I am going to do a 90-day trial to achieve my first out of body experience (OBE).
History
For the past 10 years I've had an off and on interest in astral projection. I first heard about the concept in high school when I looked up a psy-trance music group that I was interested in at the time, which were aptly called "Astral Projection". Naturally, a Google search for those two words led me to the other meaning – out of body experience.
I became quite interested in the topic and read a couple books on the subject. I tried some techniques and had some interesting experiences but I never fully got there. For whatever reason I lost interest for a while and decided to put OBE's on the back burner.
Over the years I'd periodically regain some interest, read more about it, and try some techniques. Without much initial success I became impatient and would move on to other things. For whatever reason though, I found myself coming back to the concept over and over. Eventually I came across the work done by Robert Monroe, and read his three books:
1. Journeys Out of the Body
2. Far Journeys
3. Ultimate Journey
I was completely blown away. The stories were so amazing I wondered how anyone could make them up. Then I discovered that the institute he created, The Monroe Institute, was still alive and going strong. Supposedly, people are learning how to do this all the time!
I decided that it was worth pursuing completely. As I've matured I've realized that anything worth doing usually takes persistence and patience. This 90-day trial also fits into Steve Pavlina's success strategy of 30-day trials, so I've decided to really give this my all and see if I really am "more than my physical body".
Strategy
The plan I will be using is from Robert Bruce's and Brian Mercer's book, "Mastering Astral Projection" (MAP). That book provides a 90-day guide to having an out of body experience, which includes:
* affirmations
* writing in a journal
* dream recall
* relaxation exercises
* breath work
* mind taming (i.e. meditation)
* energy work (i.e. chakras)
* binaural beats
* exit techniques
I have read many books on out of body experiences but I've never come across one with such a structured, day-by-day guide. I feel like this book will help stack the deck in my favor, giving me the best possible chance at an OBE. Note that each day will be different, so it differs from typical 30-day habit forming trials.
The plan is to follow the book as closely as possible to see its effectiveness. However, since I haven't read the entire book yet I can't guarantee I'll follow it completely. One basic change I'll have to make from the start is that some exercises that are meant to be done in the afternoon will likely be done in the morning, due to my schedule.
For the most part I'm coming into this trial as a newbie. I've been doing some meditating everyday for the past few weeks which will help with taming my mind, but that's about it.
MAP itself suggests reading other books during this trial, to really saturate the subconscious mind, so I've queued up:
* Astral Dynamics by Robert Bruce (read about 50% so far at the time of this posting)
* Adventures Beyond the Body and The Secret of the Soul by William Buhlman
* Voyages into the Unknown, Volume 1 by Bruce Moen (I will probably get the other 4 volumes as wanted)
I've also signed up to various forums and communities about Astral Projection/OBE's to try and soak up as much knowledge as I can about the subject.
Motivation
So why am I doing this? Well some people might say that it's all just mind games, but I believe it could lead to a verification of the after-life. At the very least, I will have much more evidence supporting the belief that I am more than my physical body.
Lately I've been exploring what spirituality is, as I used to be an atheist. I am a pretty left-brained and a scientific/analytical type of mind, so this type of verification of a spiritual topic would be a huge validation of my beliefs. It's one thing to believe that you have a "spirit", but it's an entirely different thing to know.
I feel like astral projection is almost like a Pandora's Box for me, which could lead to a very cool spiritual journey. Some people may think it's weird or question the whole point of exploring anything not in the "real world". I could probably write a whole post on that point of view, but I think that growing consciously is really the whole point of life to begin with. Why close your mind off from the whole package?
Other than that, I just find this topic interesting even as a mental exercise. I'm also a pretty curious person, and I like exploring topics that are on the edges of social norms.
Public Posting
I will be posting about my experiences over the 90 days. According to the book, each week will contain a different focus so posts will be weekly at the very least. I'll try to post daily as long as there is something interesting to report.
I'm making this experience public for many reasons, which includes:
* increasing my chances for success. Having people read and rely on my progress will give me extra motivation to follow through with the whole 90 days.
* exposing more of who I really am, and what I am interested in. I'm sure I'll attract other like-minded individuals who I can share and grow with.
* helping others who want to explore out of body experiences. This is a pretty nice topic, so the more information out there, the better.
* having writing from a newbies point of view. Writing's on how to achieve an OBE from the perspective of a person who has them regularly is never the same as one starting from the beginning.
Wish me luck. I'll be starting day 1 this weekend. I'd be happy to read your thoughts. :)
Goooooooooooooooooooooood luck!
A great goal :) I am a bit annoyed about this music group "Astral Projection" since they show up when i search for AP on youtube, but it helped you^^ So overall its a good name that will spread AP to more people then you aswell.
As I prepare for my 90-day OBE trial that I start tomorrow, I decided I'd write about some of the structure of the trial and what I've done to prepare so far.
Weekly Structure
The organization of Mastering Astral Projection (MAP) is broken down into weeks. Each week focuses on a different aspect of the projection process, gradually increasing in complexity. I'm not sure if a week is enough time to "master" each topic, but it is a good starting point.
The first 6 weeks focus on all of the important skills before an actual exit attempt is made, such as:
* breath awareness
* mind taming
* energy work
* entering a trance state
I will go into greater detail for each skill as I practice them. After week 6, exit strategies and all the problems or difficulties that can come up are discussed. The main point of all this is that even if I make rapid progress, it will still be 6 weeks before I even attempt an OBE.
Preparation Done So Far
Week 1 starts off strong with an introduction to many of the practices required for reliable astral projection.
I've set up a meditation space in my home that features a sofa chair for the majority of my practice. An egg timer is close by to help with the timing, as well as some incense to help associate the space with the purpose of relaxation/meditation. There is also a hard-backed chair, soft-backed chair, and an extra bed nearby.
MAP recommends keeping a dream journal to help with dream and OBE recall. I've been doing this already for the past several weeks on my own and have been moderately successful in jotting down keywords from my dreams. During the 90-day trial, I'll be posting my keywords and whatever I can remember from my dreams here as well.
I will be using the BrainWave Generator (bwgen) as directed in MAP to help with the practice. Previously, I've experimented with other binaural beats/brainwave entrainment technology such as Holo-Sync, Hemi-Sync, and have found them to be quite helpful with meditation. Luckily, I have an audio extension cable to get the output from bwgen on my computer to headphones in the meditation space.
The daily affirmation MP3's from MAP are loaded into my iPod and I'll listen to the appropriate one in the morning/evening. Every little bit helps!
Expectations
I'm pretty excited but I'm also feeling a little unsure of myself. By making this so public I risk making failure public as well, and not too many people enjoy that! At the very least, going through this exercise will be a huge growth experience for me. Not only in perseverance, but also in expression and courage. C'est la vie.
OBE/Astral Projection Trial Day 1
Program Notes/Observations:
The Brainwave Generator isn't as pleasant to listen to as Hemi-Sync or Holo-Sync, because there isn't any sort of music overlaid on top of the binaural beats. That's ok though, it definitely seems effective so far.
The relaxation exercises are pretty easy, but Robert Bruce seems to stress the importance of them so I will definitely keep working on them.
Breath awareness has been difficult for me as I have a pretty active "monkey mind", and I find my that my mind wanders quite a bit. I've been meditating for many weeks now so it's not like this is a new experience to me either. I imagine my breath awareness would be even worse if I was starting it for the first time today.
Energy body stimulation through the use of "tactile imaging", which is something Robert Bruce coined, is pretty neat. Basically you try to focus your body awareness on a single area of your body, like your big toe. You can scratch or poke your big toe to help with focusing on it. Then you can shift your body awareness to other areas of your body. I only did this for about 5 minutes today but as I write this I still feel the tingling sensations from doing this.
Dream Keywords: web design, business, gift for parents, mix up/same gift with girlfriend
I remembered two separate dreams last night. One was related to having a business on the web, and the other had something to do with a gift for my parents. Sadly I can't recall any more details than that.
hey there michaelsaganski, im actually starting Mastering astral projection today haha, hence why i've stumbled across your post, as i was looking for some success stories of using the book here on the forums, i'll be sure to let you know if i make any progress, let me know if you do too!
Its pretty exciting, and im sure it will pay off with dedication. good luck
It takes very very strong discipline. I tried it like 10 times. Once I got most of the way through it. Still didn't really help me exit. It sure helped me with my energy work, trance states, lucid dreaming and the overall mind state of the projector, all of which actually helped me tremendously in my later ventures of true exits. But at the time, I didn't AP while I used the book. USE THE BRAINWAVE GENERATOR!! I had so many lucid dreams with that program. I still use it from time to time today.
I've done the 90 day program several times over the past 5 years. I still use many of the things I have earned from that book but I don't think I have mastered astral projection yet. :-D
Yeah I won't be disappointed if I don't AP from doing the 90 day program... because I'm sure I'll make a lot of progress regardless how far I get. As long as there is progress I will be happy. :)
It's good to hear that some have tried it and have had some form of success.
Quote from: kurtykurt42 on March 16, 2010, 00:28:54
I don't think I have mastered astral projection yet. :-D
I don't think anyone has or ever will :roll:
OBE/Astral Projection Trial Day 2
Program Notes/Observations:
* I was able to relax a little bit deeper with bwgen, although I'm still having trouble clearing my thoughts when focusing on breath awareness.
* More muscles were tensed/relaxed today for body relaxation today, and I'm thinking this is a trend in the book.
* Energy work focused on sponging/brushing body awareness on my thumbs. It worked pretty well for me without any difficulties, and I felt tingling/buzzing in my thumbs because of it. It's a very peculiar reaction to just pure thought, and it even lasts for a good few minutes after I've stopped thinking about it.
Dream Notes:
* Keywords: backpack, garage door
* I remember something about my garage being broken into with me being close by. There were more details but I've forgotten them now.
* I really have to get into the habit of fleshing out my keywords into better descriptions as soon as I write the keywords down. I find myself forgetting the details behind the keywords when I come back to write more later. I find it pretty difficult to force myself to write just after waking up.
I've just started the 90 guide as well.
I'm on day 3 :-D
the furthest I've come so far is being able to relax myself to the point where I can barely feel my body, I have a slight off balance feeling, and I can feel slight surging sensations.
Clearing my mind is definitely the hardest part so far...everytime I finally start getting into the right state of mind I'll think about it, which ruins it.
Quote from: -JD- on March 16, 2010, 20:19:41
I've just started the 90 guide as well.
I'm on day 3 :-D
the furthest I've come so far is being able to relax myself to the point where I can barely feel my body, I have a slight off balance feeling, and I can feel slight surging sensations.
Clearing my mind is definitely the hardest part so far...everytime I finally start getting into the right state of mind I'll think about it, which ruins it.
Great to hear I've got a peer. :)
Ya clearing my mind is definitely the trickiest part for me.
OBE/Astral Projection Trial Day 3
Program Notes/Observations:
* I should note that I've been doing the afternoon exercises in the evening after work. I won't be doing any morning work until the exit techniques start coming up.
* While listening to bwgen, I use the time for meditation where I focus on my breath. I was especially tired today because I had just finished working out, so I found it easier to relax. There was a point today where the darkness I typically see with my closed eyes got brighter and became a more pure/solid color. That was pretty interesting but as soon as I focused on it, it slipped away. I felt a little different when that happened, but it's hard to describe other than using the word "good" or "peaceful".
* While doing the energy work on my right thumb I found that my left thumb would start tingling, just like MAP says it might. I didn't read about that until after it happened, so that was some helpful validation of my experience. I even felt my other fingers start to tingle as well.
* Body awareness of my big toes was harder than my thumbs.
Dream Notes:
* Keywords: table, chair, family, angry, apologize
* I keep seeing one of my best childhood friends' parents in my dreams, and they always seem to be there to tell me something. This is probably the 4th or 5th time it has happened recently. I don't really understand why it's those people in particular though giving me these messages. I usually end up forgetting the message by the time I wake up, although not always. One particular message was something along the lines of "People are different colors", which I believe was another way of saying that everyone is different, unique, and yet the same. Another message had to do with peace between nations.
* The particular dream I remembered today was me arguing over something with close friends and family at a table. I got frustrated, got up from the table, and pushed the chair in. Immediately afterward, for whatever reason, I understood and apologized... then woke up.
One thing I should add that's worth mentioning is that I had a bit of an intuitive/psychic event happen to me. As I sat down to use my 4-year old Xbox 360 for media streaming I had this weird thought about the Xbox 360 breaking and how it was a single point of failure for me. I usually don't think about that so I thought it was a weird thought. Sure enough, I got the red ring of death shortly after I turned the Xbox on and had to get it replaced.
Quote from: michaelsaganski on March 17, 2010, 11:01:58
There was a point today where the darkness I typically see with my closed eyes got brighter and became a more pure/solid color. That was pretty interesting but as soon as I focused on it, it slipped away. I felt a little different when that happened, but it's hard to describe other than using the word "good" or "peaceful".
This same thing happened to me today as well.
I was laying down and concentrating on my breathing, and doing some energy stimulation in my feet. (day 3 of the program) After about 30 minutes I got into a good trance state and as soon as I did, I felt my consciousness suddenly "shift". It was like my consciousness fell away form my body for a split second (almost like when you nod off to sleep but catch yourself, only I was fully aware of it happening) As soon as this "shift" happened I got very noticeable falling sensations rush through my body. As soon as the shift happened though, I noticed it, and then lost the feelings. This happened another 2 times over a period of about 15 minutes.
so hopefully that means I'm making progress
OBE/Astral Projection Trial Day 4
Program Notes/Observations:
* The relaxation I(stretching) exercises basically went through my whole body this time. No difficulties there.
* BWGen worked well again but I did not go as deep as yesterday, likely because I didn't work out right beforehand.
* The energy work/body awareness today spread to all the toes. The tingling was super intense after the exercise, almost like my toes were on fire. There's definitely something unusual going on with tactile imaging!
Dream Notes:
* Dream Keywords: Steve Pavlina, battle against really big guy, internet, warehouse
* The first dream is a little too personal so I'm leaving it out. The second dream involved me stuck in a warehouse all of a sudden, and then a really big guy faced me. He was approaching me and I felt like he was going to attack me. I decided not to fight him and got out.. somehow.
* I'm not sure what's with all the more negative/intense dreams lately. Usually they're not like that.
I'd stay away from warehouses next few days if I were you :lol:
:)
OBE/Astral Projection Trial Day 5
Program Notes/Observations:
* While I was relaxing with bwgen I slipped into a couple mini-dreams that I quickly forgot after I remembered to focus on my breath. It was different from a normal dream though, because I was still aware of my body as I was having the dream. It's hard to describe exactly how I was aware of my body yet not lucid in my dream.
* The energy work/body awareness focused on both of my feet in their entirety. This was pretty intense, my feet almost felt like they were on fire by the end of it. The tingling and buzzing were very strong. Robert Bruce says this is normal when you're just starting out though, because I'm clearing out energy blockages. It's neat to be able to already verify what he says will happen with my own real experience, because this sort of intense tingling feeling isn't something I'd expect to happen.
Dream Notes:
* Dream Keywords: APEGM dinner, tammerism?, discussion in engineering, video game for sale
* One of my dreams involved me sitting at a dinner table with my professional engineering peers, although I did not recognize anyone from the physical world. For whatever reason, words that don't even exist kept being brought up throughout the dream. One of them was "tammerism", and for whatever reason I thought I understood what that meant in the dream... but not now of course. There were other weird words but I do not remember them.
I finished Astral Dynamics and have started reading Bruce Moen's first book. I also coincidentally received a shipment from Amazon with some fresh new books. They are:
* Adventures Beyond the Body
* The Secret of the Soul
* The Power of Now
* Exploring the World of Lucid Dreaming
Needless to say I've got a full plate of reading for the next while. :)
Bruce Moen's book is already pretty intense, and is way over my head. Not in the sense of me having trouble understanding it, but rather it would be something more appropriate to me once I've had more OBE experience. I flipped through "Exploring the World of Lucid Dreaming" and I think I will read it first, because it seems like it does a better job of bridging the gap between science and the paranormal. In other words, it feels more "entry level" to me. I've ordered Bruce Moen's Guidebook today, so I will be working through that once it arrives.
I'm also building the habit of doing frequent reality checks during the day, so that I can do it during a dream and become lucid.
I just got done day 5's exercises as well.
My feet didn't feel as if they were on fire, but definitely some strong tingling in my feet. :-D
OBE/Astral Projection Trial Day 6
Program Notes/Observations:
* Energy work and body awareness on both of my entire legs today. The energy work keeps getting more intense each day. Both of my legs were tingling and the soles of my feet felt like they were on fire almost. My feet are still tingling as I write this.
* I am now fully relaxing my body as per the guidelines in MAP.
Dream Notes:
* I didn't remember any dreams last night! :( I'm not too sure why. Some mornings I just wake up and they're gone.
OBE/Astral Projection Trial Day 7
Program Notes/Observations
* Energy work implemented "body bouncing" awareness in my legs. This feeling was pretty cool, you can definitely sense the energy movement through your legs.
* Week 2 is coming up! I'm getting a little anxious to actually do some OBE exit techniques but taking it slow is probably best.
Dream Notes
* This was a doozy. The relevant part to share was that I was in my bathroom during the dream looking at myself in the mirror. For whatever reason my dream mind suddenly asked to have an OBE. I looked away from the mirror, concentrated, and looked back at the mirror. In my astonishment I looked about 20 years older. Wrinkly but with a full head of grey hair, almost like Jay Leno haha. I became scared and said "ok ok, I get the point, please put me back" and everything was back to normal... in my dream that is.
* The second part to the dream was me having a plugged toilet. I interpreted this as me trying to shed my old beliefs, but there's so much of it that it's getting clogged and will take time to get rid of. But I don't really know if that's what was meant, of course.
I'm still having trouble clearing my mind.
No matter how relaxed I get, that little voice in my head keeps talking every now and then :-(
haha.
OBE/Astral Projection Trial Week 2 Day 8
So I'm into week 2 now. The focus this week will be on enhancing the breathing exercises, calming the mind, and energy work for the upper body.
Program Notes/Observations:
* I'm finding that the energy bouncing in my legs causes various leg muscles to twitch. It definitely feels like something is changing when I do this.
* It was a little tough to bring body awareness to the back-side of my fingers. The sensations weren't as intense as my feet were.
* Increasing the depth of my breath during the breath awareness exercise felt pretty good.
* While I was listening to bwgen, I would say "astral" to myself on an inhale and "projection" during the exhale, as suggested in MAP. I found this helped me to stay alert, although I did catch myself starting to daydream a few times still.
Dream Notes:
* No dreams remembered this time again. I went out last night and did a little drinking/partying. I think the alcohol definitely affected my dream recall, for the worse.
OBE/Astral Projection Trial Day 9
Program Notes/Observations
* I found it really hard to find the time to do all the exercises today. I probably rushed through them a little faster than I should have. It almost seemed like the universe was conspiring to derail my practice today.
* Energy work moved to the arms, I didn't feel too much tingling there, just a localized heaviness.
Dream Notes:
* Wow, I remembered around 5-6 dreams last night! I wrote a full page of notes in my journal but I'm not going to write it all out here.
* In one of the dreams, there were about 4 people who had attracted attention in a crowd. Someone said something about making them levitate, so I thought "what the heck, I'll try and make one of them levitate". So I closed my dream eyes and focused hard. I heard some voices and then saw some weird (hypnagogic?) imagery with some very cool sounds. I think I might have felt a slight falling sensation, I'm not too sure. Next thing I know I try to open my eyes in the dream but it turns out I woke up.
* I think one of my dream symbols is a video game/computer screen. They seem to show up in my dreams quite a bit. Perhaps I need to start doing reality checks whenever I look at a screen.
Quote from: michaelsaganski on March 21, 2010, 23:51:53
* I'm finding that the energy bouncing in my legs causes various leg muscles to twitch. It definitely feels like something is changing when I do this.
This happens to me as well. Whenever I start doing leg work, random muscles start twitching in different spots throughout the exercise. It's distracting because I'm not sure If it's my muscles responding to the energy work, or if I'm actually tensing my muscles accidentally because I'm focusing so much on the specific area. (I'm pretty sure I'm not tensing, but it's hard to tell sometimes :-D)
Quote from: -JD- on March 22, 2010, 14:01:49
This happens to me as well. Whenever I start doing leg work, random muscles start twitching in different spots throughout the exercise. It's distracting because I'm not sure If it's my muscles responding to the energy work, or if I'm actually tensing my muscles accidentally because I'm focusing so much on the specific area. (I'm pretty sure I'm not tensing, but it's hard to tell sometimes :-D)
Yeah I'm pretty sure I'm not tensing them either. Some will twitch even when I'm not focused on that particular part of my leg at the time.
OBE/Astral Projection Trial Day 10
Program Notes/Observations:
* I'm not finding the energy work with the arms to be as intense as the legs, but it's still quite tingly.
* I'm getting better at quieting my mind while meditating and listening to bwgen. It's becoming a quite pleasant experience
Dream Notes:
* I remembered 2 dreams last night. I had my sleep time cut short, to about 6 hours. I find this significantly cuts down on the number of dreams I have during the night. This agrees with what I have read in various places about dreaming – you tend to have more REM periods during the 6-8th hour of sleeping versus the beginning.
* Dream symbol – videogame type sequences. This seems to crop up once a week or so, where I find myself playing some sort of video game like dream out. Usually they tend to be of the "First Person Shooter" variety. This aligns with my previously mentioned dream symbol of a computer/video screen.
All the books you mentioned have been invaluable for me... Monroe, Bruce, Buhlman, LaBerge. I especially enjoy William Buhlman's work. I've used tactile imaging to reenter lucid dreams - it really is amazing how interconnected all of this is. When your reading pallet lessens a bit, I'd recommend Robert Moss' work, specifically Dreamgates.
Intention has been my biggest help with achieving OBEs. I've only had a handful over the past year and a half since I discovered them, but I notice I find myself in the vibrational stage if I have done a lot of reading about them before bed. Keep up the determination - I'm going to be checking back on your progress! 8-)
Quote from: c0sm0nautt on March 23, 2010, 20:04:20
All the books you mentioned have been invaluable for me... Monroe, Bruce, Buhlman, LaBerge. I especially enjoy William Buhlman's work. I've used tactile imaging to reenter lucid dreams - it really is amazing how interconnected all of this is. When your reading pallet lessens a bit, I'd recommend Robert Moss' work, specifically Dreamgates.
Intention has been my biggest help with achieving OBEs. I've only had a handful over the past year and a half since I discovered them, but I notice I find myself in the vibrational stage if I have done a lot of reading about them before bed. Keep up the determination - I'm going to be checking back on your progress! 8-)
Thanks for the recommendation, I've added it to my Amazon wish list for later. :) What's with all the Robert's in this field? hah
OBE/Astral Projection Trial Day 11
Program Notes/Observations:
* While I was listening to bwgen and meditating today, I think I got deeper than I ever have before. I started to feel "different", with bursts of what felt like electricity going through my body. The blurry image I normally see with my closed eyes turned blue-ish, and I felt my heart (or heart chakra?) start to beat pretty quick. I was getting pretty excited so it stopped shortly afterward.
* I find myself getting anxious with body relaxation and breath awareness exercises. I just want to "get through them" so I can get to the more interesting energy work.
* During the energy work today, I felt what I think were energy blockages. One was in my left thigh, and the other in my neck. I've been told before that my throat chakra is relatively closed so perhaps that has something to do with it. Basically, I found it difficult to focus my body awareness through those 2 areas.
Dream Notes:
* Just a couple cool dreams. One with me playing basketball and the other had me defending a castle. Nothing remarkably interesting to report.
Where did you get the bwgen?
www.bwgen.com
:)
OBE/Astral Projection Trial Day 12
Program Notes/Observations
* I found it pretty hard to meditate today while listening to bwgen, as I am extra tired today. I worked an overtime shift for my job last night so my sleep schedule was thrown off.
* When I was listening to bwgen, I had wondered if the 20 minutes were up and grabbed for my egg timer to check. As soon as I touched the egg timer, it went off. I thought it was a funny coincidence, and I suppose some people might take that as being potentially pre-cognitive.
* While doing the fully body bounce energy work today my whole body felt like it was vibrating at a slow rhythm. It didn't feel like the rhythm from a heart beat either.
Dream Notes:
* 2 dreams remembered. Once was related to work but the second one was me exploring this cave full of glass/crystal artifacts. One of them was a very pretty looking crab.
OBE/Astral Projection Trial Day 13
Program Notes/Observations:
* While I was meditating with bwgen, I had this visual come to me of an outline of a human being lying down. No features or anything, just the outline. The peculiar thing was that the person had a void/vortex around his solar plexus. The words "Go Inward" came to mind.
* The energy work is getting easier. The feeling isn't as intense now, as to be expected according to MAP. I find it easier to focus on my right side rather than my left though. The whole body bouncing can be a little difficult.
Dream Notes:
* No dreams remembered, damn. I really have to set the intention each night to remember my dreams... I can't seem to slack off yet and have it happen automatically. I'm thinking I'll try working the "wake back to bed" method into my sleeping routine.
* I'd really like to have a lucid dream and am still trying to build "reality checks" as a habit.
OBE/Astral Projection Trial Week 3 Day 16
The past few days have focused on a lot of full-body awareness/energy raising through "full-body bounces". The energy work has become easier to do each day, but there are also new techniques being added to learn each day – so there's always a fresh challenge.
With my dreams, I'm definitely seeing video games as a dreamsign. I used to play video games quite a bit but not so much anymore – I just have to learn to ask myself if I'm dreaming each time I look at a screen. Another frequent dreamsign for me seems to be having people ask me questions. Almost every night I notice that someone from my past asks me a question. Perhaps I can gain lucidity if I remember to ask myself if I'm dreaming everytime someone asks me a question – but I'm not really sure if that's practical.
Week 3
This week's focus is on energy raising for the 3 primary energy storage centers, as well as more work on achieving mental clarity/focus (meditation). This program seems to have a nice steady build up of the prerequisite skills in having an OBE, although not actually practicing OBE attempts is a little frustrating. The time each day's exercises take up is increasing as well, and that's starting to take a toll on my daily schedule. I'm not doing all the optional exercises as I simply don't have time to do them, although I do what I can and am doing more than the bare minimum.
With bwgen, there's a new preset added to listen to before bed that's supposed to help with lucid dreaming. I'll give it a shot.
Day 16 Program Notes/Observations:
* My head felt especially clear after doing the "full-body circuit" energy work.
* Using the ring technique, I was able to keep my mind clear for almost 30 seconds at the maximum. I would say the average time was about 20 seconds of nothing but me focusing on my breath before other thoughts would enter my mind.
Dream Notes:
* Video game dream sign and question dream sign occurred again. I would have never realized these dream signs before if it wasn't for my dream journal. Before I started writing in my dream journal I was a little skeptical that I had any dream signs in the first place.
OBE/Astral Projection Trial Day 17
Program Notes/Observations:
* I think I'm going to start getting up earlier to do the exercises first thing in the morning. I've been doing them in the evening so far after a full days work, exercise, and supper. I find that my body and mind are too tired to focus well on mind taming. While listening to bwgen I found myself day dreaming and clicking out for long chunks of time, which is frustrating because it feels like wasted time.
* Taming my mind with the ring technique was more variable today. I got up to 40 seconds but sometimes barely lasted a few.
Dream Notes:
* I just had some fun sports related dreams last night.
* I'm going to try the affirmation: "I am more and more conscious in my dreams" to improve my dream recall and also improve the chances of me becoming lucid. I kept waffling between two different affirmations to work on either separately. I feel like this one says it all.
OBE/Astral Projection Trial Day 18
Program Notes/Observations:
* Each day is taking me a solid hour of practice, plus about a half hour of reading time, affirmations, and these notes I'm writing. This is taking quite a bit of dedication, but I still feel pretty confident about getting through it. For anyone interested in OBE's, it might be easier to just try some exit techniques right off the bat, just to get some experience and motivation to go through a program like this. Working on all the prerequisite skills for weeks at a time before knowing what you're in for takes a lot of dedication.
* I'm not too sure if the energy raising technique is doing much for me. The feeling is pretty subtle, although I do feel pretty good afterward.
* Doing these exercises in the morning is going to take even more discipline as it's a fairly sizable schedule change. I really need to do this though, because my mind is racing after a full day of work.
Dream Notes:
* I haven't gotten up early yet to do the wake back to bed method for lucid dreams, although I'm trying to work it into my schedule.
* I've been waking up lately thinking I haven't remembered my dreams. But once I lie there for a while and really think about it, bits and pieces start to come back. My lucidity in my dreams hasn't increased lately though – I've sort of hit a wall with this.
* I had another video-game-esque dream last night.
OBE/Astral Projection Trial Week 3 Day 22
So the past few days has been met with me focusing on secondary energy center work and mind taming. I think I've definitely gotten better at both. The energy work/body awareness exercises come to me pretty easily now, and I can definitely feel different sorts of tingling/buzzing/warm sensations from practicing this.
In particular, I've felt a sense of pressure on my forehead during the energy work, which is supposedly where the third-eye chakra is. I haven't even done any direct stimulation of that area yet, apart from some body awareness of my head entirely during a "full body bounce" in Mastering Astral Projection. I'm interested to see how this develops because this particular chakra supposedly has a deep connection with psychic abilities. I've also received intuitive readings in the past which have told me that my third-eye is unusually open.
There has been a slow but steady progression with my mind taming practice now. I'm getting to the point where I can definitely feel myself getting into a different state of being while meditating, and it's quite enjoyable. The surface thoughts or "monkey mind" are losing their strength. Right now I find myself starting a random thought but catching myself in the process, usually stopping it before any sort of full blown thought "sentence" occurs. I am finding the meditation practice to be more effective in the morning.
As far as dreaming goes, the progress has been slower. As a positive, I find myself remembering dream fragments from more than one dream per night without too much effort. However, my attempts with the wake back to bed method haven't been going too well. I guess I just like sleep too much :) .
I thought getting up for only a few minutes in the middle of the night would be enough to put myself in a state to practice lucid dreaming exercises, but it isn't... I just end up falling back asleep right away. I can see why some people recommend getting up for a good 15-45 minutes. I also find myself getting a little lazy with writing all of what I remember from my dreams – more effort is needed here.
This weeks exercises focus on primary energy center (or major chakra) stimulation. I'm starting to get into the more interesting exercises and am getting closer to practicing OBE attempts, which is getting exciting. Today I stimulated the base chakra, and it was a very intense feeling. I still have some lingering doubts as to whether or not the body awareness is actually affecting any sort of "energy body" or whether it's just the way the nervous system responds to prolonged awareness of a certain body area. The sensations are certainly unusual, but I think it will take a certain amount of belief for myself before I actually see the results from an actual OBE.
OBE/Astral Projection Trial Day 25
Book Reading:
* I've finished reading both "World of Lucid Dreaming" and "Adventures Beyond the Body", and am currently starting "The Power of Now".
* World of Lucid Dreaming was good but it contained a lot of information I already knew, so it just filled in some gaps of my knowledge.
* Adventures Beyond the Body was ok. I liked his dimensional model of the non-physical universe but there wasn't very much meat to the book. I liked reading about his personal experiences but they didn't really connect with the rest of his book very well. He makes some great arguments for the benefits of OBE's but does little to back it up.
* I've only started reading "The Power of Now", but I can already see the power behind this book. I think it will greatly help with my mind taming exercises.
Program Notes/Observations:
* Primary energy center work this week so far has been quite productive. I have felt a lot of activity in my base chakra, little activity in my naval chakra, and a moderate amount in my solar plexus.
Dream Notes:
* I had my first lucid dream last night ever since I've started this 90-day trial! That's the third I've had in my lifetime.
* I attribute my success this time primarily to the wake back to bed (WBTB) method. The reality checks, affirmations, and energy work also help as well of course. I fell asleep just after 11:00, woke up at around 3:30, stayed up for about 10 minutes (went to the bathroom, drank a glass of water), and then went back to bed. I focused my intention on holding my consciousness into my dream, repeating the affirmation "I am more and more conscious in my dreams" as I fell asleep.
* At first I thought it was a Wake Induced Lucid Dream (WILD). But, after I woke up and thought about it some more, I think it was more likely a Dream Induced Lucid Dream (DILD). There was a small break in consciousness between being awake and asleep, but it was much smaller than usual, which I think helped me realize it was a dream right off the bat.
* In the dream, I found myself lieing in my bed, but the room was different. A woman came out of a painting and materialized in front of me. I asked her if she is a spirit guide and she said "No, but my dad is".
* I then asked her "How do I know this is real?" She didn't answer with words but just reached out and touched my base chakra. This was an incredibly intense feeling which almost made me wake up – I'm pretty sure I lost some lucidity after this as it sort of turned into a regular dream afterward.
* The fact that she touched my base chakra was interesting because the base chakra has been the one I've activated the most with my energy work so far.
* After I woke up, my base chakra throbbed quite intensely for about an hour and has mildly throbbed/felt active for the whole day so far.
It's great to see some of this work starting to pay off. This has been quite exciting so far and I can't wait to see where this goes!
That's an intense conscious break into a lucidity. Quite impressive. You've now motivated me to try out the NEW program, I have it, just haven't done it yet. Also, thanks for posting up regularly and fully elaborating.
Keep up the good work! :-)
Seeing your path truley is inspiring!
I have started reading Astral Dynamics and it is heavy reading but I have never seen any book in so much detail! I am sticking to a few pages a day and boy my dreams where nothing more then randoms snapping images last night (not normal for me!)
OBE/Astral Projection Trial Week 5 Day 29
The past week focused on energy work with my primary energy centers (chakras). I was able to become aware of and stimulate each one with varying degrees of success. It's interesting that each chakra seemed to give me a different response or feeling when compared to the others.
Raising energy has now become relatively easy for me, it's almost a habit now. It will be a part of the rest of the 90 day program and I will likely continue it in some form afterward. I attribute this to the fact that I've been doing it everyday now for about a month, which is what Steve Pavlina recommends as the minimum time for forming a new habit.
In fact, I have been finding mind taming to be more difficult. I'm still working on this everyday as well by doing breath awareness, and I'm getting better. If I'm not careful it's just so easy to slip into a daydream or useless dialogue with myself. I know I probably shouldn't be saying that though, as it just reinforces itself as an intention.
I've been getting better at remembering my dreams, to the point where I can remember various scenes from a dream in the middle of the day without having to refer to my notes. That used to be completely impossible for me, so it's great to see that progress. There's still plenty of room for improvement though.
I've received Bruce Moen's "Afterlife Knowledge Guidebook", along with an accompanying CD and DVD. I watched the DVD "Exploring More of the Afterlife", and wow, I was pretty blown away. The quality of the video isn't the greatest but Bruce talks about some pretty advanced (dare I say crazy?) stuff.
This week's focus is on getting into the trance state. This is the state I need to be in before trying an OBE exit technique. I will be learning OBE exit techniques next week, which is exciting because I haven't actually tried to have an out of body experience yet in this program.
In my various explorations with astral projection in the past, I used to try to get into the trance state while lying down. This was easier than sitting to get into the trance state, but I would frequently go to deep and "click out"/fall asleep. Mastering Astral Projection recommends using slight discomfort to make sure you don't fall asleep, so they recommend sitting in a hard backed chair. The fact that you then have to balance your head keeps you from falling asleep, but on the flip-side it's harder to get into a trance state (mind awake/body asleep).
My first attempt at mind awake/body asleep in my chair today went alright. I didn't get as deep as I have in the past while lying down, but I just need some practice. The technique used today was to picture and feel myself going down an elevator. I will let you know how it progresses.
OBE/Astral Projection Trial Day 35
This week has been an interesting one to put it mildly. I've been experiencing some pretty large paradigm shifts and mental re-programming. My mental model of reality has changed due to both my daily exercises and supplemental reading.
I haven't had a classic OBE yet (beyond a lucid dream) so I'd have to say that my theoretical knowledge of what consciousness is is further along than my direct experience. I've finished reading "The Power of Now" and have now begun reading "The Afterlife Knowledge Guidebook" by Bruce Moen. I haven't put all the pieces together yet but I'm experiencing "eureka" moments on an almost daily basis. This is quite exciting! I'll try to share some of my thoughts here..
The major point I've picked up from Eckhart Tolle in The Power of Now is that my thoughts are not who I am, "I am" the observer behind the thoughts. Descartes was wrong when he said "I think, therefore I am". My thoughts are my ego, they are not me in its entirety because there is something that exists outside my thoughts (self-awareness) that can observe my thoughts. But what, exactly, is doing the observation?
I cannot just be my thoughts (i.e. mind) because then there wouldn't be anything that would let me observe my mind. It's like the difference between a regular dream and a lucid dream. A regular dream is my ego-mind running amuck, while a lucid dream is where I bring my own self-aware observation (i.e. focus of consciousness) – which is an entirely different experience.
To me, this points to logical evidence that we are more than just our physical body and mind, which I believe will help me take another mental step into experiencing an OBE myself. Since I am beginning to accept the idea that we are more than our physical bodies, my mind will not be as likely to inhibit an OBE from occurring. Also, if an OBE were to occur, I won't be as "shell shocked" as I would be if it were to happen to someone with the typical atheist/skeptic belief system.
I have only just started reading The Afterlife Knowledge Guidebook today but it has already given me a Eureka! moment that also points to the fact that we are more than our physical bodies. This has to do with the concept and problem of free will. Do you believe you have free will? That is, the power to control aspects of your life?
Free will is something that has bugged me for a very long time, since I have always been a very left-brained, logical, and scientific thinker. YET, I do believe in free will... I am not a robot or a computer. Science does not currently have an answer for free will. The science of physics describes a deterministic/mechanistic universe at a macro level (Newtonian Mechanics/Relativity) and a seemingly random/indeterministic universe at a micro level (Quantum Mechanics).
The problem is that our world as seen from the lens of science does not have any room for free will. It's like the universe had a set of initial conditions set at the beginning and everything is playing out due to the physical laws of cause and effect. Or, if you get down to very small scales it appears entirely random. This doesn't make any sort of intuitive sense to our own personal subjective experience.
Now if you don't believe in free will then there is no problem for you. But if you do believe in free will then you recognize that you have the power to make choices that manipulate the physical world. But from where does this choice come from? Where do you trace the origin of the chain of cause and effect?
I believe the origin of free will(s) has to come from a source that is outside this physical universe. It's not like science is wrong – the universe is quite predictable (or completely unpredictable) under controlled experiments. But a human seems to be somewhere in the middle. I'm beginning to think that there are influences outside the physical universe that can somehow change the physical universe, and we might be one of the ways this occurs.
Take for example, the problem of our understanding of the human brain. In general, scientists believe that the brain is the origin of consciousness (I used to think so, too), but we really don't know how it works all too well. I'm now beginning to think that the brain is more of an interface/transceiver between our consciousness and the physical universe.
This idea isn't new of course. See Tart's Model of the Human Mind for an interesting description; It practically begs for a Venn Diagram. Movies like The Matrix and more recently, Avatar, show that the idea can be accepted in pop culture.
This Eureka moment came to me when I got to the beginning of the "Silly Little Finger Bending Exercise" in Bruce's book. I can sit here all day and choose when to bend my finger or not – I really don't see how a completely scripted universe would let me do that. Again, to me, this points to the idea that we are more than just our physical bodies.
But anyways, back to my notes and observations on my daily practice.
* I've been noticing some weird experiences and coincidences lately. As an example, during one of my exercises I set my egg timer to 15 minutes and then proceeded to meditate. After a period of time I became curious as to why the egg timer hadn't rung yet and looked at how much time was remaining. It still said 15 minutes. Feeling a little weird-ed out, I decided to just let the timer be and see if it would start counting down. It did. I don't really have any sort of logical explanation other than just self-delusion but it was certainly weird.
* Getting into a trance state is becoming easier each day, but I'm still only capable of getting into a light trance. Some of the visualization techniques are a little difficult, but luckily I get to pick what to use for the future.
* Next week focuses on a little more preparation for OBE's (oops, I thought this was the last prep week). This includes creating a plan for what to do during my first OBE (the "walkthrough"), which is basically just a short trip around my room to maximize the chance of remembering the experience. I'll also be practicing "energy body loosening" by focusing my awareness on points outside my body, instead of just inside my body.
* It's nice to see that a lot of what Bruce Moen talks about lines up with Robert Bruce, although there perspectives/approaches appear to be quite different.
* I'm finding that the greater effort I put into telling myself "I remember my dreams" before falling asleep greatly determines the quality of my dream recall. It's harder than it sounds because I can be quite exhausted by the end of the day, which can make it difficult to not fall asleep immediately after my bedtime reading. So some days are better than others for what I end up writing in my journal.
Interesting reading :) I'm reading Astral Dynamics and he continuously says that you should return to your body after ~10 sec to avoid forgetting the experience. Move away from your body aswell since being too close can cause problems like poor vision.
Quote from: WASD on April 16, 2010, 17:32:18
Interesting reading :) I'm reading Astral Dynamics and he continuously says that you should return to your body after ~10 sec to avoid forgetting the experience. Move away from your body aswell since being too close can cause problems like poor vision.
I'm with that. Just this morning I projected, returned and then got out again, and completely forgot the second adventure. So far, it's a blank.
I am thoroughly enjoying this post. I have the book you are using, but after about two weeks of doing it when I first bought it around a year ago, I got frustrated/bored and stopped. I am currently taking the Astral Projection course over at gnosticweb, but I think I am going to combine it with using this book again.
I had a much longer post typed but erased most of it as it didn't pertain to your thread. I think I may start my own journal like this one to share my experiences as well. If nothing else, maybe it will keep me motivated this time. Thank you for being so in depth and I look forward to reading more of your experiences.
Quote from: WASD on April 16, 2010, 17:32:18
Interesting reading :) I'm reading Astral Dynamics and he continuously says that you should return to your body after ~10 sec to avoid forgetting the experience. Move away from your body aswell since being too close can cause problems like poor vision.
Yup that's part of the plan for sure. :)
you know, I never had any of those memory problems. My first time I was out for at least a minute or two and remembered it fine.
What i have had problems with is remembering projections when i have multiple in a row. Sometimes I'll come back to my body and will still be in the right mind so i go again. Sometimes when I do that I might not remember the first one as well, which is crappy because its usually the longest.
Quote from: personalreality on April 16, 2010, 21:34:02
you know, I never had any of those memory problems. My first time I was out for at least a minute or two and remembered it fine.
What i have had problems with is remembering projections when i have multiple in a row. Sometimes I'll come back to my body and will still be in the right mind so i go again. Sometimes when I do that I might not remember the first one as well, which is crappy because its usually the longest.
Yeah, I'm just being cautious for my first time. I may not have any memory problems either - but my historically bad dream recall is an indicator that this may not be the case.
OBE/Astral Projection Trial Day 36
I had an interesting experience while doing one of the meditation exercises today, which consisted of me focusing on my third eye chakra. For whatever reason, I decided to think "Guides, if you're really out there, please show yourselves". Immediately after, the darkness behind my closed eyes lit up dramatically. It's almost as if a dimmer switch had been gradually turned up in my room – but no external lighting had changed obviously. Then, I felt a huge wave of electricity/energy/vibrations come through the top of my head and down my body. This wasn't your typical cold chill, because the energy stayed for a good couple minutes. I began to see what looked like blobs of form behind my eyelids, instead of just a hazy blur.. but I didn't get anything more than that. I became too excited, shed a couple tears (I haven't cried in years), and broke out of the meditation.
:-o Exciting.
OBE/Astral Projection Trial Day 37
I'm now getting better at getting into a deeper trance state. I know this because I find that when I end the meditation session and open my eyes, I feel disassociated with my physical body for a few seconds until I start to move. This is especially true with my hands and feet – it's almost like the feeling of them being "asleep" when blood circulation is cut off.
While I was extending the body bounce awareness exercise from the floor, through my body, up to the ceiling, and back down again I saw a couple flashes of a white horizontal line of light descending through my line of vision. It wasn't in sync with my awareness exercise so it was sort of surprising – I don't think there was a particular feeling associated with it either.
I think I may have projected into my etheric/energy body while practicing the extended body bounce exercise. There was a point at which I think my body fell asleep because I felt my head tilt to the right slightly, but it didn't really feel like it was me. It's hard to describe but perhaps a better way of saying it is that I was focused on my energy body and only partially felt my head tilt over. I had felt movement but it took me a while to figure out what had happened – from my perspective I felt like I was still sitting up straight.
Sounds like you are making great progress! An inspiration to all that practice does indeed yield results, even if it's not quite the whole shebang just yet. I'm sure before long you will have even more amazing experiences, but your experiences thus far are quite impressive in their own right.
OBE/Astral Projection Trial Day 40
Well, things keep getting a whole lot more interesting.
Progress generally feels like 2 steps forward, 1 step back, but every few days I am able to get into a slightly deeper trance state. This basically means a reduction in sensory input, which is part of the process in dissociating from my physical body – I need to keep my physical senses from rooting myself into focusing on the physical. I am able to feel a tingling sensation and a heaviness in my arms and legs fairly easily, but my chest seems to take more effort (especially since I am focusing on my breath).
During a couple of my meditation sessions I've had the urge to see if I could communicate with my "guides". I'd openly ask if they were "around", and I have gotten confirmation. The type of confirmation is just on the edge of what my analytical/left-brained/atheistic mind can accept – energy surges through my body, eye twitches on demand, and an internal dialogue that feels almost imaginary. The experiences can be interpreted as real or made up, depending on what you believe.
I now see that our beliefs are what limits us, and is what also limits our experiences. It's sort of a catch-22 because in order to experience something profound you have to believe it to be possible in the first place – that can make it hard for skeptics, when self-fulfilling prophecies come to mind. I feel like I just need to keep an open mind to slowly chip away at my limiting beliefs and concepts. Patience, persistence, and practice will expand my capabilities over time.
A lot of these self-realizations I've been having have caused somewhat of a belief-system crash, as coined by Bruce Moen in the Afterlife Knowledge Guidebook. Some of my old limiting beliefs have been dissolved and this has caused me to lose part of my identity/ego. This "loss of self" can be tough on the mind and I know that I need time to heal and reintegrate my new beliefs into a more accurate model of reality. This is hard! (whoops, I suppose that was an affirmation...)
Even if I don't have an OBE from this trial I've already had enough experiences to further pursue meditation and the exploration of consciousness. I now realize that an OBE is just a subset of the larger reality that can be experienced by consciousness. I almost feel like this trial is morphing into something more general – the evolution of my consciousness – rather than to just attain an OBE.
I'm thinking about going to The Monroe Institute for their "Gateway Voyage" retreat. I have their Gateway Experience CD's which I think I will start listening to regularly instead of the Lucid Dreaming track provided in bwgen. I've been a little disappointed with bwgen so far when compared to some of the other binaural beat tracks I've tried. I'm going to be focusing on "CD 1 Track 2: Focus 10? for now until I get good at achieving that state.
I have been absorbing quite a bit of material on consciousness this week and I feel like I should slow down a little, especially with the belief system crash. I'm getting the feeling that I should be working on experiencing more, rather than just reading about it. The books are only pointers. Reality is subjective so it's up to me to see what is really true or not.
That being said I am now interested in reading the "My Big Toe" trilogy from Thomas Campbell. He worked with Robert Monroe at the very early stages of the creation of Hemi-Sync. I particularly like his model of consciousness and reality, especially the mapping of entropy with love.
OBE/Astral Projection Trial Day 43
Here it is, week 6! This is the week where I finally get to do some OBE exit techniques. This week will focus on Robert Bruce's "Rope" technique, where you visualize and feel a rope above you that you use to climb. I have tried this method before in the past and have found it to quickly put me in a mind awake/body asleep state.
From the first couple sessions I've done already it's apparent to me that I still need quite a bit of work on taming my mind. I find it hard to focus on one thing (ex. climbing the rope) for longer than 30 seconds, if that. I feel like this is the hardest part for most people, losing focus is so easy in this day and age.
I've read that it can take months/years of daily meditation to effectively quiet the mind. It's clear to me that it's probably going to take that long for me as well. I used to be quite aloof and lost in my own mind (and still am at times) so I have quite a bit of ground to cover.
So having an OBE in 90 days might be a bit of a stretch. I'll give it my best effort though. This is probably why many people give up on the process. Luckily, there are many other benefits to this daily practice so I'm going to continue regardless.
On a bit of a practical note, I used to find the egg timer quite useful for pacing the various daily exercises. Now that I've done them so many times they are now memorized, and find it more beneficial to just keep my eyes closed and do the exercises at my own pace. This prevents me from breaking my trance state to reset the egg timer for the next exercise.
Over the past couple days I've felt quite a bit of tension at the top of my head while doing the exercises. I'm not sure if this is an energy build up or if this some part of my mind resisting the process. Maybe I am not relaxing enough beforehand, I'm not too sure.
One benefit to losing focus and going into a day dream while I meditate is that I've become much more aware of the "snap-back" feeling you get when you "wake up". It literally feels like you're falling or snapping back into your body. If you've ever had a dream where you're falling and then wake up you'll know what I'm talking about. The astral projection model/theory would suggest that it actually IS your subtle/energy body snapping back into alignment with your physical body.
In any case, becoming more aware of the subtle changes that occur between the awake/dreaming state is probably pretty key to becoming successful at OBE.
OBE/Astral Projection Trial Day 45
I've finished reading the Afterlife Knowledge Guidebook as well as The Secret of the Soul. The Afterlife Knowledge Guidebook is absolutely fantastic and I am starting to incorporate its exercises into my daily practice. I'll be writing about my experiences with it as well.
I flipped through The Secret of the Soul as the writing didn't appeal to me that much, much of it was testimonials about things I already knew about or concepts that seemed more rudimentary than Monroe's Focus Level system. I've also been casually reading about traditional yoga (not the physical exercise), Thomas Campbell's online material, as well as the posts made by Frank Kepple on the subject of phasing.
Today's main OBE exit technique was to imagine climbing a rope downards. While doing this I felt intense pressure on top of head, like a vice, which later moved down to my third eye and then stayed there. Pressure stopped as soon as I stopped the exercise, although a mild throbbing was felt afterward. This pressure was very intense and made it quite difficult to focus on climbing down the rope.
The pressure was a downward pressure, almost as if my the act of imagining the downward climbing was pulling my etheric body. But for some reason I guess it didn't want to let go... I also think I started to feel my heart chakra flutter but my excitement and awareness of it quickly made it stop.
OBE/Astral Projection Trial Day 51
So about a week has gone by with trying OBE exit techniques, and I am making progress. It seems like there won't be any major changes to the day by day practice according to Mastering Astral Projection. The only thing that changes is a different exit technique to try every couple of days.
Fundamentally though, all the exit techniques are pretty much the same. The basic idea is to focus your awareness to a point in space outside your body. My favorite so far has been the basic rope technique, where you imagine yourself climbing a rope upwards from your body.
A major roadblock I've hit is that I have a hard time keeping my mind focused on climbing the rope for more than maybe 30 seconds. I'm getting better at catching myself wandering with my thoughts, but sometimes it really surprises me. One minute I'll be practicing my exit technique, and the next minute I'll realize that I had been daydreaming and I don't even realize how I lost track/focus.
On the other hand, I'm starting to notice a distinction between some of the daydreams. Some of them are clearly my own subconscious mind worrying about various aspects of my life (the ego, I guess). However, others can be rather – weird. I'll sometimes "see" people I've never met before quite clearly, in a situation that seems beyond what my own mind could come up with. Maybe they're just symbolism/metaphors created by my own mind, but they seem so random and out of place. If you are familiar with the perceiver/interpreter concept by Bruce Moen, then I think I may be getting better at non-physical perception without letting my interpreter run away with the thought (which I have noticed as well).
One time while I was meditating and realized I had lost focus, I actually saw (not visualized) myself go through a dark tunnel (1st person viewpoint) when I regained awareness. That was pretty cool, but also VERY subtle and easy to miss/forget. I really had to stop for a moment and think: "Holy crap, what was that? REMEMBER this Mike..." because I find a lot of my "daydreams" while meditating are not actively stored by my memory – they slip away quite quickly.
Depending on your definition of OBE some of you might say I've already been successful by the experiences I've just mentioned, and my lucid dream in the past. Through my readings I've discovered just how broad "out-of-body" really is. The classic floating above your physical body in the real-time zone is actually only a VERY small subset of the continuum of consciousness. I'm very interested in exploring all of this quite a bit further.
In my search to improve the focus of my mind and self awareness I've stumbled across traditional Yoga. I'm not talking about the physical fitness program you see in the West, but the original and true Yoga. The Yogis figured all of this consciousness "stuff" out (including OBE and more) thousands of years ago! One particular site I like is SwamiJ.com, because it has a huge wealth of free knowledge on this topic.
In MAP, there are optional exercises in the 90 day program. I've substituted some of those for exercises I feel would be more beneficial to me, based on what I've learned from other authors. I've been listening to a Hemi-Sync track once a day, which I absolutely love. I try to be as present and aware as possible throughout the regular happenings of my day, and I've extended the time I practice mind taming each day. I usually do breath awareness for mind taming, but I've recently been experimenting with repeating a mantra.
I've been noticing a gradual shift in my overall world view as well. I find myself becoming less materialistic, or at least am noticing just how materialistic the culture is where I live. There just isn't any balance, mostly everything is about exterior facets of life with very little emphasis on the interior. But it's the interior that actually matters, because everything else is just temporary.
I think that if more people realized that consciousness is eternal and that the whole point is to have it evolve and grow in knowledge, then there wouldn't be so much focus on materialism and so many of our problems would go away.
Heh, sorry for getting a little carried away there. ;)
QuoteHeh, sorry for getting a little carried away there.
That doesn't matter. 8-) You're a good writer and I like reading your journal.
I look out for the moment that you have your first OBE! :-)
OBE/Astral Projection Trial Day 56
So another week has gone by with what I think has been steady progress. No OBE yet but that's ok, I have a ways to go yet!
My third eye chakra has been feeling quite active lately, especially when I do any sort of meditation, body awareness, deep thought, or energy work. It basically feels like a throbbing, with the intensity being different depending on what I'm doing. Sometimes the throbbing can be quite intense when I'm working on an exit technique.
Generally, I've felt a tightness in upper body during exit techniques. At first it was mostly my head that would feel like it was getting "pulled", but now it's mostly my chest/heart. It's like I'm trying to pull away but my physical body is holding on too tightly. I sometimes have my inner voice telling me it's not possible.. right when I'm about to do it! This is counter-productive and something that needs to be worked on. I have to believe I can do it before I will ever let myself let it happen.
I have now jury rigged a headset with Audacity recording my voice. I'm finding that I get a lot of random imagery when I'm in a deep meditative state, so I'd like to record some of it with my voice when it happens, otherwise the memory is lost quite quickly. Stopping the meditative state and writing it down just isn't practical. Perhaps I can figure out some sort of pattern or meaning to what I'm seeing if I analyze enough of it.
I now regularly feel falling sensations when I sometimes go too deep in the trance state and regain awareness, which is sort of a "mini-obe". Learning to just relax and let go of any expectations seems to provide the best results. I could have swore I felt one of my "astral" fingers move inadvertently on two separate occasions, which shows that I'm starting to have my energy body loosen up.
Other interesting occurrences include my guides thwacking me on the back of the head when I asked if they were around, haha. Also, during one session I am pretty sure I experienced a very weak form of astral sight because I was able to see my arms and legs with my eyes closed. There wasn't any spectacular detail, just shiny blue lights among the blackness that took the shape of where I would have expected my legs and arms to be.
My dream awareness has not improved all that much lately, as it just hasn't been on my mind as much. There's been a slow but steady improvement in my dream recall, but it really depends on the quality and quantity of sleep I get that night.
OBE/Astral Projection Trial Day 64
Life did a good job at kicking my pants this week. I really had to push hard to find times to sit down and do the exercises, and it was usually not the optimal place or time. Today being the weekend I was able to get a great session in and still found that I had made progress throughout the week!
It's pretty amazing at just how deep meditation can get, and I know I'm still only scratching the surface. I'm finding it easier to get into a trance state, and it also happens more quickly and at a deeper level. All it takes is steady practice.
I would say my main trouble right now is relaxing too much and going off into dream imagery too easily. Once I get too deep into it I find it hard to focus my mind on anything for particularly long, which includes any sort of OBE exit technique.
In some ways I'm sort of feeling a fork in the road between meditation and OBE's. It's almost as if I'm at a level where the two are becoming mutually exclusive. In other words, when I meditate too deeply I can't focus on doing an exit technique... or if I focus on an exit technique my body/mind tenses and resists it to the point where I can not keep a focused mind either. Perhaps it's just a lack of focus on either side. In MAP, Robert Bruce says OBE exit work is a very fine balancing act and I am really starting to see that.
I just thought of another way of looking at it. When I meditate it's like I'm focusing into my consciousness, while an OBE exit technique requires focusing outside my physical body. Both techniques require focus, and either way leads to the same result – disassociation between mind and body. Which means understanding that I am more than my physical body, i.e. that my mind is not my brain. And that is the whole point of this 90 day trial.
Right now I just seem to be feeling much more success and progress with focusing inwards, rather than outward. I haven't had any mind-blowing experiences such as floating over my own physical body, but my belief systems have been slowly chipped away with unusual experiences. My body seems to resist any sort of external focus, and absolutely loves focusing inward. Perhaps yogic meditation or Robert Monroe's Phasing/Focus Level system is a better path for me than the classic OBE techniques?
One example from today happened while I was meditating. I lost focus for a period of time and started seeing dream imagery, but then quickly realized that this had happened and regained awareness. I came back to staring at the back of my eye-lids, but for a second or so I saw a very distinct dark form stand out from the backdrop. It was extremely unusual from what I normally see with closed eyes, and it kind of felt like a presence. That is a very exciting thought.
A question I have for people is should I be encouraging the dream imagery while meditating or should I be resisting it? I can see benefits to either strategy. I know that Bruce Moen talks about balancing between the perceiver and interpreter; he thinks that cutting out all non-physical perception is a mistake. Perhaps I should practice his strategy of slowing the image process down.
Frank said something about projecting into yourself can lead to an OBE. Not exactly sure what he said or where i read it (except on this forum). But perhaps you can lay aside the exit techniques and only try to focus into your consciousness.
Don't know about your dream imagery question.
Thanks WASD, I will likely focus on that entirely after the 90 day trial.
OBE/Astral Projection Trial Day 69
I had a very interesting experience last night, at around 4 am. I had woken up from a dream but had not opened my eyes yet, and I felt a distinct presence in my bedroom. I used to be skeptical of the idea that we can detect "presences" without using our 5 physical senses, but I definitely FELT something/someone close to me.
So I naturally decided to open my eyes. I wasn't fully awake yet and the room was fairly dark, but I saw a human-like form or figure approach me at the side of my bed. I became a little scared but then my vision blanked out and I felt like it merged with me. How do I even begin to describe what that feels like? I just knew it at the time. The typical OBE sensations of vibrations, tingling, whooshing noises were there. I also briefly saw some random colors/patterns and felt some pressure in my head. I was so confused as to what was going on I thought to myself "WTF... am I being possessed?". It happened very quickly.
I regained my vision and apart from the tingling/buzzing I felt relatively normal for maybe a second. I then saw ANOTHER form/figure, but it was more of a diffused sphere this time. It approached me hovering over the foot of my bed, and then merged with me as well. The tingling/buzzing/whooshing happened again with a loss of vision and head pressure. After a second or two (I think) I regained my vision and the tingling/buzzing reduced in intensity. I mentally said "Hello?" still wondering what was going on, but didn't get much of an answer (I might have heard myself say "hi" but I might just be making it up in my head). I then began to realize what had happened and decided to see if I could go for a conscious OBE exit.
The trouble was I was so scared/excited that I wasn't able to focus and just decided to log it in my notebook and stay awake for a while to solidify the memory. It's a good thing too because I know that if this had happened before I learned about OBE's I probably would have brushed it off as a dream, forgotten about it, or whatever. Maybe it has happened in the past and I know even know, I'm guessing it probably has. Even now as I write this I can hardly believe it happened.
It's possible that the affirmation I used before going to sleep may have played a role. This week's affirmation in MAP for evenings is related to waking up in the middle of the night for astral projection. I think it's pretty clear to me now that the forms were two of my energy bodies, like the etheric (real-time zone) and astral. You guys can correct me if I'm wrong though.
If only I had waken up during the beginning of the projection instead of the end! Oh well, this experience was still huge for me. I think it has tremendously helped at chipping away my old belief systems.
I also now see much more validity to Robert Bruce's AP model (mind-split effect, energy doubles, etc.). It's just a matter of focusing my conscious awareness in those other bodies. I still don't quite understand how all of Robert Bruce's model fits in with Robert Monroe's focus levels, but I do feel like they're both "right".
If you haven't read it, get a copy of Adventures Out of the Body - William Buhlman.
Personally, I think its better than Astral Dynamics / MAP for practical advice. AD makes the whole thing seem harder than it actually is, which can create mental blocks. 90-days I think is seriously dragging the process out. I think its all good experience of course, but it doesnt need to be such a long drawn process to get out of body. If you think it will take ages, it will.
Quote from: michaelsaganski on May 20, 2010, 13:27:04
I also now see much more validity to Robert Bruce's AP model (mind-split effect, energy doubles, etc.). It's just a matter of focusing my conscious awareness in those other bodies. I still don't quite understand how all of Robert Bruce's model fits in with Robert Monroe's focus levels, but I do feel like they're both "right".
They are two different approachs on the same thing. The RB (sarcasm naturally, let's really say the Golden Dawn and esoteric approach in general) uses the approach of transferring the consciousness in "other" bodies. These bodies are created in other planes, so the exercise of transferring the consciousness in them actually switches the focus in those other planes (that can be the astral or etheric, RB usually only approaches the etheric plane).
The RM method does the same, only without the "bodies". The consciousness is transferred "inward" in other planes in the same way. It is only that the experience of another "body" to bring the consciousness in is not created at first.
Both have advantages and disavantages. The RM (and FK) phasing approach is naturally much easier for beginners. The advantage of the esoteric method is that the creation of the "other" body acutally creates a perfect memory of the "other" body in the other planes, and this can have distinct impact in the experience. Another advantage is that the switch of consciousness after intensive training becomes automatic when the intent to transfer the consciousness in the "other" body is formulated.
The problem of the Robert Bruce approach on the esoteric method is that he doesn't actually explain how this "other" body is really created. Reality is that memory create "forms" in other planes. But without a real approach on creating this "other" body its existence is not easily felt.
If you really want to follow the esoteric approach I suggest you to follow the discipline of the creation of the Body of Light given in the Theoricus grade (2 = 9) of the Golden Dawn (you find it in http://www.scribd.com/doc/17856343/Golden-Dawn-29-Creation-and-Development-of-the-Body-of-Light a bit adulterated, but anyway fine). There you will find the way the feeling of the "other" body is created in the other plane. With it the transfer of consciousness is much easier and the experience of much more impact than how RB explains it. Robert tried to do the same (in a much smaller scale) with its "awareness hands" that actually creates only a part of the body to be felt clearly, but it's naturally NOT the same thing.
Sure, it requires a lot of work, but remember, this "preliminary" work is actually much more imporant than the "method" of exit in itself, for various motives.
Selea.
That's a pretty good description Selea, thanks.
AstralBeginnings, I agree with your the RB can make things seem more complicated than they need to be. That's why I'm finding myself pull away from his ideas over these 90 days and am finding myself align more with the phasing approach.
There's so many view points, techniques, and methods with this. To each his own. The most important thing is patience, persistence, and practice.
The light at the end of the tunnel for this 90-day trial is arriving, and with it many mixed feelings. While I haven't had a classic-OBE yet, I've definitely experienced many paranormal events. I've had much better results with focusing on meditation rather than any sort of complicated exit technique, so I will definitely be taking a different approach after the 90 days are up. This trial has opened up a whole new world for me to explore, which is amazing in itself.
With summer starting over the past couple of weeks I'd be lying if I said I was able to do all of the exercises in a strict fashion each day. My daily schedule is quite a bit busier when it gets nice outside, so I've had to fit in what I can here and there. This is probably slowing down my progress but balance in life is important too.
I'm signing up for the Gateway Voyage program at The Monroe Institute in August, which I'm really excited for. I hope to make some additional breakthroughs and speed up my progress there. I'll be sure to post about my experiences here.
Right now, I can fairly easily get visions/dreams in the astral while meditating. I don't have much control over what I see yet, but it is a start. I seem to lose some of my self-awareness while the visions come, which makes it seem more dream-like... but I'm still somewhat aware of my physical body too. I want to continue with this and see if I can gain more control over what I experience. Being able to clear my surface thoughts has become easier with practice, which I think is what quickly leads to the imagery.
The exercises and writings in MAP haven't had any sort of drastic changes as it did during the first 45 days or so. Robert Bruce discusses some of the finer points and possible problems or experiences that you may encounter, which are nice validations for what I've been experiencing or having problems with. It just feels like the exit techniques he recommends undo all the energy and meditation work I do during each practice session, so it almost feels detrimental to what I'm trying to achieve. I'm not sure if that's how it's supposed to be or if I'm doing something wrong, or if his methodology isn't the right one for me.
Michael,
As a projectionist since the last 20+ years now three months of producing the OBE is a excellent goal, but please realize that it never ends. It is a always on-going training, never let up and provide yourself with goals and what you want to succeed.
I commend you for your day to day blog and you are going far - so keep up the good work, don't stop where your at. Importantly, keep in mind to focus on one goal when trying to project out there. It can be as simple turning on a light on/off or just simple flying in the astral. Don't inundate yourself - just keep it simple and lite when reaching that state. Too many people have a difficult time projecting because they want the world at first, that is very unrealistic way to go about it. I know you heard before the saying "learn how to crawl before you can run" - same applies. I would seriously look at one goal to achieve and you will succeed at leaving the body. Make very sure you start statisically writing everything down so you can see what works and what doesn't.
You are welcome'd to my web site www.invisiblelight.us which you can review 20+ years worth of data, radio show interviews, videos, journal notes, you name it..
Keep it up and train for the olympics.
Dave
I would like to mention some important things that could help you archive the OBE.
1. Diet is very important. and OBE requires a lot of etheric energy in your body and a calm mind.
You can gain the energy by eating fruits which are rich in it, such as pineapple and especially mango. Avoid things like coca-cola and meat as these will drain energy.
2. Avoid eating anything meat for a calm mind. This is the most underestimated practice. Every animal has emotions, as most farm animals are grown in crowded farms, their emotions won't be too good. Emotional energy penetrates every cell of the body, and as we know energy cannot be destroyed, thus when you eat meat animal emotions pollute your body, causing you to react to the sensations you get during OBE and ending the experience prematurely.
3. Meditation is not enough, you have to practice visualization. This is the most important part, meditation will relax your mind and energy, but visualizations will prepare the mind for the work required during OBE. Visualizations should be done before you go to try to OBE, and preferably in a seating position. An advanced occultist shared with me how to do it:
1. Shake your arms, Stretch them and your legs so that you are entirely
comfortable
2. Find a comfortable position for sitting straight, both feet on the floor. You can
also cross your legs if you want if you prefer the lotus position.
3. Try to rest your palms upward e.g. on the knee.
4. Concentrate on your breathing until you have calmed down.
5. Listen to your heartbeat to release stress and worries.
6. Feel the Aura, the energy that surrounds you.
7. Breathe in this energy.
8. Imagine you are in a garden, full of flowers and plants. Everything is filled
with light and it is warm. In the middle of the garden, you see a table and a
chair.
9. Go to the chair, sit down and observe your surrounding.
10. Do you hear birds, the wind? Do you smell the air? Do you feel the light?
Concentrate on this garden for a while and visualize until it feels real. Stay for
a moment.
11. Then, stand up, go the way back where you come from
12. Concentrate on your aura
13. Listen to your heartbeat.
14. Concentrate on your breathing
15. Then slowly open your eyes
Quote from: ice_chill on June 02, 2010, 08:50:02
I would like to mention some important things that could help you archive the OBE.
1. Diet is very important. and OBE requires a lot of etheric energy in your body and a calm mind.
You can gain the energy by eating fruits which are rich in it, such as pineapple and especially mango. Avoid things like coca-cola and meat as these will drain energy.
2. Avoid eating anything meat for a calm mind. This is the most underestimated practice. Every animal has emotions, as most farm animals are grown in crowded farms, their emotions won't be too good. Emotional energy penetrates every cell of the body, and as we know energy cannot be destroyed, thus when you eat meat animal emotions pollute your body, causing you to react to the sensations you get during OBE and ending the experience prematurely.
Hi ice_chill!
Welcome to the forums! :)
I'll start this off quickly by saying that I do respect your belief and opinions regarding this... and I'll just post my point of view regarding your first two bullet points.
I'll say that both of those two points are choices you've made in *your* lifestyle regarding your OBE/AP practice...
I believe they really have very little (or anything at all really) to do with successfully projecting.
Basically, what I want to say is that I'm probably the exact opposite in diet from you... and I project just fine and have lots of energy.
MY experience denotes that diet is meaningless and it's the INDIVIDUAL himself, not what they put in their stomach, that determines viability to OBE.
My belief is that if you can dream, you can project.
PS (we'll move this into a different thread if need be... since it's really off topic from Michael's blog)
~Ryan :)
ice_chill, I currently eat meat quite regularly and have heard this argument before. I'm still undecided, as this would be a very big lifestyle change for me. My diet is ok, I eat a lot of good food during my regular meals but I also eat a lot of junk food snacks, and drink the occasional bit of alcohol. A lot of very spiritually evolved people I know don't eat meat, so I feel like there is something to it. I can see a lot of very good reasons for not eating meat, but I'm just not at a point to make that kind of change. Internally, I have a lot of mixed feelings about vegetarianism.
Xanth, Robert Bruce talks about fasting in MAP as a way to improve success at AP because digestion takes a lot of energy. As an extension, eating heavier and denser food like meat takes more energy to digest. So I can see some merit to this, but I don't think it's required obviously. Bruce Moen also talks about this in "Voyages Beyond Doubt".
As for visualization, I do practice this a little each day during my meditation session to get into a trance state. Generally I pick some sort of visualization where I'm falling, like going down in an elevator. It seems to help.
hehe He certainly does.
But then, I whole-heartedly disagree with a lot of things Robert Bruce suggests and preaches. :)
~Ryan
Quote from: Xanth on June 02, 2010, 18:24:32
hehe He certainly does.
But then, I whole-heartedly disagree with a lot of things Robert Bruce suggests and preaches. :)
~Ryan
I disagree with some stuff that pretty much everyone says.. even Frank! *dun dun dun*, to me it's all about picking what resonates and adding it your "beliefs". I do have to say though, a lot of what he says does resonate.
I totally agree with Yin. Listen to everyone and take what YOU like into YOUR beliefs!
Quote from: ice_chill on June 02, 2010, 08:50:02
3. Meditation is not enough, you have to practice visualization. This is the most important part, meditation will relax your mind and energy, but visualizations will prepare the mind for the work required during OBE. Visualizations should be done before you go to try to OBE, and preferably in a seating position. An advanced occultist shared with me how to do it:
While visualization is an important skill to acquire (if you can come to a point of "seeing" an image as with open eyes then projection is easy, you just need to "merge" with the image) your particular example leaves a lot to be desired. Advanced occultist? You must be kidding, really. That is clearly from a Wicca (or it is a meditation on the alchemical plane, a thing a beginner should NEVER begin from), and it shows. Much better if you have to start somewhere is the Middle Pillar and the LBRP (but RB energizing of chakras do enough at beginning). That visualization is only a new-age gibberish (if it is an alchemical pathworking it is badly done). Apart maybe bring you to the mood it hasn't any sort of really interesting factor, nor from an esoteric and neither from a purely practical POW.
For the rest of the points I can only tell you this: diet an meat can really produce different results when high in Pranayama (breath control). For projection the impact is minimal.
Quote from: michaelsaganski on May 30, 2010, 14:39:09
It just feels like the exit techniques he recommends undo all the energy and meditation work I do during each practice session, so it almost feels detrimental to what I'm trying to achieve. I'm not sure if that's how it's supposed to be or if I'm doing something wrong, or if his methodology isn't the right one for me.
If I understand what is happening to you correctly when you try exit techniques given by Robert it is as if you actually "bring yourself more to the surface", i.e. the technique seems more "external" than the meditation you are doing. Correct me if I'm wrong (it's difficult to understand these things via writing).
If that's the case, yes, you are doing something wrong. Try to keep the silenced, inward feeling you have when you meditate while doing the exit techniques. Don't let you "raise up" from that feeling. I say "raise" because it actually feels as if you are "stepping up" from a more internalized status.
Probably when you do exit techniques you associate the effort with the physical body without understanding it, sort of like moving the lips while reading. This is often the case at beginning, especially when exists a strong feeling (many times not conscious) that the self is intimately associated with the body, and especially with seemingly "physical" efforts techniques (as it is point-shift or rope). Mantras helps a lot in this case, as going high in Pranayama. Also, if problems of these sorts persists, do some of the exercises in the writing I told you, specifically trying to "feel" the "astral" body arms and legs moving while keeping still the physical body, they helps a lot to disassociate the two when you do those techniques.
Remember that also if you think that you are better doing something else that it's closer to your nature, it is actually a very good thing that you are confronting yourself with these troubles. They are extremely useful to overcome or you will never be able to produce a full awareness of the "other" body and it will always be a little intermingled with the physical. So, redouble your efforts, and also if you think that what you are doing is not close to your nature, do it with all your will just for that. It will be of immense help for you in future (and also in what you are trying to achieve).
I thought it might be fun to try to do the 90 day guide again.
but alas, i lack the motivation to stick to it. i got through day 1 and quit. lol :lol:
If you decide you want to try again I'll be happy to assist provided you stick to it.
Quote from: Selea on June 06, 2010, 06:25:03
If I understand what is happening to you correctly when you try exit techniques given by Robert it is as if you actually "bring yourself more to the surface", i.e. the technique seems more "external" than the meditation you are doing. Correct me if I'm wrong (it's difficult to understand these things via writing).
If that's the case, yes, you are doing something wrong. Try to keep the silenced, inward feeling you have when you meditate while doing the exit techniques. Don't let you "raise up" from that feeling. I say "raise" because it actually feels as if you are "stepping up" from a more internalized status.
Probably when you do exit techniques you associate the effort with the physical body without understanding it, sort of like moving the lips while reading. This is often the case at beginning, especially when exists a strong feeling (many times not conscious) that the self is intimately associated with the body, and especially with seemingly "physical" efforts techniques (as it is point-shift or rope). Mantras helps a lot in this case, as going high in Pranayama. Also, if problems of these sorts persists, do some of the exercises in the writing I told you, specifically trying to "feel" the "astral" body arms and legs moving while keeping still the physical body, they helps a lot to disassociate the two when you do those techniques.
Remember that also if you think that you are better doing something else that it's closer to your nature, it is actually a very good thing that you are confronting yourself with these troubles. They are extremely useful to overcome or you will never be able to produce a full awareness of the "other" body and it will always be a little intermingled with the physical. So, redouble your efforts, and also if you think that what you are doing is not close to your nature, do it with all your will just for that. It will be of immense help for you in future (and also in what you are trying to achieve).
Yes that's exactly it! The exercises (the way I do them anyways) end up bringing my awareness back in tune with my physical body. What I understand from what you're saying is that I should be able to keep going "inward" in my meditative state while also trying to separate from my physical body.
Some of what you say is a little beyond me at this point. The "writings" you refer to is the Golden Dawn link you sent me before?
I'll work on bringing the two together.
Quote from: personalreality on June 06, 2010, 12:26:25
I thought it might be fun to try to do the 90 day guide again.
but alas, i lack the motivation to stick to it. i got through day 1 and quit. lol :lol:
I know what you mean. I bought MAP and was excited to try. But I personally cannot motivate myself to stick to it for 90 days. I also feel that everything in the book could be done in 30 days. In one way, I like that RB has slowed it down to allow people more time, but on the same note, it actually feels like he is dragging it out. Whether or not an OBE happens using his methods in 90 days or even a year is irrelevant as this will depend largely on the person, the point for me is that the whole process seems drawn out too much.
Quote from: AstralBeginnings on June 06, 2010, 23:08:44
I know what you mean. I bought MAP and was excited to try. But I personally cannot motivate myself to stick to it for 90 days. I also feel that everything in the book could be done in 30 days. In one way, I like that RB has slowed it down to allow people more time, but on the same note, it actually feels like he is dragging it out. Whether or not an OBE happens using his methods in 90 days or even a year is irrelevant as this will depend largely on the person, the point for me is that the whole process seems drawn out too much.
It is a bit, I agree. But on the other hand I adore it because if you just drop all the pre-analysis and just go for it... then you'll be making progress. For me I didn't really know what to do because there's so many different guru's/protocols/aspects to this stuff. I just wanted a blueprint that I could read, practice and just see what happens! The 90 days is really more of a way to help build up a habit of a spiritual practice. It's not like you'll stop doing the exercises after the 90 days... or even 30 if you meet early success.
Quote from: michaelsaganski on June 06, 2010, 20:17:41
Yes that's exactly it! The exercises (the way I do them anyways) end up bringing my awareness back in tune with my physical body.
The act of fully transferring the consciousness in the "other" body is a personal mental trick that for some people (usually accustomed to long years of meditation, above all on mantra and pranayama work, or for precedent achievements) comes natural an easy, while for some other (the majority of people) is a lot of pain. What happens is that when you think about your self you usually tie it with your physical body, so when you try to do something resembling "physical" activity mentally you tend to think of your physical.
Since working on mantras or pranayama will require months of practice before you can clearly understand that You is not really your physical body, I suggest you to do a thing that always work at beginning. When you do the techniques do them while watching yourself doing them. If you consider closely what you do when you daydream you will see for example that when you do something "physical" there you always "see" yourself doing acts, either if it's you doing them. This is what you must do. The "you" that you see doing the actions doesn't need (and on the contrary is worser at beginning) to be detailed; a silhouette is all that you need. The most important part is "feeling" that you are doing the action while you watch "you" doing them.
When you are proficient on doing the actions watching yourself doing them then work on merging with the "figure". Do it in steps. While it can seems complicate to describe in practice it's quite easy. Just for example now bring to memory you doing an action. You will see that you can actually see your body doing it while you do the same. This is what you must do at beginning. When you can do this easily, then put yourself inside the "you" (the figure) doing the actions and do them in first person. If your concentration and willpower are good you will either find, to your surprise, that after some attempts you'll be in the figure automatically at a point, doing the actions in first person.
You will see that looking at yourself doing the actions will not bring you out of your meditative state. Persist on doing this and one day you will be able to act in that "other" body indipendently and slip in it as you can wear a dress. When you will be able to do this you will not need any "technique" at all (the techniques are used only as a mental "spring" to put your consciousness in the "other" body, simulating actions mentally transfer slowly the consciousness to it). For this I said to you that also if you think that this way of doing it doesn't pertain to your nature, it is very good training: actually is one of (if not) the best.
The most complete thing you can do in that "other" body as a training to fully transfer the consciousness to it, at beginning, it is the Lesser Banishing Ritual of the Pentagram. The beauty of this ritual when done in that "other" body is that it requires you to make the "other" body turn around (the most delicate and powerful step to transfer consciousness happens when you turn 180 or 270 degrees, from your physical position, in the "other" body), do gestures etc. This is a great tool if used well and constantly.
Quote from: michaelsaganski on June 06, 2010, 20:17:41
What I understand from what you're saying is that I should be able to keep going "inward" in my meditative state while also trying to separate from my physical body.
Yes, you should keep the meditative state while doing the action. As I've explained just now however it is too difficult for the majority of people mentally doing physical actions in first person without merging them with the physical body, they have to work on steps. Do what I said and you should have no problems after a while.
Quote from: michaelsaganski on June 06, 2010, 20:17:41
Some of what you say is a little beyond me at this point. The "writings" you refer to is the Golden Dawn link you sent me before?
I'll work on bringing the two together.
Yes, I was referring to them. Those instructions do just what I said. They actually make you split your etheric from your physical body so that you can do things in one without confusion it with the other. However doing the LBRP in the "other" body is the best way of bringing consciousness to it, in my experience.
Best regards,
Selea
So Selea, if I understand correctly, this is what you want me to do:
Instead of visualizing/feeling myself climb the rope in the first person, visualize/feel it in the third person. This will help keep me in a meditative state because I won't associate the feeling with my physical body as much. Then once I am accustomed to that I will eventually be able to "slip" my consciousness into it.
Quote from: michaelsaganski on June 07, 2010, 10:10:42
So Selea, if I understand correctly, this is what you want me to do:
Instead of visualizing/feeling myself climb the rope in the first person, visualize/feel it in the third person. This will help keep me in a meditative state because I won't associate the feeling with my physical body as much. Then once I am accustomed to that I will eventually be able to "slip" my consciousness into it.
That, is the very act of phasing. :)
~Ryan
Quote from: michaelsaganski on June 07, 2010, 10:10:42
So Selea, if I understand correctly, this is what you want me to do:
Instead of visualizing/feeling myself climb the rope in the first person, visualize/feel it in the third person. This will help keep me in a meditative state because I won't associate the feeling with my physical body as much. Then once I am accustomed to that I will eventually be able to "slip" my consciousness into it.
Yes, exactly.
Btw, I have asked if I could give you a particular technique very effective that we use with beginners. It has been told me that there are no problems, so I will share this with you. For what I know this is one of the most powerful methods to make a person "feel" the "Body of Light".
Begin relaxing as you do normally, and focus your mind (we do this with the fourfould breath, but you can do it the way you want, just try to have the less internal chatter as possible).
Focus now on a ball of light 5-6 cm. above your head. With each inalation, bring the light in your head (so that all your head is filled with light), keep it there while you hold your breath, and finally imagine it becoming brighter as you exhale. Keep pulling more light down into yourself until all your body is filled with light. At the end you should have a "Body of Light" around your physical body (if you do the exercise well you can will "see" the body clearly in the end). Do this step slowly. At first it takes at least 30 minutes to do the circuit fully, but when you will be proficient with it you could do it fast, the will alone will suffice to call up the Body of Light immediately. Don't skip this step, it is very important, do it throughly and slowly.
The next step is to feel this Body of Light to expand with each inhalation and contract with each exhalation. This sensation, once achieved, will help you become aware of this "other" body in a very particular way. It will begin to take on a physical, fluid-like existence. Performing this part will, in fact, solidify the Body of Light. The act of keeping mental constructs in motion is one of the most powerfuls in all magical practices (keep this in mind also for future practices).
When you actually feel as if you are surrounded by a "second skin" you will have succeeded. If you want then you can try to transfer the consciousness to this "other" body. With the "feel" you have it will be much easier than before.
This exercise is very powerful. Also if you don't succeed at the first attempts you will be able to begin perceiving also at the start how the "astral" body feels, so that you will be more able in future to bring up its memory to transfer the consciousness in it. Everytime you do it the sensation of the "other" body will arise, until it will look to you as "real" as the physical body. Transfering the consciousness then will be only a matter of experimentation on what works best for you.
I gave you this exercise because you, as all beginners, have problems on knowing what the "other" body feels like, so it is very difficult to transfer the consciousness on something you don't neither know what it feels like. The only parameter you have is the physical body, so it is clear that if you try to "feel" another body you will try to simulate the physical. This, however, will obviously keep your consciousness in this plane. A thought-form (as the astral body) has a definite "sensation" that only those that have succeeded in "leaving the physical" know and have memory of (less with those that utilize dream methods, but a little knowledge it is still there). When you will know a bit the feeling all you will have to do will be to "see" a figure resembling yourself in front of you and utilize that "feeling" to feel yourself inside the figure. The transfer of consciousness then becomes much much easier. When you have understood how the "other" body feels like there's no need to utilize the technique no more since it is a bit awkward for projection only.
Best regards,
Selea.
Quote from: Selea on June 07, 2010, 13:02:36
Yes, exactly.
Btw, I have asked if I could give you a particular technique very effective that we use. It has been told me that there are no problems, so I will share this with you. For what I know this is one of the most powerful methods to awaken the "Body of Light".
Begin relaxing as you do normally, and focus your mind (we do this with the fourfould breath, but you can do it the way you want, just try to have the less internal chatter as possible).
Focus now on a ball of light 5-6 cm. above your head. With each inalation, bring the light in your head (so that all your head is filled with light), keep it there while you hold your breath, and finally imagine it becoming brighter as you exhale. Keep pulling more light down into yourself until all your body is filled with light. At the end you should have a "Body of Light" around your physical body (if you do the exercise well you can will "see" the body clearly in the end). Do this step slowly. At first it takes at least 30 minutes to do the circuit fully, but when you will be proficient with it you could do it fast, the will alone will suffice to call up the Body of Light immediately. Don't skip this step, it is very important, do it throughly and slowly.
The next step is to feel this Body of Light to expand with each inhalation and contract with each exhalation. This sensation, once achieved, will help you become aware of this "other" body in a very particular way. It will begin to take on a physical, fluid-like existence. Performing this part will, in fact, solidify the Body of Light. The act of keeping mental constructs in motion is one of the most powerfuls in all magical practices (keep this in mind also for future practices).
When you actually feel as if you are surrounded by a "second skin" pretend that your consciousness is no more controlling your physical body but this "other" one, look at one of your Body of Light arms and try to free it from its physical counterpart. Remember that you move the astral counterpart not with muscles, but with will. Just "will" to move the "astral" arm. When you can "feel" it (as we have done in the precedent step) it is much easier than it seems to.
Move it up to your face and try to move the fingers. Do this slowly. When you can do it then the transfer of consciousness is complete. Try to raise now with your Body of Light. You should have no problems.
This exercise is very powerful. Also if you don't succeed at the first attempts you will be able to clearly perceive how the "astral" body feels, so that you will be more able in future to bring up its memory to tranfer the consciousness in it. Everytime you do it the sensation of the "other" body will arise, until it will look to you as "real" as the physical body. Transfering the consciousness then will be only a matter of experimentation on what works best for you.
Best regards,
Selea.
Who is we? :)
And again, I assume you mean this should be visualized in the third person, not the first. Then at some point I should begin to feel the "second skin" (astral body) you mention.
Quote from: michaelsaganski on June 07, 2010, 13:19:33
Who is we? :)
And again, I assume you mean this should be visualized in the third person, not the first. Then at some point I should begin to feel the "second skin" (astral body) you mention.
Yes, to "see" something you have to do it externally, isn't it? :-)
Anyway I edited a bit the post, skip the part of using the technique for projection, it is best used only to "feel" the body for future reference (see the last paragraph I added.
As for the "we" is the magickal order I'm int, you curious boy ;-)
EDIT: Btw, if it is too difficult at first to expand and contract all the Body of Light, just focus on a point, for example the right hand, and become accustomed to the feeling there, then do the same and exand to all the body.
Quote from: Selea on June 07, 2010, 13:24:30
Yes, to "see" something you have to do it externally, isn't it? :-)
Yes and No. It's external but I could visualize a ball of light coming down into my field of view. Or I could visualize from a point outside the body, watching the ball of light enter the body. I believe you are saying the latter. At some point though I should go from looking at my astral body to actually feeling the sensations, even though the astral body is visualized externally.. it's still in my mind (thought-form) which is a part of me.
I've been doing all the exit techniques in the 1st person, that could have been a mistake as well. This whole 1st/3rd person thing has been a confusing point for me. This can get complicated! :)
Quote from: Selea on June 07, 2010, 13:24:30
Anyway I edited a bit the post, skip the part of using the technique for projection, it is best used only to "feel" the body for future reference (see the last paragraph I added.
As for the "we" is the magickal order I'm int, you curious boy ;-)
EDIT: Btw, if it is too difficult at first to expand and contract all the Body of Light, just focus on a point, for example the right hand, and become accustomed to the feeling there, then do the same and exand to all the body.
The notion of how something "feels" is something that Bruce Moen talks about a lot.
I am curious indeed. :) I've been looking for a support group to help me grow spiritually.
Quote from: michaelsaganski on June 07, 2010, 15:06:36
Yes and No. It's external but I could visualize a ball of light coming down into my field of view. Or I could visualize from a point outside the body, watching the ball of light enter the body. I believe you are saying the latter. At some point though I should go from looking at my astral body to actually feeling the sensations, even though the astral body is visualized externally.. it's still in my mind (thought-form) which is a part of me.
I've been doing all the exit techniques in the 1st person, that could have been a mistake as well. This whole 1st/3rd person thing has been a confusing point for me. This can get complicated! :)
I see. You are complicating too much things. Do the exercise as you want, the answer to how to do a thing is to just do it without thinking about what is right or wrong.
I talked to you about 3d view only because you have a problem with merging the physical with the mental. However the technique I've given you it's only to "feel" the astral body, so you can do it however you want.
What I've told you is NOT an imposition on how to do things, not the right way to do them. It is only a mean to become separating the physical from the non-physical at first. Don't become confused with it. I told you to watch yourself doing things while you do them because it's the most natural way to do it at first for the majority of people. As I said, try now for example to envision in your mind yourself doing whatever activity. You will see that you aren't doing them in first person, usually (consider this carefully, "see" what is the most natural way to do a physical action mentally, then do the same, this is in little words what I told you). You must go with the flow at beginning, after you modify the flow to what you want (or better the flow modifies by itself if you fully surrender to it). Remember that the subconscious opens only by love, the more you force the more you obtain the effect contrary. So, just as I said, the only right way to do a thing is just doing it.
Quote from: michaelsaganski on June 07, 2010, 15:06:36
The notion of how something "feels" is something that Bruce Moen talks about a lot.
Obvious. Experience is much more important than words. There are things that cannot be explained properly (or not at all) with language, the only way to understand is to experience them. Take for example the "feeling" of the "other" body. Would you be able to explain with words to someone what your own physical body feels like? The same is true for trying to transfer the consciousness in the "other" body. This, btw, it's one of the motives why many great authors talks very little about how it is done, they tell you what to do, but not how to do it or what you should "feel" or not. Words complicates instead of simplifing. The only way you can do it is to experience it for yourself so that you have a start point.
Quote from: michaelsaganski on June 07, 2010, 15:06:36
I am curious indeed. :) I've been looking for a support group to help me grow spiritually.
It's something that everybody in some way seeks, yet you are always alone in things that really counts. It is true that sharing experiences and having a teacher can help, but true work is done alone, never forget it. When I was very young I joined the OTO thinking that they would teach me everything and opens me the path. I didn't learn anything at all. I expected others to do work for me. The group I was with was just like me. We were young and totally deluded. It took a bit for me to understand it. Apart talking and acting as grandeur know-all (tooking others' words for granted) we didn't do anything at all, we just waited for something that never came.
You don't need nobody else but you and your experience until a point, the only motive why to join a "group" is for something that doesn't really pertain to teachings. In past years this was not the case because knowledge was transferred orally, but nowadays if you seek you will find easily. I tell you this because for many people a "teacher" or a "group" is only another excuse to don't do things. They pass from a cult to another at the first difficulty and you can see it also in AP. Many people begin a certain "way" to do it and then after only some tries they pass to another one, thinking that what they did was not "right". They just go on in circles and don't really do anything at all in the end. A real teacher is not one that really "teach" but someone that tells you go to on when everything seems to not work and that brings you down when you think you already know everything. Apart from this (and making you do things that are contrary to your nature to equilibrate you, apart some more advanced things as the current you are in that doesn't mean anything at all at beginning) believing in someone or something by itself (without knowing it for yourself) is the greater mistake you can do.
So, also if this seems a controsense, you can take as a teacher also somebody that doesn't know anything at all. What you need is only discipline and a regime, this is the most important part also if people think the contrary. Some of the best physical trainers are neither athletes for examples.
Ok, thanks for that Selea. :)
I do have the problem of over-thinking things. So I'll just keep practicing regularly.
OBE/Astral Projection Trial Day 90!
Well here it is... day 90! It's a little melodramatic because I haven't been following the program to a T the last few weeks. I'm also not going to be making any drastic adjustments now either; the 90 days has been an evolutionary process.
My practice has basically evolved into 2 meditation sessions: one in the morning, and the other in the evening. I avoid eating anything at least an hour before, as well as drinking anything other than water. I find a shower in the morning helps wake me up, otherwise I'm not awake enough yet and fall asleep too easily. I seem to get better results sitting up instead of lying down. I generally start off with some breathing exercises for relaxation, followed by some forms of energy work (body awareness). I then clear my mind with the use of a mantra, and may either stay with it or attempt an exit technique. If anyone wants more specifics feel free to ask me.
My sessions don't seem to be as productive as they were a few weeks ago either, I think I've hit a bit of a dip... which is natural from what I've heard from other people who meditate regularly. The important thing is to meditate through the slump, taking a few days off as a break just makes things worse. I've found some free local meditation classes which is helping me stay inspired and motivated. I've also officially registered for the Gateway Voyage at TMI in August, which I'm super excited for.
While I haven't had a full blown OBE yet, I'm not discouraged. In fact I now know that I have opened the door to a life-long spiritual practice for me that will only get better with time. Several of my core beliefs have been modified or rebuilt, and I feel like a different person from the inside. I also feel like I understand myself and my place "in the universe" a lot more, it's like I'm more self-aware of my thoughts, feelings, and motivations. I opened myself up to my intuition, which I've never done before... and am starting to identify the information I get from it instead of ignoring it.
One new abnormal event that's happened to me that hasn't been mentioned yet is I've experienced the ability of parallel thinking. That is, I've actually been able to think two thoughts at once while in a meditative state. It basically happened by accident, since I was actually trying to clear my mind but had lost my grip on the mantra. The thing is, my mantra was still going and yet I was also perceiving/interpreting images in my mind's eye. I then became self-aware of both my focus on the mantra as well as the interpretation of the images.. after a short while they both stopped as I broke both trains of thought.
As far as the actual OBE exit techniques, a problem with my process had been identified to me. The reason I wasn't liking the exit techniques and why they seemed to pull me out of the meditative state was because I had associated the technique with my physical body. As I would focus on the technique, my awareness of my physical body would increase. So instead of going deeper "inward", I was coming back "outward" to my body. I have to thank Selea for this. The solution to this appears to be focusing on visualization... associate the exit technique with a visualized body... not my own. Theoretically at some point I should be able to shift my point of consciousness into that imaginary thought-form by "feeling" for it. Wow.. that sounds vague to me even as I write it but at my current state of spiritual knowledge I believe it to be possible.
I also had a little bit of confusion with visualization because I thought it had to be in the 1st person.. but really 3rd person is ok and is actually more natural.
I'll continue to post my progress and any major trials/events. My ultimate goal has changed into more than just having an OBE, it's about evolving and understanding my consciousness as much as possible. The experiences I read about excite me to no end. Where this will go, I'm not sure yet. I'm playing with the idea of developing my psychic/intuitive powers to the point of being able to help others. I think that would be pretty cool.
Thanks for reading my posts and I give a special thanks to everyone that has provided feedback. It was of immense help to my progress.
Quote from: michaelsaganski on June 10, 2010, 18:02:38
My sessions don't seem to be as productive as they were a few weeks ago either, I think I've hit a bit of a dip... which is natural from what I've heard from other people who meditate regularly. The important thing is to meditate through the slump, taking a few days off as a break just makes things worse. I've found some free local meditation classes which is helping me stay inspired and motivated. I've also officially registered for the Gateway Voyage at TMI in August, which I'm super excited for.
This happens to everybody, don't worry. A problem that many people have when they first try to do OBEs without having done nothing (or almost) before and try to reach that goal is that they focus their mind on the wrong things. Don't worry about exiting, worry about the meditation, if you do it right and you learn how the meditate properly (having 100% concentration and losing really in what you are doing) exiting the body becomes a trivial task.
Usually a course of study is really necessary before being able to exit the body voluntarily. People that doesn't do this can still exit the body, but the results are random. This is for the motive that they didn't actually master the steps that bring about the practice. A musicist doesn't learn a piano concert at first, he exercise on single notes, then a group of them, and so on. He constructs a base of working that when acquired will enable him to do everything easily. This is the best way to approach these things.
I suggest you for example to take a look at Liber HHH part AAA of Crowley (google it). You will see that the meditation is closely related to the body. Now, also if it's not really an OBE meditation you can clearly understand that for a person that can do the same easily exiting the body is as easy as a child's play.
This is to say to you to focus primarly on the means, not the end, this last will come by itself.
Quote from: michaelsaganski on June 10, 2010, 18:02:38
One new abnormal event that's happened to me that hasn't been mentioned yet is I've experienced the ability of parallel thinking. That is, I've actually been able to think two thoughts at once while in a meditative state. It basically happened by accident, since I was actually trying to clear my mind but had lost my grip on the mantra. The thing is, my mantra was still going and yet I was also perceiving/interpreting images in my mind's eye. I then became self-aware of both my focus on the mantra as well as the interpretation of the images.. after a short while they both stopped as I broke both trains of thought.
This is normal. The first stage of a mantra requires all attention, and many exchange the first stage for the last, in fact. In the second the mantra continues almost by its own will and you can still think also if on a different level. The third stage is acquired when the mantra loses all its meaning but it still shields all thoughts. This part is when the mantra ceases to exist altogheter and the mind becomes totally blank.
Quote from: michaelsaganski on June 10, 2010, 18:02:38
As far as the actual OBE exit techniques, a problem with my process had been identified to me. The reason I wasn't liking the exit techniques and why they seemed to pull me out of the meditative state was because I had associated the technique with my physical body. As I would focus on the technique, my awareness of my physical body would increase. So instead of going deeper "inward", I was coming back "outward" to my body. I have to thank Selea for this. The solution to this appears to be focusing on visualization... associate the exit technique with a visualized body... not my own. Theoretically at some point I should be able to shift my point of consciousness into that imaginary thought-form by "feeling" for it. Wow.. that sounds vague to me even as I write it but at my current state of spiritual knowledge I believe it to be possible.
Also in this case you have these sort of problems (as have all people that do these things without proper training first) because you are accustomed to associate yourself to your physical body, as I've said. For example in Liber O (where Crowley talks about Astral Projection) he says clearly that an absolute control of God-forms is essential before being able to create the Body of Light. This is natural. A God-form enable you to focus solely on that image enveloping your body to the exclusion of all else. There is a point in the discipline when this "form" actually exists on its own, as real as it is your physical body (and this last doesn't exists no more, your consciousness is in the "form"). When you have learned this the Body of Light is easy to create. Without, it's a pain.
Naturally there are sidesteps to overcome this lack of knowledge. One is what I told you to do. The act of creating a duplicate of your body to see in 3d view actually "trick" the mind (after a bit of practice) to follow the same, till you find "inside" the same (it mimicks a bit the assumption of a God-form). Another is explained in the document I linked you, where you actually begin separating all body and astral parts one at a time. The most powerful, however, remains mastering God-forms, for various reasons.
Naturally, then (and I will not lie to you), there are also some "tricks" that can be teached, however sadly these are only doable in person, because you have to watch the student doing the thing "astrally". Crowley insisted many times that he could make a person "go out" either at the first try. This seems to being the case in many circumnstances also in my experience. However these "tricks" are only to let a student really understand some points that were already within him/her, in reality they serves only to really make learn the student that he can surely do it. Many times this "fear of success" (or doubt that you cannot do it) is present in almost everyone. The "tricks" removes the same, and when this is out of the equation (also if it is difficult to believe) the rest is much easier.
Quote from: michaelsaganski on June 10, 2010, 18:02:38
I'll continue to post my progress and any major trials/events. My ultimate goal has changed into more than just having an OBE, it's about evolving and understanding my consciousness as much as possible.
This is really good. It is a sign of your real progress. Also if you can think that your end has not come, on the contrary you have learned something that it's much more useful. Doing work without lust for result. When you completely learn this, along with the methods of working all becomes easy.
Best regards,
Selea
This has been a very interesting and thought-provoking account to follow! Thanks for your candid insights, and please keep us posted about your progress and epiphanies.
I agree with MuVoVuM :) I've been following this thread since you started it!
I've been sharpening my meditation with the help of some free classes and gaining a better conceptual understanding of the non-physical from the books I'm reading. It's all very exciting stuff to me right now, but progress is a little slower than I'd like!
The third book in Bruce Moen's series is so crazy, and it aligns well with Todd Campbell's "My Big Toe"... I'm getting a pretty big conceptual picture of reality. It feels intuitively true, but I want to experience it firsthand. I also recently read "Eat, Pray, Love" for fun, which gave me another perspective on my spiritual growth.
I swear I was extremely close to leaving my body yesterday.. I lost all feeling in my body... almost attaining a sort of "point consciousness". For whatever reason my eyes naturally opened (or was it astral sight? I couldn't tell), and all I could feel was warmth and energy. It was the deepest disconnection with my physical body I've felt thus far.
Well I got back from TMI (The Monroe Institute) a couple weeks ago. It's taken me a while to get some free time and to really understand any sort of permanent changes their Gateway Voyage program left on me. It was an amazing week of self-discovery, exploration, experience, and development.
In a nutshell I came wanting to learn more about consciousness and subjective experience (and maybe have an OBE too!). While I didn't have a pure OBE, I did come away with much more than I expected. I do have a deeper understanding of how I am more than my physical body (consciousness). I am more aware, happy, sensitive, and caring in general, and have a modified outlook on life.
The Gateway Voyage teaches you how to attain different altered states of consciousness (what they call Focus 10, 12, 15, and 21) with the help of Hemi-Sync. Attaining these states during the program was surprisingly easy. Some people might also know that Bob Monroe termed this shifting between altered states as phasing. Phasing is a whole lot easier to do and is more gradual than trying to just attain an OBE. I think it's because phasing allows you to be open to any sort of non-physical perception, instead of expecting for XYZ to occur in an OBE.
Conscious experience is very subjective and there is quite a variety of ways to experience the focus levels. That's why if you believe you want to have an OBE just like one you've read, you'll likely end up blocking any sort of non-physical perception that isn't what you're expecting. It's much better to just be open to what comes to you. That's one of the biggest things I learned at the Gateway Voyage, and it's why I've dropped the goal of "having an OBE" for something more general and expansive.
My non-physical perceptions were varied between visions, feelings, and the occasional sense of "knowing". I should be clear that these visions came to me in my mind's eye (so I didn't see it through my physical eyes), and I'd sometimes have trouble figuring out whether I was actually imagining what I was seeing or if I wasn't. I'm far from mastering this, but I've also come a long way.
The exercises at the Gateway Voyage also give you plenty of tools. This gives you things to try when you're lying there in the altered state, such as receiving guidance, performing healing, remote viewing, manifestation, interacting with entities, etc. One of the best successes for me was deepening my connection with my guidance (be it a guide, helper, or whatever you want to call it). When I have a question about something going on in my life, I can usually get a yes/no answer from this guidance (it depends on the question) - which is very useful! The manifestation exercise actually ended up working for me (a specific boost in my career), and I received some positive results (not 100% accurate) with the remote viewing.
I'm not 100% sure why I'm more happy, sensitive, caring, etc. I think part of it has to do with having experiences that have showed me what an open heart *feels* like. Hemi-Sync also tends to make you use both your left-brain and your right-brain - and my right-brain has definitely been underutilized. Perhaps coming in greater alignment with my whole being has helped in some way as well.
I used to dismiss most subjective experience (i.e. lived in the left-brained objective causality of Western culture) - but there is SO much to it.. and it is directly applicable to our everyday lives.
I should also mention that another huge source of knowledge for me about all of this has come from the book "My Big Toe". This book and its author really resonate with me - I've been able to make sense of all this new age "hokum" in a logical framework that makes sense to me. It's been completely compatible with my Gateway Voyage and enhanced my understanding of it.
I will definitely be going to TMI within the next year to take another program. I'm currently debating between Heartline, Guidelines, and MC squared. My current goals are to become more loving/caring, and to enhance my non-physical perceptions by continuing to meditate everyday.
michaelsaganski: Hi, you have been working rather goal oriented to make an OBE. That's about the same I've been doing for a few months now, but with very little success. So I either lack skill, or I am doing things wrong.
Did you tell the TMI personal about your OBE attempts and did you ask them about what you possible could do more correct to succeed with an OBE? What Focus to start from, which Hemi-Sync CDs to use, etc?
Thanks for sharing with the rest of us. :)
Quote from: Pauli2 on September 06, 2010, 10:06:17
michaelsaganski: Hi, you have been working rather goal oriented to make an OBE. That's about the same I've been doing for a few months now, but with very little success. So I either lack skill, or I am doing things wrong.
Did you tell the TMI personal about your OBE attempts and did you ask them about what you possible could do more correct to succeed with an OBE? What Focus to start from, which Hemi-Sync CDs to use, etc?
Thanks for sharing with the rest of us. :)
Well they sort of stressed the point that there is much more to this than just OBE. By just going for an OBE you could be blocking other kinds of experiences. But that being said, there are some specific Hemi-Sync tracks that focus on having an OBE. I believe they're in the 3rd "Gateway Experience" set (Wave 3). There's also a Hemi-Sync CD called "Journeys out of the Body" which is specifically for OBE. You can have an OBE at any focus level, although I think they generally do it on the CD's from 10 or 12.
Quote from: michaelsaganski on September 06, 2010, 12:54:17
There's also a Hemi-Sync CD called "Journeys out of the Body" which is specifically for OBE. You can have an OBE at any focus level, although I think they generally do it on the CD's from 10 or 12.
The H-S CD you mention above I could not find at the TMI homepage. Could you mean "Adventures Beyond the Body"? I have that 2 CD set. The first CD didn't seem to produce so much effect, but I might be a poor subject. The second CD (Power of 7) seems to create some kind of prolonged experience, possibly of F 10 (fake numbness, feeling of lifting into air).
Do you prefer any specific H-S CD at you current stage (other than the Wave III CD)?
The complete name for it is "Hemi-Sync Support for Journeys out of the Body", and is carried by TMI and Hall of Learning.