Rope Question

[Huwie]

Use your mental hands.  Don't try to picture the rope, just imagine the feeling of climbing it.  I get better results by imagining that my body is really heavy so that it's a struggle to pull myself up, because I think it focuses attention more.

Also be aware that ROPE, whilst an extremely succesful method, won't necessarily work for you.  The ultimate aim is simply to focus your awareness outside your physical body.  Try the tactile imaging exercises mentioned in the OBE treatise too, like the one that involves placing yourself against the ceiling.

AP doesn't just happen overnight.  Keep at it, don't give up, and stay positive! []

[Ybom]

Don't forget about the different perspectives you can imagine while doing any technique either.

For instance, with "rope", people tend to imagine it differently depending on what they like. I imagine I'm inside the person and looking out/up where I'm going and climbing (more natural for me), but some people like to imagine looking at the person climbing instead (from various viewpoints), I myself would use those too, but first person tends to hold my attention better.

By the way if you pull off an OBE by physically climbing a rope, I'll pay to see it (if only to watch you fall down go boom [B)])

[holy reality]

are you supposed to visualize it like you're actually doing it from first person?

i find it the hardest thing in the world, if not impossible, to visualize things from the first person.... and I know a lot of people that agree.. it's like, if I look back on a memory, I usually see myself from third person unless it's like a random photo flashback beyond my control....

If I fantasize.. I usually don't even place myself there at all, and if I do I imagine it from third person....

if I try and visualize the rope I tend to only see my hands, but from a strange angle that doesn't seem quite first person....

If I stare at myself typing then close my eyes and try to relive it it usually jumps to third person...

if I try to imagine myself walking around a room it jumps to third person.

Is this acceptable visualization? It doesn't do very well at detaching you from the body because you don't fully feel like you're there walking around if you're not doing it from first person....

(i know you don't need to visualize rope but it works best (though it's never WORKED for me) if I visualize while doing it)

In fact it only works for me if I'm already in a trance and just need to get out or into a dream, but it works better if I create an object in the locale I want to go to and grab it with my "hands" and keep tugging on it till I get there.

[Huwie]

holy reality - if you want my advice, bearing in mind I haven't projected yet (to my knowledge, hehe), I would suggest you go back to the beginning with Astral Dynamics.  Bruce is, after all, an expert on this stuff and I doubt anybody could more clearly explain how to do it than he.

In the meantime, I would try this.  When you're at the keyboard, look down at it and remove your hands from it.  Then try to imagine your hands typing away at it.  Picture - for now - your hands transparently moving across the keys.  That shouldn't be too difficult.  When you get a good feel for it, try closing your eyes and then repeating the exercise.  See those mental hands moving across the keyboard and imagine how it feels.  When you progress enough in that way, try to do the same without picturing it.

I wish I could be of more help to you, dude.  Don't give up, whatever happens!  Everyone can learn to do it in time, I'm willing to bet.

[NecroGod]

quote:Originally posted by holy reality


i find it the hardest thing in the world, if not impossible, to visualize things from the first person.... and I know a lot of people that agree.. it's like, if I look back on a memory, I usually see myself from third person unless it's like a random photo flashback beyond my control....

I know what you mean. I believe we are victims to movies in this respect... we're so used to watching the action of our favorite hero from a distance. Now whenever I catch myself observing me as opposed to 'being me' I quickly become aware and try to snap back to first person so I can experience things more 'wholely'. It certainly takes a bit of practice, but I think it's worth trying to observe things from first person.

[Nagual]

I think that, more than visualizing it, it's the lifting sensation that is important...  You should not try to visualize hands/ropes/body/... too much, but get a sensation; a bit like what you feel in an elevator.

[Kerrblur]

I think that, more than visualizing it, it's the lifting sensation that is important... You should not try to visualize hands/ropes/body/... too much, but get a sensation; a bit like what you feel in an elevator.

I dont understand what you mean why this, how is one to 'Feel' for this "Rope" when the person hasnt any previous encounters with it?  like is there a excersize or something to do  to help people who have no idea how to use the 'Rope' Technique, get the 'Feel' 'Sensation'?  How does one manipulate the feeling in a elevator?  how do you get lifting sensation? cause honestly, I'd had this problem for a long long time.  

 Sometimes I would do the rope technique(After practice I got the first person thing working) and something would work(I'm visualizing it liek Holys doing).  I'd feel some Vibrations or some shifting happening.  All sudden I loose concentration and focus, and theres the problem of me running out of room to climb up on heh.  heres where another question add's on to Holy's.  Which is better:(or neither) Climbing the rope up, I'm visualizing my hands one hand at a time reaching up, and in a sense I'm pulling down to lift myself up. then I take my left hand and do it again.  But once I get to the ceiling, I imagine I am instantly outside and climbing to the sky.

Okay the other thing I do so I do not worry about visualizing myself climbing to a end:  I visualize my hands on the rope and I do not focus myself on how high I am move, or how much closer I am to the ceiling, but instead I just focus straight forward(as if you would tilt your head upward to see your feet over your chest) and do the hand up, pulling down, body up, left hand reach up, pulling down, body up, whilst the same time my other hand is holding for control.

is this a bunch of ggibberish? or did I make sense?

[Ybom]

That wasn't a bunch of gibberish, but I did get the feeling that you wrote it fairly quickly. To dissect your questions though is different. I'll try my hand at it and see how you like the answers.

Firstly, you basically ask what does lifting feel like, look like, and how you can manipulate that feeling.
To me it feels like my stomach is pulling itself out of my body, as if on a rollercoaster and you go rushing down from the very top. Also, don't worry about what it looks like...if you see someone climbing in your mind, you're basicaly successful! As for manipulating the feeling, work with what you have and go from there...if you've seriously never experienced "throwing up your stomach" then I suggest you look at something like the mind awake/body asleep technique instead of this one.

Next, you seem concerned about how you actually use the rope technique and if your method is good enough.
I think your technique is very similar to mine, but I do it a little differently. I picture that with every inch I move up, the rope moves down that much, and there's a black hole of unknown above it. Essentially I stay stationary, but it tricks my mind into thinking that I am progressing upwards. I don't get any results with climbing through the roof, which is why I changed it. The reason why it works is sort of the same reason why people still use stationary bikes, treadmills, and step machines in gyms; meaning when I do this I'm on a ropemill? Dang psychic gym equipment!

I hope that helped...

[Kerrblur]

hah thanks, your technique on how you use the rope is like what I do.
You also stated some things I forgot to mention, like imagine the rope going down, as if your going up.  so, do you only focus on your hands and the rope in your hands?  Like when I mentioned
instead I just focus straight forward(as if you would tilt your head upward to see your feet over your chest)

Thats all I need to know, and you keep doing that?  When the vibrations and all this stuff starts happening, what do you do then?  keep doing the 'same' action you was doing form the start?

 my reason being is, my focus always seems to drift off as soon as these vibrations or something happens.  was that the same for you?

[Ybom]

"...you keep doing that?"
No, I move on to a more powerful technique, like the more complex one I would call "stomach push, relax, body down", meaning I push out some of my energy from my stomach causing me to tire a bit (since I naturally gather just a bit too much energy now) and I let my body simmer downwards as the more relaxed I get. It's sort of like an old fashioned pump in which you work the handle for a bit to build up the pressure and the water naturally flows up and out.

"...my focus always seems to drift off as soon as these vibrations or something happens..."
Focus is a very nasty beast. I haven't completely developed focus yet, even though I am getting better at it. Hopefully I can conquer it and let you know my technique for that, but all I can do at this moment is practice and meditate. PM me and let me know how it goes on your attempts, even failures, on a day to day basis so we can compare notes, ok?

[WhimsicalFreak]

Well, this is my first post and in reading this thread I have seen several interesting techniques on how to achieve an OBE. I can't personally speak of the "Rope" technique and can't offer any advice on it, but I can give advice on the technique I have developed in order to achieve OBE's.

First off, if you are a sound sleeper you need to change this aspect of your sleep. If you are trying to achieve OBE's prior to your usual sound sleep by using some of the different methods, you are wasting your time. Your have to learn to recognize when you are in the "proper" state to achieve OBE's. What I mean by this is, you have to learn how to remain conscious and aware either prior to the sleep state and more effectively (in my experiences) between sleep and awake. This is usually in the morning hours after awakening from a nights rest.

A method I have advised in the past for people that have had trouble recognizing this state ( essentially allowing them to learn how to deprevate their sleep process ) is to set their alarm clock several hours prior to their normal waking hour and let the snooze continually wake them up. Do not get out of bed! Let the alarm keep waking you up over and over. During this exercise, try to remain conscious between each alarm. Remain aware that the alarm will go off again, but at the same time continue your dream like state. This seems to help in the initial developement in learning the "proper" state to induce OBE's.  

Once this recognition is realized, you can begin to work on the process of leaving the body. My personal method is similar to some of those described throughout the community. I lay on my side in a fetal type position with a comforter wrapped around me. Doesn't matter which direction, but it seems that facing the opposite direction from the edge of the bed works the best for me. The reason for this is that once in this state and position, I begin to imagine rocking back and forth. A little at a time. Sometimes, it doesn't happen quickly. It can take up to several minutes to several hours, often fading in and out of a sleep/conscious state. The important thing is to try and remain focused when possible. Once you start to feel your astral body rocking back and forth, keep pushing it a little further each time until you imagine yourself sliding off the side of the bed and onto the floor. At this point I wait a few minutes, stay on my knees and focus on gaining my vision. Sometimes it is a little dark at first, but once I gain some vision I tend to stand up. Then I leave the room and go to my front door and leave my apartment.

There are a lot of details that I couldn't possibly elaborate on short of writing a book, but I hope this might help some of you.

WF

[Nagual]

quote:how is one to 'Feel' for this "Rope" ..., get the 'Feel' 'Sensation'? How does one manipulate the feeling in a elevator? how do you get lifting sensation?

Again, you don't really want to feel the rope; you want to feel the lift. And for manipulating it... hum... you should be able to more or less reproduce/"imagine" this sensation on demand.

quote:like is there a excersize or something to do to help people who have no idea how to use the 'Rope' Technique

Yes.  Just climb a real rope!  [|)]  and experience the lifting sensation...

[SubGyro2]

When using the rope technique, are you suppose to imagine just your hands pulling you up or are you suppose to use your entire body?[?]