Isn't Praying Kind of Like Meditation?

[rodentmouse]

i  think  they  are  similare in purpose-  that is to  focus your  awareness on  the trancendental  for a  certain  time each day...

this is  how  they are stress releiving,   when  you turn  your attention towards the grander  scheme  of things,  the  trivial affairs  of  our  waking life  seem  insignificant.

i  dont like the way prayer  is done  in  groups  though,  that way  it  becomes  routine,   you  merely  recite the prayer as part of a schedule and to me  there  doesnt seem to be  much  heart or awareness in it,  They are like machines.

Prayer  should be a  private thing,  this  way  you cultivate   a part of  your  mind   to  "be"  with  this  higher part of  yourself  which allows   all  your stresses  to  melt away  and  for  you  to feel  intouch  with some kind of  higher power,  (IMO  though, a  clearer mind)

to  me  you cant really develop  this kind of personnal  relationship with a more serene awareness when  its part of a "schedule" and  its  just  another chore to do during the day.

Ive  tried  both  and to be honest  i  think meditation is  everything prayer is  but washing away all the irrelevant factors, e.g talking  to god,  which i  dont beleive at all but a  higher aspect of  your own  being.

[Radha]

In my opinion it first depends on how you define these terms.  In the esoteric schools, meditation is defined as "change of Being".  You are taught how to do this.  Just thinking, or visualizing or talking is not meditation.  On the other hand, in the exoteric world it doesn't matter how you define it.
If you examine prayer as it was taught by Origen, Evagrius Ponticus and other notable christian writers of the first century (or thereabouts) you see the same defining being used.  The roman church, as usual, had people who spoke the truth murdered, and for centuries they taught nonsense as "prayer".  Now the romans are trying to teach something they call "centering prayer".  If you examine this against the above two sources, as well as the "prayer of the heart" as known in the eastern orthodox church (see the Phylokalia) you'll see that the two can have identical meanings.
The only problem the romans have is too much blood on their hands as well as a severe lack of theoretical structure for their centering prayer.   They sent members of the society of jesus (who, by the way, practice correct meditation but keep it secret from the masses) to Japan to learn Zen, and are now, last I heard, teaching Zen at various places.  They are desparately trying to reinstitute that which they declared "heretical" centuries ago, but are not doing very well at it.  What they don't want to tell is that Zen is a very near cousin to what Jesus taught and that James carried to Damascus.
These types of training were brought in by the Kwajagan Lords centuries ago and the same training, under different names went into sufism, yoga, buddhism, zen, and christianity.  It is also taught in certain qabalistic orders.

[RJA]

I think of prayer as talking and meditation as listening.  I can't do both very well at the same time.  

Talking is easy so that's what we tend to do, yammering on and on about what we want - give me this, give me that, help me make more money, heal Aunt Edna's back problem, ...  Prayer, when done from the perspective of our ego tends to focus us on what we want, but don't have - and thus can cause underlying anxiety.  When done wrong it is pursued as the subtle art of manipulating God to our will.  I think that in general when we pray we should ask for things spiritual - that we would grow in spirituality, that our egos would be brought into union with God's plans, that we would experience the inner transformation that Christ spoke of, that we would see and understand the world from God's perspective rather than our own.

Meditating is difficult because it essentially involves sitting stil and shutting up long enough, and over a long enough period of time to tune into "God".  Meditation is listening to what God wants to tell us and submitting ourselves humbly to an unseen plan far greater than we can imagine.

The older I get the less use I seem to have for prayer - God knows what I want and need.  God's will is not subject to my whims.  God sees the big picture and I don't.  I pray for spiritual growth and guidance, but so much of the rest of it seems petty (material possessions and even health, to a certain degree) when put in perspective.

I haven't brought the appropriate will to bear on the issue of meditation in order to make it a consistent practice in my life, but I'm getting there and am happy with my progress.

That's my .02 on prayer v. meditation. []

[PennyJean Skyler]

 Another form of prayer/meditation is positive affirmation. I heard that you say daily affirmations to yourself in order to increase positive thinking. Although this may prove to be useful for many, it can also create a "broken record" stigma which is not healthy to say the least. I think there isn't a universal method out there that suits every person. Every person is unique and so it is up to him or her to choose the most comfortable technique.

[Radha]

Hey if you're as hot as the car and the affirmation then it's YOU I'm praying for [][][][][}:)][][}:)]

[DjM]

quote:Originally posted by FistOfFury

Isn't praying kind of like meditation? [/br]

If you say that it is...

FYI: I am not being sarcastic. []

The "handles" that we use to describe Spiritual matters sometimes make the appearance of conflicting statements.  The effects that we attempt to describe depend on our understanding of the world of causes.  Ergo, one who understands the world of causes more thoroughly, would tend to explain the same phenomena differently.

Personally, I have found that many of the handles that I exchange with my Indian friends have the same underlying meaning(s).  I often find it necessary to define the terms and proper names so that we stay on the same page.  Once we get by that, we can share what we already have in common.

[FistOfFury]

Just a quick question and idea I had today in my mind as I was reading the forums. Isn't praying kind of like meditation? My brother in law is muslim, and I've seen him pray sometimes, not sure how to word this, but it's like a "deep prayer." It looks like he's so focused on it, and that you couldn't break his concentration if you tried to (like meditation). How is "prayer" like in other faiths? (I'm supposed to be "Catholic", but I've never gone to church or prayer or anything like that,but anyway that's another discussion for another day) When I've seen my bro in law do his prayers and now that I think about, it seems like it's like meditation. What's really the difference between the two??

Also, my sister told me that he had a "vision" of one of the prophets, and he came to him during one of his prayers. I wish I could remember the name, uhh prophet Mohammed? Ironically that's my brother in law's name too. What do you think about all of this?