could have put time in growing some of their food. This would not only reduce the need to destroy forests for new mega fields, it would also provide them with fresher, healthier food and create a more stable and sustainable food supply.

Again the only reason we have these problems is because of industrial agriculture. Farming spread out in the form of small farms is much more environmentally friendly. Large concentrated mono 'crop' operations cause a lot of problems because they are not natural.

[Bedeekin]

your body absorbs supplements from food differently than it does if you take a supplement pill.

plus there's always something to be said for the life energy in the food that isn't in a pill.

Well... regardless of this I still take zinc as a supplement. I'll stick to my reality... thanks though.

[personalreality]

i didn't say don't take supplements.

it's just supposed to be more effective when you receive the same vitamins and minerals through food.

[Summerlander]

He never said that you said you did. Besides...

You take it and it's effective either way.

[personalreality]

fair enough

[Summerlander]

I don't know if it's fair enough...

It's TRUE!

[Lexy]

This isn't just about producing meat. Land has to be cleared for new fields to grow produce as well. This is more of an effect of people being disconnected from their food. It wasn't that long ago when most people grew atleast some of their food on their own land. Within a community almost, if not all, of the people's food was grown. It was consumed fresh and at its peak, supplying the best nutrients as well as energy.

Now few people, atleast in the US, grow any food at home. It isn't that they don't have the means, it is that they just don't. I drive around and see acres and acres of nicely mowed lawns. There are houses sitting on atleast 1 acre, though many times a lot more than that, with nothing but grass on them. What do they do with that grass? They just mow it. What a waste! If they wanted just grass the least they could do would be to put a cow or goat (or a few) out there to eat the grass and keep the 'lawn' trimmed and neat. Then at the end of the season they could have some meat, or have milk most of the year. A few animals do not require a lot of space.

If they wanted to, they could be growing atleast some of their food on a small patch of that, or all of it. In the time they spent mowing their yards they could have put time in growing some of their food. This would not only reduce the need to destroy forests for new mega fields, it would also provide them with fresher, healthier food and create a more stable and sustainable food supply.

Again the only reason we have these problems is because of industrial agriculture. Farming spread out in the form of small farms is much more environmentally friendly. Large concentrated mono 'crop' operations cause a lot of problems because they are not natural.

the less people that eat meat, the less of a need for industrialized agriculture. Cows cause pollution.


"Methane, which is 23 times more potent than carbon dioxide as a contributor to global warming, is produced daily by cows. In fact, agriculture generates about 14 percent of the greenhouse gases today -- including two-thirds of all ammonia -- from cows. Even though other grazing animals also expel greenhouse gases, statistics suggest that cows produce 26 to 53 gallons (and some say up to 132 gallons) of methane every day -- the same amount of pollution emitted by a car in a day. And it's only going to worsen: The U.S. Food and Agriculture Organization predicts a 60 percent increase in agricultural methane output by 2030" http://curiosity.discovery.com/question/cows-cause-pollution-than-cars


"Nothing will benefit human health and increase chances for survival of life on Earth as much as the evolution to a vegetarian diet." -Albert Einstein


btw, it's nice to see you here again WITW 

[mon9999]

Thanks everyone for your reply, though i don't eat meat because it is energetically dirty, based on clairvoyant observation the aura of meat especially pork is grayish red, but somehow i think that i still need meat occasionally to stay healthy.  

[Stillwater]

Now few people, atleast in the US, grow any food at home. It isn't that they don't have the means, it is that they just don't. I drive around and see acres and acres of nicely mowed lawns. There are houses sitting on atleast 1 acre, though many times a lot more than that, with nothing but grass on them. What do they do with that grass? They just mow it. What a waste!

I read this and I get a mental image of a suburban street, where the front yards are full of carrots and broccoli.

And yes, having yards full of grass, which demands care year-round, and provides no benefit, or even aesthetic appeal, is asinine; I think we can thank the 18th Century French for this concept; I also have no doubt the image of a yard full of grass has been partially propogated by corporate interests back in the 30's wanting to sell fertilizers and lawn-care products that serve no ultimate purpose.

I sewed my yard full of wildflowers, lol. The neighbor boys are always asking to mow it for money, but it looks better to me as it is.

[personalreality]

i'm really interested in the green rooftops.

gardens and greenhouses on rooftops in the cities.