OBE's and Lucid Dreams confusing...

[markulous]

Well I used to post semi-regularly, but just kind of drifted away.  I just wondered if anyone has experienced what I have, or maybe some suggestions if I should change anything, related to OBE's.

I learned to project pretty quick(within a month) through lucid dreaming.  I could make myself lucid dream every night so projecting out of them were pretty easy, I thought.  After about a year or 2 of projecting I looked back at my notes(I wrote down most of my experiences) and really came to the conclusion that astral projecting and being able to lucid dream just confused me more than when I never did them.

I was always trying to go different places.  Or trying to communicate with my guides or my higher self.  And trying to find answers about myself and the world I live in.  While I have met people/things in projection it really never seemed beneficial.  Half of the time it was something that tried to scare me(which after a point really didn't scare me in the least bit) or someone/something that just didn't make any sense to me(one time a little girl came down from a cloud and this music started playing.  I just kind of looked at her and said, "Umm what the heck?").

In lucid dreaming I managed to speak with some "guides"(probably just part of my subconcious though) and even then I really never learned anything really.  They never made any sense.

I even tried just projecting and just interacting and not really expecting anything.  And things weren't really any different.

So I just kind of stopped doing all of that.  I feel that I could switch it all back on within a week of meditation and just willing myself.  But I don't know, it just doesn't seem worth it.  Has anyone else felt this way?  Or a suggestion to change it if I decided to get back into it?  Thanks.

[Mydral]

If guides deon't make sense to you, why don't you jsut go around exploring and having fun? Heck that beats normal sleep any day 

[FrostyRose]

I think I can relate. I have projected for a while now, and most of my experiences are just.....silly. I think this is mostly due to lack of awareness when out of body. I would have problems seeing, or I'd just fly around without being able to remember what I wanted to do, or I'd fall into a dream. When I finally met a being I wanted to talk to, I would get excited and instantly return to body.

Still, I find my experiences priceless. I love waking up from an out of body experience, even if it's just lasted for a minute. I love the feeling of being in touch with the unseen dimensions, being able to fly, move through walls, being in a world of unlimited possibilities.

Like with all things though, we have to practice to get better at it. With practice we can project more often, and stay out longer. What helps me as well, is to be aware during the day. I also like to concentrate on one thing at the time, and try not to daydream as much. If we daydream here, we will also daydream in the astral, and cause projections from the subconscious.

I've met beings that have told me things, that didn't make any sense at the time, and I think that is because they talk in symbols, especially if it's a teaching. Maybe what they said will make sense later on? It might have been subconscious though, I don't know, you're the best judge of that

[iNNERvOYAGER]

I can relate to what you're saying on a limited level. Bear with me, the point I'm trying to make is in the last paragraph.

During RTZish in my living room I was looking at all the cool framed artwork on the wall and window sill in the "living room as it should/can be". Looking out the window into the back yard, I noticed that the small trees were very thick with leaves, more than "usual".

I wanted to do everything at once, and decided to go outside to see the sky and stars, so immediately passed through the glass sliding door, (squish) looking at it from the side while going through which was totally cool. (I just knew I could do it with no hesitation.)

Outside, I gazed up at the bright dots of star light, trying to recognize constellations, then decided to attempt flying up to see an aerial view of the local area. I went flying, and explored a more futuristic built up version of our town/city.

At this point I don't think anything constructive was happening, although all very interesting, and beginning to shift to a lucid dream.

After contemplating, I'm feeling that hauling butt around RTZ doesn't accomplish anything. (yes, I thought of locating OBL to collect the 25mil bounty, but that idea is obviously absurd)

I'm hoping that next time, I stay in the house, take note of all the cool artwork and objects to improve my physical residence later, and I'm thinking of visualizing/designing my small study room into more of shrine, temple style.
The objective is to stay in the RTZ house, go to the study, and then continue meditation while in the RTZ projection.

Any advice appreciated. Thanks.

[Leo Volont]

In lucid dreaming I managed to speak with some "guides"(probably just part of my subconcious though) and even then I really never learned anything really.  They never made any sense.

See, this is what I am talking about, that people equate Dreaming with Materialism -- that Dreams are inevitably from the Subconscious and therefore contain absolutely no objective or even subjective relevance.

Oh, and regarding how easy it is to understand Oracles, Prophecies or any Divine Revelation.  One is reminded of the Riddle of the Sphinx, or the Curse of Cassandra, or so many legends of the Oracle of Delphi where Princes and Generals came to ruin by 'interpretting' these ambiguous and paradoxical messages in exactly the wrong way.

Anything Truly Spiritual has an element of Paradox, not in the sense of contradiction, but in the sense of Inclusiveness, of containing both equal amounts of Yin and Yang.

One-sidedness is easy to understand.  But Balance and Equilibruium can be complicated.

I have had Messages in my dreams that I have had to think about for months at a time, even years.  And I am Smart.

So it means little when you wake up from a Dream and the first words out of your mouth are that your Dream Guides are stupid because YOU don't understand THEM.

I once had a dream that I was in Heaven, and suddenly there was an uproar of excitement in the crowd, of great enthusiasm because the "Oracle and Greatest Poetress" was about to come by.  And then there she was, she was singing and rhyming in what at first sounded like pure nonsense, but then her words left an afterglow of residual meaning that amazed and amused and astounded me. 

In Heaven they understand these Guides, the ones that you call stupid figments of your 'subconscous mind'.

The impotence and futility of Materialism hard at work...   

[markulous]

Leo are you talking directly to me?  Because first I never said that anything that happened wasn't relevant.  I just didn't understand it.  And second I never said these guides were stupid or "stupid figments of my subconscious mind".  It just confused the heck out of me.  Which is why I stopped in the first place.  I am not so arrogant to presume that anything I don't understand is stupid, so please don't assume that of me.  If you were just talking in general than I apologise.

So regarding the other posts...I assume you all still project then?  You still find it exciting?

I don't know I just didn't find it exciting anymore.  It's like no matter what I did I wouldn't last more than 20 seconds in RTZ and if anything did happen to me it wouldn't make sense.  I know it should seem like it should still be exciting but it's not for some reason.  Like it's too much work with too little progress.

[Leo Volont]

Leo are you talking directly to me?  Because first I never said that anything that happened wasn't relevant.  I just didn't understand it.  And second I never said these guides were stupid or "stupid figments of my subconscious mind".  It just confused the heck out of me.  Which is why I stopped in the first place.  I am not so arrogant to presume that anything I don't understand is stupid, so please don't assume that of me.  If you were just talking in general than I apologise.

So regarding the other posts...I assume you all still project then?  You still find it exciting?

I don't know I just didn't find it exciting anymore.  It's like no matter what I did I wouldn't last more than 20 seconds in RTZ and if anything did happen to me it wouldn't make sense.  I know it should seem like it should still be exciting but it's not for some reason.  Like it's too much work with too little progress.

Then it is wonderful that you are not like the stupid and foolish person I had been describing. 

But it still remains that YOU brought up the Materialistic Conception of the Subconscious Mind that automaticalty destroyes the spritual integrity of your Dream, and YOU are the one who complains of not being able to understand your Guides.

Hmmmm.  Then if you AREN'T the person I was describing, then who is?

[markulous]

I said it's PROBABLY my subconcsious.  To be honest I don't know.  I am ignorant in many ways.  And in this subject I am extremely ignorant.  I have no one to talk to about this and I have never had any sort of teacher.  And I'm not really complaining I am stating a fact: I don't understand my guides.  Is it because I am inept?  I don't know.  Maybe it is.  In your post(maybe I am misunderstanding it) you seem kind of ticked off at me.  I don't even know you man.  I'm sorry if I offended you in anyway.  I am just trying to talk a little bit about a subject I want some insight on.

[jub jub]

I have had Messages in my dreams that I have had to think about for months at a time, even years.  And I am Smart.