Personally I have been called crazy by many of my relatives who know about my interest in astral projection and qigong. I try to avoid the topic but today it came up again and I had a long argument with one of them. It actually got me thinking if it's possible to prove OBE and if it has been done before. In theory it should be a simple experiment: Someone writes something and hangs it on the wall, I go out of my body in another room and then project myself to that room and read the note. However I haven't practiced for a few years and my skills are a bit rusty. So I'd like to know if anyone has done this before and if there are difficulties to do such a thing in the so called real time zone.
Yep, i always tell to myself to try this,but when i get into OBE,I either forget and start doing something else,either i don't have enough courage and OBE time to do it.
Don't worry about proving it to anyone but yourself. :)
Stay away from discussing this stuff with people who you know think you're nuts. You're not going to convince them... ever.
Each person has to come to this at their own time under their own steam.
It's possible. Remote Viewing might be more reliable though.
Hi,
Stuff 'em, they think the worlds flat. Such losers. You're in the jet set here, enjoy.
Safe travels.
I had my cousin draw a picture and hang it in her room, and i've been trying to go see it for about a year now.. The closest I got was a lucid dream, and I ended up inventing the picture myself... I still have yet to project there in the real time zone... I've made it in her room a couple times but it was too dark! I'll get there. :)
I have been in that position before... alot. It's so hard when you experience something like OBE's you want to tell the world. Unfortunately some people will think you are coo coo for coco puffs. I would always try to have these experiments etc. I would see if I could read a card I flipped over without looking at it before projecting etc. I finally decided after a while that I wasn't able to have any OBE's because this was always on my mind. Trying to verify. Now, I just experience. I find alot of my verifications happen when I am out of body. I will ask myself something and remember to check it when I "get back to body" I have had an amazing verification on my last OBE with my grandma. I saw what she was wearing... I haden't seen her all day. Got back to body... And she was wearing and doing the exact same thing I saw her doing in the OBE. That right there was a great experience. :-D I found that I will still talk about it to my friends... even if they don't believe it. It means alot the still be my friend after telling them. But now I really don't talk about it too much with anyone except the folks on astral pulse. It doesn't matter what they believe in the end. They will see for themselves I believe. I am just so happy I have found this gift earlier than most people. It really has changed my life.
Hi rezaf,
Yes the only way to prove that it is possible to project your consciousness away from your physical body is to obtain knowledge during a projection which you would never have known before.
I tried the card trick,by placing a random unseen card face up out of sight from where I was laying. Go into projection and go see the card. Guess what? I couldn't get it to work. How many people in here have?
For me it was a shame, because I wanted to prove that what I was doing wasn't just some mind trick in my own head. The purpose of astral projection for me, was to prove that there is more to life and me than just the physical world. Yes I have had some great astral projections, very real controlled vivid dreams. But I haven't proven that its anything extra terrestrial to myself. I'm not going to go down a belief system that I am beaming my consciousness into a wider reality based on a vivid lucid dream.
I agree with what others are saying here. We can't prove what we dream. In fact we can barely prove that we even do dream. Its just accepted because everyone has done it. But if you were to say to someone "I had a mad dream last night, I was having sex with Pamela Anderson".. How can you prove it? You can't. You can't take something none physical and present it physically. Its just not possible. If you do want to talk to people about your experience. Instead of using the term Astral Projection, just use Lucid Dreaming. Its pretty well accepted now that there is such thing as Lucid Dreaming, and to be honest Astral Projection isn't much different. Everything is just a label for a non physical experience.
Absolutely Boom. It's very hard to adopt a belief system based on some vivid dreams no matter how amazing they are. I have had validations in my LD/APs which were very good, sufficient in fact to convince me of ESP at the least. But there are people who experience such a feeling of utter reality during OOB that they are convinced it is real. I have come very close to this but can't say I am totally convinced.
What I do find quite intriguing though is the spherical or 360 degree vision which some people spontaneously experience. I can't find any sensible explanation for this other than to assume it is what it appears to be, namely point consciousness operating and perceiving in it's natural environment.
desert-rat, wow that would be something :) so not only managing an astral projection to the RTZ. But to actually manipulate his physical surroundings whilst in there. That would be incredibly impressive!
catmenow: Yup people seem to have experiences which convince them of the realities of Astral Projection. But the brain is good at convincing us of stuff. What about schizophrenia, where the person is convinced that they are hearing noises, or other mental conditions where the sufferer is convinced without a shadow of a doubt of something that is not real. Also, people get convinced of an afterlife due to an near death experience. But there is still the counter argument against it that its the brains reaction to a lack of oxygen and cells shutting down etc. I don't know, maybe I'm just too sceptical, but for me I'd like to prove it for myself by aquiring knowledge whilst in the astral that I could not have known about before. This can be by any means, for example. Projecting to the real time zone, and seeing a unusual car parked down the road. Then getting up and going to check it out myself. Or an entity telling me something which I can later match up in reality. "My name is John Doe I died in 1998 in a house fire" - check news history and wham wow. Then its proven for me :)
Yeah I actually considered trying to EVP myself. Because I figured out that if someone is deceased, then they are out of body.. So my idea was to set up a tape recording an empty room far away from where I was physically. Then go out of body, and go to the room where the tape is recording. Try and shout a lot or cause energy to get on the tape. Wake up, play the tape back :)
That would be life changing if I succeeded with that one.
The biggest frustration I had, is that as much as I tried, getting a decent out of body experience at will was just impossible. I'd manage a semi decent OBE about once a month :( I realised I'd have died of old age by the time I get any good at it! If I could have just gone OBE at will, by throwing some kind of internal switch, then that'd have been awesome.
Boom, I've been studying NDEs quite a lot and there really is a strong case to be made which science should listen to. The sort of RTZ validations you talk about are made regularly and reliably in NDE reports. This is something I haven't seen the skeptics address properly. Having experienced ESP I really do know that it is real, so I reckon all these NDErs are truly seeing, accurately, from a point outside their physical bodies.
The oxygen starvation argument is nonsense, as far as I can tell. That's because their is absolutely NO statistical correlation between oxygen starvation and NDE. Let me explain....
1. In an IANDS study of 787 NDE reports, only 63.9% of cases involved clinical death or serious injury. The other 36.1% did not involve an injury which might cause oxygen starvation (many NDEs occur because the subject simply believes he is about to die, although he is healthy). Yet this non oxygen starved group described exactly the same experiences as the oxygen starved group.
2. Within the oxygen starved group, accounting for 63.9% of cases, 24.8% cases were clinically dead and 39.1% were seriously injured. According to current medical understanding, a clinically dead person can not have a lucid conscious experience, regardless of how oxygen starved they are. If your brain is so profoundly oxygen starved that it is dead, it can not think and perceive.
3. In a study by Pim van Lommel, of cardiac arrest subjects who were later revived, only 18% reported NDEs. All cardiac arrest subjects were oxygen starved, but 82% did not report NDEs.
So, we have the situation where
1) 36.1% of NDE subjects are not oxygen starved but nevertheless describe typical NDEs.
2) 24.8% of NDE subjects were so profoundly oxygen starved that medically any form of consciousness should be impossible.
3) 82% of oxygen starved subjects do not describe any type of NDE.
Statistically there is absolutely NO correlation between oxygen starvation and NDE experiences. Since there is ZERO correlation, we cannot assume any causality. Quite frankly, any scientist who suggests oxygen starvation as a reason for the experience, must explain these statistics. They can't just be ignored.
There may well be a physical explanation for NDEs, but oxygen starvation isn't it!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=25fBDJ1EiSA&feature=youtube_gdata_player
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ajqSInV2oCA&feature=youtube_gdata_player
I believe trying to prove this has been a topic on here many a time and has never had any success.
That's true, there has been very little success with direct validations. However do look at the validation thread
http://www.astralpulse.com/forums/welcome_to_permanent_astral_topics/validation_thread-t25607.0.html
I started this thread by describing a shared dream/LD/AP (call it what you like). This was a LD in which I visited my parent's home and interacted with my mother. Later I spoke to her by phone and she described what to her was a terrifying dream, which matched my dream in every detail. Details such as her observing me pass through the front door, make objects fly around etc. In other words, not a dream which anyone would have by chance.
Has anyone on these forums done any successful direct validation experiments like what I described in my first post? I'd appreciate it if you could give me the link of the posts or threads.
Yeah I'm always interested in hearing stories of proof :) I find it alarming that people read up about this stuff on here, try it, find it works and then start going down a huge belief system about exactly what Astral Projection is. My limited experiences has told me one thing, and one thing only:
An Astral Projection is a strong realistic dream like state in which I can control.
I have yet to find proof that I'm expanding my consciousness outside of my physical body, or that I'm communicating with spirits, and that I am anything more than a physical body. Focus models mean nothing to me. I have not ended up in any other dimensions.
Got to say Boom, you do have a point. I'm agnostic on this, but certainly leaning on the side that "something strange" is going on. Something strange is definitely going on during LDs. These are occasionally "shared" by two or more people. Also, people who are "out" are occasionally seen by others as recognizable forms in the physical world. Take a look at the Validation thread for examples.
However, direct "card trick" validations are few and far between, and the ones which succeed are dodgy, eg getting the card number wrong but the suit right. But I will keep on saying THIS: Whilst direct validation during OBE is really hard and rare, validation during NDE is very common. I think we should be looking to NDE for "proof".
I actually have a theory that there is a law built into the very fabric of this physical universe, which disallows absolute validation. If we were able to achieve absolute validation, this would permanently let the cat out of the bag, and destroy the usefulness of the physical world as a spiritual learning environment. So I think there is a built in rule which always ensures that any experiment which might prove that consciousness survives physical death, will always produce ambiguous results. It will neither prove nor disprove it.
I've coined the phrase "observer effect" (as in quantum physics) to describe this. The act of observing, for example during an experiment, alters the outcome of the experiment in such a way as to always render results ambiguous. This is why I think Sam Parnia's Aware study will not produce conclusive results.
I did have a very realistic OBE not to long ago. I have shared this in a few other topics but I will share this again because it's my favorite OBE that I have had. :-D
I laid down in my bed to get some extra rest before me and my grandma went to dinner at this restaurant. I had just woken up because she called me on this intercom thing and asked if I wanted to go out to dinner. I was stoked and said sure! I laid back down in bed for about 5 minutes because she wasn't ready yet. It didn't take but 15 seconds after closing my eyes. I immediately fell into vibrations. I literally felt my energy body if you would like to call it that.. rise above my physical. I felt extremely light. It was a wonderful feeling though. I just popped right out. I was 100% aware what was going on. It was more realistic than this right now.
I didn't see my grandma all day so I walked through the door that leads to the upstairs where she lives. I heard a BOOM as a passed through it. It took a little effort... but I walked through like it was nothing. xD
I then saw my grandma. I was tapping her on the shoulders shouting to get her attention. She didn't even notice me. I could feel the clothes as I touched. So I observed what she was wearing and doing. I mentally noted... "black shirt... grey sweats..." She looks like she is feeding the dogs. I walked to the other side of the kitchen to observe the dogs. They didn't notice me lol. xD I wouldn't either if food was almost in my reach!
About ten seconds later an entity tackled me to the kitchen floor and said "good job Cody!!!" Or something along those lines. It was a friendly tackle though. But I can't quite remember what was said because I hit the floor like a sack of potatoes. This startled me so I awoke back in my body. I immediately went upstairs (In this body) lol xD And there was my grandma. Black shirt, grey sweats, and had two dog bowls in her hands. I was shocked to say the least... Best validation so far. It's funny though because I have had OBE's that have made zero sense and were quite weird and slow... This one though was so different. I think I was so aware. Everything had color to it and was so crystal clear. There was no aches or pains or feeling of sadness for me. It was a great day. :-)
Cool.... Army, would you say that your level of consciousness was higher than physical consciousness, lower or the same? If it was higher or the same, did the experience seem "real" or "utterly real"? I understand about the fantasy elements. When these intrude as they do it makes you wonder if the whole thing is just some weird dream!
Thats awesome. I tried the card trick many of times. But getting a decent OBE was so few and far between, one loses patience after some months.
However I did have one interesting card trick result, which may go along the lines of "no direct validation" believe and take it as you will.
So I'd shuffle the deck face down so I dont see any cards. I'd then pull a random card out of the deck, and place it face up on a shelf. As I do this I look away and close my eyes to make sure I dont see that card at all. I then place the rest of the pack face down on the side. I then go to bed. From my bed I cannot see the cards at all, they are at the other side of the room and out of my sight.
I had an OBE, and went to see the card. In OBE state it was tough to see it. I had to becareful not to guess, and create that card. But I woke up with the red 7 of diamonds in my head. I wrote this down on a piece of paper... I then went to check the card. Completely wrong. Black Jack of Spades. Out of interest I looked at the pack of cards sitting on the side, and turned the top one over... bang.. red 7 of diamonds! :)
That is probably the best and one and only sort of validation I have ever had. I want more.. but to do that i need more good OBE's. Unfortunately I've accomplished like one or two a month at best. So progress is slow. Slower than trying to run Windows 7 on a 386.
Boom, that's how it works. I once tried to see the national lottery numbers in an LD. As soon as I got them I woke myself up and wrote them down. Later that week I bought a ticket using those six numbers. The lottery came and went and not one number came up. However, in the EURO lottery, all six numbers came up. Three came up correctly and the other three came up reversed ie 43 instead of 34. So right(ish) numbers, wrong lottery!
Oooh there is a big difference between predicting the card, and the lottery.
The lottery hasn't happened yet, and as such is a future prediction. The card was turned in the past and is in the present :)
But yup it was an interesting validation for me.. but I need more!!
Catmeow- I think that my awareness was definitely like it is now. Only it was different. Everything felt so much different, but I had full control over everything that I did. Making a conscious decision and then doing it. In a dream things just happen for the heck of it you know? This was extremely different in every way. I have also had OBE's that felt like dreams. That's why I definitely think that dreams are OBES, just you have a much higher awareness. I would say it was the same but felt "better". I am sure I could make it even higher though. Still really new to this!
ArmyOfOne - then it was the real deal! Most of my regular dreams seem to involve flying, but don't become strictly lucid. I've always thought that these must be OOBEs in some way, even though the level of consciousness was low. It's hard to figure out exactly what is going on.... Incompletely remembered OOBEs?
We can not give objective proof of the non-physical. Astral Projection, Remote Viewing, Lucid Dreams are all subjective experiences that can not be validated with the current scientific method, at least not yet. Try not to worry about proving the reality of these experiences to anyone else but yourself. Often times we feel like we need to prove it to someone else in order to convince ourselves. Keep a healthy balance of open minded skepticism and enjoy.
It's all detectable with machines that detect electromagnetism of various kinds. Tesla made some devices for it, as well as some Eastern engineers.
Quote from: zareste on April 04, 2012, 16:38:23
It's all detectable with machines that detect electromagnetism of various kinds. Tesla made some devices for it, as well as some Eastern engineers.
Thanks zareste for the information. I agree with you. The etheric body is electromagnetic in nature. It should be capable of being detectable. It is as objective as the physical body. It just follows a different vibratory frequency.
Repercussions of the physical body could be measured also. For example, when the etheric body comes back into alignment with the physical body very abruptly, and the physical body reacts with a sudden jolt. This has happened to me quite a few times. Vibrations and their repercussions on the physical body would be another great thing to try to measure. I have had two people feel my physical body vibrate that came from etheric vibrations.
I think these type of things should be researched and measured to show how the etheric field directly affects the physical plane. I would also like to find a way to measure the quantum template (Vehram energy system) that keeps our etheric body intact and also fuels it with electromagnetic energy.
Quote from: merkaba1111 on April 04, 2012, 13:36:28
We can not give objective proof of the non-physical. Astral Projection, Remote Viewing, Lucid Dreams are all subjective experiences that can not be validated with the current scientific method, at least not yet. Try not to worry about proving the reality of these experiences to anyone else but yourself. Often times we feel like we need to prove it to someone else in order to convince ourselves. Keep a healthy balance of open minded skepticism and enjoy.
It's not a case for me of proving Astral Projection. I know it is possible, I've done it. However it's more of a case of proving what Astral Projection really is? Are we focussing our consciousness away from our physical bodies, interacting with spirits from other dimensions, and those passed? Or are we simply having a very clear lucid dream? I just want to be careful of having an experience then instantly jumping on a bandwagon of a belief system. It would be rather life changing for me to prove that I am more than just a physical body and that my consciousness/soul will continue on after I die. But Astral Projection has yet to prove that for me, and I would arguably state that it hasn't proven that for most other people on here either.
I posted this once , got mistaken for a spammer , and the post got taken down . Any way one night I willed my self to give my phone number to any one that I might meet . I cant consciously a.p. but I do get dreams of being out of body . I got some dreams where only kids could see me and most were afraide of me . I did get some out of state phone calls where no one spoke . If I did get a phone call form some one that did not know me saying that they got the number from what they thought was a ghost , to me that would be proof . Also there is a story of a British member of Parliment that while he was very sick in bed used a.p. to appear in Parliment and cast his vote ( late 1800-early 1900s some where ) I read it in a book on a.p. if I get his name I will post it . desert rat
for proof the best i got was when i had a sexual encounter with my neighbor upstairs. i aped or she pulled me out. eather way i was out and there was a girl standing by me, then she jumped on me. so without going into detail. i had zipped back to my body at some point. i was able to get back to being out of body and there she was laying on the floor of my room. she was also out of body just to make things clear. i helped her up and asked if she was ok. nothign was said and she ziped back to hers.
i though nothing of it just an ap with a human urge. i left my apt. and bumped into her outside. she said thanks for the fun time. i looked puzzeled, she laughed and said thanx for helping me up. so who knows, makes me wonder. worst part about it i still feel a bit connected to her and i dont even know her last name haha.
It sounds like you both had a subconscious intent to be together. Congratulations, that sounded like a good time! :-)
ya was not bad at all. :wink: :-D
Maybe you should subtly ask her for a bit more info next time you see her. After all, sounds interesting...
ya i would but i moved and not sure if she still around were i used to live. will have to ask more if i see her.
That was a great experience. Thanks for sharing.
I definitely have to get in on this thread here..;-)
I am going to sum it all up with a clear concise reply.
If you are serious about proving if OBE is real or not, it is...
So now, that I have spoken the word take it for everything I write.....;) but you have to prove it to yourself first before others. You are the *one* that has to go out and get it! Not by just a few random experiences, but running the whole marathon and pursuing.
Let me tell you a real story... Five years ago, I was about 225lbs way over-weight. So I wanted to lose weight by running and diet. So if I told you five years ago, I am going to lose x amount of pounds, run half marathon, 25k, and a full marathon in one year.. You would probably laugh.. But that is what happened and within 2-3 years I achieved that goal of a full marathon. Along the way, I learned how to run, breath, desire, and reach the goal of 26.2
It is the same way with projecting and with anything you do in life if you find a *way* to make it obtainable. Even thou it took me close to 20 years to obtain proof, it all came to me without trying to prove it. Weird as it might sound, that actually happened. When I stopped focusing on being hell bent on proving the reality of OBE, failing year after year. I gave up and when I surrendered to that - then the course changed.
Proving it to someone else is futile - if they want to the proof, let them do the work, research, and training. It is all about energy and you are #1 to prove it to yourself. Just imagine if you did prove it to someone, then you would have to prove it to the next one, so on. And even *if so* you had hard core evidence, there still would be people that would say its a trick, hoax, and the list of excuses goes on and on.
Now, I am not saying never to do validations, or targets with images, cards, other people. Go for it!! But be careful and realize that no matter what you say, or even if you did validate your own claims. People will want the proof.... and then still say its make believe hoax.
Hope this helps
DW
I have also had quite a few accidental validations before and I guess for the most part AP is very real. In the future I won't talk about AP and other paranormal subjects to people who don't have enough knowledge about them so it is not necessary for me to prove anything to anyone anymore, however I am going to practice on targets like cards in order to train myself and dust off my skills. Who knows? Perhaps very soon there will be more powerful astral projection practitioners who can convince the mainstream science to do more research on AP by showing them such direct validations.
Rezef,
You hit it right on the head!
Accidental validations vs. forced verification's. It is nice to have a controlled validation and I have had them, but
not like the accidentals.
I would strongly suggest that you put together when you project, document the date, time, experience, and break it down to controlled, accidental, precognitive obe, etc.. This data once collected over a period of time will give you the *proof* you need. Plus, it is documented by you and be honest when you are going about this.
The very first thing you will want to do is grab the notepad, audio recorder and dictate the date,time, nature of the OBE. Once that is completed, save it, archive it for later reference if needed. You don't want to contaminate the validation with altering the experience or twisting it to validate physical to astral to match.
I give you an example:
In one OBE, it was a false awakening. My wife came into the room, looked down at me, got into bed and we held each other. Minutes later as I broke out of the false awakening, the same event occurred note for note. I didn't say anything - it all happened just as it did in the false awakening. This was just not one time, we are talking multiple times with different variations.
I immediately documented everything so later I could review this data and not edit, enhance, or add to it later.
Another example: I was in OBE, saw a playing card and returned back to the body. Immediately, documented the whole experience. A day later I was jogging, I came up to a playing card at my place of work in this neighborhood on the sidewalk face down. Of all places yah know and WHY? So take a guess what the card face up was?..
Here is the documented OBE journal back in 2005.
Date: 7/14/2005
Time: 3:45AM – 3:53AM
Subject: Card Verification Experiment #1 – Conscious Projection
Author: David A. Warner
© Copyright 2007
www.invisiblelight.us
OBE Journal (Validation)
This was the first time that I had setup the experiment with the cards. My wife placed one card on the bedroom door and another card on the door that leads to the mudroom and to the outside the house. Both cards were faced down taped at the top. I figured this would be a great experiment and not to hard to miss since I would be projecting into that path.
The cards were placed on the door about 3-4 weeks ago and it took me that long to finally wield the results.
Anyways, roughly around 3:30AM 7/14/2005 I awakened into the trance state after have gone to bed about a 1/2hr prior. I did feel the vibrations and realize that I was rather in a good stance to project. As always, I just rolled out off the bed and onto the floor. I knew exactly what I wanted to accomplish and that was to view the card on the door. I floated around the bed frame and pushed my way towards the door. I was able to pull the card off the door and view the number and suit. The card that I read was the King of Diamonds. After that, I lost control and was pulled back the way I traveled around the bed-frame.
The weird thing is that when I was on the bed, my astral body was upright and my legs were on the bed. Basically, sitting upright on the bed and during that time I was spinning around in circles. I felt the physical body trying to re-align my astral inside of my physical but just couldn't. I had to actually had to lay down and focus and could feel the alignment kick in.
I kinda of wonder if this would be a good technique to prevent from coming back into the physical if you want to stay out longer?
Now, the next part is interesting because I thought I had awakened in the physical. I could see my wife Katie and she said to me "Wow, that was fast for you to verify the card". So we both went over to the door, pulled the card off and this time it was 8 of hearts.
Finally, I physically awakened and realized what had just occurred. So I grabbed my notepad, and removed the physical card off the door and went into the kitchen were there was light. I would be able to write the notes and see the actual card. To my surprise the physical card in the bedroom was 2 of hearts. Even though it wasn't the 8 at least I got the suit correct.
I decided not to remove the card on the front door leading to the mud room because I would again try to project later.
Date: 7/14/2005
Time: 10:30AM – 10:37AM
Subject: Card Verification Experiment #2 God is the Famous One
Well, at 10:46AM I was able to project and this time no vibes were present. I did hear music from this astral projection subliminal tape I listen to physically and imagined myself rolling inside my physical like a log quickly turning.
Getting out of the body was a breeze and I moved quickly to the front door with the objective of reveling the second card. At the time, I was able to see the card and make out the number, contents BUT the problem that occurred which wasn't really a problem. I was able to stay out of body for 10-15mins exploring everything around me. I knew at the time if I was to abort the projection and come back that the experience would be cut short. So I decided to put the card in my pocket for when I would lose consciousness I could quickly look at the card upon returning and have a better memory.
Well, never a less I didn't realize this experience would be very beautiful, moving, and so inspirational that I forgot about the card details. During the experience I ran into two teenagers that I had asked if there were deceased and they both laughed at me. After that, I saw 3 black people, 2 men and 1 woman. I had asked them specifically if they were deceased and the black woman said "yes and that God is her savior and glory to be" I told her that I was sorry to hear that and agreed with her about her statement.
The other elements of the projection is that I was in a backyard which to be believed by me I was located at my mom and dads in the astral. When I was on the back deck, there were many flowers growing. Red, Pink and White in one flower petal. so I decided to pull the flower off and smell it. I could sense the texture, winkle touch and smell the scent of the flower. After that I turned to the sky and said "God, I love you and Thank You for this gift". Also, I asked help from a higher source like a angel or something from God. When I looked at the sky I could see a shimmer of a ray of light beam thru this pine tree and out from no where was this bird. The bird was a size of a watermelon, almost like a blown up puffer fish. I asked this bird at the time if you/it/he/her was my helper and it nodded back to me gracefully shaking his head up and down.
There's more to this experience and probably would take another 2-3 pages to detail, but I picked out the beautiful highlights of the experience. Imagine if I had aborted the projection upon verifying the card what I would have lost...!
When I finally returned back to my physical body, I went to the kitchen room and removed the card off of the mud room door. The physical playing card was the Jack of Diamonds.
What is truly interesting about this experiment is that the first projection and the false awakening the both times that cards matched the suit.
Astral Bedroom - card I read was King of Diamonds
Physical Front Room Door - card is Jack of Diamonds
Physical Bedroom - card was 2 of hearts
False Awaking Astral Bedroom - card I read with my wife was 8 of Hearts
What I think happened is that in the first projection and false awakening I had already read both cards. So if I was reading the card in the bedroom, I would have been actually reading it in the front room kitchen door and vice verse. I know that the card in the astral that I tried reading on the second attempt was not suit or the number on the physical cards. I am going by gut instinct and vague memory.
The odds of having the same suit in one astral projection and false awakening attempt is 416 to 1. I still have more experiments with the cards but for a first time shot - pretty dam good!!!
Date: 7/14/2005 [/b]
Later that day I was on my break jogging. I've been jogging at work for 15Min's a day for the last couple of months. Along my travels there was a playing card face down on the cement. I did not pick the card up because I wanted to finish my jog.
Date: 7/15/2005
Anyways, I came up to the card again on my daily jog this evening and still faced down.
Out of curiosity I picked the card up.. To my surprise it was the Jack of Diamonds.
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So what I am trying to say is that these experiences do offer proof. Maybe not right away in this case, but it happens. So be diligent and active in documenting.. The more data you can obtain - the picture will paint itself to knowing it is real!
All the best,
DW