Paradox in Destiny

[James S]

I agree with you here that we are free spirits, and we are free to choose.

I feel that any religion that tries to tell us that we're locked into a particular destiny is simply trying to control us. I do feel though that we do have destinies, and those destinies are tied in with the lessons our spirits wanted to learn during our time incarnated on Earth.

It is our choice however in whether or not we follow our destinies. Doing so involves being in tune with our higher selves and following the path, I wont say set for us, but rather recommended for us.

[kiauma]

I am destined to change my fate.  []

[James S]

LOL!!

Kiauma, has anyone told you yet today that you're a complete nut?[]
[]

[kiauma]

No, not lately - so thanks!  []

[The AlphaOmega]

No, I do not believe in destiny.  I believe that God is always there for us, but has given us the choice whether or not to heed His council.  He will never lead us in the wrong direction, but we can choose not to follow His direction if we think it's not right for us.  Destiny cannot exist with free will, it is a paradox.  If destiny exists then every action we take leads us to an already set outcome that we were suppose to take, and choice thus means nothing.  If we are free to choose our fate, then every choice we make changes the end result.  So I guess all you can do is choose which one you want to believe in.

[Confucius]

Thanks ..... for echoing my views!

To establish my thoughts on the subject – it also does not make sense why one person is misfortunate that he/she is disabled and the other one is able physically.

Then we have a God that is equal to being unjust and unsympathetic in his plan.

Come on all you people- disagree with my idea of Non-destiny and give me food for thought!
[]

[WalkerInTheWoods]

Food for thought:

Time is not linear. We experience it in a linear fashion. On some level all things are one, including time. All things have happened and coexist on this level. So, we have free will to make our choices, but our choices have already played out, but to our view point they have yet to happen. Since it was our choice we have free will, since it has already happened you could say it is destined to happen.

And/Or

History repeats itself because humans are creatures of habit. Though complex to us, this collection of "habits" makes things most likely to happen. So some event my not be written in stone, it is most likely to happen given the coarse of energies.

[WalkerInTheWoods]

quote:Originally posted by Confucius

Thanks ..... for echoing my views!

To establish my thoughts on the subject – it also does not make sense why one person is misfortunate that he/she is disabled and the other one is able physically.

Why?

quote:Originally posted by Confucius


Then we have a God that is equal to being unjust and unsympathetic in his plan.

The mouse may not think it is fair or just that you set out a mouse trap to catch and kill it. Or that you keep food from it while it goes hungry. Are you more just and sympathetic than your perception of this God you speak of?

[Confucius]

Greetings People,

This is my first post and I have an open ended question that I hope you can share your ideas/opinions with me.

Most of the religions do believe in Destiny. My question is just that! There is a paradox in the whole philosophy of Destiny. Do you not agree? When a particular religion believes in God and most of the time they say that your life is mapped out for you within your destiny.

How can this be? Are we not free spirits to choose from what's right and wrong. Whether it's the Tora, Quran or the Bible, we are free to choose and make our own destiny. Otherwise – there is no purpose in existence and every misfortune that comes in our way then we can only blame in God.

Secondly –
If there is a God – then what's his purpose? Is he not egotistical or does he need empowering from our praise to him?

I am standing on an agnostic platform. I strongly believe in Evolution of the species. But at the same time when I look at the complexity and design of the entire Universe then it makes me thing otherwise that there is a designer at hand.

Regards

Confucius
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[Tyciol]

There is no paradox in destiny, merely the idea that you might perceive it. If you perceive destiny, it is not destiny, as destiny would change through it's own perception.

It's similar to viewing a quantum particle.

[The AlphaOmega]

Ya, I would agree it's a paradox.  Philosophically speaking, free agency and destiny cannot coexist.  You cannot live a life of both.  If destiny is true, then every decision we think we choose is really only the decision we were destined to choose.  If free will is true, then we can alter our course of in life at our own discretion.

[Nostic]

Food for thought:

Time is not linear. We experience it in a linear fashion. On some level all things are one, including time. All things have happened and coexist on this level. So, we have free will to make our choices, but our choices have already played out, but to our view point they have yet to happen. Since it was our choice we have free will, since it has already happened you could say it is destined to happen.

I agree. It's all the same. Action based on free will and destiny are the same thing, if you look at them at their highest levels. It's all a paradox... everything!

[The AlphaOmega]

Hm, I think I'd have to disagree.  The essence of being a paradox suggests impossibility.  Obviously, not everything is impossible.  To look at the universe as nothing more than a paradox would suggest that the universe creates and uncreates itself at the same time, which is obviously not the case.  Take the ULTIMATE paradox I can think of as an example.  Time Travel!  If time travel existed, then someone could go back in time and kill the person that invented time travel.  In doing so that would mean that time travel was never invented, which would have actually prevented that person from going back in time in the first place to kill the inventor of time travel, which would mean that time travel in fact would have been invented... thus allowing the individual to go back in time to kill the inventor of time travel.  THAT IS A PARADOX!  To say that everything in the universe runs along that same analogy... well, just isn't so.  So, in a probably feeble attempt to stay on topic, I say this... free will and destiny is in fact a paradox.  If you are destined to make a certain choice, but you believe you choose that path on your own accord, only the decision you made was in fact the one you were destined to make, then free will could not exist.  But if you were destined to make that choice, and you choose a seperate path that had absolutely nothing to do with your destiny, then your choice would be free will.  However, if your choice of free will was in fact the decision you were suppose to make even though you believed it to be against destiny, then it would in fact be your destined decision, and thus free will would not be.  Holy crap, this barely makes sense to myself, so I greatly appologize for my far too in depth philosophical idea concerning this matter... but because it does in fact make sense to me (if even barely) I'm glad I came up with it... if for no other reason then to satisfy my own curiosity!  HAHAHA... am I in th wrong forum!?!?!?

[Nostic]

Hm, I think I'd have to disagree.  The essence of being a paradox suggests impossibility.  Obviously, not everything is impossible.  To look at the universe as nothing more than a paradox would suggest that the universe creates and uncreates itself at the same time, which is obviously not the case.  Take the ULTIMATE paradox I can think of as an example.  Time Travel!  If time travel existed, then someone could go back in time and kill the person that invented time travel.  In doing so that would mean that time travel was never invented, which would have actually prevented that person from going back in time in the first place to kill the inventor of time travel, which would mean that time travel in fact would have been invented... thus allowing the individual to go back in time to kill the inventor of time travel.  THAT IS A PARADOX!  To say that everything in the universe runs along that same analogy... well, just isn't so.  So, in a probably feeble attempt to stay on topic, I say this... free will and destiny is in fact a paradox.  If you are destined to make a certain choice, but you believe you choose that path on your own accord, only the decision you made was in fact the one you were destined to make, then free will could not exist.  But if you were destined to make that choice, and you choose a seperate path that had absolutely nothing to do with your destiny, then your choice would be free will.  However, if your choice of free will was in fact the decision you were suppose to make even though you believed it to be against destiny, then it would in fact be your destined decision, and thus free will would not be.  Holy [edit], this barely makes sense to myself, so I greatly appologize for my far too in depth philosophical idea concerning this matter... but because it does in fact make sense to me (if even barely) I'm glad I came up with it... if for no other reason then to satisfy my own curiosity!  HAHAHA... am I in th wrong forum!?!?!?

To look at the universe as nothing more than a paradox would suggest that the universe creates and uncreates itself at the same time, which is obviously not the case.

It's not? Well, the basic building-block of matter, the atom, has, of course, a wave/particle duality. That says a lot right there. The physical worlds most basic building-block is a paradox. It is at once created and uncreated; at once localized (particle) and non-localized (wave).

I say everything is a paradox because our created world is based on duality, but yet, we know on a higher level that everything is ONE. Do you agree, or not agree with that? I don't think a paradox suggests impossibility so much as a paradox is just a statement that, on the surface, appears to be contradictory.

[The AlphaOmega]

Yes, I would agree.  I don't know much about physics and atoms so I will assume that you are correct in your statement.  I would also agree that a paradox in some cases suggests contradictory, but some things are so contradicting in forces that they are impossible.  I do not think that EVERYTHING is contradictory, but in a sense I guess fs everything is made up of atoms, and they are contradictory in themselves, then perhaps I could be wrong.  But some things in the universe just clearly make sense and suggest no paradox within them, so I would agree with much of what you said, and disagree with some.

[no_leaf_clover]

Food for thought:

Time is not linear. We experience it in a linear fashion. On some level all things are one, including time. All things have happened and coexist on this level. So, we have free will to make our choices, but our choices have already played out, but to our view point they have yet to happen. Since it was our choice we have free will, since it has already happened you could say it is destined to happen.

Certainly food for thought     Got me thinking too much, I think.

I tried to think this one all the way through logically and came to one conclusion for the moment -  I can't.  It just goes in circles x.x    I had a couple pretty long posts typed up but each time I realized it goes in circles and now I give up for the moment :/    asdfasdfsad  Almost like it's impossible to tell from here.

[The AlphaOmega]

Maybe it's meant to be impossible to understand at this point.  If there are other dimensions, then maybe some of them need to be understood without the body.  Maybe the answers are found in a place beyond or after this life, in which finally we will be satisfied with the solution then... but as of now, it's just not gonna happen!