The Astral Pulse

Are any of the experienced members on here growing tired of teaching and advising?

Or are the experienced ones feeling that actual experience amounts to nothing and therefor are almost frightened that to consider themselves experienced is almost a sacrilege to the new 'at the end of the day we really know nothing' climate?

Or does anyone with anything to offer get the feeling they have nothing to offer to the community because there are so many other differing opinions, like banging their head against a brick wall?

Or that they repeat themselves over and over again?

Does anyone here get the feeling that each thread created by somebody wanting to learn goes something like...

A - "I want to learn to AP"

B - "I do this... its really successful"

A - "thanks... I'll try that"

C - "I find this works"

D - "listen to this"

E - "I listen to this"

F - "here is a great resource"

G - "Be careful demons will get you"

D - "there's no such thing as demons"

G - "that's your belief system and is subjective"

F - "No he's right demons do exist because...."

H - "try surrounding yourself with love and light"

I - "it is subjective and there are no right answers.... but try this because I am right"

A - "I tried last night but it didn't work... what am I doing wrong?"

Maybe if a lot of us come to the same conclusion it shows that there might be some truth to it. Or it shows that sooner or later we'll all reach the same dead end. At the and of the day, how could you tell  :evil:

All I have to say is...

What are good techniques I can use? jk...  :-D

I think a lot of people are waking up and that's why a lot of people ask about it. I really never made my first topic for help until AFTER I learned how to project. Which makes no sense in itself. I would just browse these forums and read. I remember Mainly watching youtube videos with Robert Bruce... Spirit Science... etc.

I know what you mean though Bedeekin. I said this many times before but I think every technique is going to work differently for other people. I think it boils down to intent and realizing that you are not your body. Of course I also think it boils down to practice. You can't learn this stuff in one day and expect to be a pro at it you know? Alright now I am getting off track...

I know what you mean though... It seems like a lot of people are waking up. Especially with internet 2.0

 Yes, yes and yes. I just find it frustrating to answer the same question again and again and again because some people want it now and don't want to do any work to find it. I try to stress the point that you get back what you put into this. Whether that's reading a book or watching a video every night for the next 6 months. I also try to stress the point that they should not open "Pandora's Box" unless they are ready to accept whats inside it. This one is probably the most frustrating though because you spend a lot of time trying to help them, then they come back on and say they are scared and want it to stop. Unfortunately it's not that easy.
You forgot the ever so popular questions that start arguments/disagreements here. "Is it a dream, Lucid Dream or an AP" or the other one " did I have a AP or a OBE"?
With most people though once they get to know the layout of the site, they are Ok finding the most common questions answered. I love hearing people's stories of their experiences. I love seeing their enthusiasm when they come here for the first time. Usually they are confused by some odd thing that happened to them and yes they are looking for answers. There are a lot of great people here, this site is a great resource for any one that wishes to learn more or experience the NPR for themselves. It is a place for healing and we have some fun topics as well. I don't like it when they come here looking for someone to share their fears with, especially when we try to help them alleviate them.
Tom Campbell said in a interview that "there is but one truth. But there are many different paths to find that truth".

Quote from: rain_88 on November 02, 2012, 04:51:29
Maybe if a lot of us come to the same conclusion it shows that there might be some truth to it. Or it shows that sooner or later we'll all reach the same dead end. At the and of the day, how could you tell  :evil:

Oh you can tell... because you get Teaching fatigue.  :-D

actually... that last comment is more true than joke... You do sort of nail some bits down after years of practice.

I personally have come to a dead-end when it comes to teaching my personal method because I now realise that the climate is different to when I started. I was a little kid and had no resources at my disposal apart from a really crappy library. So I didn't get confused about all the info out there and sort of figured it out for myself. What is optimistic is that although I didn't have any influences (Monroe's book being the first thing I read 10 years after I had already established my own experience) there are many people who's experiences and theories match... albeit using different metaphors.

There are so many similarities and phenomenological commonalities that it is not as subjective as we think. If the subject was so subjective and personal... we wouldn't have anything to teach or knowledge to share... This needs to be recognised I think because the subject is starting to creep into a nihilistic frame of thinking; It's an illusion... what is real... how can we know... it's all personal... Whatever works for you... etc... yet this whole site promotes an AP school that you have to pay for.. "If You Are Serious About Learning Astral Projection, Here Is Your Opportunity"... what is the teaching method in astral pulse... because according to the non-paying members... there is no method... it's all subjective and personal.

A lot of people are waking up but it seems they are waking up to a cacophony of contradicting and confusing information. I am so thankful I learned myself before the digital revolution... and instead of thinking "Good for you Bedeekin,,, get you!!!!"... ask yourself "why would he say that?"

Also I admit... I do make a lot of topics regarding weird phenomena I have experienced, and often wonder why it happened, or new sensations I get... etc. Just curious if everyone else gets them or not. Like Lionheart said, it does get to me when people spread fear regarding this subject. I try not to explode when I talk to like minded people and they say "but... I saw the movie insidious" That just makes me... ugh.

Quote from: Lionheart on November 02, 2012, 04:56:12
Yes, yes and yes. I just find it frustrating to answer the same question again and again and again because some people want it now and don't want to do any work to find it. I try to stress the point that you get back what you put into this. Whether that's reading a book or watching a video every night for the next 6 months. I also try to stress the point that they should not open "Pandora's Box" unless they are ready to accept whats inside it. This one is probably the most frustrating though because you spend a lot of time trying to help them, then they come back on and say they are scared and want it to stop. Unfortunately it's not that easy.
You forgot the ever so popular questions that start arguments/disagreements here. "Is it a dream, Lucid Dream or an AP" or the other one " did I have a AP or a OBE"?
With most people though once they get to know the layout of the site, they are Ok finding the most common questions answered. I love hearing people's stories of their experiences. I love seeing their enthusiasm when they come here for the first time. Usually they are confused by some odd thing that happened to them and yes they are looking for answers. There are a lot of great people here, this site is a great resource for any one that wishes to learn more or experience the NPR for themselves. It is a place for healing and we have some fun topics as well. I don't like it when they come here looking for someone to share their fears with, especially when we try to help them alleviate them.
Tom Campbell said in a interview that "there is but one truth. But there are many different paths to find that truth".

:-D you are very spot on there Lionheart.

""Is it a dream, Lucid Dream or an AP" or the other one " did I have a AP or a OBE"?" Cant believe I left those out either. But... they don't get one answer... they get many different ones.

I find myself most times... writing out some advice or post... then thinking... what's the point? I am just another voice to add to the confusion.

I have come to a personal and amazing life changing stage... things are happening that I cant begin to describe let alone broadcast... But I just don't want to say anything for many reasons... one is that it will just confuse the newbies... another is that I don't need other peoples opinions and I wont achieve any satisfaction or gain anything from doing so... on top of that I would need a while to really put them into a context that would be be useful to anybody.

Quote from: AstralCody on November 02, 2012, 05:12:37
Also I admit... I do make a lot of topics regarding weird phenomena I have experienced, and often wonder why it happened, or new sensations I get... etc. Just curious if everyone else gets them or not. Like Lionheart said, it does get to me when people spread fear regarding this subject. I try not to explode when I talk to like minded people and they say "but... I saw the movie insidious" That just makes me... ugh.

See sometimes when that happens I think that maybe... just maybe... we shouldn't as responsible peeps.. encourage them any further.

You make a very solid point bedeekin.

I re read some of these posts and can make more sense of what is being said too. For some reason I have to read things twice sometimes...

Everyone has different opinions like you said, and the person asking for advice is just going to get everybody's different opinion tossing in loads of confusion.

It's interesting to say that I was actually having my OBE symptoms come natural for me. Then when I joined these forums and read advice by a bunch of different users... I failed and couldn't have OBE's like I used to. I went back to the drawing board and realized... "I was doing fine when I wasn't trying what everybody else does... oh... BING!" And it's been easier ever since.

Quote from: AstralCody on November 02, 2012, 05:35:29
I re read some of these posts and can make more sense of what is being said too. For some reason I have to read things twice sometimes...

That's called "rehashing" Cody and is very usefull skill. I read posts/threads every time I am on this site. I go back into the Archives and read those, I read the stickies. I have listened to Tom Campbell's interviews at least 3 times over. Sometimes it takes seeing it again and again before it finally makes sense.
The difficulty that everyone has here is when they come here, they have to rid themselves of their "mental chains". When you come here, you have to unlearn almost everything you have learned about reality. You have to alter the way you think. That's not easy to do. But once you do, you will find the NPR easy to access. It's just you have to get rid of all the "mental baggage" and that doesn't happen right away. It takes time, patience and most importantly trust and belief!  :-)

Quote from: Lionheart on November 02, 2012, 05:44:10
That's called "rehashing" Cody and is very usefull skill. I read posts/threads every time I am on this site. I go back into the Archives and read those, I read the stickies. I have listened to Tom Campbell's interviews at least 3 times over. Sometimes it takes seeing it again and again before it finally makes sense.
The difficulty that everyone has here is when they come here, they have to rid themselves of their "mental chains". When you come here, you have to unlearn almost everything you have learned about reality. You have to alter the way you think. That's not easy to do. But once you do, you will find the NPR easy to access. It's just you have to get rid of all the "mental baggage" and that doesn't happen right away. It takes time, patience and most importantly trust and belief!  :-)

Very well put Lionheart. I couldn't agree more.  :-) It's not easy to do that is forsure. I been doing this for a while now and I am still struggling to get out of what society has taught me ever since I was a little kid. I think once I stop stressing the physical so much... things will come even easier for me. I remember the first video I watched on astral projection. I had so much intent.... So much will to try it.... (especially where I was at in my life) The very first night I had many OBE symptoms. That in itself for me shows that intent alone is really what it's all about. These forums have helped me so much.

Rehashing is a skill that can only be learned by the practice of doing it that is usually spurred on because you realise that you miss information that wasn't previously part of your paradigm. Jeez... that was as confusing to write as it is to understand.  :-D

I read MBT for the third time recently and I was confused because I dont remember certain things that he said... I wondered at one point whether he has written the first 'potential' book that changes context as you evolve... who knows... next time I read it, it could be about cheese making.

Quote from: Bedeekin on November 02, 2012, 05:56:59
who knows... next time I read it, it could be about cheese making.

LOL, that's a good one, but true! As we advance in life and our personal awakenings, we see new meanings in a number of different things, things just start to make more sense. But that is what life is all about!  :-)

Quote from: Bedeekin on November 02, 2012, 05:56:59
Rehashing is a skill that can only be learned by the practice of doing it that is usually spurred on because you realise that you miss information that wasn't previously part of your paradigm. Jeez... that was as confusing to write as it is to understand.  :-D

I read MBT for the third time recently and I was confused because I dont remember certain things that he said... I wondered at one point whether he has written the first 'potential' book that changes context as you evolve... who knows... next time I read it, it could be about cheese making.

I wish my writing skills were a tad better... I read that and had a blank face until I read it about five times  :lol: If I tried writing that nobody would even know what I meant lol. I got this now... I am now storing it in my brain.

I'm off to bed though. The sun is about to come up. :-P Have a good night.... day...  everyone  :-)

For me even a "simple" novel changes it's meaning if a read it again let's say a few years later. Which shows that you change, experience and due to this interpret things differently with all that under your belt.

But I agree with Lionheart, the same applies to a lot of things. Maybe everything if you examine it carefully.

And films... It's great watching a film that you last saw when you were a kid... the context changes so much.

But I will say that its only been a year since I first read it... then I re read it afterwards which didn't make much difference and only clarified what I had previously read. This time.. it was completely different. But I know that the reason is because I have had a total paradigm shift not because he has created a quantum shifting book.  :-D

Quote from: AstralCody on November 02, 2012, 06:08:06
I wish my writing skills were a tad better... I read that and had a blank face until I read it about five times  :lol: If I tried writing that nobody would even know what I meant lol.

I still have a blank face and I wrote it... I would like to know what I meant.  :-D

Hi,
Looking at the big picture. In looking at dreams, so many dont know what they are. They just happen, so what? Its this thinking that stops the development of critical thought.
Im sure we are in a low energy, high density trap of sorts and dreams are our natural tendency to return to actual normality.
This statement alone involves things like quantum tunneling and the assumption we are spiritual beings in a physical experience. Heard that before?
So few people will understand even the basic meaning of the above let alone having a conversation on its possibility.
Its all down to experience in life and the best thing at present is to open peoples eyes to this subject. It means lots of repeated Q n A's.
Yes these can be tedious but we are supporting an updating of a social science.
The more eyes that see the light (seeing is believing), the easier our quest.
There may be 100000 members on this site alone by next spring and thats a good number of interested souls.
Some experiences I've never had and others no-one has posted of. We as a collective should support the beginnings of our quest. A strong foundation is a very strong house.
Lets show the world the reality of this subjective PHYSICAL existance.
One ring to bind them...

And what do you think about the reason for "being trapped" in such a trap? Are we young fragments of consciousness who needs to develop in order to "leave the trap"? Are we punished for something and we are "locked up" here in order to keep us from causing trouble elsewhere? Or why?

Well it seems what you guys are talking about is just a common mistake of not keeping it KISS

Keep
It
Simple
Stupid

its actually applied to anything and everything
see the world has a funny way of making something so complex and yet so ironically simple
one of the problems even i face as a student to this so called social science is that yeah at times individuals like yourselves, other practitioners, and even me tend to start wanting to go into specifics, when in reality u cant really get specific when you are trying to apply something on a massive/general level

Like a cake  :-)

cook me up a lousiana short cake, or a pound cake, ok then strawberry cake

"what the how??? what do i need for the lousiana and the strawberry and how many pounds are in the pound cake??"
no silly what you do is u teach the basic principles behind making a cake the actual basic fundamentals in baking, matter of fact you dont even teach the cakes, you teach the Art of Baking, you learn how certain materials react with other materials, the importance of the Egg, Salt, Water, Milk, Yeast, Oil, u also teach the importance of the different tools u use and the different factors like temperature, humidity, the quality of the materials as well.

other than that u can make the worlds best lousiana short cake, but if thats all u know how to make then ur not that diverse a baker then huh?

but in reality it sucks when u cant explain or futher advance your teachings to another for the simple reason that, that life is theirs and theirs only u have no control,
"You can take the horse to river, but you cant make em drink the water"

i am very well aware of the fact that my generation is so fortunate to have a place like this where you can go and discuss these topics and opinions to thers and also not be RIDICULED for doing soo, i first got into this exploring on the web and i found Astral Viewers (whoot whoott!! :-D) and honestly ive learned and in my own knowledge that the world revolves around one universal understanding and that is to keep proving FACT! which makes me soo happy because atleast we are still doing what plato and socrates where doing and the Mayans and egyptians

You guys are Rockstars, and not just any rockstars but Astral Explorerz 8-) Thank you

(!)Keep Exploring

Actually Mr Flip... I quite like that KISS.

If we understand that the fundamental law is fractal based, which the true nature of the universe is... it becomes a much simpler job to work out what anything is. Luckily there are some very friendly open minded scientists out there working out the real complicated stuff for us.

Survival of the fittest is the most indoctrinated concept in our psyche. That we are here because we got here tooth and claw. Essentially that is a load of shneiser and has been the reason why modern society as a whole arent getting very far.

Bruce Lipton points this out... He was the first guy to discover Stem Cell Research. He's much more intelligent than we are. He describes the interaction between cells as the true blueprint for our survival as a race.

A single cell co-operated with another... and another and another... until it was a community of cells acting in symbiosis with each other... doing specialised jobs and working towards a common goal... to be sentient. At one point a membrane surrounded the cells and they divided within this protective atmosphere until they created a multicellular organism. That these multicellular organisms were filling a sort of energy field or niche that preexisted. But they could only do so by agreeing... (not agreeing to disagree... that is a load of excrement and a way of non-winning/losing an argument that leaves both sides at a compromise. We will never move forward with a few disagreeing.) and cooperating for the good of the community. We have as a race forgot this and assume it is a dog eat dog world... a DOGMA eat DOGMA world.

Now... I have been very simple in my description but hopefully you get the idea.

But already.. I can hear the cogs turning... if you don't already know (not just heard or read it.. but know it), I bet you are already trying to fit that into your belief system... maybe you disagree entirely because you appear to have a very specific idea of the world around you. If you disagree you may write up what you think. Then someone might agree... then another... soon that little very simple description I have just given becomes muddled and lost in another cacophony of theories. But at the end of the day it's not a theory... it's a workable model by an extremely intelligent man. The model fits exactly into the model of MBT, another workable model by another sage of modern times. This in turn (being a part of fractal nature) is a workable model for AP/nonphysical exploration) Those models fit very snuggly and at a workable level into what will be the future of mankind... hopefully... if we dont claw each other to get to the top.

We will get nowhere if all we do is throw theories and opposing views around. We need to be ready as a group of individuals to embrace the new-edge science... we are literally at the forefront. AS A GROUP... as an entity of many... Not Borg... individuals with a common goal.

The beautiful thing about these workable models is that the are 'Keeping It Simple'.. but being fractal in nature can get sooooooo complicated that we will never really truly understand. But being fractal in nature are also unequivocally simple at the surface.

Hi,
Rain, the 'sort of trap' referrs to the fact of no prior knowledge of an afterlife. No way of interpreting the conciousness continues on. What we have is a glimpse of NP realities and these are subjective. Whats the purpose of dreams? Whats the purpose of physical reality? Two valid questions both simple and an exacting answer is not forthcoming.
There's  more pieces to the puzzle. Im going to read MBT soon to see another viewpoint.
To teach anything a wider perspective is required. On occasion a bright student will ask a question and expect an answer.
A disheartening lesson is a poor lesson.
The KISS concept is a good idea. It works to generalise on a subject. After that it becomes a hindrance. Fine details make the cake special...

Well as they say, "You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make him drink.". Goes for anything in life really.

Quote from: Szaxx on November 02, 2012, 15:08:42
Hi,
Rain, the 'sort of trap' referrs to the fact of no prior knowledge of an afterlife. No way of interpreting the conciousness continues on. What we have is a glimpse of NP realities and these are subjective. Whats the purpose of dreams? Whats the purpose of physical reality? Two valid questions both simple and an exacting answer is not forthcoming.

The answers to all of those questions are answered in MBT... those questions have been answered for me... and I wasn't really looking for them.

It's the question of whether you are willing to let go of your ego though. The same ego that is afraid of not being the one who figures it out.

Once those questions have been answered... the only thing is to move on from there and put the answers into PRACTICE. It's an APPLICABLE and WORKING model.

Quote from: Killa Rican on November 02, 2012, 15:34:26
Well as they say, "You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make him drink.". Goes for anything in life really.

Very true... but sooner or later it will get thirsty. We are all thirsty... the problem is the water is there in front of us and has been all along.. we need to stop wondering and hypothesising what the water is and instead move forward.

Hi,
Adventures beyond the body by Christina Zaccariah is my present read and recommended to anyone.
MBT is now next in the queue. Followed by your other earlier suggestion.
Im still learning after 47 years of these experiences and would love to implant what I've learned into everyone on planet Earth.
This can't happen so being able to open some eyes to this subject is a good start.
What I have read is very close to that experienced and that in itself is conceptual bliss. I was on my own for a long time and got tied down with life. Now its so different and its being put into perspective by comments and suggestions made on the Pulse.
The answers to my personal questions have not been answered at all but reading others experiences is beginning to give me a position on a scale of achievement that is becoming clearer. Hopefully Ill find the answers and change this.
Keep up the good work on here.
No need to be despondent.

 :-)

 I think all those famous adages were made just for moments like this, lol. As having the job of training salespeople earlier in my life, that KISS one meant everything to me. It was and still is the blueprint for everything!  :-)

I never heard it before. It's a good one. I only know a good adage from acting in the theatre.

the three T's.

 In one of my very first NPR visits consciously aware, I was told to "see through". Now everytime I read a book, watch a video or listen to a speaker on this subject, I hear those 2 words again.  It's good practice. An open mind is important, but being able to decipher the real "message" is the big part of this art.

[(I quote you all)]

Ironically Life is yet only a Game :-)

A haunted house is a lovely example

subjected to nothing but change the human body is thrusted to overdrive of the natural effect named "SPOOK"


just like in many games and modern Video-games
the answers are hidden in plain site, take the time OBSERVE and then RATIONALIZE to your own LOGICAL conclusion
and after all of that
You Execute the Objective

but we all know the RULE in this game, (actually i really dont know word for word BUT this is my OUT-PUT) so here it goes
"Every Change, Every interraction, Every Effect, Every Desicion, Has a Consequence, wether or not it be Bad or Good, well You'll Know :wink:"

Warning! :RULES MAY VARY



ha

Bedeekin, absolutely spot on with your OP.

Sometimes I wish people would be a little more original with their posts, rather than just saying "CANT AP HELP NEEDED!". Posts like this do not encourage replies. Do some personal research, show some initiative and then ask intelligent questions. This will encourage much higher quality replies, and make for more interesting discussions for all involved.

Now.....

As a complete side-track, I find the acronym MBT really amusing. This is in fact an acronym of an acronym. At some point I think we should shorten it to just M. It would then be an acronym of an acronym of an acronym. Another example possibly of that fractal paradigm???!

Oh I feel guilty now. I see there is a post called "Need Help Astral Projection" which on reading turns out to be an interesting post. Sorry seany! This is tough...

As most regular patrons of the pulse notice, I often take extended absences from posting on these forums. Beyond the obvious reasoning for this, I too, have grown weary of throwing my opinion into the abysmal sea of other opinions and observations, often made by people who are 100% convinced that they are right and are still, in this age and place of enlightenment, arrogant and stubborn.

That being said, I often come back to help out someone new to this craft of visiting the NPR or those that are confused about "paranormal" and "magick" experiences (which I consider a specialty of mine of sorts, though I don't necessarily practice, nor believe in any specific methodology.) I find guiding newcomers and those with questions to be very rewarding and I often learn from them as much as I teach.

If I have to answer the same question for a million people, I will go out of my way to provide full information each time to the best of my abilities and with a smile, thankful that I'm not answering the same question twice for a single person.

Do you have something better to do with your time than guide a new person on their path?

No... not at all... in fact I prefer it now because I am comfortable with myself and others.

I get a different feeling than I used to.. .or rather I have different motives, that are less to do about wanting to be egotistically correct and right about what I could teach and more to do with guiding others using what I have learned.

I used to think that I was 100% right though. Ask anyone from Astral Viewers (R.I.P.)... I am slightly embarrassed about the original 'Bedeekin's method' I posted online years ago. Very aggressive... very dismissive.  :oops:

I took a long sabbatical because I had some experiences and events that changed my whole outlook... and I've been humbled by them. My theories haven't changed... in fact they were affirmed and given body, reason and volume by My Big TOE. But my outlook has.

I actually didn't feel 'spiritual' and rebuked 'spirituality' for a long time. I was very practical in my approach and a lot of what I used to say I didn't truly believe because on one side I KNEW that I had experienced precognition and positive affirmed remote hits involving RTZ projections.. but dismissed other things that others had experienced because they didn't fit within my defined pragmatism. so I was sort of... contradicting myself a lot.

something like....

"I denounce your theory of auras because I haven't seen evidence of them, but did I tell you about the time I was seeing through the eyes of a child alien in another reality that had lost her parents..."  :-D

Seriously.. I was that bad.

Quote from: Bedeekin on November 03, 2012, 23:14:29
"I denounce your theory of auras because I haven't seen evidence of them, but did I tell you about the time I was seeing through the eyes of a child alien in another reality that had lost her parents..."  :-D

Seriously.. I was that bad.

pretty much, dude i can totally take that and use it against you hahaha

Just to be clear... the final line you highlighted was the only true statement in that sentence... the first part was belief based.  :-D

and yeah... feel free to use it to reign me in. lol

Quote from: Bordmb on November 03, 2012, 21:59:19
As most regular patrons of the pulse notice, I often take extended absences from posting on these forums. Beyond the obvious reasoning for this, I too, have grown weary of throwing my opinion into the abysmal sea of other opinions and observations, often made by people who are 100% convinced that they are right and are still, in this age and place of enlightenment, arrogant and stubborn.

This rings with me. I too have been guilty of arrogance, but have tried to curb that. In fact, over the past year I am sure that the regular contributors here have generally become less arrogant and more open to others' opinions. However, there is still a great morass of differing opinions and misunderstandings, which I find more troublesome than arrogance. An arrogant person can be shamed if they understand they have been proven wrong. But an arrogant person who repeatedly misunderstands an argument, can not.

Yes.. this forum has lost the charm.. but i do visit sometimes :)

For past few months, I didn't get any question that can actually tempt me to answer. Most of the people here, are from west, and they are looking for some sort of rules, techniques, and set of algorithm that can actually lead to AP. Every other teacher is categorizing focus and people are trying to reach there and judge if they are going right. It is like if i give an example of a "Hindi" song that gives me goose-pump, and you try to generate that sensation by listening that song again and again, you fails because the very first thing "you do not understand hindi" and second is the poetry, that can actually not be translated in any foreign language. Hence you fail to get goose-pump.

So those focus categories are actually confusing people and making things more complicated than it seems. Consciousness can not be manipulated by just practicing few minutes in the night, you will have to start your practice when you are awake, then move further.

But everyone here is in hurry, and then there are self proclaimed masters here who are making it more complicated for beginners :)

Quote from: indian on November 05, 2012, 02:38:57
It is like if i give an example of a "Hindi" song that gives me goose-pump, and you try to generate that sensation by listening that song again and again, you fails because the very first thing "you do not understand hindi" and second is the poetry, that can actually not be translated in any foreign language. Hence you fail to get goose-pump.

This alone states volumes Indian. You have found something that works for you and that's all that's important. These are the stories I come here to read, different cultures and their techniques. Success stories from all walks of life. There are less success stories and more tutoring done here. We already have the stickies and tutorials. We need more of the success stories, more people sharing what works for them. Nobody is going to attack you for sharing. That's what this site for. Give your view, it's your view. Nobody can say it's wrong. They may want to share their view back, but not blatantly attack you for it.

Quote from: Lionheart on November 05, 2012, 02:52:25
This alone states volumes Indian. You have found something that works for you and that's all that's important. These are the stories I come here to read, different cultures and their techniques. Success stories from all walks of life. There are less success stories and more tutoring done here. We already have the stickies and tutorials. We need more of the success stories, more people sharing what works for them. Nobody is going to attack you for sharing. That's what this site for. Give your view, it's your view. Nobody can say it's wrong. They may want to share their view back, but not blatantly attack you for it.

I know people here who really attack and do not let you share what you actually wants to share. I am not the kind of person who is trying to hide anything, infact i would love to share and i did that in past. But I avoid kind of success stories because that actually confuse people. If i say there is no soul, I will be attacked, If i say there is no past life, i will be attacked. So it is actually good to help people in focusing rather than telling my own version of truth.

Regards

 Your truth is your truth. That's what makes you, you. Nobody can prove anything as the sole truth right now. We can just believe what's in our hearts and what feels right to us. People don't have to share our beliefs to make them real!
We have all kinds of forums here. From Metaphysics and Book reviews all the way down to Religion and new World happening or newsworthy stories.

I admit Indian that I used to be one of those people that 'attack' and dismiss... hey... we all make mistakes and learn otherwise. :-)

Many young people want to learn AP to 'escape' their physical existence and life. Which is like trying to learn skiing to escape snow. They are already condemning their progress.

It is a way of life... not of sleep or otherness.

Quote from: Bedeekin on November 05, 2012, 03:21:49
I admit Indian that I used to be one of those people that 'attack' and dismiss... hey... we all make mistakes and learn otherwise. :-)

Many young people want to learn AP to 'escape' their physical existence and life. Which is like trying to learn skiing to escape snow. They are already condemning their progress.

It is a way of life... not of sleep or otherness.

That's humbleness :)

I agree with you.

Regards

Well its delightful to know that this topic has not only given us a spark of motivation but its good to acknowledge these errors that we all seem to exhibit from time time.
but honestly this teaching fatigue is something that can be applied to any teachings,
professors, teachers, doctors, they must all get tired from time to time having to explain and answer the same question over and over again, they realize what we have discussed over this topic, and that is to not make the lesson too complicated,
earlier someone mentioned how our would is fractal based and its true, its the only way to make something so Big be so Small, honestly its pretty Scary but it works!!  :-D

samething goes for any teaching or lesson, each lesson, skill, ability, etc. has its own story its own "BOOK"
so when someone starts to ask about a specific technique, or situation, STOP TRYING TO READ THEM THE WHOLE BOOK, AND JUST TELL THEM WHERE TO FIND IT  :-), its saves alot of time

and again whether they decide to read the book or not is up to them, then their the ones responsible for their own learning

There was a time when I was getting bored of reading the same newbie questions over and over, the same debates, the same opinions. And not just the AP, but the whole internet. So now I limit my time on the internet and don't log on during the weekends at all. It's healthier for my mind. "But what about the people that need help?" If they're serious, they'll figure it out. When I do help, it's mostly those I feel are very genuine in wanting to change their lives, not just pick up a new hobby.

Really, I'm just a member with some experience who may be able to help a fellow AP'er out. Even when I was a mod, I never considered myself higher/better than any members, I was just the one who cleaned up the messes. No one here is certified.

It's strange... I don't get bored at all giving newbies advice... no matter what questions they ask. what I tend to do is treat it as a first to answer, first to serve basis.

If I catch a newbie after their first post then I will give them as much as I can... if someone else answers them I try to leave it with them rather than thrust another viewpoint or method onto them... especially if the newbie has built up a rapport with the experienced member.

44 replies  :lol: there should be an extremely hot topic and an ultra hot topic.

Hi,
I'm working on an easy to learn blueprint at present. It'll hopefully remove some of the basic questions by beginners trying it out first. It's basic and informative allowing variations and it promotes self learning.
Hopefully its not too long and enough info is presented within. It can be changed if necessary to improve any part or add a pertinent fact that has been overlooked.
Hopefully its good enough to help someone.

Nice...

I'm working on a Sleep Paralysis treatise at the moment for the Pulse. Although there are oodles of resources out there, this forum deserves something more concise, relative and custom made towards those that don't understand it. Hopefully it will help those who AP but don't experience it to recognise it when a newbie lists unusual phenomena they are experiencing that is plainly SP related... and to those who do experience it but interpret it as something else.

I am completely aware that SP/VS isn't a requirement to experience the nonphysical, but it is very common and needs to be addressed.

Nice one, it will be an interesting read. I seem to have been immune to SP and the vibes. There's lots out there and now there's going to be, the 'in-house' thesis too.
I'll learn something Im sure.

Yes...

The thing is, it's very easy to experience SP... too easy. It's mainly a biological process that forces a sudden change in consciousness that instantly puts one in a non-physical state of awareness... not focus. It requires a specific sleep pattern... hence why narcoleptics 'suffer' from it.

Apart from the actual act of it and what is happening I have had to reassess the importance of it.

The house thesis?

Is that beetlejuice syndrome or the common dream thing we were threading about recently?

Very good posts from everyone.

Quote from: Bedeekin on November 03, 2012, 23:14:29
No... not at all... in fact I prefer it now because I am comfortable with myself and others.

I get a different feeling than I used to.. .or rather I have different motives, that are less to do about wanting to be egotistically correct and right about what I could teach and more to do with guiding others using what I have learned.

I used to think that I was 100% right though. Ask anyone from Astral Viewers (R.I.P.)... I am slightly embarrassed about the original 'Bedeekin's method' I posted online years ago. Very aggressive... very dismissive.  :oops:

I took a long sabbatical because I had some experiences and events that changed my whole outlook... and I've been humbled by them. My theories haven't changed... in fact they were affirmed and given body, reason and volume by My Big TOE. But my outlook has.

I actually didn't feel 'spiritual' and rebuked 'spirituality' for a long time. I was very practical in my approach and a lot of what I used to say I didn't truly believe because on one side I KNEW that I had experienced precognition and positive affirmed remote hits involving RTZ projections.. but dismissed other things that others had experienced because they didn't fit within my defined pragmatism. so I was sort of... contradicting myself a lot.

something like....

"I denounce your theory of auras because I haven't seen evidence of them, but did I tell you about the time I was seeing through the eyes of a child alien in another reality that had lost her parents..."  :-D

Seriously.. I was that bad.

This post, Bedeekin, really hits it for me.

I find that the more I delve, learn and grow spiritually... the more I realize that astral projection by itself is just about meaningless and learning to do it before learning other more important things is putting the buggy before the horse.  Sure, you'll eventually get to where you're going, but you're going to struggle and it's going to suck every step of the way... and you're, most likely, going to quit because you're not getting "right away".

I question why I still come here every day... and, honestly, I still haven't really come up with a good answer that I feel is "right".  I do want to help guide people... but I also find that a vast majority of people here don't want guidance.  They want to get what they're looking for with as little work as possible to do it as fast as they can.  To those people I say good luck finding your needle, it's somewhere over there in that huge haystack the size of the cosmos.

You can tell the people who come here genuinely searching for answers... they're the ones who put in the time to actually FIND what they're looking for instead of having things handed to them on a silver platter.  I guess it's those "genuine" people whom are the people I continue here for.

Oh... and I enjoy banning spammers.  ^_^

Quote from: Stookie_ on November 05, 2012, 12:13:17
There was a time when I was getting bored of reading the same newbie questions over and over, the same debates, the same opinions. And not just the AP, but the whole internet.

Im not so sure of my source on where i heard this from, it was probably from  a peice by socrates or the founding fathers of the U.S.
"We came here not to establish something new but to up-hold what has been true for all ages and eras,"

im pretty sure it is from a document surrounding something about the US consitution or a letter sent between those involved, anyway samething goes for what this topic has been touching up on

honestly every teacher throughout history has hit this milestone, and the only thing one can do is keep going, to keep up holding the basic principles that make one a true Teacher

B, typo, corrected, now where's my glasses.  :roll:

Quote from: Xanth on November 05, 2012, 19:15:46
I do want to help guide people... but I also find that a vast majority of people here don't want guidance.  They want to get what they're looking for with as little work as possible to do it as fast as they can.  To those people I say good luck finding your needle, it's somewhere over there in that huge haystack the size of the cosmos.

I really want to help people too but I get a lot of "Well I saw this movie..." Or... "Well this guy told me that it's dangerous" I could quote so many things that I hear, and by that point I am just like... *facepalm* It was very hard for me NOT to talk about astral projection at first... even people in person. I just wanted to get a megaphone and yell hey!! There's so much more out there! etc... but now, I find myself ONLY talking about projection on here. Or anything related to the subject really... I have had so many people tell me well what do I do? I tell them intent is a must and they will just not want to even try right after I say that, and find the subject very boring after they learn it takes time and practice and dedication, and to me... it's really a life style change. Not a lot of people are willing to do that unfortunately.

As far as I can see, this forum is not categorized properly. There should be only one forum under which Newbies can ask questions regarding their progress, rest of the forum should be divided into categories related to Metaphysics and serious discussions. :) Only then we will be able to talk to like minded people .. right now we get lost in so many forums..

Quote from: indian on November 06, 2012, 01:54:46
right now we get lost in so many forums..

Exactly, why is there a topic for OBE's and astral projection ?

Quote from: Xanth on November 05, 2012, 19:15:46
Oh... and I enjoy banning spammers.  ^_^

haha!! "This house... is clear"

AstralCody... If people aren't wanting to put the time, effort or intent in then that is their prerogative... and these are qualities that are down to the individual that we as guides/helpers can do nothing about unfortunately.

Among the usual things that are repeated again and again are... (I'm paraphrasing and standardising of course)

"I've been trying for 3 weeks now and NOTHING... what am I doing wrong?"

"I don't have time for that method... is there anything else you can suggest"

"What is the best method?"

"I felt a tingle in my little finger... what does this mean"

"can I be possessed?"

"I have been researching AP online for a year now and pretty much know all there is to know... now I'm ready to AP"

The last one I have encountered many times and it generally makes me smile and roll my eyes... not in a 'dumbass' way.. more in a 'here we go' way.

Quote from: M4RT1N on November 06, 2012, 02:54:24
Exactly, why is there a topic for OBE's and astral projection ?

I hadn't actually considered that. It must be confusing to a beginner. Really though it's the tip of the iceberg when it comes to labelling the nonphysical, there are so many 'terms' that mean the same thing... I personally get confused about the Focus 1,2,3,4 etc... something I should at least learn so that I can relate to the system and be able to get involved with those discussions. But naming everything is in our nature to be able to define and understand the world. It does however slow down understanding when it comes to the Nonphysical.

I'm read a brilliant book called 'The Way of Wyrd'... it is about a christian scribe who is sent on a mission into the depths of Anglo Saxon England to collect information about pagan life... so that the church have enough info to be able to swarm in and convert the heathens. There he meets a Sorcerer called "Wulf" who calls the nonphysical realm 'Middle-Earth'. The scribe (the everyman grounding character) asks Wulf (the mystic) many questions that confuse him on the understanding of his faith... I marked a page that had a fantastic paragraph that I probably saved for this moment...

"You are labelling pieces of the world with words, then confusing your word-hoard for the totality of life. You see life as though you were viewing a room by the light of a singe moving candle; then you make the error of assuming that the small areas you are seeing one at a time are separate and cannot be seen as one. Since the small areas of your life are thus seen as separate, you have to invent ways of connecting them. This is the fallacy of the ordinary person's point of view of life, for everything is already connected. Middle-Earth is one room, lit by a thousand candles'"

Quote from: M4RT1N on November 06, 2012, 02:54:24
Exactly, why is there a topic for OBE's and astral projection ?

Because at one point they were believed to be separate experiences.   Hell, some people still think they are.   

I think the Pulse could seriously use a forum/subforum shakeup.

Quote from: Xanth on November 06, 2012, 07:43:54
Because at one point they were believed to be separate experiences.   Hell, some people still think they are.   

I think the Pulse could seriously use a forum/subforum shakeup.

I am one of those people.

I don't think there needs to be a shakeup.

 :roll: :-D

There is no reason why a compromise of a differently structured forum can be met without an I agree.. I don't agree situation.

Amalgamating the differently perceived experiences into a whole can still take place, because those who believe they are separate experiences can still write it as so and won't change their belief, surely. It must be confusing for those not experienced because they receive contradictory information and we run into the 'I say this you say that' scenario.

Hi,
Lets continue onwards with NPR and cover em both. :wink:

To clarify a bit more what I was saying yesterday, the forum goes through waves when it comes to members and topics. What is normal for a couple months changes into something else, then comes back. Like drug topics. You get a never-ending amount for a couple months, then they disappear, then they come back, etc.

So many people have come by with guides and faqs, new forum ideas, "perfect" methods, diets, machines... everyone thinks they have something that will make everything better, but from my perspective, not much ever changes. In the end, the same ideas and topics come back around and around. New people show up with the same things discussed before, and you go through it again.

What I'm saying is, I think it will always be like this. I'm not trying to dissuade anyone from doing anything, I just think that's the nature of it. If you try to harness and control it, you're gonna get frustrated. If you expect to help every person who wants/needs it, you're going to get frustrated. Everyone is responsible for their own progress, and this is a great forum to discuss topics related to it. Though I'll never look at it as a classroom or teacher/student thing. I'm more like the fellow on the corner who can point you in the right direction.

I'm neither complaining nor tooting the AP horn. It's awesome to see new contributions to the forum and think Beedekin's SP treatise is definitely needed.

Yeah... it is like that on forums. They are very cyclic.

The MBT forum is very strict and still seems to be fraught with disagreements and in-fighting. It's very difficult to post there without being EXACT about what one is saying... not free form at all. While it suits the MBT forum format (to only pertain to MBT) I would hate to see it happen on here.

The OBE4U forum is also rule-set... there is one tiny section for people who believe that OOBEs are more than just chemical brain interactions... and that is policed by evangelical admin trying to convert them to their way of thinking.

Damn... I should get a move on with it then.  :wink:

Quote from: Bedeekin on November 06, 2012, 11:58:48

there is one tiny section for people who believe that OOBEs are more than just chemical brain interactions... and that is policed by evangelical admin trying to convert them to their way of thinking.

hmmm... interesting

Quote from: M4RT1N on November 06, 2012, 13:43:34
hmmm... interesting

And the description Bedeekin mentions is why I won't participate on radugas forum anymore.  The company he keeps is questionable at best, and fraudulent at worst.

Summerlander is a moderator over at Raduga's forum. I think that would explain the reasons for everything over there, lol.

Quote from: todd421757 on November 06, 2012, 18:40:25
Summerlander is a moderator over at Raduga's forum. I think that would explain the reasons for everything over there, lol.

That about nails it too.

I've personally emailed Michael several times warning him of Summerlander... but the dude won't listen.  So I'm forced to believe that he enjoys the company he keeps... which really doesn't say much for him.  His techniques are fine, they work... they're not exactly anything new, but beyond that, I stay far away from him now.

Raduga is his own form of teaching fatigue.  LoL

Ha, Using a direct method? Rofl.

I went on a few forums recently just to have a look at their content and was utterly flabbergasted at OOBE4U.

Both you and I get a special mention Xanth.  :-D

Quote from: Bedeekin on November 07, 2012, 03:59:45
I went on a few forums recently just to have a look at their content and was utterly flabbergasted at OOBE4U.
Both you and I get a special mention Xanth.  :-D

I just went on their site for the first time and I can see that they have links and articles from this site. But it looks like they bring them there to cut them down. Kind of a strange approach. To this day nobody has been proven 100% right or wrong, so why argue? It's important to keep an open mind and find your own truths, those are the only ones that will have an effect on your own personal reality.

Really? oh dear. I just glanced at the board.

Summerlander claims that he was banned from most forums because he disagreed... He doesn't mention that during our last interaction on a chat room he ended it with pretty nasty comments including "I hope you die"

Also... he forgets that I have PMs from him on this forum... I'm not one to name and shame or slag people off... but we discussed Raduga once.

I mentioned simply that Raduga came across as very Russian - as in cold and intimidating.... for the benefit of any OBE4U spies... his reply was...

"Hmmm...this reminds me of something peculiar that happened when I decided to check out the blogs on obe4u recommended by Rudolph...

I was reading the comments on one particular experience and people seemed to be discarding the notion of 1st phase and 2nd phase.

When I introduced this perspective as a possibility, using terms that they could understand like Here-Now projection and metaphysical projection, in order to make people aware that there seems to be two distinct types...my post suddenly went missing!!!!

It was my second post there and all of a sudden I was left with only one post! And guess who was the only person online at the time...an Administrator...Michael Raduga!

Surely one can disagree with the 1st phase/2nd phase view but...why delete posts? Why can't people be allow to express their views/opinions? It couldn't have been nothing else but that. He must have deleted it. I stopped posting there because I felt that I could no longer express myself or had to watch what I said.

If that's the case then Mr. Raduga can play Russian roulette alone! "

Compared to a paragraph from his last PM...

"Whatever the phase is, who cares?  Do you know what attracts me more to Raduga than anything else?  The fact that he simply does not care what it is.  All he cares about is the results.  What people can get out of them.  How it can help them in waking life.  This is what the fantasy-loving Tombots cannot understand. This is what I care about the most too and I am glad that I am currently working closely with Michael Raduga."

I really don't want to turn this into a slagging off thread but I just had to share that.

Quote from: Bedeekin on November 07, 2012, 06:19:35"Do you know what attracts me more to Raduga than anything else?  The fact that he simply does not care what it is.  All he cares about is the results.  What people can get out of them.  How it can help them in waking life."

This is the only thing I ever could agree to Summerland's (Radruga's?) views. It's good for techniques, no matter what you make of the experience. All other views expressed by him were based on utter reductionism for me. He also seems to have a problem (which he's not aware of, of course) with his Ego. I mean, who else on forums does in a general bottom-signature quote himself ("...." - Summerlander)? I found this highly funny  :lol:.
On this forum, he also quoted YT links to the hyper-materialist-atheists Dawkins and Randi (!) once (and NOT to criticise or expose them!). Another user (in a pm to me, when I was in an argument with him on another forum) called him once a 'fake sceptic' and I should maybe try to not fall into his trap of senseless provocation, which is what he was all about. My resumé: He was a pseudosceptic (http://www.debunkingskeptics.com/) and all-out close-minded materialist from the start, which (for me) makes him a troll in a forum like this.

Well... Raduga does care about results and his Ibook is brilliant, it practically has every trick under the sun and great information on 'anchoring' and maintaining lucidity... one of the many things normally overlooked. He's also worked damn hard and you cant knock his ability of self promotion. He has also been successful in gathering together an actual group that meet eye to eye and goes on holidays etc... like a little club. A really nice idea.

I cant help but worry that those who are deeply involved in the group and actually find 'affirmation' and objective evidence pertaining to the reality of NPMR, wouldn't dare suggest it openly.

Forgive me if this sounds harsh, but that sounds kind of like a cult.   ROFL

Oh well... to each their own,  I guess.  The old "tad more open" Summerlander was a great guy to talk to, but this new "blind" version.... Not so much.   Lol

Quote from: Xanth on November 07, 2012, 07:44:37
Forgive me if this sounds harsh, but that sounds kind of like a cult.   ROFL

:-D you noticed my subtext!! lol

Should we really be spending our time publicly criticizing other people and forums? It's just going to create an even bigger rift. Let's just do our thing here. :)

lol

I know... should we also extend that to not publicly criticising each other then?  :-D

That was a joke by the way.

In light of it all I have been extremely conservative with the last posts... including the example of Summer's PMs which are very nasty to the pint of scary ... and I don't really think that we deserve a slap on the wrist and a pointy finger. Especially from someone who hasn't been at the receiving end of the rather naughty 'slagging' that has been going on over at OBE4U... It's more than a rift... it is another planet.

The interactions that took place actually almost killed my love of forums... so not only am I staying on topic but I am personally entitled to criticise. Im sure this isn't a reflection on you nor this Forum.

*EDIT*

I was also finished mentioning it until this post. The bottles were empty, the music had finished and people were gathering coats.  :-D

I love the pulse!! Everyone's really cool here.

And quite honestly... I want to make sure everyone is well aware of the "bad" that is the OBE4U forum.  Stick with Raduga's eBook... and the techniques within, don't bother with his forum.  It'll only set you back.

Edit: if you're going to post, at least pretend to keep it on topic... Thanks.

Well.... Looks like someone deleted my posts? Without any notification?

Dont worry about it Indian! They weren't recounting any information about OOBEs or your own experiences.

Dont forget that other people's posts were sacrificed in the cull... also... mine.. lionheart's... Xanth's.... not just yours. It was a whole off topic conversation between other people as well.

Nothing of any value to the forum was lost.  :-)

Quote from: Xanth on November 07, 2012, 22:09:07
Edit: if you're going to post, at least pretend to keep it on topic... Thanks.

y

That is a good example of what this topic is about. So you actually stayed on topic there M4RT1N without needing to pretend.

You could have started a topic in general discussions called 'Why do we have to keep on Topic?"

Quote from: Bedeekin on November 08, 2012, 10:45:25
Nothing of any value to the forum was lost.  :-)

No problem Bedeekin .. I thought someone deleted by mistake so I asked.

Sorry to say, but as you mentioned that only valuable things are being kept.. and this "Gossip" about another forum? That is why I asked how many ladies are here?  :-)

I do not think anyone here is posting anything authentic but people are writing their own blog and started making their books. These half baked knowledge actually harming and confusing people.

Just few day back.. I was chatting with my "Guide".. he is a kind of real intelligent.. who is always interested in good discussion .. he was telling me about harmony..

"He said human race is lacking harmony and we can actually resolve everything if we are able to put the harmony back in life. Those who have nothing to teach, they start teaching, those who have real things to teach, they remain silent. People who are fat, they keep eating all the time and there are people who keep fasting to get zero figure. If we need 7 shirts to wear, we have collection of 50 and some people try to remain in a single cloth for their whole life and they are being respected as monk. Those who wants to build their body, they keep making it for their whole life and there are some who never hit the gym and remain in chair for the rest of their life. Human race is lacking harmony very BADLY and if we do not learn this fast, nature will be bound to teach us so. "Nature" needs harmony, everything should be in harmony."

It was a long chat.. but I felt like sharing few word here with you guys..

Many Regards

The girl thing was referring to that? Wow... I did not get that. I thought you were asking because you wanted a girlfriend.  :-D seriously

He is so right. Nice.

I think the media has a hell of a lot to answer for when it comes to modern human (Western) society. It is like a giant out of control consciousness that is so high in entropy and disorder, yet is followed devoutly by a large percentage of the population. The mass of information on the internet is a blessing and a curse.

Quote from: Bedeekin on November 08, 2012, 11:43:42
The girl thing was referring to that? Wow... I did not get that. I thought you were asking because you wanted a girlfriend.  :-D seriously

He is so right. Nice.

LOL.. This is not a kind of dating site.. why one would ask for a girlfriend here .. but anyway.. I really liked your innocence.

We will keep getting "hypnotized" until human consciousness is not awaken. We all are in deep sleep hence we start following what media or anyone else shows us.

As far as i can say, when i visited the future, I was shown our race was much more ahead than today. We will be able to do/make wonders, but our population will be much more lesser than today. My main concern is to raise my and other people's consciousness, because nature will save only "refined" species/gene.

We can not blame media or anything here, we need to work on our-self. we know everything but still we neglect what is important in our life.

Regards
Tabish

Let's hope that your Future glimpse was the correct one... that some of us 'DO' survive.  :-)

Ben

People really need a refresher in the AUP... The link is at the top of every page.   Please read it... Thank you.

I think the ideology of the aincients respected harmony. The teachings from the elders. The respect that had to be EARNED. Its almost unheard of in a Western culture.
No surprise that fingernails, lipstick and a piece of string for a figure, draped in a teabag with a name, hits the mark for so many of the unfortunate.
The teaching of old world ways is left for the historians of today. Even then the spiritual side is omitted or totally ignored as it may cause an apathetic view, lowering the actual importance of the lost arts.
We are at least attempting to resuscitate a part of it and now the monotony of identical questions is pushing this task beyond limits set by some.
Harmony within a teaching method is required without becoming an automated service.
To do this needs a 'big picture' viewpoint.
  Every single question asked comes from a different source. Each source has an identity.
The identity has a frame of mind aimed at learning. To reject the question will alter the mindset of the source and create a  downward spiral respecting the learning process. The attention is lost and the learning disregarded.
A new negative frame of mind develops aimed at retribution and egoistic battles ensue.
Not an ideal situation but a strong point.
Is there an answer?
To fix the many you first fix the few.
Are you one of the few, helping to enlighten or one of the many waiting for your dinner, handed to you on a plate?

Thought time...

The answer... unfortunately, is that everyone must pull themselves up by their own bootstraps... on their own time too, no doubt. 
That's the only way the world gets better and grows together... one piece at a time.  One consciousness at a time.  :)

Quote from: indian on November 08, 2012, 11:31:52
Just few day back.. I was chatting with my "Guide".. he is a kind of real intelligent.. who is always interested in good discussion .. he was telling me about harmony..

"He said human race is lacking harmony and we can actually resolve everything if we are able to put the harmony back in life. Those who have nothing to teach, they start teaching, those who have real things to teach, they remain silent. People who are fat, they keep eating all the time and there are people who keep fasting to get zero figure. If we need 7 shirts to wear, we have collection of 50 and some people try to remain in a single cloth for their whole life and they are being respected as monk. Those who wants to build their body, they keep making it for their whole life and there are some who never hit the gym and remain in chair for the rest of their life. Human race is lacking harmony very BADLY and if we do not learn this fast, nature will be bound to teach us so. "Nature" needs harmony, everything should be in harmony."

Your Guide must know my Guide. Maybe they went to the same Astral School or something. This is the exact message I am becoming told. Our need for "overabundance" is one of our worst traits as Human beings. All these material things we own just to feed our egos. At one time Man only had a burlap bag/sash made of leaves for clothing. I'm sure he had more than one, but that seemed to be enough for him. I am shocked when they show one of those Hollywood Stars on TV with their closet filled with 300 pairs of shoes. Their closets are as big as most people's bedrooms and some people's living rooms. They are usually of the mindset that if you have the money "flaunt" it.

I agree with you Lionheart.  There are a lot of greedy people around.  They own properties around the world and they have an excessive amount of things.  I am not jealous of them.  They are entitled to do what they want with their wealth.  You can have all the wealth in the world but it does not bring happiness.  I only have what I need and I am happy with that. 

And that's just it though... those people *will* eventually come around to growing spiritually.  It might not be this lifetime, or the next, or the next 100 lifetimes, but they will eventually learn what we're figuring out for ourselves.

And that brings me to what I mentioned above... we each grow at our own pace doing the best we can with what we have.  Everyone is at a different point in their learning, but everyone is exactly where they need to be to further their own personal development.  This makes it so that nobody is "ahead" and nobody is "behind"... we all just "are", and each of us is doing it the best we can.  :)

It does alarm me how many 'spiritual' people out there are hoping for some sort of 'mass' evolution. Like aliens coming down to change consciousness.. or waiting for a paradigm shift to happen. This is almost like the Jehovah witnesses that supposes that if you pray and believe in their version of god you will ascend to paradise when the world is judged.

I actually read Watchtower (jehovah witness publication) when it comes through the post... just to be less ignorant and I find it the artwork that visualises their idea of paradise utterly disturbing...

(http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-JNTyrAUQ2RQ/UCQMvH944rI/AAAAAAAAAKc/EdOkpByX2dw/s1600/%25CE%2593%25CE%2597+-+%25CE%25A0%25CE%2591%25CE%25A1%25CE%2591%25CE%2594%25CE%2595%25CE%2599%25CE%25A3%25CE%259F%25CE%25A3.jpg)

A lion playing with a ball... and a raccoon...

(http://www.watchtowerinformationservice.org/beau.jpg)

What's with the 'cat' fixation?

(http://peaceandbeauty.files.wordpress.com/2011/12/12-17-2011-033715pm.jpg)

This one is depicting the devout survivors after the destruction of jehovah's judgement. Look at their smiling faces after they have witnessed the death of thousands on non-believers.

Joking aside they see this paradise is AFTER judgement... and that they will ascend because of their strict following of Jehovah.

A bit off topic but I had to share.

Love the lion with the beachball. lmao

Thank you Bedeekin for sharing those pictures. It shows that some religious people are selfish. Some don't care about the misfortune of others as long as they get to enjoy paradise.

It is far out isn't it? Where has the food chain gone? What does the lion eat? The racoon? Who makes the food utensils? the table with the umbrella? Are there still factories in this paradise? Why is the mexican dressed like something from a sergio leone film? Why a palm tree? They are just not thinking it through.  :-D

But the idea that we adhere to certain rules and ways so that when we die we go to this beautiful place full of love and understanding is missing the point of what COULD and CAN be achieved here.. in this particular life and on THIS planet. Without the Lions, Tigers, racoons and Koala bears living amongst us.

It definitely is far out. And I have talked with many people who thought like this. It is crazy. They should be surprised when they have their life review and see how this selfish behavior affected their actions.

I bet if they had a few fully conscious OBE's, they would wake up real quick.

I remember I asked a guy who had a near death experience about astral projection and an experience I had. He said I kid you not... "hmmm well... You DO KNOW that there is a heaven and a hell... does god really want you messing with that stuff?" and treated me like crap ever since. That's why I never talk about this stuff unless it's on here anymore. I thought that statement was rediculous. He said god held him in his arms when he died but said it wasn't his time or something. I thought it was extremely rude what he said though, and how he said it. I almost wanted to tell him there is no hell or any of that horse crap, and to stop thumping but... I was nice.

Some people completely allow fear to run their lives... and they don't ever question why. 

Quote from: Bedeekin on November 08, 2012, 11:43:42
I think the media has a hell of a lot to answer for when it comes to modern human (Western) society.
The mass of information on the internet is a blessing and a curse.

"A God of such advanced scientific, mathematic, and Artistically righteous capabilities would not have given me the Same highly advanced abilities to Waste and Ignore their Potential" - by someone i cant remember at the moment-

It is safe to say the day non-physics, meta physics, or any other synonym, is commonly accepted and understood throughout the world as a universal bond between living organisms then we sill start to have a deeper understanding of our distinctions between others who are or are not enlightened  :-D literally

we will then be able to seperate those who are able to believe and co-operate in a Monolithic society that is unique in difference individually, from those who can only ignore the being of a Living Mass

 What's wrong with a Lion with a Beachball?  :-D He looks like he fits right in!  :-)

Quote from: Lionheart on November 09, 2012, 01:47:13
What's wrong with a Lion with a Beachball?  :-D He looks like he fits right in!  :-)

:lol: I'd hope Lionheart!

Quote from: Bedeekin on November 08, 2012, 20:38:05
I actually read Watchtower (jehovah witness publication) when it comes through the post... just to be less ignorant and I find it the artwork that visualises their idea of paradise utterly disturbing...

If you show these pictures in India.. no one would understand anything and don't even bother to look. No one knows here what you are talking about... likes and dislikes depends on the surrounding you have...

I born in a Muslim family and everyone knows how hardcore Islamic teachings are, but I stopped following Islam when I was in 8th slandered. At that very age i understood that something is badly wrong with the Islamic system and i silently started ignoring gatherings and started researching my own way. Since then I tried to study many religious belief but all else failed. My journey was real hard because I had to study quietly and keep my secrets with me only and that thing still making me hesitate to share what i see and what i have learned so far. For outside world, I am still Muslim and they treat me so, but no one knows what I do and what I have been experiencing. Now, my family knows this and I am lucky to have parents and sibling who trusted and believed me.  

I took my father, mother, and my 2 sister and 2 brothers on spiritual journey and when they saw everything they believed it. At first my father was hell angry but I promised that If I am not able to take you there, I will do whatever you say, and he agreed. It was almost a year back when in the morning my father came in my room and hugged me and cried. He was so excited about the last night and very happy to tell what he saw. Now he knows the truth and he is proud that his son showed him the right path.

My whole family now is on the way to spiritual journey and they dropped everything they learned in the past. There is no religion in my house anymore and everyone is equal.

I think I can share my journey and thoughts with my like minded friends here. I want to thank you all for being here and listening me.

Many Regards

That's pretty amazing India. That you have influenced your family.   :-)

Quote from: indian on November 09, 2012, 09:06:43I took my father, mother, and my 2 sister and 2 brothers on spiritual journey and when they saw everything they believed it.

Highly interesting. Could you elaborate what you did and how you did it exactly?

The understanding of symbols is just as subjective as the process it takes to manifest them through a keyboard.

Has anyone considered that there are many similarities between what our posts are saying?

Remember, 1/4 is .25 is 25% is a quarter. All the same, but taking a slightly different bias in each scenario to the situational context.

To get to what is truly being described one has to empathize to remove the context to get to the heart of the phenomenon attempting to be expressed.

Cheers,
Contenteo

Quote from: Contenteo on November 09, 2012, 11:32:20

Has anyone considered that there are many similarities between what our posts are saying?

Absolutley.

What is even more interesting is that... other groups I am part of... UFO... Science... philosophy... neurology are also saying these same things.

We will one day all step out of our little compartmentalised rooms and realise we are in the same house.

Quote from: Contenteo on November 09, 2012, 11:32:20
The understanding of symbols is just as subjective as the process it takes to manifest them through a keyboard.

Has anyone considered that there are many similarities between what our posts are saying?

Remember, 1/4 is .25 is 25% is a quarter. All the same, but taking a slightly different bias in each scenario to the situational context.

To get to what is truly being described one has to empathize to remove the context to get to the heart of the phenomenon attempting to be expressed.

Cheers,
Contenteo

I can agree with this. Going back to the jehova's witnesses, I had a couple nice ladies come to my door over the summer wanting to tell me about jahova's return. So I talked to them about my own personal experiences in a way they could understand, using their terminology for things (I'm pretty good at this with Christians). I felt like they not only listened to me, but they were hearing a truth that made sense to them that they had never heard of or considered before. They left without leaving anything... it was like I turned it around on them. And while I'm sure they went back to their regular lives, I hope I planted a seed that will eventually grow.

And lastly, I feel one of the best ways to teach others, especially people not open to these things, is by example. I constantly try to improve myself and live in a way which I think would greatly improve the world if everyone did it. The more a person is around you, the more they subconsciously soak up these traits in themselves. You don't necessarily have to use words to teach and motivate people.

112 posts 0.0

Quote from: Volgerle on November 09, 2012, 11:18:41
Highly interesting. Could you elaborate what you did and how you did it exactly?

I told him to practice Phasing method. My father had already done many Sufi practises in past so it was very easy for him to do this. He Phased in two days of practice only.

Since my father was already familiar with meditations and all so he did not do the exact thing i said. He invented his own way just in two days. Normally for phasing I start with Frank's method, but it does not work with everyone.

My father have been working with his "Third eye" in the past, so what he did was:

"After a sound sleep in the night, he woke up around 5 in the morning, then he lay  in a comfortable position and "set his eye" between his eyebrows (eyes should be closed, please remember that).. and after few minutes. he tried to take his eye back as back as possible.. as hard as one can do.. it will be like setting your inner vision to the top of your head (inward).. and after few minutes he phased.. with a very bright light.. boom.. he found himself on a new place"..

I also try this method sometime.. when I am not well or not able to relax properly..

Let me know if you require more info..

Regards

Quote from: Contenteo on November 09, 2012, 11:32:20
The understanding of symbols is just as subjective as the process it takes to manifest them through a keyboard.

Has anyone considered that there are many similarities between what our posts are saying?

Remember, 1/4 is .25 is 25% is a quarter. All the same, but taking a slightly different bias in each scenario to the situational context.

To get to what is truly being described one has to empathize to remove the context to get to the heart of the phenomenon attempting to be expressed.

Cheers,
Contenteo

Gold.  :)

Quote from: Contenteo on November 09, 2012, 11:32:20
The understanding of symbols is just as subjective as the process it takes to manifest them through a keyboard.
Has anyone considered that there are many similarities between what our posts are saying?
Remember, 1/4 is .25 is 25% is a quarter. All the same, but taking a slightly different bias in each scenario to the situational context.
To get to what is truly being described one has to empathize to remove the context to get to the heart of the phenomenon attempting to be expressed.
Cheers,
Contenteo

This brilliant quote by Contenteo is the exact reason that I like to refer to what we are accomplishing here as simply "accessing the Non Physical Reality (NPR)". Plain and simple, everyone can understand this!  :-)

arent you just technically re-wording it to Sell It better?

Quote from: Mr.Flip on November 12, 2012, 00:00:25
arent you just technically re-wording it to Sell It better?

No, I am just stating the obvious!  :-)

Great Information :-)

I'm guilty of teaching fatigue. 

If it weren't for those who resisted burnout, though, I wouldn't be where I am today. 

Haha! Well you are a success story then... That's why it's just a fatigue and not a 'give up'.

I don't think I could give it up.

Quote from: Bedeekin on November 20, 2012, 10:50:45
Haha! Well you are a success story then... That's why it's just a fatigue and not a 'give up'.

I don't think I could give it up.

You can't, it becomes a part of you!  :-) Actually it's more like it IS you!

Yep... I hear that alright.

Greetings all
Bedeekin, Sometimes you manage to sum up my attitude towards OBE forums very succinctly.
And BTW somehow I missed this thread back when it was first posted so this post may seem a bit out of  order and disjointed (but anyway).

Q. Are any of the experienced members on here growing tired of teaching and advising?
My answer Emphatic Yes ! and many many moons ago. Even if 75 % of my advice is helpful and useful (and that may be wishful thinking) then only about 25 % of the people use only about 50 % of the advice that I provide them. Meaning most of it is a Big waste of time.

Q. Or are the experienced ones feeling that actual experience amounts to nothing and therefor are almost frightened that to consider themselves experienced is almost a sacrilege to the new 'at the end of the day we really know nothing' climate?
My answer An emphatic No! I try to distance myself from people who I perceive to have the 'at the end of the day we really know nothing' climate.

Q. Or does anyone with anything to offer get the feeling they have nothing to offer to the community because there are so many other differing opinions, like banging their head against a brick wall?
My answer, I feel weary of entering into yet another is OBE real? argument. Or getting involved in yet another long phasing vs classical OBE discussion. Not all nonphysical experiences are the same and OBEs, APs, LDs and dreams should not all be lumped together. But I've said that seemingly a thousand times and don't feel the need to repeat it again and again in every other post. (Whether Summerlander is a member of the website or Not!) :? :-P

Q. Or that they repeat themselves over and over again?
My answer is a huge Yes!!!. This is the most important of the questions and gets to the heart of the matter. How many times have each of us read a post with a title like, "Was this an OBE or a lucid dream?" Personally I've seen that title, or titles very much like that, hundreds, yes hundreds, of times. In fact I don't even bother reading those threads anymore, much less reply to them.  :|

And, yes, it Is discouraging to see so many posts follow along such well worn and tiresome lines. But then usually I have given up and stopped reading Long before poster F, G, H and any others chime in with 'contributions' like demons and subjective world views.

Tried not to rant and keep it short.
Thanx for reading
Grey  8-)

From a person who hasn't archieved it yet; (me by the way); I have read so many techniques, so many posts, experiences...etc etc. Now, I don't regret it,   - why?; Two things:

1. - I was a complete sceptical from head to toes before I got into OBE's and what they are; if I didn't read all of your coincidences, all of your amazing stories written directly from the heart to the keyboard... well, I cannot say what would have done cause I have no idea but... my gut tells me and looking at my self back then, it probably wouldn't impacted me as it did. And that is mainly because of you, because of the people that post their experiences, because of the ones that cannot archieve and they just keep trying, and because of the ones that help each other out.

2. - The main thing why I don't regret having found about it trough Astral Pulse is because, well, it may have been harder this way, I've faced times where I Got scared at the slight movement, sound, vision around me; Because of all of the stories I've read. And I've got rid of that, I moved on from there to the point I am now as we all do. It requires perseverance, you have to have faith in your self and in what you are doing, I believe 100% in something I haven't witnessed yet, and that it's amazing. It's not an easy path, it's not simple, but that is what makes it beautiful.


More than any of that, the Pulse has opened me so many doors, meditation, rethinking so many things, realizations, changes of me and my life in a very VERY good way. Of course I Get fatigue some times, when I'm trying and I can't help my self but to expect something to happen, but it's more than that, way more than that. We're building our selves around here folks, even though I Cannot see your faces... what is life but interaction with your self and others?.


I know my writing is a  bit hard to understand (same as in my native language). If it doesn't make sense wait 2 seconds between each coma. :-D

Quote from: Anonymouse on November 21, 2012, 01:55:02
I know my writing is a  bit hard to understand (same as in my native language). If it doesn't make sense wait 2 seconds between each coma. :-D

You really think this! lol

Your english writing is better than most native english speakers.

About your original post; I can only thank all of you that are helping others based on your experiences. It really does good. So yeah, thank you for that:wink: