Tests, Quests and Challenges

[Nameless]

Eegad! My bad!

[Lumaza]

Eegad! My bad!

No harm, no foul! 

I was just stating something that I thought may confuse a person reading this thread for the first time. ....that is, those that aren't already confused by the whole conversation itself period. I know if I were new here, I would be!

[Lumaza]

I am definitely going be practicing this kind of experience again, and I will going back through this thread and reading the prior posts over the next week.

I think this might be a great intended goal for all of us here to try. See if you can slow the process down. Whether that "slowing" being as  you enter your nightly Dream cycles or when you awaken. Try to find the trigger that helps it commence and morph and the trigger that kills the experience immediately.

We can do some great personal experimentation with this and then share our conclusions and results as they begin to reveal themselves.

[Subtle Traveler]

I think this might be a great intended goal for all of us here to try. See if you can slow the process down. Whether that "slowing" being as  you enter your nightly Dream cycles or when you awaken. Try to find the trigger that helps it commence and morph and the trigger that kills the experience immediately.

We can do some great personal experimentation with this and then share our conclusions and results as they begin to reveal themselves.

Great! Count me in!

Thanks for the reminder about slowing down.

[Lumaza]

Great! Count me in!

Thanks for the reminder about slowing down.

Your Welcome Subtle!  

Slowing down basically undertakes us "observing" every single point of it, every step of the way or the cycle. Sometimes you need to "abort" just so you can actually log what you are seeing and experiencing. I know if I don't do that, I seem to forget many important things that are occurring along the way.

The same goes with a simple Phasing session. I sit down to have one, but only end up logging the adventure, not necessarily the path I took to get there. That seems to become a "afterthought".

I see it's easy for new people to have that problem too. I used to. I would put so much into always "pushing forward", that I would actually lose touch and memory of all the little things that happened along the way. Those little things are important as well.

[Szaxx]

@ ST I have been sending energy to a few in order to obtain some feedback. The idea being to open a door towards an experience. When things improve on the clarity side, I can send you a sensation to see if you recognise it. This will be for the future and properly arranged respecting your wishes. If you are a close match to someone, this could be a reason towards your receiving a 'link'.  I've not aimed at you in particular as this would contravene the protocol I operate under. I do send energy generally to aid those who require it, its subtle and has helped with clarity and awareness. I only read when asked or if there's a knowing of danger. This is directed specifically.

I'm catching up too and will endeavour to reply to more posts.

[Subtle Traveler]

Thanks for clarifying, Szaxx.

Something is going on at my end of things. I will ask my guides a bit more about that (e.g., I had a sense that they gave me the name). Thanks also for respecting my boundaries.

[Subtle Traveler]

I see it's easy for new people to have that problem too. I used to. I would put so much into always "pushing forward", that I would actually lose touch and memory of all the little things that happened along the way. Those little things are important as well.

Yes. This is a common response in the OBE / Projection community - pushing forward as if the astral experience were more important than the physical experience.

My growing perception is that it is really all one thing (physical and non-physical). I think that this is why I have been attracted to all your shifting exercises and ideas.

Thanks for the tips and bread crumb trail.

[ThaomasOfGrey]

It's a fine "balancing act". But you can overcome it. You can raise your awareness quite a bit and still maintain full grasp of the scenario at hand. The problem comes when you attempt to change or alter the Dream narrative itself. When I do that, it seems like the Dream begins to spiral control. I balance this by keeping the notion that I am Dreaming as a simple thought in the back of my mind, but my real intent is to see whatever it is I am to see in the current "simulation" I am experiencing. I react consciously, but it's more like reacting to the situation itself, instead of reacting with full knowledge that I am Dreaming. Like I said, it's a balancing act and can get quite tedious at times.!  

This is correct - I should have been more specific that the instability is directly related to the application of willpower in modifying the scenario or taking free will action within the scenario.

I still haven't seen a satisfactory reason for this phenomenon though. If I told a human peer that when they went to sleep I would place them inside a scenario of my fabrication and any attempt to deviate from it would cause them to be kicked from non-physical reality, that would make me a mind controlling tyrant.

I discovered this restriction on my own many years before I knew anything about astral projection or non-physical states. I am open enough to not pull any punches explaining how this happened for the sake of discussion, hope it isn't too awkward.

Around age 11, a boy in my class told me that he had experienced a "wet dream" wherein he had sex with some dream entity. I was blown away by this because although I was a frequent dreamer I had never experienced anything of comparable "realness". From that day I set out to replicate this person's experience, and that is how I began gaining awareness and taking control of my dreams.

At this time I would often become aware that I was dreaming in the early morning prior to waking. As soon as I realised I would set out on my sexual mission no matter the context of the dream. I specifically remember one experience where I was being attacked by an adult female witch outside of my house - I thought I was going to be killed - then I decided I might as well try to have sex with the witch before I died. As soon as I took free will action in the scenario it started to slip and I woke up.

I toyed with this problem for a couple of years, taking control of my dreams only to have the scenario slip. I soon learned that I could make a small change, then "let go" of the control right before it became unstable enough to wake me up. Using this technique allowed one to maintain the dream for longer, but ultimately you couldn't get much done before breaking the experience.

Ultimately I lost interest in dreams because I couldn't achieve any significant control. It wasn't until more than 10 years later that I found this place and renewed my interest in dreams, but I still haven't been able to get back to the limited mastery I had back then.

[Szaxx]

Thomas, relearn and remember the hand that strikes back is your own.
This will make sense in time.

ST,  boundaries are protected and perhaps your guides know my value. Ask them why so I can do what is required. They should already know what is in question by the single word "why".
This too will make sense in time my friend.

[Subtle Traveler]

ST,  boundaries are protected and perhaps your guides know my value. Ask them why so I can do what is required. They should already know what is in question by the single word "why".
This too will make sense in time my friend.

OK, thanks.

I am currently using a writing process before bed to quietly communicate with them, and it is working quite well - confirmations arrive quickly - using within 24 hours. I will ask them this evening.

[Phalanx]

@Lumaza
If you still have or you know the names I am quite interested in the books on spiritual healing you mentioned.

[Lumaza]

@Lumaza
If you still have or you know the names I am quite interested in the books on spiritual healing you mentioned.

MJ said to tell you that one book is "Anatomy of the Spirit" by Carolyn Myss, PH.D. She said that's a great book to start with. Once you finish with that one I can give you the names of some others.

[ThaomasOfGrey]

Thomas, relearn and remember the hand that strikes back is your own.
This will make sense in time.

This is mysterious

I don't hold a grudge against the non-physical; I tend to write fiery and provocative things to try and stretch understanding. I am not entirely convinced that there are in fact entities that influence our dreams - I am equally as sceptical on the topic of "guides" because both are outside my frame of experience.

For me feels equally possible that both guides and dream content are merely reflections of the subconscious. Additionally, not every dream I experience is constrains my free will. I have to wonder whether this is really a property of someone relaxing the noose on a particular night, or whether it is just another natural mechanic of dreams that large contrasts in awareness cause instability.

The level of lucidity and awareness in my dreams tends to peak around the full moon - further evidence against 3rd party influence.

What do you believe?

[Lumaza]

For me feels equally possible that both guides and dream content are merely reflections of the subconscious.

That was my first thought as well. I thought and was convinced that everything was a reflection of my subconscious. But like I have said in the past "just when I think I know, something changes to show me otherwise". That something was becoming aware in another existence where the people all knew me, but I didn't know them or even the location I found myself in. This would be a "fluke" if it were a "one of". But it wasn't. It happened repeatedly for nights on end and still happens today.

I use the term "parallel universe". But it's not really because it has nothing to do with my current existence here now. This seems to be me in a whole different World, in completely different circumstances than here. My entire personality is different there as well.

Edit: I guess the term Parallel Universe does still apply though, according to this definition from Wikipedia:
A parallel universe is a hypothetical self-contained separate reality co-existing with one's own. A specific group of parallel universes is called a "multiverse", although this term can also be used to describe the possible parallel universes that constitute reality

[Subtle Traveler]

I don't hold a grudge against the non-physical; I tend to write fiery and provocative things to try and stretch understanding. I am not entirely convinced that there are in fact entities that influence our dreams - I am equally as sceptical on the topic of "guides" because both are outside my frame of experience.

For me feels equally possible that both guides and dream content are merely reflections of the subconscious. Additionally, not every dream I experience is constrains my free will. I have to wonder whether this is really a property of someone relaxing the noose on a particular night, or whether it is just another natural mechanic of dreams that large contrasts in awareness cause instability.

The level of lucidity and awareness in my dreams tends to peak around the full moon - further evidence against 3rd party influence.

I can speak up here from a different experience. I have met my guidance, when out of body (not just dreaming). Guidance is real. I no longer have any beliefs underlying this topic, because I asked the figure in my OBE to confirm herself and she did. It was rather spectacular actually, but too long a story for now.

There are also many very experienced travelers who have documented this for themselves. Probably the best writing that I have seen on this subject currently among the OBE community is Frank DeMarco. He has written several books where he has long discussions with his guidance (he calls them TGU or the guys upstairs). He is the former creator and editor of Hampton Road Publishing. I have started doing things with my guidance that he does, and it is helping quite a bit.

In "some" contrast of OBE's, non-lucid dreams (and even lucid dreams) are certainly much more subject to fictional figures created by the subconscious, HOWEVER that does not mean that our guidance cannot participate in our dreams. My guidance consistently participates in my dreams, but not all the time. And I mention this because they seem to know the territory of my subconscious better than I do.

[Szaxx]

Thomas,
The level of belief changes with experience, the experience changes with belief. This is a conundrum yet it holds the answer to itself with a little thinking outside of the box.
If we don't have any beliefs at all, we assume we are an innocent and in being so it'd be easy for any belief to become part of who we are. This sounds ok in itself yet it's based on an assumption. In the old days we were told to never assume or you'd get it wrong. Science today outside of mathematical models IS based upon assumptions. Again a conundrum exist.
Think about the deeper meaning in the above and you'll see the hand that strikes back is your own.
The message was 'supplied ' from the NP and you're supposed to work it out.
I hope it makes sense to you.

I have my eyes closed when I look into the NP. I open my mind and you'd not believe the amount of things you can see. Doubt fades away in an instant and the subconcious mind becomes a new tool to use. It takes decades to learn and in one single experience you'll get all the answers to every question you can think of and more.
Those experienced here will have already met the bliss and questions don't matter in this experience.

[Lumaza]

Thomas,
The level of belief changes with experience, the experience changes with belief. This is a conundrum yet it holds the answer to itself with a little thinking outside of the box.

Just to add to Szaxx's excellent reply here. When you think like a "Human" in a physical body, you will experience that in the other realms as well. You need to have an entirely different mindset and you also need to lose the analytical mind in the experience at hand. You can analyze everything that occurred afterwards.

I have experienced a spontaneous Guide as well while in a Phase session. Mine came in the form of my deceased Brother in law Charlie. He came, he taught me, then he left. I met him in many sessions when I was new to this practice. After that, the next Guides I met were actually invisible to me, but they were responsible for the "downloads" I received.

[EscapeVelocity]

The content of a lesson/simulation still appears to be largely drawn from my subconscious, but the actions of an independent agent, be it a Guide/Instructor/my Higher Self, has become clearly evident.

Add into this the certainty of the 'knowing' that also occurs.

[Lumaza]

The content of a lesson/simulation still appears to be largely drawn from my subconscious, but the actions of an independent agent, be it a Guide/Instructor/my Higher Self, has become clearly evident.

Add into this the certainty of the 'knowing' that also occurs.

This adheres to my comment earlier in this thread about the different cycles of Dreaming.:
  "I saw that my first Dream of the night had to do with "the now". It seemed to be whatever it was that I last experienced here in the physical, like a book I was reading, a movie I was watching, a job I was doing. Everything was based on this current time.

Next came things I was working on, as in, subconscious things or problems from my past. I would find myself in some kind of situation that was due to my past.

This was followed by a Dream scenario of "play time". This was kind of like a "recess" between schools, whereas I got some time to just enjoy being there.

Next was followed by "other". This is where things got foggy though. This was well into the Dream cycle and this seemed to be the real "training grounds" or school should I say. I say school because in this area there was a "teacher" of some sort. This is where the tests, quests and challenges were initiated."

There was a segment of the Dream cycle that was indeed "subconsciously driven". But as I got deeper into the cycle, I found that things quickly changed. The last one being the one where a "Teacher/Guide was present.
I guess it all depends on what cycle of the process that you find yourself becoming consciously aware in.

The same goes with Phasing. I begin using my imagination. But soon something that wasn't part of my "script" per se, begins to occur and leads me on some kind of adventure.

[Szaxx]

During my research I was directed to a site and found it interesting enough to share. I'm only supplying this as is and it has another viewpoint on our art.
https://borderlandsciences.org/journal/vol/09/n05/Etheric_Notes.html#FirstLetter

[Lumaza]

During my research I was directed to a site and found it interesting enough to share. I'm only supplying this as is and it has another viewpoint on our art.
https://borderlandsciences.org/journal/vol/09/n05/Etheric_Notes.html#FirstLetter

That is a great read Szaxx. Thank You for sharing that.

I am on the first page and am kind of confused. He says this "(Note: It is impracticable to reproduce this sketch in color, on a mimeographed page, but the enclosed page may convey the basic idea. ml.)" and in his description he seems to be talking about a "map" or diagram, but there doesn't seem to be a map/diagram found anywhere on that page or the other pages of his notes.  
This is even more apparent when he says this ". . . To reach into the heart of the Etherian proposition immediately & somewhat technically, I am forwarding you the enclosed sketch and a few lines of commentary on it. The sketch is the best I can do at the moment, but may serve to explain what seems to me the fundamental concept of the nature and locale of Etheria.The colored circles ABCDE are to be understood as the traditional divisions of the "Inner planes", according, of course, to the ancient Oriental or Hindu conceptions, and thereby including most of the Theosophical, Rosicrucian, and Illuministic groups, not to mention the many incidental groups (Swedenborgians, Mormons, etc.)

These Inner planes must be distinguished very exactly from the circles numbered 1-2-3-4, which are "the Etheric".

The jagged lines are the mountains of our globe, rising as you see into the Etheric, and descending into the central circles A-B-C."


I do like his term "Etheria" though. It seems to give it more of targeted, reachable/attainable destination, somewhat like the "Astral Island" that so many people attempted/intended to access.

[Szaxx]

It is interesting by itself. The originator is worth searching too as some of the work is available online... at a price and you guessed it, what I wanted to read has this obstruction so I didn't bother.
I looked at the worded and did a sort of read on them and found that 'it breathes not spins' returned from the knowing. After a few seconds this made sense and it also give a clue as to why scientific studies have not included it in teachings. I'll not say more until I have worked on it, these words make perfect sense to me. Again no physical world answers yet the NP via the knowing disclosed another clue.
The map isn't available per se,  it consists of concentric circles with the source in the centre. Not much was given about this as no man can understand its complexity. This sounds very familiar doesn't it?
As we generally look towards the centre of the Earth as the location of Hell, it appears this too is totally incorrect and the entities in question, particularly the mentors have no knowledge of such a place existing outside of mankinds knowledge base.
That itself fits well with my experiences overall although there are some aspects of mankind showing by belief systems that a generated environment does exist that fits. 
What I found interesting is the 12 dimensions we have learned to exist through scientific studies. This is also true under a different name for these etherians. I wish I knew more about this but it timed out.

[Subtle Traveler]

It is interesting by itself. The originator is worth searching too as some of the work is available online... at a price and you guessed it, what I wanted to read has this obstruction so I didn't bother.

fwiw, I tracked him down using the address provided by the web site. I used to live and work in the Los Angeles area. I confirmed his name to the home address. The author is now a 91 year old man (if alive), but I do not think he is alive. While his writing style (quite nicely) pulled together many traditional and non-traditional physical perspectives of the energy body, overall I was not as attracted to it. I was curious about him, so I did some quick work to find out.

[Lumaza]

 I put this post in this thread because it quite "literally" describes my experience with it.

First a bit of info. Last night I was talking to EV (Escape Velocity) here about this same thing, "tests" in NP. He was talking about how years ago, Szaxx made a post here on the Astral Pulse Forum about going through a series of "tests " as a child. In his post he described the test being along the lines of "spinning plates". EV soon agreed and shared his experience with it as well. This was when they were young children, at the age of about 5 years old.

EV and I didn't talk about it that much. It was just one of many topics that we kind of got into during our conversation. My talking to EV wasn't the last thing I did before I went to bed, to go to sleep either. I went worked until 5 am creating new Crystal Amplifiers for our upcoming Renaissance Faire in a month in Oklahoma. MJ unfortunately can not make her beautiful Dragons anymore. So, my Crystal Amplifiers will likely be the main thing sold there by us.

Back to my experience. I became aware in morning, via a LD, of going through a series of 4 tests in repetition. It seemed to be a cycle. I even awoke briefly for a few minutes and then went back and "re-scripted", did a do-over, the tests again in the order expected of me.

I then woke up and grabbed my Dream journal to put down what I had just experienced. The weird thing was, my mind was just a blank. I had no recall whatsoever of what had just occurred, other than the fact that I had been in a cycle of doing 4 tests repeatedly. I couldn't remember what the challenges were. All I could remember is that there was indeed a series of tests.

It was really strange to instantly lose my recall of the whole thing. I never have any problem with that. The only recall I had was that there was a series of 4 tests that I was doing over and over again. But, I did feel like this wasn't the first time that I did those tests. I seem to remember different times throughout the year when I awaken and just "know" somehow that I just experienced some kind of testing sequence.

I would love to hear your own experiences with this. I basically have not much recall at all of what happened in my youth, other than the fact that I am glad it is over with. I have heard and read about people in the past that did experience certain NP tests as a young child. They haven't really said anything about whether or not the tests continued.

Thank You!