Need a quantum physicist.

[shaman]

Hey Atalanta,

Big Bang Theory and Black Holes is more related to Cosmology and Astrophysics rather than Quantum Physics. Sure the first few seconds of the Big Bang is related to Quantum Physics too, and to Particle Physics and Particle Astrophysics, etc...

Anyhow, I do have a degree in Physics with a specialization in Astrophysics and Astronomy and I am ready to listen to your questions or to your suggestions, though I cannot guarantee I'll have an answer for everything. As to all the astral stuff and other things going on this forum, I have not yet found solid evidence to prove anything. Though I have not yet given up.

What you have to understand with Big Bang, Universe, Cosmology etc... is that there are many different theories and that part of a theory is speculation and part is based on proofs, so that not every theory you heard is complete. Some theories sometimes appear to be wrong and have to be "dropped", while other theories can evolve further.

[atalanta]

Okay, thanks so much for taking the time out to answer my questions.

Lets do one, first.

The idea of multiple universes and BB(for short)theory.  When I saw them talking about multiple universes the first thing that came into my mind was, 'I wonder, are those other universes chaotically thrown about or are they organised?'.  In the graphics they used on the program it showed these universes aligned in a grid, in which case, surely it would suggest a plan/purpose of sorts.  

The other thought I had is 'if there is nothing before the BB, then how can there be other universes, except for the fact that our universe was the first to 'bang'?'  There can't be nothing if there are other universes.

The final thing to occur to me is that even if we were to get past all this and say that there are multiple universes, then within each universe there may very well be a divine purpose that we are not able to comprehend.  You see they were saying that some theorists who don't believe in a Divine explanation, could explain the organisation in our universe by saying it was just a luck of the draw that this universe had just what it required to produce life, while others didn't.  However, it seems to me that if we make life the centre of God's plan than it appears as if that is the purpose.  I mean maybe the purpose of this universe was nothing more than to develop rocks, heat and we are nothing but the byproduct.  Maybe, in another universe, it may be something different.  I guess what I am saying is in a clumsy way, how can we know what and if there is purpose.  There may be millions of universes, maybe each one has a purpose and maybe none have.  Maybe, what looks like purpose to us isn't but at the same time what looks chaotic has purpose.  Whats the old saying about there being logic in the madness.

Now remember simple English, I've been to uni but thats no guarrantee of intelligence.[]

[coral1]

Hi atalanta,

Although quantum theory is one of the most successful and accurate ways to explain events on a very small scale even the physicists who use it will say they don`t really understand it.Einstein himself said,"the more success quantum theory has,the sillier it looks."There are a number of interpretations  of which the " many worlds" explanation is one.When you start asking questions about "purpose" and "Divine explanation" most physicists will claim that that`s a philosophical problem.I recently read a good book about these very questions."Modern Physics and Ancient Faith" by David Barr explores the interface between science and religion.It`s an interesting read and not too technical.(I`m hopeless at math myself!)There are chapters about big bang cosmology and quantum physics.I really enjoyed it.

Happy Trails

[shaman]

Hey Atalanta,

I could not get back to you earlier as I had much to do.

I do not know the details of the (say) "multiple" universes and probably what they showed was "organised" in order for the public to better understand. What seems to you "unorganised" and "chaotic" does not need to be so mathematically speaking, in that sens that there are always some very specific laws (of physics) to describe this chaos and that even in chaos there are things that are organised. The best example is the turbulence in hydrodynamics, or if you prefer the basic fact that the wheather is chaotic and changes very quickly so that we can predict it only for a week at most and even most of the time the local weather prediction can be wrong showing that it is chaotic (the winds are changing, the temperature, the humidity, etc..). However this chaos can be described quite accurately with equations (The "Navier-Stokes" equations in fluid mechanics) and in addition there are quantities in this chaos that are unchanged. The best example I can give you is the one of huricane. The huricane is a "coherent" and "organised" structure in the weather of the earth. The huricane (typhoon, cyclone) can last a few weeks and has a well defined structure and actually many things can be predicted concerning it. So within the turbulent (chaotic) atmosphere (weather) of the earth there are things that are well defined and "organised". There are other things which are known in turbulence which comes from some fundamental physical processes inside these turbulence (e.g. what is know as the Kolmogorov law, where the energy in the turbulent flow "cascades" in a very specific way from the large scales toward the smalle scales, which I do not expect you to understand, but just to know that there are things that are well defined and organised in chaos). So whether the multiple universes will look chaotic or not is more of a "esthetical" aspect. While some things look chaotic it does not mean that there are no accurate and well defined/prescriged law to define/describe it.

What is "before" the big bang is more difficult to grasp. The thing is that the matter/energy at the beginning of the big bang is concentrated and space time is distorted so that there is no "time" before the big bang. The big bang is a "singularity" at time t=0, in that sens that we cannot say that t=0 can be define there, as first of all we really do not know and second many things would just be "infinite" at t=0 (such as density) and the volume would go to zero (nothing). So it is really more of a phylosophical question. Some scientists view the time axis are curved so that t=0 is the same as t=infinity, and where the value "infinity" is actually a real value, very ver large, but finite. As to the big bang and "other" universes, since I do not know these theories of multiple universes I cannot comment on that. but my guess is that the other universes are indeed also starting at t=0 (big bang) all together. There are some theories which view many universe in time, but not in space, in that sens that the same universe would expand (big bang) then contract again until  it reaches again a big bang density and expands again, ect... so that these universes would exist one "after" eacht other in "time".

As to life in "other universes" I would first look in this universe. It seems that water can easily accumulate (in the early evolution of the solar system) due to the bombardment of comets (full of ice) so that as we discovered now, water WAS on mars in abundance and for an extended period of time. With time it evaporated. On earth, thanks goodness, it did not evaporate (not yet...). So it seems that water is a normal "surface" consitituent of (minor/rocky) planets. It seems also that planets are commonly found around stars and there are 100000000000 stars in each galaxy. And there are many  many galaxies in the universe. So, in short, all points to the fact that good environments for the development of life exist in the universe. There are many chances that life exists, existed and will exist on many planets, around many stars, in many galaxies. The answer to whether there is alife elsewhere in the universe is yes of course, and we are the first proof and we are no exception to the rule, however the chance that 2 such planets be close to each other is extremely small and we probably will never have proofs of aliens (except for the fairy tales going around, there are no proofs). As to the question of the Divine plan, of course if one wishes to belief then there are plenty of evidence to show that the Divine plan is (say) the creation of the universe (whether multiple or not) and that there is plenty of life everywhere. However, there is not proof to that, as it is just a belief (or not) in God and in the Divine scheme.

You see there are scientists who blieve in God and in that sens they would say that God is responsible for the basic laws of  physics (and consenquently also chemistry, then biology,...) and once everything is set up, you just need to let it (the universe) evolve all by itself according to these laws. For us it might look chaotic and we are unable to describe what will come, but for the One who wrote the laws and knows the solution of the equations, nothing is unpredictable as everything is already contained in the laws.

The best example of that is in a "joky" little poster. You see light is electromangnetic waves. Electromagnetic waves are described by the "Maxwell Equations". So you might see posted on the doors of some physicists a poster where it is written "And God said" and then the Maxwell equations are written. And below it it is written "and there was light".

[pod3]

Yes, they say that the entire universe existed only inside one tiny ball of hydrogen (How'd that get there?!), and as nothing existed outside of this little universe, it must have exploded all on its own.

Furthermore, this was before time existed. Think of a videotape of someone lighting a stick of dynamite. Without time, the tape cannot play.

All of this happened before space unfolded. Where was that ball of gas?

This is why, scientifically, nothing could precede causality. What could come before the cause of all causes?

Psychics will note that to unleash Gaian-type energy is basically destructive. It is scientific law that, in nature, order progresses to disorder. Things decompose, not come together!

MULTIPLE UNIVERSES--
This edge-of-the-world theory in cosmology came from calculations stating that the "drag" on stellar particles meant that matter as we know it could not account for all the material in the known universe.

Then, where do black holes take you? Imagine splitting a fiber optic cable and welding it back together at the the end. As far as we are concerned the space in between, like irrational numbers, don't exist.

[atalanta]

Hi,

I saw a program the other night called Compass (Sydney, Australia).  It is a program which discusses issues around spirituality and religion.  It was showing a program about science vs. God type issues.  They started talking about the Big Bang theory and then about multiple universes.

I am hopeless with maths and things like this.  However, I have a very good imagination and I am very lateral thinking and some things occurred to me and I want to check them out with someone who can explain things to me.  I also have a theory about black holes that I would like to ask about.  

Would someone please spare me some time.