Real or imagination?

[Veccolo]

Well, I know, at least, that telekinesis is real, because I've done it once with the PSI-Wheel, so it's most certain that other psychic skills are real too.

APs can be explained as normal dreams (or lucid dreams if you're conscious while having one), and probably are nothing more than that. At least in my opinion.

Real-Time-Zone-OBEs can be explained as a combination of ESP (extra sensory perception) and normal dreams.

So yes, I say it's real. It can be explained in many ways, but it can't be denied, because the amount of evidence of these experiences is too huge.

[happy_notion]

Just for clarification puposes...real time obes are like when your sitting in your chair or laying on your bed...putting yourself into a deep trance and inducing the state needed to project...correct?? thanks veccolo..more input from others would be greatly apprectiated..thank you all very much!

[Veccolo]

I don't like the following explanation, but I can't think of a better one at the moment:

"Real-Time-Zone" OBEs are "projections" into the physical "realm". While having one of these OBEs, you perceive the phsyical world "as it is", without much distortions.

The card tests, for example, are done while having these kind of OBEs.

[complexette]

quote:Originally posted by happy_notion

Hello fellow avid travelers..(although i have yet to embark on a truly rememerable projection). My father is a professor and he believes that there is logic behind everything and that the scientific method can prove anything. Well we've been in a discussion (on and off) about parapsychology and mainly astral travel in my case...and well..he keeps informing me how it isn't real...and i really want to believe and know it is real...although i am still skeptical...I've had all these symptoms which people keep describing...(mainly robert bruce)..as the brink of exit. Un-counterable spinning...paralysis...stiff body..etc. And i was telling him that if none of th is was real why would people post topics about
stuff relating to it...and why would someone like robert bruce go through all the trouble to write that boook? well those books? To screw us all in to believing something and wasting our time and money? Please..all I need is some clarity...someone tell me the truth and let me know what is really happening....thanks

Happy Notion,,,


   Well, I've also been very skeptical for the past 13 years or sooooo!!! Achieving OBE many times a night, I fought it for "OH 13 years!!!" I've finally proved it to myself [], through self test's that what is happening is spiritually true, And not physically possible!  I very rarely travel, generally I levitate in my room if I leave my body! Though I may FEEL the OBE vibrations and other, I excuse it as a dream, cause it's to difficult to explain " as physically possible!  So beyond my occasional dabbling in the intriguing thought, or conclusion,,, as to why something has happened in this other dimension.!. I typically leave it as that.
   I run on faith & trust that the people I love and trust enough to tell. Accept that within my knowledge what is happening to me when I close my eyes, and push into deep REM or OBE, to be true, and very real to my common sense!     Take Care,,,, Complexette

[Tayesin]

Happy,
Having people tell you it is not real, is part of your process of growth..  many of us have had the same experience.  It's very normal.  I gather you feel something when they say it to you... something that disagrees with them on your inside ?

That is the Truth within you recognising what is not Truth outside of you.

We all Astral travel at night when we are sleeping, it is very,very natural for us.  Many people AP/OBE when awake too.  

I can assure you that it is not Lucid Dreaming for the seasoned Traveller.  You will find as your experience grows, your knowing of the difference between dreams and Astral realities will sharpen.  

May I suggest you use some basics rules of thumb, Keep what you do simple, practice methods for at least 30 days to see if they will work for you,  what does work for you can be modified to suit yourself and your needs... AND.. listen to your own inner knowing and not to those who would have you believe their Standardised Belief System.

An old Druid axiom applies here.. "The Truth Against the World".  It means, real, inner knowing.. the Truth, goes against the flow of the daily world around us.  Which is why it is important to listen to your own.

Love Always. []

[happy_notion]

Hello fellow avid travelers..(although i have yet to embark on a truly rememerable projection). My father is a professor and he believes that there is logic behind everything and that the scientific method can prove anything. Well we've been in a discussion (on and off) about parapsychology and mainly astral travel in my case...and well..he keeps informing me how it isn't real...and i really want to believe and know it is real...although i am still skeptical...I've had all these symptoms which people keep describing...(mainly robert bruce)..as the brink of exit. Un-counterable spinning...paralysis...stiff body..etc. And i was telling him that if none of th is was real why would people post topics about stuff relating to it...and why would someone like robert bruce go through all the trouble to write that boook? well those books? To screw us all in to believing something and wasting our time and money? Please..all I need is some clarity...someone tell me the truth and let me know what is really happening....thanks