How Real-Time are Projections?

[Threepwood]

Hi im new here. Quick Question:

Just how real-time are the projections? Is it at all possible for two people to agree to meet at a specific place anywhere in the world at the same time? I mean, something like telling a friend "So lets meet at the eiffel tower tonight", or something like that.

If this is true, then this astral projection ability would allow me to travel to europe to my friends and overhear their conversations. I live in Australia, so the time difference would be day time over there. Then on the other hand, this ability would enable spies/pervs to peek anywhere they want. Is this correct?

Regards,
Threepwood.

[Zino]

I personally have no idea, I think you can only see your own physical body in RTZ I'm afraid one of the more senior posters will know allot more than I do

[T.L.]

"I personally have no idea, I think you can only see your own physical body in RTZ I'm afraid one of the more senior posters will know allot more than I do Smiley"

I've dropped in on some conversations before and also verified actions..etc. But the only ones I can verify that are legit were the ones that occur around my home. I have not yet been able to travel to anywhere I want. The furthest I made it away from my house when I end up in the hear and now is downtown. One of the examples would be when I was up stairs in a room at the back of the house and my wife went to check the mail while on her cell. But these experiences are few because of our time/work schedule. When Im in the real time zone I do try my hardest to go somewhere else, by will alone but it just does not happen the way it should. I have had partial success but not absolute control, figuring out how to use your mind to do various things in the non-physical is not as easy as you would think it would be. Flying is perhaps the easiest most natural thing (even though at times I have some trouble), but it is just not feasible to use that to visit someone a state away. So to a lot of the other guys questions...yes but it is no easy task. A person might not even have control over where they end up during an exit, I sure don't. I can end up locally or I can end up somewhere that doesn't seem to exist in this physical reality.

[interception]

It is certainly possible, but it is very difficult. Maintaining lucidity in the RTZ gets exponentially harder the longer and father you venture out into unfamiliar terrain. Maintaining lucidity in the RTZ eats up a lot of energy, at least for me.

Simply flying very fast can trigger a shift into a place that is no longer our earth RTZ.

You can "teleport" to another place in the RTZ, but again, no guarantee where you will end up. Teleporting seems much more successful if you can link it to a highly familiar emotional connection, like teleporting to the location of a lover/friend/family.

[Threepwood]

Teleporting seems much more successful if you can link it to a highly familiar emotional connection, like teleporting to the location of a lover/friend/family.

That's what I hope to achieve, but that person is on the other side of the world.

Another Question...
Recently I have read up on the "Universal Laws of Attraction" and they seem to make logical sense. You attract to you what you think about. I am slowly becoming convinced that this "universal law" might be what allows people to move objects using their mind (telekinesis). Also this might explain the phenomena of Astral Projection. What do you guys think? Logical?

Also...
As I have never experienced it, you must understand I am skeptical towards OBE's. However I am open to it! Is it at all possible, that this astral projection is all in the mind, and not really traveling outside the body? This goes back to my first question of 2 people meeting in Real Time somewhere from different continents, as that would prove 100% OBE's.

Thanks for comments, Great Forum.

[kurtykurt42]

That's what I hope to achieve, but that person is on the other side of the world.

You can teleport anywhere in the universe.

Another Question...
Recently I have read up on the "Universal Laws of Attraction" and they seem to make logical sense. You attract to you what you think about. I am slowly becoming convinced that this "universal law" might be what allows people to move objects using their mind (telekinesis). Also this might explain the phenomena of Astral Projection. What do you guys think? Logical?

Telekinesis will be possible for humans in a later stage of our delopment. It involves using and controlling large amounts of energy to interact with matter. This can only be done in the 4th dimension as well as higher dimensions.

Also...
As I have never experienced it, you must understand I am skeptical towards OBE's. However I am open to it! Is it at all possible, that this astral projection is all in the mind, and not really traveling outside the body?

It's good to be skeptical of things but you have to do research in order to make an informed opinion. By practicing astral projection and reading other peoples experiences you will come to learn the truth.

This goes back to my first question of 2 people meeting in Real Time somewhere from different continents, as that would prove 100% OBE's.

This has been done many times and there are documented cases of this. But some people would rather ignore the evidence and remain skeptical.

[T.L.]

"However I am open to it! Is it at all possible, that this astral projection is all in the mind, and not really traveling outside the body?"

Well if you want to be literal/technical about it the physical life we all view as reality is "all in our minds". All the physical stimuli are gathered by our senses and filtered through our minds, then our minds build the model that we see, touch, feel, hear, and smell. So even the physical world is lived out in our minds to a great degree. When you look at it this way the world real, or the phrase "is it all in our minds" holds little value as everything we experience is all in our own minds.

[ka0s]

As mentioned by a previous poster, my only experiences ive been able to confirm in the RTZ happened around my house. The most profound (which may not seem profound to others) experience since the age of 18 was when I projected and saw a purple van in my neighbors parking spot that I had never seen before. When I got up for the day I went to get the mail and peered to my left at my neighbors parking spot and saw the same purple van. They live across the street about ~450 feet from my porch. I've had other minor confirmations around my house such as certain garbage being in my yard and confirming it.

I've tried to have more confirmations with reading things such as words and such on buildings and street signs and things within my house. Most of the time it appears in weird heiroglyphics or it sometimes looks like latin. I've also had these hieroglyphics appear on my astral cord (on one of the occurrences I actually felt for it and saw it). I'm often not able to touch the material where the words are written on that I see

[Alfera]

this may answer your question

8/15/63 Afternoon
A productive experiment after a long layoff! R.W., a businesswoman whom I know
quite well through long work association, and a close friend aware of my "activities''
(but somewhat skeptical still, in spite of rather unwilling participation), has been away
this week on her vacation up on the New Jersey coast. I do not know exactly where
she is vacationing other than that. Nor did I inform her of any planned experiment,
simply because I hadn't thought of it until today (Saturday). This afternoon, I lay
down to renew experimentation, and decided I would make a strong effort to "visit"
R.W. wherever she was. (Rule one in my case always has been that I am most
successful going to someone I know •well—and the opportunity does not come up
too often.) I lay down in the bedroom about three in the afternoon, went into a
relaxation pattern, felt the warmth (high order vibrations), then thought heavily of the
desire to "go" to R.W.
There was the familiar sensation of movement through a light blue blurred area, then
I was in what seemed to be a. kitchen. R.W. was seated in a chair to the right. She
had a glass in her hand. She was looking to my left, where two girls (about
seventeen or eighteen, one blond and one brunette) also were sitting, each with
glasses in their hands, drinking something. The three of them were in conversation,
but I could not hear what they were saying.
I first approached the two girls, directly in front of them, but I could not attract their
attention. I then turned to R.W., and I asked if she knew I was there.
"Oh yes, I know you are here" she replied (mentally, or with that superconscious
communication, as she was still in oral conversation with the two girls).
I asked if she was sure that she would remember that I had been there.
"Oh, I will definitely remember," the reply came.
I said that this time I was going to make sure that she remembered.
"I will remember, I'm sure I will" R.W. said, still in oral conversation simultaneously.
I stated that I had to be sure she would remember, so I was going to pinch her.
"Oh, you don't need to do that, Til remember" R.W. said hastily.
I said I had to be sure, so I reached over and tried to pinch her, gently, 1 thought. I
pinched her in the side, just above the hips and below the rib cage. She let out a
good loud "Ow," and I backed up, because I was somewhat surprised. I really hadn't
expected to be able actually to pinch her. Satisfied that I had made some
impression, at the least, I turned and left, thought of the physical, and was back
almost immediately. I got up (physically!), and went over to the typewriter where I am
now. R.W. will not be back until Monday, and then I can determine if I made the
contact, or if it was another unidentifiable miss. Time of return, three thirty-five.
Important aftermath: It is Tuesday after the Saturday of the experiment. R.W.
returned to work yesterday, and I asked her what she had been doing Saturday
afternoon between three and four. Knowing my reason for asking, she said she
would have to think about it and let me know on Tuesday (today). Here is what she
reported today: On Saturday between three and four was the only time there was not
a crowd of people in the beach cottage where she was staying. For the first time, she
was alone with her niece (dark-haired, about eighteen) and the niece's friend (about
the same age, blond). They were in the kitchen-dining area of the cottage from about
three-fifteen to four, and she was having a drink, and the girls were having Cokes.
They were doing nothing but sitting and talking.
I asked R.W. if she remembered anything else, and she said no. I questioned her
more closely, but she could not remember anything more. Finally, in impatience, I
asked her if she remembered the pinch. A look of complete astonishment crossed
her face.
"Was that you?" She stared at me for a moment, then went into the privacy of my
office, turned, and lifted (just slightly!) the edge of her sweater where it joined her
skirt on her left side. There were two brown and blue marks at exactly the spot where
I had pinched her.
"I was sitting there, talking to the girls" R.W. said, "when all of a sudden I felt this
terrible pinch. 1 must have jumped a foot. I thought my brother-in-law had come back
and sneaked up behind me. I turned around, but there was no one there. I never had
any idea it was you! It hurt!"
I apologized for pinching so hard, and she obtained from me a promise that if I tried
any such thing again, I would try something other than a pinch that hard.
In this episode, the time coincides with the actual events.
Autosuggestion hallucination, indeterminate, as willful desire was suggested, and
preknowledge was present of general location of R.W. at that time. Identical reports
with conditions of actual events:
(1) Location (inside rather than outside).
(2) Number of people present.
(3) Description of girls.
(4) Actions of people present.
(5) The acknowledgment of pinching.
(6) Physical marks from pinching.
Possibility of unconscious preknowledge through earlier ob-servation of the above:
(1) Negative, preknowledge implied activity outdoors on beach rather than indoors.
(2) Negative, preknowledge implied adults in group, as R.W. was visiting sister and
brother-in-law.
(3) Negative-indeterminate, possibility of preknowledge of niece and hair color
through R.W. sometime previously, negative as to friend of niece, her hair color and
age.
(4) Negative, no preknowledge of non-existent habit pattern for that particular
moment of day.
(5) Negative, R.W. had no preknowledge of experimental attempt as no such attempt
had been made previously, nor was experimenter in habit of pinching R.W. Had not
done so previously.
(6) Negative, no possible way that R.W. could have known where pinch marks
should have occurred to conform with area reported.

Source : Journeys Out of Body - Robert A. Monroe
(Pdf Version Page 33)

[Threepwood]

Well I guess this answers my question 100%.

BTW, I have been trying to OBE/Lucid dream for a few days now, but no luck. Not even vibrations (although I'm not focusing on them particularly), no nothing. I'm setting the alarm for 5:30 then staying awake for short time, then start deep breathing (then normal breathing) and looking at blackness. I look at this blackness for some time, but still nothing

Alfera.... what you described previously is exactly what I'm after. Long story short, I miss someone very much and want to be with that person. Skype sucks, so the next best thing is to project to her in real time. Hope I can do it!

[SkepticBoy]

this may answer your question

8/15/63 Afternoon
A productive experiment after a long layoff! R.W., a businesswoman whom I know
quite well through long work association, and a close friend aware of my "activities''
(but somewhat skeptical still, in spite of rather unwilling participation), has been away
this week on her vacation up on the New Jersey coast. I do not know exactly where
she is vacationing other than that. Nor did I inform her of any planned experiment,
simply because I hadn't thought of it until today (Saturday). This afternoon, I lay
down to renew experimentation, and decided I would make a strong effort to "visit"
R.W. wherever she was. (Rule one in my case always has been that I am most
successful going to someone I know •well—and the opportunity does not come up
too often.) I lay down in the bedroom about three in the afternoon, went into a
relaxation pattern, felt the warmth (high order vibrations), then thought heavily of the
desire to "go" to R.W.
There was the familiar sensation of movement through a light blue blurred area, then
I was in what seemed to be a. kitchen. R.W. was seated in a chair to the right. She
had a glass in her hand. She was looking to my left, where two girls (about
seventeen or eighteen, one blond and one brunette) also were sitting, each with
glasses in their hands, drinking something. The three of them were in conversation,
but I could not hear what they were saying.
I first approached the two girls, directly in front of them, but I could not attract their
attention. I then turned to R.W., and I asked if she knew I was there.
"Oh yes, I know you are here" she replied (mentally, or with that superconscious
communication, as she was still in oral conversation with the two girls).
I asked if she was sure that she would remember that I had been there.
"Oh, I will definitely remember," the reply came.
I said that this time I was going to make sure that she remembered.
"I will remember, I'm sure I will" R.W. said, still in oral conversation simultaneously.
I stated that I had to be sure she would remember, so I was going to pinch her.
"Oh, you don't need to do that, Til remember" R.W. said hastily.
I said I had to be sure, so I reached over and tried to pinch her, gently, 1 thought. I
pinched her in the side, just above the hips and below the rib cage. She let out a
good loud "Ow," and I backed up, because I was somewhat surprised. I really hadn't
expected to be able actually to pinch her. Satisfied that I had made some
impression, at the least, I turned and left, thought of the physical, and was back
almost immediately. I got up (physically!), and went over to the typewriter where I am
now. R.W. will not be back until Monday, and then I can determine if I made the
contact, or if it was another unidentifiable miss. Time of return, three thirty-five.
Important aftermath: It is Tuesday after the Saturday of the experiment. R.W.
returned to work yesterday, and I asked her what she had been doing Saturday
afternoon between three and four. Knowing my reason for asking, she said she
would have to think about it and let me know on Tuesday (today). Here is what she
reported today: On Saturday between three and four was the only time there was not
a crowd of people in the beach cottage where she was staying. For the first time, she
was alone with her niece (dark-haired, about eighteen) and the niece's friend (about
the same age, blond). They were in the kitchen-dining area of the cottage from about
three-fifteen to four, and she was having a drink, and the girls were having Cokes.
They were doing nothing but sitting and talking.
I asked R.W. if she remembered anything else, and she said no. I questioned her
more closely, but she could not remember anything more. Finally, in impatience, I
asked her if she remembered the pinch. A look of complete astonishment crossed
her face.
"Was that you?" She stared at me for a moment, then went into the privacy of my
office, turned, and lifted (just slightly!) the edge of her sweater where it joined her
skirt on her left side. There were two brown and blue marks at exactly the spot where
I had pinched her.
"I was sitting there, talking to the girls" R.W. said, "when all of a sudden I felt this
terrible pinch. 1 must have jumped a foot. I thought my brother-in-law had come back
and sneaked up behind me. I turned around, but there was no one there. I never had
any idea it was you! It hurt!"
I apologized for pinching so hard, and she obtained from me a promise that if I tried
any such thing again, I would try something other than a pinch that hard.
In this episode, the time coincides with the actual events.
Autosuggestion hallucination, indeterminate, as willful desire was suggested, and
preknowledge was present of general location of R.W. at that time. Identical reports
with conditions of actual events:
(1) Location (inside rather than outside).
(2) Number of people present.
(3) Description of girls.
(4) Actions of people present.
(5) The acknowledgment of pinching.
(6) Physical marks from pinching.
Possibility of unconscious preknowledge through earlier ob-servation of the above:
(1) Negative, preknowledge implied activity outdoors on beach rather than indoors.
(2) Negative, preknowledge implied adults in group, as R.W. was visiting sister and
brother-in-law.
(3) Negative-indeterminate, possibility of preknowledge of niece and hair color
through R.W. sometime previously, negative as to friend of niece, her hair color and
age.
(4) Negative, no preknowledge of non-existent habit pattern for that particular
moment of day.
(5) Negative, R.W. had no preknowledge of experimental attempt as no such attempt
had been made previously, nor was experimenter in habit of pinching R.W. Had not
done so previously.
(6) Negative, no possible way that R.W. could have known where pinch marks
should have occurred to conform with area reported.

Source : Journeys Out of Body - Robert A. Monroe
(Pdf Version Page 33)

Hmmm I smell bovine excrement.

[Threepwood]

Care to elaborate SkepticBoy?

[SkepticBoy]

I smell B.S.

[nickspry]

I'm not so sure about some of Monroes desciptions of his OBE's. His experiments all seem to work out so easily and perfectly that they just seem a bit too good to be true. AP just isn't like that in my experience. Either he really was a master at it, or he was "enhancing" his experiences to make better reading. 

[SkepticBoy]

But what Alfera is saying about pinching her friend has to be b.s. I mean come on.

[Alfera]

I'm not so sure about some of Monroes desciptions of his OBE's. His experiments all seem to work out so easily and perfectly that they just seem a bit too good to be true. AP just isn't like that in my experience. Either he really was a master at it, or he was "enhancing" his experiences to make better reading. 

he is master at it and no, his experiments dont work out so easily and perfectly

if you read the whole book you will understand

But what Alfera is saying about pinching her friend has to be b.s. I mean come on.

our beliefs limit us

everything is energy and human mind can manipulate the energy (and also thats what adrian says)
it is very much possible indeed

[nickspry]

You're quite right, I haven't read the whole book yet. I should finish it and find out what you're getting at.....

[Threepwood]

our beliefs limit us

everything is energy and human mind can manipulate the energy (and also thats what adrian says)
it is very much possible indeed

Beliefs limit us? I believe that everything is energy, and (as I said before) am open to projecting, but am finding it really hard to do. This morning 5 mins before waking up I had a strong dream, where I saw everything clearly. Just seconds after becoming conscious of the dream, I woke up. So annoying.

[iNNERvOYAGER]

I agree with SkepticBoy that it's BS in respect to why would you want to waste your time screwing around in RTZ pinching people, when you could be using the opportunity to explore fantastic alternate realities and higher consciousness?

[Threepwood]

I agree with SkepticBoy that it's BS in respect to why would you want to waste your time screwing around in RTZ pinching people, when you could be using the opportunity to explore fantastic alternate realities and higher consciousness?

That would depend on what your intentions are. Flying around in RTZ most certainly has its merits.

[Alfera]

I agree with SkepticBoy that it's BS in respect to why would you want to waste your time screwing around in RTZ pinching people, when you could be using the opportunity to explore fantastic alternate realities and higher consciousness?

he was trying to find out if you can affect people in real world and according to his experience this is possible

i personally think its so much fun wasting time screwing around in rtz pinching people and scaring the hell out of my friends

if astral projection was a magic book with 10 charges that vanish after 10 spells cast then it makes more sense to explore fantastic alternate realities and higher consciousness than screwing around in real time zone

but you can always do it you have the time you dont really have to explore fantastic alternate realities and higher consciousness

[SkepticBoy]

I agree with SkepticBoy that it's BS in respect to why would you want to waste your time screwing around in RTZ pinching people, when you could be using the opportunity to explore fantastic alternate realities and higher consciousness?

No I just think the claim of bieng able to pinch someone from the RTZ is BS. Most of the time its hard to even validate the RTZ let alone go ahead and manipulate the physical world from RTZ.

[EscapeVelocity]

First, maybe Monroe ended up 'pinching' her etheric/energy body, which resulted in a noticeable effect on her physical body; something maybe rather different from trying to tip a pencil off a table (seemingly easier but actually not).

Second, as to why Monroe would waste time in the somewhat, comparatively boring RTZ, as opposed to traveling galaxies: He admitted upfront that he wasn't always in complete control of his adventures; this particular event was described IIRC in his first book where he did manage to attempt to delineate Locales I, II and III as some kind of map for the rest of us...but hey, it was the Sixties and the guy didn't even have a compass.

[Alfera]

First, maybe Monroe ended up 'pinching' her etheric/energy body, which resulted in a noticeable effect on her physical body; something maybe rather different from trying to tip a pencil off a table (seemingly easier but actually not).

"Was that you?" She stared at me for a moment, then went into the privacy of my
office, turned, and lifted (just slightly!) the edge of her sweater where it joined her
skirt on her left side. There were two brown and blue marks at exactly the spot where
I had pinched her.

Second, as to why Monroe would waste time in the somewhat, comparatively boring RTZ, as opposed to traveling galaxies: He admitted upfront that he wasn't always in complete control of his adventures; this particular event was described IIRC in his first book where he did manage to attempt to delineate Locales I, II and III as some kind of map for the rest of us...but hey, it was the Sixties and the guy didn't even have a compass.

This afternoon, I laydown to renew experimentation, and decided I would make a strong effort to "visit"
R.W. wherever she was. (Rule one in my case always has been that I am most
successful going to someone I know •well—and the opportunity does not come up
too often.)

[SkepticBoy]

the way is see it is if it was that easy to manipulate the physical from the RTX, wouldnt an awful lot of people be feeling strange pinches and signs from people who they know who are OBE? Lets be realistic; it would be alot more common if it was able to happen.