Ü-The DunGivaChit Method!-Ü

[Jeff_Mash]

Hey Zarklon.  Sounds good.  Thanks for posting it, and I'll give your technique a spin tonight.

[Zarklon]

Lemmi know how it went Jeff , I tried it again after I typed it up and I reached the state I talked about. This time I started to notice my mind stop thinking about stuff and I was at the point where when I started to visualize something , it would get very vivid looking and I couldnt tell if I was just visualizing it really well or if it was starting to pull me into it.. I was imagining myself inside a game that I play online and things started to just pop up easily and when I backed out of it and stopped my mind from thinking, I had a feeling if vertigo like my body was starting to go into reverse and I slammed on the breaks. After that I was too pooped to comment on the imagery and had to go to sleep so I just let sleep take me without trying to AP anymore.  Its definately not a hard technique to get down.. just a week or so of exploring the hypnagogic state and realizing when its at its peak about to take you away in a dream is all you should need to know where the sleep/awake threshold lies

[quetzalcoatl]

That's a cool technique.  I didn't project but I did go quite deeply into the hypnogogic state.  I felt the vibes a couple of times but I didn't quite let go enough.  I did have some really interesting dreams though.  I'll keep trying.

[Parmenion]

Hi Zarklon,

What I like about this is the fact that it is virtually effortless. I usually just listen to my breathing or listen outwards for a non-physical sound (hard to explain that one). When the imagery appears I generally push it gently away. Last night though, I tried your trick with the imagery and ended up in a medium trance before I knew what was going on! I proceeded for a while but did not quite make it to a projection. I'll try it out again tonight.

Nice idea []

Best Regards,

Dave

[NecroGod]

Zarklon,

Interestingly enough, I've done pretty much what you're saying. I just wanted to add that I believe this has really helped me find new ways to improve my visualization skills. It seems that once I started interrupting these scenarios on a regular basis that I could better involve myself in conscious scenarios with much more realism. I wonder, have you noticed this happening also?

BTW, I woke my girlfriend up once because I also laughed at what was going on once. Glad you posted something on here about it. Always amusing to relate these things to somone [|)]

[holy reality]

i regularly do this but my problem is i will have tons of background noise in my head, as in random thoughts that i'm not in control of... well that's all fine and well, and the longer they last, the deeper i go, but they all of a sudden for no reason stop, and i have no clue why...

i'm not thinking at all, i'm just focusing in on them, and i can keep focus without immediately stopping them (usually) and yet they just randomly stop

i find that you abruptly pull out of a semi hypnagogic state into a normal conscious state it produces a very heavy feeling much like falling....

and if you can manage to pull in and out and in out FREQUENTlY (this is so extremely hard to do becuase if you WANT to do it you're thinking too much but if you don't want to it you could just fall asleep) you'll start hitting vibrations, for like, a fraction of a second, when your mind refocuses itself..

but that's as far as I can get.. no paralysis... just "fake" paralysis where I FEEL heavy but I'm actually not.... and it really bothers me..... becuase it takes me like an hour to really get into this point..

and I CANNOT hold onto the images... like... I remember I was thinking about Tool just now recently and I thought "saw the gap again today" and then I saw some guy walking continually forward, closer to me, accompanied by intense falling asleep feelings... and i was just passively hearing whatever it was that was going on in my head associated with the image... and then... bam.. it's gone.. i'm conscious again, but not very, and tired and drained... and aware of my body again.

it's almost like very small remote viewing sessions or something? but it's just that I can't stay hypnagogic long enough so that when for some reason or another when the state randomly and ABRUPTLY stops itself and I get the falling sensation, that I go into a trance.

I don't ... I'd have to stay at it for > 2 hours and well I just did it for one hour and it left me really drained and tired and the last 15 minutes of it or so I was just totally out of it for a long time but by the time I drifted back into consciousness all I felt was tired, not paralyzed or in vibrations.

Yet... somewhere after 30 minutes or so of doing this I will feel vibrations for maybe a tenth of a second while transitioning from hypnagogic to conscious and experiencing the falling feeling.

So I don't know what to do to keep myself there longer... I guess maybe I should start doing a mantra once I get REALLY tired so that I can keep transitioning in and out and in and out instead of just getting completely lost?

[Zarklon]

my motherboard fried and video card's fan went out so I havent been able to reply to mypost here, sorry. I'm at school sneakin on , I'll reply when I'm at homesometime next week to help you guys , again sorry but theres nothing  Ican do at the moment. *runs off*

[Zarklon]

"I could better involve myself in conscious scenarios with much more realism. I wonder, have you noticed this happening also?"


NecroGod , I do know exactly what you are talking about. There are times when I reach a state like that where i can picture scenes and things in my mind with a lot less effort and they are usually very realistic.  That tells me that I am close to entering a dream state and I often get sucked into these scenes and fall asleep.  The rare times I project from doing this is when I happen to wake out of a deep scene where I almost fell asleep and realize that I can no longer feel my body or I'm stuck with vibrations and a very concious mind to OBE with.  


Holy Reality----

" find that you abruptly pull out of a semi hypnagogic state into a normal conscious state it produces a very heavy feeling much like falling.... "

I have noticed a feeling of vertigo combined with... well.. if you were a passenger in a car and the driver pulled off slowly from a stop and applied his breaks suddenly (almost whiplash feeling) .. that is the other feeling I get when pulling out of a hypnagogic state.. that and vertigo/dizzyness/lightness.  

Sounds quite different from the heaviness you get eh?  Usually when I do this , I am in a paralysed state either with or without vibrations but usually I can turn it into an OBE.  My past few OBEs like this have lasted only a minute or so and I slipped into a dream state very early on into the projection...not much luck lately for me it seems .

Heres a possible solution for your problem when losing the vibrational state so fast... Have you noticed yourself focusing on your breathing as soon as you reach that state of paralysis? Maybe you come out of the hypnagogic state and you realize the paralysis has taken over but maybe you feel for your body and start to conciously regulate you breathing again either willingly or not?

I was stuck in paralysis once in my school gym and I was really really having a hard time moving yet I could clearly read the letters on my sweater from my indian style sitting position.. It started to scare me (strangely enough since I have had MANY obes and know its nothing to be scared of).  That was the first time in a loooong time that I had trouble moving my body and waking from the paralysis state but what I had to do after about 30 secs of paralysis trouble was simply focus on my breathing (which I had already been feeling the whole time anyway while reading my sweater =/ ). As soon as I tried to breathe conciously I got all my feeling back in my body and sat there for a moment to think about what had happened.  I also had 3 or so full blown OBE's that day in the gym prior to or following that troubling paralysis experience..

Anything that scares be about OBE turns into an exciting rush of adrenaline which makes me enjoy it more.. I wish some people who are scared of OBEing could take on my same point of view.  

I still dont have a workin computer at my house so I had to type this one up at school again and I should be monitoring this thread on and off for the next few days from my bro's computer. Has anyone tried my technique again? If so , how did it go?

[holy reality]

no i'm not focusing on my breathing

what happens is i'll just hit these random spikes where either i lose control of my mind and voices/pictures start surfacing then I jolt back into normal thinking... or sometimes (but rarely) it'll seem like my mind was completely empty

but when i jolt out of it, I can never know when it's going to happen and it takes me by surprise.. it's like being woken up by an extremely loud noise in your room while you were sleeping... it gives me this huge jolt of adrenaline coupled with falling/heavy feelings and vibrations (sometimes) for a fraction of a second.

if i'm "looking" at the inside of my eyelids there is also usually a very bright flash of light.

this all lasts maybe 1/10 of a second so I don't have any time to realy do anything to ruin the moment, it's just that I'm not out of it enough or something.

but each time it happens i lose more and more control of my mind until i either fall asleep or get frustrated and quit.

what bothers me is I KNOW you can enter a trance without getting at all tired or unfocused, becuase I do it a lot during the night when I wake up from a dream.... but I don't really understand how I'm doing that?

I mean I think it's because I had just been deeply involved with senses from another world, so all I have to do is try to imagine I'm still dreaming and in that place and my body disappears... or something?

But I'm not sure if it has anything to do with brainwaves since if you wake up and you're not immediately paralyzed you should be in beta waves?

I don't know.

All I know is I need to be able to during the day enter a trance without losing focus of my mind and falling asleep... I don't like having to just HOPE that i'll go into a brief dream then wake up into paralysis... it's so innefficient and tiring.

also what bothers me the most is this morning i was falling back asleep and i kept dreaming about sleeping, and about sleep paralysis, yet i never thought "hey, this isn't real, let's go do something"

[Zarklon]

Holy reality , I understand what state you are reaching. I also get to the state where you suddenly realise your mind is empty and my breathing even becomes rapid and very noticable. I dont know what to do at this point because I become to awakened out of trance.  

This is probably the reason I have trouble projecting at home.. I can get to this point mostly from a sitting position.  Focusing on outside noises like my classmates chatting in school seems to let me reach the "empty mind" state and that is the point where I notice that sometimes I can see through my eyelids.  When I see through my eyelids though , nothing is how it should be most of the time.  Its like a total recreation of whats going on around me based on what I've been hearing up until that point.  

It is that moment that I am already in paralysis but dont know it until I try to move with my mind so to speak.. its hard to explain but when I see through my eyelids I am in like .. a first person dream view it seems and I can imagine moving out of my desk along with very little physical movement (moving the astral body).. after I'm moving around for a bit and focusing on becoming more aware of my astral surroundings and letting my physical body and physical surrounding awareness dwindle is when the visualization becomes more "astrally-physical" instead of just a visualization.

However, this is the point of no return for me.. either I let my astral scene of the classroom turn into a total dream ( like seeing a bunch of guys wearing thongs in the school hallway filled with file cabinets--yes its happened..) OR I am aware enough to realize I am OBE now and mentally focus on something around me like..another desk or a wall  while repeating something like "I am out of body , I need to remain focused" .. It helps me to not get sucked back into my physical body.

Maybe you are reaching a point where you can see behind your eyelids but it could be dark when you do? Perhaps a small candle would help , or just simply be ready for the sudden vision behind the eyelids to become apparent to you and pick up from there. That is the point where you can turn that intense visualization into a full blown OBE.  

I have been able to see both physically and through my eyelids at the same time.. when I was in paralysis one day in class , I could see the desk in front of me and since my eyelids were almost closed,  I could also see an astral scene in front of me.. it was like 20% physical desk in front of me  and 80% astral scene of other desk's.  I may not be making much sense cause its hard to explain but the state you are reaching is one that many people strive to get to.  You are just at a block it sounds like.. I've been there before and I still go through that block.  Changing up techniques or simply trying over and over will help you realize what you should be doing differently in your meditation/astral attempts.  Good luck- let me know how it goes.

PS: I'm no expert , I just believe that I've studied many of the OBE/Trance states enough to offer some advice for some people to get through their blocks and for some it helped a lot.  I still dont have a computer at home cause its being fixed--I'm not trying to bump this thread , I'm simply replying to it when I can every few days.

[weagle]

i think the reason why the dungivachit method works because it's similar to the duality method ie a thought enters and you negate it by substitute a thought that is the opposite to neutralize it.  the dunagivachit does the same thing but having no attachment to it and thus neutralizing it.

[Zarklon]

I typed this up for another post and thought I'de put it in it's own thread so it can attract some more peeps. I typed this up kinda quick and on the spot so if you cant understand it or I'm unclear just let me know and I'de be more than happy to type up a better version of it.



The DunGivaChit Method - (Dont give a Sh*t)

Basically you just lay down and get relaxed , maybe focus on your breathing or whatever you do to reach the hypnagogic imagery state (where stuff starts to make you dream and take your mind away ). Once you start noticing that your mind has wondered a bit and you might be thinking of a huge marshmellow chasing you in a private jet..whatever, once you notice it thinking of random off the wall stuff, start simply commenting on it in your mind. (Ex:  Hmm .. a marshmellow chasing me .. riiight..)-- Would be one of the things I would say to that.  It will either disappear and leave you thinking of nothing at all or you will start to immediately think or something else and you just comment on that..  Find time somewhere in your mental commentary to do body checks to see if you can feel anything anymore.

The way I got it to work was ... after commenting on random things for a while , my mind sort of stopped as if to say (Fine!!! Your not gonna fall asleep? I'm not giving anymore imagery!!) -- and low and behold, after I realized "Hey im not thinking of anything"-I did a body check and I couldnt feel my limbs anymore and entered paralysis shortly after for a full blown OBE almost effortless and it was actually enjoyable to comment on the stupid stuff I think about before falling asleep. But be careful , that is the spot where you can fall asleep "Hey i'm not thinking of anything" is probably the last thing you are gonna think before you just fall asleep so even comment on that if you have to =P .. imagery is sneaky like that.It really gives you a chance to explore the hypnagogic imagery part of the OBE procedure as well , maybe you can tell just how long it takes before you fall asleep or just how long it takes before you get imagery and how relaxed you are when you reach that state , etc... I know it helped me to figure all that out for myself and it definately helps to know all that to project.

PS: The method got it's name because its how you should treat the imagery state for this method.. just act like you dont care and are a bored commentator for your mind before it falls asleep.. If you are a funny person , you can kinda crack a joke at it and mock the imagery you caught yourself thinking about.. I have done this before and felt someone laughing .. it was ME ..really my physical body laughing in its sleep !! I ended the experience cause I was startled but was ready for it the second and third time it happened in a similar method. Have fun and good luck!

You can contact me if you wish , I usually play Ultima Online and am too wrapped up to talk but I will let you know whats up and when I can get back to you if I'm busy.
My contact info:
AIM=ScrotomicBomb
MSN=Nothingreallytrue@hotmail.com
ICQ=13147691
E-mail=zarklon@earthlink.net