Brain Anyone?

[PassiveFist]

A few (hopefully familiar) questions. I've left my ego at the door, believe it or not.

When we die, the brain stops working and immediately starts decaying. Consciousness is lost, thought-processes stop, emotions cease.

Unless we pretend the brain doesn't exist, or does something totally different: How can any part of my mind continue to exist after I have died?

Do those who believe in reincarnation have a different understanding of how the brain works? I don't hear much 'scientific' discussion of how the brain works from those who believe in reincarnation, so I would appreciate help with that issue.

Then there are 'souls', which have no clear definition, making them easy to attribute things to without obvious contradiction. I have yet to see any evidence of souls or any explanation of the theory or logic of them. Or does the soul 'just happen' to also do everything the brain does?

[MiddleWay]

A few (hopefully familiar) questions. I've left my ego at the door, believe it or not.

When we die, the brain stops working and immediately starts decaying. Consciousness is lost, thought-processes stop, emotions cease.

Unless we pretend the brain doesn't exist, or does something totally different: How can any part of my mind continue to exist after I have died?

Do those who believe in reincarnation have a different understanding of how the brain works? I don't hear much 'scientific' discussion of how the brain works from those who believe in reincarnation, so I would appreciate help with that issue.

Then there are 'souls', which have no clear definition, making them easy to attribute things to without obvious contradiction. I have yet to see any evidence of souls or any explanation of the theory or logic of them. Or does the soul 'just happen' to also do everything the brain does?

I won't go into to out of body death experiences because I have never had one. But I can say that I know a person who would strongly disagree with the concept that "Consciousness is lost, thought-processes stop, emotions cease" when the brain ceases to function.

Another question could be, "How many brain cells does one have to stick together before they become one unified consciousness?" Basically, how many non-conscious objects have to be clustered together to make a single conscious entity?

The typical consensus is that the physical body is a reflection of a higher existence. Therefore the brain, and anything it appears to do, is in fact a 3rd dimensional representation of the "real thing". So if a brain was to be removed, whatever aspect it represented will not manifest in this physical dimension.

As far as I can tell the physical body is just an intricately designed cluster of non-sentient particles with some electricity running throughout. Where the intangible qualities of sensation, emotion, or thought enter the equation in the physical sense is beyond me.

[tristan_mage]

Please Note: The following is an opinion, a fairly common opinion

My take on the subject is that your brain is responsible for two things: the functioning of the physical body and the filtering/receiving of your thoughts. According to this school of thought, all ideas and thoughts come from you higher self (and in some cases from other entities,) and are then received by your brain as a tangible thought form. It can be likened to a radio: the radio station sends out waves of information which, alone, do nothing, until a properly tuned radio can pick up and filter those signals, thus converting them into the music you hear. That's how I believe the brain works.

As far as a "soul," I don't particularly believe in the original sense of the word, but rather in the etheric, astral and mental consciousness which allows a person to exist outside the physical body. "Astral projection" is, by that logic, an escapade within the "soul."

[Wronski Feint]

I was under the impression that when you die, the electrical activity in your brain continues untill it all discharges.  Am I wrong?

[wizzle3]

your conciousness stays alive for a numberof minutes when you "die"

i forget the number



while dmt gets released into your body, which is known to be a beginging process of leaving this dimension



unless your head gets blowen off ofcourse


(the first part has been proven)

[PassiveFist]

I am not an expert on the brain but I'm trying to speak from a common-sense standpoint.

I don't think consciousness has been studied enough in neuroscience and I don't think they know (yet?) how consciousness is created, or what it is. There aren't many definitions of consciousness from anyone that don't have problems.

How does the 'soul' create consciousness?

I have heard of the idea that the brain is simply a receiver of mind. It is hard to disprove it, but at the same time, I have never seen any evidence that supports it, except testimony of peoples experiences. Is there any reason to think it? It sounds like passing the buck to me, in order to hold on to spiritual beliefs.

Do these people not believe in (biological) evolution?

Why believe in a whole extra unsupported concept when the brain is there and makes sense along with evolution? Why would someone believe that feelings are not caused by the chemicals in the brain, just as drugs cause feelings? Why would someone believe that reason and rationality aren't products of the neocortex? Is there anything more than wishful thinking? The mystery of subjective experience and 'qualia' is certainly reason to be interested in consciousness, but not to abandon the search for justification and just accept something 'spiritual'.

while dmt gets released into your body, which is known to be a beginging process of leaving this dimension

Couldn't dmt + other released chemicals cause NDE hallucinations?

[Existential Essence]

When yr brain dies, there is a shift, and this is the important part, In Your POINT of Consciousness...

[greatoutdoors]

PassiveFist,

You ask some very good questions! In my mind, the issue hinges on the energy/electricity that powers our brain. Does that energy survive the physical death of the brain? Whether it does or not, I believe that is what folks call a "soul" and I believe every living thing has one, not just us ego-centric humans.

You are right when you say science has no good definition for consciousness, and has no clue as to what it actually is. There have been some interesting articles on the subject in Discover Magazine -- worth subscribing to!

My own theory is that the conscious part of us comes from the energy, which requires a functioning brain to manifest. The kicker is whether or not self-awareness remains in that energy when it is separated from the brain. It might, and we just might have no way of testing it. On the other hand, it might not, and the energy may just become a part of the great energy "sea" I have talked about before.

I base this on the Laws of Conservation of Energy and Matter - "Energy can neither be created nor destroyed, but only changed in form" (and the same for matter.) Those laws have been tested and proven in the science lab. That being the case, then our "essence", if it is in fact the energy I've mentioned, cannot be destroyed. Of course, that doesn't mean it remains sentient.  

Have you ever been put under anesthesia? That is one very weird experience!! There is no concept of time, no dreaming, no awareness of anything at all. It's just "click," nobody's home, then "click," you're back! That could certainly be what death is, and if so, spirituality doesn't enter into it -- New Age, Buddhist, Christian, or otherwise. But under anesthesia your brain is still functioning and the electrical energy is still there. The anesthesia has just blocked the link between the two. Like I said, interesting stuff!!!  

[nibor]

Hello PassiveFist

Here is my go at your questions:

The reason that I don't believe the theory that thoughts and emotions dies with the brain, is that there are so much logical information available that talks against it. To not talk about all the things that it can't explain.
This theory only seems logical when you have not studied other theories. Or so it was with me anyway.

The concept of reincarnation explained many things to me, when I sat down and read books about the logic behind it. It will take up to much space and time to explain it here though, as much other things.

Those alternative theories and everything that supports them, are not often brought up in the light by media, or discussed seriously in scientific newspapers. You just have to dig out the information yourself.

Here are some recommended study for a start, that have helped me:

Astral travel, out of body experiences/experiments books(Robert Monroe books)
lucid dreaming books
Edgar Cayce:s readings (I can recommend the book "Many mansions")
dowsing water, lost things, persons, etc... (Own ability, reading books)
"The hundredth monkey experiment"
Books about ancient mysteries that discusses them from a point of view that I have not seen in documentaries in the media.
Free e-books on the Internet

Well, this have been my way to get an understanding of those things - to mostly read and reflect about it, just as I did when I learned about biological evolution in school.

Hope this helped you a little.

/nibor

[PassiveFist]

I studied lots of different spiritual theories and topics for many years. I should have mentioned it in my original post. I have studied all of the topics you mentioned.  I'm not denying that there are amazing experiences you can have with your mind. All I have ever found and all I continue to find is people saying things like 'the universe is like this, because I experienced it like this.' All talk about what the author thinks reality is, but no supporting reasoning or evidence.

The reason that I don't believe the theory that thoughts and emotions dies with the brain, is that there are so much logical information available that talks against it.

I've never found any and I have been looking for years. Care to point me to any?

[nibor]

Well, I can point you to a site with e-books, that are trying to prove the "Ascension" with scientific methods.
The three ebooks have the name:

THE CONVERGENCE SERIES: A SCIENTIFIC CASE FOR "ASCENSION"

and are placed on the left side of the site. You will find them, they are very visible. Here is the link:

http://www.ascension2000.com/

I have soon finished the first book, and finds it very interesting this far. Much reasoning! Read it if you want, and tell me what you think of it.
By the way, didn't you find all the readings and prophecies of Edgar Cayce very convincing, especially since the majority of them have been checked, and turned out to be correct? If not, why?
To me it seems to be much reasoning in his books of why reincarnation could be a reality. There you get one explanation of why some people are born with extreme gifts, and why we have different talents.
And what about children that remembers, and talks about past lifes? What better theory could there be for this phenomenon?

Hope I did not sounded to harsh in this post, because that was not my intention. I just want to start a discussion!
Well, time to go to bed for me now. Goodnight!

/nibor

[JKK]

amazing link thank you....I really find the talk about aether/ether/energy/ very interesting

maybe not fully related to the brain but this chapter is cool
http://ascension2000.com/Shift-of-the-Ages/shift02.htm