I will tell you things that sound like I am just shizophonic and this is the product of my ill brain. Noone who knows that I am sick with shiz believes me and I only hope that you here within this forum will know what I am talking about.
I am ill since five years old. Now I am 27. I take medical treatment for six years and already feel like my mind is getting more normal but there are things that don't let me live at all. Half a year ago I did exorcism, they took away that creature but something is still with me though I feel the main thing is going away.
For 10 years I did not fight anything, I was wery down. I know that this is my fault. And now I feel it wants my death. I feel helpless, I just feel helpless and miserable.
I can name two of them. One is that one certain person sent on me. He was jealous on my talent and he had abilities to black magic though he was young then but now I am sure he practises it. This creature makes me feel like a excrement, miserable and weak. Whatever I do he whispers: you are ridiculous, you will never make it, don't make me laugh with your miserable tryings. It tells me that I lost anything and that fighting wont help anything and the strongest thing I can make is kill myself. It is in my mind each second I am awake. I know that I see him but I just cant fight, I don't know why, maybe I am really a excrement, I don't know why I cant fight it, please help, I am so scared, I don't want to die. I feel like I am immured. I cant do anything, I do nothing, and I cant explain what I have been doing during the day, I don't remember.
The other one is in my father. He( the creature in my father) is very evil, I think he is a devil. It is in my eyes. He takes my sexuality and corrupts it. He feels with my feelings. He forses me to feel sex to every person that causes me in reality unsexual attitude, people that I don't feel anything like that , that is my relatives, same sex people, old men and women, little children, everyone! And he makes it so that it is in my eyes, voice, so that they all feel that I feel sexual feelings to them, I look like it. The more I try to repress it the worse it gets. Everyone thinks I am a whore. And I am absolutely not, I am a good person. I even never watch any porn, I hate it. My father is the person who believes that I really feel this. This devil makes him be so suspicious that he thinks that I masturbate 50 times a day with his things. He talks to me with second meanings insulting me. And it always is like about me really, it touches me deeply.
This comes inside every person that this sex thing appears and they start to talk to me with second meanings insulting me in most severe ways, hurting me, I think my soul bleeds... and when I ask them they don't understand what I am talking about. My father hates me like the biggest enemy and makes it clear he wants my death. But in reality he is very kind with me and when I ask him he gets very angry and says its not true, its bovine excrement. It is with my mother also.... He does it every time he sees me. Everyone does it. I cant stand the pain.
When I go to bed I doubt if I wake up and in the morning I doubt if I live up till the evening. And lately I think it is poltergeist. I hear sounds like metal scrubbing, they are loud and go from inside of the room near the roof. Few times the TV turned on itself and once the light turned off and there was no problem with the switch...
I'm afraid you will have to make your self an astral warrior and fight back
you must find the courage to win the mind games
very few people can actually help you with little more than council
I use teleporting poisonous arrows and when dark beings talk to me i just shoot them in the head
human beings are very powerfull and when you give your power to dark beings its a great high for them, you need to take back control, its a fight you can win if you stand fast, don't be afraid
be holy, negative attachments can be eather self created or can wander in from outside
but you are stronger, know you are, and fight for controll of the situation, manifest a sword with your spirit and cut there head off, bless your sword so it can only harm evil and so that no good person will be harmed by your actions, and then you are free to fight back
I understand most of what you are going through and I noticed if i did nothing it got worse
but if i fought back it became tolerable, in time
I hope you get to grips with your problem and good luck,
:NoY:
You can call on the guardians of your local tradition to help.
If you're catholic or come from a catholic background you could call on Archangel Michael for example.
There are other equivalent deities around the world in every tradition. Find one you like and ask them to protect you.
They may be your lost Aspects of Self. Send them PUL, accept them as part of you and absorb them into you, to make you whole.
http://www.astralpulse.com/forums/welcome_to_astral_consciousness/pul_pure_unconditional_love_retrievals-t33529.0.html
I think you should do the LBRP daily and the Middle Pillar ritual.
Exuse me, Lexy, I don't know what LBRP and Middle Pillar ritual is. The book of Robert Bruse has opened my eyes, but still I don't know a big deal.
Have you seen any of the entities? If so, what do they look like? Are they pale skinned?
My personal belief system is such that nothing can harm you if you don't believe in it. This is especially true in matters of the astral/spiritual/whatever-you-want-to-call-it realm.
By believing that you are possessed you are essentially giving a "possession" that wouldn't otherwise exist, more power.
Declarations are also pretty powerful where this is concerned. Try declaring out loud that there is nothing with you, nothing holds power over you, etc. You will eventually come to believe it, and as stated above, beliefs can go along way.
I don't have any experience with possession so what I say here may not work for you. It's just another idea for you to give some thought to.
Quote from: Pharoah on May 11, 2011, 08:46:00
My personal belief system is such that nothing can harm you if you don't believe in it. This is especially true in matters of the astral/spiritual/whatever-you-want-to-call-it realm.
By believing that you are possessed you are essentially giving a "possession" that wouldn't otherwise exist, more power.
Declarations are also pretty powerful where this is concerned. Try declaring out loud that there is nothing with you, nothing holds power over you, etc. You will eventually come to believe it, and as stated above, beliefs can go along way.
I don't have any experience with possession so what I say here may not work for you. It's just another idea for you to give some thought to.
I personally, fully support this response. :)
Something happened to me when I was about seven. Objects moved in the house (poltergeist activity) which happened around a time of turmoil and I've got some theories for this other than evil spirits, perhaps more mundane explanations. I blacked out at one point and it was horrible, like I was drowning or being 'squeezed out of existence' as best as I can describe it. Many who came to know about this reckon I was possessed. My mum performed the exorcism. But today I won't just accept the demon explanation. I think it was something else as elusive as OOBEs. My parents got divorced, the environment was better and the 'poltergeist' activity stopped. During my 'possession' I apparently cursed at my parents. I don't remember any of it.
I do know this tho...in Mode 2 OOBES (astral projection), if you don't believe demons to be real and you don't fear them, they will vanish and you won't experienced them again. It's just the product of dissonant states of mind in my view.
Now...about pale-skinned characters in non-physical worlds...I kept experiencing these for the first five years of my life. I'd have false awakenings so real as to make me think that 'mummy had made some changes to the house' while I've been asleep. Then they would come through the walls, giggling with malice. They would chase me and violate me. I was a scared little boy. I'd tell my mum about the 'white men'. She didn't know what to make of it but she did what she believed was right...she burned incense around the house and not once did she think the problem was in me, the fear...god bless her.
Now, can you be more explicit about the thing inside your father and the sex? I don't want to insinuate anything but I suspect real malice and that may be the source of the problem which might as well have psychological roots.
Get to the bottom of it all, see the truth, fearless... and there is the key to your freedom.
Quote from: Xanth on May 11, 2011, 09:31:25
I personally, fully support this response. :)
I've been wondering about this lately. I don't dispute that you can make some "not be there" with your mind by not providing it with attention. I mean that is the redheaded step child of physics that no one wants to just admit too, but when we don't provide attention to something, for all intents and purposes it doesn't exist as an "objective" thing. However, just because I personally don't provide attention, doesn't mean the thing doesn't exist.
So what I've been wondering is, Xanth, are you just delluding yourself into not seeing what is there? Are you putting such a creature off on someone else when it might have been your "path" to encounter it? Are you hiding from your "destiny" as it were? Not confronting the dark parts of yourself that you're afraid to own up too? I'm just using you as an example ryan, but you get my point? Perhaps you were supposed to interact with such an entity for a very important reason in your life. And I wonder if we are really tricking ourselves out of an important personal experience by "not believing in these things".
Quote from: Darina on May 10, 2011, 07:03:46
I will tell you things that sound like I am just shizophonic and this is the product of my ill brain. Noone who knows that I am sick with shiz believes me and I only hope that you here within this forum will know what I am talking about.
I am ill since five years old. Now I am 27. I take medical treatment for six years and already feel like my mind is getting more normal but there are things that don't let me live at all. Half a year ago I did exorcism, they took away that creature but something is still with me though I feel the main thing is going away.
For 10 years I did not fight anything, I was wery down. I know that this is my fault. And now I feel it wants my death. I feel helpless, I just feel helpless and miserable.
I can name two of them. One is that one certain person sent on me. He was jealous on my talent and he had abilities to black magic though he was young then but now I am sure he practises it. This creature makes me feel like a excrement, miserable and weak. Whatever I do he whispers: you are ridiculous, you will never make it, don't make me laugh with your miserable tryings. It tells me that I lost anything and that fighting wont help anything and the strongest thing I can make is kill myself. It is in my mind each second I am awake. I know that I see him but I just cant fight, I don't know why, maybe I am really a excrement, I don't know why I cant fight it, please help, I am so scared, I don't want to die. I feel like I am immured. I cant do anything, I do nothing, and I cant explain what I have been doing during the day, I don't remember.
The other one is in my father. He( the creature in my father) is very evil, I think he is a devil. It is in my eyes. He takes my sexuality and corrupts it. He feels with my feelings. He forses me to feel sex to every person that causes me in reality unsexual attitude, people that I don't feel anything like that , that is my relatives, same sex people, old men and women, little children, everyone! And he makes it so that it is in my eyes, voice, so that they all feel that I feel sexual feelings to them, I look like it. The more I try to repress it the worse it gets. Everyone thinks I am a whore. And I am absolutely not, I am a good person. I even never watch any porn, I hate it. My father is the person who believes that I really feel this. This devil makes him be so suspicious that he thinks that I masturbate 50 times a day with his things. He talks to me with second meanings insulting me. And it always is like about me really, it touches me deeply.
This comes inside every person that this sex thing appears and they start to talk to me with second meanings insulting me in most severe ways, hurting me, I think my soul bleeds... and when I ask them they don't understand what I am talking about. My father hates me like the biggest enemy and makes it clear he wants my death. But in reality he is very kind with me and when I ask him he gets very angry and says its not true, its bovine excrement. It is with my mother also.... He does it every time he sees me. Everyone does it. I cant stand the pain.
When I go to bed I doubt if I wake up and in the morning I doubt if I live up till the evening. And lately I think it is poltergeist. I hear sounds like metal scrubbing, they are loud and go from inside of the room near the roof. Few times the TV turned on itself and once the light turned off and there was no problem with the switch...
I am confused by this post. Do you believe someone else is possessed, or do you believe you are possessed? What I read doesn't seem like possession to me.
Quote from: personalreality on May 11, 2011, 11:05:29
I've been wondering about this lately. I don't dispute that you can make some "not be there" with your mind by not providing it with attention. I mean that is the redheaded step child of physics that no one wants to just admit too, but when we don't provide attention to something, for all intents and purposes it doesn't exist as an "objective" thing. However, just because I personally don't provide attention, doesn't mean the thing doesn't exist.
So what I've been wondering is, Xanth, are you just delluding yourself into not seeing what is there? Are you putting such a creature off on someone else when it might have been your "path" to encounter it? Are you hiding from your "destiny" as it were? Not confronting the dark parts of yourself that you're afraid to own up too? I'm just using you as an example ryan, but you get my point? Perhaps you were supposed to interact with such an entity for a very important reason in your life. And I wonder if we are really tricking ourselves out of an important personal experience by "not believing in these things".
All I can say is... MAYBE! :)
Honestly, I can only go by my own experiences... and I've never encountered anything of the sort. I'm not willing to believe I'm some kind of special individual who is immune to all this "negative" stuff. It's either real, and my "belief" that it can't effect me is why I've never experienced any of it... OR, it's not fundamentally real, and people are literally causing self-harm.
Seriously though, we'll *NEVER* know the truth and this discussion will go on forever. :)
Ok, I've already mentioned the malicious white skinned beings in my childhood. Then they went away. Many years later I discovered OOBEs. Last year I had an experience with harlequins or jesters...they were pale-skinned and very cartoon-like...their features exaggerated. One of them greeted me and hugged me. No words. Just really expressive with there gestures. The one in the background seemed to smirk at me...he seemed like he could turn nasty...his eyes piercing into me. He reminded me of the entities in my childhood. Looking back now I think they might represent states of mind. They could be archetypal beings that make up our personality. A bit like the creatures in Alice in Wonderland. 'Bits' of us. I don't think they're demons and I wouldn't label them as "negative" either. They merely reflect where our minds are focusing. This is my theory anyway. They are neither good nor bad until we label them that. And if we believe them to be nasty then that is exactly what they'll be...
(http://i1003.photobucket.com/albums/af154/Arlindobatista/jokers01.jpg)
Quote from: Xanth on May 11, 2011, 11:41:33
All I can say is... MAYBE! :)
Honestly, I can only go by my own experiences... and I've never encountered anything of the sort. I'm not willing to believe I'm some kind of special individual who is immune to all this "negative" stuff. It's either real, and my "belief" that it can't effect me is why I've never experienced any of it... OR, it's not fundamentally real, and people are literally causing self-harm.
Seriously though, we'll *NEVER* know the truth and this discussion will go on forever. :)
The seed of doubt is just like any other seed. Don't water it => it won't grow.
QuoteI am confused by this post. Do you believe someone else is possessed, or do you believe you are possessed? What I read doesn't seem like possession to me.
It is in me and it jumps into other people(while they don't know about it) with sexual thing like a bridge for the goal of mocking on Me. I believe in astral anything can be.
I just had an intelligent discussion with Somerandom about this. After he asked me if it's possible that I made it all happen...I replied:
"I was thinking that too. I could have moved things unbenownst to me. Around that time life was bad anyway. My father was a violent gambler who almost killed my mum. I once screamed at him for a long time as a kid and wanted him to leave. It's funny that when the weirdness started happening, things were almost forced to calm down. Both my parents were confused as to what was happening. For me, monsters existed and they were invisible.
I do remember reading about a theory in a scientific mag as a teen. It said there is a chance that mind over matter occurs when the situation in a household is tense. The most vulnerable minds, like children, are the most affected. Perhaps our minds, as a collective force, made things happen the way they did and when I was "possessed" it could have been merely my unconscious mind taking over to protect me from the objective reality. Better still, the abnormal aggression that ensued towards both my parents (in the 'possessed' state) could have been a product of another personality that my mind made up and manifested in order to cope. And perhaps it went away not because it was exorcised but rather that the mind must've realised the new personality was erroneous and the original was quite capable of coping."
I hope this helps in some way, Darina.
Get help from someone knowledgable in the field of Magick. You can still be possessed or attacked whether you believe in such things or not, It does NOT solve the problem to just brush it off as it never happened, knowing fully of the hell i gone through for 6 months when it happened to me. (Yes IT DID happen randomly and Not a result of my belief, Expectations, or fears etc.)
If your certain this is an Entity, Seek help! Do not turn a blind eye towards this.
Darina,
You need to learn to control yourself. Have you ever tried meditation?
If it's possible, find yourself a nice quiet area and just sit and quiet yourself.
Your goal here is to be alone with your consciousness to become more acquainted with it... on a one-to-one basis.
Learn to shut out anything that doesn't belong. Take control of *YOUR* consciousness.
If you've never meditated before, then it might not be easy... but just take it slowly and keep practicing to gain that control. :)
Also, I'm a firm believer that we create our own reality. This means that how you view the world, is how the world views you. If you view the world and the people around you as being full of evil... then that's exactly how they're going to see you too, because you have now limited HOW you can react/act with them.
Hi, Summerlander!
Thank you for your help!
Looks like you have had a great deal with astral world.
i really have got the problem with my father. it lasts for 9 years, hard to believe but it is so. sometimes i want to believe that it is not him, i just dont want to believe my father whom i love hates me real. but i also suspise that the neg is working with my Father's own rage. I know it is possession because there's abnormality. he makes ugly faces to me, sexually ugly, nasty, perverted, he corrupts his voice, he looks sick. and what's weird that NOONE sees it exept ME. and when he looks at me i see his eyes all black without the white eye balls, all dark... and his look is like blind, like he sees through me and does not see me... and he is so suspicious. each time i go out of the house he thinks i go to have sex with someone... i sort of read his mind. there is a very strong psychic connection between us that is hard to brake, perverted, corrupted connection...
it started after he saw me dancing naked in my room. so there is a fact of psychological roots and that it is HIS own hate besides neg.
the thing is that i look sick. for some reason i look like i just had orgasm. i don't know why. and when i try to be nice i sound like i have something in mind to the person. my father understood this that i "promise him sex for that he gives me money and food"... and he all the time makes me feel with his second meaning intonations and sayings like i am a cheapest prostitute. i don't know if it makes any sense if i try to explain it.
my father is a very cruel person. he is kind but he is very hot in temper and he used to tell me things like" kill if you feell like it". he used to be a karate champion.
the worst thing is that he is only hapy when i am down. whenever i feel high he gets very angry and makes me feel that again. he gets angry when i feel better and does everything to make me the biggest harm!
he must be in psychiatric colony. but i think i should not under no circumstances quarrel with him, he might kill me physically, i think i should be very kind with him to exort this demon out of him.
Ok, Darina. Here's what we can do...
I gonna visit you in the OOBE state. For this all you have to do is PM me a picture and anything that you think might help so I know what you look like and your posts should give me a sense of your personality. I am planning to enter your mind realm and speak your unconscious self. I can see that these things have their own reality from your perspective and that perhaps your father has been corrupted by them. On the other hand I also want you to be open to the possibility that your father may be flawed to the point where he is capable of taking advantage of his own daughter and perhaps I may be able to prove you that these malicious beings are products/representations of dissonant states of mind if indeed that's the case.
I need your consent to be able to visit you in the OOBE-state, though. I never visit anyone without their consent. You don't have to tell me where you live in waking life because that's irrelevant. I'm more interested in your mind and I want to help you.
What do you say?
How come I feel stuck in an episode of Supernatural in here...
Summerlander,
before i give you my consent i need to understand what OOBE state is and if this what you are going to do with my mind has any danger to me and my father. Are you going to change something in my subconsiousness or you are going just to look at it and talk with it for information? What exactly is your goal of OOBE? Because I am a bit scared of your proposition, I don't know what it is. I hope you don't deal with any kind of BLACK magic? I'm sorry if I could offense...
I have very vivid pictures of my father, it is very visible on those pictures.
The OOBE-state is the state of having your awareness focusing elsewhere other than the physical body. There is no black magic involved and it won't be a danger to you whatsoever. I would only like to try this because I have visited other people in this state before and reaped good results. Describing my experiences to the visited usually gives them an insight as to where they are mentally, because, as strange as this seems, my experiences seemed to have made more sense to them than me.
I wouldn't be able to change your mind because your mind does what it wants. Just like a person in hypnosis will not do anything that goes against who they are. It would just be for the purposes of information and understanding what is going on. I'm not afraid of your demons, by the way. I'm willing to get to the bottom of it.
Quote from: Xanth on May 12, 2011, 09:27:17
How come I feel stuck in an episode of Supernatural in here...
nothing more to say really. just need to echo that.
we really can be reasonable about all this. no need to get wrapped up in unnecessary superstition.
I've gotta go but lemme know what you decide to do, Darina.
Will I feel something? How long will the procedure last?
Summerlander, can you get inside my father's mind? I know what is in my mind exactly, though I might be not knowing everything, but I need to know what is in my father's mind. I want to know how much is really him in all this. And am I right that there is a demon inside of him ( though I know it is so) to make some desigion to my future actions. Also I am afraid if it will be a danger for you and if the demon might get angry of your intrusion. This is what scares me: will the demon get angry.
Face the demon.
Send the demon PUL (http://www.astralpulse.com/forums/welcome_to_astral_consciousness/pul_pure_unconditional_love_retrievals-t33529.0.html).
Absorb the demon.
It may be a part of you.
Quote from: Pauli2 on May 12, 2011, 10:28:27
Face the demon.
Send the demon PUL (http://www.astralpulse.com/forums/welcome_to_astral_consciousness/pul_pure_unconditional_love_retrievals-t33529.0.html).
Absorb the demon.
It may be a part of you.
I typically despise the stuff that comes out of your mouth, but this is good. I fully support this.
Quote from: personalreality on May 12, 2011, 10:39:01
I typically despise the stuff that comes out of your mouth...
I fully support this comment, and will have to use it sometime.
lol
Quote from: Darina on May 12, 2011, 10:23:24
Will I feel something?
That depends in my view. Here's a postulation... most people seem unaware that they are being visited, especially if they are awake because the contact/communication is happening between the OOBE-visitor and the visited's UNCONSCIOUS self. If, however, they are daydreaming or meditating they might feel strange and I'm guessing it's because their brain waves acquire the alpha mode and thus enable the CONSCIOUS part of the self to become somewhat receptive.
This was deduced from the fact that that seemed to have happened once when I visited a friend of mine (who is now a member of Astral Viewers). At the time of my experience (of which he was unaware), he reported to his girlfriend that he felt funny, as though he was supposed to remember something or someone. My experience was mostly me talking to his unconscious self in a slightly altered replica of his house where apparently both things from his mind and things that were going on in the physical were observed...possibly an overlap of both Mode 1 and Mode 2 OOBEs.
If the visited, on the other hand is asleep and dreaming, this increases the chances that they might perceive or include the OOBE visitor in their dream. Yes, because dreams take place in the metaphysical realm (or astral plane if you prefer) too. I believe the more aware and perhaps lucid one is in a dream, the more likely that they'll be able to focus on and remember any 'conversation' they might have had with visitors.
But then again, I cannot say that this is so with 100% certainty. All I can say is that, so far, my experiences with OOBEs have led me to these conclusions at present. They seem to provide evidence of telepathy and some sort of connectivity in consciousness. Even personally and collectively retro-cognitive (as I seemed to have seen the memories of a person I visited - or perhaps memories that were on the mind of the person concerned at the time). Then you get precognition which I have experienced in the dream state, but people report pre-cognitive OOBEs too (I'm yet to experience these though).
Quote from: Darina on May 12, 2011, 10:23:24
How long will the procedure last?
Again, this very much depends. I can never predict how long an OOBE, or an "OOBE visit" for that matter will last. What seems to have been my longest OOBE visit was to CaitHT on Astral Viewers. It seemed to have lasted for a quarter of an hour but time in the OOBE-state doesn't seem to correlate with time in physical reality so I don't know. Also, I am pretty bad at telling how much time has passed even in waking life. LOL! :-D
Quote from: Darina on May 12, 2011, 10:23:24
Summerlander, can you get inside my father's mind? I know what is in my mind exactly, though I might be not knowing everything, but I need to know what is in my father's mind. I want to know how much is really him in all this.
I'd rather enter yours but if you think visiting your father will help, I'll give it a shot. You may find that I might report all manner of strange things that will baffle both of us but may make sense to your father and, if he's guilty, he may not admit to what's going on if you know what I mean. On the other hand, your unconscious self may know more than you think you know and if I was to visit you, I'd probably be able to access your intuitional side too which I believe would be very insightful...
Quote from: Darina on May 12, 2011, 10:23:24
And am I right that there is a demon inside of him ( though I know it is so) to make some desigion to my future actions. Also I am afraid if it will be a danger for you and if the demon might get angry of your intrusion. This is what scares me: will the demon get angry
This remains to be seen. I have stopped being attacked by seemingly demonic beings ever since I shed my fear and stopped giving credit to their objective existence. In Buddhism, prince Siddhartha Gautama (the Buddha) defeated the demon Mara by realising he was an aspect of himself, the devil in all of us...and thus he ceased to be. I guarantee you nothing can truly harm you in the OOBE-state and if I encounter these creatures they will not be able to get to me if I take my stand unafraid. Also, take heed of this...things are not always what they seem, Darina...and I have a feeling that if I visit your father, I'll encounter nothing other than elements of a depraved mind. But we'll see. The offer is still open. Send me a picture and the name of whoever you want me to visit...either yourself or your father. You decide. Visiting one may lead to the other because of the strong connection.
I think this is worth a try as:
A) It may help you to come to an understanding of what is really happening
B) It will be something to include in my OOBE study
C) I'll post the experience here for everyone to see and give feedback
Quote from: Darina on May 11, 2011, 07:01:50
Exuse me, Lexy, I don't know what LBRP and Middle Pillar ritual is. The book of Robert Bruse has opened my eyes, but still I don't know a big deal.
Hi Darina, it's a magick practice, not "black" magic...LBRP is a banishing ritual to get rid of your demons & the middle pillar is sort of a meditation with visualization to heal you.
Dear Summerlander,
thank you very much for proposed help! I don't feel like doing this... I am too exhausted to take even little risk. I feel somehow like you are right about that there is nothing particular in my father, but what do you say about "elements of depraved mind"? Please explain me what do you mean. Is he mentally sick? If you can judge without photo, do you feel he makes a danger for my life?
Thank you again.
I will think yet. I think of giving you my father's picture. I'm sorry for undecisiveness.
Summerlander, I think u should have her father's consent before u do things to him.
Quote from: Pauli2 on May 13, 2011, 06:29:05
Summerlander, I think u should have her father's consent before u do things to him.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but you can't really do things "to" people without their consent, right? I mean, anything that is successfully "done to" someone implies there was consent (conscious or not), no?
Idk, just wondering.
Quote from: Pharoah on May 13, 2011, 07:40:58
Correct me if I'm wrong, but you can't really do things "to" people without their consent, right? I mean, anything that is successfully "done to" someone implies there was consent (conscious or not), no?
If you read Moen's first book, around page 217-218, there is a real life example
on this matter.
There will always be a payload for harming someone as the backfire against you
normally is bigger than the effect you thought you achieved in the first place.
Except for sending PUL (http://www.astralpulse.com/forums/welcome_to_astral_consciousness/pul_pure_unconditional_love_retrievals-t33529.0.html;msg280322), which always can be rejected by the receiver, I think
consent is a good thing to consider, as you can't know in advance what lessons
the other person has incarnated on Earth to learn.
The only "backfire" of sending or accepting PUL, is that you & the receiver improve
in personal growth.
This has gone a little out of hand...
First of all, Darina, the help you need SERIOUSLY can not be found online or from the astral.
You need to speak to someone locally. First off, the Police, because what's being done to you is *ILLEGAL*. Secondly, a therapist... you need to have a long talk with someone who will sit down with you and help you to work through your issues together.
The trouble is how much of this is really happening objectively. this is why visiting Darina first would probably provide a clue. About the father, I'd rather have his consent. Then again, I think the root of it all lies in fear.
Unfortunately, this is vastly beyond the scope of this forum.
It appears so. We can't make any promises in that we will be able to help Darina. But we can give her advice. I personally would consider for one minute, Darina, that perhaps your mind concocted these "demons" in order to shield you from a harsher reality. I could be mistaken, I'm no expert, but, considering that the last time I saw a demonic figure, I was able to face it unafraid and bring about its transmutation into a more pleasurable form, I concur with the view that such things are as illusory as nightmares and thus representational of states like fear, aversion and lack of self-esteem.
I'd still give it a shot at visiting you in the OOBE-state for the sake of making observations and possibly help you to come to terms with anything that you might be shoving to the back of your unconscious mind. Never underestimate your own mind. The offer is still open anyway. If you want it just send me a PM.
In addition to my previous thoughts on the nature of OOBEs, here's something that everyone might want to take a look at. It's an interesting perspective. Particularly where different rules apply to different dimensions and how they may interlace with each other to create a hyper-reality model:
http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/ciencia/ciencia_astralplane03.htm
Also, here's an interesting quote from the link:
"To illustrate this, if you are given five choices then you have five probable futures all sending their influences back in time and intersecting you in the present. The choice you most feel a tug toward is the probable future with the strongest reverse-time attraction force. You still have freewill and can choose one of the lesser alternatives, which is especially important if that strongest future is a bad one and willpower is needed to get you toward the healthier alternative. Etherically you are resonant with the strongest of your immediate probable futures.
So the etheric is closely associated with the physical realm, loosely mirroring its shape and diffusing outward in all spatiotemporal directions. It is the seat of raw life-force energy and influencer of probability. In contrast, the astral is as far removed from the etheric as the etheric is from the physical, and is thus two orders different from the physical. It is more reflective of internal psychic space than an external physical space.
The astral body is the seat of soul-based emotions. Whereas the etheric pulls on physical quantum events, the astral seems to pull on mental and emotional events. The astral realm, instead of mirroring physical form, symbolically mirrors emotional and psychic energy patterns.
Second sight also allows perception of the astral when an astral entity blends into the etheric environment. But to fully enter an astral realm requires that consciousness shift completely out of the physical and etheric environment and enter into something that is more like shared mind-space rather than space-time.
What we observe as particles and atoms (and by that logic everything in the universe) is just a fuzzy wave of possibilities before observation."
Morals are a secular concept, and there is no "Astral Principal" waiting and watching everything you do to make sure you receive exactly thrice what you put out, or whatever multiplier you happen to believe applies to karma.
"Karma" (where the astral is concerned, especially) is dependent mostly upon how good/bad you feel about your deeds. Feelings turn to thoughts turn to action, and so on. You essentially punish/reward your self based on the type of energy you radiate.
Interesting perspective, Pharoah. So, to sum it up, we are the ones who tend to punish and reward ourselves, right? I'd also like to say that I'm starting to prefer the term "cause and effect" rather than karma. Let Eastern civilisation use that term because here in the West (where I am, UK) it tends to bear certain connotations which I feel extinguish the literal meaning of the concept.
Summerlander, I decided to do it. I feel you can. Only ask you to try not to damage anything. I will give you my father's picture. Only I will do it on Monday's morning (My time is Eastern Europe) because tomorrow I won't be able to access internet. I want to send you the picture on your email privately, is that okay? and I want you to post here the results what you faced. I want to know what is in his mind. If he is GUILTY.
Yes, I think of police. But there is a problem here. I live in Ukraine and as you know it is a country of corruption and illegasy. I visit doctor privately and his practice on me is not legal. (this is my country). I am afraid if I go to the police they will know that I am ill and will find out I am not registered in psychiatrist. I will have to explain that he knew i was ill and mocked on me. Then I will get into hospital and it is no good. And I am sure father will try to put me there, he might tell i am sick and they would believe mostly him than me. What is possible to do is to get some evidense of violense without the hint on my mental illness. I might angry him up (this is damn easy) and make him hurt me physically and tape on dictophone his threatenings( he will say them). On the other hand my country is so corrupted that I can make almost anything if I have money. My chanse is to earn enought money and become independent and be able to help Mom and then do actions. I think I will have enough money by the end of this year, I am working on it. I am an artist , by the way.
I want to thank everyone who gave me help. Now I see clearlier what is happening with me and what to do. (There are different opinions, but all of them make sense to me).
:-)
Great! I'm so glad you replied! You know what? Your father is about to become the first person I visit without consent. I think this case is an exception. If he's innocent, I'm sure he wouldn't mind me doing this for the sake of his beloved daughter. If he's guilty, than I'm glad I'm doing it for you in the hope to provide you with something that might enable you to move on.
Regardless of whether I can really help or not, it's better to do something than nothing. Send it to my email or PM. I'll do it. I will peruse your father mind. I will post exactly what I experience.
You are sending the picture this monday, right?
i'm legitimately interested to see how that turns out summer. make sure you do share the story.
Quote from: Xanth on May 12, 2011, 09:27:17
How come I feel stuck in an episode of Supernatural in here...
:-D
possession eh... it's nine tenths of the law.
click (http://instantrimshot.com/)
Quite brilliant!! :-D
Ok. I'll have an OOBE next week and I'll be posting my experience here. I was quite interested in visiting Darina but I will wish to visit her father instead. See where this leads. Darina deserves this opportunity of possible enlightenment on the whole situation.
Can it be both?
:D
Quote from: personalreality on May 14, 2011, 17:20:13
i'm legitimately interested to see how that turns out summer. make sure you do share the story.
I'm not... I'm fairly certain someone is being lead around by the nose here.
But meh... knock yourself out Summer. >_<
Quote from: Pharoah on May 14, 2011, 18:52:35
Can it be both?
:D
Maybe. I hope there's enough time! :-D
I'm sorry, Summerlander.
Quote from: Xanth on May 14, 2011, 20:10:44
I'm not... I'm fairly certain someone is being lead around by the nose here.
But meh... knock yourself out Summer. >_<
call my interest healthy skepticism.
i'm just interested to see how this drama plays out. :wink:
Quote from: personalreality on May 15, 2011, 12:30:00
call my interest healthy skepticism.
i'm just interested to see how this drama plays out. :wink:
+1
Quote from: Darina on May 15, 2011, 10:52:24
I'm sorry, Summerlander.
That's ok. I'm gonna do what you've asked of me. Make sure you send the picture tomorrow.
:wink:
Why in all similar threads about such type of possesion issue, many of you think this can be easily resolved by simple will (if you don't believe in xxx, nothing can hurt you)...
Althought I am not even experienced in astral travel, but after reading many articles and experiences, dont you think possesion is a different issue than meeting negative entities in the different astral planes?
start a new thread about it
Quote from: mykorock on May 18, 2011, 05:55:14
Althought I am not even experienced in astral travel, but after reading many articles and experiences, dont you think possesion is a different issue than meeting negative entities in the different astral planes?
I think it's different.
Darina still hasn't sent me a PM. Has she gone missing? I hope Xanth wasn't right about her... :-(
you are a giant sphere of mind that covers all life,made in the image of god, you have every angel every demon and every devil inside your mind anyway and all thought forms. its only possession if they rule your mind
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
:NoY:
There's no such thing as being possessed by demons. I've been there, believe me..."possessed" so to speak. But I don't consider it being possessed by something. To me it was something else...like a reaction of what was going on with my parents at the time. As for projections being linked to such phenomenon...I'd say yes from my experience. I'd have many false awakenings which, in retrospect were projections. In them, pale-skinned beings would chase me and violate me. They looked sentient but now I've had enough experience to be able to tell that such scary episodes are fear manifested. That's all.
I wasn't able to access my comp these days so im sorry for making you wait. i don't want to let you play with my trouble and put it on a show here. no, thanks.
Put it on show?...
Is this not what you're doing?
Summerlander, i didn't mean that, sorry for bothering you. thank you very much for your help and proposition, i changed my mind, i'll try to cope by my own.
Darina.
I think that's the most sane post so far.
:-D
good luck
love all
Quote from: Darina on May 19, 2011, 06:12:25
Summerlander, i didn't mean that, sorry for bothering you. thank you very much for your help and proposition, i changed my mind, i'll try to cope by my own.
Darina.
Ok. That's alright, Darina. If you change your mind just PM me and I'll keep my OOBE visit to you confidential. My offer of a different perspective is still open. But then again, you could have an OOBE and visit your father's mind too. It may give you the answers your looking for. :-)
Quote from: Summerlander on May 18, 2011, 11:18:26
In them, pale-skinned beings would chase me and violate me. They looked sentient but now I've had enough experience to be able to tell that such scary episodes are fear manifested. That's all.
Naturally, they "can" be, and usually they are, in the majority of cases, and in the majority of cases they are just a nuisance (as in this one).
However there are many of these so called "demons" that are much stronger than you think, and much less "non existent" (whatever that word means) than you think. If you are interested you can try reading the Goetia, then try "evoking" (properly) Bhaal without a so-called circle. "Fear manifested" or not, "aspects of the subconscious" or not, after you will have to deal with it, and it will not be a pleasure, I assure you (at all, it will either be very dangerous, so no,
please, don't do it, it was just a provocation; I've personally known only a supreme butt that did a thing as that and he died two days after throwing himself from the sixth roof, and for what? He wanted to win the hearth of a girl and was so sure of his grandeur as to not either care about everyone telling him it was a really bad idea; usually people are not so idiot, either if they want to "try", and they go safe, "evoking" something "minor", with much lower consequences).
There are various "degrees" in the power of these "demons". What you encountered are just the so called "lamias". Those are what you usually encounter on the "astral" and they mean very little. They are so weak as to be easily overcome and not cared upon. However there are some types of these "demons" that are all another thing, and not to be toyed with if you know not what you are doing.
Practically speaking the probability of encountering one of these "demons" is bar none if you don't voluntarily go searching for them and you know not how to do it, but they exists, and they are just not only "fears", I assure you (or, even if they are, they are so strong as such that whatever they are, you are anyway in great trouble if not approached correctly, so it doesn't really matter).
Naturally you can think otherwise but all of the "pragmatic" people I've met (as your friend Beekdkin) also if they are so sure of what is "real" and what's not, never dared doing a thing as I mentioned before. Maybe because they don't care? It can be. Maybe because also if you show here that you "know better" you cannot be so certain of nothing in reality and it's better to just avoid coming into trouble just for bullying in a forum? (Luckily, I must add).
To the OP; this was not directed at you, naturally. In your case people here are right, you should not put too much weight on it because the more you have fear the more "power" what these "things" have. I was speaking of something specific, not your case at all. So don't become impressioned. Mine was academical talk, not related at all with yours.
That's a wonderful personal perspective, Selea. :)
Indeed it is. Maybe these entities do exist in the non-physical and they prey on the fearful or those that go looking for them. Such mischievous entities can go by many names. The religious would refer to them as "demons", of course. I have no interest in going there though. I still think that Buddha's story illustrates what they are quite well, though. Mara wasn't really a sentient being. He was a product of Gautama's mind. The devil in all of us. My experiences seem to indicate that they are not real ever since I stopped running. Perhaps my mind isn't really there.
The Goetia is a piece of writing bound to excite the imagination of those who read it. You said it well here:
QuotePractically speaking the probability of encountering one of these "demons" is bar none if you don't voluntarily go searching for them
About this:
Quotethey are just not only "fears", I assure you (or, even if they are, they are so strong as such that whatever they are, you are anyway in great trouble if not approached correctly, so it doesn't really matter).
It's a bit of an oxymoronic statement - don't you think? One minute you say you can assure me and then in brackets you practically say that there is still a chance that they might be... :? - Either they are or they are not. I'm not scared of them and I don't believe in them, hence I don't experience them. Also, is there a correct way of approaching demons? I didn't know that! why would you want to approach them anyway (supposing that such things even exist)?
Yesterday I sent my children to bed before putting
Nightmare In Elm Street on. I have no doubt in my mind that had I let them watch Freddy Krueger, they would have had nightmares about him or something just as horrible and scary to them. Why? Because it would have made an impression on them. The fear would further fuel the nightmare. Adults are not so different with their mysticism, Goetias :roll:, religious beliefs and astral projection...
These demons or negative entities (whatever you want to call them) are more likely to be anthropological concepts or archetypes arising from dissonant states of mind. I can assure you that they are only strong if you believe them to be strong - which you already do - so you are deluding yourself there. The only "protection" you need is a stable mind and a good head about you. That's all. 8-)
Quote from: Summerlander on June 29, 2011, 13:12:21
Indeed it is. Maybe these entities do exist in the non-physical and they prey on the fearful or those that go looking for them. Such mischievous entities can go by many names. The religious would refer to them as "demons", of course. I have no interest in going there though. I still think that Buddha's story illustrates what they are quite well, though. Mara wasn't really a sentient being. He was a product of Gautama's mind. The devil in all of us. My experiences seem to indicate that they are not real ever since I stopped running. Perhaps my mind isn't really there.
The problem, as I see it, is that you just lose yourself always on what is "real" and whatnot, instead on focusing on the experience. I already told you at last twenty times but it seems that you don't want to listen: "it doesn't matter what's real and what's not, what matters are the practical results you get by doing certain things".
Quote from: Summerlander on June 29, 2011, 13:12:21
The Goetia is a piece of writing bound to excite the imagination of those who read it.
And what's "imagination"? Why do you consider it any different than what is "real"?
Quote from: Summerlander on June 29, 2011, 13:12:21
It's a bit of an oxymoronic statement - don't you think? One minute you say you can assure me and then in brackets you practically say that there is still a chance that they might be... :? - Either they are or they are not. I'm not scared of them and I don't believe in them, hence I don't experience them.
The fact that you *cannot* experience them (because you don't know how to) it doesn't mean that they are not there. If you will do a stupid thing as the one I mentioned (and please, I repeat, don't do it) you will then "experience" them, no matter if you are not scared of them and don't "believe" in them and if they are just a "belief construct" brought on the "imaginination" exalted by the cermenony, and you will have to deal with it. Will be the "dealing" all a product of your "subconscious"? It could be. Will be the "dealing" just a product of your fears? It can be. Still, no matter what the dealing will really be, the results and the "encounter" would be devastating, both for you and those near you, and it will have a real impact on your life, practically.
"By doing certain things, certain results happens". You care too much on if the "result" is "real" or "not real" instead of caring about both how to reach that "result" and how to use it.
Quote from: Summerlander on June 29, 2011, 13:12:21
Also, is there a correct way of approaching demons? I didn't know that! why would you want to approach them anyway (supposing that such things even exist)?
There are motives why you may want to approach them. Goetia "demons" are usually approached to acquire material things or material informations. In more general terms "demons" are to be used for specific, practical things of less "spiritual" nature.
Everything has its uses.
Quote from: Summerlander on June 29, 2011, 13:12:21
Yesterday I sent my children to bed before putting Nightmare In Elm Street on. I have no doubt in my mind that had I let them watch Freddy Krueger, they would have had nightmares about him or something just as horrible and scary to them. Why? Because it would have made an impression on them. The fear would further fuel the nightmare. Adults are not so different with their mysticism, Goetias :roll:, religious beliefs and astral projection...
Sure, and the *practical* difference where it is? Your children could either die by a strong fear (as everybody can), unchecked. Will it then be "real" or not "real" that "fear" for you?
The difference, in this case, is that Krueger will be a product created by the fear of the child, it does not "exists" as an archetype already. Certain "demons", as a Goetia demon, already exists as such, so having "fear" of it or not it doesn't change the status and "impact" it has on you.
Having a fearless attitute is a very good advice, as it is, however, to *respect* everything, especially those things you know nothing about.
Quote from: Summerlander on June 29, 2011, 13:12:21
I can assure you that they are only strong if you believe them to be strong - which you already do - so you are deluding yourself there.
And I assure you that some of these "demons" aren't, in the terms you are seeing it, the difference here is that I have personal experience in dealing with them, while you don't, so guess what? I think I have more experience than you on the matter to know what's what.
You start always from the arrogant presumptions that I am "deluded", as if I would be a sort of "believe anything just because I have to". This is what makes you feel better with yourself, in this way you can discard everything I say thinking you "know better". It is a sort of automatic protection you have; but, if you need a shield, is because something inside you knows it has to be protected.
Yet, also if you "know better" and you are so sure these things are not "real" and are "delusions" or cannot do you no harm if you are as you are (naturally supposing you are "better"), all your "security" will melt in practice because I could bet everything you want that you will tinkle on your pants after just about 10 minutes if in practice I would let you do a thing as that, seeing what it "happens". I know because I've been there, with similar individuals as you.
I repeat: all pragmatic people I've met are really good at talking, but when they have to show their "security" on certain things, they always avoid doing them. It is because they really don't care or just because also if they put down everything they consider "bogus" in forums they know perfectly they cannot be so dogmatically sure, one way or another, of what's "real" and "not real" so it's better to not awake the sleeping dog?
Do you know it happens in the same way for OBEs? Also them can be just a construct of the mind, isn't it? Yet you are *using* them, isn't it? So what's different?
Quote from: Summerlander on June 29, 2011, 13:12:21
The only "protection" you need is a stable mind and a good head about you. That's all. 8-)
Sure.
But you suppose I'm "mad", isn't it? Or a "deluded" individual, not knowing what's what.
Selea...
OOBEs are acknowledged by science. They are often purported to be many things by the scientific community, but, what they are remains elusive. And yes...they could all be in your head. I never claimed to know anything for sure. Read my guide on how to induce OOBEs and you will find there that I mention the possibility that they might be in the head. The fact that you mention this is irrelevant. The only person claiming to know it all here is yourself and I'm giving you the opportunity here to look at yourself by holding a mirror up to your face. Again, OOBEs are a real phenomenon, what they are is what eludes us.
The same thing cannot be said about the Goetia demons. There is absolutely no proof that such sentient beings exist and can be interacted with in the Phase. There is proof, however, that the mind has the power to create many things. You seem to have an interest for esoteric writings but you completely disregard that that is just someone's view being expressed (and usually with ulterior motives).
Have you heard of Karma Lingpa? His teachings are found in The Tibetan Book of the Dead. He also engaged in esoteric practices and his view was somewhat different from that of, say, Aleister Crowley, for example. In the intermediate state, upon death, one may experience scores of demons, which, as it is stated in the Bardo Thodol (and I have it!), have no existence but a subjective one. Once the deceased realise this, they can move on from their mental dissonance towards a more harmonious state of being.
You are focusing on that and moving right towards it. I'm telling you...you are moving towards your own mental gunk as you allow yourself to be impressed by all this Goetian nonsense. Demons don't exist like people do. They are aspects of your psyche and some are from your imagination. there's a reason why we have nightmares too...to help us face our fears.
In forums like these we encourage people to project and to stay away from the bovine excrement that will discourage them. All you are doing is telling the newbie that entering the Phase can be dangerous...not so! Not at all. You are like a child being told about Santa Claus and the Boogieman and believing in them because mummy and daddy said so. Let me tell you something...these books that you read are the fantasies of another arse-wiper. Have you ever experience one of the Goetia demons? Even if you think you have, what makes you think you didn't hallucinate the experience?
Selea, if you want to remain in your ignorance you are quite welcome. I'll let you believe in your demons and engulf yourself in fear while I carry out my Phase studies and occasionally enjoy rich and interesting experiences that will invigorate my artistic inspiration. Don't bother replying to tell me how much I'm wrong because, the next time I post here, it will be in reply to someone else's post.
Quote from: Summerlander on June 30, 2011, 14:51:51
Selea...
OOBEs are acknowledged by science.
No, they aren't. There's only an interest in them, as with many other so called "paranormal" activities, including, guess what, interactions with "entities".
Quote from: Summerlander on June 30, 2011, 14:51:51
They are often purported to be many things by the scientific community, but, what they are remains elusive. And yes...they could all be in your head. I never claimed to know anything for sure.
I just let you notice that you use two measures when you interact with things. OBEs can be all in your head (as you yourself admitted here) and yet they are perfectly fine in your view and you use them to do what you want. The same can be said of "demons" yet those things are not fine with you, for your intellectual approach.
Make-up your mind. You cannot decide yourself what's "real" and what's not just on what you like more or it is more close to your personal intellectual view. And before all else, you cannot decide yourself what's "real" and what's not without either having experienced it yourself.
Quote from: Summerlander on June 30, 2011, 14:51:51
The only person claiming to know it all here is yourself and I'm giving you the opportunity here to look at yourself by holding a mirror up to your face.
I just write what I know, but, differently from yours, my knowledge is very ample and includes also those things I didn't intellectually believe or care to. My experience is based on practical things, yours in intellectual dabblings of no practical value whatsoever if not to believe you are so sure of everything already.
Quote from: Summerlander on June 30, 2011, 14:51:51
Again, OOBEs are a real phenomenon, what they are is what eludes us.
Also "demons" are. OBEs are "real" because you can use the experience they create, and in the same way "demons" are real for the experience they create. Both experiences can be used, this is the only thing that matters. Are they really "real"? Who knows and who cares. Only you do, just that you do so only for what you care to, and you are a total contradiction either intellectually. Your logic has no sense.
Quote from: Summerlander on June 30, 2011, 14:51:51
The same thing cannot be said about the Goetia demons. There is absolutely no proof that such sentient beings exist and can be interacted with in the Phase.
There are many "proofs", in fact, of the same character of the "proofs" that OBEs are real. They are in the same category. Many people doing certain things have experienced the same things, exactly as with OBEs. But I suppose that since these people don't conform to your intellectual pow then they must all be "deluded", differently, naturally, from those that share it. What you don't like is coming from "deluded" individuals, what you like comes from "wise and pragmatic" people, no matter if those people then, either admittedly never ever tried those things they insist they are experts upon.
And the fact that a minority of people (that usually, as you, care to do only what they intellectually find fine discarding all the rest as if it naturally doesn't exists because they say so), cannot experience those things in the "phase" it doesn't mean that they cannot be encountered and experienced there by people that know how to do it.
The fact that some people can only drive a car with all assists on it doesn't mean that all people cannot control a car without them. I imagine what Ken Block would think if somebody a day will write a book in where it is written: "a car can be controlled only with ABS and automatic gears, elsewhere you certainly go off-road on an overtake and everybody that says the contrary is just deluded".
Quote from: Summerlander on June 30, 2011, 14:51:51
You seem to have an interest for esoteric writings but you completely disregard that that is just someone's view being expressed (and usually with ulterior motives).
I have interest only in what I can experience, and, differently from you, I experience EVERYTHING.
Quote from: Summerlander on June 30, 2011, 14:51:51
He also engaged in esoteric practices and his view was somewhat different from that of, say, Aleister Crowley, for example.
On the contrary, on the structure the experiences are almost the same. You should read a little better and not just stop on the external part. Look at the structure of the experiences, they share many similarities.
Quote from: Summerlander on June 30, 2011, 14:51:51
In the intermediate state, upon death, one may experience scores of demons, which, as it is stated in the Bardo Thodol (and I have it!), have no existence but a subjective one.
Also OBEs are a "subjective" experience as they aren't. Same as "demons". They are subjective as they aren't.
Quote from: Summerlander on June 30, 2011, 14:51:51
You are focusing on that and moving right towards it. I'm telling you...you are moving towards your own mental gunk as you allow yourself to be impressed by all this Goetian nonsense.
I focus on what works. You focus on mental dabbling. You continue to discard all the time that I repeat that I don't care if they are "real" or not. I DON'T CARE. Do you know the meaning of the word? I care only about if a thing works and if I can use it or not.
But instead you still continue insisting that I say that they are "real" (in the sense you give to the term). Would you please stop debating on things I never said to begin with?
Quote from: Summerlander on June 30, 2011, 14:51:51
Demons don't exist like people do. They are aspects of your psyche and some are from your imagination. there's a reason why we have nightmares too...to help us face our fears.
Again, what they are and what they aren't doesn't concern me. I don't care what an OBE is, only the way I can use them. Same way I don't care what a "demon" is, only how I can use them.
And I repeat it to you: since you are so sure they don't exist, why it's that so that every people as you that I've met that say the same things then tinkle in their pants (*literally*) when they are shown what happens?
Since you (and others like you) are so sure it's just "imagination" (that yet you didn't define the meaning of the word, you discarded it altogheter, isn't it?) why I bet as much as you want that you will *never* dare to try doing a thing as the one I've mentioned?
Quote from: Summerlander on June 30, 2011, 14:51:51All you are doing is telling the newbie that entering the Phase can be dangerous...not so! Not at all.
Listen, you can do whatever you want but stop pretending you know what I've done and stop pretending I wrote something I never did. You continuosly do this: you make up stuff I never said and then you either try to "confute" it.
I said exactly the contrary, read well next time, I expressedly said in the first message that in the "phase" (as you call it) these things are never met if you don't do something specific and you know how to do it. So no, I instilled fear in anybody, and on the contrary I either wrote to the OP that I was talking of all another thing.
Maybe, I always repeat it to you, if instead of having an orgasm at the sound of your voice you will for one time READ what I write you will acknowledge that your supposed pedestal is just the chair that doesn't let you hang from the rope.
Quote from: Summerlander on June 30, 2011, 14:51:51
Have you ever experience one of the Goetia demons? Even if you think you have, what makes you think you didn't hallucinate the experience?
Because I have practical results by the experience. Namely: I ask a thing from a "demon", that thing happens. If when I turn the key my car ignites everytime, coincidence or not it's irrelevant.
Again, I'm not interested at all if I'm "hallucinating" (what is an hallucination, btw, oh wise one? care to explain?) or not. I care about the use of the "hallucination" and what it brings me. It brings me nothing of a *practical* value? I discard it. It brings something I can use in a practical way? Fine, I use it.
Quote from: Summerlander on June 30, 2011, 14:51:51
Selea, if you want to remain in your ignorance you are quite welcome.
My "ignorance" is built upon personal knowledge on what works and what it doesn't. Your "education" is based on suppositions about what's real and what not, without ever having either tried for yourself and not caring to.
Guess whom of the two I prefer...
And I already said it to you once: you are pretending you are more "educated" than me, but that's really so? If I would place a bet in your position I would be careful...
Quote from: Summerlander on June 30, 2011, 14:51:51
I'll let you believe in your demons and engulf yourself in fear while I carry out my Phase studies and occasionally enjoy rich and interesting experiences that will invigorate my artistic inspiration. Don't bother replying to tell me how much I'm wrong because, the next time I post here, it will be in reply to someone else's post.
And you can continue living in your boring world made of certainities of everything you don't either personally know for yourself as if you are an expert in them. I guess you can go in a martial arts forum, pretend you are the next Bruce Lee just because you've read a book that does make intellectual sense to you (without either knowing how to do a side-kick) and then insist that all people experiences are just fabrications of their mind, either if they are experiencing those "fabrications" everyday.
Do you think you will look "educated" to those people?
Quoteyou can do whatever you want but stop pretending you know what I've done and stop pretending I wrote something I never did. You continuosly do this: you make up stuff I never said and then you either try to "confute" it.
he has a masters in this field, it's called deception he's really quite good at it, arnt ya SL...
the governments do this on regular bases to decieve the viewer from learning or acknowledging the writer/speaker as a leader if ya like of a or many industries so as the viewer is steered (mis/guided) away from knowledge that will out perform other government official representatives...
as they dont have the abilities to learn on their mis-guided ventures...
hay SL i hear on the grape vine :wink: that some particular phaseing techniques are beeing erradicated as ya sigo says: The Phase = OOBE/AP/LD
dont know whats going on their...
good luck
love all
ether2:
You should marry the ignorant fool who posted before you and when the two of you are together, you can read this and learn:
http://www.lucidity.com/NL32.OBEandLD.html
QuoteThe Phase = OOBE/AP/LD
dont know whats going on their...
www.obe4u.com
OOBEs are acknowledged by science and paedophilia does not come from homosexuality.
Good day!
:-D
Quote from: Summerlander on July 02, 2011, 08:01:59
ether2:
You should marry the ignorant fool who posted before you and when the two of you are together, you can read this and learn:
http://www.lucidity.com/NL32.OBEandLD.html
www.obe4u.com
OOBEs are acknowledged by science and paedophilia does not come from homosexuality.
Good day!
:-D
all i stated is that you have a masters at what i stated, i did'nt say i dis/agree with anything else that s/he or yaself stated, thanx
OBe's acknowledged by science this is good, i dont disagree with this statement as it should be acknowledged by ALL, soon...as i'm sure it will be Obviously to those that know whats going on...
and in case ya not up to date Xanth does not like that word "peadophilie" as he has deleted many of my post because of that word peodophilie as his mates (CIA) dislike peadophilia understandably of course :-D...
for that reason i wont go into that discussion again...
i'm sure should you research the subject thoroughly you will be quite suprised at ya findings as it is common knowledge to those in the know, thanx...
good luck
love all
Quote from: ether2 on July 02, 2011, 08:23:52
all i stated is that you have a masters at what i stated, i did'nt say i dis/agree with anything else that s/he or yaself stated, thanx
Good, good... 8-)
Quote from: ether2 on July 02, 2011, 08:23:52
OBe's acknowledged by science this is good, i dont disagree with this statement as it should be acknowledged by ALL, soon...as i'm sure it will be Obviously to those that know whats going on...
I'm glad you agree with what is true because your friend Selea seems to live in la-la land and claims that science doesn't acknowledged them - only has an interest! LOL :roll: - science continues to explore OOBEs just as they explore lucid dreaming, sleep cycles and brain activity in general. It's true nature, of course, remains elusive. As for being "paranormal", there is nothing paranormal about it. Even if some experiences prove to be telepathic, this may actually be a
normal function of reality as our minds could be quantum entangled. Nothing magical about it as your friend has implied...I don't bother with the nonsense he posts any more anyway. :-D
Quote from: ether2 on July 02, 2011, 08:23:52
and in case ya not up to date Xanth does not like that word "peadophilie" as he has deleted many of my post because of that word peodophilie as his mates (CIA) dislike peadophilia understandably of course :-D...
He deleted your posts did he? Awww...poor baby! :-D
Are you sure it wasn't because you said paedophilia comes from homosexuality? Btw, I didn't use the word "peadophilie", I used the word paedophilia. It is not a swear word, my dear. I'm sure he won't mind if I use the word "murderer" either...
Quote from: ether2 on July 02, 2011, 08:23:52
for that reason i wont go into that discussion again...
Ok. Don't. Do yourself a favour and don't! :-D
Quote from: ether2 on July 02, 2011, 08:23:52
good luck
love all
Same to you. Love you! 8-)
QuoteAre you sure it wasn't because you said paedophilia comes from homosexuality? Btw, I didn't use the word "peadophilie", I used the word paedophilia. It is not a swear word, my dear. I'm sure he won't mind if I use the word "murderer" either...
hay, good pick up with the words peadophili(e) as against peadophili(a) and nar i mentioned the monarchy how they approved certain laws to protect certain people, i only really bought it up because the CIA really disapprove of the monarchys ruleing in the favour of protecting peadophilies, CIA really hated this as they have often praised my work in the erradication of peadophilia...
Xanth (CIA) i reckon only deletes my post regarding this subject :wink: because it use to as some know words (thoughts/actions) generate into certain processes that obviously regenerate, these processes in areas donot cannot regenerate anymore 8-)...
no other reason for it...obviously :wink: :-)
good luck
love all
Quote from: Summerlander on July 02, 2011, 08:01:59
OOBEs are acknowledged by science...
And I repeat: they are as other "paranormal" activities. (Pherhaps you did miss the "", isn't it?. Paranormal was a term invented by science, btw, not by me, for this my use of it. Again, your wanting to look "educated" is not going well. You either now confute a term constructed by the those you try to use as a backup. Oh well...)
Science has an interesest in them, but they are not considered real. There are studies and tests that try to acknowledge how they work etc.,
same (again) as with other "paranormal" activities (including, guess what, and again, interactions with "entities" - did you miss it this point, isn't it? you completely discarded it. I don't know why it always happens with you...).
And please, stop always referring to Raduga as if he should know the truth of the matter just because he pretends so. Apart that nobody knows it, then either if you practically cannot discern all the wrong or partial things he pretends to know everything about, everbody but a biased individual can see that his method of working is faulted from beginning, because there's no structure on it. He decides what needs to be tested and explored on an intellectual basis, he only cares to do what it is seems "fine" and "good" for him, and what he cares upon to learn. Given this obviously faulted approach, he knows less than nothing in the end. If you learn Karate it's good; if you don't learn Karate it's good the same; if you learn Karate so and so, in a fight you will be probably more in trouble than not knowing it at all. *Practical* truth.
I already demonstrated to you why this approach doesn't give you nothing, no matter how much time you put in it. If you either pass 20 years wanting to learn chess but you just do what you find good or interesting or intellectually affine to your pow there you will learn absolutely nothing, in the end. Another individual doing eveything, and learning in a structured manner, especially those things that s/he doesn't care about or find boring or unuseful, will have a much wider understanding on it and it will be much better at it, in the end, there will be no either comparision. The first individual after those 20 years will be at most 1500-1700 ECO (and the worser is that that ECO will be not stable; a such individual could lose either to someone of 500-700 ECO lower, for example), the second will be already an IM after 2-4 years.
This applies to EVERYTHING, every field, and if you really were educated as you think you are you would know already, since it is the basis on how the teaching process is structured in every academy worth its name.
Quote from: Summerlander on July 02, 2011, 13:31:00
I'm glad you agree with what is true because your friend Selea seems to live in la-la land and claims that science doesn't acknowledged them - only has an interest! LOL :roll: - science continues to explore OOBEs just as they explore lucid dreaming, sleep cycles and brain activity in general.
As they explore other so called "paranormal" activities, as telepathy, mediumship, etc. I used the term "so-called" for a motive. Now the use of the term "paranormal" is much less common than before, because science has began to understand more some functions of the brain and so they are now understanding that "paranormal" is not that paranormal in realtiy.
But still, in the science field there's not a comprehensive view on OBEs and what they are (as with every other thing of this nature), and surely nobody of science, if speaking formally, will tell you that OBEs are real. So, your "acknowledged" is just my "interest". They are "acknowledged" in the sense that science knows that they can be replicated given the right circumnstances (that are yet to be defined fully) but not that they are a "real" phenomena that has objective parameters in its results. For this, given the context, my use of the term "interest", because you tried to imply that OBEs are treated different from other similar phenomena, when they are NOT.
You just want to try to divert the discussion on semantics and this petty argument on "acknowldeged vs. interest" because you have nothing of concrete to say and you have done, yet another time, the figure of the guy speaking of things you don't clearly either know from personal experience as if you were an expert and that you don't either know how to have a coherent line of working and thought on what you do. You neither have a coherent intellectual approach, because, if you did, you would consider OBEs a "waste" in the same way. In that case I would not agree with you but at at last I could respect your pow because it would coherent in that point, differently from now.
And then stop talking to me in 3rd person replying to another. If you want to speak with me reply to me. How old are you? Seriously. Neither my granddaughter acts as you do, and she's only 9 years old.
Quote from: Summerlander on July 02, 2011, 13:31:00As for being "paranormal", there is nothing paranormal about it. Even if some experiences prove to be telepathic, this may actually be a normal function of reality as our minds could be quantum entangled. Nothing magical about it as your friend has implied...I don't bother with the nonsense he posts any more anyway. :-D
And you still continue to read everything as you like and insist to talk about it as if I said it. Where I said that OBEs are "magical"? Can you quote me? And, no, I didn't "imply" anything, I'm not you. I used OBEs as a reference to demonstrate that you have not a coherent intellectual view on the things and how you approach them intellectualy. I never implied that OBEs are not "normal" or anything else of the babbling you are speaking about now.
Good work btw, on not replying on nothing at all of concrete, as for example your use of two weights and two measures depending on what you like and what you don't, either if they share the same background and they function in the same thing, practically.
What a pathetic excuse of an "educated" man. If you want to debate and prove me wrong or that I what I say is an idiocy then do so fully and reply to SPECIFIC points, as I always do. Replying to generic arguments without entering in the specific and remaining on the vague it is the well known, (and pathetic) last excuse at having a point when in reality you don't know what to say.
Maybe you should ask your God Raduga if that's so, analyzing the way you behave, and let me know what will he say about this. I'm sure he will agree with me, on the fact that you have nothing of "educated" to say, but you are just someone that thinks he "knows better" on a given, yet you cannot either have a coherent argumentation without resorting to personal attacks, generic and meaningless confutations that never goes to specific and practical points, and using words the other never said to try to discredit him/her.
I said this to you once, also if you probably didn't take me sersiouly, but I was: if the way you behave is the result of something you do or are, then change it, dramatically; it does you more bad than good.
I'm just gonna toss this out there... this forum isn't the place to discuss pedophilia.
If it continues, in ANY form, I'm going to lock this.
Quote from: Summerlander on July 02, 2011, 08:01:59
You should marry the ignorant fool who posted before you ...
Quote from: Summerlander on July 02, 2011, 13:31:00
... seems to live in la-la land ...
degrading
Quote from: ether2 on July 02, 2011, 08:23:52
and in case ya not up to date Xanth does not like that word "peadophilie" as he has deleted many of my post because of that word peodophilie as his mates (CIA) dislike peadophilia understandably of course :-D...
for that reason i wont go into that discussion again...
Erm, am I missing something? Why is it that you seem to think Xanth is somehow involved with the CIA? :?
Quote from: BlueHalcyon on July 03, 2011, 12:58:05
Erm, am I missing something? Why is it that you seem to think Xanth is somehow involved with the CIA? :?
That was an unfortunate incident which another member started and ether took it upon himself to believe it 100%. >_<
Ah, ok then.
Quote from: Xanth on July 03, 2011, 14:54:12
That was an unfortunate incident which another member started and ether took it upon himself to believe it 100%. >_<
So Xanth are you going to stand by which what your statement looks like to the unaware viewer, as you know that statement would not will not hold up in a court of law...
hay BH take notice of the training of the CIA as it clearly does not say he is not CIA...
and Xanth you clearly say in one of your post that you have arrested people as the statement went something like "when we arrest these people" it was in regards to people with mentall illnesses...
i have no time to look for it...
oh... maybe you were CIA :-)...
good luck
love all
You're a nutcase. You belong in a mental institution... >_<
Quote from: Xanth on July 03, 2011, 22:12:06
You're a nutcase. You belong in a mental institution... >_<
did i touch a nerve :-D
Quotehay SL i hear on the grape vine that some particular phaseing techniques are beeing erradicated as ya sigo says: The Phase = OOBE/AP/LD
:-P
good luck
love all
Quote from: ether2 on July 03, 2011, 23:17:18
did i touch a nerve :-D
:-P
good luck
love all
You confuse pity with anger...
Quote from: Xanth on July 03, 2011, 23:23:19
You confuse pity with anger...
Lol...
to give pity to someone you would be of a higher consciousness because of their lack of understanding over your knowledge than those who you give pity too we both know you are way below my height in consciousness, so no, that statement is wrong :wink:...
here's why...
http://thewayitisether.wordpress.com/existencedimensionsladder-love-all/
and
http://thewayitisether.wordpress.com/summary-of-ladder-of-consciousnessdimensions-2/
you need more love in ya life man
and for the record are you going to claim you are not or were CIA...
consider it a couirt of law...
i expect no answer...
good luck
love all :wink:
To keep it more to the topic...ether2, you may be possessed. :-D
Quote from: Summerlander on July 04, 2011, 08:07:02
To keep it more to the topic...ether2, you may be possessed. :-D
lol...whats wrong with being possessed as being possessed is just a schooling of one's thought(s) processes are they are more advanced in areas of the minds abilities (Areas) than others clearly (cant be bothered explaining, take to long), but hay dont worry as this is just about at a close of any or all possession problems with anyone experienceing diffulculties whith such dilemmas, as their (possesses) job is near done...just a schooling for those developeing/studying the minds abilities or to those that dont study the mind it's just laying the foundation...
but you already knew that din ya :-D...
good luck
love all
Nothing wrong with being possessed I suppose. ether2 has spoken and explained it all. :-D