Which is the best?
Laying down with arms and legs spread out, or sitting in a chair?
Or is the best crossing your arms across your chest laying down?
i lay down
There is no "best". :)
There is only what is "best for you".
~Ryan :)
boring.
and predictable.
But true.
Get in whatever position you feel will do you the best. You don't want to fall asleep, but you don't want to be uncomfortable.
the easyist is laying down. right hand on the middle of your chest , left just below your navel. where the v from your thumb and finger meet. paying attention to your breathing and body for a minute or so. then bringing focus to your forehead, between your eyes , about a half inch higher, that's what works for me, a little more detailed but i experiance ob in about 5 min. :wink: hope this helps. only thing, very easy to fall a sleep by accident
Quote from: misinformedia on May 25, 2010, 11:43:41
the easyist is laying down. right hand on the middle of your chest , left just below your navel. where the v from your thumb and finger meet. paying attention to your breathing and body for a minute or so. then bringing focus to your forehead, between your eyes , about a half inch higher, that's what works for me, a little more detailed but i experiance ob in about 5 min. :wink: hope this helps. only thing, very easy to fall a sleep by accident
See... now my opinion is that all that intricate hand and finger positioning really means nothing.
Well, what I mean is that it only means something if you THINK it means something.
~Ryan
not really, it helps you get into the motion and pace of you breathing. keeps you from drifting off to thinking about other things, what do you do, some times i do just keep them at my sides.
Quote from: misinformedia on May 25, 2010, 11:53:51
not really, it helps you get into the motion and pace of you breathing. keeps you from drifting off to thinking about other things, what do you do, some times i do just keep them at my sides.
And it only does that because you think it does.
You do realize the difference, right?
I'm also just referring to the hand/finger/body positions that you speak of.
Not the technique itself... which, I guess, in the long run, is also just a precursor to preparing your mind for the shift.
~Ryan :)
i know what your saying and no, i dont think it has to be just "cuase i think it does'" . but may be your right, like i said whats your technique then, share some in site.
Some comfort is required. Too comfortable and you may sleep. Too uncomfortable and you may be distracted by your body.
Put yourself in a position that allows you to breathe unobstructed. You should be free of distractions caused by your body. I have heard that laying on your back with your forearms perpendicular to your body creates enough distraction to keep your consciousness aware but I have never used that method.
I have never felt it necessary to hold yourself in any "hand/finger/body positions", really, why would you? The process has to do with your mind, not your body and that is the point here I think. There are varying opinions though and most are correct because it has to do with YOUR capabilities and what eventually works best for you.
I prefer comfort, either reclined or laying on my back. I do not lay on my sides or stomach. I do not sit unless supported. I once had a very large bean bag which worked especially well. :-)
ENJOY!
Quote from: misinformedia on May 25, 2010, 12:46:03
i know what your saying and no, i dont think it has to be just "cuase i think it does'" . but may be your right, like i said whats your technique then, share some in site.
I lie down however is comfortable for me at that time. Sometimes on my back... sometimes on my side... sometimes in the most contorted position you've ever seen... but if it works *for me*, then that's what I do. I don't, however, expect it to work for anyone else but me. I can pass the information along, sure... but in the end, you need to go through whatever paces you need to to find *your* position (and it sounds like you have found yours :) ).
See what I mean now?
This "contorted position" of mine might or might not work for you too.
That's what I'm saying.
Basically, what you're doing is giving a mystical meaning to a position which is just that... a random position.
If that's what you need to get yourself into a relaxed state, then more power to you. ;)
As Robert Monroe said... move your body into a comfortable position free from points of stress or pain.
~Ryan
xanth, the problem with that is, your tring to reinvent the wheel. it took thousands of years for people that spent generations studing this to figure out the best positions. you cant just do what ever you want. its going to be harder and take longer to get results you want.
its like you have triage wheels on your car and your telling every one it works for you.
if you know what works, is proven to work, and has worked for thousands of yrs, why waste your time!
Quote from: misinformedia on May 25, 2010, 14:46:38
you cant just do what ever you want. its going to be harder and take longer to get results you want.
Why can't I?
Why is it going to be harder and take longer to get the results I want?
If I want to meditate standing on my head, and it works for me... who are those mystics to say I'm doing it wrong? :)
~Ryan
I know that for myself, putting my hands on my chest or stomach during an attempt is a no-go. Feeling my hands and arms moving up and down with my breathing, as well as the extra weight there, is uncomfortable.
I've found it doesn't work to try it holding the genitals either. Too distracting, comfortable, but distracting. Don't be distracted by your body - that means something different for pretty much everyone.
Quote from: Psilibus on May 25, 2010, 15:45:45
I've found it doesn't work to try it holding the genitals either. Too distracting, comfortable, but distracting. Don't be distracted by your body - that means something different for pretty much everyone.
Sorry, but that made me laugh. :)
~Ryan
It made me look at page one. :lol:
I have to lay on my back with my hands at my sides, but not touching my torso, and my legs spread about 2 feet apart.
I can't project if there is a blanket touching me, but i can project when i'm under a blanket up to my neck.
Quote from: personalreality on May 25, 2010, 19:34:35
I have to lay on my back with my hands at my sides, but not touching my torso, and my legs spread about 2 feet apart.
I can't project if there is a blanket touching me, but i can project when i'm under a blanket up to my neck.
Strange, your comment about the blanket. I absolutely cannot stand to have a blanket or anything over my toes. A blanket or comforter pressing down on my toes drives me nuts and consumes all my attention. It has been that way for thirty years and I cannot change it despite many attempts.
I guess you could say I project with "cold feet". :lol:
Quote from: personalreality on May 25, 2010, 19:34:35
I have to lay on my back with my hands at my sides, but not touching my torso, and my legs spread about 2 feet apart.
I can't project if there is a blanket touching me, but i can project when i'm under a blanket up to my neck.
That is literally exactly how I project :lol:
Anyways, Disinfo, what is the traditional thousands of years old position for astral projection? Although I usualy project from lying on my back, I have projected/gotten into trance on my side, my front, sitting in a chair, and sleeping on my desk at school.
EDIT: Ahh, so the best method is some hand positioning thing... Im sorry but if you think that is a consistent astral projection method amongst all cultures that knew about it for millenia, you are very wrong.
Quote from: Psilibus on May 25, 2010, 15:45:45
I've found it doesn't work to try it holding the genitals either.
That depends on whose genitals you're holding :-D
No I'd say any position which is not your normal sleeping position is ok. For me, I normally sleep on my side so my back is best for projecting. If I try it on my side I fall asleep too easily.
the problem with laying on my back is falling a sleep. it usually starts with me when i fell like im floating over my body like a foot above
The ancient position is to project from like a 38 degree angle or something.
There are Egyptian carvings of people laying on a table at an angle that people say is a depiction of AP.
Nickspry-
I like the comment about not positioning yourself how you would sleep. Key idea. Sweet.
i lay exactly like i sleep
Quote from: personalreality on May 26, 2010, 21:47:46
i lay exactly like i sleep
At a 38 degree angle? :wink:
Quote from: Psilibus on May 27, 2010, 03:59:37
At a 38 degree angle? :wink:
:lol:
I use a recliner, the best of both worlds.
lol, yea mushroomman, i sleep at a 38 degree angle
i find that attempting AP is easier when i do it in a position that i sleep in because it's easier for me to let my awareness drift down if i think i'm going to sleep.
i also do a lot of trance practice as i'm going to sleep at night and just spend some time staying awake in that state. it helps.
Agreed, it helps. I like watching the dreamy images start up, getting caught up and pulling myself out just before I lose control then going back again and repeating until I give in and enter full sleep. Of course that is not when I am intending to project, but just before I give myself up to sleep. That practice is what has led me to agree with the phasing concept. "Phasing" just doesn't seem to work for me. That trance state is just a heartbeat away from full release and.
and?
I tested many different sleep positions while in OBE, taking the time before/after upon coming back from the experience. It does not matter period North-South-East-West which works better. I have been able to project in riding cars, airplanes, during class, a t work - where ever.
Don't get wrapped up into esoteric mystic beliefs that positioning is the key to project. It is not or does the moon phases make a difference either. I went down that path many times believing that this item, or that symbol would make me a better project or was doing it for me. It all comes down to is self-will trial and error.
Good luck.
Dave
Quote from: tvos on May 30, 2010, 23:16:33
I tested many different sleep positions while in OBE, taking the time before/after upon coming back from the experience. It does not matter period North-South-East-West which works better. I have been able to project in riding cars, airplanes, during class, a t work - where ever.
Don't get wrapped up into esoteric mystic beliefs that positioning is the key to project. It is not or does the moon phases make a difference either. I went down that path many times believing that this item, or that symbol would make me a better project or was doing it for me. It all comes down to is self-will trial and error.
Good luck.
Dave
That's the exact advice I've been trying to get across. LoL
And it's the "esoteric mystic beliefs" that I'm trying to rid myself of in my practices.
~Ryan :)
yah... a lot of people get very wrapped up into objects, crystals, tapes, books that get inudated with all of this stuff thinking there is a magical pill. Now, please note that I am not knocking any of these at all because I did try a lot of them - how ever when I stripped everything down to the basic's it came down to myself doing the very hard work.
it is a process of trial and error - see what works and what doesn't - but at it's core "it is you"..
Dave
i still use crystals but not for ap
too distracting.
sometimes i use them to help induce deep trance, but not for ap
not saying that these symbols, objects are invalid and can't help - maybe in the beginning it is good to experiment, but not long term using as a crutch.
back in the say i would use a crystal pyramid and place it over my 3rd eye while falling asleep. i tell ya, waking up in the morning with a pyramid mark on your face is rather embarrassing - try to explain that to your boss, teacher, or family... :)
dw