Phasing VS your regular AP-which of two immerses a person

[kajaLove]

hi

I was just wondering which of the two techniques is more immersing, more real when it comes to experiencing  astral world ?

I would think that since with phasing you are still aware of your physical body to a degree, and especially due to the lack of any body ( astral or etheric - it doesn't matter if those bodies are real or just a figment of your imagination ) , I have a feeling one is not able to immerse into astral fully, at least with regards to your physical senses ( touch most importantly ) , while in contrast your regular astral projection does appear  more "real" in that aspect, since you can "feel" the astral word around you with your astral body, while I would think phasing doesn't reproduse the illusion(?) of  touch ? Or does it?!

thank you

[NickJW]

Phasing is exactly the same as the traditional astral projection except in phasing you can usually stay more councious and longer.

[MisterJingo]

Phasing will lead to exactly the same level of immersion as any tradition technique. To use a clichéd analogy: you can eat a cake many ways; the result is still an eaten cake.
Most [all] traditional techniques actually are phasing, what separates them is that phasing uses visualisation to distract from the physical and 'phase' along the spectrum of consciousness, whereas traditional techniques use visualisation in attempt to actually leave ones body. When one leaves the body in a traditional sense, they have really just phased into the astral. The Real-Time zone is actually a near mirror image of 'reality' and not actual reality itself (some might still disagree with this though).

So I guess phasing is acceptance of moving along the conscious spectrum, where traditional techniques believe one is moving out of body (but they are still actually phasing).

[kajaLove]

I'm not shure if Frank also said this, but Bruce Moen told that even when in astral he's always aware of his physical body. Doesn't that in way lessen full immersion into astral ? I mean, if nothing else sensations of touch experienced in astral is prob lessened to some degree

This isn't the case with traditional OBE

[MisterJingo]

It is possible to be totally immersed in the astral through phasing. Have a look into wake induced lucid dream (WILD) experiences. It is also possible to maintain some awareness of body. I have used both traditional techniques and phasing, and though both of them, I have sometimes been fully immersed and sometimes had body awarness (which sometimes manifests itself as being in two places at once, with two distinct thought processes - which is interesting).
As stated above, phasing and traditional techniques are both exactly the same. But they have different attributes attached to each of them. If you look into even the oldest occult literature of AP, one can see that techniques used (creative visualisation) is purely just the same as phasing at it's core.

[kajaLove]

But why is Bruce Moen always aware of his body? Are  his techniques the reason ( which would suggest most who practice his techniques will be aware of their body also ), or what ?

[MisterJingo]

But why is Bruce Moen always aware of his body? Are  his techniques the reason ( which would suggest most who practice his techniques will be aware of their body also ), or what ?

Perhaps with Bruce Moen It has simply become habit to not totally let go of body awareness? Or that he doesn't wish to. If one desires full immersion through phasing, then it is possible. The deeper the trance state achieved the greater the immersion experienced.

Another possible reason is that BM phases from a light trance state and so still has some body awareness?

As stated previously, I have experience of traditional techniques (which I started with) and phasing. Both have the same symptoms and energy sensations, and both can either be fully immersive or light enough to have some body awareness.

[Stookie]

Bruce Moen has an article on his website about this. He says when he was first leaning, he discounted his experiences because they weren't like what Robert Monroe wrote about. He said he later learned that you don't have to go out of your body in any kind of traditional sense, and he's always stayed aware of it exept around F27 (or something like that).

You can read it here:

http://www.afterlife-knowledge.com/oobe.html

He says: "Focusing my attention on this initial impression usually leads to awareness in a fuller, richer environment of impressions. I am almost always aware of my physical body and surroundings to some extent during these experiences."

[Heather B.]

In all but one of my phasing adventures, I have had a body and it felt not very different from my physical body.

I was reading the beginning of one of Moen's books a while back (don't remember which one), where he was talking about the day the Oklahoma City bomb occurred.  And that evening, he was in some restaurant getting supper, and at the same time, he was helping retrieve victims!  He said that most of his attention was on his retrieval work, but that at the same time, he apparently managed to have a beer, order food, eat, etc., in the middle of a crowded restaurant!

That's pretty amazing, but really, it's not so different from when you get in your car and start off somewhere, and the next thing you know, you're at your destination!  That happens to me all the time, and for the life of me, I don't remember anything about the drive!  I don't remember which roads I took, I don't remember if there was traffic or not.  It's sort of scary!  It goes to show that either I'm extremely lucky and have a whole army of guardian angels... or that the mind is very amazing when it come to multi-tasking!

[magicmac2000]

Almost Mrs Murphy:  I can see now why women drive so bad !! Just kidding... now, do you use Bruce Moen methods in order to Phase ?

Cheers,
Magic.

[Heather B.]

Yeah, you better watch out! :drive:

I really haven't read too much of Moen's work, I just remembered that one part.  I didn't even know what phasing was until I found this forum.  My experiences have been spontaneous, but I've been practicing at inducing them using Frank's instructions.

[magicmac2000]

Thanks Almost Mrs Murphy By the way, it's very cool what you did (site, etc) about Patrick. Hope you are well and so him.

Magic.