The Christian Mystery of Reincarnation

[kakkarot]

where did you get all this from? none of this is in the bible and you have both contradicted the bible and read into it that which isn't there.

Christianity today is based solely on the bible because there is no other reliable documentation of Jesus life and teachings, so how can you possibly say all that you have with reliability?

~kakkarot

[DjM]

quote:Originally posted by kakkarot

where did you get all this from? none of this is in the bible and you have both contradicted the bible and read into it that which isn't there.

Christianity today is based solely on the bible because there is no other reliable documentation of Jesus life and teachings, so how can you possibly say all that you have with reliability?

~kakkarot

We are NOT to materialize that which is SPIRIT- period!  Herein lies the source of ALL misunderstandings that have confused and set us apart.  A materialist wants to see the physical proof- where; who; etc...  If one is translating a spiritual book with materialistic understading (i.e. reading it like a novel), one will only fall into folly.  This is truth.

Obviously, you are misunderstood.  There have always been two schools of Christian thought- the regular teachings for the general public and the esoteric teachings which were experienced (i.e. just like the disciples themselves!) by the student.  This is a historical fact.

I believe what I know.  If I don't know anything; I don't believe anything.  This is truth.

How convenient it is to read a spiritual book; adapt it to material understanding; expecting that the greatest truths in the cosmos will passively come to us...almost childish!

Who is anyone to expect that the greatest truths in the cosmos be made simple?

Spiritual truth will not passively come to one through materialistic understandings.  One will only materialize that which is spirit.  One must see through spiritual eyes and hear with spiritual ears.

Your sentiments are materialistically biased.  My opinions are spiritually grounded.  FYI: we must approach everything in an unbiased way, else we will be held back (by ourselves).

I appreciate your devotion- truly a virtue!  However, you claim that I have read into something which isn't there.  I am certain that you are pointing at my PHYSICAL eyes.  Ergo, you are materializing that which is spirit.  It's all there- right in front of your SPIRITUAL eyes!  You don't really expect to see Christ with your physical eyes do you?  Surely you are aware that Moses, John the Baptist, and the disciples were initiates of varying degrees?  How do you think they were able to make sense of their own visions?

In one post, you claim to have an occult (i.e. beyond the 5 senses) vision; in the next post you demand physical proof of another's.  Inconsistency is the root of confusion...

[kakkarot]

you never said anything about visions in this topic (nor the others that i read). that is what i was asking for. where it came from.

as for my visions, i did not trust them blindly, nor do i trust my memories of them blindly. after all, even demons can inspire one to see something.

"Who is anyone to expect that the greatest truths in the cosmos be made simple". i didn't say the bible encased the "truths of the cosmos". i said the bible was the book that christianity was based off of. the bible was never meant to encase the truths of the "cosmos", each book was written for the reason that it says in it (except for matthew mark luke and john, which don't say why they were written. they were written as historical documents by people who witnessed and shared in jesus' life). PLUS, christianity has NOTHING TO DO WITH THE TRUTHS OF THE COSMOS. christianity is God's way of being able to establish a personal relationship of love, and faith with each individual.

i am glad that you are getting understanding of such great things, but it seems that you have somewhat misconstrued why they were being given to you, or what they were really about.

as to that "materializing the spiritual" stuff, i'm not. you are reading my posts wrong, reading into them, it seems, the reaction you would be expecting someone with a negative mindset to have.

~kakkarot

[DjM]

quote:Originally posted by kakkarot

you never said anything about visions in this topic (nor the others that i read). that is what i was asking for. where it came from.

as for my visions, i did not trust them blindly, nor do i trust my memories of them blindly. after all, even demons can inspire one to see something.

"Who is anyone to expect that the greatest truths in the cosmos be made simple". i didn't say the bible encased the "truths of the cosmos". i said the bible was the book that christianity was based off of. the bible was never meant to encase the truths of the "cosmos", each book was written for the reason that it says in it (except for matthew mark luke and john, which don't say why they were written. they were written as historical documents by people who witnessed and shared in jesus' life). PLUS, christianity has NOTHING TO DO WITH THE TRUTHS OF THE COSMOS. christianity is God's way of being able to establish a personal relationship of love, and faith with each individual.

i am glad that you are getting understanding of such great things, but it seems that you have somewhat misconstrued why they were being given to you, or what they were really about.

as to that "materializing the spiritual" stuff, i'm not. you are reading my posts wrong, reading into them, it seems, the reaction you would be expecting someone with a negative mindset to have.

~kakkarot

I don't mind trading my opinions for your sentiments, but in this case...you're just being obstinate because you disagree with me.  You are mis-communicating terribly about matters that deserve more thought and reflection.

I made some posts; you replied that I am flat-out wrong.  All you can contribute is strong negative sentiments.  This is a very weak position to work from.  In fact, it's unsatisfactory.

In your other post, you claim to have visions without wisdom and understanding.  Now, you are saying, that you don't just trust them blindly.  This is a blatent contradiction!  Without wisdom, one is flying blindly whether in a vision or not...

How can anyone not read your posts incorrectly- they are stated as such!  If one wishes to be understood correctly, one must make the effort(s) to communicate correctly.

Confrontation does not exist withour participation.  May you have wonderful thoughts of to do.

[Adrian]

Greetings everyone,

quote:Originally posted by DjM
Surely you are aware that Moses, John the Baptist, and the disciples were initiates of varying degrees?  How do you think they were able to make sense of their own visions?

Yes, I think this is a very important point indeed! Master Jesus was and is also a very high initiate.

You see, when these people conveyed their teachings to the world, they were sending a Spiritual message in Spiritual and hence often symbolic terms. For example  - when Moses "climbed the mountain" to get the so called "ten commandments" - he did not actually climb a mountain to see some chap with a white beard flanked by Archangels sitting on a throne at the top to physically receive the commandments - rather he raised his consciousness by meditation or Astral projection to confer with higher Initiates and/or Cosmic intelligences connected with Divine Providence. Likewise in the old testament - Genesis I refers to the creation of the Astral realms, not the physical realms, and the great flood likely chronicles the destruction of Atlantis.

It is the misinterpretation over the years where the writers of the bible interpreted these teachings and writings in strictly material terms, that has lead in no small part to the creed and dogma of many religions, and the state of the world in general.

With best regards,

Adrian.

[Anonymous]

Rule of thumb: Trust your gut. It's there for a reason. I hear whispers of demons in my ears and I tell the demons to leave. They do not listen so I attack them. Then I realize that even to attack a demon is not Christian, nor does it follow the code I have taken on for my martial arts and for life itself:

Ou Wen Wei, in his book of instruction for Pan Gu Mystical Qigong, states this idea, not in these exact words, but close: Treat others with friendliness, frankness and honesty, kindness and benevolence, speak with reason, move others with emotion, and act with result. Even the demons. In kung fu we are taught to look where we strike. Why wouldn't the same principle apply to spiritual advancement? Look where we're headed, where we're going, not where we've come from. Look at the light, and you move to go there. Look at the darkness, and you move to go there. Go to the light and do not look back, even as the darkness may harm you and deserves to be destroyed. If it follows you to the light it will surely die. Light is not only white. It is a variety of colors from the rainbow, each of them a part of us in different proportions, creating our identities. The light appears white because white light is made up of many different colors, and the light is extremely bright. It pierces the bodies of all demons and erases the shadows of darkness. Do what you believe is right. You can only do your best, and no one can tell you what is right, it is something you have to come to terms with yourself. There are many paths in the forest of spirituality. Some are tread by many humans and others by only a few. But we're all trying to get to the same place.

[James S]

Kakkarot & DjM,

I've been enjoying reading your "discussion" across a couple of topics now. I thought I'd throw my thoughts into this one as it's getting a little off the topic of Catholocism.

It seems to me you two are arguing different sides of the same coin.
There is a place for both views and each view is just as relevant and useful as the other. Please take no offence either of you, as this is just my point of view, but you seem to be as rigid as each other in your comments and views.

Just an example :

Kakkarot:

quote:Christianity today is based solely on the bible because there is no other reliable documentation of Jesus life and teachings, so how can you possibly say all that you have with reliability?

I'm not exactly sure why you said this, because it seems to be a very narrow view. There have been many other texts written apart from the bible that have been inspired by God to help people to understand Him. Treating the Bible as the be all & end all of christianity could be quite limiting. If you have experienced anything of what others on this site have you will know that the Bible lacks a lot of relevant info.


DjM:

quote:How convenient it is to read a spiritual book; adapt it to material understanding; expecting that the greatest truths in the cosmos will passively come to us...almost childish!

Hang on, I might be reading this wrong, but if not, isn't this EXACTLY what Jesus did? Jesus taught about the mysteries of a spiritual existence, but he did so using materialistic metaphores and parables so that the average person could understand what it was he was trying to say. There are a great many people who have had the wisdom and insight of God's spiritual ways revealed to them through the words of the Bible alone. Don't assume that God can't use this medium to reach people. For someone who has little knowledge of spiritual matters, which unfortunately is most people, esoteric christianity would be totally lost on them.

As to my own position on this matter, I spent many years in church learning the bible and the instructions within, learning the ways of the Holy Spirit (along with a few eye-opening experiences), and learning about the love of God. Nothing ever really clicked into place for me. Then one day I was visited by a spirit who was not even remotely described in the bible, and who was to become my spiritual guide. I no longer class my belief system as christian, simply because my spiritual journey towards God is no longer along the path defined by Jesus. I still however beleive there is a great deal of wisdom contained within the bible that came from a spiritual source. I believe that Jesus was one of the greatest spiritual lights that was ever to shine on this earth, and his words should be taken to heart.

Kakkarot and DjM - neither of you are wrong in your beliefs, but neither of you have the one and only way either. I'm seeing a great deal of religious texts being repeated on this site. What would be really nice is a little less preaching, and some more of your own words about what it all really means to you. You might then discover that we're all looking at the same object, just from different angles.

But then if you two still wich to debate theology, please don't let me get in the way. Just as long as you understand that this discussion might take you a couple of thousand years []

Take care,

James.

[DjM]

The revelations that are being (and will be) made to mankind will require a higher level of understanding...enter esoteric truths.  The parables themselves contain very hidden meanings that allude the masses.  Having a childlike innocense is a virtue, however, having a childlike understanding is not.  Higher consciousness requires a higher level of understanding.  Many people, even after many lifetimes, will not progress unless they increase their understanding (i.e. knowledge and wisdom).

Personally, I don't believe that we're all looking at the same object.  In fact, the masses aren't even looking (i.e. interested).  Most would exclaim, "I moving forward."  (as opposed to UPWARD)

Anyone who is Christian and is on this site MUST recognize that by their by-the-book approach- they shouldn't be here at all!  As for the rest of us, we'd be burned at the stake...shame and a sin.

My posts have been aimed at an understanding that DOES NOT eliminate the Christ-impulse, but ILLUMINATES it.  In addition, it has been my hope to provide (at least) some understanding in regards to two specific truths which are essential for the current and future epochs of mankind: The Mystery of Golgotha and reincarnation.  Obviously, there is much more to contribute, but, perhaps, I should stick to the fun stuff?

All the best!

[Adrian]

Greetings James,

quote:Originally posted by James S
Hang on, I might be reading this wrong, but if not, isn't this EXACTLY what Jesus did? Jesus taught about the mysteries of a spiritual existence, but he did so using materialistic metaphores and parables so that the average person could understand what it was he was trying to say. There are a great many people who have had the wisdom and insight of God's spiritual ways revealed to them through the words of the Bible alone. Don't assume that God can't use this medium to reach people. For someone who has little knowledge of spiritual matters, which unfortunately is most people, esoteric christianity would be totally lost on them.

I think this is true to a point, but religions have taken it "too" literally. There are two problems:

1) Conveying Spiritual truths in terms the average person of the era could understand.

2) All of these writings have been translated from Ancient Hebrew.

With regards to 1) - clearly these truths could not be taught in absolute terms, because they would have been way over the heads of the average person. But I believe what Jesus did was to note those who understood and pursued an interest in his teachings, and brought them into an inner initiatic environment where they could progress, e.g. as with the Essenes. It might well have been that this was his primary objective - i.e discovering and training the Spritual teachers of the future. The disciples, like Jesus himself, were likely already initiates of varying degree, hence the "miracles" they could perform. If this was the case, then clearly his parables etc. became very well known, and the basis for christianty and which eventually became the prevalent creed over the efforts of those who had the task of teaching Spiritual realities who were suppressed.

As for 2) - I believe much meaning was lost or diluted in the translation from Ancient Hebrew to Greek and then other languages. For example Jesus first real name was not Jesus - it was Joshua. But consider the difficutlies of translating such concepts to English from Ancient Hebrew via Greek! This and the fact that it was not until several hundred years later the bible was selectively compiled and censored at the same time. Accordingly much of the emotion and sincerity was also lost. For example the "lords prayer" - rather than a stark, formal "Our Father...." it would more appropriately have been a much less formal, affectionate and loving, literally translated "Dear Papa..." - accompanied by the feeling of a parent/child relationship which it truly is, rather than a subject/deity relationship which it has become.

The bible is unquestionably full of wisdom to the ears that can listen, but the main problem is that the church have chosen to interpret it materially, and in such as way as the clergy can control the congregation and render them "god fearing people" - the dropping of reincarnation in favour of "hell" and the "devil" is one such example. The problem is that people look up to the religious leaders for guidance and truth, and it seems that they have been at best let down, and at worst betrayed.

With best regards,

Adrian.

[Anonymous]

I need to take a speed-reading course with all these long posts! There is so much valuable information here! I was thinking about what Djm said the other day about not materializing that which is spirit. I realize now that the best path for me is the path of simplicity. Mankind has a distinct communication problem in general. I say this because I often see someone make a point about something and then someone else says something and they completely misunderstand because they don't realize that what the other person said is exactly the point they were trying to make only with more hidden meaning. arghh, this sentence just confused me... I can't think of a better way to state it though. oh well, I'm sure someone will understand sometime. Anyway, that's why I go back and read posts that may not have had recent replies. That way I get to read them in different states of mind and uncover multiple meanings. I know this has nothing to do with what we're talking about in this post but in my own little world I can relate it. En terra pax.

[kakkarot]

actually, DjM, if a person were to be a solely bythebook christian, they would be a lot different than any shape that religion tries to mold their follows in. the reason is, the bible isn't based on rules, it is based on principles. rules are set, principles are based upon situations. religion has changed this greatly.[]

i apologize for upsetting you earlier with my previous posts, since you didn't post where you were getting your information from i assumed that you were another type of person who was using religious-based dogma to pervert how people understood the Word of God. sorry, and thank you for letting me know where you were getting your info from.

also, i think it was in the other topic that you asked how i could have visions without understanding, and understanding without visions? or something like that.

the answer is: the visions were of events. there was no need to understand them. they were like movies, there was only a need to see them and figure out what the purpose of the vision was. there was no need for higher understanding of anything in the vision. the understanding of "higher" things for me came over years and encapsulated many many things (everything actually). there was no need for visual perception of the understanding (ie a "vision"). what was given to me was in pure mental and spiritual  thought and understanding.

i gotta go now, have class. oh well [|)]

~kakkarot

[DjM]

quote:Originally posted by kakkarot



i apologize for upsetting you earlier with my previous posts, since you didn't post where you were getting your information from i assumed that you were another type of person who was using religious-based dogma to pervert how people understood the Word of God. sorry, and thank you for letting me know where you were getting your info from.

also, i think it was in the other topic that you asked how i could have visions without understanding, and understanding without visions? or something like that.

i gotta go now, have class. oh well [|)]

~kakkarot

No problems; only solutions.  When one wins, we all win (i.e. like Christ Jesus).  We are all trying to understand that which is Spirit and that which is Truth.  The fact that we all come to this site to learn more is a tribute to our own development AND to mankind itself.

We are all at different levels of development.  Most of the readers who arrive at sites like Astral Pulse are ahead of the game just because they are INTERESTED in learning more.  Kudos!

The period in which we are currently in is one in which more and more Spiritual information will be revealed.  It is not the who that matters, but the what.  More specifically, it is not that "DjM" reveals, but that it was revealed.

Have fun in class!  I have no class- just joking!

Perhaps we should have a HOCKEY section on this site- then you and I could go at it! (laughs)  FYI: I AM a huge hockey fan; noticed you are from Canada.

[DjM]

quote:Originally posted by EnderWiggin

I need to take a speed-reading course with all these long posts! There is so much valuable information here! I was thinking about what Djm said the other day about not materializing that which is spirit. I realize now that the best path for me is the path of simplicity. Mankind has a distinct communication problem in general. I say this because I often see someone make a point about something and then someone else says something and they completely misunderstand because they don't realize that what the other person said is exactly the point they were trying to make only with more hidden meaning. arghh, this sentence just confused me... I can't think of a better way to state it though. oh well, I'm sure someone will understand sometime. Anyway, that's why I go back and read posts that may not have had recent replies. That way I get to read them in different states of mind and uncover multiple meanings. I know this has nothing to do with what we're talking about in this post but in my own little world I can relate it. En terra pax.

Dude- you're awesome!  You are filled with interest, amazement, and wonder, which is a requirement for learning.  My posts are filled with esoteric information that will become more apparent to the reader upon reflection- on purpose!  You ask excellent questions and are already on the path that you're looking for.  I love reading your questions and replies.  

All the best!

[DjM]

quote:Originally posted by Adrian

Greetings James,

quote:Originally posted by James S
Hang on, I might be reading this wrong, but if not, isn't this EXACTLY what Jesus did? Jesus taught about the mysteries of a spiritual existence, but he did so using materialistic metaphores and parables so that the average person could understand what it was he was trying to say. There are a great many people who have had the wisdom and insight of God's spiritual ways revealed to them through the words of the Bible alone. Don't assume that God can't use this medium to reach people. For someone who has little knowledge of spiritual matters, which unfortunately is most people, esoteric christianity would be totally lost on them.

I think this is true to a point, but religions have taken it "too" literally. There are two problems:

1) Conveying Spiritual truths in terms the average person of the era could understand.

2) All of these writings have been translated from Ancient Hebrew.

With regards to 1) - clearly these truths could not be taught in absolute terms, because they would have been way over the heads of the average person. But I believe what Jesus did was to note those who understood and pursued an interest in his teachings, and brought them into an inner initiatic environment where they could progress, e.g. as with the Essenes. It might well have been that this was his primary objective - i.e discovering and training the Spritual teachers of the future. The disciples, like Jesus himself, were likely already initiates of varying degree, hence the "miracles" they could perform. If this was the case, then clearly his parables etc. became very well known, and the basis for christianty and which eventually became the prevalent creed over the efforts of those who had the task of teaching Spiritual realities who were suppressed.

As for 2) - I believe much meaning was lost or diluted in the translation from Ancient Hebrew to Greek and then other languages. For example Jesus first real name was not Jesus - it was Joshua. But consider the difficutlies of translating such concepts to English from Ancient Hebrew via Greek! This and the fact that it was not until several hundred years later the bible was selectively compiled and censored at the same time. Accordingly much of the emotion and sincerity was also lost. For example the "lords prayer" - rather than a stark, formal "Our Father...." it would more appropriately have been a much less formal, affectionate and loving, literally translated "Dear Papa..." - accompanied by the feeling of a parent/child relationship which it truly is, rather than a subject/deity relationship which it has become.

The bible is unquestionably full of wisdom to the ears that can listen, but the main problem is that the church have chosen to interpret it materially, and in such as way as the clergy can control the congregation and render them "god fearing people" - the dropping of reincarnation in favour of "hell" and the "devil" is one such example. The problem is that people look up to the religious leaders for guidance and truth, and it seems that they have been at best let down, and at worst betrayed.

With best regards,
Adrian.

HEYYYYY!  I was gonna write that...just joking.  (It's not who wrote it, but just that someone did)  Your clarifications are pristene and even more revealing on this topic.  I loved reading this reply.  Thank you, Adrian!  All the best!!

[James S]

Adrian & DjM,

I really enjoy topics that make me think, and show me how to look at something from a differnt point of view.

DjM -

quote:Many people, even after many lifetimes, will not progress unless they increase their understanding (i.e. knowledge and wisdom).

Yes, I Absolutely agree with this.

quote:Personally, I don't believe that we're all looking at the same object. In fact, the masses aren't even looking (i.e. interested).

Sad, but true. Most people are still caught in the philosophy of "he who dies with the most toys wins." I guess what I meant to say was that people like us who are seeking something beyond our day to day material lives are all looking at the same object.

quote:Anyone who is Christian and is on this site MUST recognize that by their by-the-book approach- they shouldn't be here at all! As for the rest of us, we'd be burned at the stake...shame and a sin.

Amen to that! A while back a friend of mine was excomunicated from a church because she confessed to the pastor that she had experienced precognition & clairvoyance, and that she sought to better understand and use these gifts. She was a truly lovely person who's eyes were very much set on the spiritual, and as such, found out that there is a lot more to the spirit world that what is detailed in the bible. The pastor was too caught up in dogma & church policy to see anything else beyond it. This I believe ties in nicely with Adrian's point about the churches seeking to control rather than to teach and liberate.

Adrian, I can see what you mean about Jesus "screening" his diciples. When you look at it that way it makes a lot of sense.

EnderWiggin -

quote:Mankind has a distinct communication problem in general. I say this because I often see someone make a point about something and then someone else says something and they completely misunderstand because they don't realize that what the other person said is exactly the point they were trying to make only with more hidden meaning. arghh, this sentence just confused me...

Very nicely communicated, and it gave me a laugh []


Thanks Kakkarot & DjM for not taking offence to my comments.

It's all good!
James.

[Anonymous]

LOL! Adrian, I was reading this over another time and you quoted something that struck me both as comical and also enlightening.

quote:

when Moses "climbed the mountain" to get the so called "ten commandments" - he did not actually climb a mountain to see some chap with a white beard flanked by Archangels sitting on a throne at the top to physically receive the commandments.

I just thought that was funny. I hope you're not offended. It just sounded like something that could have been from a scene in a Monty Python movie. lol. Happy [insert adverb here].

[kakkarot]

wow, i missed that quote. actually adrian, that kind of interpretting can really get you into believing wrong things. when moses climbed the mountain, he really did climb a mountain. they even name the mountain in the bible, mount sinai. exodus 19:17.

now if moses only went up spiritually, how did he get the tablets back with him? and please don't say they were metaphors, because he threw first pair of tablets at a golden calf that the israelites made while moses was away.

i realize that you may not have read the bible through and through (neither have i), but the old testaments were not written with metaphors in mind. there were of real things that happened that showcased the truth of reality to the people.

~kakkarot

[Anonymous]

Thanks Djm, I have not seen anyone with your level of understanding on these topics.

I recall a quote from some website ( I think it was Aphorismsgalore.com) having to do with God and religion. It was nicely put, but I don't remember who it was that said it- "If you love God, burn the Church!" lol, I got a kick out of that one. I think churches act like shepherds in a way, but not necessarily a good way (which is why I stopped attending masses- Well, that and the fact that the church I was part of is Roman Catholic). They don't encourage us to question enough, and that's exactly what we need to do, but not in a way that's going to start a jihad!

Whenever I talk to my kung fu teacher about this stuff he's always got some good advice. If I didn't know better I'd say Jesus and him were sharing an apartment. He's always been very accepting of any culture in general. Like anyone else, he has his opinions about stuff and knows what he likes and doesn't like, but when he doesn't like something, it's for a good reason, usually it's just that it might not be the kind of person he is, etc. But he never judges others for doing that stuff. Even if you were a criminal, as long as you weren't doing illegal stuff in his presence, he doesn't care. I think that's a great way to be. I like it when people are open and don't accuse each other of having faults or whatever. So many people are so quick to accuse others of their faults without first looking at themselves, and the way they say it is so demeaning. The world can be incredibly cruel sometimes, but I never take it to heart. I always think of it as another's ignorance of something more important- The common brotherhood between all humans.

[Anonymous]

There is one other reason I don't like church- They only encourage you to establish a community with other Christians or only other Christians of their sect. That's a sin in itself. That kind of mentality is what divides people and cuts them off from the rest of the world, making them uncultured and sometimes even racist.

[kakkarot]

"That kind of mentality is what divides people and cuts them off from the rest of the world". ah, but enderwiggin, people who take on christ are no longer "of the world"; those who claim to be christians are no longer supposed to indulge in the fallicies of the world. however, pride (thinking higher of oneself than they ought) is one of the things that is "of the world" that a christian is supposed to lose.

so if they still have their pride, they are still of the world. after all, how can a man have two masters? either he will hate the one and love the other, or he will cherish the one and dislike the other. a man cannot serve both God and anything else.

~kakkarot

[Anonymous]

quote:"That kind of mentality is what divides people and cuts them off from the rest of the world". ah, but enderwiggin, people who take on christ are no longer "of the world"; those who claim to be christians are no longer supposed to indulge in the fallicies of the world.

I see your point, Kakkarot, but this kind of thinking has also been the cause of many unnecessary wars. That's what I meant by being divided. Whenever religion causes wars, it makes me skeptical of that religion, or rather, the leaders responsible for making the decisions to go to war. Is not one of the Ten Commandments "Thou Shalt Not Kill?" War for any reason is wrong. Even (and especially) for religious purposes. The fact is, when you are a member of a church, 99% of the time they will encourage you to form a community only with those of your faith. This does not promote relationships with ALL people. One of the largest parts of being Christian is the concept that we are all one race (and in fact this has been scientifically proven), we are all brothers and sisters, and we must stick together, even through our differences in faith. If my brother was a Muslim, I would not feel any differently about him, because he is and always will be my brother, and that is something I cannot change, whether I wanted to or not. I would still be related to him and we would still connect on the same level. Nothing would change.

It is highly important to become educated in all religions, so that one understands each and every one of them as a spiritual path. You are right when you say that pride is an earthly-minded matter. It is; but the Greeks have a term called hubris, which means having too much pride, rather than just having pride. The story of Icarus and his father escaping from an island is meant to depict this; Icarus and his father made winged sandals to fly away from an island on which they were prisoners/slaves of a king. Icarus and his father flew away from the island. Icarus, however, kept soaring higher and higher, until at last, he said "I am like the gods, soaring above the world..." or something like that. In Greek mythology, it was considered a sin to compare oneself to the gods. What he did not realize was that his hubris caused him to go so high that he got too close to the sun, and the wax that was holding his sandals together melted, and the sandals fell apart, and he drowned in the ocean. So what I am trying to say is, there is a difference between pride and hubris. Hubris is simply an excess of pride. Pride is closely related with the ego. Rid yourself of your ego, and you rid yourself of your pride/hubris. There is nothing wrong with being proud of something that you have accomplished, especially if it was extremely challenging to do. It means you have overcome a barrier, and you SHOULD feel good about it. But only for awhile. Don't "milk" it, as they say. We have emotions for a reason, and it is up to us to interpret them. In my eyes, one should worship as they see fit. You cannot judge another by your own standards, you must judge them by their standards. Actually, we're not supposed to judge each other at all, according to the Bible. That's God's job. It is best to withdraw from the world, and balance yourself, as a martial artist would, so that nothing moves you to negativity. If you are centered, you should stay there. When you achieve inner balance, it is then that you can ascend. It is hard for most people to do this. God has unconditional love for us, no matter what happens. Even if we go to hell after we die. God understands all that we have been through.

The best example I can think of right now is the properties of pairs of electrons in quantum physics. Only electrons with opposite spins may occupy the same area/volume/coordinates in space. For us to occupy the same spirit as God, we must find the right "spin." Otherwise, it cannot work. When we achieve the same understanding as God, we become like him. In the astral world, like attracts like. So, I guess what I'm saying is, only spirits with a likeness can occupy the same area or coordinates in space. Sorry, this isn't a very good analogy. Anyway, if you achieve the same balance as God, you return to God and become part of him. The more balanced and understanding you are, the closer you get.

Sorry this post was so long, I'm having one of those days, where I am lacking a good night's sleep. I feel like I've been hit by a freight train. [xx(]

[kakkarot]

it is good to see that you understand much.

congradulations. just don't let it go to your head

i understand what you mean about the difference between being cut off from other humans but still "earthly" vs being cut off from "earthly" ways but still being close to others.

~kakkarot

[Adrian]

Greetings Enderwiggin!

quote:Originally posted by EnderWiggin
In the astral world, like attracts like. So, I guess what I'm saying is, only spirits with a likeness can occupy the same area or coordinates in space. Sorry, this isn't a very good analogy.

It is quite a reasonable analogy actually  []

In all levels of the Spirit Worlds including the Astral and Mental spheres, the Soul (in the case of the Astral spheres) and Spirit (in the case of the Mental spheres)is attracted by the vibrational level of the Akasha which directly corresponds with the vibration of the Astral or Mental body. This is determined by Spiritual attainment, or if you like, degree of enoblement. Those that still express very gross human traits such as materialism, over-indulgence in sex etc.. will have low vibrations, and those that are emotionally attached to a belief system, i.e. religion who will be attracted to the lower vibration belief system territories as a result of their "baggage", and those that understand Spiritual realities and have escaped the trappings of the physical world and working on their own ascent will have higher vibrations. Of course it is all relative.

The result is of course all beings exist on the same level of the Astral or Mental realms which is analogous to them, and which is much more harmonious than the physical world where everyone has to co-exist.

With best regards,

Adrian.

[sublime]

timeless, can i please move in with you in Canada? After watching Bowling for Columbine and reading your post it really makes me want to move there because it seems as if people are wayyyy more laid back and open minded than most (if not all) Americans! ok sorry for interuputing this great topic, i dont have much to say but i've been reading all of it and i'm still interested.

[Anonymous]

The deal with reincarnation is that we must set goals and standards to meet before we die in each life. We establish these goals in childhood, then raise standards as we go along and learn. For example "Before I die, I want to help 1 million people," etc. Or something like that. If you meet these goals, you spiritually advance to a higher level. Then when  you die, you come back and your higher self hints at higher goals. Life is goooooood!