astral projetcion while on paxil (anti dep}

[Steel Hawk]

I think it can.  Ever wonder why the governments want people to use prescription drugs instead of the drugs in nature?

Anti-depressiants make you into a zombie.  Fix the problem, don't just put a bandaid on it.

[The Maven]

I honestly don't have any authority on the subject, but I have my fair share of problems with depression, and I can tell you that in my opinion, these drugs are not the solution. They don't solve anything, they just hide the problem for a while. In fact, they can make things worst. I never tried them mind you, and I probably never will either. I don't trust any drug.

I agree with Steel Hawk, go the natural way. I'm sure that working with your mind can make a world of difference. I personally feel stronger now that I have been checking out this third eye and astral projection stuff. I feel closer to my inner self, which gives me an advantage.

By the way, Steel Hawk, what is with this paranoia about the government? Why would they want to stop people from having astral projections?

[manuel]

Sounds like your 3rd density transudcer is having problems with the energy streams here on earth, ok i made that up, except the 3rd density tranducer part, but yeah, as they said, its like a bandaid, i am not sure man, i would personaly steer clear of them.

[Hannah b]

Hi

I'm posting a link to a thread about anti depressants and spiritual growth (it's long, so I didn't feel like re-writting it, sorry;))
http://personal-freedom.org/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=2179&PN=2&TPN=1
All i can tell you is that Prozac, which I took for 7 months stopped my OBE IMEDIEATELY!!!!!! A few years earlier I took some other miracle pill and teh same thing happened...I quit it, and within a month or so they came back.
i feel very sorry for you Sinister Steve and hope that you'll be able to find the peace in you without the chemistry,because it doesn't solve anything.
good luck!!!!!

[manuel]

Hi Hannah, could you please elaborate what you mean by they just stoped?

[Vindaloo]

I take Anti-depressants, and I still project. Don't think i'm a Zombie either. Strange but true.

I can only think of one type of anti-depressant, that made my situation worse. The rest were fine, they either didn't work, or had too many side-effects, or stopped working after X months. The one i'm on now, no side-effects, it works, and has been working for nearly two years. The only time i've ever felt like a zombie while on AD's, was perhaps when starting a new drug, there's usually some effect at the beginning that wears off after X days or a week or two.

Anyway, to answer your question, I still project. Actually, i'm a lot calmer while i'm projecting, which has led to clearer and somewhat lengthier experiences. It's a bit easier to learn and practice now, while "out there".

[mactombs]

I wouldn't pay attention to people who tell you to stop taking your medications. Most of them, unfortunately, are simply ignorant.

I used to take Paxil, but now I take a similar medication called Lexapro. Both are SSRI's. What this means is that your brain absorbs serotonin too quickly. All that an SSRI does is keep you from absorbing it serotonin quickly. Without serotonin, all kinds of nasty things manifest, such as severe depression. If someone without this problem were to take an SSRI, they'd never notice anything. On the other hand, SSRI's have been extremely effective for me, and really helped changed my outlook on life (I really relate to what you said about sleeping all the time, too).

It's complete BS to tell someone they don't really have a mental illness, but it's all spritiual. Ignore these people, they simply don't (or refuse) to know better. Compare our physical bodies to cars. Everyone's car is different. Some people have tinted windows, or carberator problems, 600 HP, etc. All cars pretty much differ. Some of them are lemons right off the production line. That's the way of this world, nothing's perfect.

So, like cars, why would you think that all bodies are made perfect? It simply isn't true. It happens that you and I have a minor malfunction where we absorb serotonin too quickly. As far as projecting, I've also been able to do it (in fact, I also take two other medications for ADHD). SSRI's will not negatively affect your ability to project! Know that you will project, rather than worry what might be holding you back.

Please, don't tell someone to stop taking their medication unless you are a physician or psychiatrist.

[Hannah b]

Hi Manuel,
I have had projections 3-4 times a week, and the moment i started taking them I got none. that simple;))
Mactombs,
it's not very polite to call someone ignorant just because they have a different point of view. But i guess, you're ignorant about that.
If you are one of those people who believe in everything that is said on everyday basis, all the comercial world, media bla bla. Good. lead a happy life not being aware of what is going on around you. I refuse to live like that.
There is so much that we don't know about, and we're being fed lies to keep quiet  and obedient.  I base my knowledge on different sources that are hard to find on regular basis, and unlike you try to keep my mind open. yes I do believe that drugs like that help people feel better ( i felt sooooo good ) but they don't cure the cause. If you put regular gas into a diesel it will break down. If  you use the correct fuel, everything will be fine.
There are zillions of theories about the influence of the psyhical world with the physical. But I understand that you prefer to read your doctors brochures.
good luck and don't forget to take your pills today.

[Hannah b]

p.s.
I also base my beliefs on 2 years spend on medications, which made me feel good but when I quit them, everything came back to the previous state.
right now i'm finishing my 4 year psychotherapy, and finally see a difference.

[mactombs]

Well, I suppose if you tell a pschitzophrenic to stop taking their medications, they'll start seeing all sorts of things too.

Fuel has nothing to do with say, a missing headlight. I don't see how you can say that something with a clearly physical cause, observable through CAT-scans etc. has a mystical cure. Maybe it does, but it also has a pharmaceutical one as well. Otherwise perhaps you'd like to explain while a substance that does nothing but slow the reputake of serotonin works so effectively on people who are suspected of absorbing serotonin too quickly by grace of genetics, if this doesn't cure the "cause"?

Also, perhaps you've noticed that while you claim to have had astral difficulties while on medications, others have had different experiences. Certainly your experiences are as valid as anyone else's, but by no means exclusive.

[CaCoDeMoN]

(sorry if there are any grammar errors in this post, but English is not my native language)

mactombs wrote:
" Well, I suppose if you tell a schitzophrenic to stop taking their medications, they'll start seeing all sorts of things too."

As far as i know schizophrenia isn't connected at all with hallucinations. When someone having this mental disease will stop taking their medications, they will just think and talk things that do not make any sense.

[Hannah b]

some answers:
http://www.sntp.net/main.htm
as for shizophrenia:
(this is from Kiauma's post  edited on 05 February 2004 15:26:27 )


Here is one woman's story which relates to that very thing;

http://home.earthlink.net/~onthe8thday/index.html#if%20you%

Schizophrenia has been called the Shaman's disease, because Schizophrenia and Shamanic emergence appear so closely paralell to the unbiased mind who is knowledgeable of both phenomena.   Something most people don't know is that 'treated' properly, schizophrenia is most often only temporary.

Bottom line, how you explain these experiences is tied directly to the paradime of your perception, whether spiritual, mental, or physical. There is a growing underground psychological movement to identify these experiences of fragmentation and eventual larger integration of the self as part of a natural human process. Unfortunately, the insurance industry, which largely controls the psychological industry in America, sees no need to spend the necessary money on the 'care' and understanding required to see the process through, when some cheap pills can seemingly make the 'symptoms' magically go away.

Here are some more sites:
http://www.global-vision.org/interview/perry.html
http://members.tripod.com/more_couteau/psychosis.htm
http://www.virtualcs.com/se/experiences.html
http://www.global-vision.org/dream/index.html
http://www.jungcircle.com/roberts2.html
http://www.gurdjieff.org/

All cars leave the fabrick with both headlights. they break them on the way.

  "Otherwise perhaps you'd like to explain while a substance that does nothing but slow the reputake of serotonin works so effectively on people who are suspected of absorbing serotonin too quickly by grace of genetics, if this doesn't cure the "cause"? "

1. because chemistry works good on chemistry. Billions of dollars are spend on it each year and it has to work.
2.Curing the "cause" would mean feeling good after stopping the intake of the drug. Chemistry doesn't cure the cause only the symptoms.


P.s. Do you know that simple things like love also rises the level of serotonin???

p.s.2 my astral experiences are fine now, thank you.

[sinister_steve]

Thanks for the posts guys......But for the people who have had a easy run at this life,good for you.but you cant/wont be able to undertand that just because a person is on a anti/dep by no means is he/her a zombie,,,in fact,if you ask most people who have/do suffered from the illness they will say the same thing,that they were a zombie before they took the anti/dep.so that sort of blows that theory out of the water.,,steve

[mactombs]

quote:As far as i know schizophrenia isn't connected at all with hallucinations. When someone having this mental disease will stop taking their medications, they will just think and talk things that do not make any sense.

Here is a definition of Schizophrenia:

"Schizophrenia is characterized by profound disruption in cognition and emotion, affecting the most fundamental human attributes: language, thought, perception, affect, and sense of self. The array of symptoms, while wide ranging, frequently includes psychotic manifestations, such as hearing internal voices or experiencing other sensations not connected to an obvious source (hallucinations)"

quote:Schizophrenia has been called the Shaman's disease, because Schizophrenia and Shamanic emergence appear so closely paralell to the unbiased mind who is knowledgeable of both phenomena.   Something most people don't know is that 'treated' properly, schizophrenia is most often only temporary.

Have you ever known anyone with schizophrenia?

quote:Bottom line, how you explain these experiences is tied directly to the paradime of your perception, whether spiritual, mental, or physical. There is a growing underground psychological movement to identify these experiences of fragmentation and eventual larger integration of the self as part of a natural human process.

This is true. I believe that alternate means of dealing with these things should be explored more.

quote:All cars leave the fabrick with both headlights. they break them on the way.

That is, unless the wiring was faulty off the production line.

quote:1. because chemistry works good on chemistry. Billions of dollars are spend on it each year and it has to work.

2.Curing the "cause" would mean feeling good after stopping the intake of the drug. Chemistry doesn't cure the cause only the symptoms.

1. If the human brain isn't applicable to chemistry, I don't know what is. Material cures for material ailments.

2. You must realize that not everything can be "cured".

quote:P.s. Do you know that simple things like love also rises the level of serotonin???

The problem isn't that enough serotonin isn't being produced, it's that the serotonin is absorbed too quickly.

quote:p.s.2 my astral experiences are fine now, thank you.

I'm glad to hear it. I don't disrespect you for going off medications. Whatever works best for you is the best solution for you.

[Steel Hawk]

The Maven
By the way, Steel Hawk, what is with this paranoia about the government? Why would they want to stop people from having astral projections?

It's complicated, but a better question would be "Why would the government want people to astral project?".  I mean can't you think of any reasons the government wouldn't want you to project?  Come on!

mactombs
I wouldn't pay attention to people who tell you to stop taking your medications. Most of them, unfortunately, are simply ignorant.

Actually, I'm far from ignorant; but thank you.  I was on Selective Serotonin Reuptake Inhibitors (SSRI), so I've experienced it.  There are much better (illegal) anti-depresants found in nature.

Ever read what happens when you stop taking them?

http://www.psycom.net/depression.central.withdrawal.html

Please, don't tell someone to stop taking their medication unless you are a physician or psychiatrist.

Eh, I see your an intergrated member of society.

sinister_steve
Thanks for the posts guys......But for the people who have had a easy run at this life,good for you.but you cant/wont be able to undertand that just because a person is on a anti/dep by no means is he/her a zombie,,,in fact,if you ask most people who have/do suffered from the illness they will say the same thing,that they were a zombie before they took the anti/dep.so that sort of blows that theory out of the water.,,steve

I've been there, I've come with in seconds of self inflicted death several times (handgun to the head, overdosing on sleeping pills and vodka, etc).  Maybe I should have kept taking my pills, but that didn't fix anything long term.  And while on them they did make me feel like a zombie.  So maybe it's me.  It's your life.  Best wishes.

[Veccolo]

Please don't stop taking your medicine because some people (no offense intended) on a internet forum told you that it doesn't help you. You should always see a doctor first.

[Hannah b]

Your quote mactombs:
Here is a definition of Schizophrenia:
"Schizophrenia is characterized by profound disruption in cognition and emotion, affecting the most fundamental human attributes: language, thought, perception, affect, and sense of self. The array of symptoms, while wide ranging, frequently includes psychotic manifestations, such as hearing internal voices or experiencing other sensations not connected to an obvious source (hallucinations)"

did you notice that this is a medical definition? We don't know how to cure Aids but have all the answers for shizophrenia???please.....

do I know anyone like that?
Yes, in fact I have a very good friend who is a shizophrenic. i also spend 7 months in a psyhiatrist clinic, on a shizophrenia ward while making a film about it.So what???

you quote:
"The problem isn't that enough serotonin isn't being produced, it's that the serotonin is absorbed too quickly."
there are many different serotonin misfunctions, and they cause different ilnesses.

"Low serotonin levels have been linked to depression which is a commonly concurrent disorder in people with eating disorders."

I was treated for depression and bulimia at the same time, and all I'm saying is that I felt really good while on med ( 7 months), but when I decided to quit it (my doctor knew about it) All the symptoms came back imedieately.I started psychotherapy (and it's alternatives) and it completely changed my life. My problems had it's roots in my childhood, past reincarnations and my ways of thinking. do you know how amazing it feels to have all the problems gone, and knowing that they are gone because you worked on them, understood them, and finally made them dissapear. I feel sorry for you that you will never have the chance of feeling the way I do, feeling good without medications feeling free..Even if you feel good now, and think you have everything under control remember that it's not true. It's because without the pills you would be feeling different, and your brain is being tricked, so that you are a nice and easy mr. proper citizen.
Also, do you know that my 2 psychiatrists believed that my OBE ( I didn't tell them everything) is also a symptom of mental illness??? If you trust your doc so much mactombs, why do you try to AP???I'm 99% sure that your psyhiatrist  will tell you that it's a ll a hallucination or brain chemistry problem and that he can give you this great new pill, that will stop all the symptoms, but will make you feel sooooo good!?
your quote:
2. You must realize that not everything can be "cured".
Well, I believe that everything CAN be cured, but not in the modern medical way.
this discussion is pointles, I will not  even try to convince you that there is a second side to all of this. Have a good life.And if you're ever bored or have the courage to gain some knowledge that is off the everyday cnn news, go here:
http://www.nexusmagazine.com/

[mactombs]

quote:Eh, I see your an intergrated member of society.

It's because without the pills you would be feeling different, and your brain is being tricked, so that you are a nice and easy mr. proper citizen.

I don't believe it's us versus them. I'm not some elite mystic, and the rest of the world is not out to get me (see delusions under schitzophrenia). But I suppose our opinions of the world at large might be fundementally different, because I am more an optimist when it comes to the human condition.

It's complete nonsense that you can't resolve whatever issues you have while on medications. Eliminate the cause? As I've said before, not when the cause is material.

quote:I'm 99% sure that your psyhiatrist will tell you that it's a ll a hallucination or brain chemistry problem and that he can give you this great new pill, that will stop all the symptoms, but will make you feel sooooo good!?

Well, you should have given more credence to your 1% that differed. Such is not the case whatsoever. My psychiatrist is a member of the Navajo Nation. Yes, he's Native American. No, he doesn't think things like meditation or OBEs are crazy.

You and Steel Hawk sound a lot like I did eight years back.

[dusarn]

There are different types of depression.  You have biological depression and then you have depression that is brought about by life/past-life experiences.  The majority of doctor's prescribe the same medication for both because it helps to alleviate the symptoms in both cases.

A person that does not have biological depression can often times get better by taking these pills unless the source of their depression is deeply set.  If the source of their depression has taken root in their subconcious then a skilled psychiatrist is needed to help the person work the problems out.  A person with this condition can also make themselves better by doing meditation and by personally working through their demons.

A person with biological depression however is not so lucky.  No amount of psychiatric help or inner soul searching is going to make these people feel any better.  They need those pills.  Don't get me wrong though I think it can be cured but it takes alot of spiritual skill and awareness, the likes of which most of us will not attain in this lifetime.  If you KNOW you have a case of biological depression my suggestion is to stay on the pills unitl science finds a way to permanently "cure" it or you find someone with the spiritual awareness and skill to heal you.

[Champollion FRC]

Having been a spiritual traveler with first hand knowledge of the Dark Night of the Soul,I recently read the book,The Instinct to Heal
by David Servan-Schreiber.It is informative and teaches you holistic,natural ways to overcome depression.
"Pointing to the stark statistic that more than 11 million Americans currently take antidepressants, Servan-Schreiber, psychiatrist and co-founder of the University of Pittsbugh's Center for Complementary Medicine, offers seven natural treatments for stress-related disorders."
Best wishes,[]

[sinister_steve]

Thanks for the info guys,I do think eventually i will be able to over come the anti dep,but not till im good and sure thanks to the posts from you guys,for my doctor is not of much help at all,like most of them.It seems i have to seek alternative sorces,such as this group.And it helps to know there are other people out there who are on anti dep and can still astral project fine,so i know it is not what is holding me back.but instead not enouph skill yet.Oh i wanted to ask how long it took for you guys before you could project,after sticking to a method and determined to astral project?thanks again.. steve

[narfellus]

I take paxil now, and have been on various antidepressants in the past. I agree that they are more of a bandaid than a cure, but sometimes someone REALLY needs a bandaid to be functional when a cure is unknown. They helped me at times, failed me at others, caused terrible side effects other times. I'm gradually leaning toward weaning off the medicine as my spiritual and energetic skills strengthen, because anything that manifests in the physical has its roots in the spiritual. A clean body goes a long way toward helping depression, and don't mix drugs and alcohol. The deception it creates is, "I still feel fine after that binge!" It is a very slow and insidious process, i've been through it. So keep taking the meds i say, but research and look and pray for permanent solutions, rather than relying on a man made pill by men who don't really know who the world works but think they do.

[Rastus]

I am now Depression free!  Joys of being a healer I suppose, but if your really ill, how can you heal yourself?

Paxil CR:  Stopped all lucid dreaming.  I could barely remember my dreams.  I couldn't raise power without help.  I couldn't project worth a dam.  I had a constant "fog" behind my eyes.  I couldn't see any Aura's but mine, and it was thin and tight.

WellButrin.  I could raise power, but had no control.  I could remember my dreams but no lucid dreaming.  I was agitated and Manic, and actually a bit Homicidal.  I was sorely tempted to do things no healer should ever do.

Remoran.  Not much of anything.  No lucid dreaming, but was only on it 2 weeks.

Effexor.  I could raise power. I could focus and project.  Had a few lucid dreams (1/week?  I'm about a 4/week type).  Could see Aura's again.  My own Aura was thicker and I could relax and expand it.

Effexor is what let me heal myself.  I was finally able to center enough to get out of the "Funk of Despair".  Since I "know" what an SSRI is supposed to do, I have something to focus on for a physical healing.  Of course the real problem was spiritual, and once I recognized that and took steps to deal with it the physical depression vanished.  Rather suddenly.

[sinister_steve]

Hi thanks for the info about the anti dep.i will try going on effexor so i can heal myself as to get off the anti dep entirely as you have done,,good job i will do you same as soon as i can get some head way,,steve

[narfellus]

ugh...wellbutrin. That crap put me into a near-suicidal state, probably the worst i've ever felt. The thoughts bearing down on me day in and out were horrible, even thought about hurting other people just as a change of emotion. Talk about letting negs in, the meds created a big hole and something latched on...

I've been on effexor and i like it, but ultimately i want to move off meds altogether. Are bodies and minds and spirits are strong enough, it just takes time and knowledge of how to achieve these things. If you're on these boards you're in the right place, so keep on truckin!