Dream approach...

[Blissful]

Yes, if you can become lucid while in a dream state, an OBE is practically guaranteed.. however, becoming lucid while dreaming is just as challenging as trying to have an OBE.

Good luck and let me know how it works for you!

Blissful

[Cezyl]

Hey Blissful.

If you believe that all of it is difficult, then I'm sure it will be. I have consciously projected the majority of the times I have through imagery and dreams, as I consider it transition state phenomenon, the stuff that happens between waking and sleeping, like vibrations. I'd reach a deep trance and the imagery comes, and I'd focus on the imagery and it turns into a dream, and then I'd become aware that it is a dream and proceed to exit. So now that I am actively focusing on it I'm sure it will be even easier.

Take care.

[upstream]

Hello to all.

My english is pretty week (make me laugh all the times), but here it is, an another stream of excrement from the little workshop of mine.

I have 4 method to convert dreams into OBEs or liked states. Three of them are used regularly for years. These are:

1. match the position of your physical (dreamer) body with your dreaming body
2. centripetal flying in sporas or spinning back into your energy body
3. fluctocondensation (I will not write about it at these times, because it's very complex...for a lame introduction see the topic 'what are astral senses')

(Flying upward within the dream or moving a point upward from the head of the dream body is an another method. However, I will not write about it at all, because had only couple of experiences with it.)

First and foremost, I have to introduce you to the concept of projection/dreamer body. I have not read the books of RB yet (only the treatises), so I hope you know exactly what I mean. When you're asleep, the ionic body come to loose from the relaxing muscles and nerves and begin to expand. Before dreaming or separation take place, your consciousness is transferred and reflected into it. When you do etheric OBEing, portion of this body is able to separate (albeit saved back by cable-like structures). When you begin to dream, part of your consciousness is reside in this body, and start to "hallucinate" the content of the dream you have, but hold the consciousness of your exact position. In the former case, this body serve as 'projector body', and the latter as 'dreamer body' by default.

As I mentioned before, the projector/dreamer body hold a consciousness of the place you left your body in at the time of falling asleep (one waking and maybe several position of dreaming-asleep are recorded). Most of the times, these positions can be false (to make it more specific: they are dreamed), so when you find youself back in this body from a collapsed dream state, you can be bewildered by pseudo-memories. You think you're awake, turn and toss in a place different from your bedroom. With practice, you're able to get consciousness of these episodes, open your eyes, regain consciousness of your real position, then go back into your projector body to separate from it.

Beyond the consciousness of your place, the exact position we left your biological body has a great impact on any dreaming and projecting practice. When you realign yourself into this position, you make a feedback to the physical and reinforce the dreaming process. It works because this method mimic the exact process your body used to inicialize any dreaming: first you lie down, your ionic body expand, your consciousness transfer into it, and you find yourself watching predream-hipnagogic pictures projected on your visual field, eventually loosing your consciousness by sheer habit.

Now, I will descibe the conversion methods in a nutshell (if you're further interested I'll give you a detailed descriptions about any of them):

1. Match your position of your dream body with your dreamer body.

This method comes from the 'Art of Dreaming' by Carlos Castaneda. It works exactly as he explained, and I'm very lucky to have this practice from 2000. Well, after you stabilize the dream, lay down exactly into the position of your sleeping body, and fall asleep again. You may do what you used to do when you try to project from awake, but these time you should do it briefly and from the dream. What seems is your intent to get back into your dreamer body. Within seconds, you feel yourself as forced to one direction or slipping little. Now, your consciousness is back in your projector body and you're able to separate. You may experience sensation resemble to those you feel right before any regular OBE attempt. This method can be used as a shortcut to accumulate these feelings for further practice.


2a. centipetal flying in spora.

When your attention wander on the surface of your palm, you provide a "sensory surface" to sustain your dreaming even in midst of great disturbances, absence of visuals or drifting in an abstract environment. You're able to survive for minutes, if you're breath steady and deep, moving your attention and observing the details on your palm. By forming a spora of this and obeying yourself to move to a specific place or person, your chance to reach your destination will increase greatly. This is my favorite method to travel to and enter into dreams of my friends.

Sporas can move "horizontal" or "vertical" in dreaming. (I mean horizontal/vertical movement as moving in 3D or dimensional respectively, however, in fact, flying upward (3D vertical) may cause dimansional shift in RTZ, because the ionic components of the energy body build from the atmosphere and forced to change with height, making it decondensate into a shape like a fountain.) If you move vertical, the dimension you are reside in will change accordingly. Pure movements of vertical can be centripetal and centrifugal. With centripetal moving your come to close the state of your projector/dreamer body.

When I'm about to reach my dreaming body from an ordinary LDs by centripetally accelerated sporas, first I find yourself move erratic like a falling leaf of a tree. Eventually my dream body forced to push down against the ground whil at the same time matching into the exact position of my sleeping body. At this point I can loose my sight or it will be frozen into a starter image, similar to ones I've see in hipnagogia right before a dream come into full view.

However, If I'm about to launch my spora from an AP, I have to fly a lot but not loose sight at reintegration. I found, that it depend on the activity of the heart chakra, because when I try this method right after activate it in the dream, my flying tend to be continous.

So I concluded that the origin of the starter pictures have to be same with the ending ones and both of them are connected to my throat region, while the projector/dreamer body is correspond to the solar plexus regio, as the heart inbeetwen with OBE states. If the heart are not active, the process of your descent will be broken.


2b. centripetal flying by spinning into the projector body

First you stabilize the dream, then anchor yourself into it by grabbing objects around you. Then you have to recall the feeling of your room where your body lying in. First try to feel the volume of your entire room, then gradually move your attention from the outside through the various grads of your energy body and at the same time try to spin it like a top, first slowly then with more end more speed. At this point your astral body forced to suck back with the movement resemble me to djinns as they move back to their bottles. You literally feel yourself shirinking, but first as being enormous, and at three places at the same time: dream, condensating energy body, bioplasm body in your bed. The feeling of the energy body can be censured, because first you have not accustumed to it. If you succeded, you find yourself howering above the city you live or bettween the land correspond your astral destination in physical and your home, unable to see your environment but feel it like a radar. Your energy body begin to take shape and get spin, eventually merge into your projecting body within seconds. This process is very fast, takes my couple of seconds. However, it can't be accomplished from a regular LD (I mean regular that there are no condensed seeds of your energy body outside of your projector double).

An introduction to the mechanism of this process (called 'fluctocondensation') can be read in the topic "what are astral senses."

If you increase the speed of the spinning the reintegration can't be possible. If you fail, and lost the spinning body, first try to feel as you are in the midst of a tornado, moving the etheric matter continously around you. This force will further exteriorize the etheric substance from your muscles to a point you feel two body at the same time: your physical one and your spinning one superimposed to each other. Now you can separate by spin yourself out.

[Cezyl]

Upstream... Thank you for this great service! I'm interested in more details by the way. Part 2?

Cezyl

[Cezyl]

What exactly is sporas???

[nitetravler]

Hi Cezyl,

I wish you well on your experiments! I tried the dream approach to OBE's as a teenager in the 70's and it never really worked for me, though YOUR approach is a little different from the one I tried.

Some people may have a knack for this method and find it a boon, but I aint one of them (dag nabbit!). One writer who devotes an entire book on the Dream Method is this guy...

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0906006899/cm_aya_asin.title/104-5908836-8531943?v=glance&s=books

...who'se book first introduced me to this method. It's quite detailed with some interesting techniques and ideas, as well as some personal stories by the author. I left a review of this book at the above link which was rather lukewarm, but hasten to repeat that some people may indeed find ideas here that open the door to the astral success they've been seeking.

Good luck!

[Cezyl]

Thank you for your sharing nitetravler. []

[upstream]

Hello Cezyl,

The spora is a state when you get your attention trapped by focusing on the details of your palm, and, at the same time you let yourself drift to a destination you wish to be (hovewer, with persons it work much better).

The palm will begint to distort, but that doesn't matter. (Sometimes I see extra fingers on it, or texts when have a weird companion.) The main thing is that you don't look up to your environment in order to prevent your energy field to anchor any energy field of object which may exist beneath the dream picture you look at, and (2) to keep intact your perception as you fly through surreal spaces, because if your perception is messed up totally, the dream will collapse within seconds.

Flying in an decondensed, muli-seeded energy body is a very instable state to practice. You will recognize this state by signs as duplicated picture of buildings, multiple moon on the sky (rare) and the encounter with power-lines (very common). While flying in LDs are simple, in this intermediate state you can't move by simple intend. What you look at is what you attract you, and flying is replaced by zooming.

I don't know who moves the spora, perhaps the subconscious. But is fact that your thinking will affect it greatly, so your mind must be silent. First float up, define your destination in terms as simple and squarely as you can (for example: "I want to move back into my dreamer body without awakening the physical."), then form the spora by isolating your attention from your environment and let yourself to drift.

[Cezyl]

hey all...

I am very excited. I am going to take a new approach to getting out of body, through dreams. I have found that once I become aware that I are dreaming it is just a matter of latching onto my nonphysical body by thinking it, like realizing I are really lying down asleep, and feeling for my body and connecting with it. Then I try to move and I find that I'm in paralysis, and then I relax and move out and away from my physical body. I have been waking up and going back to sleep, or just lounging in the morning by consciously thinking that in the morning I'll just dream, and this has had a great affect on bringing me some vivid dreams. I'll start to focus on my dreams more, and work on becoming aware in them and then just latch on to my nonphysical body as I said above and move out. I'll continue to meditate and stuff, and do energy work and things also. I figure this can be a stepping-stone to being able to get out consciously from waking, like directly stepping out. It related to the 'astral dreaming' method shared in the book Astral Travel by Yvonne and Gavin Frost, which is a very great book. I am too excited now to sit and read that part again, but it is closely related.

Cezyl