Hello! I have a few questions...

[Xei]

Hello!

I've been interested in Lucid Dreaming for some time now, and I've had a few major shots at it. However, I've never been successful. I think I've got pretty close... But I've never hit the jackpot.

I normally try WILD-based methods, and I suppose Astral Projection falls into that category, really.

I tried some exit methods last night, and I had a feeling that I got pretty close. Here's what I did:

1. I sat back and relaxed in my bed. (I was horizontal and had a pillow).
2. I watched as the patterns in front of my eyes slowly intensified. I don't see any physical pictures, just swirls of stuff which is a little lighter than the surrounding blackness.
3. After a while of this, I checked what my physical body was like. It was numb, but I didn't feel quite 'submerged' enough, so I tried to let myself fall asleep a little more. I had a brief physical sensation of flying through a tunnel, but it wasn't very vivid.
4. I checked my physical body again. I couldn't really feel anything, and I don't think I could have moved.
5. I tried to get my dream body out of bed by hanging my legs over the side of my bed and standing up. I think I came quite close to severing it...
6. This time, I tried to sit my dream body up. Again, I think I really felt as if my two 'bodies' were beginning to tear apart. I got a feeling in my stomach which was something like excitement, and when I gave up, I felt some very slow vibrations (about 3 per second), which lasted for about five seconds.
7. I tried a few more exit methods with the same result. After a while, I guess I lost concentration and dozed off.

So... What am I doing wrong? I have a feeling that I have to be closer to a dream state, or something like that...

Thanks for any help,
Xei.

[Selski]

So... What am I doing wrong?

You are possibly trying too hard.

And expecting too much.

Enjoy the pretty patterns.  Get lost in them.  Absorb yourself in them to the point of "losing" yourself in them.  Forget your physical body totally.  Don't even go back to see how it's doing - if it needs attention, it will tell you  

Forget about what you are trying to do, and enjoy what is happening to you.

Sarah

P.S.  A piece of advice I can give you is to wait until you have a morning when you don't have to get up.  Once you have had your full night's sleep and have initially woken up, stay still and think about your dreams (rather than focusing on what you need/want to do that particular day).  Forget the "reality" of your life and drift away into sleep again... then when you next wake up.... do exactly the same... think about your dreams and drift away again.  Lower your mentality.  Keep doing this and you will become lucid.  It may take a while (i.e. weeks or months), but it does work.

[Xei]

Hmm... Okay, thanks, Selski.

Just a couple of things that are still a little unclear to me:

Firstly, is there anything in particular that you have to experience before severing your body? As in... Is there any particular stage at which you must attempt to exit?

Secondly, I'm a little confused as to how you separate your body if you are totally immersed in your mind... To me, I can't see how you could do it without any reference points. I suppose it's just something which you can only understand when you experience it..?

Thanks for the help,
Xei.

[Selski]

Firstly, is there anything in particular that you have to experience before severing your body? As in... Is there any particular stage at which you must attempt to exit?

I suppose there is a "place" or "state" that you need to reach before you can separate.  I can't describe it - it's a "knowingness" that you are ready.  I guess it comes with practice.  Once you've done it that first time, you will be better able to recognise the symptoms the next.  

The first time it happened to me, it came via a lucid dream.  I became lucid and realised that I could separate in this state.  Everything felt different, but it was very subtle.  I was incredibly clear-headed and simply walked away from my physical body.  Well, not simply, it was a bit of a struggle and it felt totally odd, like I had swollen legs, but the knowledge that I was able to separate was absolute.

The reason I advised to just revel in the patterns and what is going on in your mind is to focus yourself away from the physical.  Keep your mind in check (so it doesn't drift off to sleep), and if you remain calm and still, you should notice your awareness change, albeit very subtly.  It may be that you realise it's gone awfully quiet everywhere.  I mean deafeningly quiet.  The silence is so loud, it can hurt.  

Or you'll notice that you've been talking to someone/something, but you'll only realise this after the conversation has finished.  And you won't remember any of the conversation whatsoever.

But the very act of recognising these changes gives you the ability to keep an eye on your awareness.  You then may come to a realisation that you are now ready to separate.  Everything may become ridiculously clear and you'll feel totally liberated.  

Of course, you also might experience vibrations which is another kettle of fish.  I don't experience them, so I can't really comment, except to say if you get them, then you're well on the way - but I don't know WHEN there is a time during the vibes that you can separate - perhaps someone else who does get the vibes can fill you in on that score.  

Secondly, I'm a little confused as to how you separate your body if you are totally immersed in your mind... To me, I can't see how you could do it without any reference points. I suppose it's just something which you can only understand when you experience it..?

I know what you mean and where you are coming from, but in my opinion, you don't need reference points.  There is just this "Aaah, this is what they are talking about, it's so obvious now" and away you go.  

I guess your last sentence says it all.

Keep practicing - you'll get there! :juggle:

Sarah

[MindFreak]

Relax yourself out of your body. Do not force anything. Just keep relaxing your body deeper and deeper while remaining alert mentally. Some people get the threshold feelings and get impatient and try to get out  right away. That will ruin it. You have to keep going deeper, relaxing more and more and soon you will get your astral sight and basically pop out of your body without any effort.

[Xei]

Thankyou! Your posts have clarified a lot of points. Selski, your point about not remembering what you were doing, but being sure that you were doing something - I've had that before. Last night, in fact. I thought I was just being stupid. ^^

I think I know what to do now. I'll call back if I have any further issues.

Thanks again,
Xei.