Hello friends,
Before i continue i would like to say that what i mean with "FACT" is that what is experienced is " reliable external data entering the individuals mind from a source other than his own brain cells " and that "FACT" , " the person is not mentally ill in any way " . Fiction is obvious, but for those who can't see it, " Created by the mind, perhaps somewhere deep, where the conscious is not usually aware, possibly created by a brain disease or mental illness " .
How big of a deal is this "idea" of being able to access a whole new world with boundless possibilities? How interested, curious and determined should one be to obtain the true light over this knowledge?
Personally i am extremely devoted to this area of study because i highly value the power these possibilities hold, and the countless number of consequences and knock on effects they would have on what we believe to be "reality". Saying all of this, leads me to another subject of mine, Data Integrity. With so many people in this world, so many personality types, so many emotions influencing people's decisions, how can one curious user possibly filter through all of the information and opinions presented? The task seems unbearably tough, and if really the truth is so god- smacking different to what we "normal" folks consider to be reality now, then it should be the most easiest of task to obtain the CORRECT information. The entire topic is very ambiguous when it really should not be. I have seen people posting a lot on the lines of , experience beats believing and things like this, ok fair enough, but i am not a "see to believe" type of person, i can trust you, if you want to be trusted.
As i put on my other posts, my skype id is : d3nd3-o0 , please do not hesitate to add me if you hold any valuable information which will set me free from these chains i find myself under.
To all those people who are on the side of FACT , then I do challenge you, i do ask you to come forward, and i do ask you to test your own beliefs. You do all have a responsibility to share with me and the rest of your race, the reasoning behind your beliefs and why you are thiniking that the reasoning is enough for you to attach a belief system to this knowledge. Together we can form a mission, to spread the true word to many many people, and get this finally out in to the open.
And now to all of those people who are on the side of FICTION, add me on skype, "d3nd3-o0", where you can take part in discussions and mind-opening exercises to help us appreciate the world around us. We FICTIONOUS people can only judge by the evidence we have in front of us, but that does not mean that we are not open to a new belief system, of course we are, we want the truth just like you do. Also i am sure that us group of people would love to try and "experience" the beauty of this wonderful world within us all, so techniques are highly welcomed, from people who are experienced users with strong validation as to why their tehcniques are effective. If the techniques you give me don't work, and we test them to find that they are nothing but junk, then i will post here to say that to warn other curious users to not waste their time on your mis directions, please, be sure before you post anything.
Peace & Love d3nd3 xxx
Let's get one thing out of the way... I have nothing to prove to you, nor does anyone else here.
You want surefire techniques on a silver platter? You're in the wrong place, bro. I'd direct you to the Astral FAQ, Permanent Astral Topics sections, and Xanth's (the mod here) website... just like I would for any ordinary person that comes here with an interest in the topic. You aren't any more special than them so you aren't about to be given the royal treatment.
If you have questions or need help along the way, feel free to ask. If you get frusterated and your goal changes into discrediting this practice I don't doubt one of the mods will serve you up a fat helping of BAN... but not before you digest this humble pie... trust me, it'll benefit you in the end. :wink:
Greetings
The best way for anyone to prove the reality of OBE and astral projection is to experience it for themself and then decide. I would add one item regarding proof and that is that the "Phasing"method of OBE is VERY similar to remote viewing. And remote viewing HAS been proved to be effective. After all, the US Army And CIA ran remote viewing programs (secretly of course) for many years and there were many verified successes with those programs.
Second, regarding proof, there are Many documented cases of people who were out of their physical bodies during a NDE (Near Death Experience) who heard and saw things that they could not have seen or heard otherwise and these Were later verified as true by either medical personnel or family members (or both). See www.nderf.org for a huge list of NDEs (many of them containing verifiable information.)
Regards 8-)
Grey
Quote from: Astral316 on April 22, 2011, 14:16:11
Let's get one thing out of the way... I have nothing to prove to you, nor does anyone else here.
You want surefire techniques on a silver platter? You're in the wrong place, bro. I'd direct you to the Astral FAQ, Permanent Astral Topics sections, and Xanth's (the mod here) website... just like I would for any ordinary person that comes here with an interest in the topic. You aren't any more special than them so you aren't about to be given the royal treatment.
If you have questions or need help along the way, feel free to ask. If you get frusterated and your goal changes into discrediting this practice I don't doubt one of the mods will serve you up a fat helping of BAN... but not before you digest this humble pie... trust me, it'll benefit you in the end. :wink:
i see people claiming to have found such immensely important information, i feel responsible to test and teach this knowledge to others, so i will join d3nd3 in his mission
why are you so aggressively trying to disturbe astral316?
nobody forces you to prove anything but i think you should feel responsible with such immensily important information
do you want to keep all the information to yourself? are you egoistic? you are a single human just like everybody else, nothing special ok?
why do u make him seem like a princess who wants everything be made for her? i see him forming a mission of high importance, u do not want that everybody knows about obes and stuff? there it seems to be the basic concept of reallity?
you seem very immature to me with ban ban ban, cant you talk instead of allways makeing war? it makes me sick...
Come on dude... If you really are dedicated you would aim to experience it for yourself. We can't prove anything to you. We can't experience it for you. If you don't believe OBE is possible it will be a major belief-barrier to success. Read a few books on the subject, form your own opinions, use a scientific and skeptical mind. I get the impression you are trying to disprove something that doesn't fit your worldview, because it challenges your belief system. Maybe I am wrong.
Btw, it's fairly obvious when you make a puppet account.
Here is a great video about belief-systems that I think everyone should learn from: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1S8AKHhNehU
I'll just echo Astral316's sentiment here: Let's get one thing out of the way... I have nothing to prove to you, nor does anyone else here.
d3nd3, you learn to project to prove to yourself, because there is, literally, no way to prove to someone who hasn't experienced it that it's real. :)
As I said, if you're willing to put in the time and effort, I have no doubt you'll be able to answer your own questions.
d3nd3, we have lots of threads or posts here with validations if that's what you seek
otherwise, for me such threads here are like a deja vu "oh no not again.." event, and make this smiley all the more valuable to me: :roll: :roll: :roll:
anyway, here's for starters:
http://reconnection.lima-city.de/OBE-Verification/index.html
8-)
Quote from: d3nd3 on April 22, 2011, 14:02:19
.... We FICTIONOUS people can only judge by the evidence we have in front of us...
http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=fictionous
:-o :-P
Quote from: c0sm0nautt on April 22, 2011, 16:26:52
Come on dude... If you really are dedicated you would aim to experience it for yourself. We can't prove anything to you. We can't experience it for you. If you don't believe OBE is possible it will be a major belief-barrier to success. Read a few books on the subject, form your own opinions, use a scientific and skeptical mind. I get the impression you are trying to disprove something that doesn't fit your worldview, because it challenges your belief system. Maybe I am wrong.
Btw, it's fairly obvious when you make a puppet account.
why do you think he is not dedicated?
QuotePersonally i am extremely devoted to this area of study because i highly value the power these possibilities hold
this sounds very dedicated to me
yes you can prove it to him
QuoteI have seen people posting a lot on the lines of , experience beats believing and things like this, ok fair enough, but i am not a "see to believe" type of person, i can trust you, if you want to be trusted.
puppet account? i could take it as an insult to be called a puppet, but i dont even know you, you with your vast amount of imagination and assumptions
Quote from: Xanth on April 22, 2011, 17:18:43
I'll just echo Astral316's sentiment here: Let's get one thing out of the way... I have nothing to prove to you, nor does anyone else here.
d3nd3, you learn to project to prove to yourself, because there is, literally, no way to prove to someone who hasn't experienced it that it's real. :)
As I said, if you're willing to put in the time and effort, I have no doubt you'll be able to answer your own questions.
by talking and getting to know each other very well on a deep basis i belive you can prove this to someone without haveing experiences
or maybe if ones analsys ability is very high developed it is easier too
if you dont want to show it to him and help him, dont do it, but do u people really have to come here with your sentences which you probably tell to every person you see on the street and break his attempt to seek truth?
Quote from: Volgerle on April 22, 2011, 17:31:27
http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=fictionous
:-o :-P
changeing topic to grammar mistakes? Really?
lol i suddenly feel the need to complain about your double posting
Quote from: alfalfa on April 22, 2011, 18:02:44
by talking and getting to know each other very well on a deep basis i belive you can prove this to someone without haveing experiences
or maybe if ones analsys ability is very high developed it is easier too
My truths can't be your truths with you actually experiencing it for yourself.
Quoteif you dont want to show it to him and help him, dont do it, but do u people really have to come here with your sentences which you probably tell to every person you see on the street and break his attempt to seek truth?
I've mentioned it several times already, the people on this site are more than willing to help you and d3nd3 to experience things for yourself.
The only proof we can give you is the ability to find out for yourself.
If you're not willing to put in the time and effort, then I'm sorry, but you've come to the wrong place.
Quote from: Xanth on April 22, 2011, 18:13:20
My truths can't be your truths with you actually experiencing it for yourself.
I've mentioned it several times already, the people on this site are more than willing to help you and d3nd3 to experience things for yourself.
The only proof we can give you is the ability to find out for yourself.
If you're not willing to put in the time and effort, then I'm sorry, but you've come to the wrong place.
i am very willingly to take any efforts nessecary
i am merely trying to defend d3nd3 by pointing out that it is indeed possible to prove this to another person without haveing the other person to have an experience
its the situation:
there is a group of people stranded on an island ( yes im watching the episodes lost, Dont tell me the end plz! )
one from the group sais that there is fresh water over the hill
what would you think? i would belive him because it is a very well possible possibility
Quote from: alfalfa on April 22, 2011, 18:17:16
i am very willingly to take any efforts nessecary
Good to know. :)
Quotei am merely trying to defend d3nd3 by pointing out that it is indeed possible to prove this to another person without haveing the other person to have an experience
Unfortunately, you would be wrong. But meh.
Quoteits the situation:
there is a group of people stranded on an island ( yes im watching the episodes lost, Dont tell me the end plz! )
one from the group sais that there is fresh water over the hill
what would you think? i would belive him because it is a very well possible possibility
What "proof" would you accept when everything we talk about doesn't exist within the confines of this physical reality?
Honestly, it's a noble goal.. a lofty one too. Many have come before you... *ALL* have failed.
Suffice to say, it's nobody's job or priority here to prove any of this to anyone who isn't willing to take the steps to do it themselves.
Your requests for such proof will fall upon deaf ears and will go unanswered.
Quote from: alfalfa on April 22, 2011, 18:02:44
puppet account? i could take it as an insult to be called a puppet, but i dont even know you, you with your vast amount of imagination and assumptions
It doesn't take a 'vast amount of imagination' to realize this account was registered 13 minutes after the other one, only common sense... but if you had even that you'd address this forum with some tact, especially when trying to persuade us to go on your little pseudo mission to bring truth to the world. Newsflash... the truth is already there. People will acknowledge it when they're ready... which is why this forum gets a steady increase in members. You on the other hand... honestly I think you're just here to kill time and have a laugh at someone's expense. How sad.
Were being trolled here....
Hey d3nd3,
I do have to ask this, but what does the concept of astral projection/OBEs mean to you (as a person)? Like other's have posted here, you have to want to have a projection experience - boredom or just having a feeling it should happen because it might be "cool" won't get you anywhere (if this is the case).
Also, I'll give an example that I used to use back in High School - A Friend (named Friend A for simplicity) and myself were both Trumpet players in concert band - Friend A spent a lot of time after class taking notes, getting lessons, basically studying any material he could on the topic. I, in contrast, didn't do anything except work on my own, and listened to how the music "felt" to me. Now, whenever it came to Chair positions (which are a big deal in HS), I always beat Friend A out. The reason was that while Friend A believed he knew everything about the subject of trumpet-playing, he never really "felt" the music (it was all scientific to him, no emotion whatsoever).
Although it may seem off-topic, you remind me of my friend; you seem to be the person that studies long into the night on certain subjects, and then when it comes time to try what you know (such as a projection attempt), you can't seem to make it work.
Also, why do you want a face-to-face method of communication? Because unless you're profiling us by body language to determine if we're lying, the evidence you need to look at is all in these forums.
Finally, (back on topic, sorry for sliding into a tangent) Regardless of the "nature" of the projections (disease, vivid/lucid dream, all in the mind, etc.), I have experienced the phenomenon known as astral projection. This has occurred on numerous occasions, and under uncontrolled and semi-controlled conditions (all my projection attempts are experiments - For example, if a particular method has worked for me, I will try to replicate the process and document any changes that happen).
So d3nd3, I have a challenge for you as well - For one week (or more, depending on the amount of time you have available to try & project), lose the "skeptic ego". As in, pretend that you are just now learning about projection - don't treat it as a True/False "if it is invisible then it doesn't exist" phenomenon, but approach the topic with an open mind. This was the barrier for me - I couldn't accept the idea that it might be possible that people could do this, even though I couldn't at the time.
As a closing note (for now :-D), you mentioned that you'll be hovering around the forums for 60-ish years - in the meantime, try to experience some kind of projection. If you fail at first, be like a scientist & keep trying. If you find a method that brought you close to projection, modify it and see if you get the same results.
No offense meant in any of this post whatsoever.
-Fossilera